Is it true that the burst mechanism and magazines are responsible

>>34899769
Yep.

In fact, the entire Army's M4s are being converted to M4A1s with full auto.

The anti-tilt follower upgrades for the aluminum mags helped a lot, too.

>>34899769
No, that would be mags. The burst pack, or more specifically the users total unfamiliarity with it, was certainly the cause of most of the "jams" in the 2007 XM8/SCAR/416/M4 comparison at Aberdeen, but in general use stoppages will overwhelmingly be mag related.

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>>34900325
>"hurr weapon testers dont know how to shot gun!"
That's like having a janitor fly your prototype fighter aircraft, and fucking remember the AR's track record.
>AR10 failed every trial it was in.
>AR15 failed every trial it was in, MacNamara had to pull strings to force it adopted.

>>34902336
Except that Dust test had completely different results for the M16 than in every other test. It was blatantly because they were counting 3-round bursts not completing because the techs were doing them wrong as failures.

>>34902336
Also, the AR-10 failures were because the Army forced Armalite to make it with Aluminum barrels, which caused predictable failures so they could favor the M14.

>>34900325
Burst mechanism still sucks. There is a reason they are dropping it for safe/semi/full.

>>34899769
Burst cam is top shit, but most users misunderstand how it's "failing." It's actually not a functional failure at all--just an inherent byproduct of the design.

>>34902380
the army didn't, George Sullivan (Armalite president) did, because he's a dumbass

>>34900325
> or more specifically the users total unfamiliarity with it,
They shouldn't have to be familiar with it for it to reliably function. The AR15 burst FCG is awful.

>>34903581
Failure or not, a burst FCG that has memory is dogshit. It even makes the trigger pull on semi something lamentable.

>>34902336

>McNamara had to pull strings
>Not McNamara got tired of Springfield Armory sabotaging better designs like the early AR trials, and T-48 FAL.

>>34904414
NOt disagreeing with this at all, I can't believe how long it lasted. And now that I've considered what I just typed, I supposed I can understand it.

don't care anymore truth is di guns are shit no matter how nicely built/machined. a piston ar is going to be more reliable. i like the closed tolerance design, but dirty gas that is gonna pass and hit your ass it stupid, mane. burst selectors and mags are a problem too. infact, most of these posts on this thread are spot on. i think they should force more qc on milsepc. just my 2 cents.

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>>34905555
>them quads
Righteous in this man, pure righteousness.

>>34904414
>Failure or not, a burst FCG that has memory is dogshit.
God you people are idiots.

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>>34905555
DI BTFO.

>>34907574
>NANI

>>34905633
Where does the bolt go when it cycles back?

>>34904377
Because he wanted to submit a 7lb(on paper) full powered battle rifle

>>34905172
There were no early AR trials except for the AR10 that exploded on it's own volition due to the shitty composite lightweight barrel Armalite insisted on it having.

FN sabotaged itself during the T48 cold weather trials. They even flew up FN engineers to fix the gas issues and they just made it worse by drilling a bigger gas port, causing parts breakages.

>>34907710
I don't know this specific rifle, but most similar designs use a short bolt and put the recoil spring overhead, like a typical AR18 derivative.

>>34899769
I thought it was bent magazines and poor cleaning. That's certainly what I've seen.

>>34902336
Is pic related about your own argument?
As if U.S. Army Ordinance didn't rig trials with every new goddamn gun for a century. AR-15 is quantifiably better than any alternative, even piston AR's. Just get over it.

>>34907754
Well that's silly, the AR-10 was already way lighter and ready to roast the competition

>>34907710
the TTA is basically an ZM LR-300 clone. Take an AR, chop the bolt carrier in half, extend the gas key suuuper long so it looks like a piston, put the recoil spring around the piston.

>>34907939
>put the recoil spring around the piston.
I mean put the recoil spring around the NOT-piston gas key. It's still direct impingement and the gas travels all the way back into the bolt carrier

>>34907891
Not really. The Sudanese model was lightweight(7.5 lbs but had a pencil profile barrel and hollow fiberglass furniture that cracked easily) and the transitional model and then the Portuguese model(8.9 pounds) got heavier and beefier as they went along.

It was still a very short lived design because of its faults.

Remember even the M14 prototype was also 7.something pounds at the time until they had to strengthen areas(add weight) for full production

>>34907843
A really well made piston AR will probably be objectively better than a DI gun at certain things such as:
-sustained fire
-suppression
-water

but worse at:
-parts replacements due to added complexity
-possible carrier tilt issues
-probably slightly less accurate inherently by design
-weight

>>34907939
>>34907945
Alan Zitta licensed the LR-300 out to para after he failed to get juicy government contracts with his faulty design. Para ate up his "operator specops use it" pitch and started production right away. Issues with the design cropped up quickly and word spread quick. Para sunk the TTR line and liquidated it to CDNN for pennies on the dollar.

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>>34908048
>faulty design
don't blame him; blame stoner

>>34908105
His design relied on a tiny piece of spring steel held on by the pressure of the recoil spring to keep it from flying off the carrier key.

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>>34908136
ok, well HK wants to talk to your bitch ass
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGwkHktkTxU

>>34899769
that auto sear

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>>34907783
>>34902336
Springfield Armory and the Ordance department were a bunch of dicks and sabotage the AR every chance they got. Biggest thing was they modified the testing requirements for the AR10. tests like the freezer test were modified, the rifle was forced to go through significantly higher round counts compared to the FAL and M14 and with fewer chances for regular maintenance. Ammunition was also an issue, standard protocol was to use regular ball ammunition. The AR10 was forced to use an experimental AP round with a confirmed by Fort Benning bad lot of powder that had been rejected for being inconsistent. All of this is why Rifle No. 1002 barrel bursted (aside from being a poor design choice for a battle rifle) With some help by a few engineers from Springfield who saw this was a better rifle, they produced a new 4140 steel barrel (interestingly enough it was of equal weight) and Rifle No. 1002 went back to finish testing a few weeks later. So in short Fuck Springfield armory and the ordnance department, they got what they deserved

>>34909590
The AR-10 was not officially part of the service rifle trial though. It was submitted for testing and they simply used what they had on hand.

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>>34909590
Furthermore from the report there was 66 malfunctions, 43 of which were from the bolt not locking back, 11 was from the trigger not resetting properly and the rest can be chalked up to weird ammo being used

>>34909590
Any source on this "experimental AP round" being used? Sounds pretty exotic for 1957.

>>34905674
Explain, in detail, why having a burst trigger that will let off one or two rounds instead of the desired three is a good thing, particularly when it's being used by grunts and other burst-capable rifles don't have this "feature." I'll wait.

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>>34909687
"The Armalite AR-10 Worlds finest battle rifle" it's from collectors grade publications. If you want the full story behind this rifle it's the thing to have. I've read it a few times over already

In it it writes that Fort Benning's Infantry board number three and found out that that lot of powder was being used for the testing and then notified armalite. Benning had rejected it because it suffered from "unusually poor accuracy" and "was found to generate even higher pressures than specified for it's type" and "dangerously inconsistent pressures and velocities"

The round itself was a new experimental AP round featuring some new shape

>>34909746
Interesting. Unfortunately the AR-10 was ultimately short lived even overseas because of Armalite and Artillerie Inrichtingen messing up every chance they were given with bad QC/QA.