Post questions that don't really deserve their own threads.

File: tumblr_m3vxgbAbBK1qbj9bko1_1280.jpg (74KB, 960x720px) Image search: [Google]

74KB, 960x720px

>>14782704
>Why didn't they just call off the navy review after the GP02 got stolen?

Because the GP02 breaks so many fucking laws by merely existing they have to invent new ones just to deal with it.

Why do you think the federation listed the whole event as "nuh uh didn't happen"

Gundam has some dumb shit in it but at least pay some attention

File: Msa-003.jpg (137KB, 339x650px) Image search: [Google]

137KB, 339x650px

How wide is the performance gap between the GM II, GM III, and the Nemo family?

Why exactly did Guntanks as MS fail? The original and Guntank MP worked, if in a limited sense.
Why did the Guntank II go more in a tank direction while the R44 whent more in an MS direction?

File: HG-GUNTANK-EARLY-TYPE_0229.jpg (184KB, 912x684px) Image search: [Google]

184KB, 912x684px

Other questions;

How long did space fighters persist in the UC? We know, for instance, that the Dra-C was born of Zaku and Gattle parts.

How closely do we know the Guntank R44 and Loto-type to be related?

Where, if anywhere, can I find Bandai's kit rerelease schedules?

What is the music used in the Gundaminfo mobile suit videos?

>>14782715

> Because the GP02 breaks so many fucking laws by merely existing they have to invent new ones just to deal with it.

It didn't. The only away it might have broken was the Antarctic Treaty. Which it couldn't have broken since the war it was designed to govern was over and the Grenada Accords had replaced it. And there's nothing saying there was a ban on nuclear anything in the accords. And banning even nuclear weapon development in it would be kind of stupid on the part of the Federation since they went in to the Accords in a position of strength and wouldn't need to make such concessions.

More likely Gato and Delaz treated the Antarctic Treaty as still being in effect since they viewed the war as having never ended and complaining the Feds were developing nukes gives them the moral high ground to anyone already sympathetic.

The review was probably not called off because cancelling such a large event is a major headache and the Delaz Fleet weren't actually viewed as a real threat, even with a nuke. There's also the simple fact Bask, and others like him wanted the excuse and probably argued not to cancel on those grounds, hoping Delaz would strike.

>>14782704
>Why didn't they just call off the navy review after the GP02 got stolen?
>navy review supposed to show off Fed's strength
>let's just cancel it!
>and show weakness, sending the exact opposite message we wanted to
>and show that we're scared of the people we just BTFO'd in the largest war mankind has ever seen

Anyway it was an inside job you dumb shit, everything in 0083 was to create the Titans
Watch the fucking show you retard

Can funnels be turned into dildos so Newtypes can fuck themselves?

How the fuck do you retards miss the detail that 0083 WAS AN INSIDE JOB
LITERALLY 9/11

>>14783002
Super Napalm can't melt Lunar Titanium

Anyone got that image comparing Naganos zeta designs to the final designs?

>>14783055
kek

Not OP, but in all honesty it's been awhile since I've seen 0083.
>>14783002
>>14782991
For it to be an inside job, who on the Fed side was funding/backing Delaz from the inside? AE just being AE?

Why don't they put i-fields around everything, or at least big carrier ships so they aren't so vulnerable?

What's the difference between a funnel and a bit?

>>14783084

Nah, AE weren't implicated that I recall. Just Bask Om, Jamitov Hymen and the guys who ran the Titans basically, as an excuse to actually form the Titans.

>>14783084
Please actually pay attention
It was Jamitov the entire fucking time
0083 is a straight out Zeta prequel

>>14782704
>Kamille
>you're my....
What was Jerids last word?

>>14782725
The GM II was barely considered an upgrade, so that should tell you how awful they were, plus the Nemo was much better than it (AEUG almost stops using GM II's later on, and I don't even remember if the Titans kept them after a certain point).

They went all out for the GM III, MK-II thrusters, better armed, stronger armor, etc...

>>14783128
"Kamille, you took my everything from me."

>>14783128
his last words were "Kamille, you've taken everything from me!"

>>14783143
His last words before blowing up is
>you're my...

So he got probably got one word cut off

>>14783150
That's just the translator's guess.

File: Zeon_toast_crunch.png (59KB, 980x199px) Image search: [Google]

59KB, 980x199px

how come the true successor to gundam was nu gundam and not mk2, zeta, or ZZ.

>>14783150
that has to do with how japanese works. What we got in the final episode is the direct translation of what Jerid was saying, but it was a mistranslation in terms of meaning.

>>14783216
they could be in manufacturing lines different from the original rx-78-2

What's the difference between the different versions of the first episode of Macross Frontier?

>>14783088
I-fields are expensive and big.

In vidya which side do you like playing on during the battle of A Baoa Qu?

Zeon putting up a desperate defense
Federation rushing into gunfire

>>14783216
Because the GP series, MkII, Zeta, and ZZ were constructed by Anaheim or others for other people's use. Nu was designed specifically by Amuro and he personally oversaw its development. He knew what worked and what he was good at, so he didn't bother with any combining or transformation gimmicks.

File: PAUNCH.gif (501KB, 252x168px) Image search: [Google]

501KB, 252x168px

>>14783104
>>14783103
But that isn't an "inside job," is it? That's just manipulating the people on the playing field. If Hymem had people inside of the Delaz organization actively taking orders from him or his proxies, THEN that's an inside job.

As it stands, its just Jamitov being kekkaku doori about the entire thing and turning a blind eye when it suits his end-game. Sly fucker.

Could be semantics but 9/11 as an example, placing explosive charges in the WT buildings = inside job. Turning a blind eye to obvious terror warnings = master manipulation.

>>14783476
but amuro had almost nothing to do with the original gundam's development. he just did for the nu what kamille did for the zeta.

>>14783492
Of course he didn't, but he did have everything to do with piloting and maintaining it. He was the most attuned to the RX-78-2 out of anyone, which is how only he could develop a true successor to it.

>>14783128
"Waifu".

>>14782991

Not him but naval reviews aren't for political reasons. It's just a tradition.

>>14782704
Why the feds don't bother using Amuro combat data on all their MS's akin to a mobile doll.
fuck Amuro in a Rick Dias kick so many ass putting Amuro in a finish mobile suit would consider a war crime for the unholy destruction it bring forth

>>14783517
>Why the feds don't bother using Amuro combat data on all their MS's akin to a mobile doll.
they exactly did copy the data to the GMs

>>14783511

It is when the Feds do it. Black_Knight said so, so you know it's true. They did it to show off strength to Zeon, and the Feds naval review is why Zeon built up arms and not because Gihren or anyone wanted a war.

>>14783517

They did. His combat data is in every GM thanks to the learning computer. It's not a replica of his skills, which wasn't possible until Crossbone did it with the Amakusa by the looks of things, but it was his data, which was probably as good as they could do.

>>14783159
>>14783218
So only the japanese can elaborate on the proper context

fuck my ass

so is all of MAHQ as retarded as their podcast? i just listened to their thunderbolt episode and they just said the most retarded shit ive ever heard.

>>14783002
Actually its literally Pearl Harbor

>>14783002
This. I still don't see why the all have to call it Zeekwank when the Delaz fleet isn't just decimated, but the Zeeks get buttfucked by the Titans years later.

File: 1469296049189.png (676KB, 692x886px) Image search: [Google]

676KB, 692x886px

What does copying battle data even mean? What does it change from a bone stock MS.

>>14783902
I assume they took Amuro's inputs and set them to simpler inputs, like motion capture or something.

>>14783536

Didn't they say in the show that the naval review has been around since the times of ocean ships?

In which case, they're referring to the british fleet review, or the american naval review, both of which have been a thing since the 19th century. It's just a thing you put on for the country's leaders to go "doesn't it look nice, sir?"

>>14784015
Domestically yes, it's a nice little show for the politicians/king. It did however have an international effect, when you can see a country's ENTIRE naval might in one place, it sends the message to everyone else that as long as they have this, their waters are safe from invasion.

>>14783907
Like an auto pilot, or just they way he got his MS to articulate?

>>14784054
The latter, how he lined up the thrusters or stepped up a cliff or shot a Zaku II behind him, that kind of thing.

>>14783902
Input macros. Basically what Chirico does in VOTOMS

File: Domon Aznable.png (1MB, 1442x1080px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 1442x1080px

>>14784120
thanks

How did the feds keep together, most every war fought was literally because someone hated them?Did they reform often to new politcal climates?. they are painted as weak and stupid and seem to survive off dumb luck.

Also how did they form and when does Universal Century begin in our time? It seems insane to think they got all the countries in the world to form together.

And why the hell do random places suddenly become so Important like Ireland? What happens to places like Washington, Berlin, Tokyo.? who gives a shit about Sydney for op British, it seems like there were much sweeter targets

Posting from phone, lazy typer.

>>14784481
>who gives a shit about sydney for op British
Sydney wasn't the target. They were aiming for Jaburo but it got nuked before it could hit it. Then the colony split in half and hit Sydney instead

>>14782730
>What is the music used in the Gundaminfo mobile suit videos?
This may never be answered, for I believe they haven't released them as stand alone music.

>>14784488
Didnt Jab get nuked in Zeta too?


Aslo with all those nuclear reactor suits and nukes going off, has cancer been cured in gundam universe?

>>14784617
Yea, the Titans abandoned it and set a nuke off to try and kill the AEUG who were in it.

>>14783000
No, not miniaturized enough. Thrust control would probably be 2tough4fuckin.

>>14783088
A funnel uses chemicals, propellant fuels, or a rechargeable battery to fire and move, whereas a bit has an onboard reactor. Typically, bits are much larger.

How exactly was the Ultimate Gundam supposed to fix earth? Even if it worked as intended, wouldn't all life basically become nanomachine-infused like the Green light ending of ME3?

Why do people like Zeta so much?

Why do people hate Zeta so much?

>>14785024
That should be obvious; they're underage.

>>14785042
That should be obvious; it's shit.

>>14785024

That should be obvious: It's great.

>>14785042

That should be obvious: Because they're underage.

What was really si bad about the Halo suceeding? Humanity goes to sleep, so what?

>>14785377

It was explained as "reverting humans back into babies"

It's basically a magnified sirocco mindrape field that can hit everybody.

>>14784481
The Federation is huge and powerful, despite its tendency to job. The wars it has fought have been against Zeek aggression or other nonsense, not multiple Sides unifying against them or what have you.

They are not weak or stupid; just slow and corrupt. They're a bureaucracy wherein favorites are played and where politics can get in the way of what seems immediately right.

Ireland was a point where a port was located. Not much to elaborate on.

Sydney was technically destroyed accidentally; another poster mentioned it but the colony the Zeeks were using to target Jaburo was damaged in transit, resulting in it landing on Sydney. The nuclear exchanges that followed would lead to the Antarctic Treaty.

>>14784858
Not necessarily; you can see in-show and it's mentioned on occasion that DG cells are curable. Presumably while its power would've restored a lot of life to the earth, it would probably have faded out of most organic life on its own once it felt the job was done.

>>14785377
Putting people to sleep was one aspect of its power; however its real danger is partly what >>14785406 says and also that the thing is powerful enough to make you sleep to death.

>>14784617
He means the failing colony got nuked and part of it was redirected. Taking or destroying Jaburo was a well-known reoccurring plot of Zeon's, to the point where everyone thought that's what Delaz was trying to do with Operation Stardust.

>>14782704

How can we say that the Feds were in bankruptcy during the cosmo babylonia wars when during Unicorn they got a lot of powerful mobile suits and had a lot of variants on it?


Do you guys think we need a retelling of late UC?

>>14785966
What if we said that they were bankrupt in cosmo babylonia because they blew all their cash on sick mobile suits in Unicorn?

>>14782704
Do you think that the suits in the Vaun Braun did the right thing powering up the colony to save their asses?
Do you think it would have been better if they just decided to sacrifice themselves and let it drop?

>>14783536
>Black_Knight said so, so you know it's true.
Thanks for the laugh, anon.

>>14785983

Yea, Britain got a lot of cool new shit in WWII and the decades before hand, but the war bankrupted them and they had to give away stuff like computers and how they worked to others nations in order to gain breathing room. Having cool shit doesn't mean you aren't broke.

I'm trying to recall something from an old thread, did Max and Milia end up joining SMS, or were they still with the NUNS during the final assault on Battle Galaxy? Also, did they get red and blue Quarter classes or was it something else?

File: 1411521454325.png (357KB, 765x593px) Image search: [Google]

357KB, 765x593px

>>14783536
>>14784015
>>14784025
>>14783511
Well, well, well. I didn't think that observation would colony crush your colon so badly you'd bring it up again.

First off, the Federation is preforming what could be considered a fleet review, rather than a Naval review, although the terms are essentially the same, but fleet reviews were done by the British Royal Navy, while a Naval review was by the Americans. Regardless there a few things you should know, they aren't held at regular intervals and they originally only occurred when the fleet was mobilized for war or for a show of strength to discourage potential enemies. Later they took place with jubilees or an event regarding the royal family. However these sorts of events always saw foreign dignitaries be invited so the core purpose of showing off military strength was never lost.

In the case of the Federation, all of their Naval Reviews were done with saber rattling or thinking it would discourage forces opposed to them for taking military action. The even is pretty clear of that since right after Side 3 declared autonomy from the Federation the Federation responded by reorganizing their space military and starting a military arming program which culminated in a Naval Review. They then immediately started a second military arming program upgrading and replacing the ships they just built and ended that with a Naval Review. Now seeing as these reviews coincided with the respective programs being completed, it wasn't done as per some tradition, but to saver rattle at Side 3 by sending the message 'We have this giant space force now, don't try and pick a fight with us.' Furthermore, as tensions between Side 3 and the Federation were mounting, and right before the outbreak of War, the Federation held yet another Naval Review. As for the one in 0083, Hamilton held it as a way to show that the Federation rebuilt its forces since 0079 and forces like the Delaz fleet or others would have to be mad to attack them.

>>14782704
>>14782737
Actually even if the Antarctic Treaty wasn't in effect, which it still was. There would be a massive political fall out over the fact that the Federation was developing a mobile suit who's sole purpose was to deliver a nuclear payload. Sure there was allegedly the Zaku II C type which used nukes, but that was during the war and not during a time of 'peace' That was one of the crux of the Delaz Declaration speech in how can you say the Federation has everyone's best interest in mind when they're continuing to build up their military might an WMDs against non existing threats?

As for why the Review not being called off, >>14782737 is right. The Federation always used their Naval Reviews as a political and military statement. In this case, to show that groups like the Delaz Fleet would be mad to try and attack the Federation with their rebuilt forces. Even if it was a prime target for the GP-02. They didn't think it would be able to get close enough to attack the fleet without being intercepted and destroyed on route. Or some similar line of thinking. By canceling the event, it would seen as a sign of major weakness by the Federation to both the Delaz Fleet and more importantly, the colonies.

>>14785966
>How can we say that the Feds were in bankruptcy during the cosmo babylonia wars when during Unicorn they got a lot of powerful mobile suits and had a lot of variants on it?
Because the Laplace Box getting out destroyed the Federation.

Riddhe did nothing wrong.

>>14785606
>>14785406
So its basically the same as dropping Axis or using crazy blade things without dropping Axis or using crazy blade things?

But I mean would it have been so bad, it was the closest thimg that ever came along to reset the Earth and BESPA seemed intent on actually cleaning up the Earth

>>14787789
Yeah, zeek equivalents trying to kill everyone as usual.
They were actually doing it a little more traditionally earlier in the series with the Motorad fleet, the whole "pressing out the earth" thing.

Zanscare kinda did want to clean up the earth, besides the genocide, but even then you see stuff in the series like an officer I can't remember, perhaps it was Cronicle, saying that BESPA forces could fight League Militaire forces a little less fearfully because the LM forces were purposefully trying to avoid reactor explosions while BESPA fighters were not. Zanscare on the whole is already something we know to truly be controlled by the backstabber generals behind the honest, if naive, Queen Maria, and those dudes didn't quite seem to care as much about the Earth's physical well being.

>>14787811
Kagatie wanted to fucking cleanse the earthnoids.

Because he realizes the Earth's problem is earthnoids.

>>14785377
Zanscare was using the Angel Halo to basically kill people's brains. You forget, they were also trying to invade the planet.

Imagine if people invading your country could make your army not only fall asleep, but if they wake up, they have the mind of a child.

>>14785966
So that would explain the zero presence of them in Victory?
god how do you go from making newtype hunting machines and f91s to getting kicked by a puny colony

Speaking of which, why didn't the crossborne vanguard do jack shit in the zanscare war when it was clear as day jupiter footing the war bill?

File: 1475164578318.jpg (293KB, 1628x532px) Image search: [Google]

293KB, 1628x532px

I have some:

>what did exactly D.O.M.E mean? All i could understand was new types didn't exist but they did, and Tiffa has powers but she just has to ignore them, or was it that simply that newtypism is stupid?

>what where Loran's intentions? he just seemed to be getting along with everything, drifting with the current.

>per the Zeon idiocy screencap, who the fuck actually wanted to follow them? gassing colonies, dropping colonies, and all in favor of colonies

>what the fuck was up with Char? he just doesn't make sense.

>>14788327
>what did exactly D.O.M.E mean? All i could understand was new types didn't exist but they did, and Tiffa has powers but she just has to ignore them, or was it that simply that newtypism is stupid?

He was saying newtypes are just mutants, and that seeing the future means nothing since once you know what can happen, you can change it. It's not set in stone.

>>14788327
Zeon's followers take form in discontent spacenoids and earthnoids. The EF has unfortunately had a long history of neglecting or alienating its constituents; these people can become Zeek followers.

Obviously, they also weren't really making things like colony gassings super public knowledge.

>char
Elaborate.

>>14788327
you mean zeta to CCA?
tomino never went in detail for some reason, but a ps2 game has a good pseudocanon ending for him going lmao lets drop axis

>>14788334
well guess I was trying to read way too much into it.

>>14788350

he just seems too retarded

>>14788362
That's the opposite of elaborating, so I'll give some blanket answers to common Char questions.

0079
>Char fucking hates the Zabis
Zeta
>Char is a sociopath and manipulator, as seen in 0079
>However he is trying to let humanity come to its own conclusions on leaving the Earth
CCA
>Char says "screw it" and decides to throw Axis at Earth, as opposed to letting mankind leave on their own terms.

>>14788318
By that point the Crossbone Vanguard were disbanded, and their leaders (Bernadette and Tobia) were actively leading the Jupiter Republic instead of leaving it to be picked up by another genocidal, opportunistic warlord. Zanscare was initially a friendly ally of the Jupiter Republic in order to help them rebuild, and they staged their war when Tobia and Bernadette were on a manned exploration mission to Saturn. Once they returned and Bernadette learned of what Zanscare was doing, plus the theft of a bioweapon discovered during the Jupiter exploration mission, she ordered Tobia to reform the Crossbone Vanguard and track down and destroy the bioweapon before it could end up in Zanscare's hands.

In fact, Jupiter initially collaborated on building the Angel Halo as an ark to ferry colonists to Jupiter, not be used as a weapon.

>>14788474
This seems a lot different than Victory's Zanscare where it's a front by Kagatie to fuck Earth shit up again.

>>14788480
That's because fucking up the Earth was Kagatie's goal all along, and he was the liaison between Zanscare and Jupiter and lead Bernadette to believe that Zanscare's ambitions were noble and pure-hearted. Remember, Queen Maria was an actual good person and the public figurehead, so it was easy for Bernadette to believe they were doing good. Once the Vanguard got involved though, Tobia quickly got back in a Gundam and started stabbing the stuff that Uso missed.

>>14788497
That's going on Ghosts right?
Gotta pick that up sometime, really digged late UC stuff for some reason
A shame the F91 didn't make a cameo in victory

>>14788556
>That's going on Ghosts right?
Yeah. Translated chapters are only up to a certain point since Zeonic dropped it cause he didn't like it, but the manga itself is actually done.

>>14788578
Thank god i can read moonrunes

>>14788578
Fucking Zeonic faggot.

Fucking why?

>>14788578
>We will never see Seabook hop into the X-0 and wreck shit

>>14788656
>tfw got kinda sad when he had to ditch the F91

>>14785966
>>Do you guys think we need a retelling of late UC?
No we need to stop extending early UC with bullshit to the point where late UC stops making sense anymore.

>>14788656
>>14788662
Wait, Seabook came back and piloted the F91 and the X-0?

>>14788717
No,f91 was junk by the time seabook came back

>>14788717
Nah. He piloted the X-1 though and fought against Harrison Martin's F91, but after Crossbone he retired to raise a family with Cecily on Earth. Tobia is the only person to have piloted every F97 unit that was ever built.

what was the in universe reason that they ditched transforming mobile suits by CCA?

>>14787664
>Antarctic Treaty wasn't in effect, which it still was
How can it be in effect if the Principality of Zeon didn't exist anymore?
Also, didn't zeon use nukes in 0080, breaking the treaty anyway?

>>14788919
I thought it had to do with them being so expensive.

>>14788947
The Lunar cities and side 6 were also autonomous signing members of the treaty and Zeon is still technically independent after the war.

Zeon didn't use nukes in 0080, the guy who was supposed to use them either got captured or surrendered willingly. They did use a nuke in the original series though, but I bet you're a filthy movie watcher where that got cut.

>>14788919
Expensive as fuck

>>14788961
I just have really bad memory, and I was playing one of the G Gen games the other day and the player had to stop nukes.

What happened to the moon race after turn a leading to g reco to make them go full zeon
and how the fuck the MB missed a big ass space tower

>>14788961

Side 3 was independent, but it was independent as the Republic of Zeon, not the Principality of Zeon. With a new government. Not just new leaders, but a new system, since it was no longer run by a single family like a monarchy as far as we know.

>>14788961
>The Lunar cities and side 6 were also autonomous signing members of the treaty
Source? As the backstory goes, only the Federation and Zeon's leaders met in Antarctica for the treaty signing as it was originally a surrender treaty.

>Zeon is still technically independent after the war
The Principality of Zeon is the signing party, and it no longer exists. After the war, Side 3 is reorganized as the Republic of Zeon.

Why does Bask wear a hat that's too big for him?

>>14783902
In the first episode he mensiones the gundams computer is compensating for his inexperience and learning as it goes.

They then take what the gundam has learned and give it to the GMs

Tye learning computer was kind of stupid anyway. It didn't add narratively to the show, it didn't help sell dumb toys, it hardly comes up in-universe it just seems pointless.

>>14789556

It provides a reason for the White Base to go to Jaburo

>>14788327
>what where Loran's intentions? he just seemed to be getting along with everything, drifting with the current.
To end the war and for everyone to get along. When he and his friends were sent to Earth as scouts to determine if it was suitable for colonization again, they integrated into society rather quickly and found jobs they liked, with hardworking and honest people. For the scouts, life was good, and Loran hoped that when the rest of his friends from the Moon came to join them, they'd get to experience the same joys of living on Earth as he did.

Loran has one foot in each door, and doesn't want one side to completely crush the other and hopes that negotiations will succeed.

>>14788947
While they technically don't have to be honored. Treaties as comprehensive as the Antarctic Treaty in real life, like the Geneva Convention continue to be in effect even after the war and a particular nation state ceases to exist or changes governments. Also in the case of the Geneva Convention, even if a signer is at war with a government or group that hasn't signed to the agreement, the signer should still extend the same rights and privileges to any combatants or civilians in war zones they come across. This was one of the major points of contention regarding the War on Terror since the United States has captured members who fight for Islamic fundamentalist groups like Al Aaeda and ISIS, however they argue that they are not a true enemy combatants so they shouldn't be protected by the Geneva Convention which would allow them to torture those individuals.

In regards to Side 6 in War in the Pocket. Zeon would have been allowed to nuke the Side 6 for two reasons. One the more loophole reason that Killing states in that Side 6, while mentioned in the Antarctic Treaty, was never a signing member of it, and thus not protected by it. And unlike the Jupiter Fleet, didn't provide a critically strategic resource for Zeon, so Side 6 had nothing to discourage an attack. But the second and more important reason is that if Side 6 was a signer of the treaty. Their housing of a secret Federation R&D testing facility and the Alex was clear violation of the their neutrality. Both the Federation and Zeon forces were allowed to have troops stationed there, but not permanent bases. (Which is why when Side 6 expelled Zeon forces, you just see their ships leaving.) So by violating their own neutrality by siding with the Federation, while at the same time declaring they are still a neutral party and not a member of the Federation. They find themselves in a no man's land where they now forfeit their protection under the Antarctic Treaty.

>>14790424
>Also in the case of the Geneva Convention, even if a signer is at war with a government or group that hasn't signed to the agreement, the signer should still extend the same rights and privileges to any combatants or civilians in war zones they come across. This was one of the major points of contention regarding the War on Terror since the United States has captured members who fight for Islamic fundamentalist groups like Al Aaeda and ISIS, however they argue that they are not a true enemy combatants so they shouldn't be protected by the Geneva Convention which would allow them to torture those individuals.

That's bullshit. The reality is we can we what we want because we're more powerful. War crimes", despite all the laws we write, are in reality just a way of punishing the loser. Whether you like it or not, war crimes only exist for the defeated. That's why we got away with Dresden and nuking 2 cities that were civilians and not soldiers. It didn't matter, we won, and that's how it really works.

It is an admission those of us who believe in the rule of law do not want to make. That might equals right. At the end of the day, those with the power to inflict physical harm and are victors, are above the law. It means we are not equal under the law. It's why we tortured so many people in the last decade, and what came of it? Nothing, because no one can prosecute a nation as powerful as the US. And when this country eventually falls, then whatever the other side does in order to beat us, they'll get away with it too.

>>14790447
can do what*

>>14790424

There's nothing saying the Antarctic Treaty is a comprehensive treaty that puts a permanent ban on all nuclear attacks by all sides in perpetuity. They were only banned in that one war to stop it escalating any further after there had already been a major death toll, not because those weapons were morally or ethnically reprehensible and were to be banned forever on those grounds like the Geneva Convention's articles regarding treatments of prisoners and civilians. Trying to pass them off as that is highly speculative at best, and in reality groundless.

ITT Feddiewankers vs Zeonwanker

Whoever dindu, we lose

>>14788327
>>14788362
This is why D.O.M.E.'s message really resonates. You're basically like Seidel Rasso in that because Newtypes exhibit new abilities, it creates the belief that they must be the next step in human evolution and not a freak chance off shot. So being told that just makes you think you misunderstood what was said and that all the bloodshed and destruction was being waged because of a misunderstanding and the only thing you should do is move past it all would seem ludicrous.

As for why people followed Zeon, it's what >>14788350 says along with the fact that they see spacenoids who sided with the Federation as just as bad as a Federation and thus, fair game to be targeted. Which was necessary for Zeon to even have a minuet chance of winning a way against the Federation. Also unless you're applying modern media, the average person never see their enemy or the war, so they civilians just follow what they're told and and soldiers just fight who they're ordered to. It's why you had situations in World War I with the Christmas truce where soldiers for both sides celebrated side by side for the day as people. Regardless, the odds of the civilians of Side 3 not knowing about what happened to the other Sides is highly doubtful.

Hell, in the Origin timeline you had Girhen give a speech after Zeon declared war and destroyed Side 1, admitting it was done and saying it was for the greater good for the war effort and people were fine with that. If it was really such an apprehensive crime against humanity, you would see protests from the citizenry as a matter of moral principle even if they are put down, arrested and executed.

>>14790447
Such a callow viewpoint of the world where 'History is written by the victor' is the only law. Let's try and look at this from another angle where you'll be able to understand why a nation that has a clearly more powerful position has it in their best interests to abide by a treaty. In this case, something more nuanced like American politics. In case you aren't an American, the upper house of legislation is called the Senate, there are 100 seats and the party that has the most seats is the majority party and control the business that the Senate conducts. Now the minority party has many options to help stonewall the majority party which was intentional since the government was designed to be slow, deliberate and unless one party had an overwhelming majority, needing some agreement with the opposition to get legislation passed. However the majority party has the option to strip the minority party of almost all their abilities to stymie the majority and they can easily implement it with a simple majority vote.

Now, with that set up, it's time to get to the main point and how it hits the heart of your argument as to why bother to honor treaties when they just punish the loser. The reason the majority party doesn't just railroad the minority and do what they please is because the current majority knows full well in the future, they might become the minority party themselves and if they set the precedent of revoking the rights of the current minority party, that that would be used as justification for why their own rights should be stripped in the future if they find themselves in a similar situation. It's a do onto others as you would do onto yourself. A long term application of the Golden Rule.

Further more it's to set a precedent of how you want your own soldiers to be treated. Yes you can say only the victors matter, but for the most part, the United States hasn't conducted comprehensive campaigns of genocide in the past 70 years and those few incidents where US soldiers razed civilian towns like in Vietnam, saw them tried and punished even if it was within their own system. It's to try and show no one is above the law, but people like yourself and neo-conservatives, want to push that to the breaking point ignoring that sometime in the future, we might not be the super power and the next country that comes out on top might just look at how we acted in the past and apply that to our forces and civilians. Also being able to claim the moral high ground when conducting a war tends to work a lot better when you're not violating the Geneva Convention.

>>14790468
The Antarctic Treaty also covered the treatment of P.O.W.s FYI. Furthermore, you are willingly ignoring the point of precedent where the treaty is supposed to keep people from violating the treaty in the future. A representation of a new Padora's Box for the modern world. The development of the GP-02 was not only the justification for the Delaz Fleet's deployment of the nuke they captured, but because the Federation created a suit with the sole purpose of launching a nuclear weapon, they decided to also use it as a justification for the colony drop since the Federation would no longer honor the treaty. Should the Delaz Fleet had honored the Antarctic Treaty themselves? Probably, but given their situation they had nothing to lose for violating it. Furthermore, in the TV timeline of Zeta Gundam when the AEUG attacked Jaburo and they found out that the Federation deployed a nuke to destroy both the base and the AEUG forces. One of the pilots specifically mentions that using nukes was a violation of the Antarctic Treaty. Keep in mind this was well after the One Year War.

>>14790573

I'm not saying we shouldn't abide by treaties. I'm just saying that if you win, you get the priveledge to just dust yourself off like everything you did never happened.

The Soviet Union was on the side of Hitler at the beginning of WW2. But they switched sides and helped beat Hitler, so regardless of all the shit Stalinist USSR did, there wasn't a single Soviet tried at Nuremburg.

File: Brennus_mg_9724.jpg (2MB, 2912x4368px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 2912x4368px

>>14790573
>Such a callow viewpoint of the world where 'History is written by the victor' is the only law.
Vae Victis motherfucker.

>>14790579

Where is it mentioned the Antarctic Treaty governs the treatment of prisoners of war or that it's has effect in future wars?

>>14790588
That only would apply if you see war as survival of the fittest or natural selection played out on a grand scale. For the most part, the victor is not going to prosecute the vanquished for the same acts that they, themselves committed during the war.

>The Soviet Union was on the side of Hitler at the beginning of WW2.
This is incorrect, they had a non-aggression pact. Meaning they weren't allies, but at the same time, wouldn't support actions that undermined each others respective enemies through supply resources or intel to opposing forces.

>>14790599
That line of thinking worked 2000 years ago when you could wipe a civilization off the face of the planet like the Romans did with the Carthaginians. These days when the art of killing and record keeping have become much more advanced, relying on victor's justice will only bite you in the ass at the end of the day. I wanted to fit in 'Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?' but couldn't find a good way to do it.

>>14790599
The original series when Cozun is captured by the Trojan Horse. Do you guys even watch the series?

>>14790619
>You could always vote to dissolve the other party.
There are so many thing wrong with this statement, I don't know where to start more than take a Civics 101 class. Or read the Constitution and then read what needs to be done to even try to amend the Constitution if your post is going to be 'change the Constitution'.

I've read a lot of ignorant posts, as this is both 4chan and I debate both the left and right on /pol/, And Feddie apologists here but this post is really up there.

>>14790651

All Cozun's interrogation implies is that there's articles laid out in the Antarctic Treaty about the treatment of officers. It doesn't say anything about moral or ethical treatment of all civilians or prisoners of war, which is a different thing and covers a much broader scope and is especially important since the article could be about officers only and providing for prisoner trading rather than done on moral or ethical grounds Nor does it say that anything laid out in the treaty has effect for the foreseeable future.

>>14790651
>That only would apply if you see war as survival of the fittest or natural selection played out on a grand scale.

It's not, it's population control.

>For the most part, the victor is not going to prosecute the vanquished for the same acts that they themselves committed during the war.

They will if the war went on long enough and had a high enough cost, both world wars showed that. At that point it's just retribution.

>'Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

Socrates already answered that, the guardians will be manipulated to guard themselves against themselves via a deception. The noble lie.

>relying on victor's justice will only bite you in the ass at the end of the day.

Yes, but I don't see that day being in my lifetime.

>>14785024
Zeta is a masterpiece.

>>14782704
Did they ever give a reason as to why there was only one space port on Deloyer? You'd think that it'd be hard to manage immigration to a planet with only one space port. Was it to do with the X-nebula?

>>14790750
It wasn't even the interrogation, if I recall correctly right when he had to come out of his Zaku and was held at gunpoint, he said he said he was to be given full rights as a POW as per the of the treaty. Which basically means if you capture a solider, you don't get to kill him or torture him if you want to. Granted there were a lot of violations of that, but it's only a violation if you get caught.

>>14790834
So you have no problem with genocide then if it's seen as 'population control'? I'm just trying to get what your point is. Going to have to ask you to post some examples when it comes to the Japanese then and how the Americans did similar things to the Japs that the Japs did to the Americans and Chinese. Only recent example you might have are the Germans and the Soviets at the end of world war II when the Soviets were out for blood. But for the most part, the Germans who weren't order to defend their line to the death knew to get the hell out of dodge and head west to the Allied forces since they weren't going to slaughter them whole sale even though the British and French would have reason to do so. It's been at least 15 years since I've taken a philosophy class, and just threw in the line out of amusement. It's something to look into at a later date That sort of selfish, short sidedness is a reason why empires fall.

>>14782737

Actually, in Zeta Gundam, during the Jaburo invasion, Roberto states nukes are banned by the Antarctic treaty into UC 0087

>>14798081
Focusing on Thunderbolt.

Make Zeon win.

This is the time for nationalism, not globalism.

You know what I want to know? When they were drawing up the Antarctic Treaty and outlawing weapons that were deemed too destructive, why didn't they outlaw colony drops? Outlawing nukes, chemical and biological warfare is fine, but colony drops are a proven weapon of mass destruction in their time and more devastating than at least nukes individually. Why would they not be outlawed when the others are?

How much of a minority am I in thinking the federation is right in Gundam? I have only seen a bit of Gundam and large parts of my knowledge comes from a friend who adores the series and thinks the colonies are in the right. But it just doesn't make sense to me because this is not like founding a new land.

Literally every square inch of the colonies was made by Earth and is their property, and before the colonies became self-sufficient they were dependent on sucking from earth's teat. This was all done so eventually the colonies would become self-sufficient and start producing on their own so the earth can get returns on their investment and profit/prosper by using them like farms.

So how the FUCK do the colonies have any right to sever that relation now that they can stand on their own after owing EVERYTHING to the earth? Am I really a minority in this opinion?

>>14801479
It did outlaw colony drops. That's why Zeon never did it again during the OYW.

Where do they keep getting the RX 78 new shields? Do they just have a giant storeroom of them on White Base?

>>14783476
which is kinda funny considering that Amuro originally wanted to pull the Zeta out of storage to use against Char, with the Federation denying him for reasons I still don't understand

File: Zanspine_-_Front_View.jpg (50KB, 508x600px) Image search: [Google]

50KB, 508x600px

Does anyone know which of the SD games the Zanspine shows up in? I love this thing and I want to see it in action.

>>14801798
99% of /m/ is feddiewankers (the other 1% is black knight)

And no, the Earth Federation did not build the colonies, people did. people that probably stayed to live on them for the most part. Sort of how while a factory boss technically "owns" his factory and the machinery in it, it was workers who built and use it to make things. The purpose of the colonies was to have a place for the federation to kick undesirables and excess population to so the rich and politically connected could live on Earth longer. The least you could do is give them political autonomy.

(Zabi) Zeon is bad because they basically just want to replace the earth federation elite with themselves and do the same thing and use the legacy of a guy whose revolution they betrayed as propaganda for it.

>>14801888
G Gen Overworld has it

>>14801961
Thanks
Hope it's in the new one too

>>14801798
You're not in a minority at all.

>>14801828
source?

Can someone post a picture of the UC timeline?

>>14801952
>And no, the Earth Federation did not build the colonies, people did. people that probably stayed to live on them for the most part. Sort of how while a factory boss technically "owns" his factory and the machinery in it, it was workers who built and use it to make things. The purpose of the colonies was to have a place for the federation to kick undesirables and excess population to so the rich and politically connected could live on Earth longer. The least you could do is give them political autonomy.
But the thing is those colonies were built using federation resources and labor cost, it didn't just grow from nothing it was made from materials owned by the people of earth and the people who built it were also paid by the feddies. That is their property, you can't have a contractor get paid to build a home and go "hey you know what, this is my house now." I can understand some level of self governing but they want full autonomy and to be a sovereign nation separate from earth don't they? That doesn't fly, they are still living on federation property.

>>14802504
Everyone I know for real have hard ons for the colonies and I've seen a lot of "zeonwank" here so I was confused if looking the federation was some unpopular opinion. Glad to see I'm not the only one who sees it that way.

After my friend showed me a few episodes of zeta it made it much worse since everyone in the colonies, particularly Kamille, seemed pretty stupid or unreasonable and then people like Jerid seemed pretty sensible. But I know Kamille is a special case.

File: 1451243760014.png (3MB, 2196x4032px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 2196x4032px

>>14802951

>>14801952
That's an awfully marxist point, anon, you are a communist?

>>14801798
By this logic Britain should own most of the developed world

>>14802972
This is more retarded than shit you see in the Zelda fandom

>>14802972
Unicorn turning G Gundam is some of the coolest shit ever.

Forever nationalist!

Space America, space Japan, space Russia, not space UN, ok?

>>14783139
>They went all out for the GM III, MK-II thrusters, better armed, stronger armor, etc...

Only for poor Jim 3 to get cucked by Jegan

>>14802976
Britain didn't build the land that their colonies stood on nor did they pump food, water, and other resources into them to keep them alive with the entire intent that someday they would have a symbiotic relationship. Britain literally sent a bunch of people to go colonize on their own while giving them basically nothing from the start. If the colonies were planets that they had to colonize then sure they deserve to be their own, but these are space stations that literally were on life support provided by earth for a very long time.

This is not an island ruling a continent, this is a planet ruling space stations they built.

>>14803102
But in CCA and onwards, it's the Earth who must depend on the colonies for resources.

Shouldn't the colonists own the Earth then?

HEIL ZABI!

File: 1471254616281.png (26KB, 632x517px) Image search: [Google]

26KB, 632x517px

>>14803108
Strange how no one in the colonies has a problem with the federation giving them infinite resources and along for little if not nothing in return. And yet when earth starts talking some resources they suddenly want independence and to break away. Very peculiar...

>>14803130
Duh, just like a child grows up and leaves his parents.

It's only natural.

>>14803133
It's a bit more like a 25 year old living in the attic mooching off his parents going "what do you mean get a job?!"

>>14803137
What? But this 25 year old is practically feeding his parents while his parents say his money and his house belong to them.

>>14803142

Not him, but in that analogy it's more like he's subsidising his parents. Subsidising them doesn't give him ownership of the property, only rights within that property. Which is still something Spacenoids don't have, but is a different goal regardless.

>>14803142
It's more like he refuses to leave and they are asking him for rent since they have gone into debt paying for his education, expenses, and paying for luxuries like cable/internet that only he was using. And it was never his house to begin with he just lived in the attic of their house which he now is trying to claim as his property.

>>14803148
Nope, he's feeding his parents, and even gives them money at part.

His parents are unable to feed themselves now, being too fucking old and incompetent.

>>14803152
What? He refuses to leave?

He's already in a different house, not even the same houses that his parent houses live in.
>they are asking him for rent since they have gone into debt paying for his education, expenses, and paying for luxuries like cable/internet that only he was using
And so he pays them, but enough is enough, you cannot pay forever.

>>14803148
I can understand colonies wanting more representation or some more freedom in self-government, but what colonies want (I guess it's mainly Zeon? Don't know how far the full separatist movement has ingrained in the colonies) is to leave earth high and dry

>>14803159
And what's the problem with that?

Can't Earth take care of itself?

>>14803157
Except it's a house they paid for and are leaving were charging him rent to live there. Suddenly he's like "nah, I've paid reasonable rent for a couple years. I'm not paying anymore."

And his parents are like "but...you haven't given us anywhere near the total value of the house..."

The colonies really come across as spoiled children to me.

>>14803154

There's never any indication Earth is totally dependant on the Colonies though. Even in G-Reco it's just batteries they get from the Colonies. They get some of their resources from the Colonies, but it's only ever indicated as some and not a case where they're completely dependant. So I don't agree.

>>14803169
>Except it's a house they paid for and are leaving were charging him rent to live there. Suddenly he's like "nah, I've paid reasonable rent for a couple years. I'm not paying anymore."
He's not only paying the rents, he's feeding them and providing for them when they come to visit.

>And his parents are like "but...you haven't given us anywhere near the total value of the house..."
Well, he has paid for more than enough. Even his parents don't want to leave in their house anymore, they want to live in his house.
>The colonies really come across as spoiled children to me.
Yeah, sound like time to kiss these children goodbye then, they have grown up.

>>14803162
Except the colonies were made specifically with the intention of eventually being a supplier to earth. They aren't robbing them blind and leaving them impoverished space slaves, they are just using them like farms and splitting the crops. Was earth supposed to just build a prosperous series of space station, spend years building it up into some futuristic utopia, and out of the goodness of their heart be like "you're free now!" What kind of retard puts that time and effort in for nothing? They literally did it with a deal laid out and suddenly the colonies want to not even alter it but drop it altogether.

>>14803170
There doesn't need to, but in CCA and Unicorn era, Earth's population hugely decreases and the pollution is getting too fucking much that people willingly migrate to spaces.

By this point, if Earth can't even feed itself, it's Earth's problem, is it?

>>14803177
The colonies was made for solving overpopulation though.

>What kind of retard puts that time and effort in for nothing? They literally did it with a deal laid out and suddenly the colonies want to not even alter it but drop it altogether.
Because it makes no sense to help the Earth anymore, the majority of humanity live in colonies now.
It's the Earth that is being a parasite.

What's up with Dancouga's combination? More than 75% of Dancouga is Big Moth, the body, shoulders, arms and legs. It's one of my favorite robot designs, but the combination is pretty much just Big Moth putting on shoes and a hat.

>>14803178

What do you mean they don't need to? In a discussion based on whether they get all or only some resources from the Colonies, showing they felt some if that's your stance is certainly necessary.

Neither CCA or Unicorn established that people were moving to space because of dwindling resources from what I remember. So I'd be interested in seeing your proof if they did.

So you f Earth can't feed itself, then prove it. Because the impression I've always gotten is that it can feed itself fine, but gets subsidised resources, mostly materials like ores, from space.

>>14803194
I don't need to prove it, because if Earth can feed itself then it doesn't need the colonies, thus the colonies are free to go.

But if Earth can't feed itself, it's a parasite worth giving up on.

>>14803200

Uh, yea you do - because the line of argument isn't about whether Earth should own the Colonies simply because they need their resources, but because they funded them on every level. The question of resources is to establish how equal the relationship should be, not a binary choice on who should be in charge.

>>14803208
So because Earth funded them on entry level, they got to rule them forever?

By this point, I guess we shall be free if we build our own colonies using our own resources right?

>>14803208
To my knowledge the earth federation was also taking surplus supplies, never taking enough that it actually interfered with the lives of colonists. If they could have maybe dialed a bit back, maybe open a dialogue with earth who often is depicted as being very reasonable about maybe instituting themselves more as proper state or member of the federation so they could self govern, argue a little lower on taxation, and gave proper representation among the federation.

But nope, instead full independence/sever all ties with the federation and break free on property made for and by the federation.

>>14803222
Because the colonies have no need for Earth, they have become fully sustainable.

>>14803215
>By this point, I guess we shall be free if we build our own colonies using our own resources right?
Yes actually, if the colonies requested to build new colonies from only colony resources as a means to being a sovereign nation that stands separate from the colonies and the federation that would be a reasonable request. You don't just tell your landlord "I own this apartment now."

>>14803228
Yeah, we should focus on building our own colonies then.

Of course, let's not involve any EF so they don't claim b-b-but these new colonies are still built by ours!

Zeonic Colony Builders project is a go!

>>14803225
If you live in a building owned by someone else that charges you rent but you pay all other bills on your own do you have a right to secede and claim that the property is yours now and you have no obligation to pay them anymore?

>>14803236
If I end up feeding the landlord and even house him, yeah, I guess?

I can even buy the house owned by him, like Char did in CCA.

>>14785076
Dont reply to yourself

>>14803233
At least the new colonies wouldn't be something the EF had any reasonable claim to. The problem I gather from Gundam is literally the unnecessary level of elevation that came from this strife between earth and the colonies which was mainly caused by Zeon who just wants to be the leaders of new space federation and get to live as the top dog.

>>14803215

Also not what I said, but thank you for that melodramatic over-exaggeration. Earth funded their construction as well as the maintenance and running costs of all of the Colonies for years, including building new ones when most were destroyed in the One Year Wsr, so they're entitled to a cut (re: subsidy) of them for at least a certain amount of time as per the original intention . If the Colonies want true freedom from Earth, then the way to do it is by showing consistent independence, using politics to establish a time table for hand over of power and maintaining those political relationships - not demanding absolute freedom out of nowhere and throwing the house you live in at your parent's house if they don't comply.

>>14803242
This strife is the core, Zabi idealism aside.

The colonies are the future, the Earth is a parasite holding it back, this is why in Turn A, the colonies end up leaving Earth to rot.

My preferred outcome is G Gundam, where every nations got their own colonies that mirrored their earth nations, instead of the shitty Spic EF.

>>14803240

That's a nice idea, but you've not only failed to show any proof you're feeding and housing your parents, you've said doing so is unnecessary. Despite it being the crux of your argument.

>>14803240
You DO feed and house your landlord. You are his source of money as good tenant.

Do you have any idea how land and property ownership works? The only way you can buy out property from someone is if you purchase it directly from the bank they are mortgaged to because the bank owns the loan used to pay for the house. If you purchased the bank or the debt you can strongarm them out of the property and make it fully yours. You can't just make an apartment yours just because you don't wanna pay your landlord anymore.

>>14803244
Nah, my preferred method is Full Frontal's method, forming a Colony alliance and sanctioning Earth to death, while moving further and further from Earth.

Those earthnoids do not deserve a single lick of resources, want them? Work for them.

>>14803247

And then the new nations make Earth a shit-hole battleground and trample anyone living there. Also, the Spacenoids may have left in Turn-A, but we have no idea whether doing so was a good idea and the remaining Spacenoids in both Turn-A and G-Reco wanted back because long term life in space was so shitty.

>>14803249
There is no need to.

Because as said:
- if my parents need my money to live, they deserve to be given up, I have no sympathy for parasites
- if they don't, then I'm free to leave

>>14803256
>And then the new nations make Earth a shit-hole battleground and trample anyone living there.
What's the big deal then, it's just Earth.
>Also, the Spacenoids may have left in Turn-A, but we have no idea whether doing so was a good idea and the remaining Spacenoids in both Turn-A and G-Reco wanted back because long term life in space was so shitty.
They can freely go back to being mama's boys, but I'm not staying.

>>14803260

They did leave. In 0079. And none of their siblings were willing to join them. For which they killed their siblings and then attempted to kill their parents and take their house, consuming what resources they did have in the effort.

Which gives great confidence in their ability to self govern and be independent.

>>14803250
I am living in rented apartment actually, but yeah, sound like it's either to buy the colonies or build your own colonies then.

It's fine either ways, each way, the Earth gets fucked.

>>14803260
Plenty of people have careers around opening property and leasing it out to tenants. Are they parasites who aren't needed and all landlords should be thrown out putting all tenants of those properties as the owner?

Do you think that's how the world works?

>>14803266
And?

We still do not need them, and the more they bother us, the more we will fight them.

We can fight forever, times are on our sides.

>>14803270
Landlords exist for poor people to rent houses.

If I'm not poor anymore, it's time to build my own house or buy a house for myself.

>>14803267
I haven't seen a lot but main UC timeline earth federation, don't know about the rest, seem really fucking reasonable. I think they would take to this well or at least discuss it for those who truly desire independence.

>>14803279
It's not like they have a choice.

We outnumber them, and we have more resources than them.

If they start shit, they will get crushed, and this time for real, we are not like the stupid cartoon villains Tomino wrote.

>>14803273

Time didn't do you any favours if Turn-A and G-Reco are any indication. The and though is that throwing a tantrum and attempting to take everything by force, hurting almost everyone else in the process after being given the independence you asked for is childish.

>>14803285
In Turn A, the spacenoids left, only some remain.
>The and though is that throwing a tantrum and attempting to take everything by force, hurting almost everyone else in the process after being given the independence you asked for is childish.
If asking for independence is childish, then so be it. When a child is grown up, it's time for him to have his own life.

>>14803283

You sound remarkably like a stupid cartoon villain though.

>>14803289
I just don't need to act like one.

You will find much people sound like cartoon villains in real life, but they are actually successful, because this world isn't written by some hack authors.

>>14803288

Asking for it isn't. Throwing a tantrum when it isn't as nice as you envisaged and you want subsidy is. Also, again, we have no idea how the ones who left fared - so positing it went well with no proof is premature. You seem averse to the concept of proof though.

>>14803292
We don't need to ask.

When a child is grown up, he doesn't need to "ask" to leave the house, he can just leave.

>Also, again, we have no idea how the ones who left fared - so positing it went well with no proof is premature. You seem averse to the concept of proof though.
They can all die, but that's still better than rotting in Earth.

>>14803290

The ones who act like stupid villains are usually only successful because of someone else's efforts though. Like a parent leaving them a fortune so they don't really have to do squat beyond talk about it.

>>14803283
>We outnumber them, and we have more resources than them.
>If they start shit, they will get crushed, and this time for real, we are not like the stupid cartoon villains Tomino wrote
But YOU sound exactly like a cartoon villain. They didn't "start shit" they reasonably are collecting resources like taxes, they only take surplus they leave enough for colonies to live their lives. That is pretty reasonable of the people that literally built the ground you walk on and supplied your colonies with EVERYTHING for decades.

Who are you, Kamille? There was no need of an escalation to severe violence. A just attitude isn't means to jump a fence and punch someone in the face. That's called being a savage not a human being.

>>14803302
And? They are still successful and free from their parent's control.

>>14803296

Literally just said they don't need to ask. And then continued that leaving before asking for subsidy because you don't like your new independence and want both at the same time is childish. Also, saying that death is preferable to living at home until you're mature enough to stand alone is a hilariously childish statement.

>>14803304
They do not deserve jackshit actually.

If they want the stupid colonies, we will drop them back to Earth while we build our new ones.

>Who are you, Kamille? There was no need of an escalation to severe violence. A just attitude isn't means to jump a fence and punch someone in the face.
If they do not grant us independence, then we make our own independence.
>That's called being a savage not a human being.
A savage is a human being.

>>14803296
>When a child is grown up, he doesn't need to "ask" to leave the house, he can just leave.
Yeah but when the child moves into their parents other house, calls it their own, and says fuck off to the notion of rent that's when there's a problem. The colonies have yet to grow up, they are still children of earth. Unless they move to a colony they built themselves then the reasonable tax on their excess resources is entirely just.

>>14803309
>And then continued that leaving before asking for subsidy because you don't like your new independence and want both at the same time is childish.
What? Who asks for subsidy? I'm even down with buying the colonies or building our new ones.
>Also, saying that death is preferable to living at home until you're mature enough to stand alone is a hilariously childish statement.
The colonies are already mature though.

>>14803306

> take daddy's money
> use it to be successful
> act like it was all their own work and daddy can die because he didn't do shit
> not a stupid cartoon attitude

Is that you Donald?

>>14803310
>A savage is a human being.
Not a civilized one who should be respected nor one who can make proper decisions that affect the lives of others.

You sound like a teenager who just discovered anarchy.

>>14803311
As said, I'm down with building new colonies and drop the colonies built by EF back to Earth.

>The colonies have yet to grow up, they are still children of earth.
Not anymore, they aren't, they are completely sustainable now.

>>14803314
I wish I'm a presidential candidate, but I ain't. And I don't hate my parents.

I just hate the EF.

>>14803316
Doesn't change the point, a savage is still a human being.

Respect is to be earned, not to be given, and I don't need it to be given by the corrupt EF.

>You sound like a teenager who just discovered anarchy.
Or an adult who found out he doesn't need his parents anymore.

>>14803317
>drop the colonies built by EF back to Earth.
What a belligerent and childish thing to do just to spite someone who thought the logical idea of you need to pay rent to live on their property. Do you think a squatter when vacating land they weren't paying to live on has the right to smash in the actual owners head in with a brick, too? Because that's what your childish mentality implies.

>>14803312

Zeon wanted subsidy in the form of access to all trade and not being locked out of established trade once Earth gave them the independence they demanded.
Also while you state you're down with building your own colonies, no Space power in Gundam ever did it. You also sound as mature as a 6 year old who still wets the bed and wants a story before bed. Even if you are mature though (and you don't sound it), the colonies have certainly never demonstrated maturity and independence.

>>14803328
Well, they want the colonies they built back don't they?

So I give back them.

I once saw someone post on /m/ that the Zeta doesn't have good atmospheric performance, which always struck me as odd when you have the oddball designs of the Titans compared to the relatively tame flying-wing looks of the Zeta.

I'd like to know if such a remark is true, and, if it is, whether it's relative to the later Zeta variants (in which case it would make sense) or if it was a comparison to other in-show Zeta designs.

>>14803329
So basically, you are calling the colonies kid.

Unfortunately, that's not for you to decide. The colonies can think for themselves.

We have grown up, and we can leave. If you want to stop us, we will crush you.

And no, if I'm on board and this isn't written by a hack like Tomino, then the EF will be gutted through economic war and then a full blown war.

>>14803331

Actually, all they want is reasonable return on investment and rent from people living on them in the form of tax, subsidy etc. Want them back is just your pithy corruption so you can make childish spite in to retribution.

>>14803336
They do not deserve jackshit and I will give them jackshit.

If they want everything to be returned to them, fine, I will return to them.

We will build new ones, stronger ones and finally leave you EF to play with sand.

>>14803335

Actually it is for us, as the viewers to decide, since it's a sociological question and we are the society it's aimed at. And threatening to kill someone if they try and stop you by way of reason or doubt is a very childish attitude.

>>14803331
So it's a reasonable human thing to do caving in the skull of your landlord like in that scenario i mentioned before? Casually starting a war is something despots do, not reasonable humans who are doing what is right or just. You sound like a child going "if I can't have it no one can!" except instead of just breaking or leaving the toy you are trying to KILL the actual owner with it. This is the behavior of a spoiled child.

>>14803341
You viewers should stick to viewing then. You have no authority over me.
>And threatening to kill someone if they try and stop you by way of reason or doubt is a very childish attitude.
If they stop me from getting my independence then they deserve to be destroyed. Childish or not.

>>14803337

Again, no one asked for it to be returned. That's all your twisting so you can make spiteful comments. Also, you can build your own if you want, but you still have to pay as long as you live in your parents while building your own.

>>14803342
It's reasonable to give them back what they given to us.

And we are not "casually" starting a war, we ask them to let us leave, if they don't, then we destroy them. There is nothing casual about that.

>This is the behavior of a spoiled child.
Sound like time for the spoiled child to leave and experience the real world then?

>>14803344
>Also, you can build your own if you want, but you still have to pay as long as you live in your parents while building your own.
Down with that too, if they let us leave peacefully then we leave peacefully.

We will build the colonies then fuck off outta here.

Enjoy your Earth, earthnoids, because I sure as fuck don't.

>>14803343
No one has said you can't have your own independence, just you can't take what isn't yours and say it is now and demanding everyone fall in line with that. You are not being reasonable, you are just committing theft. This is the equivalence of someone justifying their bank heist because they wanted to be rich and they were going to kill anyone that got in their way of taking the money they decided belongs to them.

>>14803350
But as said, I have said I'm down with building my own colonies to fuck off this place?

>>14803346

Except the landlord didn't cave in your skull, so what are you returning? Also, you're not asking for independence and then starting a war when you don't get it according to 0079. You're asking for it, being given it, then asking for help being independent and then starting a war when you're ignored. You were being shown the real world and started throwing a tantrum because you didn't like it.

>>14803346
>It's reasonable to give them back what they given to us.
When the fuck did they GIVE you anything? They allowed you to live on their property with the expectation that you would reimburse them through rent (resources) and you agreed on this. You are just now going "no! I don't want to pay rent anymore! This apartment is mine now!"

Do you honestly not see how unreasonable this is?

>Sound like time for the spoiled child to leave and experience the real world then?
But you aren't leaving, you're just trying to steal property.

>>14803355
Except I don't operate on 0079 logic here, I only play Zeon as a part of spacenoid independence, I don't give a shit about Zeonic NT theory or the Zabi's ambition

All I want is to get out of this dodge and get independent.

>You were being shown the real world and started throwing a tantrum because you didn't like it.
In the real world, when an empire breaks up, the warlord just keep the land, not giving jackshit to the empire.

>>14803357
What the fuck?

I have said that I'm willing to build my own colonies to get out of this dodge.

>>14803352
Except the colonists never do this, you are using that mentality to justify them stealing the colonies. You then topped it off with suggesting dropping the colonies on earth. This is not reasonable behavior this is belligerent behavior more close to being an animal then a civilized human being.

>>14803360

Let's operate on your logic then. You aren't a warlord independent on a former Empire, because the Empire is still going strong and just doesn't care about you since you left. Now you're out in the cold and have no trading partners because you left with such a shitty attitude. You're independent, have fun.

>>14803361
And even then, this is just me playing nice.

If I get a Colony Alliance up, the EF has no way to enforce their rules over the colonies.

In which way, we can steal them and they cannot do shit.

>>14803364
Dude, when you have the upper hands, you can afford to be "unreasonable".

In fact, why be reasonable at all, winners write the history.

In fact, I don't see the point of playing to this game's rules. I can just make my own colonies, assemble my fleet and take the old colonies to me, and drop the old ones to Earth, and the EF cannot do shit.

>>14803365
That's fine, we have our independence to live all we want, that's the premier goal in life.

Not trading partners, not any big empire forcing us to do what we don't want to do.

>>14803369
Then the EF nukes you to hell and back. EF cares about not destroying the colonies they built so they never tried to destroy it and did everything in the vacuum of space. They don't give a fuck about your colony and if you openly are attempting to mutiny their colony or just straight up conquer it they are going to use their full space fleet with the intent of destroying you.

An island picking a fight with a planet is not a smart battle

>>14803377

Actually, the premier goal in life is survival. Then procreation. Freedom is at best third on the list and only becomes a reasonable goal once the other two have been satisfied.

>>14803378
Dude, they can nuke us than we can nuke and colony drop them back, we have space superiority.
>if you openly are attempting to mutiny their colony or just straight up conquer it they are going to use their full space fleet with the intent of destroying you.
Then we will fight them, along with other colonies of the Colony Alliance.
>An island picking a fight with a planet is not a smart battle
Nah, history has shown the size with more mobility and resources win, this is how England manages to conquer so much.

>>14803381
We can survive and procreate fine by ourselves, no need for any empire.

In this case, freedom is reasonable.

>>14803383

It certainly is when you just ignore anything you don't like and just pretend you have magiced all problems away by giving yourself new colonies, a definite alliance, a large fleet and so on. By the way, I just magiced them all away. And then magiced you in to a black hole. And then put that black hole in a trash can. And set it on fire. And threw it in the sun. Does it make any sense? Doesn't have to - I said it and that's all that's important apparently.

>>14803392
Not really, a colony alliance is entirely possible, unless the EF plays foul.

The reality is that the majority of humanity live on colonies and the colonies can amass much more resources than Earth, there's no fucking reason we should let some fuckheads on Earth determine our laws and government.

The EF might have a strong space fleet, but if every sides start war against them? It's fucking over.

>>14803382
You just built your colony, what notable military might do you have. If they SEE you building some massive fleet anywhere near the size of threatening them don't you think they might go "hey there sport, watcha think youre doing there?"

And why would the colonies side with you when you want to do the same thing and have them join you bringing a nebulous fate promised by a loon that thinks colony drops are okay? Just because they grew up in space just like you doesnt mean they think the same way or that they find this reasonable. You literally just sound like Zeon, just as crazy and unreasonable as them who didn't give a fuck about the colonies but just were selfish pieces of shit who wanted to be top dogs and started a war that didn't need to be started.

>>14803397
>You just built your colony, what notable military might do you have. If they SEE you building some massive fleet anywhere near the size of threatening them don't you think they might go "hey there sport, watcha think youre doing there?"
Just improving my Side Defense Force, mister.
>Just because they grew up in space just like you doesnt mean they think the same way or that they find this reasonable.
Out of economic reason, there's no reason at all to play nice with the EF, this tax we pay to them could be used to improve the colonies instead.

>You literally just sound like Zeon, just as crazy and unreasonable as them who didn't give a fuck about the colonies but just were selfish pieces of shit who wanted to be top dogs and started a war that didn't need to be started.
Unlike Zeon, I do not have ambition for Earth, all I want is spacenoid independence, free from some earthnoids telling how we should live.

>>14803396

And the reality is that no Spacenoid force has ever successfully started an alliance. When Zeon left no-one wanted to join them and they killed all of them out of spite and/or fear. Full Frontal spoke about one, but never indicated anyone actually wanted to join him and Zanscare had to conquer other Sides using force if I recall.

It's okay though I guess, since that reality is just a hack writing and you can make up your own using the facts that same hack established until everything is just as you'd prefer it.

Winning arguments is so much easier when you just pretend reality is what you want instead of what you get.

>>14803403
In real life, Alliances are formed out of necessity and out of economic reason. Even the infamous 2nd Reich and 3rd Reich have allies.

It's not like in Gundam, where Zeon acts retarded and pisses off everyone else, and nobody else joins.

>>14803410

And in reality those alliances tend to form around stable economies and leaderships. Neither of which describes you. Again though, it's handy that you don't have to take either this reality or, more importantly, that of Gundam, and instead just make up your own that suits you and debate from there, changing it as necessary to win.

>>14803415
Uh, I believe if I'm in charge, I will have a stable economy and leadership.

Economy-wise, mining space rocks and building rockets and ships as export sound like a nice trade, as well as exporting foods.

leadership-wise, just suck ass to the EF when I meet them, but get closer and closer to the colonies, telling them the truth (we don't actually need the EF guise), while building my network of trade and SDF.

The EF is fucking incompetent, the only thing that keeps them in power is that Zeon is written so they will lose since it's a cartoon show.

>>14803419

I pike how people always go "Zeon are just written to lose cause it's a cartoon", while ignoring the converse "they're only written to be a threat cause it's a cartoon" and "the EF are only written to job and have issues because it's a cartoon".

Also the first three words in your post basically describe your whole position. You're just making up or assuming whatever suits your current argument so you always win. The messy business of proof or reality is for other people.

>>14803419
MS-wise, just suck up to Anaheim and licensed factories there.

But instead of making MS, just make space planes with beam rifles instead.

>>14803401
>Unlike Zeon, I do not have ambition for Earth, all I want is spacenoid independence, free from some earthnoids telling how we should live.
What if the colonists, who didn't sign up to leave with you in the first place because of personal agenda or ideals/values that don't line up with yours, don't want to join you? What if they proceed to not only not join you but then tell the Earth "hey that crazy guy who built the independent colony is trying to recruit us to mutiny and leave the EF if not also then attack and destroy the earth."?

What is to stop your fellow separatists from going "hey I want my independence from you because you have black hair but I have blonde hair. I demand to live on my own colony or else I will kill you because I won't let done black haired scum tell me how to live!" Or some equally arbitrary reason they want to dethrone you and run things how they want because you are"different" from them?

>>14803426
It's not even arguable that Zeon is written to be stupid & evil at the same time so they lose.

Do you remember how their HQ is like?

>>14803432

It's also not even arguable that the EF is only written to be problematic so as to ensure Zeon have some validation. Do you know how fiction works?

>>14803431
>What if the colonists, who didn't sign up to leave with you in the first place because of personal agenda or ideals/values that don't line up with yours, don't want to join you? What if they proceed to not only not join you but then tell the Earth "hey that crazy guy who built the independent colony is trying to recruit us to mutiny and leave the EF if not also then attack and destroy the earth."?
If they don't want to leave, I'm going to find factions that want to leave and work to get these factions to replace the ones who don't want to leave. If they try to tell the EF, I'm just gonna ask for proof, which they have none.

>What is to stop your fellow separatists from going "hey I want my independence from you because you have black hair but I have blonde hair. I demand to live on my own colony or else I will kill you because I won't let done black haired scum tell me how to live!"
At that point, I'm gonna sell to them colonies so they can have their own realm.

Space is big, there's more than enough place for everyone.

>>14803419
>Economy-wise, mining space rocks and building rockets and ships as export sound like a nice trade, as well as exporting foods.
Who the fuck are you exporting to? The only societies are you, the colonies, and earth. You gonna KILL one of your TWO possible business partners? You are proposing an idealistic fantasy land free of repercussions from your actions, everyone thinks the way you do, and economies run on good intentions and magic.

>>14803442
The EF is written as incompetent as a shade of gray, but Zeon is writing as stupid evil so people will think EF is the lesser evil.

Good thing the japs don't give a shit about the EF.

>>14803449

Except the Japanese and you apparently think that Zeon is the grey. That couldn't possibly be the intention though. You must be seeing something the writer never intended because you're just so damn cool I guess.

>>14803445
I can sell to both of the colonies and Earth.

All of this is to make both sides rely on MY space rocks and MY rockets while extending my trade network.

I will intentionally favor the EF's side while telling the colonies that the EF forces me to because they are too afraid of the colonies having better trade logistics, to make the colonies hate the EF even more.

In truth, I don't need the EF nor the colonies, our colonies are perfect survivable with our nuke energy, our solar green houses and space rocks.

>>14803444
>If they don't want to leave, I'm going to find factions that want to leave and work to get these factions to replace the ones who don't want to leave. If they try to tell the EF, I'm just gonna ask for proof, which they have none.
Because earth is going to trust the separatist leader more than their trusted political figures they have known for years through diplomatic and trade agreements?

>At that point, I'm gonna sell to them colonies so they can have their own realm.
>Space is big, there's more than enough place for everyone.
What if they don't want to wait decades for their own colony? What if they want one now? What if they want YOURS? What if they are as spiteful as you since they are equally xenophobic and untrusting as you are and decide to kill you or blow up your colony after leaving or declare war on you?

You have to be taking the piss at this point. I don't know if you are the first guy who genuinely was defending the childish mentality of the rebellion or you are another person who is bored and playing devil's advocate.

>>14803458
>I can sell to ... Earth.

Wait, I thought you wanted to drop colonies on them and wash your hands off the Earth Sphere?

>>14803455
The japs have never given a shit about Zeon's idealism, they just like honorable pilots and cool ass pilot suits, and the fact Zeon resembles space nazis/space imperials.

I myself have never seen Zeon as grey, except for a couple of honorable characters.

Tomino is a shitty writer and he's meant for Zeon to be fucking evil.

>>14803458
What makes your space rocks and rockets magically better? The fuck does earth care if the colonies supply them with rocks and rockets for free and the colonies are self sufficient. Why would they PAY you?

>>14803461
>Because earth is going to trust the separatist leader more than their trusted political figures they have known for years through diplomatic and trade agreements?
Earth is going to demand for proof, because I can say it's proof that the colonies are trying to make an alliance and oust me from Earth, possibly for independence for something.
>What if they don't want to wait decades for their own colony? What if they want one now? We can give them some.
>What if they want YOURS? What if they are as spiteful as you since they are equally xenophobic and untrusting as you are and decide to kill you or blow up your colony after leaving or declare war on you?
Then we feign victim, ask for other colonies' help and start a defensive war against them.

>You have to be taking the piss at this point. I don't know if you are the first guy who genuinely was defending the childish mentality of the rebellion or you are another person who is bored and playing devil's advocate.
Or he just realizes spacenoid is superior to earthnoid.

>>14803463
After we have built up our forces and have the upper hands.

Never let money be wasted.

We are gonna let them pay for our rockets and then give them back the colonies, muhahaha.

>>14803463

Nah, he's just changing his mind every post so that he always has the perfect reality and perfect solution to the latest problem and never has to argue from a stable position and certainly never has to give proof or think about the actual reality of the universe as presented in the various shows. That shits hard. Bashing skulls in is easier. Or making alliances. Or building new colonies. Or whatever his latest stance is.

>>14803471
Because they are sold cheaper and have good to decent quality with good marketing.
>The fuck does earth care if the colonies supply them with rocks and rockets for free
>for free
I can tell the colonies about this. Because there's no reason why the colonies should get anything for free.
>and the colonies are self sufficient. Why would they PAY you?
Some colonies are closer to Earth, thus they lack the ability to mine resources, and logistics is always a big thing everywhere, if I can offer them decent rockets that transport rocks at a cheap price, that would make money.

>>14803477
You are asking how I'm able to have stable economy and leadership and I'm giving you the reasons.

Of course, and I love the bashing skull part, which I have never said at all.

After all, it is better to just colony drop/nuke them.

>>14803473
>>14803482
You are working under fallacious logic that anyone should or would listen to you. You have a history of anti federation sentiments to the point you pushed for breaking away to your own colony. No one is gonna trust you.

>>14803495
Actually, the thing I'm gonna say to them is:

Hey guise, the EF is getting free shit when we are working our shit off to mine space rocks, and now they are forcing me to sell you more expensive rockets, because they don't like you guys trading with each other.

No, not anti-federation at all, just pro-colony.

>>14803485

You're not giving reasons actually, you're just assuming they'll be there because you said a few pretty words and then ignoring the concept of proof because you don't like it. Also you've implied willingness to hurt a landlord several times, including hitting him in the skull because you don't like the concept of rent and want to take revenge against him for asking for it in return for accommodation.

>>14803505
Well, I'm proposing to you my ideas of how to ruin the EF shit up, actually, starting from economy war to full blown war if they decide to not play nice.

Proof-wise, in CCA, you can see the extent of pollution and people jumping to space en masse, in Unicorn, everyone agree that the colonies have more people and resources on Earth. From an economic point of view, this means Earth is obsolete.

>Also you've implied willingness to hurt a landlord several times, including hitting him in the skull because you don't like the concept of rent
A lot of shit has been said, can you point me to where I said that?

>>14803503
Yeah but they found your secret diary that says your true plan which has your signature, fingerprints, social security, and your mother's maiden name it a written statement on every page declaring you wrote this. They also have photographic and video evidence of you writing it and 30 people saw it. Also when you said these things the colonists revealed their "I <3 earth" tattoos they all independently got on their own accord and team up with the earth in a giant mech for peace. The colonists and feddies all are wearing class 4 armor, as we know the highest of armor, and anti mind control helmets and jump you in the bathroom where they proceed to give you wet willies and swirlies before throwing you in a black hole.

No backsies, no erasies.

>>14803509
>in Unicorn, everyone agree that the colonies have more people and resources than Earth. From an economic point of view, this means Earth is obsolete*

>>14803512
Well, at that point, I have no choice but to enjoy some quality time in another dimension, ain't I?

>>14803509

The only reason people are going to space en-masse in CCA is because Char is using the Earth as a rock garden. Unicorn also never says the Earth is obsolete or even close to it. That it is getting subsidy from the Colonies, yes. That it depends on them, no.

Also you're making suggestions, but you're not providing any kind of context or proof for any of them, just asking they'll work perfectly. And then papering over the cracks of doubt with new suggestions that'll all work perfectly too.

Also, >>14803346 at the very least. And any post talking about dropping colonies. Especially ones written in spiteful language about just returning what they want.

>>14803130
>>Strange how no one in the colonies has a problem with the federation giving them infinite resources and along for little if not nothing in return
The entire point of the colonies is to reduce the human strain on the Earth's resources.

Zeon Deikun and Char wanted everyone to leave earth permanently, they don't need the Earth.

"colonies are dependent on Earth's resources" is a meme first used by zeonwankers to justify invading Earth and adopted by feddiewankers to justify Earth's political supremacy over the colonies.

>>14803529
>The only reason people are going to space en-masse in CCA is because Char is using the Earth as a rock garden.
So you are saying every civies know of Char's plan of dropping the Axis.
>Unicorn also never says the Earth is obsolete or even close to it.
Unicorn says that there is more people and resources on colonies than on Earth, that means Earth is obsolete already because the colonies are already sustainable without Earth.
>Also you're making suggestions, but you're not providing any kind of context or proof for any of them, just asking they'll work perfectly.
They would not work perfectly, it's very expected the EF to play foul because they have a fucking task force against separatist, but considering how incompetent they are, as long as I play the businessman game, no one would know shit, because Gundam is still a cartoon universe.
>And any post talking about dropping colonies. Especially ones written in spiteful language about just returning what they want.
Well, they built the colonies for us right? I'm just gonna return the colonies right back to Earth.

>>14803532
It is true that colonies need a headstart at the beginning so Gihren was right in 0079.

But after that? Nope.

>>14803540

Yes, even citizens know Char dropped Luna II. The explosion was probably hard to miss. They also know he was still at war with the EF during the parts where we see people leaving Earth.

Also, having a smaller population doesn't make you obsolete. I'm not sure you understand what the word means despite repeated use of it. Or you do and are very vindictive and petty. Both are reasonably good bets.

Taking a business approach also doesn't guarantee success, as Frontal shows. Especially when add in a propensity for violence and revenge like he had and you've displayed numerous times.

>>14803557
>Yes, even citizens know Char dropped Luna II. The explosion was probably hard to miss. They also know he was still at war with the EF during the parts where we see people leaving Earth.
Dropping colonies happen from 0079 to CCA, but more and more people leave Earth, in Unicorn, it's clearly shown the planet's pollution gets worse and worse.
>Also, having a smaller population doesn't make you obsolete.
No, but the colonies being sustainable means the Earth is obsolete, it means they don't fucking need the Earth anymore.
>Taking a business approach also doesn't guarantee success, as Frontal shows.
Frontal hasn't even put his plan into action, he requires the Laplace's Box.
>Especially when add in a propensity for violence and revenge like he had and you've displayed numerous times.
Ha, you don't know many businessmen in real life, that's for sure.

>>14782704
I may not pay attention to it. But what happened to Anaheim Electronics? Why did they stop making Gundam in the late UC era? Because the F91 series were made by SNRI and i dunno who made Victory

>>14803597
Anaheim made Victory Gundam, V2 and the LM's grunts.

They only died with the EF's dissolution.

>>14803580

People also could have left because of the drop in 0079. We don't know, since it's just not shown one way or the other. There's less point in doing it when other Colonies themselves are embroiled in a war like in 0079 though, since you're not moving to a place of greater safety. After one week a lot if the Colonies didn't even exist making it impossible.

The Colonies not needing Earth any more for resources also isn't the same as Earth being obsolete. That's not what the word means. Especially when Earth is not only the one who paid to construct them, but pays the running costs, maintenance and security of all those Colonies too, along with setting up and helping guarantee the trade that keeps those Colonies prosperous. One of Zeon's grievances in 0079 was that without the trade the EF provided they were less than. We don't know how much less than, but we know they wanted it.

Frontal hadn't put his plan in to action, but he also didn't have any support for it that we know of. It was just an idea. And while businessmen are petty, most of them don't celebrate a win with violence, or fall back on violence as an immediate secondary plan should even one thing not go their way like you've indicated a desire too. Most would rather fall back on intimidation and economic brutality rather than physical brutality really.

Anyone has the Votoms series guide. i just finished the regular episodes and i am wondering what to see next.

>>14803604
I got a feel like they aren't as exposed as back during the Gryps War and the Neo Zeon (1st and 2nd) Incident.

File: 1474637477895.jpg (183KB, 918x917px) Image search: [Google]

183KB, 918x917px

>>14803633
I gotchu

>>14803626
>People also could have left because of the drop in 0079. We don't know, since it's just not shown one way or the other.
It's undeniable that humans are becoming more and more rare on Earth, and they are leaving for the colonies.
>The Colonies not needing Earth any more for resources also isn't the same as Earth being obsolete. That's not what the word means.
Same shit, it means the Earth is old and busted and not needed anymore.
>One of Zeon's grievances in 0079 was that without the trade the EF provided they were less than. We don't know how much less than, but we know they wanted it.
This is in 0079, we are talking about 0090s and above, where it's undeniable that the colonies have surpassed Earth.
>Frontal hadn't put his plan in to action, but he also didn't have any support for it that we know of. It was just an idea.
Dude he has a plan, and him getting the Laplace's Box is the way for him to get support.
>And while businessmen are petty, most of them don't celebrate a win with violence, or fall back on violence as an immediate secondary plan should even one thing not go their way like you've indicated a desire too.
Ha ha, it's fair to say you don't know shit about economic warfare.

>>14803639
thanks anon.

>>14803642

Actually it is deniable, since we don't have population numbers for Earth and have no idea what the immigration scene looks like. Also, having less resources isn't the same as obsolescence, nor is the ability to provide your own the same as self sufficiency. I'm leaning towards you just not knowing what the word means.

The Colonies also haven't surpassed Earth in trade in the 0090s. They may have by Victory, but even by F91 that seems unlikely. Never mind surpassing Earth entirely.

Oh, and you have no idea what economic warfare entails ny the sound of it, since you think having a plan guarantees success and that surpassing someone in resources is equivalent to surpassing them in trade, if not outright. So yea, I'm not going to take your doubt seriously. Frontal didn't need the box for success or even for support. Even in show he only wants it to gain time, but he could certainly gain support without it given he's been planning all this with a while given the depth of his support in Palau. That's the one place he has support though. No Sides care about him or his plan.

>>14803669
>Actually it is deniable, since we don't have population numbers for Earth and have no idea what the immigration scene looks like.
As confirmed in Unicorn, there are more people on the colonies than on Earth, coupled with the increased pollution on Earth.
>Also, having less resources isn't the same as obsolescence, nor is the ability to provide your own the same as self sufficiency.
What? The Earth is old and busted, the colonies ending up giving them resources means the Earth is obsolete and useless to the colonies.

>The Colonies also haven't surpassed Earth in trade in the 0090s. They may have by Victory, but even by F91 that seems unlikely. Never mind surpassing Earth entirely.
The colonies has become fully sustainable by fucking Unicorn, as they can maintain larger population WITH more resources than Earth.
>Oh, and you have no idea what economic warfare entails ny the sound of it
Economic warfare entails real warfare if the other side loses its economy, as seen when Japan is sanctioned by the Allies and attacks Pearl Harbor.
>Frontal didn't need the box for success or even for support.
Well that's wrong, because he needs the Box to blackmail the EF and brings the fact the EF has corrupted the original Charter and hiding it from the colonies.

>No Sides care about him or his plan.
Most of the world do not even know of his plan to even care for it, being that he didn't put the plan into action.

>>14803704

> As confirmed in Unicorn, there are more people on the colonies than on Earth, coupled with the increased pollution on Earth.

Which is an empty statement when you consider that there were more people in the Colonies than on Earth in 0079 too. Even before the One Year War. Unicorn never says whether more people have moved off Earth to the Colonies, only that the same is true after 17 years.

> What? The Earth is old and busted, the colonies ending up giving them resources means the Earth is obsolete and useless to the colonies.

No, it means the Colonies are worked as advertised, since they would have been built with the expectation of tithing some of their resources to Earth. The Colonies still depend on Earth to build new colonies, repair existing ones, provide security and guarantee trade. One of which we know Zeon couldn't do on it's own despite apparent independence.

> The colonies has become fully sustainable by fucking Unicorn, as they can maintain larger population WITH more resources than Earth.

They were also self-sustaining in 0079. And as soon as Zeon seceded, they wanted in on the EF's trade. Which meant that they couldn't be independent regardless of resource sustainability.

> Economic warfare entails real warfare if the other side loses its economy, as seen when Japan is sanctioned by the Allies and attacks Pearl Harbor.

I think you need to check what economic warfare is, because what you've described can more accurately be described as just "warfare", with no economic element at all. One side losing their economy isn't economic warfare, since one side going broke is basically the goal of warfare. Economic warfare is when two sides try to use their economy in lieu of actual force to decimate each other.

>>14803796

>Well that's wrong, because he needs the Box to blackmail the EF and brings the fact the EF has corrupted the original Charter and hiding it from the colonies.

No, he wanted to bribe the EF using the original charter so as to gain more time than 4 years before Zeon became part of the EF again and to gather an alliance. He lays that out in episode 6 or 7. The only reason he wanted the box is for bribery, not support.

> Most of the world do not even know of his plan to even care for it, being that he didn't put the plan into action.

Unless you're supremely confident in your plan you look for support before putting your plan in to action. Even your own plans above, like >>14803419 involved building a trade network in secret before launching anything openly. Frontal had no reason he couldn't have looked for support, because making connections and alliances pretty much always comes before launching an alliance.

/r/ing that Gundam guide image, please.

>>14802972
This thing confuses me.

why does the hyaku shiki have different types of eyes?

File: head-robot-hyaku-shiki-gundam-60515380.jpg (35KB, 300x450px) Image search: [Google]

35KB, 300x450px

>>14804191
forgot image

What happen to Banagher and Mineva after Unicorn?

I saw some information about Riddhe and the Unicorn/Banshee but there's nothing on Banana and Audrey.

>>14805532
I like to believe they relaunched the Vist foundation and spent their years yelling at the various non-Zeon factions that rose up to try and conquer shit.

File: BP8.png (1MB, 1680x1050px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 1680x1050px

>>14804191
>>14804207

It's a Nagano thing. The L-Gaim and Brains also have that funky interface going on in their eyes too every now and then.

But for the Shiki specifically, that's just its scan mode visor.

>>14805578
scanning mode? anyway i wanted to know because im picking up the kit and i thought it looked cool. didnt remember it from zeta

Did the dude arguing that the colonies had the right to do what they want because they can beat the federation just happen to forget that Zeon lost the OYW?

Was the Nu Gundam just for show?

File: IMG_1051.png (699KB, 1136x640px) Image search: [Google]

699KB, 1136x640px

Why didn't you guise warn me about this before I watched it? It's fucking hilarious

>>14805798
well technically the sazabi was more revolutionary. but it lost to nu gundam, so it wasnt just for shoe like the hyaku shiki

> Post questions that don't really deserve their own threads.

Why don't edgy roleplayers that wany to pretend they live on a colony in the UC go back to gaia?

File: Unicorn Full reason for plan.jpg (173KB, 1268x708px) Image search: [Google]

173KB, 1268x708px

>>14803796
>>14803800
So I rewatch episode 6 and let's hear it from Full Frontal himself.

File: Unicorn Full reason for plan 2.jpg (168KB, 1268x708px) Image search: [Google]

168KB, 1268x708px

>>14806870

File: Unicorn Full reason for plan 3.jpg (158KB, 1268x708px) Image search: [Google]

158KB, 1268x708px

>>14806874
So yes, Earth now requires the resources of the colonies to even live.

File: Unicorn Full reason for plan 4.jpg (164KB, 1268x708px) Image search: [Google]

164KB, 1268x708px

>>14806879

File: Unicorn Full reason for plan 5.jpg (125KB, 1268x708px) Image search: [Google]

125KB, 1268x708px

>>14806883
So unless Frontal is lying (even when everybody is fucking buying it), you just gotta accept the Earth is a dependent entity now.

File: Unicorn Full reason for plan 6.jpg (115KB, 1268x708px) Image search: [Google]

115KB, 1268x708px

>>14806892
Regarding spacenoids.

File: Unicorn Full reason for plan 7.jpg (126KB, 1268x708px) Image search: [Google]

126KB, 1268x708px

>>14806901

File: Unicorn Full reason for plan 8.jpg (159KB, 1268x708px) Image search: [Google]

159KB, 1268x708px

>>14806909
This economic war would have choked the EF and force them into a desperate fight, where they will lose because they lack manpower and resources.

>>14805674
Zeon lost in the OYW does not mean colonies are not superior to Earth, it just means Gihren Zabi was retarded in his Earthly ambition when he could have stayed in space and colony drop all days.

>>14806917
>colony drop all day
Because colonies grow on trees

File: Unicorn Full reason for plan 9.jpg (122KB, 1268x708px) Image search: [Google]

122KB, 1268x708px

>>14806917
While your post regarding buying time is right.

File: Unicorn Full reason for plan 10.jpg (143KB, 1268x708px) Image search: [Google]

143KB, 1268x708px

>>14806925
There's absolutely no hurting if Frontal decides to use the fact the EF corrupted the charter to gain support from the colonies and the moon.


>>14806924
We can build new ones, or even live in asteroid or other planets.

File: Unicorn Full reason for plan 11.jpg (141KB, 1268x708px) Image search: [Google]

141KB, 1268x708px

>>14806927
HAIL SPACENOID INDEPENDENCE

DEATH TO THE EARTH FEDERATION

WE SHALL DROP AND DROP UNTIL THE EARTH IS BLUE AGAIN

>>14806927
>We can build new ones, or even live in asteroid or other planets.
Because doing so doesn't take time and resources while having extremely finite space is fucking your population up and can lead to crime/famine/riots/etc, right?

You know a lot of people aren't gonna take kindly to someone saying "you know your home? Well hear me out, we are going to drop it onto the struggling earth people of this timeline so we don't have to give them our surplus of resources you never saw to begin with."

>>14806990
Dude, by Zeta, we have fucking people living in Jupiter.

>You know a lot of people aren't gonna take kindly to someone saying "you know your home? Well hear me out, we are going to drop it onto the struggling earth people of this timeline so we don't have to give them our surplus of resources you never saw to begin with."
Don't worry, dude, we will move your houses to a new asteroid, which is stabler and has a shitload more resources.

>>14806994
What if, I don't know, for some reason they DON'T want to be uprooted for your petty fight that didn't concern them or affect them? What if they point out you are encroaching on THEIR freedom and independence?

>>14806994
Or colonizing Mars like Mars Zeon did.

>>14807005
I'm just gonna tell them by economic means, you can objectively have more land, resources and a stabler life if you just sell me this colony right now.

>>14807013
And if they refuse due to sentimental value and the fact that all their needs are met, plus they don't see the need of doing a colony on a struggling society out of spite over surplus resources?

>>14806994

> people living in Jupiter
> move you to an asteroid
> forgetting that every asteroid we've seen in Gundam has had worse living conditions than most any Colony
> unless you're one of the rich elite living in a mansion
> oh, but only the EF have elites, Spacenoids wouldn't dream of that

Your plan has some pretty glaring faults.

>>14807024
At that point, it's a heartfelt talk about how the EF is keeping us in chains.

If they do not agree, I shall be looking for other colonies, or just shoot asteroid to Earth instead.

>>14807026
My dream is spacenoid independence, not a fight against any elites.

It is better for humanity to spread all over the galaxy and not be chained down by Earth.

>>14807040

> Feeding you, housing you, rehousing you whenever Spacenoid Movement during Journey destroys your colony, providing free services like cars to all citizens and making your home an idyllic garden
> equivalent to chaining you

>>14807055
I'm sorry but we have paid back to you enough.

It's time to get out.

>>14807045

The glaring fault in that logic is the same one Char had: just because you can colonise the Earthsphere or other local planets in really strict and uncomfortable ways doesn't mean you're even close to having a method of colonising the galaxy and not only is Earth not holding you back from researching and building those methods, it'd probably help you explicitly and is certainly helpful implicitly by providing a safe and definite living space that is comfortable while you try and find a way to go beyond the Solar System. Char thought having some Lagrangian colonies was equivalent to extra solar exploration. Char was an idiot.

>>14807066
It doesn't fucking matter, we need to try.

The EF cannot hold us back, the same logic holds, when we grow up, we must leave our mother's womb and make a name for ourselves.

So now, time to go.

>>14807057

Yea this isn't even about some monetary payback, thus is questioning why anyone would have a sentiment of being chained up in the first place given what the EF provides, for free, to everyone in a Colony. Especially compared with average life on Earth from what we're shown.

>>14807076
EF doesn't provide shit, the colonies are supplying the Earth now.

It's time for earthnoid to own up and work like everybody else for their existence.

>>14807073

I never said you couldn't or shouldn't try since you apparently can't read, only that the EF isn't holding you back by any measure and you can do all that while in a colony with no issue.

>>14807085
If the EF is holding us back then it's time for us to go then.

>>14807084

The Earthnoids do work though, and contrary to your extremely narrow view provided a lot. Including the actual colonies themselves. Denying that is just a bizarre denial of reality and does your argument no favors. Especially when your argument of "we've paid back enough" relies on a central conceit of admitting they did something worth paying back.

>>14807089

Again, they're not actually restricting research in any way or holding you back at all. So saying if they are then whatever is an empty statement.

>>14807091
If the earthnoids do work, then they should capable of sustaining themselves, no need for us.

>Especially when your argument of "we've paid back enough" relies on a central conceit of admitting they did something worth paying back.
They did provide for us when we were starting up, but we have grown up now and we have paid our fair share, now it's time for earthnoid to leave us the fuck alone.

>>14807094
As said, if they are not holding us back, then it's time we leave the colonies to colonize Mars and other planets and then spread further and further.

>>14807096

Isolation has never done anyone any good. Nor any society. It certainly did Zeon no good. Also, you keep demonstrating a faulty understanding of, well, everything. Getting resources from elsewhere doesn't imply you are doing no work.

>>14807097

The EF have never stopped anyone from leaving anon. So again, let's stop pretending they are restricting your research in to extra galactic living.