>>8956605
I just thought I'd stop by and assure you that this was in fact a great idea for a thread.

>>8956620
Thank you. I thought so as well.

>American intellectuals

These faggots never read Ingenieros

>>8956764
The truth hurts doesn't it, José.

>>8956715
Crude, but accurate.

>>8956715
we didnt invent Mcgraw Hill, Harry Potter or Postmodernism, blanquitos

>>8957049
you didn't invent anything you dirty fucking spic

you disgust me

>>8957054
igual no inventamos el postmodernismo, blanquita

besitos

>>8957178
yeah I don't want you to mow my damn lawn LOL

>>8956715
Btw, just because the *average* IQ is low doesn't mean there can't be literary geniuses.

Damn why are Americans and Mexicans so equally salty and fucking stupid to be honest. Even Asia has more literary worth than your filthy continent. Nothing good has ever come out of America. Any part of America. The world would be better without you.

>>8957322
It's rude to disrespect Canada like that.

Borges. Borges towers over most American authors (though sadly, over 'all' other Latin American authors. So in a sense, he is rather an anomaly)

>>8957417
Borges is Lovecraft-tier

>>8957049
What did you invent, then?

>Bolano
>Lispector
>Borges

As if anyone cares about DFW outside of America

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>>8956605
Shut the fuck up.
Machado wrote postmodernism before modernism even had a chance to fucking happen, that's on how much irony he was on.

>>8957506
>Borges is Lovecraft-tier

Hi anon, I'm looking forward to all the growing up you have ahead of you this year!

>>8957640
I should have figured you were a Lovecraft fan.

>>8957615
>As if anyone cares about DFW outside of America

They do in some parts of Europe.

>>8957650

Not a Lovecraft fan, just a fan of good literature.

Did you read Euclides da Cunha, Augusto dos Anjos, Otto Maria Carpeaux, Lima Barreto, Monteiro Lobato, Mario de Andrade, Manuel Bandeira, Mário Ferreira dos Santos, Graciliano Ramos, João Guimarães Rosa, Carlos Drummond de Andrade, Cecília Meireles, Érico Veríssimo, Jorge Amado, Machado de Assis, etc?

>>8957745
>Monteiro Lobato

Had a hearty chuckle.

>>8957608
The airplane?

>>8957632
Yeah, OP, if youre not into Machado de Assis youre a fucking pleb.

>>8957745
>otto maria carpeaux, mário ferreira dos santos
>that heavy level of olavismo in my /lit/

>>8957417
DUDE LABYRINTHS LMAO

>>8957813
Oh yeah... but what about literature?

>>8957820
>that heavy level of sjw in my /lit/

Carpeaux is respected in the right and left wings. Did you read anything of MFS?

>>8957852
I've read Tratado de simbólica and it's absolute crap, apart from some interesting takes on color theory and Jungian psychology. You'd know if you had actually read it too.

Btw, I've read way more recs from Olavo than you can fucking mention. Good luck on finding his endgame though - it's not that hard desu.

>>8957745
its funny the way you shove up brazilian writers as they were somewhat relevant to the universal literature, and not shitty plagiarists
quantity != quality
in fact, its quite the opposite: brazilian literature is almost completely provincial/local and completely tied to its own time

btw, your list is high school tier
cecilia meireles? make me laugh! out of 10 poems, 1 is alright (nothing exceptional)
manuel bandeira has a good domain of the portuguese language, but then you read his poems and most of them are generics and the best ones aren't exceptional
augusto dos anjos is good with rymes and evoking an overused feeling, thats it
carlos drummond de andrade its probably the best of his generation, his poems are good but, again, nothing exceptional

brazilian poetry is fucking garbage when you compare to others country poetry

daily reminder that every nation owes a literary debt to Ireland that it will never be able to repay

>>8957679
>Borges
>good
>literature

>>8957949
No one cares, Paddy.

>>8957930
Drummond is great, Olavo Bilac is also pretty good, Manoel de Barros and Oswald de Andrade are good too. You're sort of plebeian, but you've got a point.

Machado de Assis is one of the greatest writers ever to live though.

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>>8957830
>be a boookish Argentinian kid
>grow up reading Shakespeare and Schopenhauer
>travel with papá to Europe and meet avant-garde writers
>come back to Buenos Aires with no friends nor qualifications
>become mildly successful writing mediocre stories about gauchos and detectives
>develop reputation as pretentious douche
>don't feel content with current work
>start writing about DUDE LABYRINTHS LMAO
>massive international success
>hailed as the greatest writer of the century
>bluff in every single interview
>everybody buys it
>tfw people value the persona of Borges over actual merit
>tfw attempts to point out the mundanity of work come off as even more vain
>tfw published a book under a pen name and was treated as a lowly impostor
>tfw denied a Nobel by leftist academia
>tfw only wanted to write humble pulp stories
>tfw died blind and trapped in own labyrinth
>tfw all because of DUDE LABYRINTHS LMAO

>>8957401
>le bell curve

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>>8958167
>You're sort of plebeian, but you've got a point.

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>>8958307
>Hay un nombre, Borges. Sí, escribe sobre literatura. Borges, para mí, no tiene la estimación que tiene para los demás. Ahora, estoy dispuesto a admitir que sea la excepción. No creo, en absoluto, que lo que lee el escritor llegue a formar parte de su propia vida y que sustituya en cierto modo a las experiencias. No. Lo que sucede es que eso, si se suma a una serie de características personales, produce un objeto muy adecuado para la sociedad de consumo, y entonces, qué sé yo, el instinto maternal de todas las histéricas del mundo se vuelca sobre un “sieguesito”, “pobresito”, “ansianito”. Eso gusta mucho.
CELA SAVAGE AF SENPAI

>>8957668
lmao americans truly believe this

>>8957745
>>8957820
Carpeaux is GOAT, MFS is shit, if you want good brazilian reactionary authors I point you to Eduardo Frieiros and Adonias Filho, and I'm as leftist as they come.

>>8959740
It's true.

>>8958307
what labyrinth are u talkin about?

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>>8958307

>>8957178
You say that like postmodernism is a bad thing.

>>8959865
it literally is

modernism was the apogee of literature and post modernism is its fast and unavoidable decline

>>8957668
Englishman here - Who?

>>8959883
Pleb. I've seen copies of Consider the Lobster sold in London bookshops.

>>8959874
>and post modernism is its fast and unavoidable decline

Nice opinion

>>8957930
Good post. Brazilian writers are awful.

>>8959888

L O N D O N
O
N
D
O
N

More seriously, we had every single DFW book in the non-London bookstore I worked at. However, only one copy of each with the exception Consider the Lobster, which is something I always found strange.

Spanish is the greatest language.
Latin American prose is better than any other prose by default just because of the use of spanish.

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>>8960109

>>8960109

>Spanish is the greatest language

Spoken with all the gusto only a Spanish speaking mind could whip up. "Greatest language" is a frame game only Latin Americans would get caught up in (As opposed to Spaniards and some Argentines, who are too self-assured to so nakedly project inferiority complex as you just did)

>>8960109
>implying its not french
>implying its not german

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>>8960169
>Argentines
>Exempt from Latin American Shit

I don't read literature from the American continent. Europe has more masterpieces than anyone could hope to read in their lifetime. Why would I waste my time on an inferior literature?

>>8960169
>Latin America includes more than 20 nations: Mexico in North America; Guatemala, Honduras, El Salvador, Nicaragua, Costa Rica and Panama in Central America; Colombia, Venezuela, Ecuador, Peru, Bolivia, Chile, French Guyana, Paraguay, Brazil, Argentina and Uruguay in South America; Cuba, the Dominican Republic, Haiti, and Puerto Rico

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Paulo Freire, a brazilian, its the third most cited guy in social sciences

>>8956715
>Kill Whitey
>implying white college students aren't the ones pushing the whole black lives matter scam
>implying white guilt isn't pretty much an american thing
>implying people weren't literally praying for a fucking shooter to be white

>Marxism=Good
You're right with this one, even tho most "intellectuals" don't really pick a side on economic models. Che was a mistake.

>Gringos=Bad
Also right, but it kinda is the universal feeling towards America. Don't really know why.

>We Wuz Aztecs
Most intellectuals blame Spain for not erasing pretty much any traces of native traditions. Vasconcelos and Paz express this on some essays.

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>>8957745

Augusto dos Anjos is alright, Jorge Amado and Erico Verissimo are alright. The others are garbage. Machado de Assis is overrated, he writes well but his stories are boring fucks.

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>>8960318

And a bloody commie that couldn't eliminate iliteracy. Hell, he could've copied USSr model but he failed at that too

>>8960368
>Most intellectuals blame Spain for not erasing pretty much any traces of native traditions.

kek, seriously? American critics would get crucified if they tried to complain about "native traditions."

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>>8960480
>Still third most cited

>>8960461
>The others are garbage.

Are they actually?

>>8960461
>praises Jorge Amado
>disses Graciliano Ramos and Guimarães Rosa
lol yeah

>>8960177
>implying it's not English

>>8960264
If you want to read good literature from the past 200 years, America is the place to go.

>>8959746
Are there translations of Carpeaux?

>>8960108
Yeah, that does seem kind of odd. Maybe Euros consider Wallace a "novelty" and don't actually read him lol

>>8959696
>>8959696
>“sieguesito”, “pobresito”, “ansianito”

what does this mean?

>>8958167
>>8957930
>>8957745
Euclides da Cunha escapes all criticism due to pretty great narrative non-fiction in a dry witty 19th century tone.

>>8957322
Are we not the product of Europe? It seems the fault of the mother when a child grows up poorly.

>>8961012
>t. american

I'm glad we can all come to the consensus that there is no such thing as a good Latin American author.

>>8956605
who are you talking about?

>>8958307
>>tfw published a book under a pen name and was treated as a lowly impostor

tfw you plebian pathetically ate that bait

>>8962031
Something like poor little old and blind man

>>8956605

> A region with an average IQ of 80,

That means they are smarter than the ancient Greeks

> kill commies, capitalism = gud, east= bad, we waz Romans plus occasional dollops of gimmicky 'magical realism'

Now you know how I feel in every western lit class. Do you know how disappointed I was with Oedipus' tales? Literally a faggot who made stupid decisions then cried about it like a girl, yet there's tons of essays talking about how 'brave and courageous'he was.

Oedipus is nothing but a long drawn out Mariah Carey song, the rest of Greek literature a cheap copy of Babylonian mythos.

I can listen to one faggoty underoath song and get all of Shakespeare's 'brilliant' (not) themes in one minute,
about superstition and how life sucks.

Holy shit literature majors should kill themselves

>>8956715
>A region with an average IQ of 80
that is not how IQ works, homo

>>8959696
Jesús, Camilo, esa mierda fue casi esquizofrenica. ¿Qué coño le pasa?

>>8962248
>>8962031
Yeah, but doing a mocking takeoff of how latinoamerican accent sounds for spaniards

>>8963578
Cela siempre fue un hijoputa como persona. Y no parece que perdonase a Borges que éste despreciase públicamente al panorama literario español de su tiempo como parvo y mediocre.

>>8963527
>That means they are smarter than the ancient Greeks
What makes you say that?

>>8963652
>Y no parece que perdonase a Borges que éste despreciase públicamente al panorama literario español de su tiempo como parvo y mediocre.

Como si no fuera verdad. Franco mató a quemarropa todo el talento que crecía en España; y los que no mató, se fueron. Cela es casi una excepción. Gala, a lo mejor.

>>8963527
Are you seriously trying to deflect the fact that Latin American literature is shit by saying that all literature is shit? Lmaoing @ your life.

>>8963670
He's projecting the low quality of Latin American literature onto authors from the rest of the world. Sad, if you ask me.

>>8963674
Yo creo más bien que Franco aniquiló cualquier posibilidad para una escena cultural, una infraestructura, un mercado, sostenibles a la larga. Que frustró toda oportunidad de constituir una tradición literaria española contemporánea, un "canon". Pero el talento florece en cualquier parte. Umbral o Benet son muy buenos, por ejemplo. No sé si hay alguien en la esfera hispanohablante que haya intentado lo que Julián Ríos. Otra cosa es que sean comprendidos o apreciados. Un americano de clase media seleccionado al azar sabrá quién es Faulkner y probablemente haya leído algo suyo; al menos, sabrá decir de qué van Mientras Agonizo o El Ruido Y La Furia. Qué decir de los latinos y sus superestrellas del boom. Un español de clase media, de 40 o 50 años, sabe quién es Umbral, con suerte le sonará Benet, pero los que han leído algo suyo o saben algo de su obra son cuatro gatos. A Umbral y Arrabal se les conoce por haber salido en la tele haciendo de literatos excéntricos. Arrabal tiene más éxito en Francia que aquí. Los únicos autores de la época que es más o menos conocido son Delibes y Cela, y al segundo más por su personaje mediático que por su obra, igual que Arrabal o Umbral. Creo que lo de que Franco dejó a España huérfana de talento desde el 39 hasta el 78 es sólo cierto en parte. Otra cuestión es si la atmósfera de la España postrepublicana ha dado lugar a autores cuya perspectiva sólo puede entender un español (y eso no tendría por qué ser malo).

>>8964481
>Julián Ríos

Is this one of your famous Latin American authors?

>>8964512
Nah he a spaniard. He kinda tries to make a spanish Finnegans Wake with every novel. Nobody here knows of him. I think he lives in France.

>>8956715
I want to refute this but can't.

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>>8956605
>ITT: uncultured rednecks posing as intellectuals

>>8964545
>ITT: Latin Americans agreeing that their countries have no intellectuals

FTFY

ITT: People who have accomplished nothing attach themselves to people that didn't waste their lives based on regional locations of birth for a brief sense of accomplishment.

Stop wasting space and write, faggots.

>>8964624
Some of us here actually read. Crazy, right?

>>8960461
>His stories are boring

go fucking play god of war or some shit, you philistine

>>8960368
>>8960368
>Also right, but it kinda is the universal feeling towards America. Don't really know why.
It baffles me how americans fail to realize this, the whole world despises them and only wants their dollars.

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the best brazilian writer is manuel antônio de almeida

don't believe in anyone who tells you otherwise, for they are plebs

>reading

>>8964637
>us
There you go again, attaching yourself to a bigger group of people. Have fun following your herd. I'm sure some day one of you will do something worthwhile so that the lot of you can project out of your miserable existence and pretend like you too have an untapped potential.

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>>8964674
Does this mean I'm the only person in the world who reads?

Damn...

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>>8964667
>part of the Romanticist movement

>>8964735
>judging an author based on """his""" literary movement
if you had read this book or just google the authors name you would realize Memoirs of a Police Sargent has almost no traces of romanticism

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>>8956605
>lo pobre... que valen meno... que la bala... que lo mata

>>8964751
I did Google the author's name. That's how I knew he was part of the Romanticism movement.

>>8964660
A lot of Americans recognize this, and that's why they're working on improving their GDP.

>>8959696
¿Hay algo que este Hombre no pueda hacer?

>>8964481
Gran opinión, amigo. Da gusto encontrarse estas cosas.

>>8964516
i remember his name, someone memed about him like 3 years ago.
la familia de pascual duarte (or whatever) was pretty cool desu. otherwise yes, Cela sounds like a butthurt gallego :DDDDDDDDDDDD

>>8957378
>canadian culture

>>8964836
That's deep.

>>8964836
holy... i want more...

>>8965058
Evitar que me duerma con La Colmena.

>>8965226
>>8965180
Galeano is truly a hack

>>8957930
>in fact, its quite the opposite: brazilian literature is almost completely provincial/local and completely tied to its own time

>probably from the country of provincial dipshits like King and Whitman.

MA (that has a whole class subject in Yale), Drummond and Rosa are elder god tier shit. The only reason why the later two didnt win a Nobel is that until nowadays that fucking Nobel academia only looks to vapid, bland, insuferable slav authors like a ostrich with its head on a shit hole

>>8965322
I'm not surprised desu

hating on borges! nonsense. It is the only latin american novel i have read..

>>8965405
>It is the only latin american novel i have read..

That's more than enough.

>>8965405
Lets not pretend like 805 of his stories aren't shitty

>>8965456
>805
80%, Borges would've probably wrote a pretentious essay on the metaphysical implications of godly providence in that mistake

>>8965446
Borges mixes the personal and the monumental /historical and his imagery is brilliant. But in the end i could not make a full evaluation since i only speak swedish and ancient greek.

why is this board so racist ._.

>>8965509
It's not racist to say that Latin America has produced nothing of literary value.

>>8965517
'literary value' is a meme.

>>8965530
Only if you're Latin American.

>>8965534
well memed

>>8965568
He's right though. Latin America is an intellectual black hole of Australia level

>>8965586
meme

>>8965530
>>8965568
>>8965624
Stellar vocabulary you have there. Are you from Latin America, by chance?

>>8965586
>>8965517
there are valuable things, but they are valuable to their own time and place
theres nothing universal here
not even borges

>>8965824
That's too bad.

>>8965308
Deja los videojuegos y las pajas

Spanish is such an unattractive language.

>>8956605

A) Novelists arent intellectuals
B) American literature post WW2 is clearly inferior to Latin American literature
C) American writers are neither read nor taken seriously outside the USA.
D) American literature is very underwhelming for a first world country with over 300 million people.

>>8966404
A) Good novelists are intellectuals, and Latin America produces zero good novelists
B) Wrong.
C) The popularity of American lit is irrelevant.
D) What's the population of Latin America?

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>>8966424

>>8966445
>Borges
>novelist

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>>8966424
>no me hinches las pelotas, boludo

>>8966424
>Latin America produces zero good novelists

What about actually read them

How can you say that latin american literature is bad when Bolaño was the last great novelist?

>m-muh pynchman
Fuck off with your wacky entry-level garbage.

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>>8966424
>Este anon volvió a Lemebel heterosexual

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>>8966424
>esa sensacion cuando a anon se le escapa el autismo

Top tier latinoamerican novels:

>Garcia Marquez – One Hundred Years of Solitude
>Vargas Llosa – Conversation in the Cathedral
>Carlos Fuentes – The Death of Artemio Cruz
>Julio Cortazar – Hopscotch
>Juan Rulfo – Pedro Paramo
>Juan Carlos Onetti – The Shipyard
>Guillermo Cabrera Infante – Three Trapped Tigers
>Augusto Roa Bastos – I The Suprme
>Alejo Carpentier – The Century of Lights
>Jose Lezama Lima – Paradiso
>Jose Donoso – The Obscene Bird of the Night
>Roberto Bolaño – 2666
>Loepoldo Marechal – Adan Buenosayres
>Bioy Casares – The Invention of Morel
>Fernando del Paso – Jose Trigo
>Mario Benedetti - The Truce: The Diary of Martín Santomé
>Ernesto Sabato – The Tunnel
>Macedonio Fernandez – The Museum of Eterna's Novel
>Manuel Puig – The Kiss of the Spider Woman
>Miguel Angel Asturias – The President
>Salvador Elizondo – Farabeuf
>Roberto Arlt – The Seven Madmen
>Juan Jose Saer – El Limonero Real

All of this is from the 20s, also, most of them oscillate between avant garde, modernism, postmodernism and experimentalism technique (very few doesn’t).

>>8966631
>leopoldo marechal
te amo

>>8956715
Damn. There are some truth bombs being dropped in here.

>>8958307
So you actually think he literally wrote about Labyrinths? Have you ever heard the term Literary Device?

>>8966803
Many of his stories are literally about labyrinths, dumbass. Immortals, Library of Babel, that one about an asian spy

>>8966813
if you only surmise the surface level of his story then just go ahead and never read him again.

>>8966355
Asúmelo, La Colmena es una puta mierda sin más valor literario que Twitter.

>>8967154
Honestly, Borges' mysticism is pretty straightforward.

>>8966631
Fantastic taste, nice to see some people here that don't just spout shit without having read a thing

>>8967775
Jaja

si

>>8964579
This is so false that it doesn't work to rustle people. Anyone that reads Latin American works will see that this is a ridiculous thing to say.

>>8965517
When you say this do you mean that we are not in a position of influence or that our works are of a low quality? Because if it is the latter, it is clear that you haven't read one line of any Latin American work.

>>8957178
ssshhhh only wall now

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As I Lay Dying ...
Pedro Paramo ..
Cien Años de Soledad..
Harry Potter ..

>>8964481
>Gringos leyendo faulkner

Lol no, hermano, yo diria q una minoria pequeña sabe quien es faulkner y practicamente madie puede tener una conversacion acerca the sound and the fury. Mucha gente en /lit/ le gusta alardear q esos libros ellos los leian em el colegio, pero la verdad es q los q lo leyeron estaban en un programa especial de literatura, y el estudiante "genio" promedio, no tiene puta idea quien es william faulkner.

>>8968503
?

>>8968628
tuve que leer Faulkner en la prepa publica. Podemos imaginar que muchos otros estudiantes lo han hecho tambien, ¿no?
>>8968675
Faulkner influences Rulfo, who influences Marquez, who influenced Rowling.

>>8968628
escribe bien maldito idiota