Why do gay people support a religion that advocates the killing

Some perople think that islam can be reformed and westernized. This is definetly true for muslims living in the west but not realistic for islam abroad.

>>7875402
Because Muslim guys are hot

>muslims come to kill him
>he brandishes a sign written in HIV blood from his butthole
>this causes muslims to stay away
>defends islam AND protect himself from islam at the same time

sjw's are evolving

>>7875402
Inclusivness is the only way we can solve the islam issue. The invasion of iraq and afghanistan by the us brought us ISIS. The sooner cuckservatives realize that the better western society will be.

>>7875402
Leftards don't stop being retarded just because they happen to be LGBT.

The way I see it, I like to half my face pushed into a pillow by a buff dude while he rips apart my asshole every night.

For decades people have been saying that because I do this I must be a pedophile or some kind of sick freak bent on destroying society.

Muslims sit in a mosque for hours and pray to allah and don't eat pig, and everyon thinks they're automatically a terrorist just because.

So I'd feel like a hypocrite not standing up for the Muslims who aren't bombs and just wanna pray to Allah and live their lives. Because I just wanna date dudes and live my life.

marxist consolidation of a power base, mostly

the pushed false narrative that there's this silent majority of muslims who are not, in fact, ignorant and sub-100 IQ individuals that are offended and oppressed by the western world's wariness of their religion and ethnicity's nature. most muslims follow their holy texts quite seriously, and there are untold millions in the muslim population whose minimum for belief is sharia law.

while western countries are responsible for destroying muslim countries by either direct war or proxy conflict (ironically enough under administrations headed by the selfsame leftists that preach tolerance, or conservatives who are so ideologically violated they're basically the same thing) this does not mean we should let in the disgruntled dispossessed of the countries we are directly responsible for ruining.

preaching tolerance for muslims atm would be like letting in every vietnamese refugee into america during the vietnam war - odds are that there will be a significant number of muslims let into a country who only have bad intentions in this day and age should you accept refugees from muslim countries.

>>7875402
Me and every gay I know fucking hates Islam. Individual Muslims get judged case by case, but Islam as a thing can fuck off to oblivion.

>>7875429

Dude, you're so misinformed, I don't blame you as it's common.

Gay Ex-muslim here raised in a religious household. (past tense obviously) We don't go to the mosque to simply pray, we can do that at home with a prayer mat. The main purpose of going to the mosque is to listen to the Imam's sermon before/after the prayer which is considered sunnah (recommended/rewarded in heaven). The sermon is usually a social commentary about how to lead your life and general life lessons, not like Christianity where the Preist reads from the Bible verbatim. So the Imam's are essentially theologians and it's up to them to pick and choose what they teach to the congregation.

The only point of contention is the Imam himself, how extreme or liberal they are. Obviously I don't mean liberal as in gay-loving but indifference or avoiding the subject altogether.
The mosque I went to was pretty liberal but a few times I went with a friend to pray at another moseque and the Imam was VERY radical. In fact, when I told my parents about it THEY are the ones who told me to stay away and not return there.

>>7875474
>In fact, when I told my parents about it THEY are the ones who told me to stay away and not return there.
Nice that there are muslims like that. May I ask which country?

How did your parents and extended family deal with you coming out and stopping being muslim?

>>7875402
for me it's deathwish
t. involved in refugee help

>>7875474
Dude you're incredibly misinformed. Christian pastors don't read straight out of the Bible and call it a day,

>They don't go to the mosque to simply pray and read the the Bible, they can do that at home with a bible. The main purpose of going to the mosque is to listen to the pastor's sermon before/after the prayer. The sermon is usually a social commentary about how to lead your life and general life lessons. So the pastor's are essentially theologians and it's up to them to pick and choose what they teach to the congregation.
>The only point of contention is the Pastor himself, how extreme or liberal they are. Obviously I don't mean liberal as in gay-loving but indifference or avoiding the subject altogether.

All religion is the same.

>>7875557
Fucked up the copy and pasto in the first sentence, fail

>>7875557

Huh?
I've only been to a black church but they were mainly praising Jesus and being joyful. Can't say I know what really happens in a white church but I probably am misinformed, I've never seen/heard a pastor giving commentaries during mass/service.

Afaik there's no reward system in Christianity to make the congregation listen to the pastor's word for heavenly points.

Finally I've never heard of extremist pastors. It's very common in Islam and I know of many here in London. However they are free to operate thanks to apologists like yourself.

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>>7875402
Because you retarded /pol/tard, not all muslims are the same, just like not ll christian are homophobes.

And Muslims will just be Christians 2.0 aka "lol i am such a nice person, we dont need to completely follow an outdated script" just like christians are doing now and are often pro lgbt.

And if you want to talk about who is more dangerous, Christians are far more dangerous since religion is used as a tool of manipulation in the US and the world in general so Christians can influence lawmakers far more

in b4
>b..but dey gonna make sharia law everywhere D:
retard

being gay shit like that is so stupid
why would you want people to be near who at their quickest will attempt to kill you

>>7875901
>who at their quickest will attempt to kill you
Woah wonder why my muslim friends dont kill me even though i have been open about being gay for 2 years

Really makes you think :o

>>7875948
> implying westernized ones will

>>7875948
Wow anon this is national news! We must make sure everybody knows muslims don't need to be deported! Only muslims besides anon 7875948's friends!

>>7875960
>>7875951
>/pol/tards once they get BTFOed

>>7875964
>implying i go on pol
implying no gay person ever was killed by a Muslim

>>7875460
True
>>7875547
LOL, know what you mean, they are fucking savages, no manners take what they want destroy what they feel like.
>>7875831
Christians are itching to throw faggots of roofs. No wait, those are the mudslimes.

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>>7875971
>This goalposting

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>>7875979
>>7875971
>/pol/ thinks they arent mentally retarded and we bother talking with them seriously
Sorry, i dont have serious discussions with my dog ;^)

>>7875982
so your dog is smarter than you good to know
>>7875980
i don't take amazingly large risks like going to iraq or any place where if your gay ---------- and their goes your head
sorry if it upsets you that people don't want to die

>>7875982
>dog shit poster is a muslim apologist

Liberals think Muslims are just another religious minority want to live their life in peace and leave everyone else alone. I think thats nonsense; the majorty of muslims living in the UK right now think homosexual acts should be made illegal and 47% think gays shouldn't be able be teachers. I get that there are "good" Muslims out there that just want to live their lives and assimilate into Western culture, but they are statistically outnumbered by the ones that want to unironically throw me off a building.

>>7876022
>I get that there are "good" Muslims out there that just want to live their lives and assimilate into Western culture,
You mean ex-Muslims and "Muslims" who are as "Muslim" as the "Christians" who say they believe in God but don't know which denomination they belong to and haven't been to church since their parents took them.

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>>7876022
>Liberals think
Nice try, your tiny brain could never comprehend what we think because our mind is flexible, yours is closed and tries to force everything to adhere to some close minded autistic definition.

We are beyond your league /pol/tard, go "discusS" with the other autists in your baord

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>>7875402
Pure retard and cultural marxism.

Kek is the God of /lgbt/

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>>7876068

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>>7876068
Fuck off tumbler

>>7875402
Because freedom of speech, freedom of religion, ect. are tenants of the us and murder is illegal? Muslims are a minority and a lot of people are phobic of them just because of what they've heard of them (just like gays). People stood up for me when the world was homophobic, why shouldn't we stand up and support people when the world is islamophobic?

>>7876156
we didn't want to harm the people who helped us since our religion dictated it

>>7876156
My religious views are that I should always be against importing minorities who want to kill me.

>>7875557
the difference being that the "christian community" is 90% people who are just christian on paper and 10% limp dicked splinter groups who make up no significant share of the demography

muslim immigrants, largely from the middle east, are mostly on the conservative side. you think they come to the west because they love gay parades and our party culture? it's opportunism. no bombs and better pay. i dont blame them for that, i'd do the same i guess.

but youre fucking yourself over if you ignore the conservativism and the amount of radicalism within that in the muslim community.

i used to work in a small shop in an area with lots of muslim immigrants. brown guy comes in, wants to buy a lighter, i ask which one, says he doesnt care, i just grab one at random. he starts to yell at me like a complete lunatic
> DEFINITELY NOT
> ARE YOU SHITTING ME
> I'M NOT A GOD DAMN FAGGOT
took me a moment to realise it was because i gave him a pink lighter. i just gave him another one, he pays, done. (muslim) coworker looks kinda shocked and he excuses himself for being so loud and explains that obviously, he just really hates faggots, that they're disgusting and should be put into camps. she's like
>yeah yeah okay i get it you were just a little loud for a moment haha but yeah youre right

.

not all muslims are the same and not all christians are the same but christianity has lost most of its power to shape popular opinion, while conservative islam (as if there's such a thing as non-conservative islam) is the center of life for a vast part of the muslim demo.

1. stop bombing the middle east
2. respect other cultures and their practices around the world, but
3. keep them the fuck out of the west

>>7876182
>but yeah youre right
WTF. Was she kidding?

>>7876156
>freedom of speech, freedom of religion, ect. are tenants of the us and murder is illegal?

is that a question? yes, freedom of speech is very important to americans and murder is illegal. ironically the majority of muslims believe the appropriate punishment for apostasy is... death.

how are muslims compatible with American society again?

>>7876193
no she wasnt.

she was in her mid twenties and still living at home btw because her parents and whatever flavour of liberal islam they follow strictly forbids you live on your own as a woman.

and she WAS actually rather liberal compared to others, i guess, i mean she didnt have to wear the headtowel and she smoked, that's gotta count for something

>>7876211
how do you know for sure she wasn't just humouring him?

>i mean she didnt have to wear the headtowel and she smoked, that's gotta count for something
It does, which really tells us something, when that's what the westernised muslims think.

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>>7876156
I'm "phobic" of Muslims because 52% of Muslims living in my home country openly admit to wanting to throw me in jail just for being gay (compare to 5% of general population). That's fucking terrifying and I feel completely justified in not wanting more Muslims in West. It has nothing to do with stereotypes.

It sounds like you just feel obligated to unconditionally support Muslims because some people don't like gays and some people also dont like Muslims.

>>7876285
Reminder that leftists tell you Christians would do the same to LGBT people if they could get away with it.

Reminder that the general population % includes the over half of the Muslim population.

>>7876022
> the majorty of muslims living in the UK right now think homosexual acts should be made illegal and 47% think gays shouldn't be able be teachers.

sounds like every bible belter i've ever met lmao

>>7876282
>how do you know for sure she wasn't just humouring him?
i dont even know what to answer to that. can you not tell when people are humoring someone vs agreeing on genocidal ideation

>It does, which really tells us something, when that's what the westernised muslims think.
you people are insane, holy shit

i'm gonna go out on a limb here and assume you've never lived anywhere near a place where there's a significant muslim population. you should try it. it'll clear things up real quick.

>>7876467
I agree with you, I just want it 100% for sure that she felt the same way.

what I meant was that even when they act western they might still think things like that.

if you have more situations like that share them.

>>7876329
>Christians would do the same to LGBT people if they could get away with it.
I live in the bible belt. I have met a lot of christians that believe freedom of religion only applies to christians and that non christians should be removed from the USA. A lot have stated that LGBT should be executed or "cured". They keep their thoughts to themselves I f they think speaking would effect them negatively.

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>>7876490
t. leftist from New York

ITT: swedes.

>>7875606
>Finally I've never heard of extremist pastors.
Maybe you should actually pay attention to the world around you.

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/28/us/pastors-praise-anti-gay-massacre-in-orlando-prompting-outrage.html?_r=0

>>7876366
I'm not a fan of Christianity either. If we could restrict the flow of Christian evangelists into the US I'd be all for that. I'd actually be interested to see a direct comparison

>>7876530
I live in a small town in Tennessee. When SSM passed there were people in public chanting "Kill the queers" and similar phrases. Be glad you have not encountered them.

>>7876530
Can't find a source for this weird screenshot of a blog headline anywhere, let alone from any reputable outlet. This doesn't do anything to disprove the point of the person you're responding to either.

You suck at this whole basic critical thinking and fact-checking thing.

>>7876486
>what I meant was that even when they act western they might still think things like that.
ah. well. you never know here

dont remember anything juicy rn but the living situation of the coworker always seemed horrific. the fact that she wasnt allowed to move despite fighting with her parents a lot; and she always told me she wants to quit the job & hates it, to the point where she had tears in her eyes, but appearently her uncle was the third cousin once removed of the boss of the store or some shit like that, and so she wasnt allowed to quit because that wouldve meant inter family beef and dishonor

she did eventually quit when there was some family situation, idk, some feud of the uncles that made it okay for her to get the fuck out of there. it really was a shit job, i just needed the income and well, i was somewhat comforted by the knowledge that i was free to quit at any time, unlike her.

i met her once, afterwards, she had found work somewhere else where she got paid a little better and treated with some modicum of respect. made me happy. she may have had her stone age political opinions but ignoring that she was actually quite a sweet person.

again i dont hate muslims, i fully agree that the middle east has been fucked time and time again by the west, but regardless there's a huge difference in where we're at (west vs ME) as a culture at this point and i don't think it's a great solution to just roll over and let all the ultraconservative muslims in. especially when there's still russian and US troops in the area right now.

let's just pull out of that area, limit the number of refugees we take in and instead pump some foreign aid into the area and help refugees who went to other ME nations, where they're amongst their own, in their own culture and where they can advance as one culture rather than being some conservative splinter group in the west where expenses are much higher and conflict is almost unavoidable.

>>7876541
Are you saying we need to teach evangelicals about contraception? I totally agree

>>7876541
Not a chance. The moment you actually separate church from state, instead of letting Christians create massive amounts of legislation based on their religious beliefs and restrictions, there will be catastrophe. Christian extremists are violent, delusional warmongers who have been searching for any possible excuse to murder people they disagree with for quite some time now. Things are reaching a fever pitch here, and now they're simply stockpiling ammo waiting for the dogwhistle.

And they think they're different from every other religion-motivated terrorist somehow because MUH JEZUZ.

>>7876569
so you live in Russia cool bro

>>7876558
You're right, only Muslims deal with being heavily pressured to work a job their family member gave them.

Also
>i don't think it's a great solution to just roll over and let all the ultraconservative muslims in
We've already been letting ultraconservative Christians in for centuries. Last year was the first time we took in slightly more Muslim refugees than Christian refugees.

>>7876580
I live in America, and American Christian extremists are violent shitheads who use their religious belief as an excuse to threaten, terrorize, and murder those they feel violate their belief system.

Why defend these terrorists?

>>7876580
Their are plenty of people like that in the USA. Why would you think otherwise?

>>7876599
> being christian ans still attend church
u wot m8

>>7876662
You're confused.

>>7875402
>>7875996
>>7876182

as a gay Muslim, all i want is a bf. why would i want to kill gays, i'm gay, i realized this a while ago.

you know, i used to be a Wahhabi? i'm probably on some list somewhere, but i used to hold sympathetic views to the Wahhabi ideology, but then, researching on westerners i cam across some guys i kind of fancied a lot.

people can change in a split second. i saw what i was doing, it was wrong. i knew in my heart it was wrong, and that's how most people feel.


Islam can be reformed and made into a more tolerant version such as ahamdiya or sufism.
or even the new sect Reform Islam.

Many /Pol/tards here are clueless as to whats actually happening in the islamic world. we are experiencing an uprising right now, the Golden age sects that died out are starting to make a comeback, and Ultra conservatives are shitting their pants, thus funding terrorist groups like ISIS and Al-Qaeda (Saudi arabia funds em).

The Conservatives even in Iran are losing, they are losing everywhere, so the terrorists are trying last ditch efforts to try keep their version of Islam relevant, this means not only killing the liberal muslims, it means stopping muslims in the west being integrated and westernized.

(why? because imagine, if people in your country stop you fro integrating and hate you, who will you turn to?)

>>7875402
#NotAllMuslims

>>7876679
> implying you can be christian and gay
have fun with your bullshit agenda bro

>>7876599
I also live in the states, and I say that you're full of shit. The only terrorists we have are you rabid leftists an your pets, the islamists in the country.

>>7875606
Holy shit, dude. There are loads of extremist Christian leaders/pastors in the U.S. Where have you been? Look up Westboro Baptist Church

>>7876702
yeah but even serial killers know that they are bullshit

>>7876593
>You're right, only Muslims deal with being heavily pressured to work a job their family member gave them.
i know you're trying to be funny, but across the board, it's true. it's a set of conservative values that occur in other demos but there's no other single demographic that is as highly uniform and brings as much paleoconservative baggage in the west right now as muslims. you're cherrypicking with the christians to make your points. i dont have to cherrypick amongst muslims to make mine.

the key is the homogeneity of opinion within the respective communities.

>We've already been letting ultraconservative Christians in for centuries. Last year was the first time we took in slightly more Muslim refugees than Christian refugees.
i'm not american, so i dont have a horse in this race. i just advise you to look at unrest happening in areas of europe before you so unabashedly support muslim immigration.

>>7875606
>Finally I've never heard of extremist pastors. It's very common in Islam
You should really come to the US. There's lots of extrmist pastors who think gays deserve death here still. The difference is that its getting less and less common now amd instead of advocating for killing gay people the pastor usually will just promise that 'God' will strike the gays dead himself one day like in Sodom and Gomorrah

>>7876694
Typical ammo-stacker mentality. Violent goddamn hypocrites. They look at every person who disagrees with them as if they're all this massive leftist boogeyman out to get them. Meanwhile they avert their eyes whenever a new radical Christian terrorist is arrested for random acts of violence and murder committed on minority populations.

But no, I'm sure the .9% of Muslims in this country are the "real threat" and not the goddamn Yeehawdis. Fucking jackass.

>>7876714
and Muhammad

>>7876556
I called into question the veracity of his statement by pointing out that he's most likely a larping, lying leftist. Frankly, your reading comprehension is terrible. Also, as I'm sure you'd insist the opposite, CNN and the NYT are not reputable news outlets.

>>7876716
Don't get to triggered, snowflake. And wipe that froth from your mouth.

>>7876743
Damn typo.
*too

>>7876727
>I called into question the veracity of his statement by pointing out that he's most likely a larping, lying leftist.
That's not an argument. That's baseless ad hominem.

>Frankly, your reading comprehension is terrible.
I understood what was written completely. Your inability to fact-check is pretty abysmal though.

Also, I don't actually see a source, let alone a reputable one. Can you find one? Or do you just post pictures of blog posts as if they're actual, verifiable news?

>>7876682
>(why? because imagine, if people in your country stop you fro integrating and hate you, who will you turn to?)
here (mid EU) refugees get housing, allowance, and once asylum is granted they get the full rainbow of social benefits from health insurance to, again, housing, extra bux for children, etc etc etc

there's language programs, diversity quotas; and the vast majority of people are liberal and pro refugees.

noone's keeping anyone from integrating other than they themselves. my ex boss barely spoke our language after THIRTY years of being here. a lot of immigrants i met don't give two shits about the local culture or the area they live in in general, they isolate and keep to their own. except when the elections come around, because they know if the right wingers win it spells trouble for them.

you seem alright and i knew people in school, friends of friends etc who are like that. i appreciate that, i support it. but that's not the vast majority of muslims coming to europe (and prolly also not the vast majority coming to the US).

>>7876743
What an argument. If your only retort is accusing me of being upset, I think you're done here.

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>this thread
Fucking hell. The Marxists have really done a number on you people. Gays and trannies are literally cheering for people that want to murder them to enter the country, and some of you think that there's a reasonable comparison between US Christians and the Muslims.

>>7876770
gave me a kek fuck

>>7876710
It's not humor, just sarcasm, because your hypocrisy isn't funny. It's just pathetic.

There are a great many conservatives in the West, that follow many religions, who do things like what happened in your unverifiable anonymous anecdote. Even people who aren't religious value family and pressure their younger family members to work in family owned/operated businesses under threats of both shame and abandonment.

I find it ridiculous how people like you try to make Muslims out to be this lock-step hivemind because many hold conservative beliefs when there are Christians in my own country fucking and having kids with prepubescent girls in woodland Jesus cults in almost every goddamn state.

>i'm not american, so i dont have a horse in this race.
But yet you feel driven to debate and comment about it, then bring up your own personal gripes in relation to it. The unrest in Europe is from extremist right-wing fearmongering about evil foreigner rape, which is still statistically unsubstantiated. Stop bullshitting.

>>7876803
> then you look at the middle east oh 12 is acceptable age to fuck k den

>>7876759
It's not an ad hom, dude. It should be easy to tell. I mean, it's not irrelevant to his argument: I'm saying that that it's all bullshit.

>>7876764
I believe given time they'd integrate, though ISIS obviously has an agenda and it wasn't the best idea to let in the refugees in such large numbers, ISIS would obv infiltrate, but then again, ISIS would have infiltrated even with a muslim ban if they really wanted to.

theres a method to integrating them, and that means allowing them to live in certain places as to not create muslim enclaves, since this will incentivise them to not integrate.

ISIS (the puppet of saudi arabia but we cant say that cause the US sucks their cock for oil cumshots) see a very Very rare opportunity to gather people to recruit, they are refugees, they dont have shit, not money no nothing, they go to the west. but what ISIS wants is so that when they get there, they get spat at and turned around and kicked out like they're subhumans. they basically want to be able to say "I fucking told you so, now grab this gun, and help me out".

As someone who was actually involved with the wahabbi ideology (i mentioned im probably on a list). I know what i'm talking about, this is exactly what they want. To give you an idea

look up a guy called Majid nawaz, me and him have a similar story, in terms of versions of islam. look at what hes trying to do, i'm also attempting in my own community to do that, at my own expense. i've received death threats from old timer Wahhabi's but i continue my work.

>>7876826
but then not being in a community with others they would revolt and they would state it would be segregation to keep them spread out

>>7876839
they wouldn't, i mean for example, not having an entire street bought out by Muslim families, maybe a Muslim neighbor here and there. they wouldn't mind at all. many would actively prefer it, especially here in the UK (where i live now).

>>7876848
you would think that but what happens a lot of the time is people get triggered by shit like that and start protesting about bullshit

>>7876824
Yeah it's not like there are extremist Christian hamlets and villages dotted all over the U.S. where ultraconservative religious nuts fuck kids (sometimes their own), stockpile guns/ammo, brainwash their children from birth, and have massive incestuous families with multiple barely pubescent girls. Oh wait, that does happen. Silly me.

We should really judge all Christians by that standard though, the same way we judge all Muslims by what Daesh does, or how isolated, heavily religious Afghani farmers live. In that way the average Christian is literally a KKK-loving pedo hermit, and the average Muslim is literally Daesh.

>>7876803
>The unrest in Europe is from extremist right-wing fearmongering about evil foreigner rape, which is still statistically unsubstantiated
i can give you an article from last fucking week about a court case wheere thirteen iraquis raped a pass out drunk local girl, and did not only not show remorse after being sentenced but seemed to completely miss why what they did was wrong in the first place.
from a liberal newspaper, not some tabloid. i can probably dig up a dozen more from around europe, maybe even one or two more gangrapes from my area, i can distinctly remember there being at least one more last year where a couple of teenagers subdued the fucked a fifty year old woman walking through the woods. statistics do reflect that.

you don't live here, i do, you arrogant fuck.

and if you already have problems with religious extremism (which i doubt comes anywhere near to the shit that goes down here but hey whatever i'll take your word for it) it escapes me why you'd want to actively invite more of that.

while there's still troops in the middle east perpetuating the problem. while it would be 2-10 times less expensive and more effective to help those people there, in the neighbouring countries they flee to first.

it makes no goddamn sense.

i bet you're AGP, too

jesus fuck

>>7876826
>I believe given time they'd integrate, though ISIS obviously has an agenda and it wasn't the best idea to let in the refugees in such large numbers, ISIS would obv infiltrate, (...)
agree 100%.

i think we should ALWAYS take in people who have legitimate claims to asylum. out of principle and because those people will actually be glad and thankful they can be here. and on top of that, we can talk about taking in qualified people who want to relocate out of economic opportunism. but not as many and with as little checks as happened the last couple of years.

>>7876824
libruls dude. mind bending.

>>7876858
i'm not familiar with this ever happening before. and clearly the current strategy isnt working.

>>7876825
It's an ad-hom, and not even a verifiable one given that we're all anonymous. You should just stop talking.

>>7876876
> i don't believe in judging till i get all the facts of course you have insane people any where you go that is life. why would you want more people like that ?

>>7876889
It's obviously not.

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>55 replies later
>People still unironically try to discuss something serious with mentally ill /pol/tards

>>7876937
I am just having fun b8ing them, i am not actually serious since i know they lack the brain to understand many things.

>>7876826
Nawaz backs the Lib Dems who are radical Islam apologists and the EU, a principal means of importing radical Islam into Europe.

>>7876877
>i can give you an article from last fucking week about a court case wheere thirteen iraquis raped a pass out drunk local girl
If it's actually fact-checked, and from a reputable source, do it. If it's just OOGABOOGA FOREIGNERS!!!! Don't waste my time. Furthermore, anecdotal shit like that, even if it is true and not some fearmongering propaganda-ridden fabrication as it seems, it doesn't replace actual statistics. And if the "statistics do reflect that" you should have no problem producing them to defend your thus far baseless anecdotes and by-the-numbers far right-wing pearl-clutching.

>you don't live here, i do, you arrogant fuck.
Well I didn't see that stop you from commenting on my country, jackass.

>and if you already have problems with religious extremism (which i doubt comes anywhere near to the shit that goes down here but hey whatever i'll take your word for it) it escapes me why you'd want to actively invite more of that.
Because this country is supposed to have religious freedom. If people abide by the laws here, and harm no one, they can believe and practice whatever the fuck they want. The Christian extremists get away with stuff like that here because they settle in places outside of the law. When they are caught they are arrested for what they've done, which is what would and should happen to anyone who feels they have the divine right to break the law because of their extremist beliefs.

>while there's still troops in the middle east perpetuating the problem. while it would be 2-10 times less expensive and more effective to help those people there, in the neighbouring countries they flee to first.
It's a pure myth that surrounding countries haven't accepted or helped the refugees. Saudi Arabia alone has taken in 2.5 million refugees and has given residency to hundreds of thousands since 2011. The UAE has given residency to over 100k Syrians displaced by the war. Gulf states have also given over 2.5 billion in aid.

>>7875422
But Muslims in Muslim majority countries have been violently homophobic long before the west started smashing their dicks into the middle east. The majority of Christians used to be just as violent and a good chunk of them still are, but even when they were at their most violent they weren't going through what Muslims in Muslim countries or what Muslim immigrants experience. The next time some Christian bombs an abortion clinic or stabs someone for being LGBT are you going to tell people we should be nicer to the Christian community?

>>7876877
>i bet you're AGP, too
wtf!

>>7876962
i bet you're a qt <3

>>7876877
>i bet you're AGP, too
Sorry to disappoint, hon.

The only AGP that I've seen recently was a morbidly obese Trump supporter with a "Trans Women For Trump" sign in a video of the most recent Berkeley riot. She was wearing a huge gray mumu with a cheap wig and it was pure fucking cringe.

>>7876937
It's nice to rattle the 4chan echobox sometimes to see what batshit crazy idiots fall out.

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>>7875402
>Why do gay people support a religion that advocates the killing of gays

Because Muslim men are fucking hot.

>>7876975
I bet you're a qt too <3

>>7875404
>Some perople think that islam can be reformed and westernized

But the same people defend islam against any criticism.

>>7876973
ty anon ily 2

>>7876975
see, agps know who wants to kill them.

>>7876991
Just a second ago, agps were liberals. Now agps are proud trump supporters who know what's good for them.

Get your story straight, sweetheart.

>>7876986
That is not at all a true muslim, he is is basically white.

>>7876947
Learn basic grammar.

>>7877029
>he is is basically white.
???????????

Muslims can be white and muslim at the same time. i'm white and muslim

>>7877034
t. triggered /pol/tard of low intelligent.

>>7876954
>Well I didn't see that stop you from commenting on my country, jackass.
i didnt fucking claim to know your living situation better than you tho you sanctimonious twat

>If it's actually fact-checked, and from a reputable source, do it.
https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=de&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fderstandard.at%2F2000053507176%2FUrteil-im-Vergewaltigungsprozess-Geschockt&edit-text=&act=url
this is the newspaper so you can le fact cheque
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Der_Standard

>If it's just OOGABOOGA FOREIGNERS!!!! Don't waste my time.
you know what, just go fuck yourself

google the rest if you want, it's not like you're not perfectly capable to do that. or keep spouting your histrionic caps lock horse shit

>>7876947
> le ebin merely pretending line of argument

>>7876962
sorry luv all is fair in love and mongolian basketweaving forum discussions

>>7877041
that goes counter the tolerant librul cuck narrative. your IP has been noted we're sending the agents now who will escort you to your gas chamber.

please don't tell them about bosnia it would really confuse them

>>7876959
But Christians in Christian-majority countries have been violently homophobic long before any Muslim set foot in the West.

>The majority of Christians used to be just as violent and a good chunk of them still are, but even when they were at their most violent they weren't going through what Muslims in Muslim countries or what Muslim immigrants experience.
When Christians have complete control over a country, even in the modern world, they burn witches and execute LGBT people with alarming frequency. Just look at Uganda. American Christian extremists moved there, and to other countries around Africa, to spread their brand of extremist Christianity, call for genocide, and generally brainwash poverty-stricken areas with violent Christian radicalism. This was, of course, after they realized that their radical religious revolution failed to take hold in the West as much as they had planned. What better way to buffer the Christian extremists in the West than to brainwash new ones in third-world nations who would, presumably, convert the surrounding areas over time and eventually act as an international bulwark of extremist Christian faith.

>The next time some Christian bombs an abortion clinic or stabs someone for being LGBT are you going to tell people we should be nicer to the Christian community?
I'm going to tell you to be rational, to acknowledge the existence of radical Christianity, and to not condemn the masses for the actions of a few. That applies to every demographic, race, religion, etc. The blatant advocacy for illogical, knee-jerk fear of foreigners and the unknown is ridiculous... but expected in this day and age given who leads the free world.

Spoiler: All Abrahamic religion is incompatible with gays.

>>7877044
lol /pol/tard

>>7877058
> everyone to the right of a revolutionary marxist-leninist is /pol/
okay guy

>>7877069
im curious, post your political spectrum.

be honest

>>7876996
that was a silly anon who doesn't like agps and supports foreign aid who said that. don't listen to her.

>>7877042
It's intelligence, you moron.

>>7877049
tfw half bosnian half albanian. i remember my mum telling me stories about srebrenica and all the other killings.

my grand uncle and aunt lived pretty normal and peaceful lives in their village, but overnight when the news was out of muslims being killed, their own neighbors killed them with butcher knives.

Humanity is ugly.

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>>7877099
t. Still triggered.

Maybe if you had a brain you wouldnt be feeling like that but like most /pol/tards you lack the intelligence to think, be self aware and instead fall for age old traps and become a close minded bigot.

Stay trashy /pol/

>>7877055
/thread

>>7877115
pls be my bf

>>7877044
>i didnt fucking claim to know your living situation better than you tho you sanctimonious twat
But you did, jackass. It's why we were originally having this discussion about your opinions on America and how they deal with Muslims. I guess you only care about minding your business when someone begins to mind yours.

>this is the newspaper so you can le fact cheque
Fair enough. It seems they were all jailed for 9-13 years after a trial too, in keeping with the nation's laws. I don't see the reason for some kind of red flag culture war alarm here. They're not being held to some kind of different standard than the rest of the populace, and this doesn't show a statistical trend whatsoever. It's just a sensationalized and anecdotal story that you feel justifies your fear of the foreign and unknown, which is exactly what I said your problem was originally.

>you know what, just go fuck yourself
How about you deepthroat a shotgun you paranoid bitch.

>google the rest if you want, it's not like you're not perfectly capable to do that. or keep spouting your histrionic caps lock horse shit
The only histrionics here are coming from you, especially when you consider that you can't seem to have a debate with someone who disagrees with you while you're in your safe space circlejerking about the spooky Muslims.

>>7877076
>post your political spectrum.
are you referring to some sort of test?

i'm mostly a classic soc-dem. i'm socially liberal. i like the balance of state and individual freedom here. i think benefits like health care, unemployment, retirement bonuses etc are good. i'm pro asylum but anti mass immigration, as are a lot of my compatriots, which is the reason right wing parties are surging, not the other way around. and i don't even like them, fuck geert wilders, fuck norbert hofer, fuck frauke petri, fuck nigel farage.

the problem is that there's noone else reasonably critical of immigration because oh hey our population is shrinking we need brown people to pay our rents

and of course big money is fully on board with that since hey even more competition in the low income workforce FANTASTIC lads

if there's one thing i'm certain about is that if immigration would hurt big corporations it would stop real quick. like overnight.

there's McDonalds and Starbucks virtual signalling in media statements do you really think those people give a single shit about brown folks. McD sources their meat from factory farms and both underpay their workers wherever they can. they dont give a FUCK. it's good business, that's the beginning and the end of their motivation in anything they do.

>>7877115
>fall for age old traps
like YOU?
boom

>>7875404
>Some perople think that islam can be reformed and westernized.
Simply putting a complete halt on islam altogether is pretty much easier and more sustainable in the long term than trying to reform and westernize it.

>>7877151
im a social democrat too.

but im also a muslim.

i'm
>>7877076 and >>7876682

i might disagree with you on some areas, but i like you cause you're a soc dem.

>>7877165
Christianity is the same, it has just been westernized, we didnt kill Christians, we wont kill muslims, they ll just change to ignore their shitty books

>>7877136
>How about you deepthroat a shotgun
t. liberal islam supporter addressing lgbt people

>>7877165
>Simply putting a complete halt on islam altogether

yeah but you see the problem with that is theres 2 billion muslims coudl you ever halt all of chrisitanity or hinduism even at once?

probably not.

>>7877165
Most of the world has been Westernized. All it takes is complete saturation and exposure, like all who come to a new country and need to adapt to the language and culture. Even if it doesn't work for the first generation, it will for the second, and even more for the third.

>>7877176
I'm LGBT myself addressing someone who told me to go fuck myself. But I guess it's automatic for paranoid nationalists to play the victim at this point.

>>7877176
>insults someone
>gets insulted back
>tolerant libruls amirite hu hu hu

Shut the fuck up.

>>7877185
actually i'm opposed to nationalism.

but if you're going to play uncle tom against us then yes do go fuck yourself.

i hope you get exactly what you wish on the rest of us, namely being thrown off a building.

>>7877136
>>i didnt fucking claim to know your living situation better than you tho you sanctimonious twat
>But you did, jackass
yes alright sweetie can you give me a quote of that?

>>It's just a sensationalized and anecdotal story that you feel justifies your fear of the foreign and unknown, which is exactly what I said your problem was originally
except it wasn't fucking sensationalised in the slightest, it was a text-only update to a court case of a dozen iraqis who raped a woman no imagery no huge headline no nothing.
it's amazing how you just invent shit that simply isnt there

>>i am not histrionic
>>go deepthroat a shotgun
>>especially when you consider that you can't seem to have a debate with someone who disagrees with you

> i disagree, post articles, google translate them for you, give you background information
> you disagree, then you go on to call the articles sensationalism, which they are in no fucking way, and tell me to deepthroat a shotgun

>>7877169
u too. idk where you live but i wish the soc dems here would get their shit together. they're doing okay ish here in the capital but nationwide they're getting fucked by the right wingers.

.

also, i just accidentally pressed ctrl+s. gives you spoiler tags
>[spoiler][/spoiler]
how the fuck did i not know about this after half a decade on this site
oh well

>>7877206
>actually i'm opposed to nationalism.
Apparently not.

>but if you're going to play uncle tom against us then yes do go fuck yourself.
Apparently believing in equal rights, equal representation, religious freedom, statistical analysis, and objectivity is being an "uncle tom" to you.

>i hope you get exactly what you wish on the rest of us, namely being thrown off a building.
And there you go being a delusional bitch again. Enjoy the far-right government you're being fooled to support due to a non-existent threat. I'm sure they'll treat you fine, just like last time.

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>>7877151
>like YOU?
>boom
Ha! Proving yourself to be yet another simpleton of low intellect like i said from the start since only people of your intelligence level use these types of behavior ;^)

>>7877185
>I'm [le greatest ally] myself addressing someone who told me to go fuck myself. But I guess it's [bland witticism] for [SJW strawman] to [mental gymnastics to move the goalposts] at this point.
k

>>7877174
>>7877179
>>7877181
>no you just have to wait eventually they'll westernize I swear
Not with Saudi extremism still in the picture.
And they have much more money and influence to export their extremism around the world than you have to stop it.

>>7877225
did you get the joke, tho

>>7877216
>yes alright sweetie can you give me a quote of that?
Sure thing hon
>i just advise you to look at unrest happening in areas of europe before you so unabashedly support muslim immigration.
>if you already have problems with religious extremism (which i doubt comes anywhere near to the shit that goes down here but hey whatever i'll take your word for it) it escapes me why you'd want to actively invite more of that.
Also you directly invited me to look at and comment on the immigration issues in your country as they pertain to mine. No need to get all uppity about it now that it bit you in the ass.

>except it wasn't fucking sensationalised in the slightest, it was a text-only update to a court case of a dozen iraqis who raped a woman no imagery no huge headline no nothing.
But yet it's blasted all over BBC, Fox News, Breitbart, and countless other international media outlets that aggregated that article and act like the sky is falling. And, from what it seems if that bullshit 90s-era website is what international news orgs aggregate from in your country, you don't seem to have comprehensive media coverage in general, let alone enough to sensationalize anything without international media help... which is obviously more than plentiful in this particular case. Nothing raises TV ratings and pageviews like anecdotal stories about spooky Muslims in Europe.

>it's amazing how you just invent shit that simply isnt there
You mean like the statistics that reinforce your anecdote-based position which you can't seem to find?

And I told you to deepthroat a shotgun after you told me to go fuck myself, cupcake. Learn to take what you dish out and quit being such a delicate goddamn snowflake.

>>7877227
If you can't actually argue your points beyond shallow greentext snark, just don't speak.

>>7877216
>idk where you live
UK senpai

and seems to be a trend in europe desu, i hope people sort themselves out.

>>7877229
>>7877229
Step 1. Ask your government to stop funding terrorism and giving money to saudi arabia.

Profit????

Even muslims hate saudi arabia, but theyre too strong cause the US basically white knights for them on everything, tfw USA is a beta orbiter for the KSA.

>>7875404
>islam can be reformed
I agree but the only way it will ever reform is if open and harsh criticism of it is allowed and not demonized by the far left as Islamaphobia. The fact that a speaker like Ayaan Hirsi Ali (a feminist hero btw) is threatened with cancellation at liberal universities is a disgrace.

>>7877401
It's the other way around. Saudis need the U.S. because they need international protection. Without the U.S., they would be invaded and destroyed by the surrounding nations. The U.S. uses them as a Western proxy and resource cow, while allowing them to maintain their antiquated government system and Muslim-dominated culture under American protection.

>>7875402
I support religious freedom, something which Islamophobia goes against. I don't support any sort of theocracy or state religion, or the idea that any religion has the right to impose its values on people who do not consent to be part of that religion, but I also don't think people should be denied equal rights on the basis of what they believe.

>>7877463
The problem is that many religious people do not feel the same.

>>7877463
This. There's something really ironic about people who champion "religious freedom" legislation in order to legally discriminate against LGBT people, but turn around and tell everyone that religious freedom doesn't apply to Muslims.

>>7877422
Yeah still doesn't change the fact that the US is essentially funding the terror, and funding the saudis.

and you know damn well why the surrounding muslims would invade, even muslims hate the saudi's, even slightly shitty ones like Iran.

Saudi arabia is a Terror state, and the US is their ally, what does that say about the US and its people? YOU SUPPORT TERROR THEN YELL WHEN IT COMES INTO YOUR FACE.

For once, stand up against your government and fucking stop it. what will it take? another 9/11? another club shooting? another bombing somehwere? [this ofcourse ignoring what happens to muslims everyday cause you probably dont care]

>>7877382
>i just advise you to look at unrest happening in areas of europe
that's not quite the same tone as
>The unrest in Europe is from extremist right-wing fearmongering about evil foreigner rape
> it's just OOGABOOGA FOREIGNERS!!!! Don't waste my time
but ok


>But yet it's blasted all over BBC, Fox News, Breitbart, and countless other international media outlets that aggregated that article and act like the sky is falling.
wow how the fuck would i know, can you link me an example of that? it's curious how you pretended not to know the story at first but then you know of a dozen news site who also reported it, isnt it

> And, from what it seems if that bullshit 90s-era website is what international news orgs aggregate from in your country
are you invalidating a news outlet on the basis of how you rate the web design? is that your criteria in general? are you completely fucking retarded? jesus fucking christ youre an arrogant shit
> you don't seem to have comprehensive media coverage in general, let alone enough to sensationalize anything without international media help...
> sensationalising iraqi rape is bad
> but your country is backwards because it's not sensationalising muslim rape
that's a) retarded and b) untrue

>You mean like the statistics that reinforce your anecdote-based position which you can't seem to find?
just google "germany refugee crime wiki" and you get a handful of statistics going in every direction. generally after things cool down and drift into political irrelevance consensus seems to agree there's a correlation
http://www.jstor.org/stable/42864353
regardless i'm with churchill on statistics.

>...take what you dish out
i'm being reasonable, you're an arrogant cunt, of course people will hate you.

i bet you're one ugly insufferable piece of shit in real life and built this edgy cynical persona to deal with your nonexistant self worth

holy moses

>>7877386
LONDON
O
N
D
O
N

(is jok)

i agree with zizeks views on that. that the three main models of socialist inspired policy in the 20th century have failed or are failing. those being full on communism, which is mostly dead, regional autonomous communes, which are few and irrelevant, and social democracy, which has grown ideologically stale and uninspired.

it's hard to fathom what should or could replace it. i like soc dems and consider myself one but i feel there's a lot of 21th century challenges that cant be met with 20th century solutions. i feel like something cataclysmic might happen at some point. idk.

>>7877499
>Yeah still doesn't change the fact that the US is essentially funding the terror, and funding the saudis.
Yeah obviously. It's no secret most 9/11 bombers were Saudi, as well as Osama himself whose family had close ties with Saudi Royalty.

>Saudi arabia is a Terror state, and the US is their ally, what does that say about the US and its people? YOU SUPPORT TERROR THEN YELL WHEN IT COMES INTO YOUR FACE.
You act like the average American citizen controls the government any more than you control yours. Most high-level American politicians are owned by the multinational corportations who profit from both Saudi oil and the control the West has over the Middle East.

>For once, stand up against your government and fucking stop it.
This isn't the plot to an 80s action movie where a small band of rough and tumble rebels with M16s take down the whole international military-industrial complex through pure attitude alone. These are international business conglomerates that have private armies around the world and sell arms and defense tech to countless countries, yours included I assume. The most people here can do without sparking a civil war (which might very well go nuclear given the madman in office) is protest and elect officials in government that hopefully support beneficial policies that don't include nation-building and modern-day imperialism. Even then, the companies would just pick up and move shop elsewhere since the governments of the world will always need both oil and cutting-edge weaponry until we both institute a system of renewable energy and declare world peace.

>>7877621
madmen kept us from nuclear war for over 50 years remember that buddy

>>7877617
hehe

yeah personally though i still hold faith for social democracy, it could go a little more right wing and be democratic socialism though, that wouldn't be too bad,

>>7877401
>Ask your government to stop funding terrorism and giving money to saudi arabia.
One meager citizen against the full power of the oil industry.
Yeah that's definitely gonna work.
Look, Saudi funded extremism (but honestly they're practically everywhere, just that SA is the main funder) is the biggest obstacle to reforming islam.
And thanks to the internet and easy travel, it's even easier to spread that extremism to everywhere you want.

So unless you're willing to confront these extremists, and bring total skullcrushing defeat crashing down upon them and utterly decimating all extremist groups,
you'll have to put up some mindboggling schemes to somehow keep your moderate mosque "vaccinated" against extremism and defend it till the bitter end (which you obviously won't do because work).
One way to do this is by turning every mosque into a miniature police state and brutally crack down on any sign of radicalisation, but you're gonna get in conflict with human rights.

Just deporting them all is far more inhumane and ethically questionable, but it's easier.
And this is something people will have to understand if they ever want to make something of a stand against "the evil populists".

>>7877621
well then what are we going to do?

seems like whats happening here is everyone is being screwed by those in the military industrial complex. and literally no one gives a shit until they get bombed and die.

this conversation went as follows.

>Saudi extremism will keep making radicals
so stop funding saudi then lol
>But we need saudi as an ally there
yeah ok, but theyre a terror state, stop funding them.
>but we cant stop funding them

what the fuck lmao is this a joke?

>>7877706

>One meager citizen

Which is it? i said all of america and its people endorse them.

do your people support it or not? why arent you doing anything to stop it.

>>7877224
>Enjoy the far-right government you're being fooled to support due to a non-existent threat.
dude 55 gay dudes just got shot the fuck up last summer by an islamic radical

it was the largest mass shooting in recent memory, get the fuck outta here with your "non-existent threat"

>>7877749
all of America is not enough.
It must be everyone.
A complete OPEC boycott.

>>7877582
>that's not quite the same tone
So now you're the tone police? Spare me.

>wow how the fuck would i know, can you link me an example of that?
I figured since you were talking so much shit, you were informed about the international media take on that article as well.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/nine-iraqi-asylum-seekers-same-9901041
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2017/03/02/eight-iraqis-convicted-in-new-years-gang-rape-in-austria.html
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-39142620
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4248492/Family-Iraqi-asylum-seekers-gang-raped-drunk-woman.html
http://www.breitbart.com/london/2017/02/23/family-of-nine-asylum-seekers-accused-of-gang-rape-attack/

>it's curious how you pretended not to know the story at first but then you know of a dozen news site who also reported it, isnt it
It blurs together with the other sensationalist media about Muslim rapists in Europe as reported on, and aggregated by, international Western outlets. I must have missed it in the throng until you linked me to the original article and I researched who aggregated it elsewhere.

>are you invalidating a news outlet on the basis of how you rate the web design?
I didn't say the original reporting was invalid. I said the site looked shitty and underfunded, which indicated to me that they're incapable of sensationalization in general. But they were aggregated by international media, and then regurgitated to the rest of the world (including your country) with pictures, pre-formed opinions, and even more details than the article you showed me originally.

>consensus seems to agree there's a correlation
Correlation=/=causation.

>i'm being reasonable
You told me to go fuck myself, and I told you to deepthroat a shotgun. I'd say we're square, but you want to cry about it.

>i bet you're one ugly insufferable piece of shit in real life and built this edgy cynical persona to deal with your nonexistant self worth
I love you too, cupcake.

>>7877828
i dont even know what exactly we're arguing about at this point

>>i'm being reasonable
>You told me to go fuck myself,
i maintain that that is reasonable

anyways youre wrong
good night
faggot

>>7877815
>worlds biggest economy

it's more than enough, and you only need to boycott saudi, the rest of OPEC is irrelevant

>>7877632
No, the profiteers that run the government did. Nuclear war is unprofitable, unlike conventional war, saber-rattling, and arms races.

>>7877726
>well then what are we going to do?
Who the fuck is we? I don't know you.

>seems like whats happening here is everyone is being screwed by those in the military industrial complex. and literally no one gives a shit until they get bombed and die.
Welcome to humanity.

>But we need saudi as an ally there
Never said this. I said that's why the U.S. is currently allied to them. I'm not ok with it in the least and I want my government to break ties with the Saudis as soon as physically possible. That won't happen until the companies who run the government have another avenue to attain profitable energy resources. This is most likely why Trump has been courting Russia with cabinet members who worked with Russian oil moguls for Exxon, and the past few presidential administrations supported fracking, the proliferation of American crude pipelines, and lines from Canada.

>>7876159
>>7876178
>>7876202
>>7876285

How do you even expect people to become westernized if you're not willing to let them enter a western society? We have laws and police for a reason, just because someone believes something doesn't suddenly make murder legal. If a muslim wants to immigrate here they will have to acclimatize to the society as much as any other immigrant. Not allowing people based on religion is straight up discrimination, it's a slippery slope and it further isolates those who are muslim.

>>7877864
>i dont even know what exactly we're arguing about at this point
Your inability to separate emotional appeals, weak statistical correlations, and anecdotal anonymous stories from quantifiable facts.

>i maintain that that is reasonable
Likewise I maintain that you should deepthroat a shotgun.

>anyways youre wrong
>good night
>faggot
Goodnight, cupcake. Don't forget to brush your teeth to get the taste of chrome-moly steel out of your mouth.

>>7878056
Stop it, you're making too much sense!

>>7878056
>How do you even expect people to become westernized if you're not willing to let them enter a western society?
By telling them to up their game or no entry.

That's like asking how people can learn not to steal your shit if you don't invite them into your house.

Or I could just not invite known thieves in!

>We have laws and police for a reason, just because someone believes something doesn't suddenly make murder legal.
To think, all it would have taken is a law against flying planes into buildings and a few more police officers (except that's racist because police pick on dark people such as terrorists), we could have saved three thousand lives!

>>7878036
>This is most likely why Trump has been courting Russia

but trump loves the saudis, he even said he's going to continue making more deals with them, hes a puppet like the those before him to the military industrial complex. just because he's a little more buddy buddy with russia doesn't necessarily mean he's going to move away from saudi.

>welcome to humanity
it's pretty fucked isn't it? it's a very ugly thing is humanity. we like to say it's all lovely, but we know deep down, thats not true at all.

>>7875407
Muslim is not an ethnicity you ignorant fuck.

>>7875606
>I've never seen/heard a pastor giving commentaries during mass/service.

The largest part of every single catholic mass is a freestyle sermon by the priest on social commentary / how to lead a god catholic ife

>>7875404
>This is definetly true for muslims living in the west
No it isn't. Islam is evil at its core. Leave the faith or forever be against western values.

>>7875557
>All religion is the same.
Wrong.

>>7875948
Good on your friends but they're stupid for remaining muslims considering their tolerance of you would cost them their lives if they ever met face to face with their beloved prophet.

>>7877174
"Christianity is the same, it has just been westernized"

No dear, Christianity IS the foundation of western civilization.

>>7877181
>ven if it doesn't work for the first generation, it will for the second, and even more for the third.

France disproves this assumption.

>>7880025
Christianity is a stage through which we've moved. I was useful once but as society progresses becomes less useful.

Kinda like statism.

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>>7880025
>implying religion is the base of the west
hahahahahahah, probably dumb bible belt amerilard

>>7878056
>How do you even expect people to become westernized if you're not willing to let them enter a western society?
I don't expect someone who has lived in a society that allows men to abuse their wives, kills gay people, and does not allow freedom of speech or religion to reverse all those views when they set foot in a civilized country. You're foolish if you do.

>We have laws and police for a reason, just because someone believes something doesn't suddenly make murder legal.
Despite having both police and laws, anti-gay hate crimes are on the rise in secular Sweden, even tho the public is becoming more accepting. Laws change to reflect society. Do you honestly believe that a society that thinks homosexual acts should be illegal will not eventually enact legislation to make homosexual acts illegal?

>If a muslim wants to immigrate here they will have to acclimatize to the society as much as any other immigrant.
I agree, but Muslims outside of the US have largely not assimilated into western culture, they still hold the regressive views of their mother countries (i.e. 47% of British Muslims think homosexuals should not be allowed to teach in schools).

>Not allowing people based on religion is straight up discrimination, it's a slippery slope and it further isolates those who are muslim.
All immigration is "discriminatory" then. Potential immigrants from certain countries are more desirable than potential immigrants from other countries. Same thing with skilled/unskilled workers. Also I don't give a shit about isolating Muslims, we as a society isolate people with shitty views. If Muslims resort to terrorism when they feel isolated then I certainly don't want them in my country.

>>7875402
>Why do gay people support a religion that advocates the killing of gays (and actually act upon it, not simply say it)?

I don't understand why some LGBT's support Christianity and right-wing conservatism either, senpai. They're literally advocating for their own destruction if they foolishly and naively think supporting the alt-right will somehow save them from brown-skinned immigrants.

>>7877052
no one gives a fuck about muslims in the west holy shit, we're talking about MUSLIM MAJORITY COUNTRIES god DAMN you have autism

>>7881723
I don't expect someone who has lived in a society that allows men to abuse their wives, kills gay people, and does not allow freedom of speech or religion to reverse all those views when they set foot in a civilized country. You're foolish if you do.
Isolationism isn't how you fix this. If you force all muslims to live in the same communities with extremist muslims and you ban them from traveling or immigrating or trading with the west then all you do is create more extremist muslims. The actual solution is to make muslim countries economically and culturally dependent on the west. If you make it easy for their brightest to come over here and become successful then they become evangelists for how great the west is. If you build McDonald's and KFC and put American clothes in their shopping malls and Hollywood films in their movie theaters and America shows on their TV then their cultural values will come to align more with western values.

>Do you honestly believe that a society that thinks homosexual acts should be illegal will not eventually enact legislation to make homosexual acts illegal?
Even if you double the Muslim population in the US from 1% to 2% that's still not enough to pass anything you're talking about.

>Muslims outside of the US have largely not assimilated into western culture
This is because in Britain muslim communities are extremely segregated.

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>>7875404
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE NOT ALL MUSLIMS SHITLORD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

>>7881723
>Do you honestly believe that a society that thinks homosexual acts should be illegal will not eventually enact legislation to make homosexual acts illegal?

No because the majority of the US isn't muslim and progress does not regress back into itself.

>I don't expect someone who has lived in a society that allows men to abuse their wives, kills gay people, and does not allow freedom of speech or religion to reverse all those views when they set foot in a civilized country. You're foolish if you do.

Then don't expect anyone to change their views or complain about people not magically adapting to situations that they never face. If someone wants to come here they have to abide by laws just like every other person, regardless of what views they hold. They might not accept me but they will have to learn to tolerate me otherwise there's no way they will be able to live here.

>I agree, but Muslims outside of the US have largely not assimilated into western culture, they still hold the regressive views of their mother countries

It doesn't matter, they have to become a part of our society. This is just the whole concept of a melting pot.

> Also I don't give a shit about isolating Muslims, we as a society isolate people with shitty views.

mfw. If you don't want extremist with bigoted view you have to expose them. It's the same reason that coming out is important.

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>>7882557
forgot image

>>7875404
It can be reformed, but westernizing Islam would involve scrapping like 85% of what Islam actually is. It's probably gonna take a while for people to be willing to make that change.

>>7875407
t. muslim guy

>>7875402
>all christians are homophobes
>not all muslims are homophobes islam is the religion of peace.

>>7875418
kek

>>7875402
The problem could be solved by better integration. Literally every Western nation has failed miserably at integration. No country comes even close to good goals.

>>7875402
Secularization of all religions is the only actual solution. Not that people can't believe, pray, etc. but you need to accept secular laws and government totally that allow others to believe in their own religions or no religion at all. In your professional capacity, and politely in a certain public capacity, simply respect secular laws. You can privately hate people and publicly say so but not discriminate or say kill people because they're a different religion or whatever. It's just the only workable and sane solution that exists. Pragmatism.

Most any radical religion or cult gets kooky. You can do it but you just plain need to respect the rest of society or civilization doesn't work. Tolerance.

>>7875460

Same. /thread as far as I'm concerned

>>7876558
> she may have had her stone age political opinions but ignoring that she was actually quite a sweet person

She was really sweet but she wanted people like you dead.Jesus fucking christ, did she even know you were gay or have any inkling that you were? Would've fucked her out for agreeing with that homophobic cunt in the shop desu senpai. Don't waste time defending people who wouldn't do the same for you.

>>7875404
Islam is cool in Asia mostly especially SEAsia where most live
>>7882675
so like modern Christianity

>>7875831

t. never met a muslim in his entire life

>>7887447
>SEAsia
Omg literally the part of Asia most adjacent to the SEA.

>>7887504
Calling your bluff and saying you've only met 1-3 Muslims.

>>7882557
I'm not the person who you replied to earlier, but I wanted to join the discussion anyway.
So, while I think what you've said is rational, you are making one big assumption:

>If someone wants to come here they have to abide by laws just like every other person, regardless of what views they hold

See, the problem is, there are Muslims who just don't wish to follow your laws because it's against their religion and consequently against their laws.
You will probably say:

>They might not accept me but they will have to learn to tolerate me

True, but for how long? In my opinion, the offspring of the minority which does assimilate will probably even accept the LGBT population (more broadly, your laws), but the majority will still tolerate you until they get enough political power to change the laws, or, until they become the majority of society.

>Majority of the US isn't muslim

Maybe not yet, but, bear in mind that Muslims have higher birth rates. I assume that the ones who accept the US values will also have fewer children, while the ones who don't will still continue to have more offspring. And I assume that the extremely conservative ones will have poorer socio-economic status, which puts them in a group that is more likely to have more children.
You can see this "Muslim overbreeding" in practice all over Europe, where they slowly but surely take over entire cities.

My biggest problem with the "tolerance" narrative is that it seems like the only people who believe in it and attempt to practice it are whites, while other groups use it as a guise to forward their agenda (see BLM movement).

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>>7877174
Of course we will, of course we will anon

>The technical meaning of the term taqiyya is derived from the Quranic reference to religious dissimulation in Sura 3:28:
>"Let not the believers take the unbelievers for protectors rather than believers; and whoever does this, he shall have nothing of (the guardianship of) Allah, but you should guard yourselves against them, guarding carefully (illā an tattaqū minhum tuqāt)."
>The two words tattaqū ("you fear") and tuqāt "in fear" are derived from the same root as taqiya, and use of the abstract noun taqiya in reference to the general principle described in this passage is first recorded in a Qur'anic gloss by Al-Bukhari (9th century).[18]
>Regarding 3:28, Ibn Kathir writes, "meaning, except those believers who in some areas or times fear for their safety from the disbelievers. In this case, such believers are allowed to show friendship to the disbelievers outwardly, but never inwardly." He quotes Muhammad's companion, Abu Ad-Darda', who said "we smile in the face of some people although our hearts curse them," and Al-Hasan who said "the Tuqyah is acceptable till the Day of Resurrection

Has anyone here actually ever read the Quran, it's unassimilatable

>>7890891
>"we smile in the face of some people although our hearts curse them,"

SOOO PROGRESSIVE, It's like the same sentiment as turn the other cheek, all religions are exactly the same :)

>>7887539
>See, the problem is, there are Muslims who just don't wish to follow your laws because it's against their religion and consequently against their laws.
That's the fucking problem, these dumbasses have never read the Quran and don't realize unlike the Bible, Quran is both a religious and a law book.

And Islamic law supersedes any earthly law.

Christianity is far from perfect, but it is 20x more compatible with the west.

>>7887539
I know I should let this thread naturally go out to pasture but I really believe what I'm saying here.

>See, the problem is, there are Muslims who just don't wish to follow your laws because it's against their religion and consequently against their laws

They have to function as a tolerant person to be a part of american society. In order to establish any kind of life here you have to abide by the law. On top of that you have to find a job, and if you can't find employment due to your inability to work in an environment with different cultures and peoples (most work environments) then your family will not survive with bigoted views for long enough to see them put in place, or propagate. American life has rules and you have to abide by them to even begin to have a life here.

Why do people even bring up Christianity in this discussion?

Hypothetically, lets say that native Christians hate gays just as much as Muslims do. How is that situation remedied by importing even more people who hate gays?

You cant kick the Christians out. They're already citizens. But you can stop the Muslims.

>>7890891
>hurr Islam is incompatible with gays
>The Ottoman Empire had an open system of gay sex
>Modern Middle East has an large underground gay scene comparable to 70s US
Really convincing argument, anon