why are there so many religious people on this board? I'm

Right? Haha stupid religious people, I agree we should go to reddit where our fellow atheists are enlightened by their own intelligence and not by some phony god's blessing

Paragraphs start with capital letters. 'I' should always be capitalised.

I think the religion is mostly just people taking the piss, but there is something to be said for the antidepressant quality of rejecting a wholey material worldview.

>>9737376
Why does this bother you?

I'd love to stick to /a/ exclusively, but unfortunately the redditmods don't allow the sort of discussion I want. /lit/ doesn't either but it's a smaller board so I don't get banned as often.
>>9737391
Fuck off you Peterson-sucking fuckfuck.

>>9737386
like i said, im not opposed to spirituality, and im all for educated discrimination (why i never visit reddit) but you'd literally have to be a retarded degenerate with no grasp of world history to fall into these traps. And then they try to intellectualize it, which pains me.

>>9737394
it just makes me sad is all.
it makes the board just a bit less appealing to me to know that some of the audience has terrible taste and judgment.

>>9737376
You wanna know how to lose all credibility on 4chan?
>i bet reddit doesnt have this problem
And anyway, religion is one of, if not the, most important influences and themes in most classic books. Exploring religious themes is a billion times more interesting than science. Atheists can fuck off.

>>9737376
Because atheism is the religion for people who want to pretend to be smart and above it all. Serious religion is for patricians only.

I'm a devout Catholic who's been on 4chan for almost 10 years now. Back in the day I didn't talk about my religion simply because it never got brought up. Back in the day 4chan just didn't talk about religion much at all, at least not on the boards I frequented.

4chan has gotten more interested in religion. Some of this is /pol/'s doing, some of this is /lit/'s doing, and it kicked up visibly with the creation of /his/. Obviously with a more general interest in religious things, it's going to bring the Anons who are actively religious more into the forefront, where they weren't before.

>>9737409
if youre of the opinion that being a subscribed christian is superior to someone who simply doesn't blindly hate on reddit and atheists, i really could not care less what you think. group-think at it's worst. Like i said, i can handle religious people but these overly-literal catholics/mormons are a cancer.

>>9737376
You should probably learn more about religion. I can tell you have only a shitty downie layman's understanding because you think "spiritual people" and "word of god types" is a useful dichotomy and not incredibly reductive. You don't seem particularly discriminating yourself, it seems more like adopted, casual, unlearned bigotry, which seems odd that you then go on to whine about elitism. I thought you were just praising elitism?

In any case, you're certainly not familiar enough with the topic for your opinion to be worth anything. You seem rather like someone butting into a conversation between several people who disagree, but understand each other, and embarrassing everyone involved by shitting on one of the parties because of something you heard on tv.

>>9737407
Religion is not based off "taste and judgment" the way you seem to believe it is. It is based off belief and faith. Live life outside of the internet and you will realize that people believe things in earnest and not in the manner of LARPers calling themselves communists or kekistanis or what have you. True belief is formed from true belief and not an aesthetic or cultural judgment.

most religions are essentially composed of mis-translated political propaganda from the dark ages.

>>9737376
>le you have to be so ignorant and stupid to believe in God xD
Just kys famalam. (not literally)

>>9737376
>why are there so many religious people on this board?
as you said 4chan is a refuge for societal outcasts as it always was
today those are religious people, if you came here years ago this was much more atheist friendly place, just like the internet in general because once upon a time religious people used to be the retards

>>9737407
WAAAH HOW DARE PEOPLE TAKE ANYTHING SERIOUSLY. ALL I CARE ABOUT IS MEMES. LE FUNNY MEMES! IM SO FUCKING IRONIC LOL XDDD I HAVE DEPRESSION XDD
Eat shit.

>>9737422
it's a practical reduction. As soon as anyone takes a holy book literally, i automatically discard their opinion.
And i happen to know a lot of about religion.
I studied buddhism and attended both catholic and jesuit schools growing up.
All the priests were clearly gay dudes btw.

just because people are religious doesnt mean they will tone down the shit posting
they just adapt to trigger non believers

>>9737395
>history
Fuck off, eat shit, Shitty Systematizer.
>>9737419
You are the only one trapped within group-think.

>>9737431
You know nothing about religion, heathen.

>>9737436
lol how so?
it seems to me youre walking into a sort of paradox yourself, buddy.
i know you-types have difficulty with that.

>>9737436
Oh great here comes systemsfag Mrs. "I can disregard history for whatever reasons I want to, fake news!" Thread ruiner. Why don't you make a cool system of a noose and your neck and see where the potential energy of jumping off a tree lands you?

>>9737429
/thread

I want OP to be happy, but this was a great reply.

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>>9737417
>I'm a devout Catholic who's been on 4chan for almost 10 years now
>devout

>>9737431
It really just sounds like you don't want to bother debating anybody you disagree with so you pull this type of bullshit

>>9737442
no it wasn't?
clearly you're playing a side.
I never mentioned anything about depression or memes.
I would like to approach religion from an intellectual and historical perspective is all.

>>9737436
Why is group think bad if it's genuinely a good ideology or religion? I base all my idealogies off other people.

>>9737438
>paradoxes are bad
Fuck off, dualist.
>>9737440
Why are you so upset? History is nonexistent. You're trapped within bad thought.

>>9737447
no but it's actually true.
I swear to God (lol).

>>9737449
But it seems that you are looking down on the sentimental and believing because you're an ironic cynic.

>>9737440
>"I can disregard history for whatever reasons I want to, fake news!"
is that why you choose to ignore the fact you wouldnt be posting this bullshit if it werent for Jesus dying for your sins?

>>9737452
i didn't say they're bad... i just said they exist. religious types tend to deny them.

>>9737449
>I would like to approach religion from an intellectual and historical perspective
Cool, you scan start by not making blanket statements about the intellectual states of religious people. What would you like to discuss?

>>9737456
I am not OP, this guy was shitting up another tread I was in

>>9737456
No. You can't sin knowing you're doing something wrong. That's a sin in itself, and a bad one.

>>9737449
>intellectual
>historical
You're a systematizer. You reduce religion to psychobabble platitudes. You get severely triggered whenever somebody decides to take something as life-dominating as religion sincerely, rather than taking it at some dirty academic level. You sicken me. Why does it matter if you did not mention depression or memes? We all know your type, the type that hates passion and sincerity. The type that hates to involve them intimately with anything, and instead falls for the ancient meme of 'distant objectivity'. Eat shit, distance yourself from it as much as you want, but it will never be anything but shit.

>>9737449
>I would like to approach religion from an intellectual and historical perspective is all.
you have centuries of literature to read and get yourself educated with. maybe youll get through enough so by the time youre on death bed maybe you repent your heathen ways

>>9737443
To be fair, I am more devout these days than I was when I originally came to 4chan. /lit/ had a hand in that, by the way.

>>9737455
I don't think of it as cynical. I see it as essential honesty. I'd tell any addict that they have a problem.

>>9737431
What do you mean "literally" anon? If you mean the idea of taking the entirety of the Bible, without regard for context, as literal in instruction and depiction, as in Biblical literalism, you'll find its a relatively recent phenomena, and not endorsed by Catholic Biblical study. If you mean literal as in having any belief based off of the holy book at all, I'd have to say your assumption is a frail attempt at mocking incredulity. I'm not in passive, uncritical awe of the Bible or anything, but as a nonbeliever I don't disrespect people who consider it a holy book.

How did you "study" Buddhism? Self-study? Uni? Watching videos from Alan Watts online?

And religious education at most Catholic schools is shit. Lots of people educated in such schools from Catholic families know almost nothing about their own religion. Not implying I look down on them for it, they just didn't get a very good education in their own faith.

>>9737462
I take back what I said about you shitting up threads, sorry. This was a first rate post.

holy shit it's worse than i thought

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>>9737417
>devout Catholic
*tips cross* *throws holy water* Have at you!

>>9737464
this just seems incredibly stupid to me... the more you learn about history the harder it is to believe tb h

>>9737465
Fair enough, you'd do better leaving this site behind though.

>>9737495
>the more you learn about history the harder it is to believe tb h
you learn there was indeed a noah tier flood
you learn sodom and gomorrah actually got rekt
then theres the entirety of jewish history...

>>9737503
well see, i actually think the jews had it figured out to some extent.
Christians have too close of a relationship with God in Christ imo

>>9737460
Yes, iconoclasm ruins bad threads. Why would I stop doing what I must do?
>>9737466
You think you are honest, but you are not. You are insincere. You think everybody else has the problem. You hate any sort of non-popular thought. How dare somebody dedicate themselves to something sincerely that does not directly benefit them? The fools!
You types take the better and make it seem worse, and the worse and make it seem better.
You do not understand religion because you've been made a sore-old jade. You could study religion for countless lifetimes and never understand it. You and so many other disgusting intellectuals are nothing more than a poor image of Faust in his study.
It isn't even a matter of 'needing an axiom', it is in no way to simple. This isn't a choice, there is popular contrarianism ('nu-atheism') and there is actual contrarianism. The position that one is stuck with but would never live without. It isn't a matter of 'intellectual merit', or what 'makes sense'. Christianity does not make sense, it cannot make sense. Haven't you heard? God is dead.

>>9737497
Nah, I can't even begin to imagine posting anywhere else any more. Going to some fucking forum, where I have to register and have an account, and a fucking avatar? Fuck that. I can say what I want here, whether I mean it or not. And everything here is more interesting and compelling than anything I might find anywhere else on the internet, precisely because no one is tethered to their previous statements here. I feel a compulsion to be here, and I think here is where I belong.

>>9737513
are you a real catholic or a vatican 2 cuck?

>>9737510
Nah. There are some nice practical ideas in there, dont get me wrong, but if you you think Jesus wasn't just a symbol cooked up by disenfranchised jews in name of societal reform, you're fucking up.

>>9737524
remove sede memelords

>>9737527
i presume you also dont believe homer and shakespeare existed

must be a sad life youre living

>>9737532
sede are just protestants giving themselves fancy names
im not talking about that,
im asking whether you desecrate christ's sacrifice by attending fake novus ordo masses

>>9737497
We would all benefit from that, in all honesty.

>>9737533
i didn't say jesus wasn't real, he may very well have been, but more likely just a clever bastard jew-son-of-a-cuck/roman soldier with big ideas and a twin he used to trick people into thinking he lived.

>>9737524
A real Catholic is not some DEUS VULT1!!!! turd that directly rejects Church tradition for the sake of preserving some meme-tradition. You types made me apostatize. Worse, you made me resent ever converting!
>>9737527
No, you're fucking up. You are terrified of having any concrete beliefs. You're a coward, who would rather 'stay hip' by fence-sitting.
You people always do this, reduce such important things to Marxist nonsense. O! Yes! Great Intellectual! It is Clear that the Greeks! The Geniuses that They were! Did not actually believe those silly Myths! They were all mere Allegory! Ah! Yes! Truths They cou'd not express without Fiction!
Eat shit.

>>9737527
>but if you you think Jesus wasn't just a symbol cooked up by disenfranchised jews in name of societal reform, you're fucking up
lmao, anon smokes some bowls and lets his brain tick away for a few hours. this is what he comes up with.

bravo

>>9737545
the history speaks for itself.
study the fall of the roman empire or something.

>>9737544
dont call yourself catholic modernist memelord
your filthy kind ruined the church with your heretical bible translations and meme masses

OP please respond >>9737469

>>9737550
I was more into it than you, fucker. I was a constant attender of a sede church.
Yes, sedes ruined the Church. That's why I left.
>>9737552
He's just smoking a bowl, don't worry.

>>9737555
lol so youre left one protestant faggotry to join another
if you told me you have complexes from living in a pseudocatholic coven for years id have left you alone because clearly talk with such people is fruitless

just dont ever again use the word tradition, ok?

and no, the sedes didnt ruined church, liberal reforms did, sedes are just a bunch of random retards taht couldnt deal with it

>>9737560
I'm not protestant now.
>ITS THE LIBRULS
Eat shit.

>>9737552
ok
>>9737469
literally as in not recognizing that the book, originally designed as a spirito-political manifesto, is mostly comprised of tall tales most of which received numerous, revisions throughout history.
And, sure it's a holy book, but mostly just because of its historical importance.

>>9737555
>>9737560
this trifling conflict is not good for either of you twos souls ok

>>9737542
i kinda hoped this post would trigger somebody.

>>9737565
IT WAS JUST ALLEGORY LOL NOTHING IS SERIOUS! I LOVE MEMES! ITS ALL JUST STUPID STORIES LOL WHO COULD BELIEVE THAT!

>>9737568
I'm okay with this.

>>9737376
spirituality is the plebest type of religion OP, at least normal religions have a tradition and not platitudes pulled up from paulo coelho's ass

>>9737567
christians have too strong a loving nature to get mad at internet shit posts

>>9737564
>>9737566
yet another liberal """catholic"""
being a catholic is not compatible with mdoern age,
fell free to delude yourself

youre a living meme, considering that you blame a small cult nobody takes seriously on earth, that doesnt even comprise 1% of catholics some threat
your entire religion and beliefs are based on rebellion towards something that damaged you in your youth
just like an ex jehovah witness who shits on religion because he used to live in a cult and thats his way of solving his mental issues

i pity you

>>9737570
well that's not exactly what i meant by spirituality but i'd take a book of platitudes over a book of archaic traditions any day

>>9737572
I'm not a sede anymore. Don't you know what apostasy is?

>>9737574
did you even read what i said?

>>9737577
I tried to. You're fucking incoherent.

>>9737572
progressivism is a cancerous outgrowth of christianity, the toxic potential was already there from the beginning

catholicism was able to resist for a while thanks to all the paganism that was absorbed into their traditions, but it ended up following the same path as the rest of cristianity

reminder that jesus's real dad was a roman soldier named pantherus and that joseph was a cuck in denial who overly indoctrinated his son to the point where his ego grew out of control launching a religious career that posed a threat to his community

>>9737580
i shouldnt have expected a brazillian to understand english properly

>>9737583
wow im so enlightened now...
>>9737586
I'm not Brazilian.

>>9737588
youre not literate either

>>9737588
basically im advocating for old jewish wisdom.
God isn't your friend bud.

>>9737581
im just glad that all those modern "christians" will be atheists/spiritualists/die off in a generation or two
projections are that by 2050 there will be more traditionalist catholic priests than fake ones

>>9737581
>progressivism is a cancerous outgrowth of christianity
this, holy fuck

>>9737590
Why would I care what Jews think?

>>9737565
>literally as in not recognizing that the book, originally designed as a spirito-political manifesto
Dummo. It's a compilation of many books. The idea of any of it being a "political manifesto" is pretty revisionist, looking at it through incredibly reductive modern lenses. You're not going to get an informative reading if you come to it with preconceived, highly inaccurate ideas about what it is.

Also this revisions throughout history stuff is dumb. We pretty much know what the original manuscripts of all the books of the New Testament were like - there weren't that many "revisions" over the last 2,000 years. Medieval scholars did a pretty good job of translating, and even when they had their own biases there were plenty of others translating to counterbalance that anyway.

>>9737599
if you believe in christianity you essentially are a jew, just a dumb one caught up in an effective political campaign from 20 centuries ago

>>9737603
youre so wrong i wont even bother.
look it up retard.

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>>9737376
>i bet reddit doesnt have this problem.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_True_Word

Remember to take your information from all sides

>>9737611
Give me some hints and trails to follow unless you want me to reinforce my own views because I've spent my time reading about this shit.

I feel like your suggestion to "look it up" indicates not that you've read any actual literature on the subject but instead intuitively feel that you're right, and that if I fail to come to your conclusion I'm just too much of a dummy to connect the dots that you have. Very arrogant.

>>9737605
ITS JUST POLITICS LOL! ITS ALL ECONOMIC!
Fuck off

>>9737622
https://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/biblianazar/esp_biblianazar_7.htm
too many to name, but you could start here.
>>9737623
Basically what history is, so yes.

is anyone actually retarded enough to believe in a virgin-birth?

>>9737376
You literally said it yourself faggot, go to reddit.

>>9737637
yeah lol thats stupid fucking bullshit lol HE WAS LE KEK LOL
Fucking frogposter.

>>9737627
>excerpts from The Bible Fraud The Pacific Blue Group Inc.
damn. looks like you ignored the crucial advice to ignore all pseudo-intellectual rhetoricians. I suggest reading some real biblical criticism instead of this polemic shit.
start with the karl erhman.

>>9737627
History is not existent.

>>9737627
http://www.tektonics.org/af/bushby01.php

>>9737644
>pseudo-intellectual rhetoricians
we're talking about God here you moron. It comes with the territory on every side.
>>9737646
lol

>>9737650
>>9737644
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_True_Word

>>9737650
>http://www.tektonics.org/af/bushby01.php
i dont take contradicting evidence as inherently wrong, like i said it comes with the territory. I'd rather hear all the sides of the story as I assume the reality is some mix of the two.

>>9737655
If I link you the Wikipedia article to Contra Celsus will you become a Christian? I don't get what you're trying to say.

>>9737659
leave /lit/ and go back to /x/.

>>9737667
Read more dissenting opinions from historical contemporary commentaries is what i'm saying.
Andyou believe in a virgin-birthed magic zombie-man.
if that's not /x/ i dont know what is.

>>9737672
>i dont understand theology and philosophy so it sucks reeeeeeeeeeeee

>>9737672
I'm not a christian idort. And I don't mind dissenting opinions but your first resource shouldn't be this fringe guy with shitty methodology and a fake quote on the cover of his book.

>>9737672
xddd read le history history is le right becuz i sed so

>>9737675
>fake quotes
>believes in the bible
whose to say?
>>9737674
that's hardly the issue bud.

>>9737677
read magic god-loves-me-special book because im scared XD

>>9737679
*infects you with treatment-resistant lice and tickle tortures you*
retard

>>9737683
I am not scared, you are.
You don't understand religion. You never will.

>>9737686
i literally cannot be intellectually threatened by someone who believes in a virgin-birth from only 2,000 years ago

>>9737683
this board should really ban people who didnt read plotinus

>>9737690
i actually am kinda religious, but no in a scared way.
I'm even pretty sure if God exists he loves me more than you.
I'm just not retarded about it.

>>9737694
You are retarded. You embody retardation. Eat shit, heathen.

ITS IMPOSSIBLE XDDD LE SCIENCE SEZ SO
>>9737692
>platonists

>>9737698
the meta-ironic aspects of this post are pain-inducing.

>>9737701
Good. You need it.

>>9737704
you wouldn't even understand what you need.
I recommend a large dose of LSD or something.

>>9737683
Believing in Christianity can be one of the most terrifying experiences you can go through in life. It gives an extremely bleak depiction of life as it stands, which I very much get behind. Its not as if Christian salvation and moral transformation is exactly an easy route to take either, if you do it properly.

>>9737708
the promise of life after death is pretty appealing.
Jews and Eastern religions dont really fall into that trap and in most ways they've been more successful.

>>9737707
YEAH LOL DRUGS MAEK U SMERT

>>9737713
You fedoracunts are such reductionists. Read a bit of theology. Oh wait, that actually means reading something beyond the level of genre fiction!

>>9737716
it's not that they make you smart, it's more that they reveal how little you really know.
The things you think you know you'll know for real. It's like seeing the world through the eyes of a child again.
You literally wouldn't know.

>>9737698
>christians suck, only the religion i like is the correct one reeeeeeeeeeee

>>9737708
>>9737713
strange
ive been drawn to christianity by all the awesome mystical tridentine-tier things and promise of eternal suffering to all the unworthy

>>9737719
you christfags are so reductive. read a bit of history. oh wait, that means reading something beyond an echo-chamber library centered around single delusional fantasy novel masquerading as historical fact

>>9737725
>being this mad that someone has experiences beyond your limited baby-knowledge.
you don't even realize that not everyone on every website is the same way

>>9737725
>t. intellectually inferior subhuman and probably a sophist as well

>>9737726
Back to /r/eddit.
>>9737734
Knowledge is nonexistent. Find a cave, Platonist.

>>9737726
Give me your 10 favourite philosophers please.

>>9737737
the irony.

>>9737739
i dont really have favorites to be honest. Everyone is a little bit right except when they're horribly wrong

>>9737742
This is a nice way of saying "I don't read".

>>9737742
>i dont really have favorites to be honest.
>nietzschefag thinking he is fooling anyone

>edgy atheist telling people to read history
>doesnt realize book nerds all throughout history have considered the Bible to be a primary source, and use events in the Bible to date other historical events
lmao

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>people unironically believing in a virgin birth
>attempting any claim at intellectual superiority

>>9737749
It's not hard when you've never read a book that's not genre trash or A Very Short Introduction to Nietzsche.

>>9737749
>other people's religions are shit reeeeeeeeeeeee
>everyone please believe the same thing i do

>>9737744
i don't really read philosophy to be honest, but that's not to say I'm not familiar with the big ideas.
I find most of the texts tiresome and overly expounded.
It's generally all pretty simple really when it needs be.
>>9737745
Sure.

>>9737746
>book nerds all throughout history
so what? People did a lot of dumb shit up until very recently without even knowing why.

>>9737755
i seriously hope you are just baiting and roleplaying an unsophisticated pleb for fun

>>9737753
that's not really what he's saying.
you have to accept some duty of retard-humility if you accept that.
there's literally no legitimate reason a supposedly intelligent person should believe that. It's irresponsible.

>>9737760
Far from a pleb.
I've probably read every great fiction novel you have and more by a long shot.
That's more my area.
I dislike philosophy and religion in general as i find it all kinda wanky and unrealistic outside of internal-musings..

>>9737765
i dont know whether you are a fedora, gnostic, muslim or wahtever, but nobody here is gonna take you seriously by cherrypicking others beliefs

>>9737772
It's not cherrypicking at all, its a legitimate point o contention. No one outside of other retards would believe or responsibly support the idea of a virgin birth.
Believe in your savior who died for you for all i care, it may be true (in a sense), but dont think youre above anyone for believing in that.

>>9737775
do you even understand teh difference between physical and metaphysical?
or is it too late because youve already gone too far in reading nietzsche

>>9737770
it's clear you've never read anything. or if you did you just read the words without understand any of it

>>9737779
of course i do, probably better than you, but how does that explain a virgin-birth?
I'd love to know.

>>9737780
No I'm actually an incredibly analytical person.
i'm one of the few people i have ever known that actually understands Ulysses and Gravity's rainbow on an intricate level of authorial intent.

>>9737755
It is to say you are an uneducated philistine.

>>9737782
ti would be explainable to you if you were ale to comprehend that things happen outside of teh sphere of the physical world, but since youre a fedora autist i dont think your brain is developed enough

>>9737783
ok, so you are trolling and never read any actual book. good to know. have a nice day.

>>9737784
Not necessarily.
I just don't need to have knowledge spoon-fed to me like a child. I'm intuitive.

>>9737789
>mad and scared
>>9737786
>f you were ale to comprehend that things happen outside of teh sphere of the physical world
LOL as if you could?
delusion at its worst

>>9737790
so you say youre an INTJ master race who doesnt need some dumb old books telling him what to do

>>9737794
INFJ actually.

>>9737429
10/10

>>9737391
>wholey

>>9737805
0/10 you tasteless bandwagon christfag.
It was not funny or accurate and was clearly a case of projection.

>>9737376
I don't know but it's one of the reasons I've stopped coming here as often.

>>9737419
>mormons
You don't know anything about Mormons or you wouldn't be posting this shit. Mormons are some of the nicest most decent people out there.

Typical ignorant fedora tipping, reddit posting. Hopefully you'll grow out of it. For your sake.

>>9737790
Children can't understand philosophy, but I wonder which other subjects you don't need to be spoon-fed?

>>9737813
jesus will people let go of the reddit and fedora shit? I'm not atheist, have never been to reddit and am more socially capable than any of you christfags i'm sure.

you can be a nice person and still be a retarded hindrance to intellectual discourse.
I have no problem with their existence, it's more of an issue that they choose post here of all places.

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>>9737810
Good. Marxists need to get the fuck out and take their cancer back to /r/eddit.

>>9737817
it would depend on the child wouldn't it?
All i need are the seeds. I don't need to be indoctrinated to critique or understand abstract concepts.

>>9737825
>anyone who isn't a christfag is a marxist
literally pathetic autistic fedora shit

>>9737823
all your posts are completely devoid of content and you've been posting empty platitudes since you started the thread

writing empty words and putting "intellectual discourse" between them doesn't make you smart, it makes you a pseud

>>9737829
But you absolutely are.

>>9737828
Can you explain monads to me?

>>9737829
You're either with them, against them, or a useful idiot. If you're not one of them then I guess you're a useful idiot.

>>9737835
no that's just projection and you're mad. I know for a fact that I'm wiser than you in every way that actually matters.
Beyond the initial posts and following the ensuing christfag crusade this was never going to be a discourse. Could have been, but when 90% of the posters came from gangbanging fanatics I started just laying out basic truths (aka platitudes).
>>9737837
this is what i mean.
It's just sad what happens with you guys. Literally pathetic.

>>9737843
Stop thinking you are superior. Many of us are cringing hard reading your posts because we also used to be stupid little arrogant autistic fuckboys like yourself. Then we grew up.

>>9737376
Because they realized that humans will never know objective truth so we should pursue pragmatic truth. Not to mention religion, especially Christianity, is directly responsible for much of the greatest literature.

>>9737841
everyone is a useful idiot to somebody.
>>9737840
esoteric computer program language of which an understanding of would hardly indicate an accurate measure of human intelligence.
see what i mean? simple.

>>9737825
Who said anything about Marxism? But since you mention it, there were many more intelligent discussions on /lit/ back when it was full of Marxists. And reddit is comprised of liberals and libertarians, not Marxists. I'd tell you to fuck off back to /pol/ but this is now /pol/'s reading group.

>>9737846
>many of us are cringing
how would you possibly know that unless you're a group-thinking christfag aware of an imminent threat to your weak sense of identity?

>>9737848
>esoteric computer program language of which
>an understanding of would hardly indicate an accurate measure of human intelligence.
Okay, you are retarded. Got it. There is a reason why purely functional languages are only used by elite level programmers. It absolutely is an indicator of intelligence.

The sooner you learn you are not so smart, the sooner you can stop being depressed about your "wasted potential" and do something with your life. You need some serious lessons in humility. Literally a spoilt child, the result of bad parenting.

>>9737856
I'm a lawyer and made 200k last year.
Many of my programmer acquaintances are smart in an autistic way and have no sense of social competency.
We both know what's really happening here don't we? let's not pretend.

>>9737852
What? That doesn't even make sense. No, I'm telling you that I also used to be a cringy anti-theist fuckwit who thought he was right about everything and believed everyone else was dumb. Well it turns out, most people are dumb but not for the reasons I assumed at the time.

>>9737857
You don't understand what intelligence is.

>>9737857
>I'm a lawyer and made 200k last year.
Oh, so you're Jewish. Now this thread all makes sense

>>9737858
Does make sense.
But that's also kinda what I'm saying. Most people are dumb, and I'm aware of what i dont/can't know.
We should tolerate delusions of that kind in certain places, but not here, a place i once considered one of the few remaining intellectual havens on this site.
I'm not anti-theist, I'm just anti-organized-religion.

>>9737863
I think like a jew, sure, but I'm not.
It's a badge of honor imo. They've always been ahead of the curve.

>>9737862
maybe you don't.
It's not easily measurable.
I'm a very efficient and multi-talented person.
It's worth more than autistic bean-counting skills to be sure.

>>9737865
>Most people are dumb, and I'm aware of what i dont/can't know.
>I'm just anti-organized-religion.
If most people are incapable of thinking for themselves, why should we be against organised religion? Spirituality is important for civilisation (For the results of combining nihilism and stupidity, just look at the modern world). Not everyone is smart enough to figure out how to live their life. Why not give them a guide? This modern culture void of all meaning and morality sure as hell is not a good guide.

>>9737877
I don't think any of our current models will do the trick, but yes I agree in theory.

>>9737877
tl;dr I think that religion should be personal and organised religion is cancer. But it's a cancer that we need because most people are incapable of figuring it out for themselves.

>>9737857
>>9737875
Anon, just like there are no girls on the internet, there are no mega-successful laweys who earn 200k a year. Same principle. Once you start bringing your supposed real life achievements into an argument of a Cambodian basket weaving forum, you know you're grasping at straws.

>>9737882
lol if you had any idea..
You sound mad though.

>>9737880
Some of these religions are definitely worse than the others. They are not all just equally bad, even if they could be equally false.

As for Christianity, most of the harshest criticisms are directed at the Old Testament and the churches. Jesus spoke out against the teachings of the Old Testament (He said they were following the traditions of their fathers and not God) and his message is almost the complete opposite in many cases. As for the churches, well, twisting a message for their own gains does not invalidate the message.

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>>9737877
>just look at the modern world
What's so bad about modern world in contrast to old world?

>>9737886
I'm not the same poster but I used to make 180k as a programmer. I would brag about it on 4chan and ask them why I didn't have a girlfriend yet. It was one of the most miserable times of my life. Now I'm happily married and I never tell anyone about my salary.

>>9737891
>twisting a message for their own gains does not invalidate the message
the same could be said of the old testament but in that case it actually worked. They all "could" work just as well, but they don't.

>>9737749
>people unironically believing in a virgin birth
Parthenogenesis is a scientific concept you ignoramus.

>>9737898
i wouldn't have even mentioned it had he not made the claim that i was doing nothing with my life.
My life is extraordinary
i dont want to go in detail but the theoretical God surely loves me.
Puts me in an interesting position in this debate imo.

>>9737886
So, you seem to be of the mind that we should accept your faulty arguments because you're "successful". See, even if you were to show us your wardrome that is supposedly full of tailored suits, the mad stacks you supposedly have in your deposit box, and the t5 apartment you supposedly live in your arguments would gain little to no merit. Because they're shit. So shit, in fact, that you have to fall back on

>u mad, bruv?!

So, like...gtfo?

>>9737906
>Parthenogenesis
never in humans retard you ignorant fuck

>>9737909
see
>>9737907

>>9737892
Where do we begin?

Depression and mental illness is at an all time high and shows no signs of slowing down. Single motherhood has become the norm (Bringing with it statistically, higher crime rates, more mental illness etc) and it rising every year. The white race is dying and will be minority in their native countries within the next century. Unforunately, we are the only race to build such a civilisation with respect for freedoms, the individual, literary achievement and scientific advancement. There is no guarantee this will continue without us and every indication that it will not.

Life has become increasingly meaningless for the vast majority of people. There is no family, no faith, no right or wrong way, only a relative "do what makes you happy". The truth is that people don't know what will make them happy. That's why people become drug addicts, that's why people waste their lives, that's why people chase false dreams and false hopes.

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>>9737907
>the theoretical God surely loves me

>Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal:

>But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:

>For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.

>The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.

>But if thine eye be evil, thy whole body shall be full of darkness. If therefore the light that is in thee be darkness, how great is that darkness!

>No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

Matthew 6:19-24

>>9737922
my relationship with God is more complex than any book could explain.

>>9737749
Jesus' teachings are what matter to me. I don't care about technicalities of theology written by autistic priests, or the fulfillment of jewish prophetic fairy tales.

>>9737927
first post i liked.
a good man.

>>9737926
m8 if you tip that fedora that hard one more time you might shatter the fabric of reality. pls sthap

>>9737934
well it's kinda true.
I have sort of an friendly-rivalry with God that would probably offend you.
I honestly believe if you could read the mind of most religious people the most disgusting sorts of delusions would appear to you.
I try to confront them in a creative way.

>>9737910
Happened in other vertebrates (fish, birds etc.), good enough for me. You're just close-minded to new scientific possibilities.

>>9737941
lol go home retard

>>9737943
Sure, but remember:
>The curse of the LORD is in the house of the wicked: but he blesseth the habitation of the just.

>>9737958
I'm hardly wicked.
I consider myself a crusader for objective truth.

>>9737637
Well if Jesus really was divine/son of God then he wouldn't need human intercourse to be able to come into this world.

>>9737964
imo we are all sons of God the same as Jesus and how many of us can say the same?

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>>9737376
if one picture could describe a thread

>>9737376
>why are there so many religious people on this board?
>>9737968
>imo we are all sons of God the same as Jesus
Ok, what's wrong with religion again?

>>9737376
i think i'm becoming insane please help me

>>9737425
Out of the dark comes the light.

>>9737983
my point has always been that the books have faulty instructions.

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>>9738004
>there is a single opinion on which books are authoratitive, authentic and which parts of those books have not been tampered with
Sorry but I really disagree.

>>9737431
>all the priests were clearly gay

You can't take out being touched by them on religious belief as a whole.

>>9738016
no i mean they were literally gay dudes.
i lived in the bay area so maybe that explains some of it but i mean they were flaming. Had subtle gay accents and interest in musical theatre, hair products etc.
forced abstinence was a mistake.
But you should hear the pedo stories i've heard on the east coast...

Why is that "spirituality" is okay but going a step further and turning it into a coherent philosophical system is not?

>>9737376
i cant even...
just fuck off summerfag

lots of people turn to religion as they get older and begin to realize that life is full of suffering, that we all get old and die, that the answers the world offers (material things, intoxication, social status, sex) don't work, that as soon as you pass into your later 20's there's a whole crop of newer shinier people coming up behind you and the world doesn't give a shit about you

among buddha-fags it's often referred to as "knowledge of dukkha"

>>9738048
because coherency is kinda against the nature of what it would really have to be to be real imo

>>9738067
This is hitting me hard since I just graduated university and my father died 6 months ago. I read the Bible and it really didn't do anything for me. I'm getting started on Plato and hoping I'll find some spirituality but I'm not sure. Where would you recommend I start if I am looking for some meaning?

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>>9737376
Because religion encourages learning and a search for a deeper meaning in life instead of mindless hedonism like a lot of people seem to be fond of these days.

Take your fedora and leave, faggot.

wtf happened to this place.
the amount of christfaggotry realy is astounding.

>>9738076
kek what an excellent image

fuggin saved

cool thread

the fedora false-flagging is something to note.

>>9738079
christianity has its fair amount of faggotry, but not for the plebeian reasons you think it does

start with the greeks

>>9738068

Religion is not "against nature," it's beyond nature. That's literally what metaphysics means. A theory being metaphysical doesn't preclude coherence. I think you're confusing the word coherence to mean "something I agree with" A philosophical system can be wrong but coherent.

Why do you people even come here? You're obvious summer and you're dumb as fuck "imo"

>>9738070
that's a tough question. "meaning" is local and relative to the individual. another person might find a lot of 'meaning' in reading the Bible, but it didn't work for you, at least not now

if you're interested in meditation or the buddha's teachings (i am a buddha-fag, as previously implied), try giving this a read and see what you think: http://static.squarespace.com/static/5037f52d84ae1e87f694cfda/t/5055915f84aedaeee9181119/1347785055665/

daniel ingram is a well regarded meditation practitioner and sometime teacher who gives a technical but readable account of 'spiritual' practice and the path of buddha-dharma. i don't know what you're looking for but when I first read this it blew my socks off. good luck

>>9738094
what you said about metaphysics is pure BS, but i would expect as much from a short-cut taking faggot like you (there's an inherent laziness in christianity). I should mention that I've definitely been on this board for longer than you and I can assure this new right-wing christ-centered 4chan is the real endless summer shit if there ever was any (notice how it coincided with the birth of nu-4chan as a whole).
there's a reason why all the good posters dried up and left.

>>9738119

Watch out gentlemen we have an oldfag here. Don't make him pull out his credentials or we'll all be pwned.

>>9738129
well it's true. I've been a 4chan regular since 2004 and have been posting on lit since 2010, the boards inception year i believe. It was different then. Everything was really.

>>9738133
I've only been here a couple of years and have noticed the massive drop in quality, coinciding perfectly with the increase in Christian threads.

>>9737913
bbut- weve got cheetos and wet ass wipes
i bet you feel silly now dumb regressive

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>>9738070
Start here. Plato is based too.

>>9738133
Well, most of us who were here since 2004, grew up. People can change their opinions you know.

>>9738138
Wrong. /lit/ was always shit.

>>9738227
But I grew up and got smarter. However it may be because I'm successful and not a neet. There's a real aversion to reality that comes with that line of thought, which i can sympathize with in general, but still i refuse to be lectured or spoken down to by the type. It's not their place and neither is this board really.

>>9738238
>But I grew up and got smarter
If you didn't, how would you know?

>>9738252
well i used to be afraid of God. Now I know he's literally inside me in a complex schizophrenic way where I'm you, you're me, we're all the prophets, and history is all happening at once.
It kinda killed any respect i had for anyone else's egotistical conception of what God is/might be, especially when they're submitting their own to someone else, as in teh case of christfags (which is even more pathetic)

>>9737913
We are sliding into an abyss and there seems to be no way to stop it.

>>9738119
What exactly is wrong with being Christ centered? Jesus preached a doctrine of love, why would you be against that?

>>9738290
I'm not against that. I'm more against the concept that he died for all of our sins so anything we do will be forgiven. I know too many shitty christians.

>>9738301
I don't believe he died so our sins could be wiped away. I believe he died so we could see our sins for what they are. We still ultimately have to suffer because of them and go through a process of self-transformation.

I agree, there are a lot of shitty Christians but that's the same in all ideologies and religions. Most people just use them as justification for their bullshit.

>>9738301
He lived to teach humanity a better way to live. He died because he would not compromise his beliefs and principles.

Christians are just followers of Christ's teachings. Not sure why you have to paint all "Christians" with this brush.

>>9738320
i can agree with the spirit of what you're saying but i just dont see any particular draw to that one of the many flawed belief systems, especially when the jewish god has been very good to me (which is not really his bag historically).
Not a jew, but jews like me.

>>9738324
i never really did blame all christians, it's always been a specific sort. there's a lot of them though.

>>9738343
You can apply that same bias to any group. I don't think there is a single group of majority "good" people.

>>9738399
yeah, you're right but there's only really a growing christfag minority on this board that's just starting to get too comfortable.

>>9737376
I think it's just because there are a lot of Americans on the chan, and they're much more religious than other western nations.
I really don't understand all the hate atheists get on here.

>>9738415
If you want us to leave then help us get a religion board. I've asked for it on /qa/ a dozen times.

>>9738436
>I really don't understand all the hate atheists get on here.
Have you tried interacting with them?

>>9738324
No, Christians are people who belong to a Church founded by Christ.

>>9738415
>that's just starting to get too comfortable
>just
How
New

>>9738439
i really do want you to leave. I have a feeling your population accounts for much of the /pol/-posts as well. It's the weakest kind of edge, we need real edge again.
I like the idea that /lit/ would be the last bastion of the old-4chan guard, but it's probably too late.

>>9738447
The majority of people I interact with are atheists, it's not an issue at all. We just never talk about religion.
Of course there is the stereotype of supremely enlightened reddit edgelord but that's really not how normal atheists act, from my experience.

>>9738456
You're a pathetic manchild, bro.

>>9738094
Nothing is "beyond nature".

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>>9738439
>>>/x/

>>9738454
i didn't mean just in the temporal sense.
>>9738447
there are a lot of atheists that are disgustingly nice simpletons.

>>9738456
>I like the idea that /lit/ would be the last bastion of the old-4chan guard
I'll never understand why newfie's think /lit/ is in any way related to the "old-4chan guard", even /pol/ is older than us and more related to the actual real "old-4chan guard" who spammed nigger on /b/.

>>9738464
This meme really needs to die. Most of /x/ is creepypasta garbage and we just don't want to see it. At least when Christians post on /lit/ we discuss literature.

>>9738460
how so?
i know you guys think i'm a fedora tipper because i don't agree with the bible but in reality it's moreso you that's trapped in your childhood bedroom. That's fine, but don't bring that pathetic kind of existential question-answer crap around here and expect anyone to be proud or happy about it.

>>9738481
i wish you guys discussed literature. More often you just lecture others on esoteric terminology and other bullshit no one gives a shit about.
>>9738470
well, as 4chan became progressively dumber since the big /b/ explosion many people fled to what they assumed was a board for brighter minds. they were wrong.

>>9738439
/lit/ was always the catholic board, no need for a new one

>>9737411
Organised religion is for brainlets.

>>9738267
Would you mind expounding on your idea of God? It sounds pretty interesting to me.

>>9738594
this is the problem.
you christfags have no idea how self-righteous and annoying you are.
At least three times a day i see a post from a christfag explaining to someone else how a description of a christian term they used is is inaccurate on a purely subjective level. we dont give a shit. go away.
you are the true fedoras.
that never seem to be able to comprehend

>>9738615
shutup stupid, go worship a microscope

>>9738612
the world is on fire, you're here for a reason but mostly just to come to terms with the fact that you are ultimately powerless to fate, chained to fun-house mirror-people in the desert. we grab God by the balls and make some demands.

>>9738615
you are welcome to spew your bullshit on this catholic board, we are merciful people

>>9738615
I'm confused, I'm not a Catholic nor religious but you don't get into literature and not expect copious amounts of Catholicism, they've kinda dominated the whole writing business for a couple of thousand years.

>>9738641
so what? literature has been dead for nearly a century by those standards. we're doing something new, embrace the warmblooded life of internet ennui.

>>9737376
>274 replies
I want /pol/, r/eddit/, and summer kids to leave.

>>9738650
>by those standards
What standards? what.

>we're doing something new
No you aren't, if you spent more time reading and less time bitching about christfags you'd know Greece said the same thing about monotheisticfags.

>>9738665
i forgot that i have to talk simple for you to understand:
catholic-influence is no longer relevant.
and everything is new because of the internet, a new age of information is upon us. get over it.

>>9738670
youtube/twitter/reddit aren't going to teach you how to live a meaningful life, ya queer

>>9738685
you have no idea what a meaningful life really is and you know it.

>>9738670
>catholic-influence is no longer relevant
Your going to have to talk even simpler, but I'm still failing to understand how you came to this conclusion.

>>9738700
modernity fucked christianity in the ass.
capiche?

>>9738689
Life is not meaningful.

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>>9738707
Are you confusing modernity for something else? a lot of early modernist authors were Christians and influenced heavily by traditional liturgy.

>>9738739
technically it was a transition phase.
influenced is another word for re-appropriating.
It wasn't until post ww2 that the nails really sunk in.

>>9738739
>modernity = modernism
e_e

>>9738599
Oh. So which organized religion are you a part of?

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>>9738641
>not expect copious amounts of Catholicism
That's possible

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>>9738689
sure i do. i have dedicated my life to shitposting on /lit/. (You)s give my life meaning.

>>9737757
YEAH EVERYBODY WAS STUPID UNTIL LE CURRENT YEAR BECAUSE FUCKING CHRISTIANITY N SHIET

>>9737775
Yeah bro how could an omnipotent who created all life do something as ABSURD as create life AND HAVE IT COME OUT A VAGINA? LOL FUCKING BULLSHIT SHE WAS A SLUT LMAO

>>9737808
>waah anything that offends me is just projection! i love memes!

>>9737968
Jesus was also God. You are not.

>>9737425
>political propaganda
>dark ages
faggotry detected

>>9738119
The Christianity on /lit/ is called Socialist for a reason you fucking dope. You've been here for a week, tops.

>>9737376
A higher understanding of religion is the new intellectual zeitgeist of our time. Surprised a "smart" person like yourself hasn't seen this by now.

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>>9737376
>>9737391
>>9737428

I love how fedorafags just assume they're the majority because they live in a bubble and take comfort in "right side of history" theology. Look at the numbers, you are a fraction of a fraction. Atheism has also been linked conclusively to autism.

>>9737411
>Because atheism is the religion for people who want to pretend to be smart and above it all
>>9737422
>You don't seem particularly discriminating yourself, it seems more like adopted, casual, unlearned bigotry,
>>9737433
>just because people are religious doesnt mean they will tone down the shit posting
they just adapt to trigger non believers

This

>>9738436
If you are a hard athiest you are by definition a physicalist/realist. This is an open rejection of so many avenues of philosophical exploration that it's no wonder people have stopped tolerating this retarded absurdity.

>>9738615
>he thinks we care
Eat shit m8

>>9737757

People have believed that only in their contemporary era was universal knowledge attained and all their predecessors were ignorant primitives for at least 250 years.

The enlightened intellectual of today is the ignorant savage of tomorrow, and as a wise Bongladeshi once said, the primary lesson of history is that nobody ever learns anything from it.

>>9738436
>I don't understand how behaving like a close-minded fanatic in my adherence to uncompromising, absolutist, black and white assumptions about the nature of reality while simultaneously shitting on everyone else who does the exact same thing with an utter lack of self-awareness could possibly bother anyone

>>9737581
spotted the pagan/atheist fuckwit. Consider hanging yourself

>>9737433
Nobody triggers non-believers more effectively than other non-believers. They know what triggers them and simply pass it down.

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>>9737726
>you christfags are so reductive. read a bit of history. oh wait, that means reading something beyond an echo-chamber library centered around single delusional fantasy novel masquerading as historical fact

>>9737376
That's not even remotely related to the Hanged Man you pleb.

>>9737376
because philosophers deal in the immaterial as well as the material

SIMPLE NO?!

>>9737376
Read Kierkegaard my friend

Because being an atheist is impossible. Either you choose your ultimate concern or its chosen for you.

God is incomprehensible, infinite, intransient--in a sense, God cannot fail you. But we can fail ourselves. This is why Nietzsche's madman goes to the marketplace: modern society worships wealth, commerce, exchange, finite resources and commodities. Society and community is no longer centered around a unifying belief, only the tenuous economic relations which we are compelled to have with each other.

I don't adhere to a particular belief or faith myself, but I recognize the spiritual vacuum that is the Western, industrialized world.

>>9740065
>this faggot

so many triggered christfags.
the ironic fedora-accusations really are concerning.

>>9737429
I take other people's suffering seriously, which the Abrahamic faiths seem to put pretty low on their list of priorities.

>>9738599
Half true. Orthodox mainstream religion is for brainlets.

>>9737513
Get off the internet. Don't you realize we're using Satan's tool?

>>9737527
>Jesus didn't exist
>What are Roman records
>What are Jewish writings of the time (fun fact: Jews cannot dispose any writing that has God's name on it)

>>9741494
So if God is incomprehensible why bother with him?

>>9741740
The Universe is incomprehnisble too so why bother with that?

>>9737376
Irrationality is on the rise. It's the weak people's response to the failure of science to provide us with better lives.

>>9741765
Your point? I agree, you shouldn't bother too much with understanding the Universe because you will never do it. You can look at cool stars and shit, but you have to know your limits. Scientists do this (when they're actually doing science at least, not when talking to laymen) but the problem with religion is that it instantly arrives at the explanation and then refuses to contest it at all. It starts with belief and ends with certainty.

>>9738739
Modernist =/= modernity

>>9741740
God symbolizes the ineffable, whereas the universe simply is; it doesn't symbolize or point to anything beyond itself. I was just explaining why religion still works for some people. If it doesn't work for you, then you obviously dont have to bother with it.