Despite all the powerwanking in the manuals and such, the Turns

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>>15126577
Yeah, but there are a ton of excuses people can use to avoid seeing this:
>Tomino made a conscious choice to focus on the human drama rather than show off a bunch of abilities of the Turns.
>They're NT-use units being used by oldtypes
>Laura is holding back
and my personal favorite:
>it was low on power
which is pretty funny when you think about the idea of a degeneracy reactor being low on power.

If you only compare it to the shows that were out at the time (and haven't seen G Gundam) then the Turn A has some fairly impressive feats. The problem comes from the fact that later Gundam shows went pretty over-the-top with the maneuverability and firepower of hero and villain upgrades, and G Gundam was already so absurdly over-the-top that there's really no point in trying to outdo it in that area. Devil Gundam absolutely shames both of the Turn units when it comes to on-screen capabilities.

Not to mention the underwhelming ending of the two Turns basically just both malfunctioning.

>>15126577
The Moonlight Butterfly is the big gamebreaker and they only use it at the end, so of course.
If Loran broke it out earlier then the show would be over immediately.

>>15126795
Turn A had absolutely nothing else going for it other than the MLB. Even barring the fact that Loran was a shit pilot, Turn A never came across as an exceptional suit.

>>15126787
I've always taken it as them being old and unrestored and kinda shitty, which kind of ties into the malfunction thing you mentioned, the power thing always got a chuckle from me since they're a fucking blackhole more or less.

That and the power wanking is silly anyways. (Not just for turns but shit like the ELS Qan[T] and everything else)

>>15126795
>only use it at the end
Harley Quinn uses it earlier in the show to attack a bunch of wooden buildings. It was less impressive at the end than it was when she had it, really, since all it did at the end was cocoon the two Turns.
>>15126795
>Laura is holding back
I knew you'd say that.

>>15126807
>being old and unrestored and kinda shitty
but....
repair nanomachines powered by black hole engines....

>>15126802
That's what I'm saying. Though I don't think Loran's anywhere near a shit pilot considering he only lost a single battle. And as you said, the Turn A isn't especially powerful.
>>15126817
Didn't the cocoon happen because the two butterflies cancelled each other out? And why wouldn't he hold out on using it? He doesn't want to kill people and he knows how dangerous it is.

>>15126825
>He doesn't want to kill people and he knows how dangerous it is.
That's exactly why the MLB isn't "the big gamebreaker".

Look at it this way:
It's a lot easier to kill 1,000 people by setting a building on fire than by shooting 1,000 people with a rifle. That doesn't mean "structure fire" is a better weapon than a rifle. It doesn't mean that "arsonist" is a better soldier than "sniper". It's a lot easier to kill everyone in a colony with a cannister of G3 gas than to destroy the colony with a 120mm machinegun, but the G3 launcher does not make the MS-05b a better mobile suit. Kira doesn't want to kill people, and Freedom could non-lethally disable a dozen mobile suits simultaneously, while Turn A has one weapon that is too indiscriminate to use in most circumstances. Having the MLB does not make the Turn A a better mobile suit.

>>15126930

Honestly Im glad to see a MS that's not a fucking beam spamming super sayin crock of bullshit.

>>15126802
It did have NANOMASHEENS even in show, but the only thing it did is fix its mustache that one time.

>>15126807
>old and unrestored and kinda shitty
Pretty much this.

It wasn't until the Militia sniped some Moonrace technicians to have a look at it that they started to get the thing back on track (the thrusters in the back of the legs, for example, were horribly jammed, whether by nanoskin bits or just dirt and soil). Remember what Turn A's armory was like after sitting around for millennia, and that stuff was buried deep under the surface; the Turn A itself is lucky the rifle it had on it held together long enough to fire a shot.

It took the trip to the Moon, with the Black History expo as well as Ghinghnam's people fiddling with it, to get it into the shape it was by the series finale.

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>>15126802
It had one of the slickest beam rifles ever.

>>15127105
And it took a couple of weeks to do that.
Devil Gundam rematerialized several whole 10x10 foot plates of armor instantly, one after another. It also grew giant tubes from colony orbit all the way down to the surface of the earth, ALL OVER THE EARTH in just a few minutes.

>>15127292
But could it do that after sitting underground for an undisclosed amount of time but over at least 2000 years?

And one thing with Turn A's power, admittedly wank, is that it had tech from every previous Gundam series and retroactively gains tech from every subsequent Gundam timeline.

>>15127105
>but the only thing it did is fix its mustache that one time.
That's a fine examples of having the right priorities.

>>15127279
People give Syd Mead shit for the mustache but fuck them, the rifle and shield are fucking amazing.

Didn't the Turn A have a scattering mega beam cannon in its lower chest that got shown with no fanfare in one episode? Maybe I'm thinking of an animation from a game, though.

>>15128317
I believe that was one of the things they unlocked on the moon along with the ability to turn completely invisible by shaking its beam sabers fast enough.

>>15127279
Which only gets used once until the very end of the series.

>>15128317
I have zero memory of that happening.

>>15126577
That's how it always is
EG Demonbane is in like one scene of one ending of the VN and for the rest of it, you're stuck with DM Demonbane (Zeorymer tier) and female Tekkaman Blade
Getter Emperor only shows up in the end of a Getter story and never does anything
Gurren Lagann gets rekt when it grows xbox huge (as with Diebuster) and only wins because its pilot can throw punches at stick figures
Ultimate Gravion only ever does one attack, which probably is not the extent of its power
Rahxephon can do some time travel, but that's no more than what DM Demonbane can do

The only one that shows universe wrecking power onscreen is apparently Ideon, which I haven't watched. Maybe Sol/EVOL/Logos Aquarion, Neo Granzon or Shorouga are Demonbane tier, but I don't know shit about any of them besides that they have shitty memes about them

>>15128639
Zearth from Bokurano destroys multiple universes at it's 'base' powerlevel, but that one probably shouldn't count

>>15128645
It's not clear whether it's actually Zearth doing the universe exploding.

>>15128639
The Evangelions did exactly what they were supposed to do though

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>>15126802
>shit pilot

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>>15128355

>>15129453
Merrybell laughing always induces a smile in me, even when I know how off the rocker she is.

And damn, the animation really aged well for the last "traditionally" animated Gundam. Guess I'll have to schedule a rewatch.

>>15128355
>I have zero memory of that happening.
It was when Joseph took the Turn A to go get rekt by the Turn X. Joseph at least blows up Gym's backpack with it.

The weapon itself seems to be part of the Turn's I Field Beam Drive system, judging from what it's labeled as in games ad things.

>>15129453
V1 Gundam does something like that with beam strings

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>>15128355
>>15129493
Here's the belly beam scattering cannon.

I-field beam drive refers to how the Turn A moves the limbs and body, it's not a weapon. Instead of having motors and internal machinery, it uses I-fields to manipulate its arms and legs and other joints. It's a very elegant sounding system, except it doesn't have a lot of torque or resistance (why is why Gavane's MS-05 can overpower the Turn A in a grappling match).

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>>15126787
Counterpoint.

>inb4 non-canon

I don't care. It's literally the only glimpse of the real deal we've ever gotten, and everything from it's appearances as Dark History version matches up with the specs that SHOULD exist within it's own show for some reason, and all of it's appearances as part of the G-Gen's story have it piloted by an AI or system of some kind, meaning that the answer really is

>Loran is holding it back

or rather, more accurately

>Loran, being human, isn't capable of bringing out it's true destructive nature

Remember, this is the kind of shit that ends entire civilizations, throws nukes with reckless abandon and can teleport both itself and it's own weaponry, including beams, wherever the pilot wishes. The show itself didn't have a good place to show it and didn't need to: side material wankery makes most of this VERY true.

>>15129652
>side material wankery makes most of this VERY true
Except it doesn't.

>>15129667
Why doesn't it? Most of the stuff that comes with the Turn's power wankery is official, either from word of the developers or from the model kits written by different developers. The DH version is just that given an animated form.

>>15126577

equivalent of the oldtype test pilot flying the unicorn instead of banana. do you think it would be anywhere near as impressive?

>>15129652
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T90O__q04OE

>>15129696
Yes, the NT-D is meant to put Oldtypes on a level to combat Newtypes

>>15129652
Did you consider this official as well?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hDKSW1xFb2U

>>15129612
>I-field beam drive refers to how the Turn A moves the limbs and body, it's not a weapon.
I know what the system is. What I mean is that games label the cannon as the 'Beam Drive Unit' (ビーム・ドライブ・ユニット), not as a scattering beam cannon or whatever.

>>15129717
Except that the NT-D system literally needs a Newtype or enhanced human to operate.

>>15129717
NT-D requires a newtype pilot in the first place.

>>15129740
>Fanservice laden crossover brawl not meant to be taken seriously and designed to fuel "what if" scenarios

vs

>Chronological trip through UC, which puts special attention to details and accuracy, with an accurate representation of a full power Turn A at the end at a place where it would theoretically make sense to be

Cmon anon, you can at least try.

>>15129717
>NT-D lets the pilot to control the unit completely through brain, thus it is like moving the pilot's own body. The stress caused by moving a 21 meter tall machine, however, was way too much for normal people. Therefore ironically, even though the system was built to eliminate Newtypes, a Newtype pilot is still required to be the pilot.

>>15126807
>Not just for turns but shit like the ELS Qan[T] and everything else

The Qan[T] was built without taking into account that the enemy could assimilate.

>>15128355
Yeah maybe that's because it practically melted when he fired it.

>>15129781
Wait, no, he used that beam rifle way more than just once. They found multiple beam rifles.

>>15129752
>>15129756

No one said it was a perfect system

Turn A being as roflstomp-tier as it is in side materials does literally nothing for the story.

>>15129804
It really doesn't. But that doesn't mean that it ISN'T the worldwide threat that side materials make it out to be. It's just that the show in question, and Loran, wants it to move past the monster that it was originally created to be.

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>>15129810

>>15129810

Or you know, it's been sitting in a mountain for so long that it's not nearly as powerful as it used to be.

>>15129822
That too,yeah.

>>15129822
I like to think part of why it'ss underwhelming is that most of the generator output and autorepair system's trying to rebuild obliterated systems from scratch, like the scatter cannon or possibly the armory itself.

>>15129846

And it's had to use its nanomachines for millenia just to keep itself from falling apart. It probably barely works.

>>15129822
And probably why the Turn X has more functioning systems, less can happen to it over the years while it's on the Moon

>>15129858
Turn X wasn't functioning at all when they dug it up.
They jump started it by taking huge amounts of power from the moonrace city.

>>15127292
The Devil Gundam does that by taking over other machines and it required a core to do that.

It took ages to repair itself in the show even with a catatonic Kyoji as the core and with him gone it was nigh-useless until they stuck Rain in it. And once they put Rain in it the Devil Gundam had to take over Neo Japan to be strong at all by taking overs its weapon systems. The actual final form was a weakling and developed a sense of pain because it was linked to Rain. It was terrible.

In fact, its most powerful weapon wasn't even its own, it just took over Neo Japan's defense systems. The MLB is at least a weapon in itself.

>>15129864
That probably has more to do with the damage it took though, while the Turn A was just left to rot on Earth

>>15129864
Even in the show it's implied the Turn X lost a battle to the Turn A, something about aching scars. Makes sense that it would be shut down even if the rest of its weapons and systems are okay.

>>15129879
The X on its chest is supposed to have originally been a wound from Turn A. The Turn X supposedly purposely kept them after healing.

>>15129902
That's something that bugs me about the Turn units. Just how sentient are they? Like, they clearly act on their own at points but how far does that go?

>>15129804
Half the point of the story is using a civilization ending super weapon to prevent another war amd for peaceful purposes. The side material wank serves pretty much the same purpose to that as the MLB in the show.
The thing can end technological civilization over a whole planet (or out to Jupiter), can repair itself, can teleport behind you and activate its beam sabre, shoot nukes casually or it can be an expensive washing machine.

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No but they sure looked cool.

What IS the most impressively powerful Gundam then, based solely on in-show performance?

>>15130032
Devil Gundam.

>>15129652
>non-canon
>the real deal
Stopped reading right there.

>>15128317
Its beam cannon was pretty awesome. I remember it leaving these weird needle things where it shot.

>>15130036
That and the 00 Qan[T]

>>15130755

What does Qan[T] even do on screen beyond go FTL?

>>15130807
Don't forget its Buster Rifle attacking a moon sized object.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nOUSlFZW3As

>>15128639
Aquarion Logos doesn't do much of anything beyond make a big sword. It has the ability to make special attacks out of words, which means it can do all sorts of things in theory, but not in practice.

Neo Granzon doesn't have any real quirks beyond the fact that it attacks by shooting black holes and shit tends to get wrecked by that. It's basically SRW's version of Zeorymer. A lot of the memery is because it gets given gameplay stats that're broken as shit and because Shu is a ridiculous mary sue character even by SRW standards.

Regular Shurouga is basically just Black Cybuster. Shurouga Sin is where it starts to get silly, because the endgame of Z3 Tengoku is horribly written and doesn't have the animation quality to back up its claims that everything you're fighting is "beyond human comprehension", a phrase that they use way too much. At full power Shurouga IS supposed to be basically a god, but all it does after getting that powerful is fix the universe and fuck off to go somewhere else.

>>15130850
>Neo Granzon doesn't have any real quirks beyond the fact that it attacks by shooting black holes
That's pretty much the same as Ultimate Gravion, but at the same time, I don't think you need to do much more than that considering that such attacks could fuck up several galaxies simultaneously.

I don't see much memeing on Full Possession Cybuster or the Astranagants, but I assume they're similar in having flashy attacks but not actually affecting much

>>15130850
Logos ain't shit. The Ralpheasea could take Logos. Logos Genesis, however, will fuck everything that is not magic to death, and will ruin Demonbane's paint job.

>>15130807
Quantum Burst brainwave projection
Quantum Sword
The flower thing it does at the ending implies that it gained the ELS assimilation power

>>15131210
"Several galaxies simultaneously" is *really* overstating it. It could fuck up one solar system, then maybe in a few million years it would fuck up a few more. And that's if it made a full-size collapsing-star black hole. Typically the ones Neo Granzon makes are tiny. They would probably wreck a mid-size city at best. It's basically the same kind of blast radius as Zeorymer.

Full Possession Cybuster is indeed mostly about flash. It can do a lot of magical damage to a focused target and not much else. Cyflash hits about the same kind of area as, again, Zeorymer.

Astranagant and Dis Astranagant are only memeworthy for their chest cannons, which allegedly erase the target from spacetime. In practice they don't actually do that against anything, so they're just big guns with lots of posturing.

>>15131266
>then maybe in a few million years it would fuck up a few more
Maybe if anything about SRW paid any attention to the laws of physics. Or scale, for that matter. Tekkamen and Iczers are the same size as giant robots, except when they're not.

>>15131278
>Tekkamen and Iczers are the same size as giant robots

they aren't though, their unit sizes are S or SS

>>15131291
Sure, but it's not like that comes across in the attack animations, where you can have both an AT and Granzeboma visible from the same perspective.

>>15131294
if every mech involved looked how it does with proper scaling for the 2d games, then it would look dumb on top of being harder to animate.


Units like Daitarn 3 could not fit in ships used in the games that series is in.

>>15126802

This is such a weird complaint. I might as well say if you removed the DG Cells from the Devil Gundam it'd be nothing impressive. Or the Twin Drive from 00 Qan[T]. No shit removing the systems that make something powerful makes it less powerful.

>>15132339
Sometimes, it makes sense, particularly when the robot in question does not always have access to the system/weapon

For instance, I often hear it claimed that Mazinkaiser was supposed to be a Mazinger on the level of Shin Getter Robo. When I first watched the OVA, I had no understanding of why that was since nothing Kaiser ever did was particularly impressive. And then I learned about Kaiser Nova and came to understand, though I am uncertain why so many renditions of Mazinkaiser omit this attack.

Genesic GaoGaiGar is the same way. The Goldion Crusher is fucking ridiculous, but it appears to be a one use weapon, and without it, GGGG is a chump, especially considering the Crusher was designed to be used by GaoFighGar to begin with. You don't ever see GFG topping tier lists. It's the weapon itself that's powerful, not the robot that docks with it, doubly so because the Crusher has a different AI program controlling it. And even if GGGG can use the Crusher more than once, it's a very slow weapon that leaves GGGG wide open.

>>15130036
The 00 Qant could probably easily destroy the Devil Gundam.

The Devil Colony was big but it wasn't that strong unless you shot something at Neo Japan's beam barrier. You could just go inside and wreck its shit, especially since the core is weak as shit.

The 00 Qan[T] has better feats than the God Gundam and there's no reason Setsuna wouldn't kill Rain, so it's an easy win.

>>15132405
I'm pretty sure J-Decker and Goldran's screws are both stronger than the GGG crew.

J-Decker and co. flew to Saturn in an afternoon, giving them incredible speed and thrust power. And then they fight an intergalatic battleship (even if it was remotely controlled) And they're generally pretty strong even if a lot of their fights are lowkey.

And Goldran of course is just fucking powerful all around and they all have Trans-AM and are generally fast in travel speed.

Also, they can dock to use their miracle cannon or w/e, which was able to beam clash against a gun that could destroy a planet with a short burst. Unfortunately we never saw them use that in conjunction with their trans-AM.

>>15132409
>The 00 Qant could probably easily destroy the Devil Gundam.
lol nope.
you cannot destroy it with violence. this is explicitly stated in G Gundam's finale. No amount of destructive force can actually put it down permanently, it can only be destroyed by love.

Cry all you want, but that shit's on-screen canon.

>>15132405
I love the Earth-driven power progression in GGG.

Their alien-civilisation robot lion flies away, removing the only effective option they had for fighting?
They just build an Earth-made replacement which is as good or better than the original.

A giant alien robot thing sprouts out of Jupiter and all of GGG barely beats it. But its gone so no need to worry about it anymore right?
Nope, GGG goes and builds a giant hammer intended to be capable of one-shotting the worst big bad they've come across so far.

>>15132339
>DG Cells from the Devil Gundam it'd be nothing impressive. Or the Twin Drive from 00 Qan[T]
Not the same thing. DG Cells and the Twin Drive directly affect their respective Gundam's overall performance. MLB is just a weapon of mass destruction. Saying that the MLB makes the Turn A impressive is like saying that the G3 launcher makes the MS-05 impressive. It's a single weapons system on an otherwise unimpressive unit.

>>15132409
Don't try to argue this, anon. Even with the 00 Qan[t]'s Twin Drive hax, it isn't compatible with a super robot show fueled on the power of manliness and love.
Unless the Quantum Burst can achieve the same power as love through its UNDERSTANDING.

>>15132455
Nothing is as pure as Setsuna and his love for Gundam.

>>15132455
We literally see it being destroyed by violence. The God Gundam was tearing it apart. The only actual reason violence couldnt work is because Domon couldn't kill Rain

>>15132461

Oh, so you just haven't actually seen Turn-A and/or have no idea what you're talking about? The Moonlight Butterfly is far more than "just" a single weapons system in the animation. It's self repair systems kept the unit together and operational (though possibly at lower power) inside a statue for at least two millenia as well as repairing damage to.the head. It gives the unit literal wings that allow high speed movement. It generates another barrier that can absorb a variety of effects from physical weapons like missiles to the plasma of explosions and even radiation. Gym uses it to beak the i-field barrier of five SUMOs.

The Moonlight Butterfly is as integral to the operation of the Turns as the DG cells are to the Devil Gundam or Twin Drive is to the 00 and Qan[T], not a single, removable weapon. It'sp provides offence, defence, motive power and support. Even as just a weapon, it can be used as more than a "fuck everything" button to destroy cities, since it's used as a blade in the finale to slice Corin's custom Kapool in half.

>>15132431
Da Garn as well. Great Da Garn GX hopped up on the Power of Legend actually did destroy a planet, albeit at the apparent cost of the entire team.

>>15132513
That reminds me. Goldran's team physically stopped a missile so fast it traveled to another galaxy during the course of a 10-minute fight (in viewer's time) and then contained the explosion, which was at least a planet buster, maybe a solar system buster. I don't quite recall.

If one of the Goldran yuushas rammed a planet they could probably just blow it to pieces and keep going.

>>15128639
>The only one that shows universe wrecking power onscreen is apparently Ideon, which I haven't watched.
Ideon displays a rather ludicrous amount of power, but it's also not invincible.

For an example, immediately before the famous scene where it cuts a planet in half some enemy mecha pierce it's armor and kill it's main pilot.

For all it's power it's a glass cannon.

>>15126787
>Yeah, but there are a ton of excuses people can use to avoid seeing this:
>>Tomino made a conscious choice to focus on the human drama rather than show off a bunch of abilities of the Turns.
I don't know if you can call that an excuse if it's self evident from watching the show.

>>15132490
>It's self repair systems
That took weeks to bend Turn A's moustache back into shape, something that would have taken much less time for the militia to do so themselves.

>>15132542
It's a container/conduit for the Ide, so its only purpose is to open up some ports and blow universe destroying power out of a hole. Not unlike a toilet.

They should've invested in a force field powered by the Ide.

>>15132574

It was also repairing the head itself, since there was a big dent in the scalp and not just a bent mustache. I'm pretty sure it also took days, not weeks. Regardless though, the militia were not only unable to repair the damage themselves, not even Horace and the Moonrace engineers knew how to. So no, they couldn't have just have bent the mustache back in to shape and been done with it.

Loran also notes during the fight with Gavane's Borjarnon that the suit is reacting slowly, so the head is almost certainly responsible for that in some fashion given that the head was mid repair at the time.
The only ones shown capable of repairing the unit is the Ghingham faction, who Joseph credits with making the Turn-A a lot easier to use as well as more efficient if I recall. They were the ones responsible for the beam cannons in the stomach for a start, since there's missile silos shown to be in the same spot earlier in the show. They probably also gave it full flight capability, since the Turn-A can fly, even without the Moonlight Butterfly after they service it. I think Gym notes that even they don't understand it properly and wouldn't without pulling the unit apart entirely at least though.

I also wasn't trying to claim the self repair was some kind of feat that made it better than, only that it existed, was a function of the Moonlight Butterfly and shows that the system does more than just provide one offensive capability.

What is some of this side material "wankery" that keeps getting brought up? I've watched Turn A, but only recently, and haven't looked up any more info about the series and whatever sidestories it may have.

>>15132860
Shit like how the Moonlight Butterfly can reach all the way to Jupiter, actual teleportation instead of just lightbending tricks and a artificial black hole powersource

>>15133127

The power source bit actually has some basis, given that there are few power sources that would still be active after 2 millenia in the dirt.

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>>15132656
>They were the ones responsible for the beam cannons in the stomach for a start, since there's missile silos shown to be in the same spot earlier in the show.
No, the silos and the beam cannons occupy different spots. The silos are in the upper chest while the beam emitters are in the lower chest.

>They probably also gave it full flight capability, since the Turn-A can fly, even without the Moonlight Butterfly after they service it.
No, that's incorrect. The Turn A was already more than capable of flight long before it was captured and repaired by Gym's forces. In the episode where the Willgame launches into space on the mass driver, the Turn A's thrusters are able to overpower both a Muttowoooo and a skirted SUMO that were tangled up in the Gundam hammer chains and drag them along during aerial fighting. There was also an episode on the moon where the Turn A was able to push back the Gendarme battleship.

>>15132577
>They should've invested in a force field powered by the Ide.
They did. It worked just fine--when the Ide permitted it to.

>>15132405
GGGG's big problem, like a lot of others that have ridiculous feats going for them, is that it's a glass cannon. Its Protect Shade is actually considerably weaker than regular GGG's or GFG's because of the easily destroyed fins. Offensively it's a beast, but it lacks for durability.

Mind you, it's not helped by FINAL turning GGG into a bunch of morons who have no tactical ability whatsoever. If it were used as intelligently as in the show then GGGG might have put on a much better showing.

>>15133262
>GGGG's big problem, like a lot of others that have ridiculous feats going for them, is that it's a glass cannon. Its Protect Shade is actually considerably weaker than regular GGG's or GFG's because of the easily destroyed fins. Offensively it's a beast, but it lacks for durability.


Genesic's main fight was against Palparepa, a guy who could keep regenerating over and over again like the rest of the sol masters. Guy put various holes in him over the course of the fight but like the other masters he could regenerate to being brand new thanks to Pisa Sol.

Combined with his strength, it's less Genesic being a glass canon and more that over the course of a battle, like most other robots, it's taking damage from someone basically in constant top form.

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>>15133213

You're wrong, on both counts. Let's start with the silos though. What you posted is Mead's design, which is different to what got animated in a good few ways. The shoulder cannons were completely rejected for a start, hey never even mentioned anywhere in side materials or fluff. There is a shoulder thing in the manga, but while we have no idea what it is, it doesn't look like a cannon. Furthermore, the cockpit block doesn't have a center divider, the mustache doesn't curve in the same manner, the rifle looks different and so on. The chest doesn't have the same design either. In Mead's drawing there the chest has 8 silos for missiles with another 2 below that for the cannons. The animated Turn-A does not have the final two silos the cannons are in in that drawing. Take a look at animated Turn-A's upper body here for instance, and compare it's chest to Mead's design.

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>>15135440

Now, compare them both to this shot of Turn-A firing missiles from all it's silos in episode 22. Both the upper and lower silos are all open. You can even see the diagonal of the bottom part of the 3rd set of gates on the lower left chest, with another silo open below it. There are no further silos hidden that it wasn't opening here. So all the silos had missiles at least as far as episode 22. And the militia certainly weren't going to be replacing it with beam cannons. Ghingham, who explicitly did tune up and examine the Turn-A is almost certainly the one who did.

File: Turn-A Jocket Stirrup Jumps.webm (3MB, 1440x1080px) Image search: [Google]

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>>15135452

As to the Turn-A being able to fly, here's a webm of Loran fighting a flying ship in episode 31. Notice that he needs Sochie to constantly boost him up to the ship and cannot simply fly up or stay up there once he's been elevated.

File: Turn-A falling.webm (3MB, 1440x1080px) Image search: [Google]

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>>15135468

And 3 episodes later when he snags the Muttowooo and a SUMO with hyper hammers as you mentioned here's the immediate aftermath of Poe severing the chain using her heat weapon. The Turn-A falling uncontrollably and Harry needing to catch Loran.

File: Turn-A Jumps.webm (1MB, 1440x1080px) Image search: [Google]

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>>15135479

And finally, here in episode 29 (which is a few episodes before the fight in the previous webms) Lily outright asks if mobile suits can fly and Guin says that what the Turn-A does is more like a long jump, not flight.

It is possible to brute force flight using thrust alone, and the Turn-A almost certainly does just that in episode 49 when it's chasing the Turn-X at the end of the episode and demonstrated high thrust by pushing both the Gendarme and the Willgem while on the Moon, but that thrust may not have been enough on it's own, and at the very least it either needed Loran to be in more pressure to find that thrust or the Ghingham faction to tune it up to do so.

>>15132485
>no amount of destructive force can put it down permanently
>PERMANENTLY
Hurting it and destroying it are not the same thing, anon.
Regardless of your headcanon interpretation, it is explicitly stated on-screen that Devil Gundam can only be destroyed by love. Not "I can't destroy it with Rain still in there" but a very clear "it cannot be destroyed with violence, it can only be destroyed by love".

And just to throw a little more FACT on top of you, after Rain was removed, the Devil Gundam was destroyed by the LOVE LOVE Sekiha Tenkyoken, not the VIOLENCE DESTRUCTIVE sekiha tenkyoken. It was a very, very obvious "only love can beat the demon" sequence. Cheesy as fuck, but canon nonetheless.

>>15139402

Is this webm supposed to be proving anything out of interest?

>>15136902
The Devil Gundam is almost useless without a core, which is also a fact, if Domon had killed Rain it would've been a lot easier for everyone who died fighting it.

>>15139788
>if Domon had killed Rain
You ASSUME it's possible to do so.

>>15126822
IIRC some of the data needed to activate the full potential was left out in both A and X. IT wasn't until they both made contact that they activated that moonlight butterfly and the rest of its wacky powers.

>>15139779
read up

>>15140796

You don't. You remember the wikia entry which has had that theory for years but which there's no proof of in show. The two Turns both deploy a radiation shield that is almost certainly Moonlight Butterfly derived given it's colors and pattern when Loran nukes Mistletoe for a start, which takes place when the Turn-X is just a head and well before either name or use the Moonlight Butterfly, or before the two units spaz out and fill their cockpits with symbols. I'm pretty sure Gym talks about using the Moonlight Butterfly before that point too.

>>15140811

I did, and that's why I'm asking. It appears to match up with the stuff in >>15135452, but with no context it could be someone posting it to disprove that point given that they may think the chest design there lines up enough with >>15133213. I don't see how, but that doesn't mean it wouldn't happen.

File: 1481703601737.jpg (11KB, 318x313px) Image search: [Google]

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>>15139402
>Hate when the MC's mecha is stolen by a shitter

Every scene where Laura had her Turn A stolen pissed me off, this fucking idiot stealing a sub optimal turn A and almost getting it destroyed made me want to fucking die.

I almost want to say Turn A was bad only because it constantly pissed me off with that fucking shit.

I'd actually argue that the Turn-A is one of the weaker Gundams for much of the show. It does become one of the more powerful ones, but only for the last couple of episodes, much of which is spent with the Turn-A in other hands. For instance, the Turn-A's armor is caved in by a single punch from a SUMO around episode 16, which is fairly pathetic armor wise. It does get stronger later and is able to take a tonne of hits from the Turn-X's Bloody Siege, as well as a hit from a Bandit's wire thingy and I think a missile directly impacts at one point in the finale too, so the nanomachines may have made the armor stronger over time or it could just be more resistant to beams and heat than direct physical impact or something. There's fluff about the i-field beam drive making it physically weak for a start if I recall.

The Turn-A also has no guns of any kind from episode 3 till either episode 21 or 22, depending on how you want to measure things - since a beam rifle is unearthed in episode 21, but there's no fight in that episode so Loran doesn't actually equip it till episode 22. Which is fairly unprecedented in a Gundam show. Not even the Shining or God Gundam's go that long without guns, since they both at least have machine guns in the head and chest, and I think the Shining has some guns in the forearms it uses at one point. The Turn-A doesn't even have vulcans. It doesn't any weapons at all from episode 3 until episode 9, when Sochie finds the beam sabers and has to rely on punches, kicks and throws for those 5 episodes.

Loran also doesn't find the thrusters till episode 12 when he's about to fall in to some lava, and they're gunked up with dirt or something prior to that point, so it can't even thrust assist it's jumps and is essentially Earthbound in a way not even the original RX-78-2 or some of it's weaker knock-offs like the Ez-8 are.

>>15141583

The only things it really has going for it for more than the first half of the show is an i-field that Loran only uses once, but which can be set to react automatically to stimuli and a VR head that gives it decent targeting capability. Though that could be just as well put down to a lack of minovsky particles as the VR head. I think there is, again, some fluff about the Turn-A being immune to minovsky interference, but I don't think there's anything in the actual show about it.

>>15126787
>firepower of hero and villain upgrades,
>and G Gundam was already so absurdly over-the-top
Not really in firepower. Both Shining and God Gundam have a pretty limited scope for their destructive power, they're one on one fightan machines, not made for taking down tens of mobile suits at a time like some of the other AU stuff. Anything that shoots big beams or does beamspams could be said to be more powerful.

G Gundam was over the top in style, not power levels (at least for the hero robots).

>>15128639
>The only one that shows universe wrecking power onscreen is apparently Ideon, which I haven't watched.
Then how would you know? Well let me spoil it for you: Ideon is a useless piece of shit most of the time. The pilots can't just turn on the super power, just like Turn-A. All you can count on Ideon bringing to the party is stock standard missles and those missle launchers aren't even part of the robot.

It's true that Ideon's 'true power' does show up occasionally before the final episodes, but in general it follows your 'nothing special until the end' rule and frankly Daitarn 3 could kick it's arse.

>>15143414
The key word there was "onscreen"

Of all the robots just mentioned, the most impressive feat of any of them is TTGL throwing galaxies. The rest are theoretically able to destroy, at the very least, a solar system, but never display such feats if they do anything at all. Indeed, if all anyone knew about EG Demonbane came from the visual novel, they'd point out the memes as total bullshit if they even recognized that EG Demonbane was in the VN at all. All of its supposed power comes from a crabsticks translation of some light novel based on the VN