What's /lgbt/ opinion on non-binary people?

Don't real.

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From people I've met, most of them seem to be closeted FtM people who are using a Non-Binary identity as a stepping stone to accepting themselves.

my identity is just as valid as yours

>>6597879
Not really. Most gender identities are backed by genitals.

>>6597898

But gender is a social construct. You can be a woman with a penis. Transwoman that chose not to take hormones are as 100% women as the others.

>>6597851
Possible, but a friend of mine lived for a while as a trans woman, which also felt wrong, so they now identify as NB and they're happy and comfortable now like never before.

I didn't really get it at first, thought it was some offshoot of feminism... people wanting a genderless society, but it's a real identity and if it makes people happy and content, don't let it bother you

>>6597912
LUL

>>6597925
What's so funny. The fact that many transwomen chose to mutilate their penis and take hormones because they believe they aren't real women is stupid.

>>6597920
I don't let it bother me, one of my friends thought they were FtM for a while took a low dose of T and got a breast reduction and decided it was enough and they go under an agender identity which is alright with me, whatever makes them happy makes me happy y'know.

>>6597942
ULU

>>6597813
They're sexist because they say things like OH I FEEL LIKE A BOY TODAY BECAUSE I WANNA LIFT WEIGHTS or I FEEL LIKE A GIRL TODAY BECAUSE I'M WEARING LIPSTICK. Totally regressive and goes completely against eradicating rigid gender roles.

Ironically the people who have the most right to claim non-binary status if anyone, people who have body dysphoria but are maybe non-op and keeping their birth genitalia, usually just identify as one binary sex or another.

>>6597813
Gender is a spook that should to be slowly phased out

"Non-binary" is still playing the gender game, they should just opt out and stop supporting the meme.

>>6598093
thats not what non binary is though

and thats not ironic it all, thats what actual non-binary people are
you do realize they only identify as one binary gender because they are forced into that?

>>6598093

regular trans folks are also sexist. You don't need a vagina to wear lipstick and skirts.

>>6597912
>gender is a social construct
pls
Monkeys raised in labs still have the same instincts (like female monkeys being nurturing) as their wild counterpart. Why would humans be any different?

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>>6597813
They don't exist but I won't shit on them unless they are being faggots about it, other than that I don't care what they want go call themselves

>>6597851
I've seen this happen with MtF as well.
I remember going through a nonbinary phase, because my friend came out and I didn't wanna be seen as a trender.

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I don't get it tbvh, but they aren't hurting anyone so i'll allow it.

>>6598383
>We can discern some difference in behavior between animals of different sex (mostly due to hormones)
Does not lead to
>Therefore gender exists

Behavior corresponds to a particular neurobiological pattern. There is plenty of overlap between male and female brains in this regard, so it's impossible to reduce all behavior to 2 categories. If there was a complete division in the variance between the two sets then it would be quite simple. If there was a complete overlap between them, we would not be able to discern gender.
In reality, the variance in dimorphism is non-existent to moderate in specific brain areas, with all people having a combination of characteristics.
Therefore defining 2 categories is arbitrary.

Gender in the way we use it only exists because we collectively agree it is a coherent concept. It can not be reduced to biology (and can not be inferred from observing animals)

I'm female nb. I hated being a girl so I thought I must be a guy. After a few months on T I relaized that wasn't right either, so I stopped taking it and began presenting as androgynous as possible. I prefer they/them pronouns, but she/her is ok too.

any enbies wandering through here can join our skype group
its been pretty dead recently but if more people join then it will be better

https://join.skype.com/rawJDWWT2z2V

>>6597942
plz leave

>>6598439
I haven't ever met a MtF who had a non binary phase desu so I guess it didn't come to mind to mention it. Yet I think most of the NB-MtF's call themselves Fembois nowadays.

>>6597813
Unless you walk around with just your feet sticking out of a refrigerator box you will always appear as either male or female.

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>>6597813
I Think they are trans people in denial

>>6598793
its alright to have a little hope
its the only way as a trans person

>>6597944
I agree with this,

>>6598793
Saying something doesn't make it true, brah.

DESU famaloo I was agender before starting T, was too "truscum" for my local group of Tumblrinas years back in high school. As a kid I remember being disgusting by the thought of anything sticking out, whether tits or a dick, so I had some NB dysphoria as I wanted a sexless, androgynous body. Since society is still playing the gender meme and I feel much less dysphoria as a man than as a woman, I'm content with being a loser manlet.

>>6597813
Young women who take tumblr too seriously.

I think is 100 percent bullshit, but as long as they're not constantly telling me they're NB I don't really care. I don't see the point of it either. Who gives a shit if you have different interests or taste? Sometimes I wear guys' t-shirts, but that doesn't make me any less female.

I've only met one, she was pretty weird and borderline SJW. She was always nice to me, but I think that's because she wanted to fug.

>>6597813
The general rule of thumb is if something was around 100 years ago then it's not made up bullshit. non-binary wasn't so it's just attention whoring.

They are confusing their personality traits with gender/sexuality.

>>6599349
other cultures have had non binary identities for thousands of years

I feel like people should have the right to identify as neither gender, as long as their not hurting everyone, a person should be able to do whatever the fuck they want.

eh honestly if you're lgbt you don't have any stake in setting normative bounds so I don't see reason to fuss about it. I'd much faster trust someone who's a demigender quoisexual than someone who seems like a terf or a conservative

>>6598858
Show me someone who does not appear as either male or female

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>browsing /r/transtimelines
>find a MtNB post
>AA's + shaving off every hair on their head (eyebrows too)
>mfw

>>6597813
autism

>>6598786
Are you really surprised? Being free to identity as NB without repercussions is female privilege in its finest.

>>6597813

How to even sexuality

>>6600052
No I'm totally aware of it, I have to remind my FtM friend of it all the time because they never seem to understand why I'm so terrified of presenting myself more femininely

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>>6597818
Me too

Gender isn't real. NB is people reading too far into gender roles and neurotically internalizing it as an identity because they have nothing else to hold on to.

>>6600474
huh you might actually be right
damn
well either way id still prefer being called they and looking androgynous so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I think Non-binary/genderqueer should be considered a different thing from being Medically Trans, i.e. needing drugs and surgeries and things that should be covered by health insurance.

That way Trans people who have the worst of physical dysphoria don't feel like they have to share their identity with "fakers", and genderqueer people can work through their identity issues without being pushed towards more permanent body modification.

TL;DR only people who undergo physical binary transition should be called trans, the rest are some kind of non-binary genderweird

>>6601539
100% this

Special snow flakes

agender is non binary right? Then I'm one, and I don't understand the internal experience of people who strongly identify as a particular gender. Gender seems kinda dumb tobedesu.

>>6597942

It's funny because 'lul' means 'dick' in Dutch.

>>6597813
Bosian Anthropology taken to one of it's conclusions. Absolutely disgusting.

Can a nb in this thread please give me a solid definition of what non-binary even is and what you think causes it?

I mostly just leave them alone. If it helps them then awesome! I just think that being non binary in a binary world is even more of a struggle than being trans. I don't envy what they must be going through.

That being said, as a Hard aligned MTF I can't empathetically understand non-binary people.

In general if they are being obnoxious about it then fuck you, just like fuck anyone being obnoxious about their identity trans or otherwise. Just like fuck pushy vegans etc.

I don't appreciate when people bring up their identity in places/situations that don't have anything to do with their identity.

>>6597912
>gender is a social construct
But not all societies are the same. So if someone with a penis is within one society where their traits make them female they're a woman with a penis, but if they go to another society where their traits are viewed as male traits, are they no longer female? Can gender change by crossing a border?

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>>6597813
Nothing like that exists.

>>6601539
im nb and im transitioning
i think people who arent transitioning shouldnt be considered trans either, or even nb for that matter
i do experience dysphoria, just not in the exact same ways as binary trans people

>>6601904
for me at least
its really not complicated, i dont feel like, or want to be, either a boy or a girl
i hate my masculine features, but i dont want feminine ones either
just like an mtfs ideal goal would be to appear 100% as a cis female, my goal is to appear 100% androgynous
im on hrt for now and i might get an orchi much later on

>>6597813
From a scientific point of view, there exist people with other chromosome combinations than XX and XY.

From any other point of view, it's just opinions and definitions, and no useful discussion will ever arise from that.

>>6601904
Yeah I just don't identify as being male or female. That's iiiiit.

I don't really understand how people can feel like they identify strongly as particular gender, I'm don't really know what that feels like.

>>6603156
Sex =/= gender.
Non-binary people are not claiming to be intersex.

>>6602919

YOU ARE A FUCKING BIGOT I AM 100% AGENDER AND I WILL NEVER TAKE HORMONES.

I'm a trans agender myself but I tend to group all non-binary gender identities as "queer".
Gender: Male/Female/Queer

Would you get offended if I called you "queer"· but you are "bigender" or "genderfluid"?

I generally don't give a fuck about "gender activism" but I do "celebrate" trans day the same as men and women celebreate their respective days.

Personally, I think it's kind of tough as I get some people pushing me to choose between being a girl or a boy. But my family and close friends are very supportive and that's all what matters I think.

I don't care

stop dressing weird

>>6598575
is the 30 year old hon still in there preying on teen girls?

>>6605708
I'm agender as well, but I don't really like queer. You do what you want though.

>>6605812
>I don't really like queer
Care to explain why?

>>6605800
theres no girls in the group

and i dont see how someone being 30 is a bad thing

>>6598575
>>6605967
and i reopened joining for a bit

https://join.skype.com/rawJDWWT2z2V

>>6602919
>I hate being male
>but I don't want to be female
So you don't want to be a human then...

>>6606329
yeah transcending humanity is the ultimate goal
but until i unlock the fifth dimension, am able to upload my consciousness to a digital medium, or reach nirvana, im stuck here in this shitty body

>>6606329
>>6606401

Transhumanism is the way to go.
I do not regret nothing.

COME ON, YOU TOO, MY SIBLINGS

JOIN THE H+

>>6597813
When I first found out about it, it was kind of annoying because I honestly felt like those people just wanted attention but now I just don't care about it (thanks to Kate Bornstein @I Am Cait)

>>6605855
Queer suggests to me that I have some kind of weird nb gender. I just don't have a gender.

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Guys the key word is tomboy. Now end this insanity before it goes any further.

New to this board. Came here because im bisexual (but lean towards men.) and i thought it would be interesting.

I see this thread.

I now want to kill myself.

Why the fuck does half the lgbt community have to be a bunch of special snowflake faggots. Fuck.

>>6607354
bisexual huh? Who's the special snowflake really? You're probably just straight and want to pretend to be cosmopolitan. So pretentious.

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>>6597813
They're either stupid teenagers and/or tumblr trash that have chosen not to assimilate to civilized society.

>>6607362
same with gay people to be honest

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>>6607380
Gay people have assimilated to civilized society and have existed for thousands of years before tumblr.

>>6607408
and today they're stupid teenagers and tumblr trash

I am a femboy on hrt, am i technically non-binary?

>>6607429
are you a boy or a girl?

>>6607438
a boy

>>6607442
you're cis male

>>6607445
Ok, thank you

>>6607354
This>>6607359
Bisexuals have been subjected to the exact same identity erasure
You're a hypocrite

>>6607408
Non binary identities have existed in other cultures for thousands of years

>>6607480
>Non binary identities have existed in other cultures for thousands of years
No, just males who were deemed as lesser due to having transness or homosexuality were segregated from main society into ostracized castes

>>6607509
no difference fuccboi

>>6607509
Edgy

>>6607510
I'm glad we came to the same conclusion that non binary identities doesn't exist

>>6607517
neither do gay people, lgbt is a meme

>it's a gender is a social construct tumblr retard episode

Guys I'm special and different xD
biology doesn't matter smash the patriarchy im a pansexual gender non conforming demi squirrel xD

>>6607537
sounds like all people who pretend they aren't straight

its LARPing

>>6607537
You must be the dumbest and a really primitive faggot if you can't accept thefact there are people who don't identify with any gender, or people who identifies with both binary genders.

Otherkins are other topic, also ideologies are a barrier which prevent you to think properly so that's other topic as well.

>>6598093
Yes to a point, but as a binary myself, it is difficult to one day feel super masculine, want to fuck all the bitches and take over the world, to the next wanting to be a skinny little twinky fagget boy who would let any big boy fuck me up the ass and take care of me. This literally happens to me everyday, i'm like martin morning who has to rek or be rekt

>>6602058
No, you're confusing the idea of social constructs with things that are determined by society. While society creates the construct of gender, it is the individual who assigns themself a gender. The gender identity is independent of behaviour. Human society then teaches the person how to behave, and they follow the example of those with the gender they identify with.

Therefore, if a person moved from one society to another, their gender would not change, as the person has already found which gender identity they are comfortable with. However, their behaviour would probably change to reflect the socially acceptable behaviour of those of their gender.

>>6607408
me in the back

>>6597813
literally no reason for it
you are just an androgynous male, female, or hermaphrodite

>>6607429
yes. Femboys are the kind of person who the term non-binary was invented for.

AFAB- stepping stone for coming out as a trans man.

AMAB- full on autist.

Castrati make the best trophies.

>>6616158
You should explain the distinction

Gender don't real but until we don't have to state gender/sex when doing pretty much anything, 90% of people who are made particularly uncomfortable by the choices of male/female will call themselves whatever term they happen to find that expresses that discontent.

I'd arguably fall into the category of nonbinary but I don't want to be an obnoxious tumblrshit about it, so instead I just let people assume what they want, go by my sex when I'm forced to, and generally just hope gender doesn't get brought up to much. (Spoiler: It always does.)

>>6615986
He identified as a boy. That would make him male.

>>6616806
Yeah I do the same, people get annoyed/mad about it so I keep it to myself and let people think what they want. It's not really worth dealing with the reactions to tell people.

>>6616806
>>6617037
this needs to stop desu

if it was anything else people would tell you not to stay in the closet

>>6617078
I'm in the closet about being bisexual as well. There's nothing wrong with being closeted, I don't need people to know and dealing with people reacting so negatively isn't worth it.

>>6617102
are you closeted to everyone? when someone asks directly, do you tell them?

for me being fully closeted is just torture, youre just lying to yourself and everyone around you

>>6617110
If someone asks directly I tend to lie, but sometimes I tell them, for example if it's someone I'm never going to see again.

>>6599446
Those cultures haven't done anything important or created anything meaningful... ellipsis are the reward for your efforts... ... ...

>>6600349
That period is unsettling

>>6617115
is it hard for you to form meaningful relationships when you are hiding a significant portion of your identity?

>>6617078
But the closet is comfortable.

To be serious: there's not much positive to be gained from telling people. I tell my close friends and such, but even then its more of a joke than a serious confession. Its not even that I'm inherently about "privacy and secrecy" in my personal life: I'm pretty open about being bi. It's just that being loud and serious about it would take more effort than the whole thing is worth.

If you look like a man, and intend to dine in the club house... If you don't have a jacket, one will be provided.

>>6617145
No? Even the people I start romantic/sexual relationships with don't need to know, I only have to communicate my interest in them. For some of my longer relationships (those lasting years) it eventually gets brought up I guess, but I don't consider my sexual orientation / gender to be a particularly significant portion of my identity at all, it doesn't really have much influence on my day to day experiences.

>>6617146
you dont have to be loud about it, just open about who you are to anyone who wants to know, and comfortable with your own identity

>>6617213
im kind of envious to be honest, i could never do that
its too important for me

>>6617220
Why do you consider it so important to you?

>>6617234
i like to be completely honest with people im close to
when im not out to them it feels like im not being myself and that makes things stressful for me, and then we drift apart

>>6617253
why is being out something they have to know? Unless you're planning on having sex with them it's probably not relevant right?

>>6617257
i just like to be completely open about everything about myself
and gender and sexuality is an important part of who i am (despite the labels that apply to me being all about rejecting labels ??)

I think it's a fucking meme. You don't have to be manly to be a male and you don't have to be feminine to be a female; "girl" and "boy" are just euphemisms for m/f and the whole concept of gender is absurd.

all that matters is what's between your legs, trying to be a special non-binary snowflake just leaves you looking like an idiot to most well-adjusted people.

>>6617220
I suppose, but it's hard to be proud about something people either misunderstand, be rude about, or be overly enthusiastic about. I just want gender to not be a big deal, you know?

>>6617352
t. cisgender

>>6617361
i try to avoid those kinds of people i guess

>>6597851
Fucking this. I know someone who just "came out" as nonbinary. Get over yourself. Express how you like, but don't make it a god damn confession that you don't conform.

>>6601904
-someone who is not a man or a woman
-someone who fluctuates between multiple genders

>>6617352
reactions like this is exactly why people who are non binary make sure to stay closeted

>>6598476
Gender exists because some monkey get babys and others don´t. Gender exists because it´s absolutly clear that male and female behave different in general throughout all the animals. the thing with this statistical imsignificative group of tg is that you mix up sexual preference with actual gender. You get the hype because you are dragged through the media freakshow.

>>6597813
Do what you what as long as it dose not hurt anyone.