Vice President Mike Pence breaks Senate deadlock to confirm Betsy

>>109010
I still don't understand how "totally unfamiliar with the system, policies, and basic issues of the department" can translate into "the kind of reformer the education system needs." Did 50 Republicans really find the answers she gave at her hearing anything close to adequate? Can anyone explain this to me?

>>109015
Get in line or get out.
Welcome to congress.

>>109015
The republican motto has always been party before country. Fun fact: they're holding Sessions' confirmation until afterward because they still needed him as a senator to help get her confirmed.

Also look up the donations made by the Devos family to members of senate.

Fucking pay2play shitweasels.

You cannot make this shit up.

Papa Pence Pretending Presidential

>>109015
>>109020
The real question is do 50 Republicans find the Department of Education more important then a political defeat.
The Republicans see the Department of Education as a bloated, unnecessary, and poorly run institution. Handing the Democrats a victory for the sake a Department most of them would rather see eliminated or cut is un-realistic.

>>109015
As others have said, they got bought off. Watch the ones that speak in her defense, the only defense they could form was that she is a good person and the education system needs vouchers.

Almost all of ignored the fact they were getting flooded by calls from their districts asking wtf is going on.

>>109066
tbf vouchers aren't a bad idea, especially considering how shitty the public school system is. DeVos is hardly the worst thing to come out of the Trump administration, and has potential to actually be good for US education in the long run.

Well, we can rest knowing that no bear in this country stands a chance with Betsy's hard stance against these vicious child devourers.

>>109068
VOUCHERS ARE RACISM AND WE LIKE PUBLIC SCHOOL ALL OF A SUDDEN

I always try my best to be impartial and neutral when looking at the American political "scene" and I know there are plenty of instances of democrats doing retarded shit (the Feinstein-Burr emcryption bill comes to mind for instance), but I cannot shake the impression that there is something about getting elected to Congress that makes Republicans completely lose touch with reality and stop giving the most miniscule of fucks about what's good for their country in the medium-long term.
Do they really think interpreting "small government" as repealing any environmental regulation that crosses their way (and strangely enough, those are the only kind of regulation besides financial rules they seem so intent to repeal) is so good for business that it makes up for serious environmental damage and public health issues (note I'm not talking about CO2 here but plain old air/soil/water pollution)? Do they really think filling the education secretary post with someone as inexperienced and, frankly, clueless on the subject of public education as DeVos will do anyone any favors, speaking both politically and in "real-world" terms?

And really, both parties need to stop playing such extreme partisan hardball . Although here, again, it is my impression that the Republicans are somewhat worse in this regard, especially in terms of willingness to engage with the other side to come up with bipartisan solutions to real problems. One example for this is healthcare: the country was (still is from what I hear) in desperate need of reform. Anyone with any kind medium-term perspective of the world could see that. But the republicans tried to stonewall Obamacare (they could have easily made a decent deal with the dems if they'd tried), leading to less than optimal bill which they still can't afford politically to repeal outright, because the republican base has (subconsciously) realized that they're better off with some kind of healthcare bill.
Sorry for rant, part 2 incoming.

>>109113
Cont.
So instead of fixing what they have now that they're in power, they apparently feel obliged by their years of ranting against the ACA to repeal it - which is a bit strange because one would think that Americans could deal with yet another flip-flop from their elected representatives, especially in this situation. So they're going to jam a repeal bill through both houses and most likely won't have a replacement that's even as good as the ACA, let alone as great as Trump has been promising. Which in turn will fuck up the healthcare situation for a lot of Americans, potentially costing the republicans dearly in the midterms and in 2020. And more importantly, the country will be measurably worse off after they're through.

I wish American voters would completely wipe the congressional slate clean and finally elect some good people who don't feel the need to rant against their opponents to the point where they would lose face if they were to work together with them on something constructive.

>>109117
>ipe the congressional slate clean
Drain the swamp

>>109068
Listening to both sides, vouchers wouldn't be such a bad idea in theory but we all know how it would turn out in practice. See US colleges

Basically Feds give people X amount to put towards charter/cathlic/whatever schools.

Schools charge X+1 to attend. This results in the poor getting butt fucked and unable to go. They are now stuck in a public school that is even shitter than before because what meager money they were getting got slashed. Even if the school doesn't raise their prices, the voucher still doesn't take into account location. Poor people tend to have little means of getting around.

Another problem brought up is that public schools have to deal with retards, the hungry, and special needs kids. Something private schools are exempt from and would not be forced to deal with based on what DeVos has said.

Now you make think so what, but you have to look at education as an investment to prevent people from going on crime sprees and keeping the nation #1.

>>109117
A major problem with American politics is that as Americans we're short sighted.

We think you can fix a problem 30+ years in the making in 8 years or less. That if you don't fix it then throw it out and start from scratch. And don't you dare look at how other countries fix their shit. Not that you're perfect either, but it'd at least give a guideline of what not to do.

As for repub stuff, I think part of their problem is that they get framed in a bad light. Libs put out a lot of bills that have sympathetic righteous names, however they also write in riders and shit into the bill that just completely fucks up their districts, nonsensical, or unrelated to the original bill.

Now since most people only hear the title of the bill and maybe first paragraph, you get Repubs who look like Captain Planet villeins having to smack down "big gov" because the alternative is watching their district crash and burn. Its like getting into a fist fight with a suicide bomber dressed as a nun. Although I think this maybe applies to like %20 of them.

>>109010
Good, now we can purge these nigger propaganda out of our schools and teach the boys to be men and girls to be wives.

>>109128
Nobody thinks this way you stupid jew

>>109112
I don't believe in free market capitalism.
I think markets should be free by default; because profit incentive is useful, supply / demand function sets price point without need for top-down micromanagement, and companies should generally be able to have faith that their business model won't suddenly be confounded by government.

But there are drawbacks to privatization. Profit incentive sometimes produces conflicts of interests. And though we might have mostly free enterprise, if we can demonstrate that an industry experiences a conflict of interest between profit interest and general social interest, we shouldn't hesitate to add regulation and publicly funded options to mitigate that hazard.

In particular, we need public options when it comes to education (both schooling and news), with healthcare and emergency services in general (wherein the public is restricted to what's immediately available), basic necessities for the needy (NHS, supplemental nutrition,sanitation, etc.), and some promising areas of exploratory R&D where private investors aren't prepared to accept much risk.

Free markets are not an end within themselves; they are a tool toward greater social health. And if they can be engineered to better serve greater social good in the long run, then we shouldn't hesitate.

>>109041
The Department of Education is unconstitutional and must be eliminated.

Well, the education system was broken anyway. Maybe we need to break it completely and start from scratch.

>>109266
But that's the problem, they'll never start from scratch: they will take this old system they had, remove the bad parts and replace them with untested parts and try to say it's completely different.

>>109274
>they will take this old system they had, remove the bad parts and replace them with untested parts and try to say it's completely different.

If it works, and works better, it's a victory.

>>109109
>People are stupid enough to claim that bears are a threat to public safety while blaming illegal immigrants for their problems
Living in an episode of The Simpsons is far less entertaining than I had imagined

>>109173
Jews don't think this way, True 'Muricans do.

>>109010
>An education system made for underperforming niggers and spics to pass
>They still can't pass
>Made everyone else dumb, laughing stock of the entire world, memes about "american education"
>Costs too much $, pumps out cretins
>Common Core is such a joke that even fucking Laos has a better education system

>>109333
Also, see >>109227. The federal government has no business in education.

>>109126
To build on this, both sides do it since its a way to get unpleasent but necessary legislation through sometimes. The left uses it more than the right because the right has come to expect being called heartless and out of touch.

Suppose a bill called the Clean Streams act comes in and its a bill that will direct funding from something that doesnt need it anymore (funding that went to a project thats finished under budget or something I dont know)to a project to clean up local water sources. No new taxes, clean water. Sounds easy, why would anyone be against it? Well the problem the big mean reTHUGlicans see with it is that there is a provision attached to it that has nothing to do with the Clean Streams act that would raise taxes on certain areas inside their constituency for something they would never see the benefit of. Something like a rec center for inner city youth paid for by taxes on diesel fuel. Now his name and face is everywhere for hating clean water and he gets brow beaten into accepting it or has to slog through the media painting him as a captain planet villain

>>109355
>>109126
Good posts, thank you.
It's also important to note that there's not actually that huge of a policy gap between the two parties. They both advocate a free market with maybe some slight government oversight, they're both fairly hawkish on war and decidedly interventionist, they both promise to cut taxes for the middle class. So much of political debates these days is "I agree with you, but actually you're the bad guy and you're lying," where it becomes a he-said he-said as to who will actually implement this universally desired policy successfully. So a huge portion of the party structure gaining and maintaining power is polarization.

>>109068
>has potential to actually be good for US education in the long run
Explain yourself

>>109389
What we've got now isn't working.

So lets try something else. More freedom, how can that be bad?

I thought you people liked diversity LOL

>>109403
What is your definition of "isn't working"?

>>109404
Before Trump got elected EVERYONE agreed our school system is trash.

Go fuck yourself.

>>109406
Except DeVos is a wealthy swamp dweller . .. and she’s so fuckin’ stupid and ill advised (like Drumpf) she can’t do the simplest research . ..

http://www.nbcnews.com/nightly-news/video/report-trump-education-nominee-allegedly-plagiarized-responses-867090499844

…and still may not get appointed.

>>109408
You support the status quo? I thought you were edgy.

>>109403
Mass education has never worked and always been a sham.

If you're teaching your children the right way - just tell them not to listen to anything anyone says and yell "LIBTARD" over everything they don't like. They don't need education or some of the times even a "job" because the world is out to get them anyways and the Jews will never let them make an honest living because every Monday is "plan out how to screw [Insert Child's Name Here]'s life forever this week" day in the unnamed and vague Jewish corporation. If anything this child is a very good investment economically...

If you're teaching your child the left way - just teach them to learn as many Nazi names as they can and add them as well as "-ist" to every word imaginable and just spout them out like some sort of verbal dookie machine gun, if they can fart out at least 4 "-ist" words and names of Nazies a second they are the chosen ones who will graduate the Gender studies course in college so it is advised to let the parents know that this kid is the only one worth raising and the others can go right the fuck off and should be immediately accused of being Islamophobes and sent to a military school or an orphanage.

This is why schools don't work.

>>109406
Anon that hasn't changed. Nor has the opinoin that Obama care needs work/sucks for some people.

But thing is the voucher solution has holes you can drive a 18 wheeler through and still doesn't account for even half the shit public schools must deal with. Just answer this:

How does vouchers address hungry kids?
How does vouchers address special needs?
How does vouchers address transportation?

>>109415
>listen I agree with you but you're wrong

I'm not answering your dumbass loaded questions.

You don't care about kids. Otherwise you'd support school choice. Fucking commie retard.

>>109324
Do you really think people fall for this shit?

>>109416
Critical thinking is hard isn't it dumpf poster?

I also don't recall saying I don't support it. I don't have kids and any I give a shit about are already home schooled to avoid the shit fest that is the education system. If anything vouchers benefit me as it'll eventually lead to singles being able to withdraw from paying taxes into it.

I did however point out what would most likely occur should the system be deployed.

>>109408
>>109419
Thank you for correcting the record.

>>109419
Just another subjectivist with nothing to add beyond pessimism.

This is why we need school choice. The kids today are being taught leftist philosophy (communism) and nothing more.

>>109425
Education should be a privilege, not a right. It is a privilege to get an education. When people think of it as a privilege, and have to actually spend money to get in, they'll respect school far more. Also, when we only educate those who deserve it, we can spend more resources per student. Quality, not quantity, should define our education system.

It's like healthcare. Our exclusivity means that we can provide a much higher quality of care then the rest of the world for those who can afford the access.

>>109446

http://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/fund-reports/2014/jun/mirror-mirror

Sorry m8, Americans don't actually get the best healthcare, even though you have all the benefits of scale you spend both the most per patient and the most per capita by a pretty large margin and still don't deliver the best care

Also, education is the best and most proven long term method of improving the lives of the people and the economy

>>109446
Relublicans don't think this way you false flagging retard.

>>109462
I'm pretty sure some in the libertarian wing of the GOP would disagree with you on that.

>>109477
>I'm pretty sure
Right...

Well I am 100% sure you know nothing about us.

>>109478
>Applying our theory to parents and children, this means that a parent does not have the right to aggress against his children, but also that the parent should not have a legal obligation to feed, clothe, or educate his children, since such obligations would entail positive acts coerced upon the parent and depriving the parent of his rights. The parent therefore may not murder or mutilate his child, and the law properly outlaws a parent from doing so. But the parent should have the legal right not to feed the child, i.e., to allow it to die.2 The law, therefore, may not properly compel the parent to feed a child or to keep it alive.

>>109479
>Here's this pasta I found so obviously you and your entire party agree!

nigger

>>109480
I was saying that some in your party would agree to it. You wouldn't paint all libruls as being pro open locker rooms for the sexes, would you?

Also, the person who that quote is from is Murray Rothbard, one of the central figures in developing American libertarianism.

>>109479
Why would you expect me to read this shit? Lol

You are insane.

>>109010
Go ahead, fucktard. It's your own funeral.

Morons like these better die off soon.

>>109066

and all of them will still get reelected

>>109421
>student plagarizes major assignment
>gets expelled
>head of the Department of Education plagarizes
>gets on the Trump payroll
Go ahead and cry "m-muh CTR" like Clinton even matters anymore.

Would Pence be better than Trump? Even if he was the GOPs crony at least he might think before acting. What do you guys think?

>>109406
I don't agree with that. I went to public school and got a great education, helped me and my wife get great jobs (both six figures)

>>109572
Now you're making shit up.

>>109579
Trump is fine.

>>109117
Wow that's really amazing that you know how the new healthcare plan will work out. Not only will it be bad but it will be worse than the ACA! Amazing stuff. How did you cultivate your powers of clairvoyance?

>>109599
So what? The federal government doesn't have constitutional power to decide on matters of health anyway.

>>109599
Obviously I don't know anything for sure. But from the way things are looking, with a bunch of healthcare floating around the Republican party and everyone unable to make up their collective minds as to which is best, the chances of reaching an agreement on one consistent and comprehensive plan are looking slim. The reason for this disarray is that many Republican politicians don't really believe in healthcare reform, but it is a political necessity at this point.

Good job, dumb Americans.

>>109604
See >>109600.

>>109607
The supreme court seems to think otherwise.

>>109611
>SCOTUS
>impartial and non-partisan
You almost got me there, fam.

>>109613
>impartial and non-partisan
That's not what I said I said:
The supreme court interprets the constitution. Not you. Period. That's the way it's always been in America and that's what the constitution itself says. So you can fuck right off with your pseudo-relativistic bullshit that conveniently always seems to lead to the conclusion that you are right and everyone who disagrees is wrong.

>>109615
You are under the misleading impression that SCOTUS has always been consistent on interpretations of the Constitution regarding the same sort of issues.

>>109616
No, I'm not. I'm saying, the law of the land is that the ACA is constitutional and any replacement that's similarly structured and laid out will be too, until the supreme court declares otherwise. You, on the other hand, seem to be under the misleading impression that only those supreme court rulings that you like and that match your political philosophy should be considered valid. That isn't how it works. Citizens United stands, even though it's fucking retarded. Plessy v Ferguson was a valid ruling even though it was fucking retarded and objectively wrong, because the supreme court can not produce invalid rulings. It is the final authority on constitutional interpretation.

>>109619
That doesn't mean I can't criticize SCOTUS for its selection bias.

>>109446
Also wanted to add that road infrastructure should be privatized, if people have such a problem with potholes then they should be the one to fill them, not with my money.

>>109333
Why '.....even fucking Laos'? are they not allowed to have better education system than America?

>>109333
>smaller country has better education system
Pottery

>>109580
I can tell you went to public school. Sorry.

>>109682
Laos is poorer than America. Their schooling ought to be worse.

How do you not get that? You must be deliberately ignoring reality. Another public school zombie.

>>109588
Wow way to answer my question. Trump seems to just sign whatever stupid shit is in front of him and does a shit job of enacting policies such as the travel ban disaster and pisses off foreign nations with his idiotic rhetoric. He won't listen to national intelligence or take advice from a lot of experts and demeans the media, a key part of the democratic process. Pence might have conservative policies that I personally disagree with, but at least he has government experience and knows when to take advice. So why wouldn't Pence be an improvement over Trump? I'm just curious if people like Trump because of memes or if they genuinely are willing to brush displayed lack of experience and incompetence under the rug

>>109010
Great..
Like we need for profit colleges. Welcome back Trump U.

>>109748
You're confusing strategy with apparent incompetence.

>>109748
With Pence I know what I"m getting. Bush 3.

With Trump its like being in a plane crashing straight to the ground. But in the mean time he is doing stunts with the plane.

So yea, I'm in it for the memes, tears, and shitfest we're going to get.

>>109123
solid post, thank you

>>109408
nobody reads your post if you say drumpf like a butthurt nigger

>>109680
Privatizing roads would fix a lot of our infrastructure problems.

>>110192
No it wouldn't

>>110192
Because privatising public services like healthcare and prisons has worked so well in the past

>>110288
And would you rather trust the government instead? Private interests will always be able to deliver a higher service then government because their incentive is to make money and gain customers, not waste it.

>>110291
>private interests will always be able to deliver a higher service then government >their incentive is to make money and gain customers, not waste it
kek, without as much of a breath between

>>110192

You act like "privatize" is just a magic word. What does it mean it terms of roads? Currently road repairs are typically bid on by private contractors, which is called public-private partnership. If the road management is privatized, what would incentivize the company to maintain the road -- it has a monopoly on that particular route? Also, how does it make a profit on a road -- tollways are the only reasonable ways to do so, but you can't set up tollbooths on every city or suburban street.

So when you say "privatize roads" you need to have a specific plan -- typically it means outsourcing the management structure to a private company while all the regulation and financial incentive is still driven by the central government. In practice it works about as well as the government oversight structure, and ranges from better to the government-only administration to far worse. But conservative lawmakers with their vast Econ 101 knowledge are satisfied as long as they can say it's "privatized".

>>109708
Why, because I have a great job and hold a better command of the English language than you do?

>>110339
I love how a post like this will get no response because it BTFO of the conservative world view

>>110539
I'm heavily conservative and I agree with him. My job is in making roads too so explain how I got BTFO

>>109403
>What we've got now isn't working.

so education welfare is the solution?

I find it funny that conservatives get all riled up whenever the government gives money to people for food or rent.. but whine when they can't get government money for school.

>>110641
Because the old neocons and old guard conservatives are typically not Trump conservatives. The Tea Party onwards has been cancer to the conservative party.

The only reason liberals hate her and what is being done is that they know this is going to create white flight out of the shitty schools and then it will just blatantly show that the single biggest problem with the public school system is the children.

>>110813
Well, public education was always a waste. The majority of plebs won't ever have to use it, and all the money spent into it is retarded (not to mention how unfair it is to those without children). Better to have an opt in system like, oh I don't know, a private education system?

>>110910
>user pays for public goods
r/libertarianism is that way

>>110930
>WHAT DO WE WANT? MORE GOVERNMENT
>WHERE DO WE WANT IT? EVERYWHERE

>>110933
>what do we want? privatised police, armed forces, education, just fucking everything
>when do we want it? once I've had my fair use of them for free, then they can be privatised, fuck you it was all owed to me because I was born, but it's not owed to anyone else because freedom

When it comes to public education, no need to change a fucking thing. Whats wrong w/ public school in S. Chi?

>>110935
>no u

So. Tiresome.

>>110957
>implying this sort of shitpost isn't
>>110933

>>110966
goooood one lol

>school-voucher
Isn't that what Sweden has?