how can music be "emotionally dishonest"? I know it's

>>75033152
Yes, of course, and you posted a prime example of emotional dishonesty. Basically, it's when an artist uses very basic and expected chord progressions in order to emulate a certain emotion, which of course fails everytime to anyone who isn't easily blinded by such pitiful tricks. It's very common in most /mu/core albums, and pop music in general.

Relies on the idea that the art and artist have to have some intrinsic connection or that that is somehow important or necessary. Complete bullshit, ignore any douchebag that uses stupid phrases like that. Pure pretension.

>>75033152
it's supposed to mean that the artist is pretending to be sad/angry/whatever in order to garner people's sympathybux. Not just portraying sadness, mind you, PRETENDING to be sad. Which is generally something that happens in the lyrics and in the artist's interactions with the media and the public.

Music itself, as in notes and stuff, can't be emotionally dishonest because it doesn't feel anything.

>>75033193
okay so then what is emotionally honest music?

>>75033228
Classical music in general. Folk music can be emotionally honest too, as it is passed from generation to generation

>>75033228
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wICsfTDDPYA

>>75033152
In effect, it's just another way to say "manipulative". The assumption being that art tricks naive people into feeling a certain way and into assuming certain things about the artist.

>>75033236
Nigga stop

>>75033228
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tv9YoYCKNoE

>>75033247
>>75033247
sounds like father john misty

>>75033224
This is what I think of every time someone brings up the "future of emo" generation of rappers. There's really nothing emo about it, the affected sadness is clearly just a fashion statement.

>>75033253
Stop what?

People, not music, have emotions, any dishonesty is entirely down to the listeners.

>>75033228
Music that's a genuine attempt to express genuine feelings
>>75033236
Definitely NOT classical music in general. Most classical composers had a very workmanlike approach of music. They made sad music when paid to make sad music, happy music when paid to make happy music etc

>>75033274
"emo" music in general has always been emotionally dishonest, whether it's emotive hardcore, midwest emo or emo trap.

>>75033291
this
rich white kids whining about tfw no gf and muh parents don't understand me.

>>75033281
No, it's entirely down to the artist

If I'm lying to you, you don't get to decide if I'm telling the truth or not. It's up to me.

>>75033285
>Definitely NOT classical music in general. Most classical composers had a very workmanlike approach of music. They made sad music when paid to make sad music, happy music when paid to make happy music etc
And yet, it sounds and IS less dishonest than pretty much any single artist relaying on his "emotions" to make music.

>>75033304
That doesn't mean it's dishonest, it just means it's blown way out of proportion

honestly I don't know what's more embarrassing: HONESTLY believing that tfw no gf is the worst thing in the world, or PRETENDING that you feel that way in order to get famous.

>>75033317
>sounds less dishonest
you do realize that it means fucking nothing, right?

>>75033210
>>75033210
>>75033210

>>75033308
>you don't get to decide if I'm telling the truth
Have you never had a conversation? Of course the listener gets to decide if the person is telling the truth.

>>75033401
What listener? I'll decide if you're listening to me or not. You don't get to decide that.

>>75033291
>>75033304
I don't think you can really defend that kind of blanket statement. "Never Meant" by American Football seems pretty genuine to me, it expresses a universally sad concept with serious delivery and appropriately sad instrumentation. Whether the listener can relate to the music is irrelevant to it being a genuine expression.

Which is different than sampling sad music and rapping over it about having a new bitch and doing cocaine in the back of the club, yeah? There's a disconnect there.

>>75033304
>>75033327
name one tfw no gf emo song

>>75033416
To you, someone else might find that very sad. Emotions are completely subjective. An emotional response is essentially as subjective as you could possibly get. The whole conversation is stupid. The term is stupid.

>>75033401
assume =/= decide

a decision has direct consequences on its object

>>75033451
My fists will have direct consequences on your object (head) you little bitch. Shut the fuck up. You're not smart.

Yes, rap is a good example of this. Braggadocio and gangster talk is inherently emotionally dishonest.

>>75033477
I'd be being emotionally dishonest if I said I'll be sad or at all remorseful when I pile-drive your skull into pulp you stupid little cretin.

>>75033470
I'm not smart you're just dumb.

>>75033496
lil peep pls go

>>75033507
Tell it to my Mensa certificate, brainlet.

>>75033436
Again,
>Whether the listener can relate to the music is irrelevant to it being a genuine expression.

So even songs that I don't like can be genuine emotional expressions.

On the other hand, I don't think you could listen to Lil Peep's "Benz Truck" and argue that it isn't manipulative. I think that's exactly what's dishonest about it, the instrumentation and the lyrics do not mesh. No one would claim this was emotional at all if the lyrics were over, say, a 2016 trap beat of the week.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3rkJ3L5Ce80

Name Top (3) dishonest album

>>75033425
all of them
>>75033416
>Which is different than sampling sad music and rapping over it about having a new bitch and doing cocaine in the back of the club, yeah? There's a disconnect there.
both are emotional dishonest. emo is fucking worst because majority of kids come from privileged homes

>>75033664
dishonest =/= illegitimate

emo kids don't have the right to feel the way they feel, but they do feel that way, so they're honest

>>75033664
But the referenced nu-emo artists also come from privileged homes.

Further, class has nothing to do with it. Rich people can feel genuine sadness as well as poor people. Generally, emo songs aren't about money at all.

>>75033695
>don't have the right
>kids don't have the right to feel sad because their parents make more than the national average

come on dude
I'd understand if you were saying they didn't have the right to complain about not getting enough in life or being privileged enough but being happy and having money are totally different things

This thread taught me that the "emotionally dishonest" meme is just bait and has no basis in reality or intelligent thinking

The notion of emotionally dishonest musicis pretty much the notion that the artist isn't feeling the emotions he's attempting to portray in the music. It's inherently flawed because you can't know the artist's intent most of the time. A song might be extremely true to what it actually is, but sound completely fake, and vice-versa.

Honestly, I'm not a fan of GY!BE, but I wouldn't quite say it's emotionally dishonest. Something that would be emotionally dishonest is Taylor Swoft, for example.

GY!BE is definitely pretentious and uses quite lofty ideas to prop up their bad music but I wouldn't say they were "dishonest"

The only thing I can think of is Hospice and how that uses events that never actually affected the people playing the music to emotionally manipulate the listener.

You could make the argument that all stories do this on some level but usually we're given some frame of reference and context for why we should feel sad in those stories. All we hear in Hospice is a guy that sounds very sad singing about things that he has never personally experienced in order to make the listeners feels sad

I'm sure its a possibility that whoever wrote the music did have a relative with cancer or was in shitty relationship at one point but creating a fictional narrative to pour that shit in reeks of dishonesty to me.

You know who the kind of person that uses phrases like "emotionally dishonest" to describe music is? They're someone who has fucking nothing interesting to say about music. Who fucking cares if Billy McGee wasn't really all heartbroken about his dead mother or whatever else? He might have written a great song nonetheless.

>>75033761
>Swoft
Fuck, my eyes are still weird from last night.

File: kek.jpg (44KB, 340x371px) Image search: [Google]

44KB, 340x371px

>/mu/ actually taking this /pol/ meme seriously

>>75033708
what privileged home does chief keef come from again?

>>75033802
t.consumer

who cares of animals get butchered and treated like shit from the farmers.
this meat tastes so fucking good

>>75033664
>emo is fucking worst because majority of kids come from privileged homes

Why is that bad though? The lyrics, stories and emotions in their songs don't have to manifest in reality before being written.

>>75033838
Nice analogy dipshit. This is the kind of person who thinks this idea is anything but completely retarded.

>>75033841
then they are actors playing a role.

>>75033855
t.consumer
enjoy your heart disease. because of muh taste

>>75033838
Vegans, ladies and gentlemen.

>>75033866
I'm actually furious at how fucking sub-par this trolling is. Step your game up or fuck off you tedious cunt.

>being so autistic you recognize memes but still want them to be explained to you as if they're serious

>>75033858
Nothing wrong with that though, as long as it's an honest portrayal

>>75033885
im telling you simple facts bud. you could careless where it comes from. just how it feels to you
enjoy your heart disease

>>75033893
nothing wrong with being emotional dishonest either.
we are just pointing it out.

>>75033898
>you could care less

this is the one thing that never fails to bother me
how retarded do you have to be to say this shit unironically

>>75033898
You are genuinely terrible at this. I hate that you're trying.

>>75033924
>>75033930
why are you avoiding the truth of eating meat because of muh taste?
could you answer this please

File: 8d9fbb79.png (346KB, 790x395px) Image search: [Google]

346KB, 790x395px

hey

>>75033946
No one cares about dumb animals, you cow fucking cuck.

>>75033946
Ok, here's an actual insight for you. Unless you are growing all your own food and living a self-sustainable lifestyle somewhere entirely away from all economic contribution, your veganism is completely void. Let's be honest, you're not. You spend money, and you're killing animals. It doesn't matter if you go to the supermarket and only buy kale and celery and tofu or whatever else. You spend that money there, and in your mind it just stops dead, having reached it's conclusion at a moral highground. Except it doesn't. It goes to Bob, Jim, James, Kate, and they go out and fucking spend it on meat and animal products. What you are doing is pointless. You are delaying the chain of events by a single stop. It does nothing. I don't doubt the morality of veganism. If everyone in the world suddenly decided to stop eating meat, I'd be all aboard for that. But they wont. We will reach the stage where it is possible with science to create animals from stem-cells and DNA in petri dishes and kill them without having to resort to animal cruelty, and veganism will die out as anything more than a morality-free diet Until then, please shut the fuck up.

>>75034019
But if meat demand goes down so does supply.

>>75033224
>Music itself, as in notes and stuff, can't be emotionally dishonest because it doesn't feel anything.

What? of course it can be emotionally dishonest. Notes express the emotion of the musician as much as the words do.

>>75033193
Oh look it's another retard who thinks he knows about chord progressions

Classical composers would commonly go back and forth between 2 chords and made it sound beautiful because, if you know shit about music, chords are just structure

>>75033193
this meme again

>>75034621
emotions OF THE MUSICIAN
not of the music

>>75033237
thanks for posting this