What are /lit/'s thoughts on nicholas carr's the shallows?

I tried to read it but I kept getting distracted and shitposting on 4chan instead.

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>>9898804
lmao great banter

I enjoyed it. It wasn't as alarmist as some others ( Lanier or Birkerts, whom I actually like).

>>9898797
He's right, but what are we supposed to do? You can't live completely disconnected from the internet in the 21st century.

>>9898797
Haven't read it yet, but judging from the title I probably will at some point. Though I'm not into this idea that The Internet does something to people. I'm more in the line of, what are people doing to their brains by using a computer interface in the manner that they do, given that that interface is biased to be used in such a manner. If it's anything about technological determinism, I'm in - though there tends to be less treatment of how this process works and more moralising bullshit about the dangers of tech - cause that's what people want to hear.

>>9898804
fpbp

>>9898835
He actually addresses these issues. Gets into some of the neuroscience.

>>9898835
See this

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/brain-hacking-tech-insiders-60-minutes/

>>9898852
Well, guess it's time to just fucking kill myself then familam

>>9898848
Ok. I'm interested in the intentional problem of how we force adaptations to manage tools, so I don't know if that will be enough because I don't know how much science deals with intentionality. Thanks.

>>9898852

>http://www.cbsnews.com/news/brain-hacking-tech-insiders-60-minutes/

Hahaha. This is like an expose on the dangers of caffeine for people who already have high anxiety.

The reward function isn't going to automatically rewire your brain unless you have no capacity for critical thought, or more accurately critical aversion response to the technology that you are aware has an effect on you. This is just something I made up, but it does work in practice. You aren't programmed, you have critical awareness, and if you are feeling repercussions from a drug or a tool, you need to change your habits.

But don't tell me drugs can't be used wisely if they are structured with a proper intent by the user. The tech is not the problem, the people with no critical ability are the problem.

Oh by the way...this might be a paranoia shout out to the great overseers by the way - making life jump from one area of expertise to the next with subtle slices and dices, or clicks and hits. I first tried not to care too much about the constant surveillance, then I became sexually attracted to it, and now I can live with out either it or some laughs.

>>9898804
kek

>What we find is the typical person checks their phone every 15 minutes or less and half of the time they check their phone there is no alert, no notification. It’s coming from inside their head telling them, “Gee, I haven’t check in Facebook in a while. I haven’t checked on this Twitter feed for a while. I wonder if somebody commented on my Instagram post.” That then generates cortisol and it starts to make you anxious. And eventually your goal is to get rid of that anxiety so you check in.

I'm not sure this is an accurate description of what is happening.

>>9898797
its ok, but they should have hired a better actress to play surfer girl in the adaptation

>>9898959
>you need to change your habits.

lol that's like saying hey man, you want to quit smoking? just change your habits. ;)

>>9898959
>you need to change your habits.

No shit.

>>9899021

It`s a simplified take of the problem indeed. How would you improve it? I do precisely that (checking stuff constantly) but it's not an explicit thought like "Gotta refresh /lit/" or anything like that, it's much more akin to other bodily stuff like scratching.

>>9898797
>facebook deploys ai to distribute content
>ai seeks to maximize engagement
>decides highest form of engagement is outrage
>actively seeks to cultivate outrage in all users

>>9898797
How many of these (((neuroscientists))) and (((cognitive psychologists))) do Americans have?

the attention merchants is much better if you want a critique of the internet

>>9898959
This cbs piece is neat, it's obvious when it comes to game industry but for some reason I didn't think about it too much outside of mobile gaming - when transferred to the very sphere of cell phone usage in general.

So dopamine craving can indeed be construed as a race to the bottom of the brain stem. Constant bells and whistles distracting us (and I don't mean plebeians) from adequately questioning what the elites do.

>>9903882
as many as the market requires :^)

>>9898804
reddit tier """joke"""

>>9898797
The movie last year was better

>>9903195
At root it's a question of willpower. If you can't handle it on your own, seek help

>>9904435

Aristotle was right again. Start with the Greeks.

the internet is a tool, and it's been a meme since the dawn of technology that every tool be scrutinized for its "effect" on humanity, when really it's that man, in his infinite curiosity, cannot help but see the world differently, through the lens of the tool's potential. i.e. fire changed what forests symbolically meant, writing changed what communication and preservation of information could be, etc. etc.

yes the internet is being exploited by capitalists, just like every other technology. people are no worse for the wear, yet we still must suffer the doomsayers until the next revolutionary technology provides a unique prism with which to see the world through. and the capitalist dog that wrote the book in the OP is playing the game as well by baiting passerbys with scandal by using a term like "THE SHALLOWS"

>>9904529
What exactly does a "scandal" like this do to help capitalism?

>>9898959

>you need to change your habits.

That's pretty much what Carr says. He goes on for a while about 'plasticity' saying how the human brain can adapt both for and against to changes in behaviour. He advocates personal responsibility as a way of coping, not disavowing technology altogether.

Although, it's true that we as humans tend to have to replace one thing for another. I think Freud says something to that effect too. You can't just stop doing something and replace it with nothing. If you stop smoking, you need to replace that behaviour trait with something akin to not-smoking (ie jogging).

I think the issue with technology (internet) is that nothing comes close to the speed of it and that's it's difficult to switch, at least initially.

>>9904975

>If you stop smoking, you need to replace that behaviour trait with something akin to not-smoking (ie jogging).

This, by the way, is illustrated perfectly in Wong Kar Wai's 1994 arthouse film, Chungking Express, where the character Cop 223 narrates to the audience about how he goes jogging every night to forget about his former lover. He says that his body uses up so much water through sweating that he no longer feels the need to cry. And so on and so on.

>>9903278
You're not wrong

>>9904529

only non-garbage post itt tbvh ham

>>9905047

Carr uses the term 'shallows' to describe a form of shallow thinking, which is perfectly in-line with that cbsnews article posted above says.

Read the book kid and stop posting shit on /lit/.

Carles is the best writer about the internet. It's too bad he deleted his website

>>9904411
Let's be honest it would have +100 if you could upvote. Too many people here are plebs.

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>>9903195
>>9903232
>>9903259
>it's much more akin to other bodily stuff like scratching.

Fucking sly reference there my friend. The future is frightening isn't it, though in more of a one eyebrow raised sort of manner.

-

Physical addiction to nicotine is difficult to overcome, and sometimes easier than physiological addictions which are rooted in habits that for some become akin to sacred rituals. To break an internet "addiction" you need to leave the monastery, go to the desert, and talk to the devil about why you want to change your religion. If we are physically addicted to anything it is information, and because that is the air we breathe, we need a better climate and better lung capacity. The current people raised on tech are doomed to their subservience, but in a comfortable, pleasant sort of manner that has nothing to do with strive towards conflict.
-
>>9903913
>>9904435
>>9904975
>>9904529


Metamodern was one term for the routine of post-irony when it was seen as the new Hip to be square. But welcome to the new cold war inside your head. Bang your drums with your tribe. Ride the plastic, inflatable tiger on each wave of attack. Crash onto the virtual beaches of Normandy and play out scenarios while your life stagnates into a reassuring paranoia that if forgotten leaves you with land, soaking wet and needing a medic. Push those boundaries to their edge. You can go no further. You are calm. You are tranquil. Make the best of this d-day. Stuttering into oblivion, domesticity, and glorious outrage during moments primed for hate. Make sure your hands are clean. Do a good job. Hear what people are saying to you. Praise the market place of ideas, praise the sacredness and possibility of innovation. Push your boundaries to the edge. You are calm. You are tranquil. This is your modern ephoche.
The world has never changed. We have never been modern.

The Internet is something other than any of us have imagined, and better

>>9898804
Don't worry, you can think of yourself doing empirical research.

>>9898797
Doesn't go too dark on the actual problems. Should have mentioned Nick Land and his engame to actually scare people.

>>9905317
Hey man maybe you should try to quit life?