During the open lecture "Transgender" in the eveni

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>>8563649

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>>8563653

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>>8563658

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>>8563663

These dudes look salty. What happened to them?

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Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko on Sunday said the visit by U.S. Secretary of State Rex Tillerson to Kiev was a powerful show of Washington's support.

He also welcomed the appointment of Kurt Volker as a Special Representative to the Minsk peace process, saying Volker's experience as a career diplomat would help bring about the full implementation of the Minsk agreements.

Poroshenko added that Volker, who accompanied Tillerson to Kiev, will stay in the Ukrainian capital for several days to speed up coordination between the U.S. and Ukraine.

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>>8563649
commies can never stop hating those who are different

>>8563701
They just look for proxies for Jews to oppress when they've reduced the Jews to insignificance. First they blame the regressive capitalists and call them fascists, then the far left communists, then the counterrevolutionaries, then the counterrevolutionaries are called Jews, then all the Jews get blamed with antisemitic tone, then you go for the Hitler targets, the gays, the trannies, the degenerates, the foreigners, and the homeless. when you are done and have no one left to blame, finally, the real culprit appears! It was the oppressive regime or your fellow countrymen all along! Then a war starts, a good faction arises to reform, they win; turns out they just end up starting the cycle all over again.

>>8563729
You are really misinformed about the post-Soviet world. You should try traveling there.

>>8563753
I've been to Serbia; they blame their neighbors for everything. Famine, dairy going bad, rapes--- they have no love for Croats or Albanians. All because of religion and other stupid primitive shit traditions. I've never met a Serb I trusted. They were all shifty and had bloodlust in them. Truly one of the most regressive, bordering on subhuman, savage countries I've ever been. Their tea was good though. Croatia was better in every way. A lot less ethnic tension.

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>>8563770
>I've been to Serbia

>post-Soviet world

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>>8563770
>they have no love for Croats or Albanians
No fucking shit... ever heard of the Serbian war?

Also, that's not the former Soviet Union.

>>8563770

kek its like saing you know about usa because you was once in canada

>>8563799
>>8563866
I wasn't claiming they were part of the Soviet Union? Neither was Cambodia or Cuba, but they'd be "post-Soviet," because communism for the Soviets was a global agenda and they may have diverged in alignment to the states outside the Soviet Union, but they still mostly relied on copying Bolshevism, Leninism, Stalinism, etc. The entire world is "post-Soviet;" he didn't state "misinformed about former Soviet states," Yugoslavia was communist and was considered part of the Iron Curtain. Tito was not considered more friendly to the west or capitalism than Stalin. They were communist shit holes all the same, and their ethnic bickering and genocidal tendencies didn't depart from other conflicts that have existed; events in South Ossetia and Georgia are not a far cry from the Yugoslav wars or Bosnian genocides.

My original post wasn't even referring specifically to parts of former Soviet Union, but to all repressive regimes: they follow Soviet and Nazi Germany tactics of introducing an enemy, an "other" or outgroup, then knocking it down while consolidating the "ingroup" of supporters and collaborators, but after they are done defeating this enemy of the people, they have a new enemy to create, a scapegoat to distract from the outcome not fixing any problems. Inevitably no purge fixes the economy or the root issue of the government's own centralized incompetence. They must distort cause and effect to keep people from resorting to protests, revolution, attempts to change the state fundamentally.

>>8563987

ok.. what the fuck.. how old are you? yugoslavia was extreme oposite of "soviet" or even "post soviet". do you homework at least.

>>8563952
My total time spent there over several visits was one year and eight months.

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>>8563987
Please stop spreading your disgusting lies and propaganda about the glorious Soviet Union.

>>8564014
Please stop forcing a meme version of reality with the expectation that if you force it hard enough it will become reality.

>>8564002
If Tito's reign was so great, why did the Yugoslav wars happen? If they had made so much progress under communism, why did the region regress into violence and sectarian conflict?

>>8564029
BTW I will give you the fact that Tito was by and far the greatest communist leader of the time. That did not mean there was no political suppression in Yugoslavia.

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>>8564024
stay mad, capitalist pig-dog

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>>8564029
>>8564034

why are you talking about yugoslavia whe trhe shit happened in american ukraine?

>>8564014
>tfw you're so leftist you would have been purged in the soviet union
trotsky did nothing wrong
lenin destroyed communism thru dictatorship of proletariat and was a misanthrope who hated humanity and loathed proletariat's illiteracy and idealism
communism and soviet world ambition died the day china and soviets stopped working together
stalin was a criminal and mass murderer who cared less about starvation than nuclear weapons
real communism becomes anarchism

>>8564046
ukraine is just kosovo 2.0, where ukrainians are scapegoating degenerates and russians while russians scapegoat ukrainians and degenerates all over a few patches of land and some oil and money, whereas in kosovo it was a patch of land and some religion and ethnic bullshit

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>>8564054

tell ya lenin loved to fuck bitches in his house made of gold.

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>>8564062
>ukraine is just kosovo 2.0

>>8564063
lenin was only at home in a HOUSE OF LIES and it paid him back greatly when his illiterate street thief successor killed huge swaths of the population by employing a guy- just a guy, i wouldnt call him an agricultural scientist- who applied debunked lamarckism to seeds

mind you stalin wasnt even ignorant of modern science, he just didnt give a fuck about people starving. he had lots of nuclear physicists who were top of their field who couldve told the guy that lamarck was a dipshit and you cant magically condition seeds to survive winter

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>>8564080
>lenin was only at home in a HOUSE OF LIES

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>>8564054
Stalin did nothing wrong. He was a pragmatist and he got great results. Trotsky was too much of an idealist and his expansionist doctrine would have resulted in the Soviet Union's swift destruction.

Stalin's purges of counter-revolutionaries and fitth-columnists were absolutely necessary to prevent another Russian civil war.

Stalin's rapid industrialization process took a toll on the population in the short term, yes - but in the long term, this was necessary to protect the CCCP from capitalist empires.

Stalin's collectivization of farmland also had short-term consequences, but in the long term it did pay off hugely. Russian commoners had total food security for the first time ever in the 1960s and it was thanks to the agricultural planning which began under Stalin.

Stalin robbed banks to fund the Bolshevik revolution, escaped prison camps multiple times, then went on to become the ruler of the nation. During the battle of Moscow, Stalin's choice to remain in the city despite the danger was an inspiration to the Soviet people. Not only did he lead Russia to a victory over the German invader, he turned a country with wooden fucking ploughs into a nucear-armed global superpower.

Are you really morally concerned by his methods? Or just jealous of the results?

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its ironic how faggets defend people who just tried to kill their people in american ukraine by kidnapping the thread into bullshit troll fest against soviets and lenin.

>>8564096
fuck you, commie

america in the 1960's was more free and liberal even for black people than your disgusting imagined USSR

>talin's purges of counter-revolutionaries and fitth-columnists were absolutely necessary to prevent another Russian civil war.
he shouldve been deposed to pave the way for a true communist country run by the people

>Stalin's rapid industrialization process took a toll on the population in the short term, yes - but in the long term, this was necessary to protect the CCCP from capitalist empires.
his death toll was as bad as modern genocides. he knew that the science behind their agriculture and their industiralization was incorrect and that the bureaucracy of the central planning was unworkable. he did not care because war and the military were more important; atomic bombs were more important than feeding people

>Stalin's collectivization of farmland also had short-term consequences, but in the long term it did pay off hugely. Russian commoners had total food security for the first time ever in the 1960s and it was thanks to the agricultural planning which began under Stalin.
lies. the food handouts were long and punishing, aisles of stores were empty of food. if they had food security, why did so many die of starvation? why did the same stalinization in china fail and cause mass droughts and starvation as well if it worked so well?

>Stalin robbed banks to fund the Bolshevik revolution, escaped prison camps multiple times, then went on to become the ruler of the nation. During the battle of Moscow, Stalin's choice to remain in the city despite the danger was an inspiration to the Soviet people. Not only did he lead Russia to a victory over the German invader, he turned a country with wooden fucking ploughs into a nucear-armed global superpower.
he was a criminal and a coward. he didn't lead anyone: the people themselves triumphed by sheer force of will. arming them with nukes was about the only good thing he did.

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>>8564154
>america in the 1960's was more free and liberal even for black people than your disgusting imagined USSR


i am out. this level of jew cant be broken..

>>8564117
fascism and totalitarianism is the seed that gives supremacists the courage to kill us. it is a systematic problem not just the savagery of human beings of their bigotry but of the modern ideologies that allow them to release the normal boundaries of behavior to become violent

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>>8564154
>fuck you, commie

>pave the way for a true communist country run by the people

>>8564169
In America, nigger sits on back of bus. In Mother Russia, bus runs over nigger, cannot ride, line too long, never on time, and party representative takes up all the seats, so must walk through miles of snow and starve to death while walking.

>>8563649
>The lecture was held in the Kiev
stopped reading there.
It is easier for a camel to fit through the eye of a needle than for a slav to be lgbt friendly.

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>>8564192
Please stop posting your ridiculous propaganda about Russia. It was never like that.

And people blame Stalin for the starving that happened while he was in charge, only because people forget Russians were starving BEFORE the communist revolution... the Soviets inherited a huge mess to clean up. They did clean it up too, and Stalin laid the groundwork of that, but Stalin was dead by the time things were really better.

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>>8564180
Hegemonic commies who love USSR are not real marxists.

see: dictatorship of the proletariat
see: luring jews from former german occupied areas with promises of egalitarian treatment, then murdering them as enemies of the state to cover up corruption
see: country run by former criminals

>>8564211
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lysenkoism

'Interestingly, perhaps the only opponents of Lysenkoism during Stalin's lifetime to escape liquidation came from the small community of Soviet nuclear physicists: as Tony Judt has observed, "It is significant that Stalin left his nuclear physicists alone and never presumed to second guess their calculations. Stalin may well have been mad but he was not stupid."[8]'

Stalin's physicists were educated enough to know Lysenko was wrong, but for political reasons Stalin allowed Lysenko to push an incorrect scientific model that cause famines and starvation.

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>>8564241
>not real marxists
Perhaps not. More than anything else, Stalin was a pragmatist and a realist. You can call his methods immoral but you cannot question his results.

>muh Lysenko
Doesn't change the fact that Russian people never, ever had food security in all Russian history until 1960s Soviet Union (after overhaul of Russian agriculture, which Stalin began, was completed)

The short-term consequences for the population were worth it for the long-term gains of the whole nation. And don't forget this was achieved despite the initial mess left by the Tsars, the destrution of civil war, further destruction by German invasion...

>>8563987
>Yugoslavia was communist and was considered part of the Iron Curtain
Yugoslavia was never part of the Iron Curtain. Yugoslavia was within the Soviet sphere of influence (which wasn't the same thing as the Iron Curtain) from 1945 to 1949 but even then the tensions were somewhat high because Yugoslavia was the only country not occupied by the Red Army in Eastern Europe (instead Yugoslavs liberated Yugoslavia) and Tito was slow to honor Stalin's wishes and decrees. And then from 1949 they completely split and there was open threat of war between the Eastern Bloc and Yugoslavia for few years.

For reference the Iron Curtain was only erected after 1949 when all West-East relations collapsed and it became clear that one time allies in war were now bitter enemies.

Even communism in Yugoslavia was different from communism practiced in the Eastern Bloc. Yugoslav communism was more nationalistic, more worker oriented and closer to anarcho-syndicalism than state communism practiced by USSR and its satellite states. In addition Yugoslavia was never as repressive as USSR and Yugo passport was the only passport with which you could travel to any Western or Eastern country in the world. You could travel to US, Cuba, Western Germany, Eastern Germany and the USSR with no problems on a Yugoslav passport.

>>8564054
>destroyed communism thru dictatorship
communism is essentially totalitarian ideology of enforced equality that punishes excellence, success and limits any freedom
dictatorship or other form of totalitarianism is inevitable consequence of commie ideology

anarchism equals rule of gangs when strong men with weapons do whatever the fuck they want robbing, killing and raping the weak, what a great alternative

>>8564211
https://vimeo.com/105422200

RIDICULOUS PROPAGANDA USSR MADE ALL THINGS BEST!!!! AMERICA A SHIT!!!

ussr never had problem with roads and sheet we wuz kangs of industry and starvation and bread lines

>>8564286
> And don't forget this was achieved despite the initial mess left by the Tsars, the destrution of civil war, further destruction by German invasion...
this was done by mao as well: blame the previous imperialists and act as imperialists but with a "purer" agenda. and while mao and stalin made huge leaps and bounds into modernisation they also did so while killing their own people and cultivating cults of personality. theyre both shit, the tsar of russia and dictator of USSR. it is not virtuous that the soviets made progress on the backs of so many deaths. the tsar was just as indifferent to suffering as stalin. dont think that because people in russia think fondly of despots that they objectively needed to modernize in such a fashion. they could have embraced reforms that wouldve produced little death and big payoffs.

>>8564289
i stand corrected. however at no point did i deny tito was better than the most of the other soviet bloc leaders. there was nevertheless oppression in yugoslavia, but it was nowhere near as bad as anything the USSR accomplished

>>8564313
this is all wrong and stupid. totalitarianism is not the natural end point of communism. it is because it ended this way that no one can reproduce the original form. it works against the very intention of marx that statist marxism and failed workers states turned out terrible. in that way, who would willingly self-sabotage their utopian system? it isnt the natural state of communism.

anarchism isnt anything you described. what you described is called a "strawman."

>>8564313
>rule of gangs
Police, courts, prison systems, politicians with violence enforced power, corporations
>when strong men with weapons do whatever the fuck they want
Rich people with bodyguards and a militray that serves their interests who prohibit ownership of arms by the populace
>robbing
Taxes
>killing and raping the weak
Eugenics, police with freedom to shoot "criminals," rich people who use the law to their advantage to avoid rape charges
>what a great alternative
We already live in the alternative of people resisting democracy and anarchism

Literally the opposite of anarchism is what we live in, a perpetual Hell of torment and arbitrary rules enforced by those who own land, water, transport, money with violent force they pay for with imaginary power

>>8564117
>american ukraine
wut

>>8564348
>dont think that because people in russia think fondly of despots that they objectively needed to modernize in such a fashion
They did though. Military geopolitics is often simply mathematics. Had it not been for the purges and/or the rapid industrialization, the CCCP would have almost certainly descended into civil war and later been divided between capitalist colonial powers.

Stalin was a man who did what had to be done. He made some mistakes but you should read about his conduct during the Battle of Moscow.

>>8564211
>>8564169
jesus christ you are the archtypical delusional neonazi holocaust denier just with a red star

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>>8564415
The fascist who posted the suicide clown and anti-Semtic trash is not me.

You have been lied to about the Soviet Union.

>>8564410
>Stalin was a man who did what had to be done.
It still makes little sense that he allowed Lysenkoism. It's just like Madame Mao being allowed her reign of terror by pushing the Cultural Revolution; Mao allowed her this, and then had her punished for it. It obviously benefited him to have the whole country in a fervor of obsession over him; it signaled his monolithic dominance of the Chinese communist party. Stalin let Lysenko do what he was doing, because it directly showed to the people that Soviets were able to create their own science; it was part of Stalin's cult.

Yet, in both cases the dictator allows great evil for their own political benefit.

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>>8564445
I don't think Stalin really knew it was bad science... Remember he was born to a literal serf and after a short-lived religious education focused his life on revolution. The problem was men who knew better would not question him when he wrongly endorsed Lysenko's plan. Because of his cult as you say, and his isolation as the Genaralassimo. But he did not end up with that cult of personality for nothing.

>>8564468
I appreciate your candor; certainly this is one of the views, that because Stalin was an illiterate serf he was not capable of discernment on this issue. I would counter, and this is a position taken many times by USSR historians on Lysenkoism, is that Stalin deferred often to his physicists and simply ignored or told them it was politically inopportune to oppose Lysenkoism. Those who opposed Lysenko were purged; it is clear that those who were of import to the atomic bomb programs were opposed to Lysenko's ideas, but they were immune to being purged or exiled or shamed for their opposition.

Stalin took his physicists seriously- and so did the other scientists in Russia- and gave them autonomy; that is at odds with Lysenko, who was given autonomy despite a huge swath of critics from all walks of life cropping up when he was propped up to his position of authority.

>>8563649
>in the Kiev cafe-club
>of the Kyiv city council
Which one is it OP, Kiev or Kyiv? Ukrainian or Russian?

>>8564313
>communism is essentially totalitarian ideology of enforced equality that punishes excellence, success and limits any freedom
Lolno. Communism is a stateless, classless society in which the means of production are owned by the workers.

>anarchism equals rule of gangs when strong men with weapons do whatever the fuck they want robbing, killing and raping the weak, what a great alternative
Anarchism as a political philosophy actually entails the elimination of all unjustified hierarchy, which armed gangs are obviously a form of. "No rulers" does not mean every man for himself.

>>8564014
>>8564042
The best thing about the soviet union? Killed millions of citizens of the soviet union.