So how mainstream will the concept of "genderfluid"

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>>6923459
the only good thing that could come out of gender fluidity being accepted is that it could play into the gradual acceptance of total gender neutrality. That's a best case scenario, although it's doubtful as genderfluidity has to do with the idea of gender, gender roles and gender norms being biological and that one can "flow" between them.

>>6923502
Where does "gender neutral" land if that's valid but genderfluid isn't?

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>>6923508
Gender neutral is the idea that gender is not biological and is socialized (remember we're talking about gender, not sex).

Genderfluid is the idea that gender is a biological spectrum that you float along on depending on your brain chemistry, and that you "feel" male or female and that you have a "male brain" or "female brain" that biologically predisposes you to acting in "gendered" ways.

>>6923550
So basically it doesn't and shouldn't matter beyond labels?
Cause I ain't callin nobody "they".

>>6923563
Of course you can just refer to everyone and he and she. That's based on sex, or just general physical appearance, not to do with inherent gender.

>>6923577
Good, so this is a circlejerk after all.

>>6923577
So what even is gender outside of gender roles then.

>>6923590
Physical appearance.
Or, more specifically, a dick/vag or the facsimile of one.

>>6923459
Biologically it makes no sense and shouldn't be taken seriously. Socially and culturally I believe it holds value, masculinity and femininity, expression aren't across the board everywhere despite what westerners believe.

>>6923508
Wouldn't that be considered unisex? As to how to express this, that's up what is consider a gender norm. Either way it becomes a rubbish term since nothing will truly be gender neutral outside biology.

>>6923608
That's sex.

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>>6923590
A general of idea of what shapes you as a "male" or "female" that is comprised or roles, positions in society, etc. Like race, sex is a physical trait, but the attributes given to these are socially manufactured and driven into you from birth, hence why there are a myriad of different cultures and ideas around what is desirable out of masculinity and femininity.

Of course the physical nature of the individual has influence on the way that gender norms are create, but they are still created.


>>6923608
That would be sex and not gender.

>>6923615
>>6923629
By that logic someone with a dick and no intention to change that can be a lady because he decides it.
That's when you approach "genderqueer" territory. And that's just silly.

>>6923646
They could act and present as the general perception of what society views as a "lady", yes.

However, passing physically (As in the looking like the biological general image of the female sex) is what grants someone into being accepted as a "woman", though. Remember, the passing threads here based around the physical image, not they way that the individual "acts like a woman".

>>6923678
If you're talking drag we both know that's not what I mean.

>>6923459
I guarantee you that everyone who now currently identifies as genderfluid will eventually pick a side and in about 10 years from now everyone will be saying "lol remember that time we all had tumblrs and called ourselves weird genders?"

>>6923889
You're too optimistic.
When we have an entire faction of people perpetuating this nonsensical dogma some people will stick to it, whether or not a few individuals wake up.

I am nonbinary but I don't feel comfortable being out about it due to how socially unacceptable it is. I suppose I could be considered genderfluid. Some days I feel female, some male, usually not either.

I do think it'll eventually become acceptable. Whether it's in my lifetime is anyone's guess. First we need to deal with binary gender issues, such as making binary trans people more acceptable and making it acceptable for male identified individuals to be effeminate. Once men can wear skirts without much issue then maybe we can talk about nonbinary issues more.

>>6924249
What nonbinary issues do you refer to?

>>6923459
it'll happen before it is accepted that intelligence is linked to genetics and genetics related to intelligence and behavior differ between racial and gender groups.

>>6923459
It'll be one of these things that people know exist, but can't be half assed to care about, kinda like everything that doesn't happen in their immediate surroundings.

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>>6924296
>exist

>>6924253

Not nonbinary issues, binary issues.

>>6924358
I didn't misspeak. Nonbinary issues are still mentioned, which are what I am asking about.

>>6924373

Huh? Oh, now I noticed. I didn't mean actual issues. Just genderqueer acceptance.

>>6924388
What would you consider acceptance?

>>6924399

I'd say on the tier of current gay issues in America. We'll never get everyone to accept it but being to the degree when most don't react completely negatively is fine by me. I just want to be seen as inconspicuous and normal even if I use they/them pronouns.

>>6924436
Why are pronouns so pivotal?

>>6924441

I don't know. It just feels bad when people misgender you. The rational side of your brain realizes it's stupid to care but that doesn't make it feel any better. It's similar to how trans men hate being called "her" or "Ms".

The english language is very pronoun based. We're not as bad as spanish or french but pronouns are unavoidable. Thus, pronouns appear multiple times a day in normal life.

I don't mind if random people on the street misgender me. It's not intentional after all and it's not worth correcting. How are they supposed to know my pronouns anyway? However, people I talk with frequently such as my coworkers or my family should be able to use the correct pronouns. However at this moment in time I don't feel comfortable discussing pronouns with anyone irl, not even family. I feel they'll make fun of me, think poorly of me, or just outright refuse.

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i really don't understand the concept of genderfluidity. i've tried doing some research, but nothing answers my questions.

from what i understand, people who do not identify as male or female have qualities and interests of both genders. from what i've read, these individuals were raised in an environment which emphasized the "boys play sports, girls play dolls" type of idea. as the child grew, they found that they have some characteristics of one, some of the other, and some neutral. instead of accepting that they could have interests outside of society's expectations of them, the expectations were so ingrained that they believe that they must be niether, both, or a mix of genders, a category of their own. if this is the case, the cause seems like a mix of poor parenting, self-esteem, and pic related. if true, isn't this idea hurting the cause of gender neutrality by saying "if you don't fit into column A or B, you must be in column C?"

however, i could be wrong. i'm still not entirely sure if this is the case. is it a definite, psychological, biological need to be genderfluid, like being trans? if one is nonbinary, what level of societal acceptance would you be looking for? the understanding of those close to you, or the understanding of society and language as a whole?