How the fuck can it be that this show actually good? I decided

The writing actually gets much, much better too.

CGI also notably improves by seasons 2-3. Not because of super high quality, but because of good cinematography and design work.

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Try watching Energon if you want bad CGI, and this was years later.

And give mainframe some slack, they were the first to do all CGI cartoons in the mid 90's. They were making it all up as they went along.

>>15304478
The difference between the first and third seasons of Reboot is astonishing.

Anyways OP makes me feel really really old.

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>>15304478
Man, I still remember watching Reboot as a kid, even after all these years.

It's hard to believe how far CG has progressed since those early days. Say what you want about how the Nips use it, but nowadays, if you throw enough money at something you can get some pretty neat-looking shit.

>>15304133
It also doesn't have the obligatory part that Transformers always must have: the puny humans.

While it's possible to make the humans characters not intrusive or forced, the fact the setting allows to work without them certainly benefits the show.

U r yung

>>15304133
>penguinz0
Just say Cr1TiKal.

And you see young lad, despite the fact that everyone likes to get on their high horses about "adult media", narratives are dependent on the writer and execution not as much the initial premise. Just because it's a CG cartoon robot gorilla, it doesn't mean that the writing has to be idiotic or crass. Welcome to /m/ where among the absolute shittiest of you commercials, there are some series with rather good writing that can get quite deep and interesting. Never let a medium inhibit your opinion of a work of fiction.

>>15304463
>Not because of super high quality, but because of good cinematography and design work
It largely came from them just figuring out how the CG works. They were firing from the hip and just trying to see if they could figure out how rigging and texture engines work the whole time, steadily figuring out what looks good.

>>15304133
It's unwatchable due to Waspinator though.

>>15304133
>remake
Fuck no. Unless we're talking a purely visual reskin, it'd be pointless when the original is perfectly fine.

I'm game for a new beast Transformer show with new characters though, it's probably just a matter of timr.

>it's a Scott McNeil talks to himself episode

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hJkvwoddxY

>>15304587
So most episodes?

>>15304590
David Kaye's the man.

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It was kickass watching it as a kid and getting some of the toys on birthdays and Christmas. The manta ray, Depthcharge, was my favorite toy back then.

>>15304587
>>15304593

like when Duo Maxwell and Chaos Lord Bale started to bickering with each other

>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3JuKsfgpkk
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8ngVxPMqV8
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jh_Uxonl7rM

>>15304506
>They were firing from the hip and just trying to see if they could figure out how rigging and texture engines work the whole time, steadily figuring out what looks good.

They had like what, 4 seasons of Reboot to already figure that out?

>>15304961
I doubt that was the same engine, at least not for rendering. Not to mention rigging animal movements is a fucking nightmare as opposed to human movement.

BW also had a pretty big influence on all the future TF fiction, since it was the series that introduced the concept of Sparks.

>>15304612

Til DepthCharge voice actor went to voice Fucking Prime Shockwave years later

aa the coldest and ruthless interaction of Shockwave

>>15304133
I get BW vibes from the last few western TF productions (Animated, Prime, RID).

All of them focus on a small central cast stranded on a foreign world. TFA and RID have fresh rookie leaders trying to wrangle their uncooperative teams of misfits. TFP Megatron feels like BW Megs at times.

They are all fucked by the western production format in the same ways. They all had to abandon or hastily tie-up plot threads due to not knowing if the show will be cancelled or renewed. TFP had the same CGI production limitations which made it difficult to expand the cast. TFP to RID had an abrupt shift in tone like BW to BM, but at least they got to keep their writers and most of the staff.

>>15304587
>A breif history of the Canadian animation industry.

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Anyone in the U.S remember getting these at McDonalds in their happy meals? I always got this exact one

>>15305339
Canada here, but yeah I got the manta ray.

>panther's limbs have joints
Slightly jelly

>>15305339
Shit I also got that exact one.

>>15305339
>>15305346
I had both and the rhino/hippo/whatever. I preferred the stingray.

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Best megatron

>>15306316
My nigga.

>>15305364
Oh geez, same here. I always wanted the stingray, but I kept getting rhino after rhino.

>>15305364
>>15306511
Keep an eye that Depth Charge voiced later Prime SHockwave

>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jU0HeRY03UM

from BatManta to the coldest Decepticon ever

>>15306316
yess

>>15305179
>I get BW vibes from the last few western TF productions
Hardly surprising, given how influential BW's approach of focusing on a small cast proved to be.

And yeah, technically in the case of BW and Prime, CGI limitations were also part of the reason behind that decision.

>>15306511
>kept getting rhino after rhino

Something I became aware of is that if you were very polite, and asked for a specific toy, you'd often get it unless the person working the counter was shit or they were out. (And even then if your problem was getting too much of one thing you just say "anything that isn't X" and you'd get it).

>>15304133
I don't do rankings of my favorite cartoons, but Beast Wars would be pretty high up there if I did. Following my initial reaction of "what the fuck is this shit", it sucked me in after half a season and it's the only Transformers show I keep going back to.

Too bad the dated CGI does make it hard to sell it to newcomers. I once did a write-up about the show for some website, focusing on all of its achievements and giving a general outline, and the only reaction it got boiled down to "looked like crap even back then".

Technically the writing can get uneven too, which is a more fair complaint. The first season starts out very slow and the third is a mess, leaving many ideas unexplored and having horrid pacing. For that reason, I wouldn't mind a remake that irons out the faults, but it would need the original writers and cast and no toy-based limitations, and that would never happen. Maybe if BW was truly big and popular, but sadly it's not.

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why didnt they just end the series after season 3

>>15307780
Because Hasbro gonna Hasbro.

>>15305339
i got the stingray nigga
shit was cash

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>>15307780

You've gotta applaud them for trying something different though. Not just different for Transformers, but something wholly unique.

It was crap, and the designs are weird and borderline gross most of the time, but they tried, damn it, and that's worth something.

POWER IT UP THE POWER BLOOCK

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EzjPQgfZROY

>>15307809
Ah Beast Machines, a prime example of trying to """fix""" something that ain't broken. I'm not one of its haters, but, like, what the fuck were they thinking? It's like they ran with a random ass half-baked concept idea they came up with at a Hasbro conference and made it into a full TV show and toy line, instead of stopping and thinking it through.

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>>15307836
BM was a good example of destroying a characters credibility

pic related

>>15307836
Hey, at least it was better than Beast Wars.

>>15305059
And Protoforms.

>>15307854
I do like how Rattrap was originally going to be a cripple, but the opted not to go through with that, so he was left with organs showing in his robot mode. Though when BM was being made they brought back that idea and made him the wheelchair kid.


On another note I hope after Masterpiece Dinobot we will get a Masterpiece BW Megatron.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWWW1HyRy3E

great scene

Season 1 Rat Trap was the best design in the whole show fight me.

>>15309002
Any Rat Trap is better than Beast Machines Rat Trap

>>15307809
>>15307780


i cant play Crysis trilogy nowadays without looking prophet as BM Optimus

Goddamit Crytek
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5T19v3zliY
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fnnyPHLjVkE

>>15309008
>>15309002
>Niggas dissing based Optimus Primal.
Dude looked awesome in his first and third forms.

>>15304529
Why 4chan hate Wazzzpinator?

>>15309147

the multiverse hates waspinator

I remember that episode where dinobot fucks all the bad guys by himself, sacrificing his life to protect human ancestors

>>15309433

Code of Hero, the episode who made every 90's kids and oldfag tf fans cries manly tears for a month

>>15309452
tell my tale to those who ask , tell it truly
the evil deeds along with the good
let me be judged accordingly
teh rest , is silence..

manly tears indeed

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>>15309002
rat trap was the best character period

he was like the only character in the show with common sense sorta like a fouth wall breaking character who thought everything happening around him in BW was crazy and he had the balls to admit it

Rat trap: Where you been bird brain,
Silver bolt: Scout patrol

Rat trap: oh I see, I see, scouting the enemy.
Find any new positions?
*punch*

Not until I was older did I realise he was implying silverbolt was fucking black arachnia. Though the basic inference even back then was obvious.

>>15309739
My sides, I should rewatch Beasties.

>>15309805
Found the Canadian.

>>15309549

Scott Mcneil was The MAN, even fucking Duo was Human rattrap, though less jerk

>>15309805
>>15309829
>not having both ABC and YTV
Granted, I don't know why the word "war" was considered so hilariously offensive back then when Canada can get away with more things than the US.

>>15304133
>Why is shit so enjoyable to watch and why isn't there a modern remake of this? The writing could actually work as a modern cartoon if it had decent animation.
For exactly the reason you said.

Why would you want a remake of something that was already well written? G1 stuff gets recycled because the original media/toys were iffy and frankly dated af a lot of times, so there's a demand to make stuff that's "like ___ but as good as I remember it being.", like with the new TMNT or Scooby-Doo cartoons, but that's because the original stuff does not really hold up.

Like, BW is not just some dumb, episodic cartoon where you could just do season 1 style episodes all over again, but good. There are very specific reasons for why everyone and everything is the way it is on the show, both in-universe and IRL, and if you were to remake it...
>You'd have to shill new toys which means new characters...
>And any changes to the cast would throw off the very delicate balance of its small size and reliable character dynamics
>Any changes to any of the show characters' personalities, mannerisms, appearance or catchphrases would piss off and alienate fans.
>Hell, casting anybody BUT the original Canadian VAs for all the roles would probably piss everyone right the fuck off, and forget that, this isn't the 90s anymore.
>Without spoiling much, the overplot hinges on some big fan-favorite twists that they'd be damned if they did, and damned if they didn't - because you're pointless if you retell the story the same way, but hated if you deviate even slightly from the original, which is actually beloved.

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>>15309549
Rattrap was all-time bro tier, just wanted to go back to Cybertron and buy everybody a hookerbot to celebrate.

>>15310051
We never saw that bar he mentioned where the hostesses don't wear chest armor.

>>15310051
>>15310085

in the end he ended up married with a Tree

>DEAL WITH IT!

poor waspinator, would still he a butt Monkey in RID, since he already exists there but only on the 3ds game?

>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLYmcarnFZA

>>15310044
>Why would you want a remake of something that was already well written? G1 stuff gets recycled because the original media/toys were iffy and frankly dated af a lot of times, so there's a demand to make stuff that's "like ___ but as good as I remember it being.", like with the new TMNT or Scooby-Doo cartoons, but that's because the original stuff does not really hold up.

It's more like the premise and designs of G1 are great. The actual writing, animation and execution are iffy. The movie showed how great Transformers can look if given a proper animation budget.

>>15309433
Press F for Dinobot.

>>15304498
But they are there.

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This show was and still is absolutely one of my favorites. I watched it religiously as a kid. Too bad the sequel was beyond terrible.

>>15306316
I had this toy and it was great. I also had this Rat Trap.

>>15304612
His toy was complete shit, though. The fins kept popping out of the shoulder slots in beast mode.

>>15309433
>>15309452
Code of Hero is such a GOAT episode.

I've always wondered if BW would be half as good without Dinobot

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>>15309452
>Code of Hero
>that epic fight with the preds
>that Megatron taunting him
>"A warrior still"
>tfw Dinobot resites Hamlet "tell my tale to those who ask...."
We will never again have a cartoon like BW and Reboot.

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>>15310677
Yes, but they appear waaaaaay later, and are still monkey-like cavemen.

heres the prototype models of BW tv series and the glorious transformation sequences of it

>airazor still he best girl, with IDW making justice both her and Tigatron
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNmxxYzBTKU
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GVJAxel0sx0

>>15306316
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWWXw5SMIP0
Duly noted.
AND IGNORED!

>>15312846
also the deaths were fucking brutal for a 90's cartoon

>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vj--3N4JVO0

>>15312183
>dinobot is raptorjesus

>>15304961
>They had like what, 4 seasons of Reboot to already figure that out?

More like 1. Also it featured far more organic designs and settings than ReBoot.

U WONT GET ME ALIVE!

>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFR1EqjxXmo

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>SFDebris is doing Beast Wars now

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>>15304133
I think at the end of the day writing is the biggest component in terms of quality when it comes to shows/movies/books/ etc. Y'know, storytelling.

Beast Wars was the shit cuz

>>15304587
>>it's a Scott McNeil talks to himself episode
>>15304699
>like when Duo Maxwell and Chaos Lord Bale started to bickering with each other
Yeah, how is this not awesome?

>>15309452
>Code of Hero, the episode who made every 90's kids and oldfag tf fans cries manly tears for a month
>>15309512
>tell my tale to those who ask , tell it truly
>the evil deeds along with the good
>let me be judged accordingly
>teh rest , is silence..
>>15311727
>>tfw Dinobot resites Hamlet "tell my tale to those who ask...."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oifs6ulpd9A

>>15310670
>Press F for Dinobot.
F!

>>15316266
he has always been doing it but I reckon no one donated for more eps

>>15316266
Watching it again thanks to him.

>>15304587
I can't believe the Megaman cartoon had him play both major antagonists

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>>15307809
I am still salty that we never got Transtech after Beast Machines.

>>15318435
MUNKY IS TRUKK

>>15309739
Black arachnia was based on an asian stripper from Vancouver the animators were fans of.

It kind of explains the massive titties and slanted eyes.

>>15318435
This is 90's as hell, holy shit

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>>15318438

Here's the rest of the concept art. I'm too lazy to dump it all.

Third party transformer companies need to get on this shit.

>>15304587
It's funny how he was willing to be in the He-Man reboot and proceeded to play about four villains.

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>>15318439
http://tfarchive.com/fandom/transtech/?dgallery=browse

There's some great mecha in here.

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Dose having organic transformation form has any effect on the behavior of the transformer ?
i remember they mention that in the show
Alice in the movie seems to be actually vary into her human persona and enjoy the seducing thing .
Unlike other Decepticons , she really does has sexual feeling of sam even though her goal is still to cut open her enemy
mainhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5SOdTsGaxLk

>>15318819
>i remember they mention that in the show
There was an episode dedicated to how staying in beast mode for too long caused them to take on the behavior of their respective animal forms, due to a programming error. Their way of overcoming it was establishing balance between the robot and animal forms and using both to their advantage.

>>15318440

Scott Mcneil will always be /ourguy/

from /tg/ to /m/

>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZzbAaHHidg

>>15318437
this gotta be fake.... is it ?

>>15304133
I think some of the limitations actually helped. They couldn't do a bunch of characters on screen due to limitations of the technology, so they had to focus on a small group of bots. BW still has the strongest character work out of any of transformers series.

Also Mainframe had some fantastic writers. Reboot and BW still hold up 20 years later.

>>15319467
It's been pretty widely reported. Guys who made the show were known to be pervs, just think of the fake Transmutate script or the render they made of Dinobot with his "dick" out.

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>they do a remake of Beastwars, but its literally the exact same voices and soundtrack, overlayed on top of new CGI

>literally nothing changes except the graffix

>>15319556
They'd need to redub Rattrap's "scale-belly" remarks and change them to "feather-belly" for bonus scientific accuracy.

>>15311147
Wow, that tail has more articulation than some of the toys we're getting now.

>>15319556
I want Takara to show the MP Dinobot so much. They'll have to go crazy to make the transformation work.

>>15319542
could you provide a link or be a bit more specific? its the first i heard of this perv thing.
i love the show since my childhood but never searched for non toy related topics

>>15309981
I remember a lot of violent parts were toned down or cut out for American channels, like Rhinox strangling Terrorsaur or Tigerhawk gunning down Megatron.

>>15319641

TFwiki aka what 1d4chan will never be

>tfw Paramount will never just cut out the middleman and make a Transformers movie with the Pretenders so we don't have to waist our time on human characters

>>15304133
Show had some great episodes. I used to watch this all the time on tv. That multi-episode plot about the fight over a large floating island with a lazer tower in the center was probably the best in the series.

>>15318917
So Alice's unusual erotic and sedative behavior cab be explained that she stay in her human form too long

>>15319742
Only in the Foxkids version. The violent parts were in the syndicated version.

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>>15308928
>The question that has haunted my being has been answered: The future is not fixed. My choices are my own. And yet, how ironic, for I now find I have no choice at all! I am a warrior... let the battle be joined.

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>tfw a transmetal toy you own starts to have it's metallic paint chip

It looks so cool but holy fuck do they get damaged easily

>>15304699
The only show where you can watch a rat argue with a velociraptor

I liked spider boobs

>>15321246
Not as bad as Gold Plastic Syndrome
https://youtu.be/36AIzcV7iOc

>>15318436
GEEWUN GIT OUT

>>15312846
>airazor still he best girl
>that part where she moans

>>15321268
best girl

>>15321246
Don't remind me. I was stupid enough to try save my TM Rattrap by coating his chrome parts with nail polish, but it just made him look like he got hotglued. And when I tried to remove it, the chrome got damaged as well.

I maintain that these toys still hold up today, and if their molds are intact, they'd just need to replace the chrome with metallic plastic or paint and sell them again.

>>15321275
>Gold Plastic Syndrome
Explain?

>>15321481
https://youtu.be/qcjAUN5Ssj8
During the 90s, they started using metallic plastics for transformer toys. However, that plastic is poorly formulated and the bonds between the metallic flakes and the plastic will degrade over time, making the plastic devastatingly brittle after a few years.

>>15321500
i´ll never again touch my transmetal megatron...

>>15307809

I'd applaud them for making something interesting and better than Beast Wars personally. I'm one of the few that likes Beast Machines though, and also apparently one of the few who doesn't love Beast Wars. I saw Beast Wars getting constant praise on /m/ for years and finally decided to watch it, only to find it a rather mediocre show. The things it's often praised for, like it's characters and on-going story were something I found in Beast Machines instead. Beast Machines had awful designs (at least for the good guys), and really had no place being a sequel, but Beast Wars had only slightly better designs much of the time and was a worse show in most ways.

The one thing I really enjoyed in Beast Wars was seeing the production team mess with the then new 3D technology and seeing what they could do animation wise with it. Seeing them do Looney Tune style stuff occasionally was fun, as were a few of the characters, at least in theory, but they were mostly kind of boring and went nowhere. Dinobot's much lauded death being the best example to me, since his character arc is essentially done in the pilot when he switches sides and then when he does die nobody ever mentions him again. Not even when his clone shows up. The actual death scene was decent mind, but the way the show treated it was to just forget it. Which takes away from it. A lot. I've been told the creators were forbidden from doing more with it since the production company didn't think kids would be able to follow a serial work, but I think it's just as well given that the more I've heard they wanted (Rattrap wanting to clone Dinobot himself or something) is probably worse than the nothing we got.

Beast Wars has a better initial plot, but I think Beast Machines is far and away the better show.

>>15321540
>Rattrap wanting to clone Dinobot himself or something
He wanted to upload the original Dinobot's memories into the clone, only for the conflicting personalities to drive himself mad, leading to Dinobot basically killing himself again. It would have partially given justification for Dinobot II turning back into his old self at the end, though it would still not have explained how he gained the original Dinobot's final memories, since he never made a backup for those.

I'm also one of the four people on this planet that doesn't hate BM, but it took me a few watched to get there. It can't escape the stigma of being a followup to BW and the wider G1 mythos, and I really would have loved to see the Cybertron that got hinted at in BW.

I can look past most of the designs and tonal and character shifts, but even with all these, BM feels halfassed. The philosophizing is never that deep and some of the messages are dragged out and dumbed down. There's also the wasted potential, the show could have taken a better advantage of its setting, like the Maximals exploring other parts of the planet, at least for the sake of variety. Cybertron's history also got put in the trash way too quickly, and maybe they could have given hints of what happened with the Cybertronian-human relationship. Or how about bringing back those organics that lived underground from season 3 of the G1 show? They would have fit right into the theme.

It just feels like they could have done much more with the concept in some areas and less in others. There was a lot of potential in both the "BW sequel show" and the "deep, dark, philosophic TF show" concepts, but when they mixed the two together, I feel both ideas got halfassed.

>>15321540
>really had no place being a sequel
I think this is the heart of most people's problems with BM, honestly. On its own merits it's surprisingly mature and well-made for a kid's show, but the stigma of following Beast Wars hurts it too much.

Obviously since it came before, people wouldn't have had as much to compare BW to, so development and storylines that feel simplistic now were a pretty big deal. So people naturally got attached to the cast and their quirks, which makes things a little odd come BM when main cast members like Primal and Rattrap might as well have been completely different characters.

>>15321754
I recall hearing that BM was more of a sequel to the Beast Wars toyline than the actual show and having seen Beast Machines, a lot of the characters do feel fairly different from where Wars left off.

As someone who didn't really pay attention to the bios until around Cybertron, is there any truth to that?

>>15321781
It's a sequel to the toys in the sense that by the end of BW, the designs were already a bizarre, grotesque mishmash of organic and mechanical parts and crazy colors, so BM took it to a new level.

The toy bios weren't consistent within the line. Originally, according to the toy descriptions, BW took place in the modern day and featured the same characters as in G1. They slowly began adhering to the cartoon canon later on, but they still ventured off into various directions that never came up in either BW or BM.

Most of the differences in the handling of the characters probably come from there being a new writing team who were instructed to ignore both G1 and BW, and also from the characters being cast into new roles with little time to adapt.

>>15321781
Sounds more like someone's headcanon than anything.

The very, very early BW bios and promo material before the show implied a modern-day earth setting with Primal and Megatron literally being the G1 guys, for instance. But once the show hit everything more or less lined up, and the bios probably wouldn't have been big enough for BM-style huge personality shifts anyway.

Because it was made by the crew of ReBoot
and ReBoot was the absolute tits

until Season 4 anyway

Dunno if you guys saw this, but a fan did a short CGI remaster of Beast Wars of what it would look like with modern graphics.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tXH9wVLHV5M

>>15304590
This is oddly pleasant

>>15304498
>While it's possible to make the humans characters not intrusive or forced,
Yeah we call that the Braves shows
But murrican Transformers never wanted to take that step of having pilots

>>15305339
Yeah I remember chewing on his head until it was unrecognizable
I was a weird kid

>>15310044
>Scooby doo
>doesn't hold up
Oh fuck off, name a better scoob than 60s scoob I dare you

>>15318435
His vehicle mode in the Fall of Cybertron game is EXACTLY like that, just a heads up

>>15306316
very sexy megatron

>>15323880
See, if BW was "remastered" like that by just redoing the episodes with updated graphics but leaving everything else alone... it'd be perfect.

I never have had an issue with the "dated" graphics, but since it's a turn-off for most (and especially newer/younger TF fans), a revamped visual BW could draw in a new audience with the same appreciation for it as the original BW fans.

>>15321849
>until Season 4 anyway

What was wrong with Season 4 (I mean beyond the unfortunate cliffhanger and cuts to the story they had no choice but to make)?

>>15323880

WOOOOOT AWESOME. Now make the whole show like that!