So did revealing this piece of marble to the world actually do

It's pretty much about putting the ghost of Zeon to rest, giving an idea as to why it's so damning to the setting and why it could perpetuate for so long only to abruptly end between CCA and F91.

As much as F91 was a new generation tale, CCA was the closure of Amuro's and Char's rivalry, whereas Unicorn is the closure of the so-called early UC, wishing for a future where Gundam isn't just Zeeks and Feddies going at each other's throats until the end of time.

>>14897838
I've never thought of Unicorn as the big conclusion, only an epilogue.

And the reveal is my biggest problem with Unicorn. They hype up Lapace's box every fucking episode (which i was tired of by episode 2), but it's just a politician's promise? It's entirely meaningless.

>So did revealing this piece of marble to the world actually do anything with regards to what happened in the later UC (Hathaway's Flash, F91, Crossbone, Victory)?
By its very nature as a prequel, no, it didn't change anything. At most, it just fills in the gaps to explain the whole "why the Federation went into decline" thing that happened.

>I also found it a bit offputting how it played up how the Vist Foundation was this shadowy "Illuminati" organization, by saying they've been influencing everything that goes down in the Universal Century.
Don't think that was ever implied, at worst they were just one of many "players behind the scene" that participated in and profited from the corruption that was always there in the beginning.

Remember those old guys who were colluding and laughing in that one episode of ZZ where Bright and Judau reunite with Fa? Who's to say one of those guys wasn't a representative of the Vist Foundation, or the Marcenas family?

>If that's so, why have we not heard of them until now?
Again, by its very nature as a prequel, it's impossible to have heard of them by name up until Unicorn.

>Prequel
>Series is set after all the important UC events
Wat

I know this really isn't on topic but do any of you anons know if there is a complete transcript (or just more of it) for Ricardo Marcenas UC speech.

I figure there is probably just enough written to fill the gap before the Laplace station was blown out.

I looked a while ago and could not find anything. just curious.

>>14897926
>but it's just a politician's promise? It's entirely meaningless.

I can think of few things in the world less useful than the word of a politician.

>>14897926
>And the reveal is my biggest problem with Unicorn. They hype up Lapace's box every fucking episode (which i was tired of by episode 2), but it's just a politician's promise? It's entirely meaningless.

How thick headed are you ? Even one that hadn't read the novels would have had a slight intutition about what the Laplace box was about. Certainly it could not be a weapon. It couldn't be anything other than a political statement. And that I figured out at the end of the first fucking episode of Unicorn and I'm not even a die hard Gundam fan.

>>14898257
Obviously It wasn't going to be a weapon, yes. As i said, I didn't care about the box, so good for you.

>It couldn't be anything other than a political statement
How about space jew gold?

>>14897838
>but to hype up the OVA series as a big "conclusion" UC universe is kind of pushing it.
They did nothing of the sort; Western fans did that.

>>14897838
No, in fact it was probably a fake that the Vists created to swindle the retards at the federation, since the original PM and his crew died and was replaced by a bunch of second stringers.

There's literally zero evidence to believe that the thing is even genuine within the universe. People believing in a thing doesn't make it real. That isn't to say it's fake, but everyone who believes it's a genuine article created by the federation to usher in a new age is tied in some way to the Vists and benefits greatly from the power that the charter commands simply by "existing". For all we know the Vists and some feddie higher ups colluded to create a fake document that they could use as a bargaining chip to blackmail the rest of the government.

>>14898311
They had footage of the creation and signing of the fuckstupid plaque by the politicians from multiple angles.

The fact that somehow nearly a hundred years later it's still very effective as blackmail evidence is stupid but it does point toward the Federation bigwigs being blackmailed knowing it's real.

>>14898324
>mysteriously have footage that the rest of the world didn't see apparently because it wasn't broadcast
>everything was blown to shit and no other evidence exists
>totally not fake

I'm sure

>>14898338
you can make up all kinds of shit just to make a scandal and it'll cause a ruckus

>>14898311
The fact that it was written before Zeon Deikun was born yet perfectly aligns with his ideology is pretty damn fishy.

>>14897907
>putting the ghost of Zeon to rest
Not the anon but put to rest how? If anything doesn't this revelation legitimize Zeon's war against the Federation? It pretty much shows that every character who has worked for the Federation in any way was supporting a corrupt regime.

>>14898609
It's supposed to be the last hurrah of allremaining Zeon remnants. Besides the ones on Mars.

>>14898609
Zeon got exactly the thing that they wanted: independence for spacenoids. Delivered by the very hands of the founders of the Federation, no less. Because the Federation then has no choice but to obey its own charter, Zeon (or at least the followers who believe in independence and not conquest) then has no reason to fight anymore, and thus no more reason to exist outside of self-governance. Which you don't need an army for, and for which you don't need to start wars.

The problem then comes that since the Federation was thus weakened due to losing their control over the near-Earth colonies, parties from Jupiter such as the Crossbone Vanguard and Zanscare could then turn the tables and attempt to conquer Earth. All the while, Zeon has been forgotten in the colonies, and they either join the invaders or join the Federation to fight the new threat. Or turn their colonies into interstellar ships and leave the Earth sphere altogether, eventually becoming the ones who create the Turn X millennia later.

>>14898609
No, because

1. Any argument in favor of Zeon hinged on a particular interpretation of "newtype," such as the one Deikun came up with before the Zabis co-opted his entire life, especially before Giren decided spacenoids deserve to conquer the Earth. A definition that Ricardo Marcenas probably didn't have in mind years before when he had the UC charter expanded to include a clause meant to give space colonists a hope for a future full of possibility.
2. At the end of the day, Zeon FUCKING DROPPED A SPACE COLONY ON SYDNEY, AND NOTHING THEY SAY OR DO CAN CHANGE THAT FACT. Zeon forfeited the right to a moral high ground by committing crimes against humanity, even after you twist the Charter to mean that the Sides should be free of Federation rule nothing can justify dropping a colony on people who had nothing to do with corruption perceived or real on the Federation's part.

>>14898882
But does that matter to the spacenoids? They've already tried to overthrow the federation several times since the colony drop, they don't seem to concerned about a perceived forfeiture of the moral high ground. They have continued to see the federation as their oppressors.

And do you think the spacenoids will interpret newtypes as anything other than "a space-adapted human" or whatever incredibly vague definition Marcenas gave.

I understand that your post was a rebuke to the "legitimization of Zeon's war" in a more objective sense, but I don't see how this manages to put the ghost of Zeon to rest. What's important isn't an objective high ground, but a perceived high ground.

>>14898407
>The fact that it was written before Zeon Deikun was born yet perfectly aligns with his ideology is pretty damn fishy.
My filling-in-the-blanks is that there must've been some pre-UC scientists who found evidence vaguely predicting the rise of a new species. Newtype ability is described as unlocked latent ability, and in ZZ they talk about Newtype ability as stuff that humans once used but later lost due to the use of technology. Perhaps scientists found scattered evidence of these latent, lost abilities, or found genes which they thought might produce special powers if mixed and matched after some number of generations. It's just that this idea didn't become popular among the masses until Zeon Zum Deikun, and he might not have been thinking about the biological aspect at all, only the spiritual one.

Another thing to consider is that the Charter writers weren't intending that article to come into play in the near-future, only the far future. Think about it, they include four digits even in the first century of the Universal Century; UC 0001, UC 0079. They've got a mentality similar to that of the real-life Long Now Foundation, who want us to think of our current year as 02016. Perhaps the Charter writers only expected a new species to arise sometime around UC 9999, and the fact that it became important by the time of UC 0065 would've been a complete surprise. (The article before it is about contact with extraterrestrials, right?)

>>14898407
Deikun might very well have been working off the theories of previous philosophers.

Plenty of great thinkers have done so in the real world.

>>14901304
I feel it was more of a "coinciding evolution"

in the same way similar inventions were produced in different nations without any interaction similar ideas can likely be produced just out of coincidence... or inevitability

>>14901005
Consider also the fact that in the aftermath of the One Year War (and more specifically the aftermath of the actions of some really deranged Zeon remnants), the Federation formulated the Titans as a means to keep Zeon movements from rising up again.

The existence of the Charter conspiracy recontextualizes the act to be a product of a fear more than just "if we let the crazies multiply they'll drop another colony," a fear that Zeon actually would be seem as in the right all along and that a massive Zeon revival surge could occur if the masses swung in just the right direction. So you had this group, the Titans, and their job was to squash even the slightest possibility of a Zeon movement, because the last thing the Federation wants on its plate is round two of the One Year War. Shit wasn't fun the first go around.

The problem was that despite formed to extinguish Zeonesque uprisings, the Titans arguably fueled the very seditious sentiment it was meant to suppress, because their violent actions were seen as evidence of an oppressive Federation that the colonies ought to distance themselves from.

Now, do you see by any chance the existence of a vicious cycle in the making? In the interest of preventing a Zeon revival, the Federation conducted acts that in essence gave purpose to more Zeon revivals.

Unicorn argues this to be the fundamental flaw of the Universal Century, the antagonist of POSSIBILITY. Every conflict would boil down to the Federation peeving colonies off while a Zeon revival tries to take advantage of the situation, resulting in echoes of the One Year War repeating over and over and over again. The Charter is meant to be a sort of tangible burden wherein the unrelated actions of a few people who might have meant well end up resulting in this fear that one side might -believe- that they have post hoc justification of their behaviors.

>>14901356
Like, really, it does come down to the Federation fearing that the Charter would give wind to Zeon, even if it takes a certain narrow interpretation of the facts, along with looking past the colony drop.

Long story short to defuse this conflict the last heir of the Zabis divulges this text while openly condemning the actions of her predecessors, stating that what Marcenas wished and what Deikun preached, despite having similar language, shouldn't be taken as the same exact ideology, which means Zeon as a movement of spacenoid supremacy shouldn't be encouraged, which means spacenoid independence shouldn't be tied to Zeon, which means it shouldn't be suppressed by groups like the Titans, which also results in Zeon as a movement not being necessary, which means Zeon as an ideology can finally die, blah blah blah, skip a few connections, eventually you conclude that the Universal Century can now be about more than just Zeon remnants bitching a fit.