Rockism is the cancer killing /mu/. You will never get a good

rock is built on anti-establishment ethos
the other stuff is not
dunno' what you expect from misfits and wastrels

Indie rock is literally the only good genre

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>You will never get a good thread about soul, R&B, funk
It happens, where are you?
>classical
There's a classical general.
>dance music
There's a bleep general.
>jazz
See above.

Stop bitching and participate. It's your fault.

it's because /mu/s average age is like 12 or so

>>70850081
>I, The Witchfinder
bro.............................................you listen to f*cking metal for godsake

>>70850200
Yeah, and a lot of other things.

>>70849885
>rock is built on anti-establishment ethos
>the other stuff is not
What? Like this is objectively false, even when adding punk rock to the mix.

Soul, R&B, certain folk music and jazz have their histories in far more oppressive atmospheres coming from the establishment than anything whiteboy rockers ever had to deal with.

Same with dance music, which has its origins in violent Jamaican spots, the hellhole that is Detroit, and the kind of discrimination gay minorities dealt with in Chicago.

Classical doesn't have that kind of societal anti establishment ethos attached to it, but from an ideological perspective towards how music making is done, in the past 70 or so years classical has gone so far out from the establishment that people still think of the radicalization of classical music and call it it's "downfall" due to how out there it became.

>>70850549
all they ever did was boo hoo complain about their troubles like drunks in a bar

rock, real rock, is weaponized against the establishment

>>70850247
listening to 10 """""different"""" genres of metal doesn't count as other things

>>70850589
That's because they had something to actually complain about, as in there was actual conflict. Rock was never weaponized against the establishment when it WAS the establishment all along.

>>70849814
>because they aren't marketed predominantly by "COHESIVE CONCEPT ALBUMS!!!!"
[citation needed]

>>70849933
Unironically this.

>>70850661
What are your favourite techno singles then

>>70849814
That's not what rockism means.

>>70850673
Not relevant

Waiting for that citation

>>70850701
What do you want a citation for?

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>>70849814
>or Jazz outside of Miles/Coltrane

A H E M

>>70850731
>You will never get a good thread about soul, R&B, funk, folk, classical, dance music outside of Daft Punk/Burial/Aphex Twin or jazz outside of Miles/Coltrane the list could go on because they aren't marketed predominantly by "COHESIVE CONCEPT ALBUMS!!!!".

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i just read the defenition and welp that's 100% me id totally prefer things in a cohesive album format

sorry guys :(

>>70850754
There are like three different assertions there, which do you want citation for?

>>70850761
Why does it matter if the good music you are hearing is presented alone or amongst other songs?

>>70850762
All of them

>>70850779
>>70850661

>>70850794
[Citation needed]

>>70850779
Because my musical attention span is about 50 minutes, not 5
>>70850807
for what?

>>70850798
Im still not sure if you want citation showing that dance and jazz arent marketed via concept albums or if you accept that but want citation showing that thats why they arent discussed in depth on /mu/

>>70850609
lurk more

>>70850810
Listen to 10 5 minute singles then?

>>70850829
>concept albums
Why are you throwing this "concept" in here? Most albums in general are not concept albums.

>>70850831
get some taste first

>>70850851
That's more work to continually put on different releases.

iut would be easier of I was just listening to one album for that length of time.

>>70850855
Most albums widely discussed on /mu/ are concept albums, i think all of the "/mu/ essentials" are

>>70850894
Like what specifically?

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>>70850779
i guess i just prefer it to be organized in that way

i've got nothing against it being presented in other ways.

but like, let me give you the example of electronic music. now, i've tried getting into it, but it's a mess, singles everywhere, messy comps, it felt overwhelming just having a dozen singles and stuff to go through.

and then there's the issue of the songs themselves. i like crystal castles, for example, because their songs are still written in a typical pop format, in the same way that a rock band would write theirs.

it's not about having a verse-chorus or whatever, it's more about being able to anticipate how it's gonna go. i understand the movements and it changes in a way that i understand. stepping outside of that (as happens often with some electronic music) it starts to feel ungrounded, and i lose interest.

then again, with a lot of avant-garde and shit i listen to their live albums (or comps or whatever) because then i can hear that progression again.

i'm in no way arguing that one way is better or anything, this is literally just a "my comfort" kind of thing.

>>70850885
Have you ever heard of playlists?

>>70850872
taste is subjective

>>70850894
Retard

>>70850919
It's still easier to put on an album than to sit and collect all the songs and make a playlist.

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>>70850912
Everything on here except arguably tvu&
(Although i have never listened to popol vuh so dont know about that)

>>70850919
it would fuck up my archive.

it's the only thing in my life that is at all organized

>>70850919
>playlists
Albums are just playlists made the by the artist themselves. That's what they wanted me to hear anyways

>>70850978
What are the concepts of Pet Sounds, Loveless, TMR and Kid A?

(give citations as well)

>>70850962
But you will widen your taste and knowledge with only minimal effort

>>70850913
Maybe you should step out of your comfort zone more? What is there to lose?

>>70850987
A playlist by an artistis more like a DJ Mix, honestly if you are autistic about singles for some reason you could probably listen to DJ Mixes and podcasts to get into dance.

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>>70851004
There is strong artistic cohesiveness on those albums

>>70851005
>But you will widen your taste and knowledge with only minimal effort
I could do that with listened to 10 albums.
>>70851040
Or I could just listen to albums because that's what I like?

>>70851005
there's nothing to lose, and i try it regularly, but like i said, i just end up losing interest

that's the other problem for me getting into electronic music or hip hop. the former i can get into intellectually but doesn't excite me personally and the latter can excite me but i just don't get it intellectually (it's not even a question of like "i feel it's stupid," rather i just can't hear a "story" to it, like it doesn't resonate with me).

don't get me wrong, i don't listen strictly to like "rock" music, i listen to a lot of different stuff, but it always falls into an album format.

>>70851063
You cant gain much knowledge of dance music at all by listening to ten albums

>>70851060
Nice goalpost shifting

>>70851092
Where is the goalpost shifting lol

>>70851089
>dance music
When did I mention dance music at all?

EDM is shit though

>>70851115
If you dont listen to dance music then your taste and knowledge of music will always be strictly limited because you are depriving yourself of hundreds of genres

>>70851113
"artistic cohesiveness" =/= concept

The albums I mentioned are not concept albums at all.

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>>70849814
aphex twin and burial are great though

>>70851130
why would anyone want to listen to fucking edm?

>>70851117
What are some shit dance singles that you listened to to come to this conclusion?

>>70851130
listening to 10 """""different"""" genres of dance doesn't count as other things

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>>70849814
>he doesn't listen to full albums
>mfw

>>70851131
Well my citation says otherwise, can you prove it wrong with a citation of your own?

>>70851151
fuck if i know
just random shit normies like that gets played in public

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>>70851131
>pet sounds
>not a concept album
do you know who phil spector is bud

>>70851144
>i have never listened to dance music but i know its bad by magic

>>70851159
Haha yeah i forgot ragga is the exact same genre as detroit techno. Even though they were developed in different countries and influenced by different genres, cultures and traditions they somehow ended up being exactly the same! How mental!

>>70851229
all edm is the same corporate manufactured garbage, yes

>>70851195
Wouldn't you think i was an idiot if i dismissed rock as a genre because i have heard normies playing shit like McFly, Korn and Avenged Sevenfold in public?

>>70851175
>Well my citation says otherwise
The implications are that all albums are concept albums, which desalinates the term into uselessness. Why do you have poor artistic analysis skills?
>>70851212
>ripping off Phil Spector is a concept
No

>>70851229
>Haha yeah i forgot ragga is the exact same genre as detroit techno. Even though they were developed in different countries and influenced by different genres, cultures and traditions they somehow ended up being exactly the same! How mental!
That's nice.

So do you listen to albums when you listen to non-dance genres?

>>70851258
>Wouldn't you think i was an idiot if i dismissed rock as a genre because i have heard normies playing shit like McFly, Korn and Avenged Sevenfold in public?
Except rock music can be quite good. All edm/dance music/whatever you want to call it is inherently nonlegitimate and garbage.

>>70851260
Where is that implication? The majority of albums are simply collections of songs without any concept or cohesion.

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>>70851260
>>ripping off Phil Spector [isn't] a concept
>nuance isn't real because I DON'T LIKE IT AHHHHHHHH

let me guess, wilson should have dealt with and explored "actual concepts," right?

this is a fake screencap, you edited it to include your forced anti-album meme. no relevent voice has said there is anything inherently rock-centric about organizing songs into albums

http://portpcfix.com/wikifusion/index.php/Rockism

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rockism_and_poptimism

>>70851240
which corporation manufactured this?
https://youtu.be/xboVY_5a4Yc

>>70851277
I listen to dance albums sometimes, I listen to rock singles sometimes.

>>70851296
Whys that?

>>70851363
fuck if i know
it still sounds like generic shit with disortion

>>70851299
>Where is that implication?
See >>70851060
>The majority of albums are simply collections of songs without any concept or cohesion.
That's what I said here >>70850855 Thanks for agreeing with me
>>70851335
>let me guess, wilson should have dealt with and explored "actual concepts," right?
Yes because that's what an actual concept album is.
>>70851363
>I listen to dance albums sometimes, I listen to rock singles sometimes.
Then what do you care?

EDM is gay and shit! Singles are for normies!!
*Listens to Moth / Wolf Cub*

>2017
>still thinking of overall album releases as a way to judge the works of a musical artist
What the fuck? You guys are dumb. That rockist shit should've ended in the early 2000s when individual computer files of music became a thing. Before the idea of there being like individual FLAC and MP3 files yeah it made more sense to judge by overall releases because that's kinda how a listener was forced to go through a record, but that's not the case anymore. The Album Era is more or less dying/over at this point, and the Playlist era is what exists now. Sure one can still release a concept based LP or a DJ Mix, but that's not all the popular music medium is limited to. Grow up and get hip, grandpas.

>>70851405
IDM is good though. EDM is just trash.

>>70849885
Rock is anti-establishment what?!

>>70851396
I never disagreed with you, i just said that /mu/ almost exclusively discusses concept albums.
>Yes because that's what an actual concept album is.
[Citation needed]

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>>70851396
>Yes
>actual
to reiterate
>nuance isn't real because i don't like it

>>70851461
con·cept al·bum
noun
noun: concept album; plural noun: concept albums

a rock album featuring a cycle of songs expressing a particular theme or idea.
>>70851469
nuance =/= narrative

Otherwise all albums would be concept albums, wouldn't they?

>>70851433
Moth is undeniably EDM idiot, its in 4/4

>>70851496
We both agree that definition is wrong since it specifies rock and we would both agree there are conceptual hip-hop albums. It also doesn't state the themes or ideas have to be lyrical, a cohesive style is an expression of an idea.

>>70851496
Plenty of albums are just a random collection of songs with two or three singles chucked in, which certainly is not conceptual

>>70851509
It doesn't sound like EDM. Burial is more innovative and experimental.

>>70851394
https://youtu.be/rc85cGTlKLY
Is this also generic shit? How can they both be generic if they sound completely different.

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>>70851496
>narrative

the narrative is that wilson built the album around interpretations of spector's sound, emphasis on interpretations since the overall style, attitude and color palette(s) varies greatly from spector
you would know this if you listened to pet sounds in mono, or at least did a cursory read-through on wikipedia lol

>>70851615
it's boring shit you have to be on molly to enjoy
it has no musical worth

>>70851584
Thanks for agreeing with me
>>70851554
>since it specifies rock
Not relevant
>>70851554
>It also doesn't state the themes or ideas have to be lyrical, a cohesive style is an expression of an idea.
How else would they communicate a narrative or unifying concept?
>the narrative is that wilson built the album around interpretations of spector's sound
[citation needed]

>>70851630
>>70851656

>>70851600
t. Guy with no knowledge of EDM
Most of burials output is a genre of EDM called 2-step garage.

>>70851656
It is relevant to the credibility of your source you dimwit. There is blatantly at least one factual error there so it isnt reliable.

>>70851630
Pet Sounds is just a shifty pop album with a few barbershop quartet harmonies with a bunch of songs about >tfwngf chosen because they were the best ditties since the last album lmao

The only reason it's praised is because Yanks are jelly of The Beatles

>>70851632
Psychedelic rock is just boring shit you have to be on acid to enjoy, it has no musical worth :^)

>>70851632
Rock is boring shit you have to be drunk to "enjoy"

EDM is boring, IDM only please!!
*listens to the field*

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>>70851733
you's trollin guy

>>70851656
>>the narrative is that wilson built the album around interpretations of spector's sound
>[citation needed]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pet_Sounds#Concept_and_inspiration

>Wilson stated: "If you take the Pet Sounds album as a collection of art pieces, each designed to stand alone, yet which belong together, you'll see what I was aiming at. ... It wasn't really a song concept album, or lyrically a concept album; it was really a production concept album." He added that the album may be considered an "interpretation" of Phil Spector's Wall of Sound recording methods.

>>70851656
You can communicate a concept without words obviously. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Musical_Joke
Screaming isnt a fucking word but it still communicates things

>>70849814
It's an absurd claim to pretend the reason people don't talk about non rock genres is because they are not cohesive concept albums. If that were true, then this board would love stuff like AMM or Umm Kulthum where their albums are just one giant track, but instead you'd get viewed as pretentious. Most genres have just as much cohesive concept albums as rock and are viewed by rockists on the same level. Where your assumption is so clearly wrong is that this rockist mentality doesn't shut out other genres, what it shuts out is music from before the 60's...and that's why those things aren't discussed here. The reason why non-white genres aren't discussed should be obvious (it's not racism btw).

>>70850699
this

>>70851978
But it's also true that a lot of the best stuff in the non-rock world doesn't come in the format of traditional LPs though. You're right that rockists don't often enjoy the one long track type LPs, either. The appreciation is very limited to a shallow specification of LP.

But the thing is, that this doesn't even necessarily just count for non-rock music, either. Robert Wyatt for example, made rock music, but outside two critically acclaimed records, it's been inconsistent albums with VERY high points and some low points. If his two acclaimed LPs plus all the other individual good tracks from his other LPs makes up more good music than say...someone with three full good LPs instead of two, should the earlier artist not also be worth talking about? With music that's also worth checking out despite being released in a format that limits some of the really good stuff?

All I know is that neutral milk hotel is fucking garbage. I downloaded the album today and had to delete that trash after the third song. Is everyone here just jobless hippies? There was no redeeming qualities in that shitty album that gets shilled everywhere.

Proof

>>70849508

>>70852104
Well, I think the problem there is a lot of older music was reviewed in a day where you had to buy the whole album, so if an album is mostly terrible with one great thing, is it right to ask someone to pay for a bunch of shit they don't want?

In the modern era, this is no longer the case. but critics have to move away from just rating albums to change the viewpoint of the person who has just always known the album format.

For my part, I don't discuss a lot of my all-time favorite music on here just because it is so hard to post an album but specify that only a number of tracks are worth checking out.

I am not ashamed of my rockist tendencies and how they have shaped my taste. This is a free discussion zone and polarity encourages discussion. Plus, lumping hip hop fans in with the rockists is just plain wrong. Hip hop still embraces the single and encourages DJ sets and playlists. It's more akin to electronic dance music in terms of format alignment.

>>70850978
>Money Store
>King Crimson
>Talking Heads

This is bait. Putting out tracks that fit a general theme rather than just compiling a list of singles doesn't make it a fucking concept album you absolute autist.

>>70851718
Not how wikipedia works. Try again
>>70851781
>It wasn't really a song concept album
End of story
>>70851838
Over the course of an album?