Did the AEUG actually accomplish anything in the long run

>>15342782
They brought down the corrupt Titans and beat Neo Zeon while the Federation was licking its wounds.

>>15342928

I'd agree on them being integral in the fall of the Titans, but Neo Zeon fell because of Neo Zeon themselves. AEUG by ZZ had devolved into petty bearacracy and Anaheim bickering, turning them into a pawn of the Federation rather than a real resistance army. Had Glemy Toto not started his insurrection, the Earth Federation would have been subjugated by Neo Zeon, and remaining Karaba forces would have gradually been hunted down.

>>15342782
Crippling the Federation by eliminating their most competent arm, thereby empowering Zeonic and general spacenoid movements for the rest of UC.

>>15343162
>Titans
>competent

In terms of smashing Zeon insurgencies, sure, they kicked ass at that, but they had no concept of deescalation and gratuitously cruel reprisals against their authority only gave the AEUG the justification to oppose them.

OT, in the grand scheme of things, no, the Federation just kept falling in on itself while it dealt with the odd insurgency every other decade or so. The AEUG was just a small stitch to the large, gaping, oozing wound that is UC's timeline.

>>15342782
>, in the grand scheme of things, no, the Federation just kept falling in on itself while it dealt with the odd insurgency every other decade or so. The AEUG was just a small stitch to the large, gaping, oozing wound that is UC's timeline.
Tomino really is a pessimist when comes to the future unlike the AU Gundam directors who all seem to believe things will get better in the end.

>>15343345
>unlike the AU Gundam directors who all seem to believe things will get better in the end.
They know their show is doomed to be a 1 & Done. No continuations, no universe built up around it, no nothing.

>>15342782
Nothing. They wanted to defeat Titans, but became Titans themselves (most of the LondoBell unit members are ex-soldiers of AEUG and Karaba)
They wanted to reform the Federation. Nothing has changed, exept for government no longer trying to gas civilians for protests.
>>15343162
>empowering Zeonic and general spacenoid movements for the rest of UC.
Oh yes, the EF system was absolutely flawless and its stagnation and crisis wouldn't affect spacenoids if Titans were here. Yeaaaah.
>>15343345
>Tomino really is a pessimist when comes to the future unlike the AU Gundam directors who all seem to believe things will get better in the end.
Not quite. 0079 was pretty positive by the time of the final story. Zeta was dark because Tomino knew about continuation. Same goes about ZZ. Victory, F91 and CCA are ending with a positive idea "It's pretty bad now, but everything's about to improve later!"

>>15343162

I have to agree there.

And on top of that, their replacement in Londo Bell was largely a joke.

In fact, the AEUG may be the reason the Federation eventually collapses as they never seem to recover from that event.

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>>15343318
>>In terms of smashing Zeon insurgencies, sure, they kicked ass at that,

>>15346057

I thought Axis and Karn were on "the agenda", but those plans were derailed by AEUG and Karaba insurrectionist activities?

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>>15343318

To be honest, the Titans might have been compromised in their purpose the second this guy joined them.

Though he was a talented strategist and engineer, he was from Jupiter.

And Jupiter doesn't seem to really care for Earth or has some un-explained issue with the Federation.

>>15346084
What the fuck was even going on over at Jupiter anyway?

>>15346084

Not really no Jamitov was quite similar to Scirocco.

>>15346039

What event?

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>>15346088

On screen, they launched a fuel embargo of the Federation during the Cosmo Babylonia affair.

I think the guy in charge of the Zanscare Empire was also a top official of the Jupiter nation in Victory Gundam (and may have been it's leader at the time).


The Crossbone Gundam Mangas elaborate on it a bit by stating that, apparently, it's Jupiter's leadership and not the Jupiter colonies and Energy Fleet that bear a serious grudge against the Federation.

Their leader, Crux Dogatie is bitter over the fact that, not only did the Federation reject Jupiter's request of independence, but forced him to marry a young woman so they could keep an eye on him. They forced him to marry her when he was in his 80s. He considers being made to do this the equivalent of being made to grovel.

It's why he funded Cosmo Babylonia (allegedly) and why he later launched an invasion of the Earth Sphere with the aim of using Nuclear weapon equipped Mobile Armors to rain havoc and destruction down on the Earth.


So it's quite possible more than personal ambition was involved in Scirocco's appearance among the Titan's ranks.

>>15346093

The destruction of the Titans.

It seems it hampered the Federation in the long run.

>>15346110
Jupiter is already independent. What he was bitter about was that the EF basically abandoned them and refused proper support before this independence, and then once the colonies weren't total hellholes and had stabalized a small bit they came back and strong armed him into a political marriage to tie the Jupiter colonies back to the EF for better trading rights.

>>15343949
>Nothing has changed, exept for government no longer trying to gas civilians for protests.

I'd call that a nontrivial change!!!

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>>15346125

Ah okay, appears I had a number of things incorrect then.

> they came back and strong armed him into a political marriage to tie the Jupiter colonies back to the EF for better trading rights.

And they really thought that was going to ensure his loyalty?

>>15346138
Except the government didn't change at all because the TItans covered it up in the first place and blamed somebody else.
Or well better said Jamitov had to damage control Basque's idiocy.

>>15346114

That would imply that their existence strengthened the Federation. Which there's really nothing to prove they did. Zeon weakened the Federation, not A.E.U.G. They publicly defied them in a way that inspired others to do so, they destroyed huge swathes of their military strength, decimated their population etc. And they did it all before A.E.U.G. The Federation was already declining in Zeta, since they needed external help to fight foes.

>>15343318
>allies with a Zeon insurgency

>>15343949
>Nothing has changed, exept for government no longer trying to gas civilians for protests.

I'd say that's a pretty big change since it means the federation is going back to just being lazy assholes instead of just being full on edgelord kick puppies assholes.

>>15343162
You mean the same competent arm that proved the AEUG was right when their ideal strategy to stopping Char's Dakar speech was "KILL EVERYBODY WITH DA MOBILE SUITS!" That sure was some competence on their part.

>>15346084
Their purpose was compromised the moment they gassed an entire colony. It wasn't even tear gas, but straight up murderous NERVE gas.

>Hurrhurr space niggers deserved it fer bein poor! One percent lel!

>>15346114
The federation's government's own incompetence is what hampered it in the long run. Win the war? Let's build a gundam and arm it with a nuke! Conspire to form the Titans using Operation stardust to justify their actions later? Civil war breaks out! Kow-tow to Haman AND Char in the hopes they WON'T drop anything on earth? Whoops! Fingers crossed! They didn't bother doing shit with Full Frontal because the fuck good is Laplace's box gonna do? The politicians are still in power, and Zeon still re-joins the federation at the end of the year anyway. Really all the late-UC conflicts building up to Victory all boil down to the feds not giving a shit because it's not affecting earth directly. Hence why their mobile suit development eventually started to stagnate, because until Zanscare came about, everything else was the crossbone vanguard's problem.

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>>15346084

If Titans took total control true order would be archived.

Off topic question, but did the Titans technically kill more people than Phantom Pain did when they unleashed the Destroy on Eurasia in SEED?

Or was it less?

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>>15346388
Considering the initial launch of the Destroy took place in a part of Berlin, while the Titans gassed an entire colony, followed by firing a colony laser upon one or two more, I would say the Titans did indeed kill more than Phantom Pain. It would not surprise me if Basque had a lollergasm from both of those incidents.

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>>15346456
Hafez Assad was a great guy

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamist_uprising_in_Syria

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1982_Hama_massacre

>>15346456

I thought Phantom Pain destroyed two more cities on their way to Berlin?

Though to be fair, a Colony probably has five times the population of Berlin so it probably doesn't matter.

>>15346110
Fonse Kagatie wasn't the leader of the Jupiter Republic at the time he was manipulating Queen Maria to go to war with the Federation. He was a renegade Crux Dogatie supporter/ambassador that fooled Queen Tetenith into believing that Zanscare had noble goals, and Tetenith, desperately needing allies to help with the rebuild after the previous costly wars, agreed to an alliance.

When she found out later what Kagatie was actually up to and how Zanscare had misused the Angel Halo the Jupiter Republic had built for them, she ordered Tobia to reform the Crossbone Vanguard to hunt them down and broke off the alliance with Zanscare.

>>15346498

So part of the Zanscare conflict was just an extension of lingering Jovian aggression?

>>15346270

They also neglected their landship forces too didn't they?

I read those apparently weren't available to meet the Zanscare invasion.

>>15346378
ah yes the most humane and popular form of government, a military junta

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>>15346084

Wasn't their Mobile Suit development kind of compromised too?

For some folk that are supposed to be combating Zeon, a few of their units look like things Zeon would build.

In fact, the Ashimar looks like a Zeon unit and I believe the Destroy Gundams were based on a particular type of Zeon mobile suit to a certain degree.

>>15346546
Most likely. Though it's hard to tell how much of it was Kagatie's manipulations and how much was genuine on Maria's part. She did seem pretty well informed on the war, yet still kept up the war effort regardless after learning about Uso's side of the conflict.

At least Tetenith realized that the Jupiter Empire/Republic was going to keep pulling Neo Zeons until someone with some sense in their head took the reins.

>>15342782
>accomplish anything in the long run of UC history
In the long run, no

>>15346676
I mean they still saved billions of people by taking out gryps and also stopping axis if we're counting londo bell as a continuation of AEUG

>>15346039
I would say the OYW is ultimately the reason the federation collapsed. The shock of the megadeath caused in the one year was basically assured that the federation would no longer continue a civilian space program and would not ever continue expansion into the solar system and instead, became very insular and obsessed with preventing a second OYW. Which lead to the events of zeta and onward. The AEUG was a symptom of the problem just as the titans were. Not the primary cause.

>>15346957
Basically I believe the federation has no version where they were a successful state in any universe where the one year was occurs. Because either Zeon wins and destroys the federation. Or Zeon loses and the gaping wound left by them causes the federation to slowly bleed out over a century.

>>15346957

If they didn't continue their expansion into space, then who built the Veniusian Colonies in G Reco?

I heard there were colonies around Venus.

>>15347002
Obviously it's an AU where the feds didn't have the OYW as we know it occur. I believe g recos continuity has a 0079 with much less death but more isolated proxy conflicts. Think a cold war in space that never erupted into the Zeon EFF conflict.

>>15346582
Yeah pretty much. Feddie laziness fucks itself up.

>>15346663
Everybody here still believes the Tee-Tahns only used GM Quels, Hazels, and Gaplant Fivers.

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>>15347045
>I believe g recos continuity has a 0079 with much less death but more isolated proxy conflicts.

Then explain all the fossilized mobile suits at Capital Guard and in Jaburo. I don't accept fanservice as an answer since all those dead Z'goks clearly imply some shit went down. Let alone them using the map which once again has Australia with the big-ass hole in it.

>>15346582
They likely didn't see the need since by the time of Victory even lowly Salamis Kai have Minovsky Craft systems and can operate in atmosphere.

>>15347052
>Everybody here still believes the Tee-Tahns only used GM Quels, Hazels, and Gaplant Fivers.

Why?

>>15346971

One can wonder if the Federation had cowed it's subjects more if it would have lasted longer than what it did.

Granted, it might not have stopped Jupiter or Zeon, but it might have gone a considerable way towards curbing Cosmo Babylonia or the Zanscare Empire.

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>>15347052
Literally nobody likes AoZ

>>15346270
The ideal strategy for stopping Char's Dakar speech would have been to just bomb the assembly hall as soon as he got to the podium. Claim that the AEUG did it, watch as the Federation forces start fighting the AEUG in earnest.

>>15347074
Not that anon, but G-Reco contradicts itself regarding its place in the timeline, so I wouldn't take such things seriously.

>>15346469
Can't Mossad the Assad.

>>15347966
No, but everybody here loves the Tee-Tahns and Jims, so of course they're going to ignore the hypocrisy of how all the other MS they fielded during the Gryps war look like Zeek stuff.

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>>15347985
Well yeah. But then you remember JERID was involved in that, and you know his success rate with missions.

>>15342951
>Had Glemy Toto not started his insurrection, the Earth Federation would have been subjugated
Don't downplay Judau and the crew so much. Haman and Minerva were the only glue holding neo Zeon together.

>>15346663
Part of the premise Tomino wrote down for Zeta is that the Feddies did hostile takeovers of all Zeon MS manufacturers. They weren't going to put it to waste. Part of the Titans purpose was to waste alot of tax dollars testing out all the tech and ideas stolen from Zeon

>>15346957
>and instead, became very insular and obsessed with preventing a second OYW.
In other words the West between 1920-1940

Is there any internet and/or other form of mass-information system (other than TV, radios, etc) in U.C? It seems to me that the lack of it does factor into the lack of accountability and democracy in general in U.C?

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>>15342782
>Did the AEUG actually accomplish anything in the long run of UC history?
Yes.

They gave the Gundam Mk II a better color scheme.

>>15348417

So even though Zeon maintained it's independence, the Federation took over their means of production military wise?

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>>15346369
>>15346378
of course a superior state would be proclaimed

>>15348499
Individual colonies and Earth itself might have their own internet, but with minovsky particles fucking up long distance communications, any kind of cross colony system would be unreliable at the best of times.

>>15347966
Is there something wrong with Advance of Zeta? I never heard it get bad mouthed.

>>15348686
Well, what's been established is that they just shut (most of) them down. Zeonic and Zimmad were bought out and absorbed into Anaheim Electronics. Bases such as Solomon, California, and Pezun were occupied by the Federation, and the technology and data with them were transferred into Federation R&D.

In Zeta we can see that Side 3 still maintains some OYW era equipment. The Titans force Side 3 to provide them with (mostly supply) support near the end of the series, I recall seeing some Chivvays, while MAHQ claims that Rick Doms appeared which I don't remember.

>>15351381
Minovsky particles dissipate over the course of weeks. The jamming effect doesn't stay forever, and they're probably using laser communication anyway which isn't affected by minovsky jamming.

>>15342782

Did any UC organization accomplish anything for you out of interest OP? The Federation faded away, slowly losing control of their territory and becoming obsolete. Any future stuff shows a divided Earthsphere with multiple nations and organizations. Zeon never won anything and got smaller and smaller as time went on. The Buch Concern/Crossbone Vanguard were only a tiny rebellion. Zanscare only lasted a few years and didn't influence anything long term to our knowledge.

What exactly are you looking for in terms of accomplishment?

>>15343345

Its not really Tomino's fault or decision, its sort of the necessity of a franchise that only has one story to tell (Earth and the colonies fight because reasons) and the financial incentive to tell it as many times as possible.

That setup REQUIRES that no one in-universe ever fucking learns anything or solves anything for more than a few years. If an actually competent administration took power in the Federation and they were something other than corrupt dickbags for a few years, there would literally never be another UC gundam show again. The whole continuation of the timeline requires the political and technological situation to remain basically stagnant, just swapping in new names for factions and changing the name of the current 'best' MS and leaving everything else the same.

If you gave the Feddies any kind of competence, Zeonic forces are never a problem ever again. If you let the human expansion into space go forward, the earth sphere itself loses relevance and (OH GOD) they might have to come up with a DIFFERENT STORY to tell. If you give either fucking side a 2010 er smartphone, they now have the computers necessary to make minovsky interference militarily irrelevant and mobilesuits cease to be a viable weapon of war as battleships can pick them off from range again.

>>15352114

That what was the incentive for Turn A and G Reco?

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>>15353551

You have to ask?

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Well, at least the Titan uniform was pretty nice and apparently comfortable for wearing beneath a pilot suit.