Why are artist that don't write or produce their own

>>72811126
because poptimists have transformed top 40 into "if you don't like mass-appeal pop music you're probably a closet racist/bigot/homophobe/etc"

>>72811126
because (and this may surprise you) people like the music

It's always been that way until a very recent period of time in modern history and it really doesn't matter at all, ever heard of folk? standards? the entirety of blues history?

>>72811158
What really irks me about it is that there's a huge width of diversity in pop music outside of Top 40 shit but they won't bother to even talk about any of that because it doesn't involve their "queens". They don't even actually like pop music, they just like being attention whores.

yaaassssssssssssss slay mama

>>72811184
>They don't even actually like pop music, they just like being attention whores.
whats life without attention?

>>72811172
Yes, music that they didn't even write or produce. So why is an artist considered amazing when they didn't do anything to make the music that people love beside sing? It's not her music, I bet she has people to tell her on what key for her to sing on for each song.

Because people who listen to top 40 and don't feel guilty are fucking stoopid.
>Not knowing this

poptimists now also reviewing One Direction solo projects. they're pretty silly.

>>72811390
She's a great singer, what more do you need? It's not like a record company chose somebody at random with literally no talent to spend millions writing songs for.

Plus, while Beyonce didn't write the songs or produce the beats of her last two albums, she did function as a producer for the album and directly worked with the producers and songwriters to get the sounds she wanted.

Also, >>72811181 is right, and what I've come to realize over time in regards to >>72811184 is that most people care about music as entertainment rather than art, and there's nothing inherently wrong with that. They aren't getting the full emotional and artistic impact that more challenging music has to offer, but it's not like you have to do that to lead a happy life

>>72811441
I can understand people liking her for entertainment, and you make some great points, but my argument is why do people like to label her as the best musical artist? Why do people make these claims? (I'm probably gonna answer my own question) Is it their way of supporting their favorite artist?

>>72811441
I get that but poptimists get on "rockists" for not appreciating their music but it feels shallow when they only care for a small portion of their own music anyway. I'm not the biggest fan of guys who wank about classic rock but they tend to branch more into what they like than poptimists do.

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>>72811126
But artist who do. Gets shitted on and mocked by /mu/.

Like pic related

>>72811426
Harry Styles was pretty good. Chill.

>>72811505
I've never met anybody who's unironically said that Beyonce is the greatest artist of our time, but I'd assume that anybody who did would mean that they found her music very personally meaningful rather than an honest attempt at music criticism.

>>72811532
Personally I dislike rockists more because they're infinitely more elitist. In the end though, how much someone enjoys the music they listen to isn't directly informed by how deep or wide their knowledge is

>>72811550
I don't disagree with you entirely and I like your attitude, I just think if you're going to preach about something to people outside your clique, you need depth to back it up.

>>72811550
I like you. You're literally the only person I've had a genuinely good conversation with on /mu/

>>72811126
shouldn't they be praised? if so why?
It's their voice and their interpretation, sure you should praise the producer the same way

>>72811585
You aren't wrong that you should be able to back it up, but most people outside of high school/early college don't evangelize their music quite as hard and ignorantly

>>72811588
Thanks!

>Hate Capitalism
>Love pop music

Do you see the double standards here?

>>72811184
"Pop" is short for -POPULAR-, therefore nothing that doesn't appear on the Top 40 qualifies as pop.

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>>72811660
Popular refers to the style, not its actual popularity.

Who cares good music is good music

>>72811172
you can like Beyonce's music w/o liking Beyonce. The problem is that normies don't know the difference

>>72811660
Pop as a genre has stylistic signifiers. What you're talking about is pop as a radio format.

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>>72811660
pop is a GENRE you half-wit

>>72811126
>>72811390
people don't care because it doesn't actually matter

>>72811441
Holy fugg, this guy knows about his shit!

>>72811539
Bruno Mars is not a good thing

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because the "industry" has destroyed the art of /mu/

>>72811126
she has a writing and producing credit on every song on that album though

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>>72811637
no one said anything about capitalism

>>72811126
>>72811856
also musicians who are sampled get a writing credit. the whole "U NEED ALL THOSE PEEPL CUZ U SUCK" attitude really misunderstands the process of making an album at that scale

>>72811441
>She's a great singer, what more do you need?
I think we're done here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNCcIyIuarU
Decent maybe, great - definitely not. Not to mention "her lyrics".

>>72811805
Oh, really? So, on what merits do you praise musicians if not writing their own material or producing their own records are one of them?

>>72811923
>making an album at that scale
Get over yourself, it's not a classical or an orchestral piece.

>>72812252
I didn't survive the cancer I got from that intro

>>72812274
unlike the rest of /mu/, I judge music based on whether or not I like it.

>>72812318
And I expected a worthwile reply...

>>72812361
>on /mu/
>expects worthwhile discussion

you've already messed up tw2ce

>>72812252
Rihanna isn't Beyonce my dude

>>72811441
>most people care about music as entertainment rather than art
And that's why so much basic garbage gets the high praise.
>haha love the beat!
>whoa, BASS DROP haha!

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>>72812400
>Rihanna isn't Beyonce my dude

>>72812361
How is enjoyment not a good criteria to judge music on.

>>72812418
You are getting mad at people enjoying things

>>72812400
>>72812421
Doesn't this speak volumes about popular music? You can make an honest mistake due to lack of individuality or any originality. And it took people more than 10 minutes to notice.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPl3e7gjk2s

>>72812453
This is what you should actually hear
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f1nYC7_VZGw&ab_channel=Will

>>72812439
>How is enjoyment not a good criteria to judge music on.
It is, but the average listener doesn't think at all about music on any significant level. I mean, how many times have you heard something like:
>>72812418
Rather than a discussion about chord progressions, tri tone substitutions, drop 2 voicings, arpeggios, arrangements?

>>72812453
I don't get what you're trying to prove, she sounds incredible in that video

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>>72812453
>And it took people more than 10 minutes to fall for my obvious bullshit

10 minutes is an eternity on /b/

10 minutes is almost instantly on /mu/

>>72812467
>>72812488
Again, decent. Are you aware that Aretha Franklin is still alive? That's incredible for you. And she is a true original. She is the voice every female singer today has in some realm. Sure, it may be passable or good, but unique, innovative, one of a kind - no.

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>>72812487
>being this pretentious
>being this unaware
>being this autist
>being

>>72812516
>I have no arguments
>Autist, unaware, pretentious
Brilliant. You sure proved me wrong.

>>72812528
>>being this pretentious
>>being this unaware
>>being this autist
>>being

>>72812511
Nobody brought up innovation, originality, or uniqueness. We're talking about pop singers being good singers, which they are.

You're essentially saying that music cannot be good unless it's breaking new ground and it's incredibly pretentious

>>72812553
Again:
>>72812528
You can continue if you like.

>>72812565

>>72812558
>You're essentially saying that music cannot be good unless it's breaking new ground and it's incredibly pretentious
Why are you romanticizing the genre of music which panders to the lowest common denominator? Just see it for what it is and admit it.

>>72812579
The only person conflating pop music with great art is you, and it isn't anyone's fault but your own that you can't get enjoyment from well-constructed pop

>>72812604
>The only person conflating pop music with great art is you
How did you deduce this? I'm clearly against taking pop seriously.

>>72812487
>MMMMMMM THE AVERAGE LISTENER IS NOT AS INTELLIGENT AS I, HOW DARE THESE PLEBEIANS DIFFER FROM ME IN THEIR OPINIONS?

>>72812635
Because the only person comparing pop to art is you. You're taking it far more seriously than anybody else in the thread and it's embarrassing

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>>72811856
She's only credited for one song

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lemonade_(Beyoncé_album)

>>72812680
These are my posts:
>>72812252
>>72812274
>>72812453
>>72812487
>>72812511
But please tell me again how I'm a pop fan.

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>>72812683
DELETE THIS NEPHEW

>>72812683
>mobile link
>she's actually """"""credited"""""" on every song

senpai

>>72812708
How do you not get it? Nobody has said you're a pop fan. However, what you and you alone are doing is comparing pop to more artistic music while the rest of us have been saying nothing more than pop can be enjoyable. You're getting worked up by something absolutely nobody is saying and misunderstanding everyone trying to let you know about it.

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>>72812683

>>72812733
Thanks for finally clarifying your position after an hour.

>>72812747
You're the only person who hasn't understood this and you're still condescending.

/mu/, everyone

>>72812747
see
>>72812516

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>>72812717
>All those writters
damn son

>>72811545
Yikes

>>72812717
>tmw you realize Beyonce last name is Knowles


Well shit, I'm sorry. Still, that's a shit ton of writers for just a song. I wonder how much of it she actually written.

>>72811740
Sexists

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lemonade_(Beyonc%C3%A9_album)#Accolades

this is just an unnecessary amount of awards for an ok album

You're a pedantic mongoloid if you think that it's a necessity quality "good music" to be composed by the performing artist.

>>72812421
Sexism

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>>72812717
>15 Writters for a shit song

really makes you think...

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why is this hack praised? didn't even write his own music

>>72812911
jokes aside... Frank Sinatra was as much an industry plant as Beyonce is now

>>72812867
>he doesn't know about we wuz kangz secret society
they control hiphop senpai

>>72811441
>She's a great singer
She lip syncs frequently, so clearly not.

>>72812994
see
>>72812467

all that matters is the final product, who gives a shit about who made it, no need to fuel the mega-ego's of so many artists even further

i think the artist doesn't mean shit, i couldn't care less if my fav song was made by 1 guy in his basement or by a company.

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>>72812992
If black people control black music does it matter?

I mean let them have their thing

>>72813010
See:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHsnZT7Z2yQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJXLqAutql4
And if she's such a great singer, why would she even lip sync once?

>>72813046
an underlying question that no one is addressing is: Is music a competition?

>>72813064
Bands like Dream Theater are surely trying to make it a competition.

>>72813064
Yes

>>72813082
are they? or are they just trying to make good music? I find it hard to believe that everyone is trying to be
>the best
>the best
>the best

>>72813084
oh ok thx

>>72813046
You just don't quit do you? Those links don't disprove that Beyonce is a phenomenal vocalist, they just show other great vocalists.

As for lip synching, it's because pop concerts are more about the show than just the music, and dancing and singing perfectly at the same time is ridiculously hard.

You're probably referring to that one time she lip synched the national anthem though, so here are her own words:

The 31-year-old singer said she's a "perfectionist" and wanted her performance for President Barack Obama to be a memorable one. She called the day "emotional."

"I practice until my feet bleed and I did not have time to rehearse with the orchestra," she said. "Due to no proper sound check, I did not feel comfortable taking a risk. It was about the president and the inauguration, and I wanted to make him and my country proud, so I decided to sing along with my pre-recorded track, which is very common in the music industry. And I'm very proud of my performance."

>>72813046
I assume because much of her stage shows are about the choreography and the visuals, and rather than compromising the singing during physically intense parts of the show she justs lip syncs. Not that I've seen any live footage of hers, I'm just assuming.

Not that the argument is particularly good anyway. Michael Jackson was inarguably one of the best singers ever, and he lip synced live as well. More often it's about taking cautionary measures for live shows rather than hiding sub-par singing abilities.

>>72813082
I can't tell if this is praising or ridiculing Dream Theater

>>72813082
>>72813140
Ridiculing of course. Like, what is this?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwkcRTNMsWs
Sure, the band can play it, but who would find this song memorable? And this is coming from a progressive rock fan, among other genres.

>>72813154
Thank goodness, Dream Theater fans are the worst

>>72813123
>Performance for a politician
Yeah, thanks, we can know see that she's a person of integrity.

>>72813171
now*

>>72811126
The same reason rich people who get rich through inheritance and listening to other people tell them where to invest their money are praised as smart.

>>72811193
>saying mama in 2028

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http://thequietus.com/articles/22389-rockism-poptimism

this article does a pretty good job summing up why poptimism has started to become a problem.