Fact: If Suzaku was the protagonist, people would sympathize

>>14842604

Fact: he WAS a protagonist.

He was a protagonist. The problem is that he often opposes Pelouch and his GLORIOUS plan for liberate Japan with some good revenge for himself.

It's the same reason why people hated the wife of Walter White. As if this were not enough, Suzaku was naive and his reasons are not as strong as those of Lelouch.

>>14842606
A protagonist, the deuteragonist. If he was THE protagonist, people would sympathize with him.

>>14842617
I sympathize with him anyways. He had found the waifu of His dreams, the good , naive (like him) princess who asks him to become his white knight. He must have thought that all his dream were come true.

And so... Lelouch takes all this away because of his stupid joke...and despite everything, the fans still cheer to him.

>>14842604
People (at least the Nips) still like Slaine over Inaho.

Char is more popular than Amuro.

So, not really.

>>14842629
At least he'll get that sweet Nunnally pussy.

>>14842629
Do you think he and Euphy fugged?

>>14842635
With Euphemia he would run some good night of sex, eventually, given that the two characters are attracted reciprocally from the start.

With Nunnally he would only be a distant protector. Not surprisingly, Lelouch says that become Zero will be a curse to him.
At the end Suzaku remains an incredibly unlucky character.

>>14842604
>herp derp it's best to change Britannia from the inside

Nope

It's like thinking someone could change the United States as a minority

No, the only solution is to make the majority a minority

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>>14842604
No, the IRA were the heroes.

>>14842646
But that's what happened in the end: Britannia was changed from the inside by the two.

>>14842661
No. Lelouch destroyed the world and rebuild it, like God in Noah's ark during Noah's arc in Bible.

>>14842661
By killing or brainwashing any Britannian leadet who got in their way.

Definitely not by working slowly in legal way.

>>14842646
Are you fucking stupid?
>>14842667
Uh....that's still changing it from within stupid. By dismantling the old regime and es true establishing a new one.

>>14842646
Except he did change it from the inside by becoming the first Japanese knighted and then going up to the Knights of Round.

>>14842604
True but people would have been less likely to give the show a chance and dismiss it as a Gundam SEED ripoff as oppose to a Death Note ripoff. Also most people who side with Lelouch watched Code Geass as teenagers so their impression is that he's always right of course nowadays people like him because he was more entertaining as a character.

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>>14842771
Confession... i miss him.
yes, he was a faggot but still better than many other anonymous mc.

And i miss C.C. too

>>14842604
He was a protagonist of equal screentime and importance as Lelouch. People just rather Lelouch.
He's far less popular than Lelouch but that doesn't mean he isn't liked or popular. Lelouch was a phenomenon at the time.

>>14842740
Except it was Lelouch who ultimately did it, not Suzaku, Suzaku acted as Lelouch's pawn following his plans.

>>14842612
Oh don't you compare Skylar to someone who has any kind of sympathetic traits like Lelouch
I'm just going to give away all that mysterious money to my new fling instead of keeping it for my family and your cancer treatment why don't you make more time for me :c

>>14842761
But he never changed anything as a Knight of Round.

>>14842740
Dismantling an old regime from within would be promoting positive change and trying really hard to get better people put into positions of power through legal means like elections
Killing everyone to do so is either rebellion or war

>>14842604
Fact: Code Geass is terrible

>>14842740
That was a coup d'estate not Suzaku's original plan.

>>14843082
*etat

>>14843007
>Except it was Lelouch who ultimately did it,
Wait so Lelouch was the one who went about destroying Britannian control facilities and removing their control from the nations they had conquered as well as fending off Britannian supporters? I didn't know that.
>>14843016
>>14843016
>Dismantling an old regime from within would be promoting positive change and trying really hard to get better people put into positions of power through legal means like elections
But that's exactly what they did. They got rid of the old opposition and left the Britannia in the hands of Nunnally and Schienzel to rebuild its reputation in the world by painting himself as the evil opposition. That was the whole point of his reign as a tyrant to take all of Britannia's past deeds on himself so they could grow.

>>14843013
Uh...him becoming the first Japanese member IS changing the system retard.

>>14843082
Suzaku's plan was to go into the ranks and get into a position to make change. What teh fuck are you talking about?

>>14843102
No it isn't because Suzaku never changed anything or improved life for the 11s. He got a high position yes but he never did anything with it but be Charles's pawn.

>>14843007
Zero's Requiem was something they both created. All Lelouch did was use his linage to become the Emperor and with Suzaku's strength they were able to go about their plan because Lelouch would have been dead without him. Suzaku wasn't a pawn in anything.
>>14843016
>Lelouch became the Emperor
>Goes about removing control of HIS EMPIRE across the globe
>Opposition objects
>Proceeds to take them down until they submit
I'm not sure if you believe they will be no people oppose to the ideas of changing Britannia's regime with no blood involve, Suzaku himself realized this from the beginning but didn't think the best opposition was to go to war with the EMpire like his father did. Suzaku isn;t oppose to violence to get what he wants nor he is a moralfag.

>>14843118
>He didn't change the system because I say so

So you didn't watch the anime.

>>14843106
Which he never managed to accomplish. Suzaku's strength only extends as far as being Lelouch's attack dog. He's not smart enough to enact any sort of real reform.

>>14843106
The fact that he ultimately needed to dismantle the system to make change, not work with it, in fact the power he gained as a Knight of Round wasn't enough which is why he made a bid for more power.

>>14843118
How is being the first pure Japanese blood to be accepted into the ranks of the Britannian armed forces not changing the system?
>Suzaku never changed anything or improved life for the 11s
He restarted the Special Zone for the Elevens in R2. But because the first one went sooo well they decided to take their changes with Zero and head to China.

>>14843125
He didn't anon, a coup d'etat isn't changing a system he removed it entirely. That's not changing a a systen from the inside out that's changing it from the outside in.

>>14843126
>Which he never managed to accomplish
Hey dumbfuck! He became a KoR. He accomplished his goal whether you accept it or not.
>>14843129
The system still exists though. The big difference is that Britannia isn't in absolute power. They dismantled the old regime, which is what he was gaining for to begin with.

>>14843106
Fun fact, if Euphemia had not died in that crude way, Suzaku would succeeded, for the most, with his plan. The next step would be become an high tier knight or even get married with Euphemia. There is also a precedent with Charles married with Marianne (knight of six of her era).

Sure, Japan would not have been fully free, but chances were good enough that things were less violent , this way, than the mass brainwashing of Lelouch.

>>14843137
>he removed entirely
>Britannia is still standing

I'm starting to think that a lot of you retards didn't pay attention to the plot of this.

>>14843132
Because that system was already there, in reality anyone can move up Britannia ranks so long as you have the political backing. Beyond that though we've never seen the lives of 11s improved by his actions alone.

>>14843140
By R2 he was fed up with everything and saw that his way wasn't going anyway with the current regime in place.

>>14843139
No it really doesn't though, what Lelouch did was dismantle the system by the end of the story the system is no longer there.

>>14843142
Anon dismantling a system and getting rid of a country are two separate things.

>>14843139
After which he promptly fucked off to the desert to kill Euros. Yes, I'm sure this was in his "plan."

>>14843148
Nope. With no Euphemia around as a charismatic figure he no longer had the support for doing what he wanted. Together they could represent an union between Japan and Britainnia.

Suzaku alone counts for nothing, despite the new military rank.

>>14843140
For about as long as Cornelia was in charge of area 11. If she ever got reassigned then he'd be fucked. Euphemia didn't even have the power to decide on the winner of am art contest.

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>Suzaku didn't change the system
>Became the first Japanese Knight which was unheard of that time and cause a blow in the rebellion
>Suzaku didn't make lives better for 11s
>reinstated the Special Zone that failed previously for the people who stayed in Area 11
>Suzaku was Lelouch's lapdog
>Zero's Requiem was created by both of them using both of their strengths

I'm confused here? Was I watching this show wrong and am I to believe Suzaku didn't accomplish nothing yet Lelouch did everything? Because I'm pretty sure that the entire point was both were stuck in a rut before they actually teamed up in the last arc and was able to succeed in their respective goals.

>>14843122
And Suzaku never would have gotten half that that far if not for Lelouch.

>>14843176
>Became the first Japanese Knight which was unheard of that time and cause a blow in the rebellion
Not by any of his own doing. Lloyd literally just picked him up off the street and said "yeah, you'll do."
>reinstated the Special Zone that failed previously for the people who stayed in Area 11
Which nobody believed in. Besides, it wasn't his idea, he was just clinging the memory of his dead waifu.
>Zero's Requiem was created by both of them using both of their strengths
Again, it was Lelouch's plan. Suzaku's role in it amounted to shooting a bunch of people, which is ultimately his only real strength. That's like saying that Amuro was the one who was responsible for the Odessa offensive.

>>14843155
So why are you acting as if Lelouch destroyed Britannia when all he did was weed out the opposition? Hell he didn't even kill the Royal Family
>>14843161
You're going to have to tell where in the show that states that Suzaku was oppose to warfare. Because you seem to believe he was all for pacifism when he clearly just wanted to die in battle.
>>14843163
>With no Euphemia around as a charismatic figure he no longer had the support for doing what he wanted.
Uh...the Japanese didn't fucking trust the Britannians after the Euphie incident. In R2 he didn't need support since he became a KoR. Had it gone differently then yes things would have a chance but now? They couldn't trust them.

>>14843176
>Became the first Japanese Knight which was unheard of that time and cause a blow in the rebellion
What blow? The rebellion was still going strong and 11s just considered him a traitor. In fact they tried to assassinate him. Besides that Brittanian system already allowed for that to happen, also he only got that position because of a deal he struck with Charles, not because he rose in the ranks naturally.

>reinstated the Special Zone that failed previously for the people who stayed in Area 11
The very first episode of R2, and we never see Suzaku's idea helping anyone.

>Zero's Requiem was created by both of them using both of their strengths
With Suzaku acting as the dumb muscle.

>>14843193
Because Lelouch was the one who killed Charles, and use his geass on his siblings so they couldn't fight him and Suzaku. If he didn't use his geass on Schnizel then he would have continued to fight against them.

>>14843192
>Not by any of his own doing
Actually it is. The reason why he even got the recommendation to be knighted in the first place was because Lloyd took a liking to him. Pretty much everything that came to Suzaku was because of personality. Lelouch had nothing to do with that.
>Which nobody believed in
As already fucking stated because the previous one failed. For the people that did stay however it got better through Nunnally's eye..
> Besides, it wasn't his idea,
Actually it was. Euphie came up with the idea through Suzaku and he wanted to reinstanted knowing that it was pointless in her memory.
>Again, it was Lelouch's plan.
Nope it was both of their plans even stated so in the show itself Lelouchfag

>>14843179
And Lelouch would have died the second he sat on the throne. But feel free to fail at proving a point.

>>14843192
Suzaku became a Knight because Llloyd and Euphie liked him. How Lloyd found him is irrelevant since it was by pure concidence much like how Lelouch gained his Geass

Nobody believed in it because Lelouch fucked it up the first time dumbass.

It wasn't Lelouch's plan and you can't even prove it was Lelouch's plan. The very notion that you take Suzaku's role as "the guy who shoots stuff" when ITS THE FUCKING CRUX OF THE PLAN proves you're just a blind hater.

>>14843193
>Had it gone differently then yes things would have a chance but now? They couldn't trust them.

The point is that the goal of Suzaku, MAYBE, would have been possible without the "kill all the Japanese" trolling.

It would be easy? No, but this is just a what if.

>>14843197
>What blow? The rebellion was still going strong and 11s just considered him a traitor.
What? Diethard literally said that Suzaku becoming a knight meant that the BK would lose its support, that was the whole point of the ceremony to show that it was possible for them to raise the ranks like he did.
>In fact they tried to assassinate him.
Wrong. The only one who tried to assasinate him was Kallen AND SHE WAS ORDERED TO BY DIETHARD because he was a treat to Zero's gripe on the Eleven's conscious.
> Besides that Brittanian system already allowed for that to happen, also he only got that position because of a deal he struck with Charles, not because he rose in the ranks naturally.
Wrong again dumbfuck. He became a Knight through recommendation of the Imperial Princess and the Duke, then he got knighted again by Cornelia and he was granted approval by Charles who ultimately runs the shit.
>The very first episode of R2
The new SAZ was not reinstated until episode 8
>With Suzaku acting as the dumb muscle.
Yeah the "dumb muscle" who became the symbol of peace.

>>14843205
>Because Lelouch was the one who killed Charles,
And Britannia was still standing
> and use his geass on his siblings so they couldn't fight him
There were guards about to kill his ass and forgetting the World Army gunning for him as well.
> If he didn't use his geass on Schnizel then he would have continued to fight against them.
Schnizel had retreated. He only let him live because he saw that Schnizel was useful in the new world he creeated.

>>14843207
Suzaku's plan at the start of the series is predicated on the fact that he'll somehow be able to rise beyond his status as an honorary Britannian, which is impossible. The only reason Lloyd chose him as the operator was because he was desperate to prove how awesome the Lancelot was. You could have put anybody else in that situation and Lloyd would have done the same thing because he's a fucking wacko.
Even after his first sortie in the Lancelot, he's immediately stripped of his status and nearly executed, something he just passively accepts until Lelouch saves him. His blind faith in the system is one of his defining character traits.
>>14843223
>It wasn't Lelouch's plan and you can't even prove it was Lelouch's plan
Well by that logic, you can't prove Suzaku had any effort in it either, and the plan may as well have been given to them by Jesus. However, empirical evidence suggest it was all Lelouch's idea, since it aligns with his goals, he had already killed Charles, and he's long since established to be far more intelligent than Suzaku is.

>>14843205
Charles death didn't mean doesn't mean the fall of Britannia.

>>14843246
>you can't prove Suzaku had any effort in it either
Of course I can because we see him in battle and see that he dons the mask in the end which is the fucking key to the hold thing to begin with. To say one had more say than the other, which is fucking hilarious you're saying Lelouch did everything when he was about to bail out when Nunnally came back and Suzaku had to remind him of his position and the plan at had, is just dumb.
> empirical evidence
So shit you pulled out your ass. Gotcha

>>14843246
>However, empirical evidence suggest it was all Lelouch's idea, since it aligns with his goals
I thought Lelouch wanted to DESTROY Britannia not give it another chance at prosperity and especially not in the hands of his brother.
>he had already killed Charles
And what does that have to do with anything? He didn't had much to go on even if his goal was to kill Charles.
> he's long since established to be far more intelligent than Suzaku is.
After R2? Hardly.

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>>14842604
But I do love him.

>>14843246
>Suzaku's plan at the start of the series is predicated on the fact that he'll somehow be able to rise beyond his status as an honorary Britannian, which is impossible.
And that happened. Next.
>The only reason Lloyd chose him as the operator was because he was desperate to prove how awesome the Lancelot was
Once again, Suzaku becoming a Knight had nothing to do with Lloyd finding him on the street. Llyod himself took a liking to him personally hence why he was able to get a recommendation from him the same with Euphie as to why you keep putting that out like it means something, it really doesn't since it implies that Lloyd would have kept anyone on board which anyone who watched the show and know how Lloyd thinks would tell you that you're an idiot.
>Even after his first sortie in the Lancelot, he's immediately stripped of his status and nearly executed, something he just passively accepts until Lelouch saves him
Its almost like he was suicidal or something. Nah it couldn't be he was all for the system and it had nothing to do with guilt suffered from childhood trauma.

>>14843132
It's kinda like how Jackie Robinson becoming the first black MLB player didn't really help all the poor black people who actually were being treated badly

It was a milestone, sure, but its actual effects were limited and it didn't do any tangible good, just 'This gives hope to the people!'

>>14843312
>It's kinda like how Jackie Robinson becoming the first black MLB player didn't really help all the poor black people who actually were being treated badly
That's actually a point made in the show throughout R1. All Suzaku is just a example of how far an Eleven can go but if you don't do anything to make your life better you'll never go anywhere. Lots of heavy handed anti-nationalism in this show which is no surprise given the writer behind it. Hence why the Japanese characters are portrayed very negatively instead of sympathetic.

>>14842604
Well, duh. If he was the protagonist, the story would be shaped in such a way to convince (or at least try to do so) the audience of his being superior. The uncommon twist was to make him the rival/main antagonist (for 80-90% of the show).

You could say the Code Geass world would have been just as likely to gradually improve as to essentially remain the same for the Japanese, if Lelouch had never become Zero.

>>14842604
OP Thanks to A/Z and Slainefags we had an absurd increase in the number of delusional deuteragonistfag shitposters who insist on the stupid idea that a deuteragonist character is the main protagonist of his series.
Currently, these delusional deuteragonistfag shitposters are present in practically all the threads about mecha series to the misfortune of everyone.

>>14842604
I always sympathized with Suzaku more than anyone else, ever since I watched Code Geass four years ago.

>>14842604
If he was the protagonist and the story was rewritten appropriately, sure.

If the plot was exactly the same, then he would be the shittiest "Did Everything Wrong™" protagonist in history.

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>>14845557
>A/Z
>Slainefag
they've left an terrible legacy for the mecha threads.

>>14845557
Don't you have a kusomukuro thread to be shi- oh wait that shitheap ended didn't it?

Well fuck.

>>14845583
What you didn't see the macross threads or are you retarded?

>>14842604
I wouldn't say my opinions about Suzaku were ever that strong, for or against, but it's hard to sell the audience on someone who supports the occupation of his country by a foreign power. He's conflicted about that and other topics, to be fair, as shown both in the original series and in side materials like Akito among others, but it's a position that will only appeal to a minority of people in most cases.

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>>14845699
>but it's hard to sell the audience on someone who supports the occupation of his country by a foreign power.

I lost any sympathy I had for Suzaku when he was threatening to use refrain on Kallen. He became the same kind iof asshole he claimed to be fighting against.