personally, i believe that gender is a social construct. if society

>>7775972
GENDER, is a social construct. SEX, Is not. Gender is where you fall on your expression of masculinity and femininity. Sex, or biological sex, is your genitals and chromosomes. It's an important difference that people miss. Gender =/= biology, Thats your sex organs. Gender, is your expression of female and masculine traits.

>>7775972
>the point of doing this is to ensure people recognised and treated you as your gender. if i decided to stop taking hormones, not bother shaving, exclusively wear male clothes etc., i would still be female, but nobody would see me as a girl.

Even if nobody else in the world existed, mirrors would still exist, and I would still end up feeling like total shit.

i completely agree, OP. i don't know if your post will gain a lot of traction on here because everyone's too autistic to let go of the textbook definitions they learned in 7th grade, and/or just wants to be edgy and hate people who have it worse than them.

>>7776018
no one really says that though. the physical characteristics that make up one's sex are obviously real and quantifiable, but there's not much point in labeling people as only one or the other forever. no trans person is convinced they're literally exactly the same as a cis person in terms of biological sex. however, people like to use this as some kind of argument as to why trans people shouldn't ever be referred to as the gender they identify as, or even as some bullshit explanation for why dysphoria does not exist.

>>7776018
Gender is biological, and it's how you feel your sex should be.

Sex is also hormones, etc.

>>7776026
>mirrors would still exist, and I would still end up feeling like total shit.
Maybe you wouldn't if you hadn't been raised with the belief sex determines gender and that you can't be the gender you want if your body doesn't match.

>>7776345
>Gender is biological,
For what definition of gender?

"how you feel your sex should be" is a psychological definition. Note "feel" instead of actual medical or scientific definitions.

Personally I believe that testosterone and estrogen have the same effect as one another because like you I am fucking retarded

>>7784651
>he thinks there's a hormone for wanting pink toys and skirts

>>7784764
>they think gender roles and gender are the same thing
W E W
E
W

>>7784795
Step 1: Stop shitposting.
Step 2: Say what EXACTLY you think OP is wrong about that's caused by hormones.

>>7784815
>shitposts
>criticizes other for shitposting
For real, senpai? Fine.

Testosterone: reinforces aggressive, dominant behaviors. This is useful for males to convince others to accept their point of view with intimidation rather than reasoning

Estrogen: reinforces nurturing and group-oriented behaviours. This is useful in situations where a mutually beneficial conclusion to disagreement is important

>>7784881
>>shitposts
>>criticizes other for shitposting
What? You make shitty passive aggressive "ur retarded" posts >>7784651 instead of actually saying whatever the hell you mean, so that it takes literally hours for you to actually get to your point, and when you do it's "T makes men aggressive and intimidating, therefore gender is real"?

>>7785171
So now you're going to go off topic and ignore the content of my post? You should have continued to shitpost desu

>>7785430
You're saying literally nothing. You have made one single post that actually says anything >>7784881 and your whole argument is nothing but "gender exists because hormones reinforce moods." Stop wasting everyone's time and either make a substantive post or fuck off.

>>7785485
>>7784815
>Step 2: Say what EXACTLY you think OP is wrong about that's caused by hormones.

You got what you asked for and because it's not what you wanted you throw a tantrum? Maybe you don't believe that hormones reinforce gender but your T-rage doesn't make for a compelling argument against it.

99.97% of the population conforms to a gender related to their sex. 0.3% is trans with the vast majority conforming to male or female binary...and then a small minority of that is "genderqueer". B-B-BUT GENDER IS A SPECTRUM! really? because that .01% that is an exception to the rule, that's now the standard for the other 99.99?

>>7787894

99.7% my bad

>>7787894
>>7787898
No, many people are non-conforming in some ways and many more would have been even more non-conforming but pressure from parents, peers, etc broke them down until they miserably accepted the role you want forced on them.

>>7787894
people who believe in genderqueer etc. probably think there are a lot more who don't know about different gender identities or whatever

>>7787915

but to the level that there's dysphoria or dissonance? sure gender roles are forced upon people, but why automatically conflate gender roles with gender? the whole idea that it's a social construct in the first place originates with de beauvoir, and she was writing at a time when we knew fuck all about the brain or hormones. what reason do we have to believe her?

>>7787961
>but to the level that there's dysphoria or dissonance?
Irrelevant. Don't force people into roles. Any amount of that, no matter how small, is harmful.

>>7787970

no i don't think people should be forced into roles either. but i think in that hypothetical 100% pressure free situation, there would still be some marker among people who conform to the binary.

>>7787977
There wouldn't be a binary. There would be a smooth continuum. There would be clusters and correlations with sex, but those would be irrelevant.

>>7787986
>s

then you're basically saying that people who are mtf or ftm are full of shit because no one can naturally feel like a social construct.

>>7788002
Let people be themselves without having to conform to anything, whether that's what they are assigned at birth or a binary choices or that or the opposite.

>>7788016

yeah, nobody has to conform to anything, do whatever you want. i'm just saying that i don't understand why identity politics always has to be like "there is an exception to the rule...so therefore the rule doesn't exist at all!"

>>7788038
This is the polar opposite of identity politics. The rule must end so that there are no exceptions.