If Char got the harsh beamsabre dicking instead of Lalah, would

>>15311693
We don't know because Lalah had very little depth as a character and we didn't know anything about her besides "newtype who likes char".

>>15311693
What's the connection between death and asteroid dropping?
Char could drop them because he:
1. Had AE support
2. Was Zeon's son
3. Was charismatic on his own
4. Was raising the questions, which were important for spacenoids.
5. Understood that fighting against EFSF in a straight fight for a long time without any advantages would be a failure.

>>15311702
The entire axis drop incident was just an excuse to fight amuro because LALAH SUNE WAS A YOUNG WOMAN WHO COULD HAVE BECOME A MOTHER TO ME.

>>15311693
Nah, Amuro would have given her the dick and she would have forgotten all about Char.

>>15311706
That's too simple and unlikely. It's like, if Montgomery would like to duel with von Rundstedt and that's why he launched Market Garden.

>>15311707
Would that had last?
Because Amuro's relationships don't seem to last long

>>15311707
No. I suppose that she would separate herself from any military group and go into hiding

>>15311712
(Is that a jojoke, I only know the broad strokes of wwii.)

File: Amuro UC Mode.jpg (28KB, 480x360px) Image search: [Google]

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>>15311693
Isn't that one of the time lines in "UC Mode" from Gundam vs Zeta Gundam on the PS2? Actually I think there were 2-3 variants of it.
>Amuro and Lalah joins the Augusta Newtyple Lab and joins the Titans earlier
>Amuro joins the AEUG with the RX-78
>Amuro as the "Quattro" archtype

>>15311821
Oh yeah also the sweet scenerio where CCA plays out during the Gryps era with Amuro using the Zeta. Plus Char's version

Also remembering Garma's Zabi winning the Gryps war scenerio. Man that game had some fun with UC Mode
>OYW missions for Yazan, Lila, Buran and other Titans
>Zeon OYW missions for Appoly and Roberto
>All the splintering scenarios for characters surviving

>>15311693
Considering how bad newtypes fly off the handle when someone important to them dies, I'd say she'd do worse.

>>15311693
Char was left without his mother, of course he grew up wrong.

>>15311915
It most likely didn't help he fucked his 'mother', and got a whole raft of STD's from her life as an underaged prostitute

>>15311920
Half the people connected to Zeon are underaged prostitutes.

Lalah, Ramba's gf, Haman's sister...

>>15311729
I imagine had Sayla's VA not been out of the country he would have been with her in Zeta and CCA.

File: Hamon1.gif (22KB, 385x550px) Image search: [Google]

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>>15311940
What?

>>15311693
Lala didn't seem like that kind of person but you never know I guess.

>>15311971
I thought about that too
I wish that happen just to see Chars reaction
>Char decides to drop Axis because he can't get over the fact that his sister is with his nemesis

I still get confused to whether Lala could have been Char's one true love or whether he actually felt a motherly bond with her like he says.

>>15311990
More like
>Char decides to drop Axis because he can't get over the fact that his nemesis is with his sister instead of him

>>15311992
Casval was one messed-up faggot, it was likely both at the same time

>>15311992
Something something Oedipus complex something something transference.

>>15311992
What in the world is your definition of a motherly bond with a with a woman of your age that you were in a romantic relationship with?

>>15311729
I think in one Gihren's Greed AU they actually hook up? Amuro cucks Char and takes Lalah from him, I think.

>>15312108
Psychoanalysis is so stupid.
If Char has Oedipus complex so does everyone. If his feelings are transference so are everyones.
>Man wants to cuddle with lover. Mom uded to cuddle him as a baby. Therefore man wants to fuck his mom.
>Man who had good relationships as he grew up is good at relationships. Man who had bad relationships as he grew up is bad at relationships. Hm. It's almost like there is a pattern.

>>15313878
That's why nowadays nobody takes Freud seriously and he's more of the joke source than a theorist

>>15311712
What part of Char's Midlife Crisis did you not get? Dropping Axis was the cheap and quick way of doing the bare minimum of achieving his father's goals which he no longer believed in anyway, and more importantly he got to resume his 13 year old pissing match with Amuro doing it. Gundam people do not think like actual sane rational people, your analogy is off.

>>15313940
People don't think like rational sane people.
Your headcanon is off.

>>15313940
You're a fucking idiot if you think Amuro factored into Chars decisions in CCA as much as Kamille did
He decided to fight Amuro again because he was doing a suicidal mission, not the other way around. Zeta was genuine. Try watching it sometime and look for their conversation about sacrifices. Char is the sacrifice to achieve peace (in his own head) and he'd rather nobody else killed him (or at least attempt to) than amuro

>>15314655
>implying anyone gave a shit about Kamille
typical Zetafag

>>15314655
>you are a fucking idiot if you think Amuro factored in as much as Kamille did
Or maybe it was just the entirety of his shitty life and not just one particular particular thing. You know, like in actual decision making.
>because he was doing a suicidal mission
Don't make bombastic statements without evidence. There is nothing to suggest that.
>look for their conversation about sacrifices
Try to read the flow of the conversation and how the whole theme develops throughout the show. It's one of the central themes of Zeta too. The sacrifice is something else. But he chooses not to do it. This is the point.

>>15311693
>Oh Amuro, I still think back to that day, how full of passion Mr. Char was. Still, I'm glad we've learned to put our differences aside. MAKE LOVE TO ME AMURO, MAKE LOVE TO ME ON TOP OF HIS GRAVE AND BECOME LIKE A FATHER TO HIM!

>>15314655
>You're a fucking idiot if you think Amuro factored into Chars decisions in CCA as much as Kamille didHe decided to fight Amuro again because he was doing a suicidal mission, not the other way around. Zeta was genuine. Try watching it sometime and look for their conversation about sacrifices. Char is the sacrifice to achieve peace (in his own head) and he'd rather nobody else killed him (or at least attempt to) than amuro


And YOU are a fucking raving idiot if you think the character interactions in Zeta hava any relation whatsoever to what Char, Amuro and co. do in CCA. The day gundam-tards will understand that CCA is not a fucking sequel to either Zeta or ZZ can't come fast enough.

>>15315102
What makes you feel so confident. Have you actually watched any of the series?

>>15315096
>implying that Lalah wouldn't abandon Amuro and go lesbian for Sayla

>>15315115

One could as well ask you the same questions: what makes you so confident? Have you even watched any of the series?

The only things that link Char in Char's Counterattack to him in Zeta are a Cutsdean from a game that came out years after the fact and shares, as far as I know, none of the staff along with an an out of context set of images that have to edit scenes in order to make them linked.

And in regards to the second Char is clearly thinking about Lalah when he's holding the whiskey, not Amuro. He even narrates about her. Maybe it's just characterization that carries over though, and the image ise meant to represent that characterisation, with Char making himself a sacrifice like he talked with Amuro about? This conclusion ignores that Char made himself a sacrifice in both Zeta and 0079, not just Char's Counterattack. He sacrificed his freedom to lead A.E.U.G. in Zeta, and sacrificed it earlier to join Zeon and work under his enemies in 0079 for the chance at revenge. Saying he must be influenced by that talk in Zeta not only doesn't involve Kamille regardless, it ignores his history of constantly sacrificing himself as a person in pursuit of a goal.

>>15311821
Man I need to play that just because of the alternate scenarios.

Would Lalah help Mirada? Seems like a Gundam thing to do given their own pasts.

>>15315323
Are you retarded? Char cries like a little bitch when he realizes his plan failed in CCA. He's very serious about the SAVE THE EARTH spiel he went on about in Zeta. And in the first place he hatches the entire force everyone to become newtypes idea in Zeta after meeting Rosamia.

>>15315484

When did I say he wasn't serious about his plan? Nor does his "plan" in Zeta bear any resemblance to his plan in Char's Counterattack. In Zeta he posits that it might be better to make everyone cyber newtypes since evolution is slow, which has nothing to do with his actions in Char's Counterattack, where his efforts might eventually evolve people but would do so at nature's pace and as a secondary consequence at best given that he seems far more concerned with contolism than evolution.

>>15315529
>In Zeta he posits that it might be better to make everyone cyber newtypes since evolution is slow
The entire point being that he believes newtypes will somehow gain the wisdom to not abuse the Earth. He says "if we just leave it to nature the Earth will be used up" or something around those lines.

Contolism was always his philosophy, in CCA he just takes a more aggressive approach towards it. And his strong environmental slant was introduced in Zeta too.

>>15315323
CCA picks up the unresolved thematic conflict of Zeta (Individual vs. Society), rather than that of MSG (Individual vs. Individual).
The political conflict is also a direct continuation of the one set forth in Zeta.
Char's conduct in CCA is a result of the resolution of his moral dilemma in Zeta (personal freedom vs. social acceptance), rather than that of MSG (reason vs. emotion). In fact the latter dichotomy is proven to be false and , at the end of MSG, broken down and dismissed. Without conflict there can be no movement. Thus Zeta is necessary on order to introduce a new conflict.
The theme of sacrifice is introduced in Zeta to reflect its central thematic conflict and is not relevant in any way to MSG. It represents giving up your personal freedom to gain social acceptance.In this particular discussion between Char and Amuro, Amuro suggests that this is the morally correct choise. In the end Char rejects this idea because for him free will is of the utmost value ("Isn't expressing your emotions the most important thing?").
If you assume the Char in CCA is the same as MSG magically transported in time, that his age and life experiences have no influence on him, that a man thirty has the same priorities, values, physical and emotional needs as a man of twenty is the criminal act of completely ignoring all of the subtleties of the storytelling.
In the same vein I would like to know how you would explain the relationship upgrade that Char and Amuro receive in Zeta and that is one of the key elements in CCA with only the help of MSG.

>>15315571

When does he say he believes newtypes will be that wise in Char's Counterattack? The closest I can think of to him saying "if we just leave it to nature the Earth will be used up" in Char's Counterattack is pic related, which is an argument for Contolism and not an argument for artificial evolution of any kind, newtypes or otherwise. I also never said Contolism was only a belief he espoused in Char's Counterattack, only that his actions were more about Contolism than anything to do with newtypes in the film. Also, he had a strong envioronmental slant in Zeta from almost the start, and held it regardless of Kamille, not because of him. It's also a belief (along with Contolism) that he expressed mildly in 0079.

He does say something similar to "if we just leave it to nature the Earth will be used up" in the Zeta episode where he and Dr. Hasan discuss cyber-newtypes after Rosamia is examined, but I don't believe he says anything like it in Char's Counterattack.

>>15315657

How is 0079, the story of a boy changing as he helps his comrades because they might die otherwise, not a story about individuals versus society? How is Char's Counterattack a direct continuation of Zeta's political climate, and not also a direct continuation of 0079s given that Haman's Neo Zeon has little to do with Chars? Also, while Zeta might be necessary to introduce a new conflict, Char's Counterattack is at least partially about revisiting old conflicts, not struggling with new ones. Char's anger over Lalah's death is not a new conflict, nor is his feelings about it new.

Sacrifice is also an element of 0079 by the way. And not just for Char. Amuro sacrifices his freedom and to a degree his personality to help fight for his comrades. More directly Dozle sacrifices himself for his men. I'd also like to know what "relationship upgrade" you think Char and Amuro receive in Zeta that is a key element of Char's Counterattack and is unexplainable without Zeta.

File: Contolism.png (2MB, 1366x768px) Image search: [Google]

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>>15315723

Also, pic since I forgot it.

Char is actually a newtype elitist and is called out on wanting to get rid of oldtypes in the Texas colony. Saving the earth is a cheap facade for wiping out oldtypes.

>>>>15315723
>How is the story of a boy changing as he helps his comrades because they might die otherwise, not a story about individuals versus society
Because it doesn't explore the psychological conflict of identity vs.conformism. A child is not aware of this conflict (the children vs. adults theme).Coming of age is about struggling to find identity (i.e.becoming aware) but this is as far as MSG goes.
>and not also a direct continuation of 0079s given that Haman's Neo Zeon has little to do with Char's?
I don't see what Haman or Char's Neo Zeon have to do with anything.
MSG follows a contained conflict of two sides struggling to overcome one another as characters on both sides clash to fight for their personal values and beliefs(individual vs individual).
In Zeta the conflict is presented as an escalating stalemate that is pointlessly perpetuated by both sides' unwillingness to compromise neither their interests(individual) nor security(society) .CCA tries to break this stalemate.
>Char's Counterattack is at least partially about revisiting old conflicts
I am talking about internal conflicts of values, not external conflicts of interests. At the end of MGS Char still has unresolved feelings but is unable to sort them out because his way of thinking has been disproved. Thus he had no basis on which to seek confrontation. You see, to fight over what you believe in you need something to believe in first.
But if I have to integrate the "revisiting old conflicts" theme in terms of Individual vs Society then expressing your emotions is embracing individuality - seeking conflict, resolution and release, wanting to move on (CCA), while holding on to your emotions is accepting society - avoiding confrontation, seeking security and constancy at your personal expense (Zeta).
>Sacrifice is also an element of 0079
I already told you what the theme of sacrifice represents in Zeta.
>what "relationship upgrade" do you think Char and Amuro receive
Are you fucking serious?

>>15311729
Lalah was Amuro's endgame since she's a person that understands him. The only reason he doesn't fuck Char is because Char likes "them" young.

>>15315723
0079 is really deep once you start thinking about it.

Too bad the animation and soundtrack don't help.

>>15315175
I wish Sayla had done something. She quit the military like Char wanted her to but that led to her doing nothing afterwards.

>>15315723


again only /a/ fags keeps defending zeta and cca

though the latest posts here on /m/ are now they trying to shitpost against 0079, wing and crossbone

>>15317445
Wait, I thought /m/ generally liked CCA because of all the gay and because the great ending made up for all the shit parts.

>>15317445
I know Wing is getting a new BluRey release. Is Crossbone getting one too?