how accurate is this /lit/ taken from a lecture slide in

Well yeah pretty much

Although surprisingly enough, long, difficult books have more than a single idea in them & take more than a single word to summarize

>>9360112
it's a good example of bad post modernism.

Horseshit, modernism was the beginning of the end already.

Enlightenment: Study of objective reality
Modern: Expand study of objective reality with subjective perceptions of it
Postmodern: Everything is subjective, there is no objective reality

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>>9360112

It's more like this.

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I find this image interesting.

Anybody want to theorize what happens after postmodernism? My guess is a hard swing back towards something like neo-rationalism as we realize that differences of opinion don't really matter much when the really interesting story will be robots and computers and so on.

>>9361074
I don't think you realize that postmodernism is just one intellectual theory of the 21st century and that there isn't a single unifying theory currently that needs to be replaced by another unifying theory

>protip there wasn't one in the Enlightenment period either, or in the Romantic period (compare Romanticism to German Idealism)

>>9361074
Full communism

>>9360112
This is the kind of oversimplification I would expect someone who lurks /v/ to make, not a professor.

>>9361074
I've been thinking about this a long time. If you compare the different ages of human thought and read stuff going back even a hundred years, the simplicity is increasing by the boatload. We used to be more verbose and have a more open approach, more dialogue. I think that the general thrust has been towards simple and instantly gratifying language, even novels or nonfiction tends to try to get to a concise point even faster these days. If you go to your nonfiction section, you'll get a lot of books telling to 'everything you know is wrong and I'm an expert on this' but it really boils down to them offering you worth so that you can feel like you matter more as a person for having read their stupid book.
Robots/computers are just going to evolve the social movements. It's going to turn into a competition, who can be the nicest to who and who can be the most caring to others. Because people will realize that they have nothing else but their worth in society, their instant gratification from proposed value in books will evaporate and we'll become a society of starved loners looking for attention.
It's already happened to an extent. It won't be a perspective based world, it will be a entirely feeling based world.
In this world, I think that the most powerful people are going to be the ones who have old values, traditional convictions, because the feelings people will constantly be on edge about what someone said or did and be a constant spout of bitchery and whinyness while the conservative types have to get things done. I think you'll see a future where people would rather argue feelings being the majority of the conversation, because these people want the attention the most, meanwhile the people who have a vested interest in practicality will be the ones sending them government checks to live off of.

>>9360112
>>9361051
Those charts aren't bad rudimentary portrayals, but the pre/mod/post applies to different fields and artistic mediums differently. Architecture, literature, music, commercial design, and film didn't follow a singular, linear path of compositional and structural development.

>>9361074
>>9361251
Metamodernism
essentially modernism with postmodern devices and techniques

>>9360148
T. Uncultured retard

>>9360112
Without commenting on the others, "Because God put it there and that's the way it's always been" has some truth when you look at Descartes and onward, but when you look at the Scholastics they really didn't think like that.

The Scholastics saw the universe as an expression of God's inherent intelligibility, whereas Enlightenment thinkers basically saw God as being outside of intelligibility. The Scholastics didn't think that you could just reduce nature to an arbitrary expression of God's will, instead they saw the nature of reality as being defined by God's nature, which meant they thought that the nature of reality must not be arbitrary just as God's nature isn't arbitrary.

So basically this slide, whatever its other errors, looks at the history of thought with a very modern-centric bias, i.e. "no one before the modern era thought anything worth taking note of."

>>9360112
>This is how you teach philosophical concepts to ameritards
No wonder for lots of things

Premodernism: Its important to ensure Europe remains white and non-degenerate.

Modernism: Maybe we should be degenerate scum

Post-modernism: It's important to ensure Europe becomes non-white and degenerate.

>>9361586
t. mad postmodernist

>>9361667
Kek.

>>9361670
kek

>>9360112
The myth of eternal growth was denied its status as true, and to keep the lie going truth had to be made chaotic and random. What follows is a closed box, the Demiurge dream, the time cube.
What follows is eternal growth.

>>9361786
>denied its status as true
As false*

Medieval:
>Let's build a better society as envisioned by God

Enlightenment:
>Let's build a better society with Reason and Logic

Modernism:
>Hey guys, Marx here. Reason is great and all, but we should overthrow capitalism to implement a communist utopia

Post-modernism:
>Hey guys Neo-Marx here. So yeah, that last thing didn't work out so well. I have pinpointed the problem to be Reason. Lets say everything you know is just an opinion, so forget all about it so we can overthrow western civilization to implement a communist utopia

Post-post-modernism:
>Okay whatever, your identities are in the way too, just become a asexual genderless amorphous gray blob, then we can finally implement a communist utopia

>>9361286
>essentially modernism with postmodern devices and techniques

That has passed.

>>9361795
>Modernism:
>>Hey guys, Marx here. Reason is great and all, but we should overthrow capitalism to implement a communist utopia
>modernism began with Marx
>modernism is in anyway related to Marxism

back to your containment board

>>9361795
Do you even read?

>>9361858
Marxists took advantage of the progressive attitudes and industrialization hysteria in modernism. They didn't cause it though, that was the industrialization.

When their little global project failed, Marxists decided that economics and politics are downstream from culture and entertainment, so they developed critical theory and other neo-marxist methods designed to destroy and replace the established society and culture.

>>9360148
This anon basically has it right. Enlightenment was the beginning of the end, but religious thought was retained in art, specifically Romanticism. Modernism brought epistemological concerns to the table and postmodernism abstracted the fuck out of everything and shifted the concerns to the ontological

>>9361074
Christian Socialism

Law course? Was it a lecture on how to bail out postmodern writers? Or was the lecturer just having a giggle?

>>9362303
the lecturer is always having a giggle

>>9361074
>Anybody want to theorize what happens after postmodernism?

Cultural implosion, breakdown of all values, morality & meaning. It's happening already.

>>9361880
Internet rightists have the wackiest conspiracy theories

>>9362535
that doesn't seem like it will me a very stable state, nothing more than a transition period
what happens after that

>>9362535

go to bed, peterson

>>9362541
Dude you can read up on this on Wikipedia. Research the Frankfurt School, Critical Theory and the writings of the figureheads of the school.

>>9360148
but its true
name one thing that exists independently of being observed

>>9362580
cogito ergo sum, tripfag

>>9362614
but you observe yourself

>>9362580
You have to assume that the universe exists and behaves regularly even if it is not being observed. You can't prove it, but you can utilize this educated guess to great effects, as demonstrated in the scientific revolution. Pragmatism trumps pedantic self destruction.

>>9362621
No you don't.
It's not I think about the fact that I am thinking therefore I am, it's I think therefore I am.

>>9362624
This is a literature board. Not /sci/entism.

>>9362637
>No you don't.

OK but you do though.

>>9362299
>these people still exist

>>9362644
Yeah you can observe yourself but you don't need to when proving your existence.

>>9362655
Idiots will always exist. I think one line bait greentext replies will survive as well. It's a shitty world.

>>9362658
You are constantly observing yourself though, it's not optional. So you can't assert that.

>>9360148
Beginning of the end of history

Absolute when?

>>9362579
I've actually read their work. You are wrong.

>>9362637
You are constantly observing your own existence otherwise you stop breathing and die.

>>9362679
So if I am constantly observing myself and the statement was "nothing can exist without being constantly observed" it means I exist.
However, am I observing the part of myself that is doing the observing? Can I even observe myself in that way? I just tried really hard and the answer is no

>>9362693
You have a very broad definition of observation. Am I observing myself when I'm sleeping ?

>>9362679
Even if we admit that we are constantly observing ourselves, my point is that it's not relevant to the topic of proving our own existance.

>>9362737
> Am I observing myself when I'm sleeping ?
Of course you are.

>>9362750
Can I ask you what your definition of observation is ?

>>9362759
I think what he means that you can't observe anything other than yourself. It is your thoughts, your own mind that you are using right now.
You aren't observing the "real world", only thing you are seeing is your own thoughts and stimuli about it.

>>9362770
that's not what I meant but sure

>>9362535
Can't wait for that

>>9362560
we all become religious again because we realise we cant handle it

>>9362687
It was founded by Felix Weil who wrote his PhD on finding alternative ways to implement socialism. The most prominent guests at the meeting that set off the institute were Georg Lukács and Karl Korsch both marxists who's main concern was finding ways to implement socialism in the west.

>>9360148
>the apex of society was Christian traditionalism

kys frogposting racist

>>9360112
The definitions on that slide are exactly why the periods in question have failed

>>9360112
Postmodernism is just self referential modernism.

>>9362655
>>9362663
Care to explain why I'm so wrong? Us idiots only continue to exist as long as Academics like yourself refuse to teach us

>>9363482
Reading comprehension doesn't appear to be your strong suit.

>>9361074
post humanism

>>9361074

If Hegel is anything to go by I guess the enlightenment rationalist/post-modernist empiricist dialectic will sublate and we'll get something that synthesises the two.

>>9364481
Didn't we already have that? Modernism?

>>9364487

Close but modernism didn't contain all the interesting developments of post-modernism.

In other words we had to go there even if it was "too far" and see where that thought would take us, before we can learn what are the useful parts of post-modernist thought we need to keep and what we need to discard. Then once we have that wisdom we can make historical progress.

If we cut it off at modernism we wouldn't have learned the useful developments of post-modernism, even if some of the developments were bad we needed to go there to see what we should keep and what we should not.

Or maybe Hegel was wrong anyway but it's an interesting way to look at how ideas progress.

>>9364563
Isn't this kind of progressivism and view of philosophy as "picking what works to move forward" something very modernist in itself?

>>9362541
It's not conspiracy theory, it's the work of Gyorgy Lukacs and Antonio Gramsci.

Postmodernism was what happened when French intellectuals realized communism was shit at reality. Instead of denying communism, they preferred to deny reality, all because they didn't want to admit they were wrong.

>>9364580

Sure, and the idea of different perspectives being something that could drive progress is a feature of both as well (even if Hegel thought there may have to be an initially destructive conflict between them).

>>9364563
>Hegel
>wrong
kek

>>9362614
>>9362621
>>9362637
>>9362644
>>9362658
>>9362679
>>9362693
>>9362724
>>9362737
>>9362750
>>9362759

>In a strange room you must empty yourself for sleep. And before you are emptied for sleep, what are you. And when you are emptied for sleep, what are you. And when you are emptied for sleep you are not. And when you are filled with sleep, you never were. I don't know what I am. I don't know if I am or not. Jewel knows he is, because he does not know that he does not know where he is or not. He cannot empty himself for sleep because he is not what he is and he is what he is not.

It's easy guys--just don't know that you don't know whether you are or not.

>>9360112

completely useless for understanding any of the thinkers and writers those periodizing labels allege to describe. how's that sound?

>>9361880

comically cliche at this point. try lizard people next time cutie pie

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>>9360112
this helps me more, but its still a little unintelligent

>law courses
Absolute autism

Let's create a new Athens or if everything fails a new sparta

>>9361074
something faith based.

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>>9361051
fixed it for you

>>9365143

that's stupid

>>9364600
Modernists denied reality. Postmodernists pointed to other things that comprise our reality that were unaccounted for in the failed projects of modernism

>>9364481
Post-modernism is Enlightenment thinking, but it allows for a 'return to nature' since it uses modernist systems to counter the alienating and nihilistic 'effects' of modernism

>>9363557
This is pretty accurate. The idea that modernism can't just be taken as-is and is not just a window onto the truth of the universe

>>9361670
underrated

>>9361880
>cultural bolshevism is a real conspiracy

>>9360148
>everything is subjective, there is no objective

That's not postmodernism. You're still thinking in dichotomies.

>>9362614
Esse est percipi, anon-friend

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fixed

>>9360112
it's accurate if you've only heard of post-modernism as something associated with "leftism" and you come from /pol/.

>>9366228
lol

>>9366258
only nerds and losers care about literature

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>>9366263

>>9366401
me on the left u on the rigt haha nerd

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>>9366402

>>9366419
me on the right you on thel eft

>>9362560
Well, Plato would say that after the belief in democracy inevitably dies in the hearts of the people (it has been eroding for a good long time now) a majority will elect a tyrant to keep those whom they see as dangerous thoughtcriminals from poisoning public discourse and otherwise influencing society. They'll find a boogeyman to fight against and unite under a single flag to destroy it.

>>9366514
I really need to read Plato.

What I'm interested in is what is coming
Is Brexit/Trump the beginning of the post-post-modern era? Will the rise of European nation states lead to a revival of European culture?
Will it be more classical than romantic?
And most important, how do we make ourselves a role to play in that world?

>>9367009
Contemporary was post-postmodern. Brump is post-contemporary.

>a revival of European culture?

Europeans won't have it, they're too different.

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>>9367009
>Is Brexit/Trump the beginning of the post-post-modern era?

that would imply there is competent thought and cohesive action within these groups

> Will the rise of European nation states lead to a revival of European culture?

What rise of European nation states?

> Will it be more classical than romantic?

yes

> And most important, how do we make ourselves a role to play in that world?

Just keep posting on /lit/

>>9367019
>Europeans won't have it, they're too different.
I can assure you, there is hope in the air here too. The future of EU will be decided by the french on 23rd, lets hope for the best.

>>9367088
>What rise of European nation states?
A rising appreciation of European countries cultures and demand for more localized and sovereign governments. Not much, but still this is the right direction for national cultures