Why do the late transitioners here hate trans kids so much, even

>>7868228
You made me check Kissanime and the new episode of Little Witch is there, thanks

>>7868228
>even though early transitioners are the ones doing the large percentage of public advocacy, legislation passing, and respectability politics
lolwut

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>>7868228
hey cara, have you ever taken this? it's old honscience but i'd be interested in seeing your score
http://www.hemingways.org/GIDinfo/sage/

>>7868237
okay.
there's an important spoiler in the epidsode where akko reanimates a skeleton and he is revealed to be the father of the headmistress.

>>7868243
look outside for once retard.

>>7868252
>look outside for once retard.

Lol did you really just say that? Also have you started HRT yet?

>>7868246
An A*P would score as unclear gender, right?

>>7868311
the test is theoretically able to detect a*p (both agp and aap, though the test maker apparently thinks she made up the idea of aap) though the answers regarding it are...not subtle, so i can see how an aap in particular might be labelled as non- by it

>>7868328
>though the answers regarding it are...not subtle,
What do you mean?

>>7868333
it's shit like "what do you think when you see a tampon commercial?" and the agp answer is "i get really turned on wishing i could menstruate"
also, it doesn't seem to have an a*p modifier for people already labelled as transsexual -- i just ran through the test answering it as if i were aap post-transition and just got 'female-to-male transsexual'

>>7868372
I'd like to make an A*P/HSTS/cis test.

>>7868386
i think that would be very interesting, though keep in mind you can't really distinguish between 'cis' and 'trans' people at some points on both etiological spectrums (especially the a*p one, and especially especially aap)
do you plan on using only explicitly sexual questions to differentiate hsts and a*p, or are you going to distinguish between the behavioural phenotypes?

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>>7868246
okay.

>>7868418
Maybe it would be better only for trans people, so that there's less to keep track of and issue of defining trans doesn't come up. Alternatively, it could just be like "all scores are low/all axes are middle = cis"

Ideally I'd like to see which clusters naturally form out of all questions, so that behaviors would show up as correlating with one or the other group or being unrelated. In practice though the closest to that would probably be a sexual axis and a behavioral axis. Then the correlation between behavior and sexuality would still be tested overall.

>>7868425
>Your Answers indicate your psychological state has likely prevailed since you were quite young.
Cara, you could have been an early transitioner!

>>7868228
idk but late transitioners are NOT trans

>>7868228
>Why do the late transitioners here hate trans kids so much

Youre just making shit up! Why? WHy do you keep doing this?!

>>7868228
agreed.

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>>7868425
>your appearance is androgynous
the nerve on this delusional retarded faggot, tbqh

>>7868228
Stop making shit up you fucking imbecile.

Late transitioner here got nothing against you but I also post on imageboards once a month and don't use social media, accept my not passing, live as a fem guy. 28 yr old started at 26.

>>7869796
>nothing against you
>you
OP isn't an early transitioner. He is a non-transitioner and chaser stalker.

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>1540
What the h*ck? That can't be right!

Am I the only one who feels that Cara is slowly growing more and more insane as the court date in which she has to confront Nikky-chan approaches.

What was once shitposting is now just nonsensical rambling, I don't know, I really hope the prophecy doesn't become true and she doesn't end up trans Elliot Roger.

>>7869986
>>7870286
thread just for this test >>7869824

>>7870212
What do you think is going to happen at the court date?

>>7870212
she decided to skip the court date and just accept she was going to have a restraining order against her
...but yeah, she's really not doing well

>>7872938
Have you considered finding her a psychiatrist she can talk to over skype or something? Would cara be open to that?

>>7872995
psychologist* sorry i just woke up.

>>7869802
Cara is an early transitioner at heart.

>>7872995
>>7873000
checked
anyway, i'm not sure she'd be open to professional help at this point, which would make it an inefficient treatment method
she needs a broader peer group, though i understand all too well why she does not have one (i'm most of what she has and she's been turning against me lately)

>>7873170
no offense anon, but it probably doesn't help that you speak freely about her personal issues in her own threads, and generally seem to treat her as some kind of armchair psychoanalyst case study

>>7873170
Well I doubt cara would want to talk to me, (I'm the anon that always spams her threads telling her to start HRT.)

However caraposter if you are reading this and need someone to talk to about anything, I will listen.

>>7873170
She really needs to get out of her current living situation and go somewhere else so that she can assess her current livelihood, maybe stay with family for a short while.

I really wish I could help, it pains me to see a troubled trans girl in need of immediate help.

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>>7873170
There are so many reasons to hate you.

Early transitioners hate late transitioners because they give the public face of transpeople a bad image by usually not passing and typically coming off as sexual fetishists. The negative public image reflects back on early transitioners who are then denied treatment for their dysphoria because people assume they are like the hons. Early transitioners also think that anyone who doesn't transition until later in life must not really be trans or they would have known and transitioned early like they did, though they are usually oblivious to the hardships late transitioners faced not even a decade ago when trying to get treatment themselves.

Late transitioners hate early transitioners because they are bitter and envious that they get to transition before hormones utterly destroy their body and feel the need to deny early transitioners medical treatment because they were denied when they were younger and think everyone should have to go through the hardships they did.

>>7870212
Cara, if you end up as a tranny Elliot Rogers, remember, the real enemy is Blaire White not Eli Erlick or Nicole Maines.

>>7873250
How are we supposed to get our daily dose of Cara without Blanchardian anon's help?

>>7874038
maybe we're focusing our shitposing efforts in the wrong place

blanchard anon, how do we know you aren't secretly nudging cara closer to the edge just for the fun of it?

>>7868228
How could you not hate them?

>>7874085
Why would you assume a pedophile Christian ISN'T attempting to get somebody to commit suicide?

>>7873250
yeah, i'm too autistic for normal human interaction
keep in mind that what i tell you is a tiny, tiny fraction of what's going on, for that exact reason
>>7874028
she already dislikes blaire, but blaire blocked her snapchat so i don't think anything's likely to happen there
>>7874085
because if i was doing that it would end in her dying or leaving or something along those lines and that would be sad
>>7874437
?

>>7874465
? ? ? :)

>>7874465
You're already done that time and time again.

>>7873416
what did blanchard anon did to you, cara?

>>7874525
It responded to itself, for one thing.

>>7874531
what?

>>7874538
what?

>>7874544
what?

>>7874437
Post proof, faggot.

>>7874574
But none of what you said is true, that's exactly the sort of reason I was making fun of your worthless bullshit before.

>>7874574
Opps, wrong thread though. The same reasoning applie anyway though, I know you're shit, so why would I try to give you what you request?

>>7868228
Cara im 27 in transistion i have no issue with early transistioners im happy for them i don't get this idea of spite comes from, we should be supporting our sisters we know most people are already against us due to ignorance.

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>>7869781
Goddess

>>7874593
What parts aren't true?

>>7874666
The parts where you implied you're not a pedophile, and where you implied that you shitposting dank memes on a meme website isn't proof in and of itself.

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Hey Cara I have a question for you.
Most people here would generally be quick to say I am trutrans ftm until I tell them that I am a guy that likes to fuck other guys and then I get called a fetishist and AAP. I find this very confusing. I don't try super hard like some other ftms to appear and act masculine, I just act like myself and I'm pretty average joe-ish. HRT also eliminated all my mental issues aside from maybe some minor depression (turns out estrogen was fucking me up and caused sort of a disconnect), but I actually feel like I'm normal now despite my obvious lack of a bio cock which is depressing in itself. Despite this I still get called AAP because I'm not attracted to women and femininity. I just like men on a physical and mental level better, partially because I understand them better. I'm also fairly vaginaphobic, and not just towards my own anatomy. They repulse me. If I were honest, if I wasn't trans I'd probably be a dick towards ftms if one tried to ask me out. What do you think I am?

>>7874953
Who's calling you autoandrophile? Ive literally never heard anybody say that outside 4chan.

>>7874987
It was here on /lgbt/, I've never heard of people saying anything like this outside of 4chan either. I realize that you really can't take what's said around here very seriously, but I've had people try to tell me more than once I was AAP the moment I said I was ftm who likes men and I can't help but to wonder why I was automatically labeled like that.

How do we free Cara from the evil cunning claws of Blanchard anon?

>>7875004
>why do people keep insulting me on this 4chan board
Because it rustles your jimmies

>>7875028
Is being called AAP intended to be an insult? The MTFs of this board seem to have no issue in embracing their AGP identities. I'm genuinely curious. Perhaps I don't understand because I don't spend as much time here as others.

>>7868228
the only reason I have to hate trans kids is because they're all tumblr incarnate

>>7875080
what's wrong with being tumblr :3

>>7875080
You mean the ones you've met are tumblr incarnate.

>>7875104
They're insufferable.

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>>7868246
>tfw not trutrans because I'm a practical person and don't think traditionally "male" activities are icky and gross and would never do them

hmm

>>7875016
we can't

>>7875016
why would we want to?

>>7874953
not cara, but i'm ftm and i'm pretty much the same as you--was "gnc" for pretty much my whole childhood, have masculine interests, not many problems making friends with guys, etc, but i'm also gay. i know a few people who fall along those lines too, and while i don't discount the blanchard theory entirely, i think it has a lot of flaws especially in categorizing ftms.

i think a big part of it is that most of the time, "girls" are given a lot more freedom wrt gender expression than boys, which means we're less likely to need to repress as hard as an AGP woman, and therefore even if we're not fully "male socialized" we can get close enough that bridging the gap as an adult is fairly easy. there's also the obvious issue where hardly anyone bothers to crossdress for the purpose of jerking off to the idea of themselves as a male because that's ridiculous.

from what i understand, "AAP" is more of a descriptor of the way dysphoria manifests in someone's brain as opposed to the way it does in an HSTS person, and not necessarily the name of a fetish. for mtfs, it's more likely that they use crossdressing and sex as an outlet for their repressed desires, but that's not always the case. they still feel dysphoria and an intense need/desire to change their body to look more female like it should be. whereas HSTS generally already act feminine naturally, fit in with girls, and feel more right with themselves when they're living as a woman. and as you can probably guess, these definitions are very very close in how they are presented outwardly (the only differences being age of transition and level of repression beforehand, which can always vary greatly).

(cont)

>>7876318
(cont) and as for ftms, from my experiences, i know a lot of genuinely dysphoric non-"trender" guys who i would consider to be AAP; not because they seem to be fetishising anything per se, but because they way they use fictional relationships, draw porn, create things or generally present themselves that isn't quite the same as a cis gay man. not that they're "faking" anything--it's more that it's a way to cope with not passing or being able to transition, or a holdover interest from before they transitioned, or maybe because they don't fit in with other guys yet and are kind of socially outcast. (keep in mind most of these people are between ages 16-20 ish).

tl;dr: what i'm trying to get at, is that 1. i don't like how sexuality is such a defining factor in blanchardian analysis and there's a good chance you're not genuinely AAP--it depends more on your past experiences than sexuality, though AAP/HSTS is still very strongly corrolated w/ sexual orientation. (the real answer to your question is probably this >>7875028) 2. A*P (especially in ftms) does not necessarily mean one jerks off to the idea of themselves as a male/female. it means that they way they experience dysphoria is often along the same lines as people experience paraphilias, and use various coping methods which may or may not be inherently sexual but often have to do with sex/relationships/etc because it provides a release for their psychological problems.

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>tfw feminine /pol/lack

>>7876318
>from what i understand, "AAP" is more of a descriptor of the way dysphoria manifests in someone's brain as opposed to the way it does in an HSTS person, and not necessarily the name of a fetish.
I think A*P is more a different kind of being trans which leads to different kinds of dysphoria, and some overlap, and different kinds of repression. So the same results you talk about, but the core reason for the difference isn't just dysphoria manifesting a different way.

>>7876330
>i know a lot of genuinely dysphoric non-"trender" guys who i would consider to be AAP; not because they seem to be fetishising anything per se, but because they way they use fictional relationships, draw porn, create things or generally present themselves that isn't quite the same as a cis gay man.
I think A*P is better understood as a sexual orientation than a fetish. There's an idealized member of the opposite sex the A*P wishes to be. This manifests in different ways, just like normal male and female sexualities are different. AAPs can be more romantic and AGPs more directly sexual. But not always, hence MtFs in the AGP group not necessarily having directly AGP sexual fantasies.

This is the big different from HSTS trans people. Their sexuality is conventionally directed to someone else. They have an idealized partner just like cis het people, not an idealized self like A*Ps.

>it's more that it's a way to cope with not passing or being able to transition, or a holdover interest from before they transitioned, or maybe because they don't fit in with other guys yet and are kind of socially outcast.
A*P fantasies can appear before dysphoria and in people who aren't outcasts and do fit in, so how is it a way to cope then?

>>7877045
So if I don't have an idealized sense of self, I'm not AAP? I don't think I've ever gotten aroused to the idea of being male, but I definitely know what you're talking about since I've met ftms who grew up drawing and writing stories about fictional characters playing out their fantasies, which seems rather girl-ish when I think about it. I've also seen this apply to both hetero and homosexual ftms. For me it was more that I needed to fix what was wrong, and since I was already a very androgynous child, adjusting to male socialization was pretty easy. Even though I like men it really doesn't have anything to do with my own personal identity as male and I could easily see an alternate version of myself who likes women instead and not be very different.

So I would agree that narrowing it down to whether you're gay or straight is too much of a simplification, since under this definition there would even be "straight" (or perhaps bisexual) AAPs.

>>7877220
>So if I don't have an idealized sense of self, I'm not AAP?
No, in the same way a cis het person won't necessarily have an idealized partner. But in both cases their orientation still points that way, for the cis het to a partner and for an AAP to himself.

>which seems rather girl-ish when I think about it.
Which fits if we consider them female-minded but with their androphilia turns inwards. It matches how AGPs have a more male sexuality with an inward gynephilia. That's why the typology seems such a good explanation.

>I've also seen this apply to both hetero and homosexual ftms.
How many of each, out of how many hetero and homo FtMs you know in total?

>For me it was more that I needed to fix what was wrong, and since I was already a very androgynous child, adjusting to male socialization was pretty easy.
The HSTS part of the typology is that people who are basically extremely masculine lesbians/effeminate gays see that they would fit in better in the other gender role. The human mind has plenty of variety and there is no reason you would need to be gay (from the perspective of your natal sex) to be masculine/effeminate enough to want the other gender role.

So I think the typology is best interpreted here as a general rule and a guarantee that there aren't homosexual "HS"TS people.

>since under this definition there would even be "straight" (or perhaps bisexual) AAPs.
Bisexual AGPs are part of the official typology, so it should be the same for AAPs. They both make sense because they are still gynephilic/androphilic. In fact being bi makes even more sense than just being into their transitioned sex, because of meta-attraction.

Exclusively gynephilic AAPs/androphilic AGPs are a different matter. I assume they could exist in theory, but they do seem to deviate from the typology much more than "gay" HSTSs. Maybe they are mostly bi but focusing on the one sex. I don't know.

>>7877220
>since I've met ftms who grew up drawing and writing stories about fictional characters playing out their fantasies, which seems rather girl-ish when I think about it.
Also on this I wouldn't say it's inherently AAP. Cis het boys and girls both do this, so it doesn't rule out being HSTS.

I know this seems kind of like making the theory unprovable, as if anything can be interpreted either way, but if A*P is a sexual orientation then this is the equivalent of trying to work out someone's orientation from their drawings/stories about characters. So in this situation I hope it's understandable that it can be hard to pinpoint which parts match which bits of the theory, HSTS or AAP.

>>7877045
>I think A*P is more a different kind of being trans which leads to different kinds of dysphoria, and some overlap, and different kinds of repression. So the same results you talk about, but the core reason for the difference isn't just dysphoria manifesting a different way.
oh i agree completely, maybe i just didn't word that the best way. it probably stems from a different neurological source, but definitely has more differences from HSTS beyond that.

>A*P fantasies can appear before dysphoria and in people who aren't outcasts and do fit in, so how is it a way to cope then?
i mean it in a way that's more subconscious--maybe outlet or expression would be a better term. for example, a young trans boy who doesn't know being 'trans' is a thing, who refers to himself as a girl because that's what he's been told he is and he has no reason to dispute it yet, but who also obsesses over the male protagonist of a YA novel and identifies more strongly with him than a normal straight girl or cis boy would (even if he doesn't tell anyone he does so).

>>7877447
I knew you didn't mean a conscious coping strategy. The young trans boy example just sounds like typical AAP.

I would say his obsession over the male protagonist is his AAP sexuality manifesting the same way a cis het girl would fantasize about herself with a male character she likes. I expect that sort of thought from every A*P, regardless of dysphoria or loneliness.

>>7877392
>How many of each, out of how many hetero and homo FtMs you know in total?
For a short time I was in a mostly FTM discord server and there was a decent number of both varieties before I got tired of the group and left.