Historically and currently, why have FTMs done so little public

What? For the last six years it feels like FAAB trans people are the main face of trans advocacy. It's really hard to find stuff about trans women.

Lesbians already did the job for them when they're pre-T, and after it's easy for them to pass, so they don't experience much discrimination.

>>6852709
Trans advocacy != FAAB genderqueer otherkin advocacy

>>6852692
What is this obsession you have with demeaning FtMs? Who hurt you, anon? Just why do you feel the need to do this?

>>6852692
FTMs are useless.
They have it much, much easier since almost most of them pass after taking T.
And they also have it easier to transition socially since everybody likes girls who want to be boys.

Damn, I fucking hate them so much.

>>6852692
I love you and all but don't go after ftm, they aren't the problem. Plus they'll just blame us and you'll set off needless infighting.

File: 0x01uue.jpg (16KB, 388x220px) Image search: [Google]

16KB, 388x220px

>>6852739
>ftms are useless
alright, mtfs look like this I guess

>>6852739
>be me
>know 5 different ftms taking T
>all seemed normal
>2-3 years later.
>they are all tumblr trending non-binaries/genderqueer and don't pass.

What happened?

>>6852692
In my case at least, It's simply indifference. I may sound like an asshole, but I'm just taking advantage of the system to get my mones, I don't give a shit about other trans people.

>>6852773

Maybe there's something in the water causing babies to be born nonbinary

>>6852801
its a conspiracy anon, the jews are doing this. amright?

As a teen I used to be really big into the SJW and activism scene but I stopped a few years ago. It's too stressful. I don't have the desire to go around and hear about all the crap going on in the world. I just want to get a job and live my life, as selfish as that sounds.

>>6852773
This. Happening everywhere. FTM is a meme (I'm sorry for real ftm fags).

>>6852764
>FTM perpetuates the violent assertion of male dominance over feminine expression
can't say as i'm shocked

>>6852773

That happened to me personally.

When I was 13 or 14 I realized I wasn't cis. After some thinking I came to a conclusion I was bigender. After a few months I came to a different conclusion that I wasn't bigender, I was just a slightly feminine trans man. I was fine with that for years but by age 18 I noticed I didn't want to really live as a man anymore. Some angsting and thinking later and I acknowledged that I am non binary. I won't ever tell anyone though. I don't have the guts to be open. I'd rather blend in as binary and transition as a man.

>>6852692
Our culture is, and for some time now has been, obsessed with trans women, as well as any expression of femininity in AMAB folk.

MtFs are in the crosshairs of a plurality of forces fixated on their destruction. Those who cannot pass consistently, or those who care about people like them, cannot afford to back down.

FtMs commonly get to choose whether this is their fight. I appreciate all the ones that do immensely, but understand the desire to live unmolested just as much among them as I do consistently passing trans women. I think most trans people just want to live their lives well, without needing to have their bodies, experiences, and lives politicized.

To be fair it took a long time for lesbians to join the gay liberation movement and lesbians actively fought against gay and trans people for years. No one was bothering lesbians so they didn't want to help gays (that and they hated the trans women who where part of the gay liberation movement.) No one is bothering FtMs sp they are not going to actively put themselves out there.

>>6852739
Lol keep up with that vag envy, hon. :^) I've never seen an ftm hate mtfs because of penis envy but I've seen so many disgruntled mtf hons despise ftms because they're jealous that we were born female. Jealousy doesn't help anything.

>>6853011
>Using the term AMAB
Nobody is assigned a sex. You are born one STOP using this term.

And, maybe if there weren't so many attention seeking hons, trans women wouldn't be in the spotlight so much. Sorry but a lot of mtfs make no effort to pass it all and expect everyone to look at them as a woman even though they look like a man in a dress with beard shadow. Yes it is harder for mtfs to pass but at least try.

>>6853143
If you were born in a civilized country, they did indeed assign you a legal sex at birth. It's a lot more relevant to most trans discussions than your average concept of genetic or biological sex.

>>6853143
Everyone is assigned a sex. Until very recently, it was entirely decided by the length of the penile/clitoral tissue.

No, our culture's hyper-attenuation to expressions of femininity and prominently female characteristics is not the fault of a miniscule minority of historically (and dramatically) marginalized persons. You need to start paying attention to systemic issues instead of looking for a few people to blame if you're going to contribute anything to this discourse. Responses to the existence of trans women are disproportionately negative (and sexualized) despite passing and non-passing.

>>6853161
Unless you're intersex, no you are not assigned a sex. Maybe assigned gender roles but most people are not intersex and if they have a penis, they're genetically male, vagina genetically female. People who usually use "assigned" are just trying to delude themselves about the fact that they were born the wrong sex. I accept that I was born female and have XX chromosomes, that doesn't mean I can't call myself a guy though.

>>6853177

Are you the 16 year old pre T dood?

>expecting women to lift a finger to do anything, ever
>expecting them to be the movers and shakers in any movement
even after shooting T that lazy entitlement they grew up with never really goes away

>>6852968
What the fuck does non-binary even mean? You're either a boy or a girl.

>>6852692

Because being masculine is uncaring.

>>6853177
adopting a /pol/ mindset doesn't make you more of a man, ayyyden

>>6853551

It means you don't consider yourself strictly male or female. It's an umbrella term for all non-male, non-female genders.

File: 1464549920556.jpg (162KB, 634x752px) Image search: [Google]

162KB, 634x752px

>>6853835
so you just mean gender non-conforming? or is there something else?

>>6853860

I don't think that's possible for nonbinary people. Femboys and tomboys are gender nonconforming because they don't fit societies gender roles for them, but how can you be gender nonconforming if your gender doesn't have gender roles?

>>6853910
Your gender does have roles, because you're male or female. You're a human, not a fungus. There's 2 genders.

File: 1459325793559-3.jpg (33KB, 615x409px) Image search: [Google]

33KB, 615x409px

>>6853910
you still have your sex, and people are going to recognize and categorize you and try to assign gender roles and norms based off of that. Gender roles aren't inherent, they're an exterior force that manipulates you. How you non-conform and conform to your gender is based on societal expectations, not some interior force.

Do you look totally androgynous of something?

>>6853761
ummm excuse me hon you weren't "AMAB" you were born male, it's a fact.
t. MALE to F

>>6853973
>Gender roles aren't inherent, they're an exterior force that manipulates you.
this is paranoid claptrap. even young non-human primates like chimpanzees display "gender roles" such as female chimps preferring to play with dolls
sure gender roles are invented to an extent, but they're informed by biology

File: 345.png (530KB, 456x615px) Image search: [Google]

530KB, 456x615px

>>6854042
why the fuck would man-made items like dolls be engrained in human psyche? Do you mean baby dolls, or are you trying to say they naturally picked items with a "feminine" aspect?

>>6854042

Those aren't gender roles. It's a known thing that girls lean towards dolls in general and boys like rough and tumble stuff. It's biological. This is in general though. Gender roles are the made up part, like saying that boys shouldn't wear skirts or that girls being sporty are unusual. They're enforced by society.

>>6853973

If you're on hormones then people can mistake your sex too. Let's say you're FAAB but on T. You can look masculine and no one will know you're biological sex, or if you're lucky you will look androgynous.

File: chart1.jpg (82KB, 750x1371px) Image search: [Google]

82KB, 750x1371px

>>6854057
that's exactly what i'm saying

Because when you hand in your dyke card to become a straight white man, people assume you're just a privileged tourist trying to speak for a group you don't belong to.

>>6853143

Uh oh, someone's triggered.
Male and female are assigned to literally everyone, simply as a means of integrating their sex into our social systems and paperwork. And through transition, it can be legally RE-assigned based on where you fit as far as society is concerned, regardless of your observable biology. Because whether you're a newborn or an adult, it's easiest to go by the rule of 'if it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck,' which is why a baby who has a penis will be assigned male, and a female-presenting male may be re-assigned female.
The latter is technically still male and always will be, but it's a lot easier in a bureaucratic sense to go by the fact that she lives as a woman. So she is assigned a sex despite her biology, because biological sex and legally recognised sex are two different things - one is a biological constant, the other is a manmade designation.

AMAB and AFAB explicitly acknowledge the subject's birth sex. It's right there, M and F. Hell, the person you replied to was explicitly referring to every single born male, both cis and trans.

What would you prefer, BM and BF? Because those acronyms are kind of taken.
>hey guys, I'm a BM!
Oof, trans women just can't get a break.

>>6853174
>Until very recently, it was entirely decided by the length of the penile/clitoral tissue.
Wait, what?

>>6854161

Damn, why are males so narrowly focused?

File: 1468257229206.jpg (9KB, 250x250px) Image search: [Google]

9KB, 250x250px

>>6858730
>Damn, why are males so narrowly focused?

Why are women so girth obsessed??

File: 1467214114664.png (44KB, 657x527px) Image search: [Google]

44KB, 657x527px

>>6852764
>reads on 4chan that ftms are useless regarding the advocacy for trans rights because they have a much easier time when it comes to passing and are generally more accepted by society
>gets upset because of this
>posts the most disgusting mtf hon he could find
>makes fun of mtfs
>... proves by this that most ftms are a piece of shit

>>6852739
>knows some ftms who seemed normal and passed, then became tumblr transtrenders and don't pass anymore
Transtrenderism is all about attention seeking. They were unhappy with the fact that they were passing and seemed normal. Before they become transtrenders their thirst for attention was satisfied by being trans alone and after a while it was not working anymore.

>>6853124
>muh, you're just a vagina envy mtf hon
No, I said that ftms have a much easier time than ftms because of an easier transition (T makes the most part of it and even changes their voices) and because a woman transitioning to a man is socially more accepted since people love tomboys anyways and feminie boys are looked down upon as faggots. These are solid arguments.
But obviously you have nothing else to say than calling me a unpassing tranny/ a bitter hon.
Well done, chef!

Because they don't have to.

Not only do trans guys have an easier time passing than girls, even if they don't pass, AFAB people are allowed to alternatively express themselves in a way AMAB aren't.

1. Nobody minds females wearing male clothes, so even pre-transition ftms don't really experience discrimination unless they're insufferable faggots and get bullied more because of their personality and looks are just an excuse
2. Soon after getting hrt the most of ftms go stealth so the only discrimination they can get is for looking feminine, small etc. which they share with some cis males so if anything they could lean towards the kind of movement that protects feminine men (some kind of feminism, I guess)

>>6863827
>they could lean towards the kind of movement that protects feminine men (some kind of feminism, I guess)
>feminism
>protecting men
absolutely laughable

>>6868583
Radical, gender critical feminism is about abolishing gender roles and expanding "acceptable" male behavior to include "female" or "feminine" behavior. Liberal feminism is pure garbage. Don't discredit feminism because it has been hijacked by ninnies, please.

>>6868602
Gender critical feminism has traditionally been vitriolically hostile to expressions of femininity in all people, but especially so those assigned male at birth.

What a load of shit.

There are branches of feminism that do a lot of good for members of all genders. These pets and beneficiaries of far-right hate-groups aren't among them.

>>6852692
I think men in general (especially straight men) just aren't very engaged in the whole minority advocacy stuff compared to females

If you get into disabled rights most activists are women too