http://thephilosophicalsalon.com/th e-sexual-is-political/

>>8379958
[gif of man opening chair and sitting]
Dis gone be good

Wow, I thought he would side with SJWs... respect.

Slavoj really BTFO a large segment of the Left in that article tbqh.

>>8380297
This, I thought he was leftist tho?

>>8380310
He considers himself a Leftist, but sometimes I wonder in what way.

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>http://thephilosophicalsalon.com/a-reply-to-my-critics/
>[4] Quoted from: https://m.reddit.com/r/GamerGhazi/comments/4vxmfk/philosopher_slavoj_zizek_knows_next_to_nothing/
>Zizek is literally replying to reddit posts

>>8380319
>>8380319
I find it kind of cute.

>>8380319
All right, fuckers, IT'S TIME. We need to get Zizek onto 4chan. He's spent enough time on the internet, he's ready. We need to direct him here.

How can I achieve to write like that? I was thinking of making a podcast and discuss ideas, but I feel I would just express simplistic observations of things.

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>This deadlock of classification is clearly discernible in the need to expand the formula: the basic LGBT (Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transgender) becomes LGBTQIA (Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transgender, Questioning, Intersex, Asexual) or even LGBTQQIAAP (Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transgender, Queer, Questioning, Intersex, Asexual, Allies, Pansexual). To resolve the problem, one often simply adds a + which serves to include all other communities associated with the LGBT community, as in LGBT+. This, however, raises the question: is + just a stand-in for missing positions like “and others,” or can one be directly a +?

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>>8380351
The satire is pretty subtle.

I doubt one of those people will get it though, they don't really have the faculty of humor.

>>8380339
But how will we do it?

>>8379958
fuck he responds to a reddit comment in a reply to my critics

>>8380339
>implying he isn't already a /pol/tard
get real, he probably made this thread and mentioned reddit just to trigger idiots.

>>8380339
A Zizek Q&A on 4chan would be amazing

>>8380315
he's a non-identity politics leftist
outside of n. america, they are the majority, it's just your worthless culture that has people inventing all over the place

>>8380358

I'm a simp.
Please explain the humour here.

Is it that Zizek is playing dumb at the end, or that a "+" has some comedic value I'm unaware of

>>8380435
He's literally just trolling.

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>The great mistake in dealing with this opposition is to search for a proper measure between two extremes. What one should do instead is to bring out what both extremes share: the fantasy of a peaceful world where the agonistic tension of sexual difference disappears, either in a clear and stable hierarchic distinction of sexes or in the happy fluidity of a desexualized universe. And it is not difficult to discern in this fantasy of a peaceful world the fantasy of a society without social antagonisms, in short, without class struggle.

>>8380358
>>8380435
It's not at all a joke, he loops back to the point at the end of the article.

>Thinkers like Frederic Lordon have recently demonstrated the inconsistency of “cosmopolitan” anti-nationalist intellectuals who advocate “liberation from a belonging” and in extremis tend to dismiss every search for roots and every attachment to a particular ethnic or cultural identity as an almost proto-Fascist stance. Lordon contrasts this hidden belonging of self-proclaimed rootless universalists with the nightmarish reality of refugees and illegal immigrants who, deprived of basic rights, desperately search for some kind of belonging (like a new citizenship). Lordon is quite right here: it is easy to see how the “cosmopolitan” intellectual elites despising local people who cling to their roots belong to their own quite exclusive circles of rootless elites, how their cosmopolitan rootlessness is the marker of a deep and strong belonging. This is why it is an utter obscenity to put together elite “nomads” flying around the world and refugees desperately searching for a safe place where they would belong–the same obscenity as that of putting together a dieting upper-class Western woman and a starving refugee woman.
Damn that first article is devastating.

>Consequently, there is only one solution to this deadlock, the one we find in another field of disposing waste, that of trash bins.
Dammit Zizek

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how can one man be so based
pls lets get him here sometime

>>8380495
Have you been eating from the trash can of ideology

>>8380504
i eat there all the time

>>8380391
he has publicly declared his preference towards trump compared to hilary
i bet he belives in kek

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>In the space of anti-Semitism, the “Jew” stands for social antagonism as such: without the Jewish intruder, the two classes would live in harmony… Thus, we can observe how the third intruding element is evental: it is not just another positive entity, but it stands for what is forever unsettling the harmony of the two, opening it up to an incessant process of re-accommodation.

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>mfw all these spergs on here realize zizek isnt only a fucking clown

cis-scum

>>8380458
>>8379958
wow! looks like zizek's been chomping down on some ideology

sexual dimorphism is natural law. going against it will only bring about suffering and ennui. sounds like a dystopia.

>>8380268
What made you think that?

this is fucking hilarious

>>8380625
you misunderstand him

>>8380625
Wow anon you suck at reading.

>>8380641
>>8380639
nah, you guys did

>>8380666
no
you didnt earn your trips anon

>>8380666
He wrote two articles asserting that sexuality is not a dimorphism and you didn't pick up on it?

>>8380686
damn, read what i wrote because that's exactly what i said

>>8380708
>sexual dimorphism is natural law. going against it will only bring about suffering and ennui. sounds like a dystopia.
The last sentence reads as a response, which contextualizes the first sentence as a (wrong) paraphrasing.

>>8380358
Tranny here, alphabet soup is for nonces with pink-triangle bedroo ideas.

>>8380729
me saying sexual dimorphism real also innate

him saying sexual dimorphism fake also bad. trannys go about it wrong way. trannys not real trannys.

you saying "He wrote two articles asserting that sexuality is not a dimorphism". me say i agree he said "sexuality is not dimorphism".

me say that stupid! me say he stupid!

>>8380761
you're definitely stupid

>>8380768
me detect fish smell from post

>>8380761
>confusing sex with gender
It's really not that hard to understand

>>8380772
you're just really dumb

I feel like Zizek is talking way over the heads of most of his critics and he realizes it. I find the whole situation funny, a very real example of the futility of trying to reason with the uneducated.

>>8380775
midol day huh

>>8380782
you better think you're being funny for the sake of your own soul

>>8380787
got mad

>>8380790
>>8380768

>>8380793
>>8380790

>>8380416
You must not live in the UK or Oz my third world friend

>>8380805
fine, anglos, whatever
i thought they were less bad as they seem to have genuine intellectual conversatives
(well maybe not oz but the gene pool got crapped in)

>>8379958
the second article is better and actually really quite good

>>8380761
his position is quite a bit more complicated than that friendo, that sexual dimorphism is just 'fake also bad.' i mean, did you even read them? i mean sheesh

>>8380830
yeah when you douse it in ideology lol

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>>8380625
>natural
>law

>>8380848
>yeah, let's just take an even MORE spooked position! epin!

>>8380567
I realized that a long time ago.

Someone post the chart.

>>8380850
Being some sort of magical, unspooked Man is – a spook.

>>8380863
rely maee me thinjK@!

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Poor Zizek. You make a few select people butthurt and the whole world starts hating you.

>>8380777
I think you're right. Leftist identity politics people want him to champion transgender rights (which, by the way, he is in favor of), but he wants to talk about how every identity (straight, queer, trans, trans-straight, post-queer, whatevs) is always already an act of violence. Which, by the way, is what he's been on about since the early 90s, but popular culture is only just beginning to catch up to him, and popcult is mad that a big name lefty isn't parroting the party line.

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>>8380871
Your sarcastic impotence is delicious.

>>8380891
>sarcasm

nice spook

>>8380874
Good

>>8379958
>people who don't fit the binary put in question the existence of said binary
yes, nice falafelocizing
and so how are we to rid ourselves of the 3rd antagonizing element? eugenics? mass killing? lets get rid of ugly people while we are at it, just a thought.

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>>8380897

>>8380909
Read the article.

>>8380911
pure ideology

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>>8380880
What is about this era and the mob mentality of the mainstream left/right?

>>8380933
Most people have been mobbish for all of history. The right had it pretty good for a little bit because William F. Buckley chased all of the anti-semites out of the Republican party for a few years, but they all came back. The left has always loved to attack other leftists (see Orwell's Homage to Catalonia, in which the Communist turn their guns on the anarchists) and the right is getting just as bad.

As Zizek says, take the third pill and study, study, study. Read Carl Schmitt and Zizek, Leo Strauss and Karl Marx, Nietzsche and Adorno.

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>>8380909

Do you know what's literally going to happen? White people are going to die out either from failing to reproduce, genocide, or both. Then the retarded ideas we invented will disappear and the mud races with their simple peasant mentality will inherit the earth.

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>>8381010
>tfw there are hundreds of millions of black and brown Christians

We're going to be all right, my brothers and sisters in Christ.

I'm really jealous of this nigga. He seems very creative.

>>8380909
he is literally not saying this holy fuck

>>8379958
>different colored hats
Has Gaben finally seen the error of his ways?

>>8381034
zizek is bad at not having idiots think he is saying the opposite thing
maybe it's on purpose so people pay attention to him, i honestly have no idea

>>8380310
He's basically adapting a lot of French New Right/Religious Right arguments for the Left

>>8381048
nah maing i didnt see no right wing arguments except for the part in which he mentions that postgenderism will only or might only bring about the death of sexuality. But in no part does he shit explicitly atleast on transgenders or anything like that

>>8380546
but if Jews invented psychology, doesn't that mean that Jews invented this antagonism in the first place? Is Zizek playing 8D chess?

I've read a lot about this online, and so far the radfem position seems most plausible to me:

1) There are biological facts about sex. Humans are a sexually dimorphic species with various sorts of intersex categories.

2) There are stereotypes and power structures that grow up around these sexual qualities. The enforcement of the resulting classes is gender.

That's it. No such thing as 'gender identity,' or a 'male/female brain,' or 'feeling like a gender,' or 'genderqueer,' etc. I can't think of anything that adds to the above two undeniable points that isn't just 'muh feels' or wish fulfillment fantasy astrology nonsense. Am I wrong to think the situation is that clear?

>>8381055
he implies that the Left needs duality to function, and that unlimited difference (creating much more inequality) will cause Right-wing arguments to dominate, and so this is how polygenderism creates problems for the Left. As far as him adapting arguments from the Right, this is basically a pose he takes, for instance on the humanity of Christ, which is the one thing that cannot be integrated into Liberalism (or Judaism, for that matter).

>>8381066
This is a good point. 2nd wave feminism is, to use one of the feminists' favorite words, toxic, but it's the most coherent position philosophically. We should recognize that all sex is rape, just as we should recognize that all legitimate political authority is founded upon violence. The point is not to get rid of violence but to find a way to rationalize it, make it legitimate. Everyone remembers Rousseau's first lines in The Social Contract: "Man is born free, but everywhere he is in chains," and forgets how the paragraph ends, with Rousseau saying that he thinks he can make the constraints of society legitimate.

>>8381034
He literally is, he just presents no solutions and really takes no sides. Getting rid of the 3rd party would be a way to protect the enforced binary, which does serve some function. A function that has come under a lot of questioning recently.

>>8381022

I don't believe in god, but I wish Christianity was still common in the West. It gave life meaning and purpose.

zizek is spot on

>>8379958
>So the big question of tolerance is, do we tolerate intolerance?
Is it really this fucking hard to notice if you aren't Zizek? The whole "intellectual left" fails not only to answer these very natural questions, but even to start discussing them.

>>8381150

>but even to start discussing them.

but that goes against the narrative, anon.

and at all costs we must protect the narrative.

Can't we just settle on the logical conclusion that there are men and women, and then there are a whole bunch of mentally ill bipeds?

>>8381156
That's one possible perspective, as Zizek notes. The other is that all sexual identities are oppressive and are to be discarded. Which is no less logical tbqh

>>8381160
But he says that sexuality is inherently antagonistic and that the rigid MF distiction is antagonistic as well. This rigidness he thinks is just a lie we create to reduce our Real tensions.

>>8381160

I'd say it's highly illogical given that human reproduction depends entirely on binary sex. You still need a male (XY) and a female (XX) to make a viable offspring.

>>8381178
Sure you do, but that fact is also oppressive (and seemingly fixable with technological advances)
>>8381175
That way you can say that any dichotomy is a lie to be solved through dialectical synthesis. It's still a useful and working division.

I think that the notion of "a society which accepts all weird configurations (LGBTASADSADASD) in order to ease people's anxieties" leading to the death of sexuality is just drivel. I mean just discard lacanian nonsense and think of it empirically; why can't I, as a heterosexual horny masculine guy, accept and respect weirdly gendered people and retain my masculinity? Is that scenario inconceivable? I know fairly masculine people who believe in all of these sexualities given credence, and nothing has magically changed in them.

I think Zizek is just trying to justify intolerance with unempirical drivel.

>>8381182

Just because you can contravene biological limitations does not mean the identities based on binary gender are obsolete. Women will still be physically smaller and predominantly affected by estrogens, whereas males will be larger and influenced by androgens. Biological sex is the basis of psychological identity. You can't talk someone into being a homosexual or a transsexual.

>>8381184
Sorry to break it to you buddy but you aren't a masculine man.

>>8381184
>I, as a heterosexual horny masculine guy
HAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA
WOW

>>8381201
if you'd see mah dick you would believe me, sir ;)

>>8381208
What's about your very feminine penis?

>>8381184

k-e-k

>>8381211
8 inches soft

>>8381184
anyway, the reason it's so easy to make fun of you is zizek's point; you're constructing an identity here, there will always be friction, it cannot be overcome, assuming we can reach that point is stupid and others (not zizek unless he's written about it elsewhere) would say such stupidity is harmful because the weirdly gendered think they aren't supposed to feel as if they are struggling to create, they should be at ease, and if they aren't, they should bind their breasts/cut off their cock

>>8381184
>I think that the notion of "a society which accepts all weird configurations (LGBTASADSADASD) in order to ease people's anxieties" leading to the death of sexuality is just drivel.

Cool, so does Zizek. His point is that all sexuality is essentially uncanny and that identifying as one thing excludes a whole ton of other things, and so makes one anxious/angsty (what am I missing?). No one identifies as what they're interpellated as, it's always an imposition, but the tragic thing is that there's no self before this imposition. You are created when someone says "you are a boy," "you are a girl," or, even, "you are a genderqueer furkin."

Z's point is that having a sexuality, at all, is always oppressive and, while we should allow trans* persons to use whatever bathrooms they want, we shouldn't lose sight of the fact that all identity is ideology, and that claims of "authenticity" (I was raised as a boy but I'm really a girl!) are also just ideology that hint at the essential void at the heart of the subject (none of us are really anything until we're put into a social context).

>>8381175
You say that as if the FM antagonism is something surprising that has to be pointed out.

>>8381231
You are mostly correct, except there are biological foundations for sex and sexual preferences, which make things a bit more complicated. But that's just another form of oppression.

Generally speaking, everything that divides us from not-us, and thus produces us as discrete beings, is oppressive. Apparently this falls within the framework of hegelian worldview, with which Zizek works.

>>8381231
Well then my point still stands since, if noone but the people identifying as queer are affected by this "imposition" then, to speak of a sexless society is meaningless. It'd just be sexless for those involved in deviancy and pretty much remain the same way for the rest; the MF dychotomy still stands, but new unsubstancial added elements (in cuantitative terms; you wouldn't encounter many weirdos in your daily life) just happened to have emerged.

I get what youre saying in terms of our vacuosness without the social order or things and the concept that you miss out on things, but that's a sacrifice these people are willing to make, and i would say, it probably makes them happier and less anxious.

Now i probably sound like a faggot but whatever.

>>8381251
gtfo jorge

>>8381251
That's not quite right, though, because Zizek's point is that even if you do perfectly identify with the dominant order, then you are still aware of a "castration complex." That is, even if you are still a perfectly shitlord cishet alpha male, you are still haunted by the question of what it feels like for a girl... And vice versa. The emergence of transgender persons as a political category both 1) makes explicit this problem and 2) obscures it, insofar as trans persons want to be their own special category. Zizek's point is that, no matter how many categories you make, there will always be a remainder, the question of "what am I missing?". He wants to draw our attention to this superfluous element, that no matter how we identify, we're always leaving something out. It's a variation of the Hegelian point that every affirmation is also a series of infinite negations (when I say cat, I mean not-dog, not-human, not-mouse, not-a copy of Infitinite Jest, etc).

>>8380315
He is in every way leftist. it's american that has a warped view of what the left is. Protip: not authoritarian.

>>8381291
Left is naturally authoritatian
t. Stirner

>>8381295
it isn't.
t. fuck you

>>8380567
Zizek can only blame himself for giving that image.
Mostly because you can't always tell if he's joking or not (like when he talks about toilet construction)
Thanks to this though he can get away with saying things like "I am for capital punishment because Sam Harris is alive."

>>8381351
It's like the court jester who may be the smartest man around the king and gets to say things others can't because he's a jester.

>>8381360

>Q: Who is the jester's jester?
>A: The king.

>>8380416
Uhhh, that shit comes out of France, and they along with the UK and Germany are much further down that rabbit hole. US doesn't have restrictions on free speech unlike Europe, so fuck off.

>>8381389
>US doesn't have restrictions on free speech unlike Europe

>>8381406
USA has much weaker restrictions, to be precise. And it has the 1st amendment, while europe has nothing more than the abstract "censorship is bad" meme.

>>8381291
THIS. Thanks anon for putting this out. Recently alll the gender discussion have been attributed to Marx. I mean what the fuck? Zizek is leftist in every way becayse he's a communist. And i mean that in a good way not that american rascal use of the word.

>>8381421
What exactly good communist does that bad communist does not, and vice versa?

>>8381426
I meant that many americans uses the word communist as negative designation. Where in some places of Europe it doesn't have the same negative ring to it.

>>8381435
Americans love communist witchhunting, sure. But a big part of Europe, that including Russia, have experienced communism firsthand and thus holds certain scepticism towards it.

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>>8381295
have you fucking read stirner

>>8381406
Pretty much. You can serve jail time for holocaust denial or hate speech in France and Germany. The point was it's absurd to paint the US as the purveyors of social Marxism when it's not true, and only a few years ago people thought the complete opposite.

The right wing in the US is not completely marginalized yet like it is in Europe. I used to wish it was, but when I see what the left has been getting up to lately, I miss the days when bible-thumping rednecks were supposedly the biggest threat to our national discussion.

>>8381435
and there are some places in Europe where wearing a hammer and sickle will get you thrown in jail or kicked in the head

>>8381439
True. I don't think we disagree in anything.

>>8381440
Yes, and have you? He has a nice chart of liberals who, increasing the degree of liberality, simultaneously increase their authoritarity.

>>8381439
>experienced communism firsthand

>>8381453
liberals are not leftist

>>8381459
Well, Stirner called them liberals, and the modern leftism falls into his classification pretty well. I don't know any other left, or liberals, save for free market loving libertarians (who obviously aren't left). And maybe anarcho-primitivists.

>>8380310
He's a leftist. The liberals who oppose him are just zealous centrists.

The whole "SJW" phenomenon isn't very left, but just the particularly impassioned defence and extension of social ideals.

>>8381295
you're a fucking moron and citing stirner doesn't change that fact

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>>8380339

>>8381447
>social marxism

Kill yourself

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>>8381467
I bet this actually was zizek

>>8379958
Do my best. You don't have to succeed.

>>8381447
>I used to wish it was, but when I see what the left has been getting up to lately, I miss the days when bible-thumping rednecks were supposedly the biggest threat to our national discussion.
what does that even mean? forget it, just stop posting

>>8381490
If you can't understand his sentence, maybe you should stop visiting /lit/

>>8381490
he's doesn't understand the difference between the left and liberalism because he's an american
it's not that complicated

so has anyone emailed this thread to comrade ziz?

>>8381047
He has himself to blame at least a bit. I mean, if someone does the "if we can have transgender why not relationships with animals" would you really expect people to think he actually meant that we should recognize relationships with animals?

Anyway, the part about the transgender project being postgenderism is just wrong. A lot of trans people don't like the idea of gender abolition and many gender abolitionists don't hate trans people (TERFs).

>>8381508
if one is meant to gather that "the american left is more of a threat to our national discussion than bible-thumping rednecks" then please explain what that even means. specifically, tell me why anyone would use the phrase "our national discussion" in any situation, and what that particular poster was meaning to communicate by saying that it is lamentable that now the left is an even bigger threat "to our national discussion" than bible-thumping rednecks. alternatively, kill yourself

>>8381231
Thank god one person read the fucking article.

Can we keep the knee jerk Facebook "I haven't read the link but I'll comment on it anyway" posting to Facebook newfags? This isn't the place to post drivel where your "friends" can't see.

>>8381066
And the neuroscience that seems to imply that brains are somewhat gendered? And even if genders are completely social that doesn't mean they're not real.God isn't real but christianity is. Btw some woman who didn't believe in gender identity tried living as a man just to disprove it and ended up feeling dysphoric as fuck.

>>8381156
Intersex is real and not mental. Lrn 2 biology.

>>8381231
This.

>>8381412
What? America is not the only country with free speech in the constitution.

>>8381536
>And the neuroscience that seems to imply that brains are somewhat gendered?
Neuroscience is a young science and incredibly vulnerable to "hidden bias" in research. This is mostly down to stupidity: the biggest thing is treating very complicated analysis such as one might find in MRI scans as both magic and ineffable. Like it's mass and wilful ignorance in regards to large parts of how the results are obtained in the lab. Another big thing that is allegedly getting less big but you are kidding yourself if you believe it is poor subject selection. Many researchers historically haven't taken nurture/lifestyle etc elements into account, which again is stupid considering the brain is v plastic. So you often get the equivalent of male dirt bike racers compared to female knitting circle goers, and the differences are held up as "male v female" not "dirt bike racing v knitting and gossip"

Do not underestimate the stupidity of these people or the people around themselves and you.

>>8381447
Economically there's virtually nothing but right wing parties. And even on the 'value' axis you're wrong given the rise of the far right. You seem to get all your political information from memes.

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>be tranny
>agree with everything he said
>legions of white guilt sjws attack him in defense of 'people like me'

Every time

>Judd thinks that his belief in the truth of Communism results from his thorough study of history and the texts of Marx, to which Guy replies, 'You are not a Communist because you understand Marx, you understand Marx because you are a Communist!' - that is to say, Judd understands Marx because he presupposes in advance that Marx is the bearer of knowledge enabling access to the truth of history, like the Christian believer who does not believe in Christ because he has been convinced by theological arguments but, on the contrary, is susceptible to theological arguments because he is already illuminated by the grace of belief.

Fuck this philosophical mumbo jumbo
Literally random words

>>8381536
>some woman who didn't believe in gender identity tried living as a man

And once again, someone confuses gender with sex.

>>8380297
>>8380310
Lacan is a card-carrying hetero-normative who thinks women will never be able to articulate what they want.

>>8381609
He has one of the best talks on the censorship of "nigger". Certain white people are such shits that when they're reminded of something that makes them feel bad or guilty they go around trying to suppress it so it "doesn't oppress others".

>>8381609
>being triggered by male tears shirts

>>8381640
No I didn't. She didn't change her sex.

>>8380310
>I thought he was leftist tho?
he is

>>8380315
>He considers himself a Leftist, but sometimes I wonder in what way.
He's literally a gommunist. It's only in fucked up America-land that "leftist" means starbucks-drinking, poor-people-hating bourgeouis capitalist stooges..

>>8380761
You saying dimorphism real also innate

Zizek saying there is tension between the two morphs, conservative attempts to harmonise the tension by strict enforcement of gender roles and liberal attempts to harmonise the tension through abolishment of gender roles are both misguided as well as counter-productive and there is no way to harmonise the tension because the tension is innate.

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Zizek: Multiculturalism is terrible because cultures in general are terrible

:O :O :O

>Tim Cook can easily forget about hundreds of thousands of Foxconn workers in China assembling Apple products in slave conditions;
I don't understand why do lefties always bring this up though. They do know those people choose to work at those factories because it's literally the best job available to them, far better than anything local employers offer?

>>8381818

that doesn't change the fact that tim cooke is directly responsible for inhumane working conditions

>>8381823
>helping people improve their living condition is reprehensible if you don't help them enough to meet some arbitrary standard imposed by western champagne socialists
Guess he should pull out those factories then and liberate those locals from their inhuman working conditions.

>>8381833

or in the name of consistency, enforce standards, being the champion of human rights that he is

>>8381833
or he could directly manage the factories or site them in america

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>>8379958
ŽŽ IS THE HERO WE NEED BUT NOT THE HERO WE DESERVE

>>8381833

>western champagne socialists

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foxconn_suicides

dumbass

>>8380627
Because he's a /pol/io ridden numb nut that still thinks "left" = "liberal"

>>8380911
"PURE IDEOLOGY"

>>8381844
>Although the number of workplace suicides at the company in 2010 was large in absolute terms, the rate is low when compared to the rest of China.
Way to prove a point.

>>8380943
>see Orwell's Homage to Catalonia, in which the Communist turn their guns on the anarchists

More like when the Anarchists couldn't organize and mount a principled solidarity, turning their guns on peasants and communists and other anarchists, and thus lost to the Francoists. Or Orwell himself who literally sold out -real- Leftists and left-liberals to the fucking crown.

>>8381863
Wah wah bullshit bullshit
Wah wah Orwell wasn't a republican and that's really why I'm butthurt wah wah

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>>8381883

>>8380805
We still have a lot of real leftists though, and most educated people actually understand what socialism is, unlike americans.

>>8381833
Or he could pressure China to allow his workers to form free and independent unions.

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>>8381894
SJW's are very visible in the UK, it's a Transatlantic Anglo-American thing

>>8381231

10/10 post

makes me happy theyre still SOME smart people on this board

>>8381389

youre a retard

>>8381558

good post

I feel this is an American sort of issue and a Slav shouldn't waste too much time on it.

Sure sure, it's relevant everywhere. But there are larger issues right now.

>>8381150
>>8381153
Except situationists and post-left anarchists have already discussed the left's intolerance of intolerance, albeit in a much more sensationalist way than Zizek's

>>8380310
He is a communist

searching 'zizek' on twitter delivers deliciously tear-stained snark

some guy even annotated his first article

>>8381461
Stirner called them liberals, but liberal to the rest of the world is a defender of free market and humanism (at least in Sankt Max days), two notions the left very much despises (with reason)

>>8383448
>left despises humanism

???

>>8383457
Ever since (or at least since) the Frankfurt School, the left has been extremely suspicious (and downright critical, when you get to post-structuralism) of the humanist, tabula rasa, being human as a metaphysical condition, project

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>>8383457

>>8383470
>despise humanism
>throw human from stair to show it

really makes u thank

>>8380315
>>8380310
>>8380297

I dont know if I should be dissuaded this many people have no idea what leftism is or encouraged that they dont even realize leftism they are against is actually liberal capitalists

Wow! This is an almost neme-free Zizek thread. We should have these more often.

>>8383521
Yeah its also a thread where hardly anyone read the article and even less understood it

>>8381448
such as?

>>8380319
>gamerghazi
Holy shit.

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http://queer-trash-witch.tumblr.com/post/148364218818/in-case-you-missed-it-slavoj-zizek-publicly

how will he ever recover from this?

>>8383550
Croatia, Poland, probably other central European countries

>>8383597
Ah. The Arsehole of Europe.

>>8383603
I've visited them, they aren't too bad. They lack some Western European problems but have their own.

>>8383462
What possible justification could there be for all the egalitarianism garbage without humanism?

>>8383586
>something something Lacan
>he’s basically incoherent at this point

not meaning that post in particular, since its just some random tumblr, but...

Oh jeez, sometimes I wish Zizek wasn't a public intellectual. It fucking hurts to read some his his "critics" who neither know or try to learn the theories which Zizek builds on. Obviously he seems like an incoherent mess if you skip the theory, he uses terminology (in such a way) that it cannot be understood just like that.

>>8383612
I just wish Stalin's Hitlerific Tag Team hadn't fucked up all the historic sites in Poland. I've got a hard on for the Golden Liberty.
>>8383620
Christianity.

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>>8383655
>Stalin's Hitlerific
>I've got a hard on for the Golden Liberty.

>>8383680
From a historic point of view, anon. I also have a hard on for the Mongols.

>>8381435
Not necessarily the same, but rarely is it a neutral word. Which is good for us communists, the name of our movement SHOULD divide people, it SHOULD be somewhat scary etc.

I don't remember whether it was Zizek or Badiou who said it, but there are basically a few reasons to call oneself communist rather than socialist/anticapitalist/etc:
It is a divisive label as it should be.
It reminds us of the horrible acts done in the name of communism in the 20th century so that we won't redo them.

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>>8383683
Acceptable.

But you must still go to gulag.

>>8381351
>"I am for capital punishment because Sam Harris is alive."

I still think it's hilarious that people hate Harris so much.

>>8383710
Hilarious and easy to empathize with.

>>8383723
>and easy to empathize with

lolno

>>8383734
lolyes

>>8383736
It's easy to empathize with the thought that a public intellectual has to be killed because you disagree with him politically or intellectually?

lel, you got to be 12 years old, or a leftist.

>>8383752
>he pretends he doesn't have violent fantasies

>>8381389
>US doesn't have restrictions on free speech unlike Europe, so fuck off.
We do have those laws indeed, but you know, they've been there for ages. They're not stuff by liberals, they're more like a remnant from the age when blasphemy etc was against the law. The law which can be used to prosecute someone from talking too much shit about Islam is a direct descendant of the blasphemy laws which existed at least since the 1700s (like literally, it simply replaced the more specific blasphemy law at one point and now concerns all recognized religions)

At least around here, anyway.

>>8383769
>he has violent fantasies about political or intellectual adversaries

Seek help.

>>8383788
>oh me?
>I only fantasize about freedom and procreative sex

>>8383752
Wow butthurt

I think Tumblr's more your style

>>8381184
>I think that the notion of "a society which accepts all weird configurations (LGBTASADSADASD) in order to ease people's anxieties" leading to the death of sexuality is just drivel.
Didnt a study recently come out that showed that the young have less sexual partners and activity than their parents?
Marriage is dead as well
I think Zizek is spot on with his analysis

>>8383878
Another fact though: the young are (monetarily and maybe in other ways as well) less well off than their parents. Which is a pretty rare situation, you know; generally the new generation has it better.

If your financial situation is unsure, career as well, so on, traditional marriage, buying houses and getting kids starts to seem like a sort of shitty option.

Its capitalism and inequality, bruh, not liberal values, that cause this.

>>8383655
>Christianity.

That's my point, you don't get secular christianity without humanism.

>>8383896
Capitalism is a liberal value.

>>8383919
Well, I suppose so.

I meant cultural liberals, not either American "liberals" or economic liberals.

>>8383620
The left doesn't believe in "egalitarianism" (in any serious sense of the word, anyway) anymore than the right does. It's a word with almost no meaning that gets thrown around for anyone who didn't care enough to engage with any actual leftist work. If you wanna get down to it, the left believes in worker's autonomous organization and horizontalized property of the means of production. While one could say this is "egalitarian", one could also say neoliberalism is "egalitarian" for believing in equality of opportunity and so on.

If you want justifications, feel free to read absolutely any work by any anarchist or communist think ever for different approaches to the problem.

>>8383896
>If your financial situation is unsure, career as well, so on, traditional marriage, buying houses and getting kids starts to seem like a sort of shitty option.

>Its capitalism and inequality, bruh, not liberal values, that cause this.

Yes this situation would stop traditional marriage and having kids but this surely would not stop people from having their natural urges to have sex especially since we live in a period where its easy to get contraceptives

>>8383951
>absolutely any work by any anarchist

Like...Stirner? You fucking retard.

>>8383956
What does Stirner have to do with anything I say? Are you telling me the union of egoists isn't pretty much a anarcho-syndicalist system?

>>8383951
Oversimplifying "the left" like this doesn't make any sense, really. Leftist politics tend to involve other "egalitarian" things such as universal healthcare, welfare support for those unemployed or unemployable, education for all, etc. Of course, many market capitalism supporters support the same stuff.

If an anarchist doesn't specifically want equality and so on, I'd say he isn't leftist. Same could go for some communists but I can't think of any who are like that.

>one could also say neoliberalism is "egalitarian" for believing in equality of opportunity and so on.
True, this is why egalitarianism is a shitty political "cause" for strategic reasons (everyone agrees with it) but adequate for some discussions where the context makes it clear what we mean by it.

>>8383961
Yep.

>>8383961
You clearly haven't read a word of Stirner. No, the union of egoists has literally nothing to do with anarcho-syndicalism. First of all it's a far more flexible and abstract concept. The one practical example he gives of a union of egoists is some children outside his window playing in the street.

Second, anarcho-syndicalists commit the same sins that Max accuses leftists of wrt property.

>This is the second robbery of the “personal” in the interest of “humanity.” Neither command nor property is left to the individual; the State took the former, society the latter.

>>8383987
>If an anarchist doesn't specifically want equality and so on, I'd say he isn't leftist
Guess I'm not a leftist then. I guess that makes sense; I only want socialism.

>>8381518
no one on /lit/ does anything ever so probably no
i would like to see his reaction to memes

>>8383995
>I only want socialism.
That is your only cause? Then I suppose it might not make a whole lot of sense to place you on the left - right line.

Otherwise: does your idea of a socialist society contradict with equality or is it totally indifferent towards it? Yeah you are not a leftist if answer to either was "yes".

Socialism without any other "leftist values" (which are defined very loosely sure) isn't necessarily leftist.

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>>8384061
>mfw /pol/ gets him first and either Ben Garrisons him or is converted to Marxism

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2008/aug/09/slavoj.zizek

There is no doubt he visits this place or at least would love it.

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>>8384731
>To whom would you most like to say sorry, and why?
>To my sons, for not being a good enough father.

>>8384731
>When I really love someone, I can only show it by making aggressive and bad-taste remarks.
What's the žižekian way to tell someone that she sounds like her hymen is intact?

>>8384870
Literally what you just said.

>>8384731
this is uncharacteristic for him

>>8384889
Surely he'd put a dialectical spin to it.

>>8381627
'No'

>>8383913
god can you guys stop calling egalitarianisms 'secular Christianity'? you evince a lack of knowledge of both things when you do this.

>>8383992
the means of production aren't personal property

>>8380542
Source?

>>8381231
so, as an amateur in these matters, am I correct in saying that this is a postmodern, social-constructivist reading of sexual identity? Is that why everybody's saying he's on the left?

So then beyond the radical-campus-tumblrcore left claims of oppression, priviledge, and deferral to minorities, what separates Zizek from other leftists?

>>8380319
I hope he noticed this horrendously unselfaware comment:
>The more I read or listen to Zizek, the more I think his most antagonistic statements wouldn't seem so egregious if he didn't bury his overall point in a bloated word salad.

>>8384978

not really an endorsement, just calls trump 'maybe not so bad'

google zizek trump, click any link

>>8385112
>as an amateur in these matters, am I correct in saying that this is a postmodern, social-constructivist reading of sexual identity
When I was an amateur I spoke as an amateur. Are you honestly to believe this is a good question for yourself?

From my understanding you could apply post modernist readings of what he's saying but it's not his position. Social constructivism is even less this case since he's saying no matter what you do (so not dependent on social conditions) there is an affront to delineations of gender or sex, as there has been, as there is, as there forever shall be. But you know nothing stops you arguing these things, but I don't think this clarifies anything.

He is a leftist because he very strongly and sincerely identifies as a leftist (card carrying communist). A lot of kiddies on the left really hate him, what you would probably identify as "social justice warriors". Many consider him as racist or sexist etc because he doesn't feel the need to self censor and quite enjoys the utility of the odd #bantz racist joke. However there is a whole other world to the left outside of SJWism.

A lot of the above arguments are him taking his bestie Judith Butler's well worn arguments and doing a Hegelian/Lacanian reading btw.

>>8385238
A lot of people have suppressed the memory of dubya Bush's presidency. Trump is not on that level. Although I look forward to seeing more delusional shorty presidential artworks.

>>8381447
>The right wing in the US is not completely marginalized yet like it is in Europe
that's because it isn't completely marginalised in Europe

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>>8381447
>social Marxism
ebin meme

>The right wing in the US is not completely marginalized yet like it is in Europe
In almost every country the conservative party is the ruling party. Also, in almost every country the far-right party is either big or getting big. The "socialist"/"labour" parties are capitalists. The left-wing is completely marginalized.

>>8385281
Thought process of the right wing internet kiddy:
>nobody listens to me
>I am right wing
>therefore the right is marginalised

>>8384870
It šeemš like her *šniff* hymen-sešiš štill hašn't fačed ze phalluš-antisešiš, to arrive to ze vagina-šynsešiš.

Something like that?

>>8380416
t. Muslim Swedish rapebaby

>>8384731
>>What is the trait you most deplore in yourself?
>Indifference to the plights of others.
>>What is the trait you most deplore in others?
>Their sleazy readiness to offer me help when I don't need or want it.
Slavoj you big baka.

Figures a fat creepy neckbeard would be a GamerGater.

>>8386137
Again someone not bothering to read the articles. Do not post on a literature board of you can't be bothered to read.

>>8379958

Kind of disappointed he went from "Transgendered bathrooms are a mistake" to "What's next, marrying animals?"

>>8385308
Meanwhile every teacher fawns over how kind and enlightened left wing kiddy is and left wing kiddy can say whatever stupid immature shit he wants with no recourse because society sees him as the good guy.

>>8386145
Did you read the second article? He actually thinks you should get to marry animals, he doesn't use it as an argument against bathroom access.

>>8386179
>every teacher
I think we're getting to the root of your politics now. Join a debate club and see how you fare. I think you're going to find your thoughts are just not so well thought out and really what you've been doing is hiding away in edgy opinions.

>>8386217
Your post is completely incoherent because I never said anything about my politics, you smug fuck.

>>8384731
>tell us a secret
>communism will win
A B S O L U T E
M A D M A N

>>8386242
This is obv a sore point for you """"""comrade""""""

>>8386252
What is my sore point, smugfuck? And while you're at it, why don't you tell me what my politics are?

>>8384731
Holy shit, Zizek is a real life shitposter

>>8386286
that's the most accurate characterization of Zizek I've ever seen.

>>8384731
youtube.com/watch?v=6MVOKesg4wc

Skip to the last 15 or so seconds.

>>8386284
Do you need me to command you in what your politics are? In that case you are a radically left wing anarcho-communist in theory, though you also believe in a kind of liberal peaceful revolution. Go and be strong and courageous now I have commanded thee.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKX5Ce_qtdI
whwh finally I found a new Zizek rant that seems quite fresh

you also get to glance at his bookshelves a bit

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>>8384731

>What makes you depressed?
>Seeing stupid people happy.

>"without the Jewish intruder, the two classes would live in harmony… "

Zizek is officially OUR GUY

>>8381553
Correct, there is one other country that has, at least in theory, a constitutional guarantee of free speech equal to America's and that's the Philippines.

Unfortunately no nation in Europe has a guarantee of freedom of speech equal to the United States'. Their poorly worded documents circumscribe their liberties from the outset, ascribing power to the state rather than the people.

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>>8384731
>What would be your fancy dress costume of choice?

>A mask of myself on my face, so people would think I am not myself but someone pretending to be me.

>>8388395
>Unfortunately no nation in Europe has a guarantee of freedom of speech equal to the United States'.
You're buying into the anti Human Rights Convention Brit spin there. Some UK politicians want to have limited human rights with some "rights and responsibilities" legislation and so have slated human rights legislation in the EU. US freedom of speech is actually quite limited.

>>8388395
Article 5 [Freedom of expression]

(1) Every person shall have the right freely to express and disseminate his opinions in speech, writing, and pictures and to inform himself without hindrance from generally accessible sources. Freedom of the press and freedom of reporting by means of broadcasts and films shall be guaranteed. There shall be no censorship.

legit retarded amerifat

>>8388395
Meanwhile you're from the only country in the world where a publishing house can get sued because someone got an idea from a book they published and did it in real life.

>>8381291
What? Zizek is absolutely an unapologetic authoritarian.

>>8384731
God damn is that not brilliant

> One can argue that postgenderism is the truth of transgenderism. The universal fluidification of sexual identities unavoidably reaches its apogee in the cancellation of sex as such. Recall Marx’s brilliant analysis of how, in the French revolution of 1848, ...
He's never going to change, is he

>>8388912
what a beautiful man

>>8388704
*arrests you for calling somebody a nigger*

*lets you out of jail*

*arrests you again for denying the holocaust*

whoah, such freedoms

>>8388395
>Correct, there is one other country that has, at least in theory, a constitutional guarantee of free speech equal to America's and that's the Philippines.

>canada

>>8379958
This is that guy that got completely btfoed by Noam Chomsky. Right?

>>8388570
human rights arent real

>>8380911
pure ideology

>>8388373
this is like people quote mining ghandi complimenting Hitler, lacking the context where he's shitting on him

>>8381654
and also nobody else either.
the particular way in which they cannot express their desires is unique to their womanhood, but that only subjects the woman to one of his four discourses.

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I've seen another sheet like this, does anyone have it?

>>8392337
>Free Space
should be "Ideology" desu

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>>8392337

>No Mein Gott
>No Trashcan
>No Ideology

>>8392374

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2jpnLoBQgGw

You're all truly pathetic. Shitting all over genuine left politics until one of your memes strikes against one of your pet enemies. Disgusting. Hang yourselves.

>>8389979
Your eyes aren't real.

>>8389839
You are able to do those things, under certain conditions. You could equally say
>teaches about religion
>thrown in jail

>>8392388
>implying the majority of /lit/ isn't left wing
you're so stupid lmao
>Disgusting. Hang yourselves.

>>8392374
But Ideology is there (?)

>>8392337
Mark Hamill made me larf.

>>8392438
Ideology is everywhere.

>>8392493
good boy

>>8383752

I'm starting to emphasize more and more with the German nationalists who gunned down politicians and public intellectuals like Kurt Eisner.