>tfw you're old enough now and finally realize that Gundam

>>14875970
Well, yeah.

Pretty hamhandedly, but still.

>>14875970

>old enough

>when all any nameless Coordie and Natural does - and most named ones, for that matter - is froth at the mouth,in primal, savage fury

Truly, wisdom comes with age.

>>14875970
I too, remember turning 13.

>>14875970
>tfw you're a social justice warrior and see hatred, social issues, inequality and racism everywhere you look anyways

>>14875970
did your testicles just drop OP?

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>>14875970
>Its the only gundam where a woman literally whored herself out to convince a quatre tier crybaby gundam pilot to commit mass murder hate crimes
>with several people

I'm pretty sure Optimus Prime told me that as a kid

>>14875982
Can't exactly blame them for being so bloodthirsty and insane towards one another. Co-existance was completely out of the question by the end of Destiny.

The Coordinators are a dying species, slowly eroding away due to genetic sterility and are constantly being attacked by assclowns like Djbril and Azreal. With that said, if they don't outbreed with naturals, they will basicaly go extinct by virtue of sterility. Given how many potential genocide plans they have cooked up (GENESIS, Junius 7 drop, ect) They are the bigger threat of the two groups.

Blue Cosmos, while a comedically evil at times, made some sense from a pragmatic point of view. Unlike Coordinators, Naturals still have the ability to reproduce without issues and generally understood the danger that allowing a hyper advanced species of super humans slowly coming to realize they are dying from population loss could pose to humanity. Azreal may have been a cunt for firing first on Junius 7, but the attempted assault on the PLANTS was mankinds last and best shot to remove the Coordinators biggest power block once and for all. Unfortunately he was to foolish to deal with GENESIS and then have the remains of his fleet deal with the PLANTs. LOGOs on the other hand deserved everything they got. Unlike Blue Cosmos, they were a self serving terror group that were more than happy to kill Naturals and destroy mass sections of the Earth to fit its own private agenda.

All in all, both sides have some valid reasons to keep that genocidal conflict going, and as much as I hate to say it, Durrandal probably had the right idea to fix the whole situation. Destiny Plan was a flawed mess and in any other timeline, it would be really damned stupid. In C.E however, things were only going to get better by forcefully removing that divide between the two. Oh well, Lacus and Kira ensured an eternal dark age on Earth and the continued sterility of the Coordinators by taking over the PLANTS.

>>14876069
they were never sterile, what the fuck are you saying?

>>14875970
I never really got the idea that SEED was about racism. Coordinators aren't a race, they're a social class. They're the embodiment of the wealthy flaunting the law to get what they want, then claiming persecution when a populist movement tries to curb their abuses. Like, the tension started because after they stole manufacturing plants from the nations that built them, they were offended by the idea that said nations wanted the plants to still build things for them. Coordinators are a bunch of jackasses, Blue Cosmos had...well, not the right idea, because ideally instead of banning genetic augmentation you'd make it cheaply available to all and possible to do in-vivo instead of in-vitro. But they were right for wanting to kill off everyone in the PLANTs.

>>14875970
In SEED it doesn't even make any sense though because the whole plot relies on racists being right.

I mean you can make a good argument that blacks and whites and asians are all equal, but co-ordinaters are literally designed for superiority. The show spends half its time going on about how perfect Kira is as the ultimate co-ordinater.

>>14875970

Old enough? The X-men are more subtle about this shit.

>>14876162
Yes they are. It was a minor plot point, so it's understandable that you missed it. But Coordinators breeding with Coordinators have decreased fertility with each "purebred" generation. Breeding with Naturals or lower-generation Coordinators ameliorates the problem, though. I guess it's kind of like hybridization breeding programs. Anyway, that's why Durandal and Talia broke up, because he couldn't successfully impregnate her. Like I said, minor plot point.

>>14876006
I like Quatre. He was alright.

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>>14876006

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>>14875970

You realize the villains won.

>>14876765
Of all the outcomes from best to worst...

Blue Cosmos: Would have erased the Coordinator homeland, forceing the survivors on Earth either to accept extinction or to interbreed with the regular Natural population, increasing all of the genetic positives without any of the negatives. Humanity continues on just fine and eventually space development might become possible again.
Three Ships Alliance: Stopped a full scale two-way genocidal war and actually decided to fuck off after the war and accept living peacefully away from the politics of the post-war matters.
Z.A.F.T (C.E 73): Destiny plan destroys the nationalist identity of the entire world outside of Scandinavia, humanity is eugenics into a more stable and sustainable species, but at the same time the bureaucratic system could fall apart without a strong centralized planning board and military.
LOGOS: Literal Illuminati puppeteers continue to propagate conflict on Earth even after killing every single coordinator. The human race would become stagnant and would be manipulated for the gain of a small council of elites from the Federation.
Terminal/O.R.B: A violent military coup that was not endorsed by either Naturals or Coordinators. With the Atlantic Federation leadership dead and the LOGOS leaving a massive rift in power, countless new terror groups will begin to crop up. Pro-Patrick Zala support would also begin to surge to the distain for the Clyne family name. Earth enters a dark age, space is on the verge of a full fledged uprising eventually due to differing agendas.
Z.A.F.T (C.E 71): Would have killed every living creature on Earth with GENESIS, with Naturals gone, Coordinators would be unable to fix the genetic sterility issue, leading to the extinction of the human race as a whole. Rau can be heard keking from beyond the grave.

While nothing is ideal, Blue Cosmos would have reset the playing field to 0, a brand new start for mankind to correct the mistake of Coordinators.

>>14876858
>Blue Cosmos
>interbreed with the regular Natural population
If by "interbreed with" you mean "get lynched and murdered by" then yeah.
Remember, the first violence was Naturals attacking Coordinators.

>>14876882
While you are correct in that the first strike was done by Natural interest, that was mostly due to the paranoia of them overtaking naturals artistically, culturally, in the work force, in politics, ect. By quelling them into a spread out and non-unified group, they no longer serve as a major threat to the human race. In the case of interbreeding, it would only serve to upgrade the natural without turning them into a full blown coordinator, A gene filter basically.Within about two to three generations, pure coordinators would be completely extinct either due to sterility or their own genes being deluded over the generations.

Put them to the rope or allow them to exist and go extinct by virtue of their genes and ideology not being passed on, either way Blue Cosmos completes its core objective in the long run.

>>14875970

Uh, no shit?

>>14876162

They're BECOMING sterile is the issue.

>>14876882
No, the first violence was done by the parents of Coordinators using their wealth and influence to spit in the face of the legal systems of the world in order to get what they want. They started this war, that Naturals were the first to draw blood doesn't excuse their crime.

>>14876930
>they no longer serve as a major threat
While that may be true, by the start of the show the Natural side, especially Blue Cosmo, sees Coordinators as abominations that shouldn't exist. The only way a Blue Cosmos victory would result in interbreeding is if low-level coordinators lie about being naturals to avoid being destroyed. Blue Cosmos would view the idea of "serve to upgrade the natural world" as obscene. You might even be killed for suggesting it.

>>14875970
And that racism part was written pretty badly.
The fight over economical and political issues from UC looks more believable than this.

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>>14876944
>I don't know what the word "violence" means

>>14875970
>SEED is literally SJW: The anime

Wew

>>14876069
>Co-existance was completely out of the question by the end of Destiny.
Except that Destiny completely dropped that point by the end, given how most of Earth was like 'Destiny Plan? Uh, we'll think about it' instead of 'DIE COORDINATOR SCUM REEEEEEEEEEEEEE'.

>>14876964
He's just using the SJW definition of violence.

Someone disagreeing with you about something? Violence.

>>14875970
How can someone watch SEED and not pick up on any of this what the fuck are you mentally retarded?

>>14876765
>>14876858
Azrael wasn't a villain you faggots

>>14876930
That's incorrect. Naturals reacted that way when you realize what Coordinators are; people genetically engineered to ubermensch levels. Parents can pick their skin tone, complexion, eye and hair colors, if they'll inherit particular talents and aptitudes, and so on.

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>>14877090
Sounds about right. It's just as wrong and hypocritical.

>>14876858
>Terminal/O.R.B: A violent military coup that was not endorsed by either Naturals or Coordinators. With the Atlantic Federation leadership dead and the LOGOS leaving a massive rift in power, countless new terror groups will begin to crop up. Pro-Patrick Zala support would also begin to surge to the distain for the Clyne family name. Earth enters a dark age, space is on the verge of a full fledged uprising eventually due to differing agendas.

And at the head of it all, Kira and his friends try to maintain peace through military action. Armed interventions begin to take place on battlefields, while Terminal agents begin acts of sabotage in order to weaken each factions war machine. The Clyne faction tries to paint it's actions in a noble light through the usage of propaganda, but this only seems to radicalize their opposition. Natural Groups begin talking about hoe this is the Coordinators taking over everything.

>>14876162
By the third generation Coordinators start becoming sterile unless they interbreed with a natural.

So if your parents were both coordinators, and all four of your grandparents were coordinators, then you have a higher than normal chance of being sterile, with that chance increasing with every generation.

It was part of the setting notes and a very minor point in the show that got ignored in place of the generic evil racism message.

>>14875998
OP is a brazilian transwoman.

>>14875970
I am so dissapointed when I see SEED and Destiny.
They had the chance to make two masterpiece gundam series that could've surpassed the original, but they fucked it up TWICE.

I feel bad for the man who wrote the lore for SEED because it is so fucking interesting, then fukada and his wife come along and crash the train while pressing every fucking button in the cockpit.

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We need to make gundam as awesome as SEED and Destiny were.

>>14877194
It was something they added in because they needed to give the coordinators a weakness to try to give the whole "give peace a chance!" thing that all Gundam AU's eventually devolve into. Of course, this is all thrown away in Destiny when all the coordinator/natural couples are broken up and characters are assassinated.

If it wasn't for that whole sterility thing, the coordinators would likely never even have to deal with the naturals. Hell, they could move their plants deeper into space and go get Mars rays or something or go to Jupiter to find Ayy's like 00.

>>14876069
Most of the Earth was fine with each other after SEED. It was just LOGOS and some leftovers trying to force another war.

Durandal's Destiny Plan was a stupid idea and he could have gotten along just fine ruling ZAFT without that or the fake Lacus.

>>14876944
Are you legally retarded? Violence means attacking someone with force in order to cause physical damage, not just doing something that you don't like.

>>14877562
>as awesome as SEED and Destiny were.
Kill yourself.

>>14875970
>like that shit wasn't literally pasted on the walls in crayon in every scene

>>14878090
Yes, and the Coordinators attacked the Naturals with economic force, and caused the physical damage of poverty and disease. Those monsters.

>>14877562
>Implying Destiny was good

Pls

>>14876171

THIS. 9999999999/10

>>14878181
It was though.

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>>14877356
>tfw OP literally is a fag

>>14877194
Close, but not quite. They weren't sterile or infertile, it's just that third-gen sperm and third-gen eggs had low compatibility. Third-gen males could still get natural females pregnant and third-gen females could still get pregnant by naturals. It was only a problem if both parents were coordinators

How are the compilation movies? I want to rewatch it (maybe Seed Destiny too, but only when I have absolutely nothing better to do) but I don't want to go through all that stock footage and recap episodes at every 5 episodes.

>>14880606
Destiny is rip
Just watch SEED so your good time isn't ruined by the sequel

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>>14880332
>Muh perfect coordinator
So could Kira and Lacus theoretically produce god babbies?

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>>14875970
>tfw you're old enough now and finally realize that Gundam Wing was all about uh.....urm.....uh....

What was it about?

>>14880661
Baiting fujoshi and gunpla sales.

>>14880661
It was about wild beat communication

>>14880661
Allahu ackbar.

>>14876069
The root of SEED's problems was the general Japanese attitude towards personhood (or, at least, how it's expressed in anime). Namely, its batshit insanity. It's pretty much impossible to have a rational exploration of race relations when people think that 3-ish generations of minor genetic enhancement constitutes enough of a difference that families will split off into different nations and literally nuke each other.

>>14876964
>>14878090
Broader conception of violence. What's more damaging to the human body, a punch to the face or implementing a regressive taxation and social welfare scheme that causes children to starve?

>>14880661
Mostly fucking around with notions of the legitimacy of war and how it's carried out.

>>14880661
Drone warfare is bad and men should kill each other with their own hands

>>14880720
That was Gundam 00

>>14880661
Soldiers failing to adjust to an age where they are no longer necessary.

>>14875970
I realized that shit in middle school, maybe you're just dumb? :(

>>14878048

Pretty much. Durandal actually managed to get many earth nations on his side and basically won the war and brought peace in episode 45. He could have quit while he was ahead and even made Kira and Lacus and Orb look like idiots for not working with the guy from the start.

Instead he went "Nope I cannot accept not having total control over every aspect of every life. Destiny Plan or get lazered." and proved them right that he was crazy.

>>14876858
>to interbreed with the regular Natural population, increasing all of the genetic positives without any of the negatives. Humanity continues on just fine and eventually space development might become possible again.

The funny thing is this is what they were intended to do from the start according to George Glenn. Coordinate humanitys future by breeding with naturals, so that generations into the future everyone would have the genetic benefits.

The problem is people are inherietly selfish and care about themselves and their present, and not a hypothetical perfect future they'll be long dead for that a bunch of people they'll never know can see. Which must be a thing because Unicorn brings up the same problem.

As a result Naturals were resentful of the perfect coordinators when they could never have their gifts by the time they were born naturally, and Coordinators got big heads and wanted to know why they shouldn't upshow all the naturals. And they didn't make nice like George wanted.

00 does a similar plot with the Innovators (the real ones, not Ribbon's and his godcomplex). And in this case it works, and humanity is well on their way to all being innovators after the movie. In this case it probably helps that while Naturals could never be Coordinators, anyone could potentially become an Innvator so the jealousy wasn't as bad since one could hope they'd become one as well.

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>>14880978

Depends on who's punching.

>>14881124
>00 does a similar plot with the Innovators (the real ones, not Ribbon's and his godcomplex). And in this case it works, and humanity is well on their way to all being innovators after the movie. In this case it probably helps that while Naturals could never be Coordinators, anyone could potentially become an Innvator so the jealousy wasn't as bad since one could hope they'd become one as well.
Well there was apparently a damn war that happened in the hundred some year span Setsuna went off with the ELS and the epilogue...

>>14880978
I know this is going to sound shocking, but you can cause damage without violence.

>>14881111
It bugs me that Durandal plays Djibril like a fiddle with all of his carefully-laid plans, but all of his schemes against Lacus fail simply because he rushes.

He still wheels out Meer after the Lacus assassination fails, but gets lucky that (a) Athrun keeps mum about it, and (b) Lacus doesn't bother to point out that Meer is a fake for 30 episodes.

He tells the world about the Destiny Plan when Orb/Lacus are still in a position to resist him. All it does is place doubt in his own forces (Luna, maybe Shinn, if Rey wasn't manipulating him), while galvanizing the resistance forces.

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>>14879219
At least the OP isn't as bad as pic related, who considers himself a lesbian because he's in a relationship with a woman.

I always found it wierd that SEED, written by japs of all people, is essentially saying with Orb that humanity is best with a multicultural society.

Granted, they mean in that there is more or less a dominant culture and the rest learn to assimilate, but that's still a message that differs a lot from the "Japan for the Japanese" ideal a lot of japs have.

>>14882780
>Granted, they mean in that there is more or less a dominant culture and the rest learn to assimilate
Because historically that's the kind of multiculturalism works. It's why so many different kinds of Europeans hate each other in Europe but those same ethnic groups can get along in America.

>>14882788
that works*

Knowing how nips piss their pants and REEEE at the thought of something that isn't hyper-nationalistic NIPPONSTRONK stuff I wonder how something as gratingly liberal as SEED became so popular.

>>14882825

Because young japs don't really think of that stuff like their parents and grandparents did. It's hard to be ultra nationalistic when you've lived your life starting with a lost decade, followed by mediocrity.

>>14882788

Europeans don't all hate each other. We are very civil about murdering each other.

Destiny Plan was so stupid.All of the problems of their world was caused by genetic engineering and Durandal's solution was more genetic engineering?What made it even more dumb was that most people were actually okay with it.

>>14882873
>Durandal's solution was more genetic engineering

No his solution was basically an enforced caste system, you're stuck in whatever field you're born with being seen as "best" in.

>>14882865
My point is, it seems like when you're no longer living on your old home turf, you learn to as someone put it on a thread, either mellow the fuck out or lose your mind and commit an atrocity in hopes of getting the most irl (You)s.

>>14875970
Why does one of the most racist countries on Earth constantly include racism as a theme in their entertainment?

>>14882825
>>14882839
>>14882780

>Lacus and Kira literally the de facto Emperor or Empress of the Earth sphere by the end of Destiny
>Orb is the only society that works because it's !not Japan
>Liberial

More like the typical empowerment fantasy for otakus. Where the world is at peace the right way if they follow the ways of their self-insert, in this case the directors as Kira and Lacus

>>14882969
Abloobloo hiroshima we dindu nuffin stupid evil white piggu

>>14875970
A lot of people knew about this, but they bitched (and rightfully bitched) how it was poorly handled.

And then they over-bitched with DESTINY. Also for very good reasons.

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>>14881080
I wish there was a Gundam Wing X Metal Gear crossover.

>>14881125
That's overkill. He killed a planet-sized god by punching him in the finger.

>>14882969
I too want to know.

>>14883214
It's them playing victim. Due to contact with the rest of the world, Japan has lost something of it's culture in order to fit in. In shows like SEED and Code Geass, Japan or it's stand-in are usually the victims of racists who want them to adopt foreign ways and work towards foreign interests. Japan paints itself in a noble light, and become the good guys fighting racism.

Then you have Destiny. Shinn was supposed to represent the average Japanese youth. The kid became critical of not-Japan after the war, left and joined a foreign nation. There, he fell under the sway of it's leader and ended up attacking not-Japan, even killing the man who helped him after his family died. In the end, after he lost he is brought back into line by the all-loving Kira Yamato, Yamato being Japan's dominant ethnic group.

It's sad that G Gundam is less "fuck yeah Japan" than shows about racism.

>>14883350
It's rather farcical in Geass because Japan's freedom isn't all that central to the narrative compared to some wunderkind gaijin who co-opts the independence movement so he can stick it as hard as possible to his old man for letting his mom get shot up.

I for one think the use of racism is just because it's an easy to identify "bad thing for bad people" behavior. Like how Marvel loves to use racism to quickly establish such and such character is meant to be some inherently unlikable antagonist. The hypocrisy of it all is probably lost on them just as much as someone here with racist beliefs enjoying X-Men, to them it's just escapist fiction with no bearing on real world issues.

Still, if you want to talk issues of systemic discrimination, that's a discussion I think is best reserved for the Reconguista fans.

>>14883350
So, in MSG, Zeon ~= WWII Japan.

Orb ~= ?.

>>14880978
>Broader conception of violence.
>I still haven't looked up what "violence" means
There's a reason that "oppression" and "violence" are two different words:
THEY'RE NOT THE SAME THING

>>14883420
Fukudja said that Orb was an "idealized Japan" meankng it's how he wishes modern Japan was.

>>14883420

Fukuda has admitted Orb is supposed to be his idealized version of Japan. A Japan where the royal families seemingly run everything and the elected legislature appears mostly for show, but his ideal Japan nonetheless.

>yfw Dearka was demoted for racemixing
Really makes you think...

>>14883429
>>14883432
So, Fukuda's ideal Japan is one where the ruling monarch gets kidnapped from her own wedding, and a bunch of buffoons make shady alliances and run the country into the ground before she returns?

>>14883520
Never mistake Fukuda for being smart.

>>14883429
>>14883432
The same Orb, whose two knights of 'freedom and justice' interfered with the capture of a war criminal, who had ordered the deaths of millions, and whose escape led to the deaths of further millions?

>>14883632

Again, unless the point of Destiny is that we're supposed to question Team Kira's actions, Fukuda isn't that smart. Notice that while Kira flies machines labeled Freedom he acts as a terrorist, and his version of UNDERSTANDING is "I'm right. I'll use this power to make everyone chill the fuck out and listen."

>>14882565
Well, I'm a heterosexual male and I consider myself a lesbian, too.

>>14882969
Is it though? Anime shows which include racism as one if its core themes are extremely rare in my view. Try to name a few. Apart from Code Geass, I can't really think of any.

>>14882969
>>14883214
>>14883350
You should learn proper English, cabrones.

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>>14885475
You too.

>>14885958
Nice reply, maricon.

>>14885461
I wasn't talking about just anime, but other things like video games too.

Hence, "their entertainment".

>>14885475
>>14889556
Reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee spics get out.

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>>14875970

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>>14879063
Destiny had one good part.

>>14883421
Oppression is a form of violence.

>>14882969
Anime tends to address a lot of things Japanese don't want to face in reality.

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>>14875970
>it took OP to long realize what's theme is about

>>14889726
Okay. I'm not really familiar with Japanese vidya.

>>14893106
You should probably play Dragon Quest VII sometime.

>>14893382
Consoles suck.

>>14875970
Kira my Idol