What does /m/ think of Mazinger ZERO's inclusion in SRW?

Sure.

Some element of the manga... sure.
The full story it's complicated, but they can do it.

There's been manga in SRW before ZERO.

>>15072468
>Do you think manga series should be part of it?
In general there's nothing wrong with it.
> What does /m/ think of Mazinger ZERO's inclusion in SRW?
I'm so glad it's units only. It's utter rubbish.

>>15072468
Manga only stuff has been in SRW before.

>>15074189
This.

Crossbone was already in @2 ages ago, as well as Astray in W.

>>15072468
I'm only gonna be happy if we get all the units from Mazinger ZERO. Great Mazinkaiser (fuck this Mazin Emperor G shit), Artemis A, Jun's Venus A MK II, etc. I say this because we're not likely to see SMZERO again

>>15075974
Really?
Shin Mazinger is going to be a staple in every SRW now as they can't depend on the old VA anymore not in X-Omeganot yet
They'll need ZERO to change things up as the original story is almost done to death, oh and Kouji needs his new upgrade too.

>>15075974
Mazinger ZERO would also work well with Grendizer Giga, as both have Cutie Honey

>>15075974
>>15076013
It'd be cool if they could toss in Mazinger Angels as well, that already has its own theme songs.

>>15076044
Angels, too.

>>15076050
IIRC in Angels she's just a normal person, but yeah, they could easily use all of them.

Angel works best a unit-only, but they can as well add some plot... just think: instead of starting with Mazinger Z and Kouji, you start with the Mazinger Angels

>>15076053
The series' episodic nature works well for that. Plus, no need to have VAs for the usual MCs (especially since Duke only exists as a DOG here).

>>15076013
> the original story is almost done to death
That didn't really stop them from including Toei Mazinger Z time and time again, often by itself, even after the Mazinkaiser OVA came out.

I guarantee you we're not likely to see much of ZERO because very few people are familiar with it or have an attachment to it.

>>15076061
Exactly- the only possible problem might be mixing Angels Maria and Giga Luke, but they can easily recycle the original storyline and have have them being siblings anyway.

>>15072468
I'd still have a total manga SRW:
Z Mazinger (and possibly some Energer Z)
Grendizer Giga
Linebarrels
Bakuraiga
Majinryu Varion
Carmine Trick
Jinki (the whole not animated story)

etc

But sadly, it won't sell and they should cast all the VA. It would ahve been way simpler if something like this had been developed on the gba

>>15072468
it was a nice surprise. The Manga's actual plot being used would require some work though. Like do we start off running through various bad ends? Just one? Do we skip the bad ends all together? Does Zero work like Ideon did for @3?

>>15076013
It's going to be a switch up between Shin Mazinger Anime possible units from ZERO, and the use of SKL. There's always the loop around of "This is actually the original mazinger manga, so we can give Kouji his new va."

Toei mazinger being done to death didn't stop it from being used as long as it did.

>>15076440
>Does Zero work like Ideon did for @3?
Yeah, Mazinger Z getting more powers over damages and going Zero=Game Over when destroyed does work.
Hell, add a "new game+" when Zero activates, to emulate Minerva resetting the world.

>>15076440
>Toei mazinger being done to death didn't stop it from being used as long as it did.
"This is a loop where TOEI Koji got a different voice!"

>>15074189
Ing was actually from a manga that never got finished.

>>15076611
and that was quite awesome, the original short featured Ing managing to escape alive from the whole preventer monsters (Kaiser, Shin Getter...) using nothing but a MP Huckebein MkII (not a Hucky MkII M, but a Mk II lookalike from alpha)

>>15076013
>the original story is almost done to death

Yes, with that one time they used it in SRW and all.

>>15075974
>I say this because we're not likely to see SMZERO again

We're probably gonna see Zero again. If anything, we'll get that version of Mazinger Z

>>15076013
>>15076440
Uh, surely there's no particular reason they can't still use 70s Mazinger or Mazinkaiser OVA every once in a while if they happen to feel like it? They already have all the voice clips they need.

>>15072468
Sayaka Zero version using that lewd outfit in SRW V?

>>15076954
Appeal to novelty, possibly. I wouldn't be surprised if they drop Shin, Zero and SKL in favor of Toei's new movie in a few years.

>>15076954
because they can record new lines with the new cast.

In the end, under the Zero moniker they can play basically any storyline, old anime included.

>unit-only
This makes me sad. I'm sure it'd be hard to implement the manga's storyline into it, but maybe if they did a universe-hopping central plot?

>>15076954
>They already have all the voice clips they need.
Echo effect won't disguise the low quality forever.

DynaPro should just hurry up and plan a goddamn ZERO OVA.

>>15076954
I don't think we will for the simple reason that both Shin series actively create an environment in which typical SRW plot shenanigans can happen (time/dimensional travel) as well as the fact that Mazinger Z itself is simply a much more badass robot than anything in Toeizinger or Mazinkaiser. It's much easier to get hype about the cloud-parting Photon Power Beam and the Hundred Rocket Punch than it is for Breast Fire or Final Kaiser Blade or any of that shit. Say what you will about the fights in Shin; it knew how to make a special attack look like the most awesome thing in the world.

>>15077043
I'd prefer we finally get our sequel to Shin, but

>>15077043
>>15077262
Shin is dead. We're getting Toeizinger later this year and it will be the one that's probably going to replace Shin.

>>15076954
The low quality is going to become very obvious at some point.


>>15077746
Nah, Shin is still going to be used. It'll just mean that there are more mazingers to pick from. I highly doubt they're going back to how it was when Toeizinger was in basically everything up until K when they have Z-hen, ZERO, and SKL to pick from as well now.

>>15080336
It's a new toeizinger. Didn't you hear?

>>15076092
What's the appeal of Jinki? Given that the only available English work is the really shitty Anime.

>>15080347
>toeizinger
At least they'll be forced to use the plot this time, since it's just a movie.

>>15082832
How many times has the actual Mazinger plot been used for Toeizinger? It always seems to be post script or something original

>>15083961
Apparently once, for Alpha 1.

>>15076068
Fine, just as long as they don't go anywhere near Zwei.

>loads of shit retconned from the original
Oh, I get it, this is an alternate continuity!
>The finale establishes that it is, in fact, a sequel
what the fuck

>>15084015
Oh yeah, it did. Right down to Z getting trashed and Great showing up.

>>15083961
>>15084015
64 used it partially. It shows Kouji finding and piloting Mazinger Z for the first time, meeting Sayaka, and adapts choice episodes like the Minerva X one and the one with the android girl that falls in love with Kouji. But all events are altered to have the Mycenae as the villains and Dr. Hell is in his Great Marshall of Hell form from the start.

>>15084161
But Zwei had Gattaiger, so all is forgiven.

>>15082832
Is it confirmed for just a movie? I was hyped for a new series

>>15086216
It's Nagai's 50th career anniversary this year so we might expect more than just Mazinger.

>>15080347
Do you have a link to more information?

>>15082826
I think it has the best mech fights ever drawn in a manga, maybe even better than Linebarrel. It's a pity it has all that fanservice, but the plot of Jinki Shinsetsu is really good

>>15077031
Zero's storyline is entirely worthless (Only the opening and the end is relevant. Everything in between is utterly pointless and irrelevant).

They could probably make do with doing the last jump (mangaka Kouji) as the start of the plot or something like first game uses the first world jump and then work your way around the world jumps in the subsequent games, but then dimension bullshitery is overplayed to hell and back in SRW so I would love it if they actually didn't do that.

>>15077031
they just got done with that for the Z series. not to mention, Zero's actual plot would require constant bad ends and the team getting fucked super hard.

it's easier to just combine shin anime mazinger with the Zero manga and have Z go zero through means where kouji can control it

>>15075974
SrwM featuring Mazinger Zero vs Demonbane

>>15072468
I think Banpresto/Dynamic Pro will rewrite the plot to make Mazin Emperor G relevant for ZERO story.

>>15086295
There are few screenshots of the teaser which wasn't released, but other than that, there's nothing else since it hasn't been officially announced by Toei. The only way we know of its existence is through mipcom 2016. Even nips don't know about it and so far only one Italian company has acquired the rights to it.

In other words we should probably wait a few months. It's going to be a cel shaded sort of cgi going by the leaked screenshots and most likely a movie.

>>15086596
there's no doubt about that. Kaiser was done the same way.

For F it was just Mazinger evolved by Getter Rays.

Alpha came up with "Prototype Mazinger that was too strong, so Z was created as a powered down form" that the OVAs went with.


Emperor G could be similar.

>>15086472
>Zero's storyline is entirely worthless (Only the opening and the end is relevant. Everything in between is utterly pointless and irrelevant).
But that's wrong you retard

>>15085659
The version of that event used wasn't from the TV series though, it was from Mazinger Z vs. The Great General of Darkness. Even in Alpha TV Mazinger's plot was barely touched. It was basically used to give Kouji a bit more reason to be doing what he does instead of the previous games wierd idea of him (and the Getter Team) just being a part of the Federation forces.

>>15085706
>It shows Kouji finding and piloting Mazinger Z for the first time

Route dependent though. In some he just shows up with his mech.

>>15087476
It does do the whole events surrounding Baron Ashura's death, and covers a lot of the major points from the last few episodes (so it can call back to them when Alpha 2 ran GM's plot)

>>15086596
Mazin Emperor G is using Shin Mazinger's (the anime) assets for Tetsuya.

>>15089583
No real need to rewrite Emperor G, just replace Great Mazinkaiser from the Zero vs General of Darkness manga with it.

>>15089617
Let's not do that since it's uglier and clearly only there to appeal to Toeifags

Make it a route split thing. One route gets you the shitty new bot and the other gets you the thing that was actually in the manga

>>15089685
>uglier than Great Mazinkaiser
you fucking wish

>>15089685
It's not ugly. There are some great design ideas in it, but overall it doesn't feel complete. Either way I'm happy with a new Mazinger.

>>15087356
Great argument, EOP.

>>15089900
You're the one with no argument.

You didn't say how Shin ZERO's plot is pointless.

>>15089685
Look out boys, an Anon has an opinion.

>>15089933
The story goes off the rails into pointlessness after the first "send Kouji off to another world" in the first battle with Ankoku Daishogun, which served to establish that ZERO is still a possible threat.

From then on it follows this plot against Ankoku Daishogun and Dr. Hell which starts roughly independent from the plot of ZERO until the climax where Dr. Hell awakens ZERO and Kouji gets Minerva to transfer him into another world where the plot finally starts back up and swiftly moves into its climax.

This entire portion of the story only serves to catalog a fight between Ankoku Daishogun which in of itself has no relevance to the events pertaining to ZERO.
The first world, Kouji and his allies had entirely lost. It's by sheer coincidence of the multiple worlds that the next world (which we have no reason to have any purposeful connection to), in which he attempts to locate Mazinger Z, involves Ankoku Daishogun, once again, which then moves on to a twist with this world's Dr. Hell, which then leads to the exact same conclusion as the first world leap, except this time Ankoku Daishogun is killed.
The plot is no more progressed at this point than it was at the first world transfer. The only thing that is resolved is that a Great General of Darkness in a different universe in a different conflict is killed because he and the Mycenae just so happened to be around
It just served to kill the pointless Mycenae as opposed to resolve or advance anything pertaining to ZERO.

>>15090021
You could MAYBE make the argument that it was to push Kouji into making the reclusive decisions he made near the final, but, yeah, wasting all that time fpr just that alone is just bad writing.

I have a feeling ZERO is going to be behind a lot of stuff in SRW V.

>>15089685
>it's uglier than Great Mazinkaiser.

Ha! No.

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old magazine

>>15089685
great kaiser looks worse

>>15072468
If Mazinger Zero can get in, I want Shin Getter from the GR-GO manga to get in as well.
Otherwise cool beans.

>>15076930
What? Will we get Mazinger Zero Z?

>>15089617
Why do people care for Great Mazinkaiser which is just a tiny bit rework from Mazinkaiser compared to donut steel Mazin Emperor G?

>>15072468
I hope Mazin Emperor G powerlevel is higher than the likes of Getter Emperor, TTGL and EGD.

This is the Fourth manga they've used iirc, so I'm fine with that. Honestly mecha shows in general are anime original works, but there are some which had cool manga that I wish were used.

>>15097986
I think they just go with what's most popular

At any rate, I prefer having Armageddon if only because New Getter really only has one unit while Armageddon has a few more, so it's more interesting for gameplay purposes.

Deleted comment because I realized Ryoma has the same VA in all the OVAs.

>>15097998
I suppose. Still sucks though. I really liked New Getter.

>>15097998

I don't even think it's popularity with Getter, otherwise they would've stuck with Toeigetter forever.

New Getter will be back eventually.

>>15098032
It's the same thing with Mazinger and Jeeg and all the other old properties: you don't see them as much anymore because the voice actors are all old and can't record new lines while the newer voice actors can

And that's not to mention that newer entries are favored just because of cross promotion potential and the fact that newer fans are going to be more familiar with the newer entries regardless. This is also probably the reason we very rarely see the manga versions of anything getting representation. Casual audiences want what they know.

>>15098057
>Jeeg
Given that, you'd think they'd use Kotetsushin more.

>>15083961
>>15084015
>>15085659
>>15085706
>>15087476
so is there a reason why SRW almost never actually used Mazinger Z's plot, and the one or two times it did was barely anything?

>>15090021
>>15090044
same thing can be said about almost everything that happens in the first ZERO series as well due to the world hopping, except VS Ankoku Daishogun ends up making everything that happened in the first ZERO series pointless as well thanks to even more world hopping, in the end the only world that has any real relevance is the final one where ZERO gets defeated, and we don't even get any proper resolution since the manga immediately ends upon ZERO getting defeated

>>15097998
it's a shame that Armageddon is the only modern Getter that's really all that usable in an SRW context, as Shin vs Neo has issues with it's Shin's moveset, and New Getter is just plain hard to fit into plots if it wants to actually have any plot of it's own

>>15098086
Clearly it wasn't popular enough to be a selling point after the two games it was in

Also, it's a decade old at this point. Granted, Armageddon is the oldest Getter OVA. I think Getter is just a bit of a special case since SRW has been using it since the beginning so they feel obliged to put it in, but at the same time, they have to be practical about it

One thing I think is weird about not using Jeeg, though, is that the OVA had the old Jeeg (albeit slightly redesigned) in it, so it could have attracted old and new fans alike. Maybe they just didn't promote the old Jeeg enough

>>15098105
Koutetsushin Jeeg didn't reach the 1000 blurays per volume and that was TTGL's year. Same with Mazinkaiser SKL. They were too niche.

Armageddon was a hit, Shin Mazinger wasn't, but it was a Mazinger reboot so it automatically gets in.

>>15098105
>One thing I think is weird about not using Jeeg, though, is that the OVA had the old Jeeg (albeit slightly redesigned) in it, so it could have attracted old and new fans alike. Maybe they just didn't promote the old Jeeg enough

Wasn't the reason Furuya didn't return as Hiroshi because of timing? I recall hearing something like that though I don't know if it was hearsay.

It'd roll some heads if he showed up voicing Hiroshi in a voiced Shin appearance.

>>15098121
>Wasn't the reason Furuya didn't return as Hiroshi because of timing? I recall hearing something like that though I don't know if it was hearsay.
That may explain why it had a Gundam reference, even though he wasn't present as Hiroshi.

You know who should be in the next SRW after V?

Robot Girls Z

>>15098119
>that was TTGL's year
You say that, but it isn't as if that show is headlining any recent SRW games either. Though I will say it managed to get on an actual console title while Jeeg and SKL didn't.

Come to think of it, it's hard to think of recent mecha shows I'd describe as a "hit" regardless, aside from the yearly Gundam topping sales charts as usual. In the context of mecha not doing well in general, I'm not so sure it can be said that Mazinger did badly compared to its peers

>>15098131
Now no, but Shin Mazinger was among the very few mecha shows of 2009, so technically it should have had the advantage, but too bad that the executives didn't believe in the show from the start and barely gave anything to Imagawa to work with. Even your average no name mecha show still had more budget than Shin's.

>>15098135
This is the first I'm hearing of it getting screwed from the outside. Did it have a bad timeslot or something?

>>15098141
It had a late night time slot, 23:30 I believe but I could be wrong. It's been a while. For its time slot, it did good with 3 percent on average and it was like 4.4 on it's final episode. The problem is that the episodes aired on TV were shorter by a minute or two compared to the home release. It was supposed to be an incentive to get people to buy them but I think that plan backfired. Also, many fans didn't like what Imagawa was doing to Mazinger and it got a load of bad press during the earlier episodes. Many bailed out, but since you and I know how Imagawa operates, if they stuck to it, they'd probably like it. Imagawa does story arcs, and not episodic content that many people were expecting from Mazinger. My point is that if it had a bigger budget, people would have definitely stayed just for the visuals, but it's obvious that he had to cut many corners for this show. He didn't have the luxury of the giant robo ovas. In fact, Imagawa himself said that Shin Mazinger was a difficult job.


But people didn't like the show enough and I think a proper budget

>>15098177
Would have saved it from being a disaster.

>>15098177
>>15098181
Personally, I think the show looks good enough as it is. It had a really charming art retro art style and I've seen far worse in terms of animation. And Giant Robo wasn't terribly successful either IIRC.

Anyway, I can definitely see it catching flack for the whole "Not muh Mazinger" thing given all the previous animated works and the original VAs being replaced (for the better, but nonetheless). I just wonder why something like Macross can get away with trying something different while Mazinger can't. Maybe it's just due to DP using the same characters again and again.

What kind of content was cut from the TV broadcast?

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>>15098205
Many scenes are just extended and scattered all over the episode. Some even modified the line dialogue.

Here's one example.

You know the scene where Kouji gives his whole speech in the first episode right? That speech is missing from the final fight in the TV version. So he just goes straight to the rocket punches.

And another:

Remember in the first episode, you see Zeus meeting with Kouji and Mazinger? That scene never showed up again in the TV version but it did show up in the Bluray version.

And another:

The final rocket punches scene was redone for the bluray version.

When the show was being subbed by Gattai, they basically had to take the extra footage (again it was scattered all over) which was streaming on bandai channel (only available in Japan due to ip block) and stiched it together with the TV version to create some hybrid.

Basically, you have 3 version of Shin Mazinger

1. Shin Mazinger Shougeki! Z-hen on Television (They removed the on Television part for the Bluray version). It is the shortest version.

2. The one found on Bandai Channel / TV at the time, or whatever it was called. Can't remember. It's the long version of Shin Mazinger, but without the QUALITY fixes and additional sound effects added on the home release

3. I think it was just as long as the Bandai Channel with all the fixes. It's funny because even the bluray fucked up sometimes and forgot to animate Tsubasa's hair in one scene, when it was already moving in the TV version. Also, when Kouji does his big bang punch, and you hear some clings when the gold aura leaves the earth, they removed the audio for that (Because I guess you can't hear stuff from space) but it's still dumb. Funnily enough, in SRW when that same attack is done, that sound is left alone. Instead, they added some extra sound effects to Garadoublas when he walked. I found that totally pointless.

>>15098239
3. I meant the Bluray version. Forgot to specify.

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>>15076050
Angels would be worth having just to hear the Cutie Honey theme when this happens.
I guess it would cost more to include the theme, but not doing it would be a fucking crime.

>>15098239
>>15098246
It doesn't sound like they stuff they removed from the broadcast was terribly critical

Either way, there's no good way to do that. QUALITY fixes alone should be good enough to justify a blu-ray purchase, no need to bullshit around with things like that.

>>15098401
Actually they are critical because they gave weight and depth to the show. The tv version has a shortened version of Tessho Genda's narration in episode 1 and it really removes some context from Kouji Kabuto. There are other information that was just left out that were important to the plot. I can't recall them now but I'm aware of their existence.

>>15098105
Kotetsushin Jeeg aired on the WOWOW network, which is a special satellite channel.

>>15086328
Is it translated at all?

Can someone help with shirtless Kouji scenes in Shin?

>>15100130
What's there to elaborate?

I know of the scene where he and Sayaka were naked and they crashed into each other, but was he shirtless apart from that in Shin Mazinger?

>>15099812
>>15100419
Go back to your containment thread.

>>15090021
>the next world
it's not the next.

Kouji had Minerva seal her own memories and reboot the world many times between the Great Mazinkaiser world and the Mazinger Hell world

>>15098096
>so is there a reason why SRW almost never actually used Mazinger Z's plot, and the one or two times it did was barely anything


toeizinger is pretty episodic. you just need dr. hell and his mecha beasts destroying shit and mazinger is built to stop them.

as a result they can barely use the original plot or go post season with it.

Dancouga was the same way. you just needed aliens fucking things up and sharpio being a traitor

>>15098205
mazinger was a more influential series, and as you said, it's the same characters over and over again.

>>15100773
Alpha 1 showed they could use events from the Toei series pretty well. I think the main issue is that they prefer to portray Toei Kouji as a veteran, rather than another teenager that just got into a robot.

>>15100773
Dancouga has more to it than that, but presumably they normally leave out the whole beginning arc where the team had to learn to work together and deal with Ross being an asshole because it would mean they'd have to animate all the individual robots

Mazinger Z does have some arcs regarding Mazinger's abilities. For example, early on, Baron Ashura made attacks from Saluud and Kouji couldn't do much about it because Mazinger was useless underwater, so Dr. Hell gradually created mechanical beasts more and more geared to underwater combat until Professor Yumi was forced to make some upgrades. And then after that, the exact same arc repeated except with aerial mechanical beasts, leading to the creation of the Jet Scrander.

I imagine something like that is kinda hard to translate into the context of SRW though. It doesn't make sense without several missions where the Mazinger team is on its own.

>>15100816
There are some later events unrelated to specific abilities, like Gorgon/Hell alliance or Hell finally managing to steal Super alloy Z, Ashura's death and Hell's revenge. The Scrander and underwater upgrades also could be done with auto events - Kouji by himself is taken out by a flying mecha beast and then the rest of the team deploys. Alpha 1 handled the underwater stuff pretty oddly though, they adapted a scene from the episode that led to the upgrade, but then just stopped there.

>>15100946
Do you know if the Toei Viscount Pygman even appeared in any of the games? He'd probably be the first thing to go when making cuts to Mazinger Z's plot

>>15100816
>it would mean they'd have to animate all the individual robots
Why is this a bad thing? I'd rather have 4 or 5 small units that combine into a powerful super than have 3 or 4 slots I can just jam anyone into with no fucking strategy.

>>15101037
I agree, but this takes actual effort and money and talent and other things that Bandai is extremely hesitant to use, especially nowadays.

And I mean, if you think it's bad what they do to Dancouga, I can't wait to see how many potential units they completely gut from Might Gaine. Every Brave show has a shitload of different forms and combinations, but I'm absolutely expecting almost everything to be permanently combined.

>>15101037
>>15101048

They more than likely kept something like Dancouga formed all the way through just to cut down on unit space

>>15101048

Convenience.

Mechs being combined by default leaves room for more useful units to take those slots.

>>15101048
On the bright side, this gives more chances to get the train of pain.

>>15101079
That's the exact thing the guy I was replying to was arguing against

These games would be a lot more interesting if you had to gamble on using four or five deployment slots in order to form an OP combined unit instead of just filling 2/3 of the slots with OP units and the other third with supports.

Just think of how different a game J and MX would be if you had waste three deployment slots in order to form Zeorymer, for example. You might actually have a reason to not use it in every mission in that case.

>>15101160
>Just think of how different a game J and MX would be if you had waste three deployment slots in order to form Zeorymer, for example. You might actually have a reason to not use it in every mission in that case.


There's really no difference between not using the thing because of the parts and not using the thing just because you want Great Zeorymer. One just requires a bit more self control than the other.

MX didn't even offer great Zeorymer so that would just make using the damn thing a pain in the ass.

>>15101048
>And I mean, if you think it's bad what they do to Dancouga, I can't wait to see how many potential units they completely gut from Might Gaine. Every Brave show has a shitload of different forms and combinations, but I'm absolutely expecting almost everything to be permanently combined.

Dancouga is different, that's just 4 units for the main mech. 5 if you count Alan's but in games where Final Dancouga is possible, Dancouga is usually stuck combined.

Might Gaine having separate units wouldn't be as fun as you think

Tri Bomber would require 3 units. 4 units for Battle Bomber.

Guard Diver would Require having 4 diver units out as well. You'd be wasting up 8 slots just to scramble to get Battle Bomber and Guard Diver on the map together.

Might Gaine is made up of Gaine, Might Wing, and Locomoriser. Gaine pretty much goes straight to Might Gaine after episode one and he's pretty useless not combined. You'd be wasting 2 slots which isn't that bad, but still not exactly worth it considering what the two units actually do. I can see it being like GaiGar at best, where it might be like that for story reasons for a stage or two, but not the whole game.

Might Kaiser is its own thing. The vehicles that make it up don't even do anything in the show.

Might Gunner is pointless as a unit itself. But for the sake of this, we'll say it's playable.

That's twelve units. Twelve spots you'd need to fill if you wanted to get the entire possibly playable Might Gaine cast out on the map. This isn't counting Joe who has a good chance of being a secret character. V doesn't seem to have a squad system so you can't just pair them up.

>>15101198
could implement a system to allow combining using undeployed units instead of requiring all of them to be out(like maybe it has a will requirement to combine, and the more units are actually deployed to combine the lower that requirement becomes)

>>15101160
>Just think of how different a game J and MX would be if you had waste three deployment slots in order to form Zeorymer, for example. You might actually have a reason to not use it in every mission in that case.
That's pretty much just FMW's deployment cost system. Which isn't a terrible idea, but it requires the dev team to have some vague understanding of the idea of "balance". And considering this is SRW we're talking about, that's not likely.

>>15101198
>This isn't counting Joe who has a good chance of being a secret character.

More like likely being an automatic get kinda like Stella was in L.

What I see being the case is Goryu and Hiryu being secrets.

>>15101235
Meanwhile there's whether or not they'll do anything with Black Might Gaine and the ninja girl.

>>15101194
>There's really no difference between not using the thing because of the parts and not using the thing just because you want Great Zeorymer.
There is. One is a strategic choice made for the purpose of completing the requirements for one mission. The other is not abusing your "Win the mission without even trying" option in order to get the "Win the game without even trying" option later.

>>15101198
>Might Gaine having separate units wouldn't be as fun as you think
>Twelve spots you'd need to fill if you wanted to get the entire possibly playable Might Gaine cast out on the map
This is assuming you want to field the entire cast, which you may or may not want to do depending on your personal preferences and how the game is balanced. I mean, I'd be totally down for doing so if, for example, they made Joint Dragon Fire a ridiculously broken attack in exchange for using most of your deployment slots just to set it up, but I'd like it even more if, in spite of Joint Dragon Fire's power, it still has a relatively limited range that makes it difficult to use outside of certain favorable situations or could only be used once per battle or something like that.

The whole point of exercises like these is to present a variety of gameplay options and make the player think about how to use them, which would make SRW much more enjoyable as a game as opposed to how it is now, where you pretty much just spam your most powerful attacks with your most powerful units and refuel as needed.

>>15100472
I'm asking about Shin Mazinger, not the older one.

>>15100563
There hasn't been one in months.

>>15101311
>would make SRW much more enjoyable

some would probably like it and some would probably hate it. there's now sure fire proof that everyone would enjoy it.

that wouldn't fix the problem with powerful units and spamming. people would just pick strong units that wouldn't require a ton of slots and just go to town on the maps. there isn't any way around that

>>15100773
>as a result they can barely use the original plot or go post season with it.

But they include the plot of Great Mazinger all the damn time.

>Dancouga was the same way. you just needed aliens fucking things up and sharpio being a traitor

Except a large portion of the time they either don't even bother doing this, or have Dancouga plot.

>>15101014
Not even once. Brocken's track record is a lot worse than should be reasonable as well, there's a number of games where Dr. Hell and Baron Ashura show up as commanders to some other guy but he doesn't.

>>15101160
>These games would be a lot more interesting if you had to gamble on using four or five deployment slots in order to form an OP combined unit instead of just filling 2/3 of the slots with OP units and the other third with supports.

Except even with that, Dancouga wouldn't be OP. If they did its plot properly it eats energy like a fucking maniac (Which SRW basically always does), its best weapons are not-very-powerful cannons, it doesn't get to fly until absurdly late, it doesn't get the sword until the OVA, it doesn't get the ability to fire all the cannons at once or Dankuukougaken until the movie, and in general is pretty shit.

Sure, ok, some robots would be amazing if you did that... but there's basically no robot worth wasting 5 deploy slots for, even if it's god tier. I'd just deploy shitty units and reals half the time, and that's a dumb idea.

>>15101198
>5 if you count Alan's but in games where Final Dancouga is possible, Dancouga is usually stuck combined.

Nowadays? In GC, J, and Alpha 3 - the first three games where it was a thing - he was playable.

>Might Gunner is pointless as a unit itself. But for the sake of this, we'll say it's playable.

Well, if Alpha 2/3 decided fucking Goldimarg, who has LESS attacks, should be playable...

You also forgot Black Might Gaine and possibly maybe pie in the sky dream of Kouchou as playable.

>>15101311
There is a lot wrong here, so cont.

>>15101311
>This is assuming you want to field the entire cast, which you may or may not want to do depending on your personal preferences and how the game is balanced. I mean, I'd be totally down for doing so if, for example, they made Joint Dragon Fire a ridiculously broken attack in exchange for using most of your deployment slots just to set it up, but I'd like it even more if, in spite of Joint Dragon Fire's power, it still has a relatively limited range that makes it difficult to use outside of certain favorable situations or could only be used once per battle or something like that.

>The whole point of exercises like these is to present a variety of gameplay options and make the player think about how to use them, which would make SRW much more enjoyable as a game

No.

No it wouldn't. You have absolutely no goddamn clue what game balance is, so let me clue you in a little, as someone who focuses on things like this.

Lets say you need to deploy ~10 Might Gaine units to use Joint Dragon Fire. Might Gaine - which would be precombined in the second half of the game, it always was in show - Might Kaiser, the four Bombers, the four Divers, Might Gunner. That's ten deploy slots, putting it at about a quarter of your deploy slots in a handheld with a twin system and about half your deploy slots in a game without. That is a HUGE investment - that's putting half your team on these.

Let's say they're good, though. Guard Diver and Battle Bomber well outstrip what they can do in show, they're 4 pilot units and hit like tanks. Ok. Are they better than Great Might Gaine? Because if so, that's hilariously wrong from a story standpoint, where they are shit compared to GMG. But if they aren't? Why ever field them? GMG is a much better two pilot unit that has two components, and thus takes less space away AND has more worth.

But each of the Bombers and Divers are also traps! Individually, they're shit, meaning any other given unit is better. Together... cont.

>>15102885
Together... they're still HILARIOUSLY SHIT! Ok, so maybe they're MC tier. That's great. You know what else is MC Tier? Nu Gundam. Zeta Gundam. Strike Freedom. Destiny. Mazinger Z. These take up one deploy slot, are as powerful, and give as many pilots-per-deploy-slot. So why would you ever field the units that need to be combined? I could justify at 2, MAYBE 3 if it's absurdly good - GMG Perfect Mode should be this - but as it is they take up way too many deploy slots to be "good" and making them "amazing" makes less than no sense.

Oh, but Joint Dragon Fire! But that's a combo, an expensive combo, which would only be use on bosses, which takes half your squad, and... maybe does fuckloads of damage once? You might compare it to L Final Phase. It's not even close - L Final Phase took close to an eighth of your unit count for the absolute bomb on units that at least could claim to be good on their own, some of them were outright amazing. Joint Dragon Fire would take half your units where effectively three of them are good and the rest are 100% useless literal spacewasters who never do anything.

SRW wants people to use units from various things. If they do shit like that, no one is going to do that. Ever. Unless it's a Neo system... but even NEO didn't go that hard (good thing, that. Ganbaruger would have been a fucking nightmare given your system.)

>>15102875
>Well, if Alpha 2/3 decided fucking Goldimarg, who has LESS attacks, should be playable...

I'm glad they really just give you the Hammer/Crusher without him being a unit now.

>>15101311
>for example, they made Joint Dragon Fire a ridiculously broken attack in exchange for using most of your deployment slots just to set it up, but I'd like it even more if, in spite of Joint Dragon Fire's power, it still has a relatively limited range that makes it difficult to use outside of certain favorable situations or could only be used once per battle or something like that.


It wouldn't be worth it then. You could waste half or more of your deployment slots for a once per battle attack or something that can only be used in certain situations, leaving you fucked if there's more after you destroy something with the attack or it misses.

Or you could just deploy the best units you have that can deal out massive damage without the handicap that JDF has.

>>15102983
>Or you could just deploy the best units you have that can deal out massive damage without the handicap that JDF has.

Or even the shitty ones.

If you have to field eleven units to put out Battle Bomber, Guard Diver, and GMG Perfect Mode, that means you field 11 units... and get 3. You're fielding 3/11ths of a unit multiple times. Or, more accurately, you're fielding 3 units and abstaining from fielding 8 units, those 8 spots being spots that even Classic Series Boss Borot would actually work better in. So you could do that... or you could deploy every unit from three other series, even the bad ones!

Gaiking The Great in L proved that even if your unit was absolute god tier, if you take 3 or more units to combine that are competent units... then it's better to use the three competent units. And this was GtG, which was so hilariously goddamn god tier that it was head and shoulders above the rest of the units in all but final damage -and in terms of precombo damage it still did more before Soul came into things against all but Dancouga Maxgod! But having Gaiking, Vulking, and Raiking was basically always better, so GtG was only happening if you really wanted it. So unless Guard Diver and Battle Bomber are so good GtG is small babies to it... they suck.

Alright, which one of you idiots rankled shitman's Might Gaine autism again?

>>15103059
>Gaiking The Great in L proved that even if your unit was absolute god tier, if you take 3 or more units to combine that are competent units... then it's better to use the three competent units.
This example is flawed since K and L, due most likely to their pair systems, made combiners uncombinable after you mashed them together.

In a less retarded SRW it would be better to decombine, use Vulking and Raiking, then recombine into Great and smite things. It'll eat gobs more EN, yes, but you have resupply units for a reason, and refilling components is less of a morale hit.

>>15102885
>>15103059
>>15102894
>You have absolutely no goddamn clue what game balance is
No, I understand game balance completely. The issue here is that SRW will never balance in a way that makes for an interesting game because it instead chooses to balance on the relative power levels of the units as seen in the anime they come from, the prominence of the characters in the series (MC or not) and the relative popularity of certain series as compared to other series (usually applied to real types).

OG shouldn't have this problem, but I've never played an OG game.

>>15103337
K actually did let you decombine, the issue was that GtG was fucking terrible in K because it has five EN based attacks and 30 is the lowest cost and 180 is the highest.

Decombining midbattle is the most fucking degenerate thing SRW has ever let you do and lets you do so many fucking degenerate tricks that it's not funny. Getting rid of that was an amazing idea, and they need to start doing it in OG before Valstork gets in or else we'll have the old Valstork decombination shenanigans stacked on the already stupid SRX ones.

>>15103352
>The issue here is that SRW will never balance in a way that makes for an interesting game because it instead chooses to balance on the relative power levels of the units as seen in the anime they come from, the prominence of the characters in the series (MC or not) and the relative popularity of certain series as compared to other series (usually applied to real types).

No, the problem is that there's absolutely no way to make a 4 combiner worth it. It would have to be worth more than four units individually, as well as worth more than all four of its components individually, as well as being invulnerable because if you lose it you just lost four units, but not being actually invulnerable because it's four units.

>>15103383
>but not being actually invulnerable because it's four units.

Because it's shitty gameplay, rather.

>>15103383
>degenerate
Fuck off. It's the one benefit to wasting multiple deployment slots to make single units over just bringing strong single units to begin with.

Also
>blaming GtG being shit on K being shit to everyone's EN totals

>>15103389
>blaming GtG being shit on K being shit to everyone's EN totals

K was shit on everyone's EN totals, but GtG was particularly bad because for the most part when guys like Dann had bad EN costs they had a free move or ammo move to fall back on.

GtG's five attacks cost 30 EN, 50 EN, 100 EN, 150 EN, and 180 EN. On one hand, you can pretend it's a 180 EN comboattack between Gaiking, Vulking, and Raiking to use against enemy bosses... on the other hand that's fucking 180 EN and it's not even Kotetsushin Jeeg tier power for that cost. Just not worth it at all. L's was amazing, but Gaiking, Vulking, and Raiking by themselves were always better.

>It's the one benefit to wasting multiple deployment slots to make single units over just bringing strong single units to begin with.

No, it's the one thing that makes them brokenly overpowered. The benefit is supposed to be that you get a new unit that's much better than either original one that benefits from having the multiple SP pools (hopefully, most of the time) which is something both UX and BX understood and handled well and L didn't quite handle well because it was a new mechanic.

>>15103408
>brokenly overpowered
Uh, what? There's several OP combiners, but not because you can separate off the bits and have them poke at things. Even R Formation or Proton Cannon Focus is really that broken, especially considering how much EN those options eat.

>bitching about multiple SP pools
But these days the worst offenders don't even have separation options.

>>15103416
*not even
Then again, if you took that statement at original face value then you've never played those games.

Gaiking the Great being unable to combine in L almost made sense, since the rest of Raiking and Vulking's parts just kind of fall out of the sky - and obviously even K disagreed. It's a game anyway, no harm done in making the components not useless.

What was obnoxious was shit like the Twin Drive Mode machines and MaxGod getting the same treatment, especially when they can split off on their own just fine normally.

There's a good reason Terada and Friends haven't seen fit to repeat that experiment after L; it's neither 'balancing' nor all that much fun.

>>15103383
>>15103385
I don't see why you'd think that'd be difficult to balance in a game that isn't beholden to some kind of external lore.

And besides, you're thinking about as creatively as the people who actually make Brave shows

>It would have to be worth more than four units individually, as well as worth more than all four of its components individually
You say that as if this has to be universal, but it doesn't, nor should it, or else there would be no point to something like this when you really could just have the units always combined. For example, say one of the uncombined units has an elemental attack that hits the current enemy for extra damage surpassing that of what the combined unit could do when added to the chip damage of the other individual robots. But obviously, that doesn't work on every enemy. Or even more generally, the uncombined team is better at taking on trash mobs by virtue of being able to cover more ground, but their HP is low enough that they need to combine in order to withstand attacks from more powerful enemies. Simple shit.

On the other hand, making a combined unit more powerful than four individual units is also simple. Take the strongest attack of the individual units, multiply by four. How does this not rip the game in two? 1 range, 50% EN per use.

>because if you lose it you just lost four units
This should not be a concern of the gameplay developer. Obviously, if you choose to do this, you know what you're getting into.

Anyway, at this point, I'm only speaking hypothetically because SRW will never ever balance things this way. Enemies will forever be too weak for strategy to be worth a damn.

>>15103437
TDM/Max God not being able to split apart is just internal consistency with the combine mechanics. It would be stupid for GtG to be unable to split apart while the others do so.

And they carried that flaw over to UX/BX where you couldn't split apart Odyssea/Max God/Glitter Falsaber and the Tobikage combos.

>>15103416
There's a lot of really stupid combos you can do with decombine/combine things. The absolute most obvious to me is GC/XO Final Dancouga, who can fully restore its EN each turn for effectively free thanks to decombine mechanics on top of being otherwise generally the best unit in the game, but in pretty much every game that doesn't have a squad system above 2 (where it's heavily counterbalanced) and has a unit that's decent when it's decombined there's some stupid combination of spirits and abilities you can use to blow open the game. It's a lot of extra damage you can throw at things.

On top of that, modern games have fucking Continuous Action that you could stick on every pilot and then just slap your way through an entire army with decombine mechs, which is totally possible in NG+ Z2-1 thanks to Gurren Lagann (but not on NG, which is nice - it's actually balanced on a first run mostly because it loses the decombine later in the game.)

It's too powerful unless the units are shit, in which case the ability to decombine is completely pointless anyway.

>>15103437
>There's a good reason Terada and Friends haven't seen fit to repeat that experiment after L; it's neither 'balancing' nor all that much fun.

And you accuse me of never playing SRW. Go play UX and BX. (Though, now that I think about it, didn't Neo debut that? I seem to remember the Eldorans not being able to decombine.)

>>15103487
>you're thinking about as creatively as the people who actually make Brave shows

Which is actually also a problem with Guard Diver - good fucking luck dealing with the components because if they even do have attacks beyond Melee they must have used them like one time.

> Take the strongest attack of the individual units, multiply by four. How does this not rip the game in two? 1 range, 50% EN per use.

No, now it's just fucking useless. Congrats, your EN balance is K tier.

What's with Kouji's face? It doesn't look like Rape Wolf's art, it doesn't look like Shin's art, it doesn't look like Nagai's art, it doesn't even look like Toei's art. WHO DREW THAT IRON HELMET?!?!

>>15103907
It kinda looks like a bit of a mix of shin and toei to me.

>>15098239
great quality

>>15103828
>playing the 3DS games
That's your own fucking fault.

>>15072468
Need Mazinkaiser ZERO

>>15103352
>OG shouldn't have this problem


It does. OG games go by who is relevant for the story for that game.

SRW in general has been doing that for the longest.

>>15072468
Kaiser is better

Wasnt as good as the MEGAS cameo

>>15072468
>Do you think manga series should be part of it?
...yes? More options are always good and this way we get animations for stuff that would otherwise never see them.

>>15113187
>Kaiser is better
You're wrong