Anyone have any non-garbage studies on transgender persons. Like

>>8434986
http://www.annelawrence.com/

>>8434986
Take your coddly science cult and shove it. Transsexualism is a mega controversial issue and it's going to constantly have political opinions on it under any banner possible, by whatever masquerades necessary.

>>8434986
Like medical studies? Search 'transgender' on PubMed.

>>8435264
>In short, autogynephilic eroticism, as evidenced by erotic cross-dressing, precedes cross-gender identity by years or decades in nonhomosexual MtF transsexuals. These transsexuals do not have female core gender identities, nor do they have well developed cross-gender identities that precede and act as the driving force behind their desires to turn their bodies into facsimiles of women's bodies. Rather, nonhomosexual MtF transsexuals gradually develop cross-gender identities after years or decades of erotic cross-dressing, accompanied by the autogynephilic wish to turn their bodies into facsimiles of women's bodies. In this sense, cross-gender identity in nonhomosexual MtF transsexuals is a secondary phenomenon or epiphenomenon.

See I don't understand this because this isn't true for me at all. I'm not sure if I'm trutrans^tm but I had almost no history of erotic cross-dressing at all in fact I don't think you could call my corssdressing from 18-21 erotic either because I never did it to fap or get off but rather to try to look female. As for identity; I don't have a separate female identity. Who I am is just who I am male or female. I just feel more free to express myself as I'd like in a female context. I really don't like these studies because they never help me at all. They're practically irrelevant to my situation which is really distressing when you're trying to figure yourself out. I hit maybe 1/12 of the telltale signs of agp but literally none whatsoever of hsts. But I hate being male and surely taking tit skits of my own free will, trying to cut my own balls off and multiple suicide attempts (or cries for help or whatever) must be worth something?!

>>8435418
Like for instance:

>Among our subjects, 79% did not appear in public cross dressed prior to age 20;
Got me there but then again I didn't like getting beat by my parents or frowned upon by society so what does this really mean?!

>at that time, most of the subjects had already had several years of experience with cross dressing.
I literally only started actually doing it as a regular thing when I left my parent's home. Prior to that there may have been 4 or 5 episodes in 18 years.

>The average number of years of practice with cross dressing prior to owning a full feminine outfit was 15.
How the fuck does anyone get 15 years experience crossdressing before having a full femme outfit. I had my first full outfit shortly after moving away.

>The average number of years of practice with cross dressing prior to adoption of a feminine name was 21.
This doesn't really apply to me because my birth name is actually a female name and to make a long story short my parents are stupid and the internet didn't exist yet. But I found out at 16 and literally embraced it then and there. Like what the fuck is this even supposed to mean in this context?

>Again, we have factual evidence indicative of the considerable time required for the development of the cross-gender identity. (p. 209)
WHAT DO THEY MEAN BY THIS! I ONLY HAVE ONE IDENTITY! I'M JUST ME! THE ONLY DIFFERENCE IS MODERATING MY MANNERISMS SOMETIMES TO AVOID THE SCORN OF OTHERS!

>>8435431
Regarding identity, it's seems common for hons to separate their "female identity" from their "male identity," sometimes going so far as to refer to the female identity in third person. I don't understand it, but it's a thing.

>>8434986

Concerning what? Effects of transition on family and friends, STD risk, brain studies, or something else? There's a range of studies.

>>8435437
Flexible identifications are very neat though. For a very illustrative example: there's two guys that worked together really, really fucking with me. I don't think of them as "a they" or as a "he and he", I think of that two headed snake as an "it".

>>8435418
>but I had almost no history of erotic cross-dressing at all
AGP sexuality isn't necessarily expressed through crossdressing. It's just a common one. She's wrong when she says it's a sure thing.

Did you have other expressions of AGP, such as in your fantasies?

>I don't have a separate female identity. Who I am is just who I am male or female. I just feel more free to express myself as I'd like in a female context.
She didn't say a separate female identity in that part, just that the core identity isn't female. But she's mostly got experience of hons who did have masculine core identities because they didn't get an alternative and whose femininity often did become a separate identity (also why she's wrong about crossdressing). There's no reason modern AGPs couldn't be kind of gender neutral and female leaning from early on. This is a matter of modern culture.

>But I hate being male and surely taking tit skits of my own free will, trying to cut my own balls off and multiple suicide attempts (or cries for help or whatever) must be worth something?!
It is. It shows you're trans. It just doesn't say whether you're AGP and HSTS, which can help you understand yourself, but isn't the be and end all and isn't how to know if you should transition or not. Understanding whether transition would help you is and identifying your type can help that.

>>8435418
>>8435431
nigga chill
go for a walk or something

>>8435431
>but then again I didn't like getting beat by my parents or frowned upon by society so what does this really mean?!
It means you didn't need to present as female before then. Needing to is a sign of HSTS. But when you did start it was still for the purpose of passing, not erotic, which is more HSTS. Did you also do it for inner comfort just from feeling female to yourself?

>Prior to that there may have been 4 or 5 episodes in 18 years.
What were those episodes?

>How the fuck does anyone get 15 years experience crossdressing before having a full femme outfit.
Hons who crossdressed erotically for years. Check the average age of the subjects and it'll be 40s or even older.

>Like what the fuck is this even supposed to mean in this context?
HSTS want to be called female and will ask people to call them female as soon as they can. AGPs typically stay in the closet about it and don't make waves by asking to be called something female until they come out and transition.

>THE ONLY DIFFERENCE IS MODERATING MY MANNERISMS SOMETIMES TO AVOID THE SCORN OF OTHERS!
Hons moderate their manners much more, to the point that it can be a different identity. HSTS and younger AGPs can both have just one identity. Essentially she's talking about a result of AGP repression.

But even a young AGP might identify as a boy or at least as not a girl early on and perhaps only start considering themselves as a girl at 20 or later. That would be unusual for an HSTS.

tl;dr she's talking about AGP hons, not AGPs in general.

>>8435463
>Did you have other expressions of AGP, such as in your fantasies?

I never really liked gender bender tf stuff but I did like futa for a while if that counts. When i used to fap I usually couldn't get off unless I imagined myself as the girl. Afterwards i always felt like shit though to the point where I started associating sex in general with shame and hating myself. One of the main reasons why I decided to start taking HRT was that I didn't want to get erections anymore. if nothing else that would make it worth it because they cause me alot of psychological distress and they JUST DON'T FUCKING STOP AND RANDOMLY APPEAR WHEN I'M NOT EVEN ARROUSED! It was just really intrusive on my life and even if I don't end up transitioning I'm still going to take AA's. I know that AGP are supposed to be gynephilic and I am to an extent but my entire attraction is all fucked up. I never get attracted to girls outside of the context of trying to rub one out. As in I can fap to a naked female but if I saw a pretty girl I wouldn't be "attracted" to her. For men it's sort of similar. But they have something that women don't usually have which is masculinity. Romantically I could never be with a woman. I really just have no attraction to feminine personalities. It took me a long time to admit it to myself but I really want to be held by someone taller and stronger than me and for them to say they cherish and appreciate me. And that also makes me hate myself. I'm not even sure why anymore.

>>8435502
>Did you also do it for inner comfort just from feeling female to yourself?
I tried but I kept failing. I didn't let it shatter me completely and tried to work to improve my appearance. I have some trusted internet friends that say I'm pretty but I really don't believe it at all. No matter what I do I just feel ugly as a woman. Which is ironic because I feel like I'm at least moderately attractive as a man. i don't fail to inadvertently attract a female every now and again but I literally have zero interest in a romantic relationship with a woman. I know I'm not HSTS because I am gynephilic but I don't feel AGP either because I just don't feel like any of those things really describe me. I would and do feel alot better when I get confirmation that can pass for a female but it's only transient because no matter what I go right back to hating my appearance and generally feeling inadequate.

>What were those episodes?
stealing some of my sisters clothes and trying them on at various ages all under 11. The only time I ever got an erection crossdressing was wearing one of her dresses when I was I thing 10 or something. Not sure what that means. But every time I tried I stopped because I was afraid of being discovered and luckily never was. And it was always a long time before I did it again.

>>8435507
>but I did like futa for a while if that counts.
It's borderline.

>I know that AGP are supposed to be gynephilic and I am to an extent but my entire attraction is all fucked up. I never get attracted to girls outside of the context of trying to rub one out. As in I can fap to a naked female but if I saw a pretty girl I wouldn't be "attracted" to her.
Describe this contextual attraction further please?

>It took me a long time to admit it to myself but I really want to be held by someone taller and stronger than me and for them to say they cherish and appreciate me.
Sounds pseudo-bi.

>>8435519
>but I don't feel AGP either because I just don't feel like any of those things really describe me.
I think lots of AGPs are less explicitly AGP like this, rather than having overt TF fantasies and lots of crossdressing fapping.

>stealing some of my sisters clothes and trying them on at various ages all under 11.
Crossdressing in secret, gynephilia and the way you describe your attraction to men are all very AGP.

The rest I think comes from your shame and self-hate issues around sex.

>Another implication of the potential independence of erotic desire and attachment as components of erotic-romantic orientations is that these two components may differ significantly in relative strength. It seems plausible that some nonhomosexual MtF transsexuals may experience relatively little erotic desire but may nevertheless experience substantial feelings of attachment to and affection for their idealized images of themselves as female. This would be consistent with the reports by some putatively autogynephilic MtF transsexuals that erotic desire was only a minor aspect of their wish to be female. It is not uncommon for nonhomosexual MtF transsexuals to report having a low sex drive, losing their virginity late in life, having been sought out by female partners rather than seeking them out, and experiencing little sexual excitement with cross-dressing after a few years’ time. Nonhomosexual MtF transsexuals with histories like these appear to resemble the “asexual” MtF transsexuals who were extensively studied by some early theorists (Bentler 1974; Person and Ovesey 1974) but who have received less attention recently. Reports by these transsexuals that their desire to be female lacks a strong erotic component do not necessarily indicate that they do not have an
underlying autogynephilic erotic-romantic orientation, nor do they indicate that they are deceiving themselves or trying to deceive others.
(cont)

>>8435620
I further hypothesize that, when nonhomosexual MtF transsexuals describe themselves as having been unmasculine or “not like other boys,” they often may be referring to an unwillingness or inability to seek out female sexual partners with an avidity comparable to their peers, rather than to the presence of female-typical interests or behaviors. The nonhomosexual MtF transsexuals I have interviewed rarely describe themselves as having had female-typical interests and behaviors in childhood, but many describe themselves as having been “unmasculine,” in ways that go beyond their commonly reported disinterest in team sports. Many recall
having had little erotic interest generally or little interest in interpersonal sexuality specifically, in comparison to their male peers. Many never dated during adolescence unless invited by girls. Clearly these boys had not been unattracted to girls, but their attraction was often more idealizing and affectionate than overtly erotic and was not expressed with typical masculine confidence. Admittedly, this is a complicated issue: a significant number of nonhomosexual MtF transsexuals appear to have comparatively little interest in other people generally, but substantial interest in “things,” especially computers and other machines (Laub and
Fisk 1974).
(cont)

>>8435628
>In my experience, the tendency of some MtF transsexuals to prefer things over people sometimes involves deficits in empathy and interpersonal skills similar to those seen in Asperger’s disorder; this may partly explain the limited interpersonal sexual expression or interest of some nonhomosexual MtF transsexuals (Galluci, Hackerman, and Schmidt 2005). Nevertheless, its seems plausible that some nonhomosexual MtF transsexuals who report that they were unmasculine in childhood and adolescence can accurately be thought of as persons who want to become what they love, but whose love for women is more affectionate than erotic.

This one made much much much more sense to me but it still makes me want to kill myself. Basically what it's saying is just that I'm broken and have autism.

>>8434986
I posted this a billion times at this point but here:
http://www.hawaii.edu/PCSS/biblio/articles/2015to2019/2016-transsexualism.html
http://www.hawaii.edu/PCSS/biblio/articles/2005to2009/2006-atypical-gender-development.html

Both by Milton Diamond
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milton_Diamond

The first article cites an excruciating number of studies that you can follow up on yourself. If you want to look into the specifics of any study just google the title of the study. There's usually an open access article within the first few results.

>>8435264
Has Lawrence ever commented on the studies pointing out that pre-HRT gynephilic MTFs also have feminized brains? :^)

>>8435633
this is what happens when you give everyone access to sci papers they read one or two studies (maybe the only two studies on the subject) and develop huge lvls of confirmation bias playing into whatever worldview they already have developed.


I miss the pre Sci-hub age already

>>8435603
>Describe this contextual attraction further please?
Like breasts. They're pretty. I could fap to them. But I probably wouldn't actually have sex with a woman.

>>8435418
>>8435633
Lawrence is advocating a theory that grossly disregards any neurological findings in favor of opting for an untested, unproven psychological hypothesis called Blanchard's Transsexual Typology. It is not a coincidence that this theory was popular for a brief period in time and fell out of favor when more and more brain scan data showing neurological differences in transsexuals of all orientations in sexually dimorphic regions came in. Today it is not taken seriously and is not even in the DSM-5.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Causes_of_transsexuality

>>8435643
Then clear it up for me because I literally know nothing. That's kind of the point of this thread. I don't understand myself and it's getting really hard to live like this so I just want more information and maybe some help.

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>>8435633
>whose love for women is more affectionate than erotic
This makes sense to me. Fascinating.

>>8435655
>A first-of-its-kind study by Zhou et al. (1995) found that in a region of the brain called the bed nucleus of the stria terminalis (BSTc), a region which is known for sex and anxiety responses (and which is affected by prenatal androgens),[7] male-to-female trans women had a female-normal BSTc size (like cisgender women) and female-to-male trans men had a male-normal size. While the transsexuals studied had taken hormones, this was accounted for by including non-transsexual male and female controls who, for a variety of medical reasons, had experienced hormone reversal. The controls still had sizes typical for their gender. No relationship to sexual orientation was found.[8]

I wonder how common it is for trannies to get really bad Anxiety attacks. For me they aren't frequent but when I get them I feel like my whole life is falling apart, sometimes because of a simple social gaffe and I literally just have to remove myself from everything for up to an hour. The last time it happened was a few years ago and it made me start rambling like an idiot about being stupid and i felt what I imagine it feel like to be on a bad batch of meth.

>>8435655
>>8435674
Just a note on the gynephilic section (when you get to it): the Savic study was done using MRI and found no white matter differences, but a later DTI study did find white matter differences.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4699258/

I also suggest that you don't skip over
>>8435639

>>8435643
Agreed, research should be only for the eyes of experts.

>>8435655
>and fell out of favor when more and more brain scan data showing neurological differences in transsexuals of all orientations in sexually dimorphic regions came in.
Is that the real reason it fell out of favor?

Be honest.

>>8435674
how would that link into anxiety attacks? it just says that mtfs are have the same size of that brain area as cis women.

>>8435831
Read the sources I've linked and try to argue otherwise hombre.

>Dick Swaab and Milton Diamond were just forced to say what they did by the SJWs lmao it's all politics XD

>>8435847
>he can't answer the question
I wonder why not.

>>8435887
You asked a question the answer to which is contained in the post you responded to. Yes. It is incompatible with the neuroscience and has been abandoned as a result.

>>8435923
I don't believe you. Prove it.

>>8435944
This is not a matter of belief. I suggest that you read the links I've posted so far.
>>8435639
>>8435655
>>8435682

>>8435948
Quote the precise part that addresses what I'm accusing you of lying about.

>>8435959
Nigh-everything there, a few androphile-focused studies apart, is a direct contradiction of the typology via demonstration of a "feminine essence".

>>8435965
>is a direct contradiction of the typology
Not what I asked. Are you being deliberately obtuse or did you just not bother reading my posts?

>>8435971
So, accepting that the typology has been thoroughly refuted by neuroscience, you're asking for proof that scientists did not abandon it for political reasons rather than because it was thoroughly refuted?

>>8435979
Is that what I said?

>>8435984
What else could you be asking? The typology has been refuted factually and definitively. Evidence to that effect has been posted, without challenge. Given this is the case it only follows that scientists changed their views to match the advances in the field. The extraordinary claim here would be that they changed them for other reasons.

>>8435997
That's another lie though. It doesn't only follow.

>>8435997
Don't argue with him. The guys here (>>8435984) lacks critical thinking skills completely and reading comprehension.

You provided him with the sources and he's still saying "Can't answer the question, I wonder why" or "I dont believe you, Prove it". He's like a child.

Just leave him be. No point in arguing with such morons. To anyone with a brain you're clearly the more intelligent one and he's just a troll.

>>8436014
>You provided him with the sources
t. lacks critical thinking skills completely and reading comprehension.

>>8436026

>>8435639
>>8435655
>>8435682

What are those? :)

>>8434986
ANZU IS NOT A TRANNY

REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>>8436031
Proof you didn't read my question.

>>8436038
Proof that you argue you like a 3 year old.

>>8436048
t. pot

>>8436048
Hey, you might want to follow your own advice haha.
>>8436014

>>8436054
"Is that the real reason it fell out of favor?

Be honest."

That is his question.... you're geniunely retarded.

Noone is going to spoonfeed you, read trough the sources. If you're too lazy to do even that, perhaps you shouldn't be arguing about this to begin with.

>>8436075
>Noone is going to spoonfeed you, read trough the sources.
t. literally everybody whose sources don't say what they claim and nobody else ever

>>8436079
No it's literaly everyone who won't waste time doing what you should be doing in the first place.

Stop arguing with that person already..

>>8436084
That's a lie though.

It's extremely telling that one side resorts to lies like this.

It almost answers the original question itself.

>>8436090
You're right.. I'll stop

>>8436101
I bet you're caraposter.

>>8436107
Another brilliant refutation of nothing at all!

>>8436090
Welp I fucked up there haha, told you to stop arguing with the moron, and then proceeded to do it myself....

>>8436101
>All of the papers cited therein are lies
Your entire argument, all the way through, has been sticking your head in the sand. You got your answer.
>>8435997

Make a counterargument or stop posting.

>>8436113
Strawman.

>>8436116
penis in butt

People on 4chan have unnatural abilities compared to other Internet patrons in absolutely ruining and poisoning a thread or discussion. Have there been any studies about that?

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>>8435655
Can I get a brain scan to make sure if Im trans?
Or what would be other way to test? Serious question.

>>8436159
I'm AGP scum, blanchard-kun.

>>8435633
>>8435660
hahaha, and people were laughing at me when I came up with Affective Target Location Error.

>>8428757

>Nevertheless, its seems plausible that some nonhomosexual MtF transsexuals who report that they were unmasculine in childhood and adolescence can accurately be thought of as persons who want to become what they love, but whose love for women is more affectionate than erotic.
Literally what I said.
> deficits in empathy and interpersonal skills similar to those seen in Asperger’s disorder
Inability to bond emotionally.
>appear to have comparatively little interest in other people generally, but substantial interest in “things,”
Telltale symptom of inability to bond.
> It seems plausible that some nonhomosexual MtF transsexuals may experience relatively little erotic desire but may nevertheless experience substantial feelings of attachment to and affection for their idealized images of themselves as female
Only love themselves through projecting femininity onto themselves.

>>8436159
>Can I get a brain scan to make sure if Im trans?
No, because that's a pile of lies.

>>8436167
What if Iv none of the autism, Im very empathic but still
>Only love themselves through projecting femininity onto themselves.

>>8436159
I'm AGP scum, blanchard.

>>8436159
>Can I get a brain scan to make sure if Im trans?
In theory I think that, given all of the different findings, if you got a group of scientists to run all of the relevant tests on you you could get a probable answer (some of the studies were post-mortems though so uh probably not those??).

In practice, unless you're wealthy, it would be difficult to get people to run all of the tests on you.

>Or what would be other way to test?
The old, clumsy, vague way of psychology.

also
>tfw you're the one who made that image on a lark months and months ago

>>>8436180
Ah, see, there you go. You finally admit that you're denying the veracity of the studies linked.

im tired of people telling me what i am.
im tired of people saying im emotionless and autistic.
its rrally invalidating to all the people ive fell in love with and cried about when they died.
im tired of pepple saying im not woman in their eyes. as if they ever had my trust
fuck these studies
i got tranny hands
my body my choice

>>8436182
Depends what you mean by empathic.
Empathy means you understand people, it's easy for you relate to them, and you feel sympathy towards them.
You can have that and still shy away from intimacy (inability to bond). Maybe you have a tendency to be easily overwhelmed by strong emotions like intimacy or conflict, maybe you find it difficult to trust other people not to abandon you, betray you or harm you, etc.

>>8436191
>fuck these studies
Most of the studies are on your side lady..

>>8436188
I haven't examined their veracity because I don't follow every link liars try to trick me into wasting my time on.

>>8436197
>I don't read evidence
Cool.

>>8436198
More strawman dishonestly.

It's like I'm on /pol/.

>>8436192
inability to bond
maybe we got hurt and our soulmate died in a hit and run
not autism

>>8436192
Yeah. all of that, I keep distance because I feel too vulnerable and insecure.

>>8436192
Please make your own thread about ATLEs.

>>8436182
>>8436192
To add to that, inability to bond doesn't mean you never feel "connected" to other people, that you never feel sad or broken when rejected or when you lose them, or that you don't feel strongly about others.

Inability to bond means your mind is dysfunctional (in other words, there is frequent conflict between different parts of your mind), which is widespread and nothing to be ashamed of.
It simply means part of you wants to bond with other people, just like everybody else does. But due to trauma, other parts of your mind don't feel safe doing so, so they "take you over" emotionally and prevent you from caring "too much", bonding "too deeply" or being "too vulnerable" (they numb out and detach from others who they feel could hurt them). There's a constant tension between needing to love or be loved, and needing to feel safe, in a way that being with full ability to bond don't have.

Inability to bond can be selective (can trust some people but not others, or maybe only animals) and can be strong or weak (you allow yourself to be somewhat vulnerable, but not too much). It's not all or nothing.

Typical symptoms are:
>Being attracted to others not out of love, but out of neediness, sex, loneliness, duty, or wanting to rescue the other person.
>Feeling "empty" within the relationship, or like "something's missing", or confusing this emptiness with depression
>Feeling lonely despite being surrounded by people, or having an intimate relationship with someone
>Feeling like there's a "hole in your soul"
>Using addictions to numb away the pain caused by the above
>Feeling unloved despite being in an intimate relationship
>Approach-avoid relationships, "independent" relationships (emotionally detached), codependent relationships

>>8436209
I never said it was autism, it's a consequence of trauma.

>>8436210
Me too. It's tough to live with. Hopefully someday I'll find a solution.

>>8436217
I'll try to later today, have to run a few errands first.

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I step away for like 3 hours and the whole thread becomes a violent shitshow.

I just want to know why I am the way I am and how to fix it. Could we leave the vitrol and arguments for another thread?

>>8436188
>>Or what would be other way to test?
>The old, clumsy, vague way of psychology.
Tried and failed. So Im still suck with my doubts wondering where and why did all go so wrong.

>>8436228
Nobody knows.

>>8436225
>I'll try to later today, have to run a few errands first.
Make it now by pasting the premise and then there'll be replies ready for you when you get back.

>>8436228
>I just want to know why I am the way I am
You got the answer.

>and how to fix it
If you're trans? By transitioning.

>>8436225
I used to fall in love too easily, I just didn't know how to handle it.

>>8436237
>>8436275
done
>>8436320

bump?

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>non-garbage studies
>written by real grad students
Pick one

>>8435264
umm how about we just call agps men with a crossdressing feminization fetish and actual transsexualism just transsexualism...

I do not want to be considered a homosexual transsexual because I was born as a female with a dick that I had to fix, I'd rather just be called a female born with an unfortunate sex development disorder why is it so fucking complicated for cis people to understand that?

I mean ffs I had a microdick and my body never masculinized even at age 19 why am I a fuckign homosexual for being born with a fucked up body?

>>8435431
I do this and seperate my male and female identities.

A G P
G
P

Every day I wake up is another day I'm glad I don't transition. Soon the cure will be here.

>>8440287
>I do not want
That's ok, when people talk about reality we aren't talking about your wants!

>>8441423
>25 year old psychobabble
>reality

ITT:
>I trust studies, but only those ones which confirm the opinion I already had.

On all sides.

>>8441527
Bull. I read most of Blanchard's AGP-related work. Drop the false equivalence.

>>8440287
How about we just go on and call autogynophiles hons/twinkhons and HSTSs faguettes?

>>8434986
op's pic looks like a real life version of Chihiro from dangan ronpa who is this adoreable creature

https://www.routledge.com/The-Transgender-Studies-Reader-2/Stryker-Aizura/p/book/9780415517737

>>8445066
because "transbians" and "drag queens" are already in the collective consciousness, are self-explanatory and are easier to remember

>>8441527
Only one side has actually posted studies in terms of actual research though, and neurological at that.

The other side is just pure opinion and vague allusions to some undefined conspiracy suppressing the truth that would surely prove them right and somehow manipulating all research and science to produce false results that disagree with what they feel should be true and are therefore illegitimate.

... i reckon they gotta be out there, OP... they have books out there like "ritual homosexuality in new guinea" and all kinds of studies on sexuality all over the world

....i've read an actual published book on sexuality that got homosexuality and trans all wrong... the man claimed to be a doctor but had a completely false view of homosexuality and trans, you could tell he was heterosexual