I am an Endocrinologist currently working on a project touching

thoughts on femboys taking estrogen but not actually being trans?

>>8700467
Part of our panel tests actually included a handful of individuals who identified both as "mostly homosexual" or "bisexual" and "active transvestitism" or "actively medicating hormones".

We have found that most people of either orientation who pursue solely transvestitism do not manage their hormones in anyway, but the few who were produced some worrying results.

The synchronization of the mind and body is deeply rooted in the hormonal system. When one transitions from one gender to another they are effectively activating and promoting that part of everybody's mind which "knows" how to utilize the two major sex hormones (t and e) in order to produce respective results.

"Femboys" are effectively dosing to the point that the mind doesn't take the hint, to be concise, and continues trying to process T while simultaneously processing E. The effect actually results in the "femboys" in our study having elevated levels of T, mitigated by the moderate self-dosing of E. This will be detrimental in the long run, likely resulting in cancerous development in either the testes or prostate.

So have you discovered a cure for heterosexuality yet?

>>8700458
What are the negative effects of HRT on cis people?

>>8700495
Transpeople sometimes experience shifts in sexuality after hrt. If there's a way to create a synthetic chemical based on hormones that doesn't fuck up your body, there could be one.

Not that it would ever see light of day since there would be a massive controversy behind it.

>>8700498
Definitely psychological. A cis individual's mind will innately reject the physiological changes occurring. They will, essentially, develop gender dysphoria.

>>8700503
Sexuality actually has quite a few more mysteries to unlock than simple gender does.

>>8700495
This is only my observation, but I've noticed a bit of evidence for the notion that sexuality might be rooted moreso in aesthetic and visual qualities, and therefore occupy a different area of the brain than the sexual response itself does.

>>8700507
Can you be more specific?

In any case, no offense but psychological side effects aren't really your field are they.

>>8700529
No, not at all. I actually assumed you were asking about psychological effects, hence the short answer. Did you mean physical?

>>8700540
I meant any effects that are different for cis people. Obviously cis males don't want breasts but that's just harm of what e does to trans women too except they want it, so that's not what I'm asking. I want where the actual effect is different.

File: ssj3.gif (4MB, 320x240px) Image search: [Google]

4MB, 320x240px

>>8700458
hand over the hyper testosterone and no one gets hurt


You're going to love this, trust me.

What you're seeing now is my cis male state.

This is a super male.

And this, this is what is known as a super male that has ascended past a super male.

Or you can just call this a super male 2.

And this,

IS TO GO EVEN FURTHER BEYOND!!!!

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

>>8700555
From a physical perspective we would see properly-managed HRT be effective even in a cis individual. The only differing effects would be psychological.

>>8700558
Fat.

>>8700587
Okay. Can you describe the different mental reactions beyond "innately reject" vs "innately accept"?

>>8700601
At a basic level, sure.

The mind of a trans individual is effectively wired to best function under hormone levels consistent with the typical gender opposite their sex organs. This is a major factor of what causes gender dysphoria. We see elevated levels of stress hormones in pre-transition individuals as well.

When a trans individual begins a hormone regimen consistent with their gender it actually mends the brain's functional issues. Trans individuals under proper HRT and in a positive environment often see a reduction in their stress hormones, a cognitive boost, and a decrease in general depression and anxiety.

On the other hand, an individual who is not actually transgender will develop these issues if they begin taking hormones inconsistent with their actual gender.

>>8700458
>I am an Endocrinologist currently working on a project touching on the effects of natural and artificial nutrient and environmental hormone intake and its effects on delayed hormonal puberty.

tf does that even mean?

>>8700627
Which part?

>>8700494
What percent of trans would you estimate lean towards homosexuality with regards to natal sex vs heterosexuality?

>>8700636
>bi erasure

>>8700622
But how can we tell that the reduction in stress hormones, cognitive boost and decrease in depression and anxiety aren't just consequences of the positive environment and seeing their body feminize, rather than any direct interaction between the hormone therapy and their brain's wiring mending functional issues?

>>8700636
That's a good question. 73% of our transgender subjects were "mostly homosexual", but 15% of those experienced a change in their sexual attraction during or after transition.

I think sexuality and gender are not necessarily as related as one might think, but that hormones (insofar as they alter perception, personality, and the mind) can shift the perspective of sexual attraction.

I said above that I think there's evidence to support the idea that attraction is rooted moreso in the visual cortex, and is related to aesthetics, rather than being in the same area as the sexual response itself.

Something interesting that our study has shown is that a majority of people (men and women, cis and trans, gay and straight identifying), when asked to be totally honest and promised complete anonymity, claim to be bisexual in some form (either light or heavy)

>>8700663
What is light bisexuality?

You keep mentioning studies- are any of these published yet?

Also, why choose a website like this to do an AMA rather than a site like reddit with a larger userbase?

>>8700655
Because those consequences (body feminising/masulinising, and even positive environment) are caused by the hormone therapy. Otherwise the mental state remains the same.

>>8700671

Probably something like being mostly attracted to one gender, with a smaller amount of attraction to the other.

>>8700671
incidentally or rarely.

>>8700673
Not yet, we're in the late stage of assembling our work.

I'm a regular here (female bisexual) and thought the community might get something out of the topic, especially since it's multi-faceted.

>>8700673
Quality over quantity.

Honestly kill yourself if you think reddit is better because it has more users.

I would like to add that since the questioning has gotten into a bit of psychological territory that I am not very trained in the field. Most of my work in this involved effects in pubescence.

>>8700663

assuming you could mess yourself up if you take hormones and are not actually trans, how do you think I should assure myself I am actually trans? How does one actually know their dypshoria is that real? It's a very difficult problem to figure out for the individual suffering.

>>8700694
this is 4chan. When people think quality, they don't think here.

Reddit isn't better because it has more users, but if you're looking to spread information and get a variety of questions, a site with a larger userbase is better. That doesn't make the site as a whole better, but better for a purpose.

>>8700694
Reddit might be better for AMAs because it is established as a platform for that purpose, has moderation who can verify credentials and keep the thread on topic, and threads don't disappear.

>>8700675
So there isn't a mental change besides the consequences of experiencing the physical changes?

>>8700458
Could you give us a rundown, maybe something similar to an abstract, so we have a bit better idea of the exact range of your research, and can ask better questions that way?

>>8700458
How should we interpret the 40% suicide rate among transsexuals? Isn't it likely hormone therapy isn't helpful and essentially plays into their delusions? Why should something so outside the norm as artificially modifying your body to pretend to be the opposite sex be accepted in society?

>>8700702
Counseling, pre-transition presenting, and eventually beginning a monitored HRT. One can begin hormone replacement and monitor their transition for a fair amount of time before any effects become permanent. It's important to use this short period to monitor how the mind reacts to the estrogen.

>>8700704
Good on OP for picking us over the kind of questions you'd have her prefer.

>>8700716
What if a trans woman feels a reduction in dysphoria and is happy with her feminization, but experiences a spike in other issues such as anxiety and depression? Is that an indication HRT is a bad idea?

>>8700458
Gay man here. How does gay horminial make up differ from straights? Also is a healthy horminial balance for me basically the same as for straights, ie plenty of testosterone.

>>8700710
Yeah, I'm not sure why I didn't do that in the first place.

Here's my summary:

Contemporary studies have noted the drastic changes in both pubescent and adult sexual development in the past thirty years. Relationships between nutrient-dense food intake and natural/artificial environmental hormone intake produce clear signs of visibility in both the foetus, the pubescent child, and the mature adult. Among these effects is the current statistical prevalence of Gender Dysphoria (DSM V), which remains unrelated to the prevalence of non-heteronormative sexuality. As the former has risen, the latter has remained stagnant. The study examines both theoretical physiological causes as well as direct testing on approximately 400 random individuals over a 4 year period, utilizing additional unpublished research undertaken on this same project (which is currently wrapping up but has been opened since 1992) in 1993 and 2003.

>>8700747
Oh this looks super interesting. Thank you for doing research in the transgender field, we desperately need more of it.

>>8700458
As an endo what evidence for/against Blanchardianism have you discovered?

>>8700731
I would wonder about environment first of all, but also question the timetable of feminisation. There's a debate in the gender studies community about whether we should promote "presenting" as one's identified gender for a longer period before beginning HRT.

Have you spoken about this to your physician or a counselor?

>>8700754
>Blanchardianism
The Fraternal Birth Order Effect?

>>8700756
Isn't that a rather old standard which was dropped due to ineffectiveness in rooting out non-transsexuals (because crossdressers or people with other mental disorders masking themselves as gender dysphoria), as well as it increasing the risk for people trying to transition in less accepting environments?

>>8700756
>There's a debate in the gender studies community about whether we should promote "presenting" as one's identified gender for a longer period before beginning HRT.
What argument could possibly be made for it, considering how harmful it is to trans people?

>>8700760
No, the other meme.
The AGP/HSTS dichotomy.

>>8700733
So this is actually a very interesting question. Most gay-identifying men in our study actually presented with slightly higher levels of testosterone (enough that, across the board, men who identified as "mostly homosexual" or "exclusively homosexual" make a statistical hormone level difference)

>>8700771
>the other meme.
:^)

>>8700716
>>8700756
>defending RLE
>considering current RLE requirements to be too lax
Everyone move on, we have either a dedicated troll or a quack

>>8700756
I'm 2 1/2 years on HRT and experienced an increase in depression at around the 6 month-1 year timeframe. The thing that really has me conflicted is that I am very, very certain of my identity, but I'm no longer confident HRT is a correct or moral thing to do...it's obvious society abhors trans people and I'll never be cis. I'm sure that plays into the anxiety as well. It's difficult to say my life is better than it would have been had I not started.

Im not in therapy right now because of a poor fit with my last therapist, but I'm looking.

>>8700622
>The mind of a trans individual is effectively wired to best function under hormone levels consistent with the typical gender opposite their sex organs.
>When a trans individual begins a hormone regimen consistent with their gender it actually mends the brain's functional issues.
Is this a direct effect of the HRT or as you seem to say >>8700675 a consequences of the feminizing/masculinizing effects of the HRT on the body?

>>8700771
Ah, I've not found much of an evidence for Blanchard in that sense. Most of my fellows don't take his typology very seriously, either.

>>8700779
I only presented an argument from the other side. We are allowed to have opinions and alter suggestions based on individual needs, y'know.

>>8700774
I assume that "mostly homosexual" includes bi men that have only a marginal interest in women?

1. Do you have an opinion on why a group of men with higher testeroine would be prone to effeminate or fairy like thought, as gay men do?
2. What group of people is low testosterone associated with?

Please share anything else about male homosexual chemical balance. This stuff is awesome. Also when will I be able to screen cap this research. Being part of a group that has higher testosterone levels is something that makes me happy.

>>8700789
blanchard memers btfo

>>8700789
>evidence for
The question was 'for or against'. You haven't found any evidence against then?

>Most of my fellows don't take his typology very seriously, either.
A kind of snobbery against it by the sound of it then.

>>8700788
Both of those effects are innately related, one has to understand the physical and the psychological as being connected (being that we're all giant meat bags and such).

But the hormones themselves and their effect on the brain do have a large part to play. But hormones or physical changes by themselves, without the other, would likely not have the same success.

>>8700747
How did you get into this research?

>>8700801
>A kind of snobbery against it by the sound of it then.
I don't take flat earth theory very seriously either, doesn't mean it's snobbery.

>>8700801
>every side of an argument is legitimate, no matter how insane!

>>8700812
If you don't support outdated theories that have no legitimate basis, then you're clearly engaging in intellectual dishonesty

>>8700806
How can we tell that the hormones are having this effect on the brain, scientifically speaking?

>>8700458
Do you think there are potentially efficacious treatments for gender dysphoria we are overlooking that don't involve changing the body, such as antipsychotics?

>>8700832
>antipsychotics
more likely therapy and non-hormonal non-surgical ways of expressing femininity

>>8700747
"Among these effects is the current statistical prevalence of Gender Dysphoria (DSM V), which remains unrelated to the prevalence of non-heteronormative sexuality. As the former has risen, the latter has remained stagnant"

To make sure I'm understanding this correctly, this is stating that trans people are on the rise, while non-hetero people are not?

Could this actually be non-physiological in origin, and be more related to increasing societal acceptance and awareness?

The former would cause more people to come out- even on anonymous polls- while the latter would get more people to question their own gender, and realize that their feelings may be a result of having gender dysphoria, thus increasing the amount of people identifying as trans?

>>8700796
I guess I should have elaborated on this in my first response, but I think you might find this very interesting.

If we examine male homosexuals by preferences we reach some interesting conclusions.

"Exclusively homosexual" and "mostly homosexual" males who identified their personalities (using our phrasebook) with the phrases "aggressive", "dominant", "top", or "power" had the noticeably higher testosterone levels as a whole. However, if you break it up by age it becomes more interesting.

15-18 had average T levels
19-25 had consistent elevated T levels
26-30 had the same elevation
31-40 had slightly lower, but above average levels
41-54 had average T
55+ had lower T

"Exclusively" or "mostly" males who identified with the phrases "passive", "feminine", "receptive", "submissive", or "bottom" had average levels of testosterone as a whole. But with an even more interesting breakdown by age

15-18 had below-average T levels
19-25 had the same relative below-average T levels
26-30 had average T levels
31-40 had average levels
41-54 had slightly higher
55+ had lower T levels

We saw a noticeable delay in testosterone production until the late 20s, coupled with a mid-life elevation before the typical geriatric falloff. This is especially interesting because it couples with the research done into puberty models, and how male puberty and female puberty have experienced shifts in the opposite direction.

>>8700838
Yep, and that's the controversial bit that everybody involved in the study is trying to triple-check.

I think it's directly linked to the prevalence of artificial hormones in the current world. We already see it in the development of children and in the onset of puberty, which is what most of my work was concentrated on. Increasing acceptance could account for a slight shift, but not to the extent that we have seen.

>>8700812
Is this you OP?

>>8700845
>male puberty and female puberty have experienced shifts in the opposite direction
Admittedly I don't know much about the current research on puberty, but could this be caused by increased exposure to environmental estrogens? It would make sense if that causes female puberty to start sooner and male to start later

>>8700859

this is the one case where tripfagging would actually be beneficial, so we know which comments are from OP

>>8700859
Wish OP used a trip code for this, thread would be more readable

>>8700854
What's the data like on the increase in GD? I've heard a lot of claims that it's because of acceptance, it's social contagion, it's the new fad among teenagers, it's a conspiracy, etc, etc. but not usually claims that it could be physiological. How steep is the increase?

>>8700854

A great deal of other studies have shown tendencies for transsexuals to be neurologically closer to their gender rather than their sex. Would similar effects be created by exposure to artificial hormones, meaning that it would still become physically based and thus requiring standard treatment?

Or would it be environmentally dependent, meaning being removed from the environment of artificial hormones, or even being put on sex-expected hormones, would cause feelings of gender dysphoria to lessen?

>>8700747
>Relationships between nutrient-dense food intake and natural/artificial environmental hormone intake produce clear signs of visibility in both the foetus, the pubescent child, and the mature adult. Among these effects is the current statistical prevalence of Gender Dysphoria

So is the idea that exogenous hormones are causing abnormal development in the womb, such as the "neurological intersex" theory?

>>8700845
Man this is awesome. It's like harmonic. Also makes perfect sense with what I know about myself and the rest of the gay community.

Do you know of any books or literature which focus on this type of stuff or develop theories about it?

Also are you researching the causes of horminial states or just their effects? I'd be interested in research about causes.

>>8700882
not OP here

https://williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu/wp-content/uploads/How-Many-Adults-Identify-as-Transgender-in-the-United-States.pdf

A williams institute study has show that in the 65 and over group, transsexuals make up about .5% of the population, whereas in the 18-24 they make up .66%

>>8700863
>Admittedly I don't know much about the current research on puberty, but could this be caused by increased exposure to environmental estrogens? It would make sense if that causes female puberty to start sooner and male to start later

Exactly.

Our research makes a clear case that females are beginning secondary sexual development at younger ages (12, on average) while men are delayed (16.5, on average). We did a separate panel of interviews (not involving sexuality but purely physical puberty) with children ranging from 8-18.

What we found is that young female brains are being exposed to estrogens at such a regular rate that they are transitioning through puberty at a rapid rate. What shocked me is that, of the hundreds of kids involved in this study, we interviewed and examined approximately a dozen girls between the ages of 10 and 13 who were between IV and V on the Tanner Scale, which is just unheard of.

For men, on the other hand, the tables turn. The presence of so much estrogen actually causes their brains to become very adapted to it early in life so that the presence of testosterone after the triggering of puberty actually gets partially rejected by the brain. Even in young adults (18-25) we see low levels of testosterone and the same abnormal levels of estrogen.

It's taking men, on average, until they are 19 or 20 to reach Tanner V. Just like with the girls we were surprised to discover that almost half of the boys we examined between the ages of 15 and 17 were still Tanner III or Tanner IV, which they should have outgrown 2-5 years earlier.

>>8700494
>synchronization of the mind and body
lol

>>8700926
Also, and this is just a request in addendum to this. If you as an LGBT individual are ever contracted for a study please let your body hair grow out just a bit so we can see where you've actually got it.

Apparently it's vogue for teenage boys now in addition to girls to shave their underarms, groins and legs, which we luckily figured out before progressing too far into the interview research (we were labeling teens as Tanner III and lower who were actually IV or V).

We were thoughtful enough to inform all the female participants, but none of us even thought to inform the males.

Just thought you might enjoy the humorous aside.

>>8700458
Can you say anything about the effects of progesterone on mtfs? It seems to be the only thing which helps me with scalp dryness and itching.

>>8700895
>A great deal of other studies have shown tendencies for transsexuals to be neurologically closer to their gender rather than their sex. Would similar effects be created by exposure to artificial hormones, meaning that it would still become physically based and thus requiring standard treatment?
>Or would it be environmentally dependent, meaning being removed from the environment of artificial hormones, or even being put on sex-expected hormones, would cause feelings of gender dysphoria to lessen?

The developmental aspect of the situation means that treating the Gender Dysphoria, not changing the environment, will be the only effective treatment. It's not like these people are "false transgenders" or anything.

>>8700944
That would be funny if it didn't get accounted for later on

"you guys are like thirty-five, you should really, really be in tanner V by now"

>>8700806
How can we tell that the hormones are having this effect on the brain, scientifically speaking?

>>8700944
...how many other studies have rendered themselves worthless because of elementary slip-ups like these, but without anybody realizing until after publication, if ever?

>>8700458
Late to the party but whatever. Regarding male homosexual hormone levels:

You mention effects of environmental estrogen intake on delayed puberty in boys >>8700926, and also earlier made some fascinating points on lifelong testosterone levels for groups of gay men >>8700845.

(1) What I want to know is if your your research has actually found a clear or tangential connection between the two? It sounds from here >>8700747 that no, hormonal puberty delay isn't as strongly related to homosexual development in the same way it is with gender dysphoria.

(2) I'm just trying to reconcile how a lot of boys are being introduced to estrogen at ridiculous levels that slow puberty or perhaps even affect gender identity, while gay men still report higher levels of testosterone later in life. Could that period of below average T during early formative years explain some gay men? Or is it not conclusive enough to say that they're intertwined?

(3) And if they are, is there is a way to tell how much of this culprit nutrient/environmental hormone intake is prenatal as WELL as postnatal exposure? Does the research support that hormonal "feminizing" or "masculinizing" of prepubescent children's brains is largely happening in utero to later affect sexuality just like physical development and gender?

Prenatal or post, I may be conflating epigenetic factors going on around the time of birth with strictly hormonal changes. If the two are inextricably linked then I suppose one is acting like a developmental switch for the other and maybe that's part of a more unifying theory behind prevalence of LGBTs in general.

>>8700663
Mostly homosexual with regards to natal sex?

Do you have something I could see published about that?

>>8701910
She probably got confused and means with regards to transitioned sex. Notice that she doesn't acknowledge anon's reference to natal sex in the question. The 15% also doesn't ring true going in the direction she said, but both numbers are roughly what would be expected if talking about transitioned sex.

>>8700712
>How should we interpret the 40% suicide rate among transsexuals?

Maybe actually reading the study, seeing that those rates drop off after like 1989 or something, and that the author of said study would think everything you've said in your post is lazy uneducated bullshit is a good place to start.