How does one live authentically? What does it mean to live

>>9885412
It means acknowledging the fundamentally socially bound nature of all choice and action while at the same time remembering one's capacity to reject whichever social current one is riding at any given moment in order to choose another to which one might be better suited for any given reason. According to Heidegger at least.

>>9885412
Good question, anon. I want to give a better, more detailed answer, but if I had to take a shot at it right now, I'd say that living authentically consists of preserving what makes you "you" no matter the circumstances. In other words, holding on to a sort of inner freedom even when all the shit external to you makes you bend to its will.

Anyone got a good Authenticity reading list? I've read some Heidegger and Sartre, and I hear Fannon is also a good place to look to, but I want more.

>>9885412
in general, living in accordance with your nature, not pretending to be something you're not

>>9885436
for heidegger it is our nature to be embedded in the world but also always able to transcend that world

>>9885445
watch this docu
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEUl_z5tyHA
camus was authentic as fuq

it means not to think

>>9885449
Yeah exactly re: Heidegger - all action, even rebellion against the social, is a socially determined route. And yet, at the same time as one is fundamentally "crowd-like" in one's given-ness to one's self, in acknowledging the social fabric through which one must move, one is able to "switch threads" so to speak, so that one needn't follow whatever social impulse one is currently bound too to its end if it becomes something unresonant with one's 'self' - social determination without social compulsion might be a way to sum it up.

Don't be a poser.

Just be yourself, dont try to be anybody else
Its literally that simple idk how you can not understand this

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in order to be authentic man must first be, but man as one ordinarily finds him is not, he has no being.

>>9885455
this is pretty enjoyable, thanks anon

>>9885412
patrice o'neal is a good example.

>>9885501
redpill us on gurdjy, where to start w him

i disagree with most of the posters here saying "just be yourself", real authenticity is authenticity against oneself. we are each, individually, our own greatest obstacles toward being authentic. authenticity requires a constant state of revolt against oneself, and vigilance against the inner-tyrant

Get into Taoism

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>>9885553

>>9885556
Memes are awful

>>9885533
there's a russian documentary called "i am gurdjieff i will not die" that's a good place to start. if you can find it with english subs, it's hard to find though. it should be up on piratebay. otherwise read ouspensky's "in search of the miraculous"

>>9885533
also read this essay buy julius evola
https://www.counter-currents.com/2011/08/mr-gurdjieff/

>>9885412
Stick to your guns, but keep a loose grip with your off-hand, so you can still shake a hand or give a pat on the back.
Make sense?

>>9885561
Dost thou forget thy locale?

>>9885561
It's fairly accurate though. The whitewashed pseudo-Daoism most Westerners adhere to isn't based on scriptual tradition, just whimsical New Age fancies about Eastern "spirituality".

>>9885436
This in combination with
>>9885534

>>9885595
Just ironic that memes appear in a thread about authenticity. In my mind they're the complete opposite of it.

>>9885596
The original New Age actually is actually pretty worth looking into. It's been made fun of for like three decades now, but OG New Age is probably one of the most authentic subcultures around.

>>9885618
>OG New Age
are you talking about blavatsky type quakery

auth rhymes with goth

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>>9885622
Nah I mean like late 70s, early 80s stuff. The hippies who evolved after hippiedom got subverted

>>9885628
care to name any individual authors?

>>9885630
I've only really been exposed to it through New Age music and Stewart Brand's earlier writings before he sold out.
This might be a good place to start though:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Potential_Movement

I guess I should also augment my earlier statement about it being the late 70s-early 80s. I've tended to view New Age as basically the more mystical/philosophical elements of the Psychedelic movement.

>>9885445
carles is essential

>>9885457
Succinct and correct. Nice anon.

>>9885648
>carles
who?

>>9885533
I was reading Ouspensky's Fourth Way because it's a compilation of what Gurdjieff taught his students.
I think Beelzebub's Tales to His Grandson is also a good book

>>9885532
yup

>>9885671
>I think Beelzebub's Tales to His Grandson is also a good book
it's not an easy book, really it's only meant for people who are involved in the Work

I'd say follow all of your desires until you the cconsequences are unbearable; at that moment, you commit suicide.
After that, there's no regret or pain.

>>9885711
>you
ignore this

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transcend yourself

>>9885711

Renunciation of worldly desire is the way out, and you get to live a rich satisfying life too.

Why the fuck would you want to be authentic in the sense of uniqueness, being yourself, etc? There's words used to designate people like that. Autists, mad and nut people, retards, that kind of name.

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Dedicate yourself to Christ, die in Him, the only truly authentic man, the absolute man, the image of God incarnate, and through His grace you will be raised into authentic personhood.

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just be yourself bro

>>9885812
t. cattle
mad people are the ones who bring forth substantial change

>>9885590
Unfortunately it does...

>>9885818
My dick has died the little death Inside of Christ one thousand times and he screams 'daddy! daddy!' as I bonk him

>>9885412

Drop Camus. He's a sophist brainlet

>>9885916
wow quality post, haha sexxxxx cum toilet vagina! cuck sexual cock in butt

>>9886025
Thank you :D

>>9885412
How dare one live authentically?

>>9885916
You need to go back to Mexico

>>9885412
It means being stupid enough to believe you have a true unchanging self to which you can be authentic.

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>>9885871
Hahahaha,
ok, there's a POSITIVE way to look at that, and NEGATIVE way to look at it.
.
>if we look at + , we may not need guns one day, unless ABSOLUTELY necessary
>if - , wellĺllll, we're already kinda THERE, aren't we...

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>>9886072
indeed man has no unchanging self, man has no soul, but through persistent effort and conscious suffering it can be acquired―if one is sufficiently clever

Don't fall for fr*nch memes. They've been LARPing as r*mans since they were imperialized.

Existentialism is such piss.

>>9885556
>Thus it is that, were the superior man to speak of his way in all its greatness, nothing in the world would be found able to embrace it, and were he to speak of it in its minuteness, nothing in the world would be found able to split it.
what did he mean by this

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>>9886177
Everything the " juntzi" (supreme gentleman) does is the standard to be followed. If he calls something great, nothing greater is conceivable, if he calls something insignificant, nothing more insignificant is conceivable. The supreme gentleman is followed in everything.

>>9886189
>Everything the " juntzi" (supreme gentleman) does is the standard to be followed. If he calls something great, nothing greater is conceivable, if he calls something insignificant, nothing more insignificant is conceivable. The supreme gentleman is followed in everything.
Truth

>>9885412
maintain integrity

>>9885866
No, I'm not, you are, for you think it's cool and daring to be "unique" and "authentic". You have obviously never been there. It's something dangerous and devastating. "Being yourself", "being authetic", it comes with all kinds of setdowns. Have you ever spoken to someone insane? Some who is nuts? Mad? Crazy? Who has hallucinations? Who just doesn't operate in the normal human spectrum? Someone who screams, rolls on the floor, that kind of thing? Nobody in society wants those people, not even their own families who gave them birth. Nobody who will love them, comfort them, understand them, help them, all because they're just being different from others, they become unwanted, annoying, inconvenient, a burden, someone who should be eliminated. Do you know what happens to the unique kids of preschool, the ones who are being "authentic"? They get bullied so hard that they develop irreparable psychological traumas, often ending up as the aforementioned example of insane individuals in the mental wards of hospitals. With all being said, society has no place for those who are authentic, unique. It just doesn't want it. If you truly behave in an unique or authentic way, you'll be deprived of your most basic necessities, even food and shelter, not to mention everyone constantly hating you. It's a defense mechanism, it happens in nature too. Do you understand what I'm talking about? Do you recall experiences about what I described? No? Then you're not authentic, you're just a stupid, pathetic, disgusting, teen ager, trying to develop some kind of identity, so, as I already said, YOU are the cattle. Your natural response will be to disregard this reply in a way or another, which would only further give basis to this thesis.

>>9885466
this, unironically. don't label yourself and play to your label. (which you probably do)

>>9886246
are we supposed to read all those words?

>>9886246
Good post.

There is no unchanging self to find, you'll be looking forever.

>>9885449
This sounds like an excuse for never developing oneself.

Like, "I'm a lazy fat assed bitch and that is just how I roll. No need to work even if I could evolve through it."

>>9886351
it sounds like that because you're a dumbass

>>9886592
I bet you smashed them all in the Debate Club.

>>9886597
fat bitches? hell yes

>>9886600
quod erat demonstrandum

Ride the Tiger

>>9885553
quality post

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Dionysian Appollonialism

>>9885412
Realise that you are a puppet of mimetic desire and that trying to live "authentically" puts you at a worse disposition to actually do so.

>>9885412
Just know urself

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>>9885412
You have begun the way of living authentically by asking such a question my dear Dasein.

>>9886633
Adam and Eve knew not their nakedness till they ate of the fruit―but we have already eaten of the fruit, my friend, and we must learn to live with the consequences somehow.

There was some guy at my gym that I saw there several times that reminded me of someone. Later I realized it was Camus.

>>9885412
Striving to live authentically ensures that you will never live authentically.

>>9887096
We must forget the fruit for we cannot live authentically till we have forgotten.

>>9885677
is the work some self help bullshit

>>9885412
To live an authentic life you must, in order:

-Always be honest with yourself
-Always be as honest as you have to be to others (I.e., don't lie but don't speak whole truths either in scenarios where it isn't needed)
-Clearly define your ambitions from your desires (you're ambitious to get home and write 1k words, but desire to smoke a bowl and relax)
-Work. Work at your ambitions hard and honestly. Begin using desires as 'treats' until you no longer desire them.
-Once wholly true to yourself can you be true to others.
-You're now living an authentic life. You may now enjoy: less anxiety, less existential dread, little to no self loathing, effortless love and care of others, an honest sense of pride, clear consciousness.

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>>9887375
self-help? it can be helpful for some, for others it can be very dangerous. see the essay by evola here
>>9885585

>>9885412
not an important question. Those who are authentic are so not by conscious will. If you're authentic you won't know it, if you aren't you will. Move on losers.

>>9885412
Isn't that just being honest with yourself? What you want and what you enjoy?

>>9887416
ive read the evola essay. i might have trouble asking the right questions, but can u plz just explain what u mean. why would it be dangerous? do you do the work yourself? what do u think od it? etc, etc

>>9885677
>>9887375
>the Work
what is that?

>>9885532
I miss that fat negro

>>9885412
authentic living is the biggest fucking meme of all time. i would have less of a problem with the phrase "authentic living" if it was used to mean a moral lifestyle (if this is your question then there are countless philosophers who've written about morality) but when people talk about authentic living it's usually people that get their panties in a bunch over privilege-talk. i.e. if you were born with a silver spoon in your mouth and rarely had to struggle physically/financially then you're not living "authentically". this is almost always espoused by people who have been demoralized by the propaganda that was pumped into them throughout their adolescence. they feel bad for those with a less-privileged lifestyle (as one ought to, naturally) but they take this to the extreme by either 1. dramatically changing the course of their lives so as to attain (artificially) a less privileged lifestyle by aligning themselves with authentically-less privileged people (transgenders seems to be the most popular atm) or by 2. becoming social and political advocates for the type of change that would bring about an equal amount of privilege across the board (i.e. marxism)

Authenticity is a metaphysical superstition.

>>9885412
oh its this thread again

not very authentic

>>9885457
but what if you are an authentic thinker and authentic while you are thinking

>>9886246
You have some reason in what you say, but it's a very reductionist way of understanding authenticity. First of all, you are talking mostly about those who are born different (llunatics, children) but there are also those more or less normals who want to develop their autenticity, and this is not such a dangerous and chaotic process. Second, «authenticy» is not a sinonimous of «originality», I believe one could do what everyone else does but in an authentic way, because for me being authentic means «to do something because you actually want to do it» , and this definition is not exclusive to crazy people. I think one needs to read a lot and be very self conscious and critical to somewhat achieve this tho, so not everyone can do it.

You are right about the «society bullying different people», but but being authentic doed not mean being externally different.

English is not my first language, so sorry if there are some mistakes in my text.

>>9885412
living the way your ideal self would, but avoid doing so for lack of or fear for x

>>9885436
>>9886156
Fuck, these two scare me the most. That the soul IS made, and that it is made by and within some social current rather than some McLullan sailor within the maelstrom. Instead persistent effort and conscious suffering, it is built up in our retaliation against certain choices and actions, and we may not even know why. We're damned to have no individual will outside of the group except in the most mundane ways. And that we can become self aware to some omniscient degree and take on the world as Uber-lords is to fail to acknowledge the necessity of choices and actions within the social current.
>>9885458
This to me is from someone who needs to presume that social determination isn't arbitrary? Does Heidegger talk about how selection would work? Does the "unresonant with one's self" mean disgust with aesthetic appearances, or does it mean a biological resonance with what is good for the self?

It isnt possible to live inauthenticly
Anything you do is authentic because you did it.
Being a poser and pretending. To be someone your not are very human things to do. If they weren't why do we see humans do them and with such prevalence.

Someone's gonna have to help me figure out what y'all are talking about B.C. To me inauthenticity doesn't exist

>>9889539
These fools think they got a soul, and this soul has qualities

>>9885445
This. A good starter kit mixing philosophy works with literature pieces would be useful.

>>9890357
Sometimes metaphors work well in place of (X) to denote something that is vague such as an interdependent complex system. Most people know already that no one talks about the soul with some archaic attachment to seventeenth century philosophic debates. You're not even aware of the straw man you've built.

>>9891928
I'm using soul as a metaphor too. No straw man to be seen

>>9891936
That's the not aware part I'm talking about. I think you might not understand what others are talking about when they say soul, because they're talking about something that is vague and ill defined to the point that they have to use the metaphor soul to define it; and so it doesn't make sense to make fun of them for thinking they have one. Whether or not it has qualities is irrelevant except to your definition of what you believe they think is their soul - a straw man.

>>9885412
if you can't even define what is to live authentically by yourself you probably doesn't deserve to
tl;dr kys

>>9889539
It's not meant literally. People are by nature authentic because they always act according to their values, assuming they aren't insane. What people mean by "living authentically" is (usually) that you need to think about and understand what it is you truly value. Most people go through life without actually examining their own values. Often their values are full of contradictions and inconsistencies that could be rectified if they actually thought through them. So if you do that and find you really do value pretending to be someone you're not, then that's fine, you're now living authentically. But if you find that you don't value pretending to be someone you're not, then it would not be living authentically to continue to wear a mask.

I have had the most inauthentic childhood and adolescence imaginable. Is there any way to recover?

>>9891552
bit of a problem since art is artifice by definition. what feels authentic differs from culture-to-culture, time-to-time.