I think I finally get the difference between Sunset Shimmer and

>>28490352

Didn't read lol

>>28490352
Glimmer is autistic. I'm not even trying to insult. She's autistic.

>>28490352
Great analysis, family.

>>28490352
I agree with this.

>>28490393
Sociopaths are pretty much on the spectrum so yeah, kind of, but it'd have to be high-functioning since she can at least grasp most of the structures of social interaction even if she doesn't actually absorb their meaning.

>>28490352

I just have a problem with her being so damn powerful. I mean sure she's naturally gifted, but damn she's on Twilight's level already and she's an Alicorn that was taught by Celestia herself.

I mean shit man, if just practicing magic makes you this fucking powerful then unicorns really are OP.

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>>28490352
Glimmer is autistic but god damn, she doesn't need to be. In the season 5 finale we get a scene of Glimmer spending time with the rest of the mane 6, doing things they enjoy etc. and showing that she can be friends with them. Then fucking Haber takes the reins and it's almost like none of that ever happened.

>Baking a cake with Pinkie Pie frightens me
You literally did it before.

The point of the scene at the end of the finale is so the writers could say "okay, so Glimmer's good friends with the mane 6 - next season we can have proper episodes about her" but she's become a new Discord. She's still "evil" deep down, like Discord. Problem is it doesn't make sense with Glimmer. Discord is naturally the way he is, he's the spirit of chaos etc. Glimmer is just a regular unicorn, it makes no sense that she would be doing this shit.

>>28490432
In order for Glimmer to be an effective narrative device for Twilight, she needs to be powerful enough that her learning the value of friendship actually has some stakes. The cold open was entirely a reminder that Glimmer is dangerous and doesn't hold back, so if she doesn't learn friendship it would be very bad for Equestria.

She was established from the outset as a magical prodigy who just lacked the training and focus to learn the same way Twilight had, so Twilight teaching her spells would obviously make her more powerful. Twilight's power comes more from her love of study than raw power (though she has a fair bit of that too), so we're almost meant to be worried that Twilight's love of teaching is turning Glimmer into a dynamo but her skills at teaching friendship aren't quite as refined.

I definitely think Twilight saw this episode through the lense of her experiences in Lesson Zero and figured Glimmer was just under a lot of stress and made an innocent mistake that snowballed. She didn't see the very deliberate and conscious decisions Glimmer made to make this happen and doesn't recognize that she didn't absorb why controlling her friends was wrong beyond "That's not how to complete this part of your training".

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>>28490432
The thing with that is, FiM never really focused on this. Magic is just part of the setting, but it's not the core focus. FiM is about friendship first and foremost and it doesn't (strive to) have deep magical lore. TL;DR: you're reading too much into this.

>>28490510
Did you miss that in this very episode, Glimmer clarifies that she's worried about baking a cake with Pinkie because she thinks she's being graded on baking?

Those scenes at the end of season 5 confirmed that Glimmer can socialize, but she's taken to Friendship Training the same way she takes to any challenge - and the opening scene of this episode showed how recklessly far she was willing to go in her Magic Training. She sees learning friendship as something she can game and maximize in a competitive way.

Another difference between Sunset and Starlight is that Sunset likes competition and being the best, but she also seems to like to challenge herself and respects friendly competition. Starlight seems to see competition as more like opposition to be crushed, which is why she quickly went from completing one lesson to trying to complete them all, then instead of backing down when she bit off more than she could chew decided to magic the problem into submission.

Starlight is not 100% turbo-autist, but she is definitely not seeing what's wrong with her outlook.

>>28490352
Nice analysis fampai but you left one episode out that debunks this theory, and that's No Second Prances.
In the episode Starlight actually cares for Trixie and feels betrayed when she finds out that she was used,kinda, to get under Twilight's skin. She forgave her because she liked her and wanted her as a friend.
I think that the problem with GlimGlam is that she is basically forced to be friend with the others just because they are Twilight's friends. Sure she eventually got to like them but not because she was intrested in them in the first place unlike what happened with Trixie.

In this episode she was forced to hang out with the others when she didn't want to and so found a way to get "rid" of them in the most fast efficent way so she could compleate her assignment.

>>28490541
Nice shitpost /hsg/

>>28490352
It's wonderful, isn't it?

>>28490609
>/hsg/
What is that?

>morality

>>28490536

Except she was already fighting on even ground with Twilight in the season 5 final.

It's just something that bothers me because if she wasn't so efficient at magic episodes like this would be much more interesting.

But to try and stay on topic, I suppose the problem I have is that rather rit's the writers themselves or the family friendly filter Hasbro is forcing on them the character study is not going to go anywhere as deep as it is here.

It's a shame too, it would be cool to see a sort of anti-hero type character develop out of Starlight.

>>28490631
Starlight was better at fighting, not better at magic. You can see in the fight montage that Starlight actually got some direct shots on Twilght and she blocked them, but Starlight never once got hit aside from that one time where she got put into that Crystal Prison thing.

If Twilight landed her shots, Starlight probably wouldn't have been strong enough to block them.

>>28490623
Homestuck General. They've been spending their existence trying to make shit miserable for MLP fans, and they did when they exiled us from /co/

Nowadays, they try to derail threads by being passive-aggressive cuntmuffins, as I called out

>>28490605
No Second Prances was a shred of hope for Glimmer, and the story in that one was more about Twilight as a teacher almost ruining a bit of genuine, organic progress for Glimmer due to her own biases. Starlight is in fact capable of learning about friendship and bonding, but the way it happened in that episode was actually outside of the bounds of how Twilight was trying to teach her (just a chance encounter with Trixie) which is part of why it succeeded.

Glimmer might not be absorbing the Friendship Lessons (TM), but she is capable of improving and becoming more socialized. The real season arc is Twilight becoming a teacher, so conflicts with Glimmer arise in ways that underline Twilight's teaching and its flaws so far. I think it's possible that by the end of the season most of what Twilight tried to teach Glimmer about friendship will fail but some of the incidental experiences she had along the way like befriending Trixie will be key to saving her.

>>28490609
>>28490623
>>28490657
No offense pal but I think the whole /hsg/ ref was a bigger derail than whatever you were trying to call out

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>>28490657
WEW
E
W

>>28490631
>>28490649
Power Level discussion is usually hopeless because the writers aren't tracking things sooooo close down to every magical bolt fired. She was on equal raw power with Twilight pretty much from the start, but she doesn't seem to know as many spells or as much about magic so that was what we saw today (teleportation, transfiguration).

Her being efficient at magic is important to make her a credible threat and explain why learning friendship is so important, if she wasn't nearly as powerful as Twilight then episodes like this wouldn't carry high stakes since if Glimmer fails to learn about friendship that's only a problem for her.

>>28490368
TL;DR
Sunset was trying to fill a sense of emptiness with power that she got from magic.
Starlight got dumped and became a sociopath after ranting on Tumblr about when men are jerks.

>>28490630
A show named Friendship is Magic, moralizing? Perish the thought!

>>28490541
But that's a fucking problem, you can't not have anytging aboyt magic lore, then have nonsense like this where one character is too OP without reason.

>>28490663
That's essentially what was outlined in the premiere too with Spike and Twilight's chat. Celestia didn't 'teach' Twilight about friendship other than forcing her to go to ponyville, she let her figure it out on her own. However, Twilight is coming up with all these formal 'Friendship Lessons' for Starlight and pretty much none of them work out as she intended: Starlight nearly gave up on Sunburst until she finally had a heart to heart, Starlight bonded with Trixie of all ponies and Twilight disapproved, and now Starlight went bat shit and nearly destroyed her home when she told her to finish a 'friendship' lesson in a night.

No Second Prances expanded upon this idea a bit more by showing that Twilight also wants to use the progress of her student to impress Celestia. Ultimately though, social interaction and relationships can't really be hard taught and it's something you just need to figure out on your own.

I think the finale could manage to pull off these themes nicely with the whole Suicide Squad set up.

>>28490740
Uh, I'd figure the opposite? The fewer rules you lay down governing magic in a setting, the easier it is to treat it as whatever it needs to be for the plot.

But regardless, Glimmer's magic is fairly well defined. Twilight's specialty was learning and study, while Glimmer's is raw power. Glimmer was cunning and willing to go recklessly far when Twilight would hold back (as we saw again today with the shield testing) and now that Twilight is teaching her from the books as well, she's becoming a genuine threat to Equestria. The reason the writers have made her this powerful is to increase the stakes of teaching her about friendship, it puts the pressure on Twilight as a teacher and we're meant to worry after this episode that Twilight is too good of a magic teacher and not good enough of a friendship one.

>>28490352
Seems somewhat legit. But does it fit with the other S6 Glimmer episodes, aside from today's?

>>28490779
I would enjoy if something flawed in Twilight's relationship to Celestia was the tipping point for Glimmer, like Twilight wants to show off Glimmer's progress to impress Celestia or angles for a bigger and better teaching job from Celestia and Glimmer starts to think Twilight is just using her as a prop rather than being really concerned for her progress as a friend.

Some people have claimed Twilight is being replaced by Glimmer and I think they're totally missing the point that Glimmer's story is one meant to extend Twilight's, since students are a reflection of their teacher. The conflict is still being driven by Twilight when she does things like set unrealistic goals for Starlight, and Starlight's blindspots that lead to ideas like mind-controlling everyone are meant to show us how Twilight has also failed to notice these underlying problems.

Repeating "Everypony wins" is a good example. She still has the same mentality as she did in her village.

>>28490837
There's discussion in the thread about No Second Prances, basically it's another example that Twilight's structured approach to teaching friendship doesn't work for Glimmer (she only befriended Trixie by accident) and Twilight's attempts to control Starlight's progress can actually be counter-productive. It's meant to give a sliver of hope that Glimmer really can be socialized and value friendship but also that it's not something she can be taught the same way she's learning magic spells.

I especially like >>28490779's point that Celestia didn't "teach" Twilight this way, she let Twilight discover friendship on her own. It's a theme that's coming up this season that Twilight still has a lot to learn about being a teacher.

>>28490352
I think the difference is that Starlight is canon

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>>28490740
Fuck of and go watch some anime if you're so autistic about it. This show clearly doesn't fucking care to have any deep lore, so you can either deal with it and see what the writers were trying to convey, or you can throw a tantrum after each new episode, because the show doesn't fucking care to have any lore beyond what is necessary and the writers just make it up as they go. Why are you even watching? The show never had consistent and precise lore, it never tried for that to be the appeal.

Starlight is powerful, because that's part of the story and most of the lore is like this - it's there, because it fit in the story that the writers was telling.

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>>28490882
I'll kill you.

>>28490596
>Glimmer clarifies that she's worried about baking a cake with Pinkie because she thinks she's being graded on baking?
But nothing of the sort is implied when she did it before. They showed Glimmer socialising with the mane 6 and if you accept that that's okay, you can't accept that it's also okay for the staff to have written Glimmer like the autist she's been this season. She was fine before so why not now? Because the staff are fucking lazy and we've seen Glimmer go through the same problems 4 times now in all her episodes in one season.

>>28490895
Now it doesn't have a "deep lore" as you call it and continuity (which the show actually has even now) because the writers are all new, shit and have no experience, and the story editor,that should be the one keeping all the writers in check, is compleate shit and doesn't give a single shit about the show. Fuck even when Megan was in charge the show had his own kind of lore let alone when Faust was.

>>28490709

Your tl;dr was tl;dr

Still didn't read lol

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>>28490916
Or maybe, just MAYBE the storyboard artist got a vague assignment to show Glimmer doing stuff with mane 6, because it felt like a good way to end the finale and it didn't have any deeper or thought out meaning.
It's crazy, I know how much the show cared about every little detail up to this point, but maybe you could just consider it as a possibility.

>>28490965
We're you that kid in "Billy Madison" that couldn't read the sentence in 3rd grade?

>>28490982
Or maybe, just MAYBE it's the job of the writer to decide what happens in an episode and the job of a director to make sure that everything from the script to the final product is consistent and the story board artist has literally no say in the events that occur in a scene, just how they look on screen.

>legit show discussion thread

strange times indeed

>>28490951
It had some kind of lore, but it never was very detailed or consistent and it never made a whole lot of sense. Complaining that it isn't 100% consistent with the lore is just silly. You could argue that it's bad for storytelling because it trivializes shit or something, or that the powercreep makes it generally less fun, and that might be a valid point, rather that it seems a bit inconsistent with extremely vaguely defined lore.

ITT: people who need to chillax

>>28491048
And its about Sunset and Starlight.
That should tell you something about them and the faggots who waifu them.

>>28491048
Is this how it felt back in the gold times? I joined after season 3 but before the first EQG

>>28491048
I don't get you show discussionfags. Every time there is a new episode there are several thread talking about it for days after it ended. Just because no one talks about S1 E1 every single day doesn't mean that show discussion don't happen.

>>28490352
At least now she's an interesting character. She can still "explode" when something really bad happens.

>>28491081
>Implying the series premiere was actually good

>>28491079
Yes. Literally every day. No shitty Greentext Generals. Good times indeed.

>>28491015
Or maybe you could filter the important stuff, instead of insisting on literal meaning of the Bible.

>>28490352
I absolutely despise EqG but I agree with all of this. I can't believe the franchise I don't like has the good character while the show has this freaking shit of a character. I don't know who is to blame, but this is absolutely heartbreaking.

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>>28491063
Fuck off /GeneralCancer/fag.

My problem with Starlight is that she's not nearly as endearing and captivating as the others

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>>28490352
Calling it now. Starlight Glimmer betrays her friends for power.

Then they will magically forgive her and we're meant to feel as if we should accept it.
I'm not accepting it, I'm hoping it's doing a metal gear /w Raiden and having Starlight be a shit character on purpose.

>>28491120
Fuck off Shimmerfag. OP was just outlining what made Glimmer different from Sunset, he didn't say anything about which was better. If anything, Glimmer being still evil is more interesting.

>>28490393
The first time I agree with someone making that statement.

...damn. She is Sheldon Cooper

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>>28491120
>waaah, the show doesn't have muh "she just needed some friends" villain
Yeah, now the show might actually do something interesting and sorta new, instead of something that was done 1000 times before. How terrible.

>>28490352
As autistic as you are, you are probably right. Rather, you would be if the writing consistent and had a real fucking goal.

>>28491149
If that's the case then I agree it's interesting and I might actually like Starlight for once.

But as it stands, I really hate her. I doubt the show would do anything as complex as that.

Tldr of this thread for everyone

Shimmer >>> glimmer

>>28491151
>now the show might actually do something interesting
I can't wait for it to get started. I hope today's episode wasn't one of those "interesting" things, because it was fucking shit.

>>28491087
Okay? What does that have to do with anything? S3 E10, S5 E9, S2 E2. It doesn't matter what episode you pick, it doesn't have a thread dedicated to it on a daily basis, and yet every now and then, some one makes a thread about it, and people will come and talk about it.

>>28491063
What, that they actually care to do more than circlejerk and read fanfiction?

>>28491169
Evil Glimmer >>> Evil Shimmer
Good Glimmer <<<<<<< Good Shimmer

>>28491150
You mean media's worst portrayal of autism ever? Not even close. Sheldon Cooper is a pick and mix character that borrows from all areas of the spectrum whenever it's appropriate to the punchline, then loses these characteristics the next episode. The writers of TBBT have no idea what autism is or how it works, Glimmer is closer to being an accurate representation of someone with sociopathtic tendencies and learning disabilities, though not perfect.

>>28491184
A million times this.

>>28491151
Yeah because it totally needed a "she's perfect at everything except making friends" character
As if that's not way worse

>>28491184
I honestly agree and I'm a shimfag.

I say Glimmer is more high functional autistic, if even.

She wants friends and she understands social norms, but the problem is she tries to tackle social issues the same way she tackles magic: as a science.

Let's face it: Magic is to some degree handled like sciene in Equestria. Unicorns can combine spells/theories to create new ideas and use the concept of refinement to improve standard procedures for better results.

Starlight approaches magic in a weird scientific way, doing research and combining things she learn in new ways. And she is proud of doing stuff like that and what she can achieve, as shown in the interaction with Twilight.

But friendship is not something you can just approach in a scientific way. But that was kinda what she tried to do. She approached the "friendship lessons", whcih were meant to be more like just spending time with someone, like a student approaches a practical excercise in a lab course: Get it done based on what you know to also impress the teachers. And her "overachieving" aspect (trying to tackle multiple "lessons at once) was part of her undoing.

I don't think Starlight is a soociopath, she is just "autistic" enough to not realize the difference between interacting with someone socialy and seeing things just based on facts.

To quote Dash: She needs to chillax.

>>28491199
>"she's perfect at everything except making friends" character
Too bad she's shit at more than just making friends. In fact, she already made friends with someone that she enjoyed being around just fine.

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>>28491184
Shimmerfag approved.

>>28491228
>Unicorns can combine spells/theories to create new ideas and use the concept of refinement to improve standard procedures for better results.
That's how magic is in everything I know of. Magic has always been a form of science because science isn't test tubes and math.

>>28491184
Completely agree and I'm a Glimmerfag. Shimmer had Megahn dealing with her integration into the main cast whereas Shimmer's had Haber.

>>28491229
But it's true
Her only struggles so far this season are in making friends
Everything else she just does flawlessly with her mary sue magic

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>>28491228
here fag

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>>28491212
>>28491253
Can you fags fucking kiss already?

>>28491265
Nyx >>>>> Good Glimmer
And I haven't even read Past Sins.

>>28491253
>Shimmer's had Haber.
*Glimmer

>>28491254
Turns out she's shit at baking, probably designing/sewing, and animals in general. Guess she isn't a "mary sue" as you seem to think.

>>28491255
Holy shit. Any pro-lifers here to witness the darkest of realities that is our own?

>>28491184
Starlight's motivation for doing evil was crap, though.
Sunset: I want to become an alicorn and take over Equestria.
Starlight: My boyfriend dumped me! Grrrr I hate everything. It's all cutie marks fault, I'll rid the world of them!

>>28491288
But she did all of that before in the finale of S5 and baked a perfect cake that threatened to drive Mrs. Cake out of business in like 5 seconds in No Second Prances

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>>28491255
That is severely fucked up. If I ever knew I had a mother like that I'd put myself up for adoption. Hey, you can still be adopted as an adult.

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>>28491151
>implying the writers are clever enough to actually do something interesting
>implying Hasbro would actually let them do something interesting if they were clever enough

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>>28491299

>Sunset: I want to become an alicorn and take over Equestria.

Comic aren't canon, shimmer only want to take over equestria

>>28490541
But anon
Friendship is Magic

>>28491084
Sunset does that as well

>>28491330
She went apeshit when she heard others saying that Twilight was a "real princess". Obviously she was mad jealous and wanted that position for herself.

>>28491330
On that topic, people bash Sunset Shimmer's tactic but think of it. These aren't just hypnotised teenagers, when they go through the portal they will be ponies. And you've got two fucking potential alicorns under your rule. I'm sure evil mind control has something to make them use magic even if they don't know how.

>>28491355

Nice non canon headcanon, bro

>>28491362
Go watch eqg1.

>>28491184
^ Pretty much this right here.

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>>28490393
Here's the true sperg.

>>28491330
>first glance had Celestia deflecting a blast without her horn
Damn, I thought she was actually powerful for a second there. On another note, angry Sunbutt is best butt.

>>28490417
> Sociopaths are pretty much on the spectrum

I wouildn't say that.

>>28491359

>two fucking potential alicorns under your rule

Sure, that will don't know how to deal with they new magic or fucking walk because they aren't bipedals anymore.

Now add a lot of useless teenager ponies that don't know how to walk to that army.

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>>28491370
DELET

>>28491362
But it's literally true you dumbass
She even sarcastically shouted at them that "She's so /very/ special"
What would be the purpose of that other than to indicate jealousy?

>>28491384
Did you continue reading after that point? I literally just answered your question dum dum.

>>28491384
They're mind controlled you retard
They don't need to know how to do shit on their own because Sunset's using them like puppets with her magic

>>28491362
It's true. RR had her so jealous of her that she thought of herself as shit. She was even depressed that Celestia made her a princess, but not Shimmer.

>>28491299
So Sunset was Hitler but France and Britain said no at her first demand whereas Starlight was a Tumblrina who thought that her boyfriend leaving her was the end of the world.
Great.

>>28490352
>Sunset Shimmer went down a bad road, but as she later told human Twilight during their fight, all the power she was after was a way to fill a sense of loneliness.
But that's bullshit. She only became lonely because she went power crazy first.
>I'm sorry I stole your food, I only did it because I was hungry because I threw the food my mother gave me into the trash
While Glimmer is a sociopath Sunset is retarded.

>>28491362
At the end of EG 1 it showed how mad she was that Celestia made Twilight a princess when that crown was supposed to be Sunsets.

>>28491228
Except as I already said no second prances nullifies this. In there Glimmer doesn't act as making frinds with Trixie is some sort of assignment or siecnce. As some anons said the problem is not as much Starlight being autistic about friendship as Twilight treating friendship as something that as to be taught and has rules.

>>28491408
>I'm sorry I stole your food, I only did it because I was hungry and my mom wouldn't give me any food
FTFY

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>>28491414
no sense in arguing with FiMfags, they never even watched the movies, they formed their "opinions" all on hearsay

>>28491435
>>I'm sorry I stole your food, I only did it because I was hungry and my mom gave my food to you
FTFY

>>28490352
Twilight, Moondancer & Sunburst are all introverted scholars by nature. Without help to bring them out of their shell they'd spend their entire lives studying.

Starlight is a driven pragmatist, for her magic is a means not a end. If she actually bothered studying she would easily become the most powerful unicorn in Equestria, instead when she developed her equality spell or time travel spell she immediately put her plans into action. For Starlight the world is a nail and magic her hammer.

Sunset is adaptable. When she got into a conflict with her immortal pony princess magic mentor she ran away to be a magicless queen bitch in a human high school and then after she was defeated she pretty much become the Twilight of the human world. Her biggest problem is that after turning good she's seemed to lose all motivation and more or less wait for someone to tell her what to do, seriously the overly complicated planner with a chip on her shoulder from the first EQ is nothing like the Sunset we see in the sequels, which is odd considering Starlight and Discord were both able to keep their major character traits after reforming even to the point of still retaining some villainy like three dimensional characters.

>>28491385
It's the truth though.

>>28491439

Sunset legitimately jumped Twilight when the others were praising her willingness to sacrifice going back home as "princess worthy" indicating that yes, Sunset was resentful towards Twilight for being "special".
At the same time she wanted freaking power and got to Equestria and stole the Element specifically to use it in the human world where it would give her special abilities.

... for fuck's sake, lets just all come to the conclusion that EqG was a badly writen mess as far as it comes to Sunset and her plans making "sense" or the fact that she even managed to become the school alpha bitch while not even having a personal ID to enroll in that school

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>>28491455
DELET THIS POST RIGHT NOW

>>28491414
Evil Sunset was fucking hardcore if you think about it. Imagine if she didn't run away and worked out things with Celestia. Regardless of what happened afterwards, if Twilight was made a princess before Sunset, she WOULD made an attempt on Twilight's life. She was crazy obsessed like that.

>>28491452
Sunset didn't wait for someone to tell her what to do in FG; she was the only one who was doing anything relevant to main the plot at all from CHS's side
And in RR she fixed all of the issues that the m6 were having, came up with the idea of fighting the sirens with music, and is the whole reason that Twilight is even there.

>>28491475
I wrote a green where it mentioned in one of Sunsets diary entries that she was planning to kill Twilght or have her killed when she noticed Celestia giving all her attention to twilight but Sunny let before she had it carried out.

>>28491452
this explains Sunset in the same way I would, and WHY us Shimmerfags love her
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PrwgCKeeXZY
>inb4 Silvershill
he does a wonderful explanation

>>28491467
No shit EqG 1 was badly written
The majority of its content is worthless and irrelevant with the m6 constantly holding the idiot ball and creating conflicts out of nothing for the sake of killing time until the end, but Sunset's final plan after getting the crown did make sense

>>28491487
She spends most of EG wishing Twilight was there to solve the problem.

>>28491543
And she then earned her self confidence back when she understood how smart and strong she was and that she didn't need Twlight.
She helped massively with the sirens and she singlehandedly stopped Midnight Sparkle with her batteries

>>28491564
She was the only reason they beat the sirens. Twilight and Fluttershy's song failed.

>>28491543
I assume you mean FG
And it doesn't matter because that whole plot was about her doing it on her own
Plus all of the moments where you hear her talking about Twilight or that moment in the hallway about her afraid of messing up were just hastily rewritten parts that were originally where she was going to be considering going back to Equestria.

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But Sunset has a leather jacket. All of your arguments are invalid

>>28491577
And Spike was the only reason she beat Midnight Sparkle.

>>28491599
That's a good point.

>>28491599
Obviously a pony would never wear leather.

>>28491601
And Discord was the only reason they defeated Tirek.

>>28491608
Shes just that badass.

We can agree that Sunset is the pony with the best character development of the whole franchise?

>>28491625
Yes.

>>28491601
>>28491614
Not even the same. Watch the movie again and see that without her, they wouldn't have come close to winning.

>>28491625
Yup.

>>28491614
If Discord had done his job in the first place they wouldn't have needed to use the lockbox of harmony and Twilight would still live in the library.

>>28491625
>We can agree that Sunset is the pony with the best character development of the whole franchise?
Not that there's competition. It's like being the shiniest turd. The other characters are bland and boring, and the ones that have more development keep hitting the reset button.

>>28491625
You could have just said best pony.

>>28491665
Why are you here if you hate all of the ponies?

>>28491625
It's not such a great feat when you think about it, most of the characters in the series are very one-dimensional.

But yes, I agree.

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This is Starlight's future but with Twi instead

>>28491641
>Twilight momentarily gets the mike knocked out of her hand.
>This means the Mane Six would've never been able to defeat the sirens.

>>28491679
Yeah because they were getting their shit pushed in
That's the reason that the mic was knocked out of her hand in the first place

>>28491677
I already told you why youre wrong in your shitty thread you made

>>28490987
didn't read lol

>>28491672
On 4chan it's actually a declaration of love. Hate is not giving a fuck.

>>28491625
I don't think glimmerfags know what character development means.

>>28491648
>Discord indirectly destroyed the library.
Now I'm mad at him.

>>28490352
Very well put.
Man, imagine a finale with Glimmer on a power trip. That would be great.

>>28491728
We got Glimmer on a power trip, she couldn't beat a undistracted Twilight.

>>28491698
>Because Starlight is a neutered pussy now whereas Sunny was an aggressive, power driven badass before EG1. She is also neutered now.

>I fucking hope. It would explain why Starlight *still* doesn't understand that other ponies have autonomy which must be respected. I would love it if they made Starlight an incurable low-level sociopath and the object lesson was that while friendship is magic you can't be friends with everyone; not everyone deserves it.

where?

>>28491741
That was just her using a time travelling spell, not really trying to cause other damage. But now, after a year of learning and training more advanced magic in Twilight's library, I'd say the situation would be different.

>>28491679
They lost the fight. They all got knocked down and had no way to stop them. Also, I was talking about getting them to stop fighting, for one. Bringing Twilight in was another point. This is just another reason why she is the reason they won.
>>28491677
I'd like that, if only to have more development for Twilight.

>>28491648
>If Discord had done his job
If discord had done his Job Celestia and Luna would've been under his rule.

>>28491435
>>28491446
Why would Celestia not be friends with her ? What indication in the whole series there was that she wasn't liked BEFORE she became a power hungry bitch ?

>>28491814
Too be fair, he did do his job. He ruled for many years until being usurped by the sisters. Makes me wonder how no one seems to question whether him wanting revenge was even a bad thing.

>>28491648
Celestia's whole plan on dealing with Tirek made absolutely no sense. And Fimfags will still claim that the show's writing is better than eqg.

>Wander off after I figure thread wound down
>See the tab is still open and refresh
>All these posts

Well I'm glad to see my post spurred some discussion! There's a lot people have already posted but I think it's a good sign for both Starlight and Sunset's characters that they've got enough distinct character traits and development for a discussion like this.

Sort of a pity the two won't meet. It'd be neat to see what they'd think of each other. I guess Sunset might run into human Glimmer but that'd probably only be a hint of what Glimmer's really like.

>>28491856
...because he spent those years torturing ponies? What, were you also expecting the Crystal Ponies to go
>You know, in his defense, he was king before the princesses illegally broke border sanctions and shot him, maybe we were in the wrong here?

>>28491894
Well Sunset in FiM is never happening, and I don't see them somehow shoehorning Glimmer into EqG either.

>>28491916
I could see a cameo, but probably not more than that. The Equestria Girls cast is already a little overloaded and while Sunset is different from Glimmer in a lot of ways they still fill fairly similar roles. Heck they've even got human Twilight for the redemptive story/relapse element.

>>28491901
Regardless of his actions, it was still his land to do with it as he wish. They got pissed and dethroned him, fair enough. My point is that coming out of a boring stone prison after hundreds of years I'd want some vengeance too.

The alicorns had no right to stop Sombra, that's his land and only his people should be doing something. Same with the S3 opener.
>>28491885
Well, Discord was the right choice for finding him as he did so with ease. Only issue was that he had no leash.

>>28491885
>Celestia's whole plan on dealing with Tirek made absolutely no sense.

It does if you remember her character. Remember that Celestia is super into the thought that friendship fixes literally everything, she genuinely wanted Discord to prove himself and show he could be a real friend, and thanks to him not acting up post EOH getting put back in the tree, she had basis. Discord could find him the fastest and was so powerful he had no fear of being drained. From Celestias perspective it made sense.

>>28491930
Yeah, as a background cameo maybe, but not as an actual character. That would need too much explaining and establishing for no real reason, since SciTwi and Sunset are already there so there is no need to introduce her.

>>28491934
Why not pick Discord, all princesses, the Mane six, Shining Armor and the royal guard, and jumping on Tirek. He would never have a chance on his initial, weak form.

>>28491938
>From Celestias perspective it made sense.
It does in just about every way since he's the most powerful being in Equestria and already has experience with evil fucks. Only issue was the unknown that he actually didn't like his role as her lapdog.
>>28491953
I believe that >>28491938 said it best. They probably could have done it with ease by having spies sit in all of the major cities and wait until he acted, then dropped his ass. Issue is she wanted to give him a chance to prove himself. Ultimately he failed and should have been imprisoned after Tirek lost.

>>28490352
This rings true to me.

>>28490848
Glad I wasn't the only one that caught her saying that.

Gonna repeat another anon here and say if Starlight is a socipath then Sunset is retarded. She would be in Twilights spot right now if she were more patient.

>>28490916
Because it was an assignment by Twilight and Starlight wanted to do it as good as she does her magic lessons. Starlight is also only comfy with Twilight or Trixie, she has no synergy with the rest of the mane6 (up until the very end of the episode), however it is implied that she didn't actually see it as having a good time with folks, but more pleasing Twilight, completing her tasks and such.

>>28492503
Sunset isn't even part of the FiM lore. She was made just for EQG, AFTER twilight ascended, and even if she were part of the show, we don't know if she would've managed to ascend.
It wasn't her cutiemark on the Tree of Harmony after all

>>28492503
Impatience has been a consistent character flaw of hers before and after getting rainbow'd to the face.

>>28491051
The lore got screwed several times by Cadence being a suprise alicorn out of nowhere, the interactions of cutiemarks in MMC, some super strong artifacts, transferring power, Pinkie having an additional sister and most importantly, the Tree/Map of Harmony. Wtf is that shit? It had the cutiemarks of the mane6 on it a thousand years before they were alive. Is that some prophecy thing or what?

>>28492534
If the pink abominations (which shouldn't even exist) got their ascension for free, Sunset could get it.

>>28492587
I'd bet my house Glimmer will not ascend

>>28491081
>People discuss new things and new information
>I DONT GET YOU

>>28492596
Glimmer doesn't seek ascension.

>>28490352
You are goddamn true.
Now I know why I don't like Starlight, thanks.

>>28492583
>forgetting that once every hundred or so years six ponies are born with the same marks
Celestia just fucked it up by making Twilight immortal.

>>28490352
>>28490432
>there are finally people who have come to these conclusions
>they aren't being told to fuck off and go back to watching S1 through S3 since muh S6 is flawless and the show's only gotten "better"

Maybe there is hope for /mlp/ after all. 6 years ago I hoped this series was going to go out in a bang but it's looking more and more like it's gonna be a fizzle.

>>28490605
...Except now you're the one skipping an imoortant part, specifically the one where Trixie pretty much suicide-guilted Glimmer into being there for her.

This is still one of the most fucked up ""lessons"" to come out of MLP:FiM; if someone isn't being a good enough friend to you, guilt them by attempting suicide.

>>28492583
The M5 elements were shapeless

>>28492734
The element of magic was also shapeless before season 4 retconned it.

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>>28492587
>Sunset could get it
Anon, she already has

>>28492720
Horse shit. She clearly said what she didn't mean and Starlight learned that people can make mistakes.

>>28492587
With the turn the series is taking, I fear this will be the final.
If that's the case, MLP canon will stop at S5 end for me.

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>>28492743
No it wasn't.

>>28492587
>pink abominations
Who?

>>28492804
I hope that they make G4.5 and retcon the hell of all the bullshit.

>>28492849
Yeah, Starlight is worst op mary sue oc pony.

>>28491312
> baked a perfect cake
she used her magic, doesn't count as baking imo.

>>28492881
It doesn't. It's why she was afraid of baking with Ponks.

>>28492804
I'm afraid, Anon. Hold me.

>>28492881
She didn't bake a cake using her magic in the S5 finale. She baked cupcakes with Pinkie.

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>>28492952
Unicorn madness, it was only the begining....

>>28493023
>dat Larson
kek

>>28492676
>Celestia made a deal with the supernatural being of harmony (it can take the form of trees, maps and more)
>1000 years of being a single ruler
>After this time she will be replaced.
>Build an empire, takes all the magical prodigies and enrolls them in special schools to brainwash them into loving her.
>The new one arrives.
>She struggled at first, but got good really fast.
>Too fast
>Send the new one against the most brutal enemies, so she hopefully dies.
>Make her write a diary to keep track of her.
>Doesn't work, she keeps getting stronger
>Last straw: Make her an alicorn princess to get her eternal loyalty.
>Twilight is powerful, but weak-minded.
>Harmony needs a new plan, someone new to end her reign. Someone to bring eternal harmony.
>Harmony uses weak-minded twilight to bring Starlight into play.
>to be continued...

>>28492954
Or Pinkie baked the cupcakes for her while she watched. All we get as evidence is this picture >>28490510

>>28490352
its actually a lot simpler than that OP
glimmer is a shit character and sunset isn't

>>28493328
As a villain, glimmer is far superior

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>>28493328
>Sunset doormat
>good

Look, just because the new EQG movie is gonna suck hard doesn't give you fags the right to shitpost everywhere

>>28493286
kek? What was the deal and why would it want her to lose?

>>28493356
>not watching FG
fuck off and go watch it

>>28491184
Evil Glimmer ≤ Evil Shimmer
Good Glimmer ≤ Good Shimmer

I have a bit of a bias toward Shimmer, but otherwise like them both roughly equally for slightly different reasons.

>>28493380
I did, it was shit, like your life.

>>28491184
As far as "entertaining to watch goes" yea, both had shit tier kids show villain of the week motivation, but Glimmer was far more entertaining and threatening as a villain.

>>28493403
if you had seen it, you'd know the doormat meme is dead, you dicktwat
and FG is better than S6

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>>28490352
So she's basically Discord then?

>>28491184
this
evil shimmer was a generic bully villain and waste of a good concept in a rebellious celestia student but since RR her guilt and desire to change, and her gradual change into a leader was great.

Meanwhile starlight was an entretaining villain who seriously belived in her ideology only to get froced redeemed and turn into this inconsistent mess of a character that's dragging a whole season down

>>28493618
The best thing they could do is have it that Glimmer was only faking to have Twilight teach her better magic.

Yeah, I'm going to agree with you OP. After 2 friendship lessons Sunset became the rightful leader of the Humane 5. Meanwhile Starlight is still a massive threat to Ponyville even when she tries to help.

She will never be their leader.

>>28493981
watch as the finale is going to force her into being one

>>28494009
zapped and capped, bagged and tagged.

>>28494009
Not leader of the M6, leader of her own suicide squad of outcasts and failures.

>>28492606
Not him, but I think he was obviously saying-
>Why do you treat it like show discussion never happens, just because it doesn't happen 24/7?

Are you missing points, intentionally, or something?

>>28490510
Never mind the fact that, in the Season 3 finale you have Twilight flying like a pro and then, in the start of Season 4, you have Twilight taking flying lessons from Rainbow Dash.

Such mini-retcons are not unprecedented with this show, but it's still fucking annoying.

>>28490352
You're not wrong, OP.

The problem is that the world doesn't treat her as such. Hell, if anything people treated Shimmer more like an outcast; even if it was resolved with some overly-rushed reconciliation, at least they even bothered to show some lingering distrust towards her.

Meanwhile, Glimglam literally gets off of everything by just apologizing. I mean, I understand that the show is about friendship and they're not going to show her being put into a mental institution for her issues, but at a certain point Glimmer's relationship with other ponies is borderline abusive and yet she's not being required to show any development beyond literally just "say sorry". If someone like Glimmer was hanging around with me, I'd be noping the fuck out of there as fast as I could.

>>28495991
I think that's the ultimate problem I have with Starlight. If this season had been Starlight earning the Mane 6's trust (outside of Twilight) and realizing that being a selfish asswipe hurts those closest to her (outside of just saying "Sorry"), then I would be okay with the direction the writers are taking her.

>>28495991
this
mind controlling the mane 6 wasn't just a cute accident, she deliberately planned to use them on a way not even discord right now would do

>>28495991
how was Sunset's struggle resolved in an overly-rushed way?
It took a whole movie and then they stopped when she saved everyone's asses
Even then they still bring it up from time to time in the latter movies
If anything that's dragging it out too much

>>28496565
Fair point. I only watched each of the EqG movies once, and even then a long time ago.

If so, though, I'd say that only reinforces my point: Shimmer had to go through a fuckton of proving herself before she was considered a friend. Glimmer's 'proving' has so far been verbally admitting she was wrong... and then going on to do the exact same things again.

Glimmer has two main issues, and, combined, I think they hurt the show. Not just for us autists, but for the show's actual target audience.

One, she's incredibly magically powerful for no reason. One of the reasons that MLP was so fun to watch was that the main character was super powerful, but she worked hard. Hell, all of the characters worked hard. Not only was that a great character dynamic (characters that work are more interesting than those who have shit handed to them), but it was good for kids too. It encouraged dedication and a good work ethic. A lot of kids shows are terrible in this regard, and it was really nice to have one with good morals like this.

Two, she's a really shitty friend. She does terrible things and expresses no remorse outside of a verbal apology. Not only is this frustrating for an older audience, but it's a fucking horrible message for kids. It's teaching them that this kind of behavior is okay as long as you apologize, which is very much not the case in real life. If kids take this message to heart they'd open themselves up to all kinds of horribly abusive behavior.

>>28490352
there's only one problem with your theory, and that is starlight expressed extreme guilt over her enslaving other ponies and messing with time. A person or pony without empathy, by its very definition, cannot feel guilt over hurting others

>>28496957
Very much this.

>>28497246
I think the word I was looking for was remorse

>I think I finally get the difference between Sunset Shimmer and Starlight Glimmer.

Glimmy once was an interesting character and Baconhead never was. (she just has the best porn drawn of her)

This thread is so fucking true.

>>28490352
I don't know that her motives are as self-centered as just wanting success, since she did create her entire village around the ideal of friendships being important, but it's becoming frighteningly clear that Starlight isn't the Sunset Shimmer type of reformed villain who recognizes that what she did was wrong and wants to be a better person. She's the Discord type- she knows that her actions had negative consequences, but she doesn't entirely recognize why. The motives and beliefs that made her become evil in the first place are still intact.

She's not exactly the same as Discord. He was malicious for his own entertainment and to satisfy his ego. Starlight is an extreme idealist. She's not satisfied with less than perfection from herself or anypony else. This is her strongest parallel with Twilight, but it's also her most dangerous trait. Even with her genius-level intellect, Starlight Glimmer is something of a brute.

>>28491625
I suppose I'd say so, but she only has to worry about three movies. The main six have six seasons of episodes and dozens of writers to remain consistent through. It's no surprise that their development is less consistent.

>>28497776
Delete yourself, namefig

>>28491255
>I'm sick of this condescending Holland shit. Holland is a lovely country. But low functioning Autism just fucking sucks. There is nothing nice about this at all.
Is it bad that I know what the fuck she's talking about, and I'm still kind of laughing?

>>28491885
>And Fimfags will still claim that the show's writing is better than eqg.

It honestly hurts me that you actually believe that.

>>28490352
Wow. You really know Starlight Glimmer. Why don't you tell us about her past after she lost Sunburst and blamed the cutie marks?

>>28490352
>High-functioning Sociopath Glimmerovich
Headcannon accepted.

Shes just amoral as fuck

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>>28491184
This

>>28492614
Because she doesn't "seek" it, she'll end up getting it and being worthy of it, just watch.

I think it's implied that if you ever seek ascension, at all, you're unworthy and will never do so. Which is why Sunset still has no wings and heavily implied why Starswirl didn't either despite being the most powerful unicorn ever (before Starlight came along, that is).

I think that's why Celestia had to "trick" Twilight and not tell her what the next level of studies really entailed, because if she actually knew she'd be unworthy just like Sunset before her (a huge mistake Celestia made).

another scene that adds fuel to the 'glimmy's a sociopath' fire is the one where she relates her troubles to sunburst: she doesn't really express any guilt over hurting anypony or messing with time.

instead she complained about being beaten by twilight twice and then being forced to learn about friendship.

>>28490352
This.

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OP's just catching on. It won't be long until they find out how to cum inside of RD.

>>28493618
>>28493640
I kind of want it to turn out that Starlight just doesn't "get it," even by the season's end, and that she almost has a heel-turn, but she has to sacrifice herself to finally understand. I know redemption through death is kind of overplayed, and I know it wouldn't ever happen in a show like this, but it would certainly be consistent. Not sure if I'd want another season of Twilight moping and being uncertain, though.

But at this rate, it seems likely that things will finally click for her, and that she's going to fuck off to some corner of Equestria with her own mane six. Handily written out of the show in time for the movie.

>>28502455
>>28502455
> Not sure if I'd want another season of Twilight moping and being uncertain, though.
Frankly, if they could use this to lead in to a proper season-length arc of Twilight questioning her abilities and purpose as a princess, that'd be amazing. Those emotions got kind of touched upon in Twilight's Kingdom, but apparently resolved by her discovering herself to be the princess of DBZ fights and magical macguffins. Suffice to say, I'd like to see her really question herself and have a proper soul-searching and self-rediscovery instead. It's something that's been needed since MMC.

...of course, the odds of the current crop of writers being capable of delivering that is not high. So, I'd just settle for Starlight being dead and gone.

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>>28498613