Why do the SEALS seem to have the highest rate of fuck ups in

Because seals are a meme.

>>34633784
Mission creep

>>34633807
Green Berets took the mission creep in their stride, why not the SEALS?

>>34633784
SEALS lack basic infantry skills, this is what happens when you directly recruit from civilians rather than current serviceman.

>>34633919

Most units do that, you can enlist into the Army on an SF slot

>>34633784

Because if it was the army it'd just be a drop in the bucket and other resources could be called in.

With the small team size if things go wrong the initial contact force can be wiped out before the reinforcements/artillery/air support can get there, if it's even available at all.

Poor structure, irrelevant training, you can join as a civilian and with a parent branch that has nothing to gain from having a special forces unit tacked onto it.

>>34633936
You can, but the number who end up there through that route is minute. With the SEALs its the bulk of their manpower.

They are generally put into something they are not trained as much in. Example: kicking in doors for a valued target, may want to get army or marine SF specifically. Boat/pirates abducting a large cargo carrier and need it cleared? Get seals. Comes down to training and implementation.

File: 1813233_original.jpg (206KB, 900x600px) Image search: [Google]

206KB, 900x600px

>>34633784

Because light infantry is a meme that was devised by peace time generals who were tasked with fighting (((Neocon))) wars on the cheap.

See what happens when a SEAL unit goes up against a conventional mechanized unit of some other major force in contested air space with extensive jamming and GPS denial (which is what a conventional battlefield will look like).

I can't wait to see the intestines of dead MemeSEALs getting caught in the running gear and treads of tanks and IFVs.

>>34633955
fucking SEAL apologist. STFU.

SEALs, like all Navy personnel, are FUCCBOIS.

>>34633784
They started believing their own hype.

>>34634005
>See what happens when a SEAL unit goes up against a conventional mechanized unit
>goes up against
Why in the living fuck would a SOF team engage any actual unit? Are you retarded?

>>34633784
>SEALS
>mission prep/mission planning
>fuck it, we'll do it live
>mission goes sideways
>what are comms?
>FUBAR
>quiet professional
>book deals, movie deals, lecture circuit

>>34633955
>wiped out before the reinforcements
Assuming they know what comms are and how they work.

File: 11242895_458318130991431_311161837_n.jpg (33KB, 480x480px) Image search: [Google]

33KB, 480x480px

>>34633784

>>34634077

So you're claiming they are strictly designed for police work like searches and detentions?

What's the difference between SEALs and a local SWAT team?

File: 1480962218983.jpg (63KB, 455x817px) Image search: [Google]

63KB, 455x817px

>>34634104
>So you're claiming they are strictly designed for police work like searches and detentions?
You could just admit you know fuck-all about anything instead of making such ludicrous strawmans.

Because they keep being told to do things that aren't their specialty. Socom thinks commando equals supersoldier and good people die as a result.

>>34634082
Correct answer here lads.
>fuck it we'll do it live
Had this patch on the inside of my admin pouch

>>34634104
they're generally above average soldiers with special training to take advantage of weaknesses that can only be exploited with something less than an entire fucking platoon. if you put them up against a mechanized unit they're going to die 100% of the time.

>>34634114
the first company i worked at out of uni went under because of that. they pushed a developer's update to production without even checking it, and said update accidentally the entire prod database.

>>34634077
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PT-76

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/1990-02-09/news/9001120248_1_seals-platoon-plane

Every resource I find on the web conveniently leaves out that when the SEALs tried to capture Noriega's jet, the airfield was guarded by PDF V-150 Commandos.

>>34634112

basically this, and it's obvious that most commando fuckups can be traced it

officers/commanders/civ administrators are retarded and forget that even commandos aren't trained in everything

>>34634112
>Socom thinks commando equals supersoldier and good people die as a result.

But isn't everyone in Socom part of the special forces community?

That's the entire point of Socom, spec ops being run by spec ops.

>>34634315
>special forces community
>community
people need to stop using this word. This, and "research".

>>34634005
why would the seals be fighting a mechanized unit? are you fucking dense?

>>34634324

That's the word that SOCOM itself uses

>>34634552
doesn't mean they should use it.

Because the missions they're sent to are the most likely to have fuck ups.

File: implying this isn't our year.png (505KB, 954x715px) Image search: [Google]

505KB, 954x715px

>>34634580

And I'm sure you have a much better authority on the Special Forces community than the goddamn SOCOM

>>34634596

PJs, actually.

PJs are sent on the missions most likely to end in failure.

>>34634207
>can't take out a tiny garrison
>they must be commandos

just like how the seal's must have been buttfucked by 200 taliban at red wings when it was less than a dozen

>>34633936
You can, but it's been explained to me that you have to be top .01% Of humanity to get through the assblasting you will endure from trainers who hate you.

>>34634104
they swim real gud

>>34634382
See >34634207

Because armor is on the battlefield? In other words, you reasonably trained dirty DAT can easily kill off America's elite commandos. Let that sink in for minute.

>>34634600
>SOCOM
>Special Forces
Pick one.

>>34634082
This is correct. It's a combo of them not knowing how to plan a mission and the amount of publicity they generate for themselves.

>>34633784
>Is it just that more of their missions are made public so more of their mistakes will be known as well?
You make me feel good. You're thinking.

I ain't saying I know.

>>34634064
This, being told that you are a badass motherfucker on a daily basis gets to their heads and eventually makes them think they are bulletproof

For some fucking reason, the Seals can't keep their face holes shut and they all want book and movie deals or some shit.

Their leaks and known details area fucking meme in the SF community.

>>34634723
My OSUT company had like 160 18xs, of those 90 kept their 18x contracts. The other 70 either got kicked out or reclassed. Keep in mind that's just 11b osut, only like one or two will ever make it into group. They pass selection at a higher rate thanks to SOPC but get dropped like crazy during the Q course because of alcohol or being retarded in general.

>>34634723
could still be inexperience? i watched a doco on the Australian SAS, and im pretty sure they needed to serve 4 years before being eligible

Probably they are a lot more publicized and get more media coverage?

because seals arent actually that good at standard mission sets

>be inna korea
>doing joint mission with seals
>we x-land, roll of the bird, clear our compound
>we watch as seals land, get lost trying to get to their compound, and basically just hang out in the open with their weapons down waiting for their PL to unfuck his mess

different mission sets. you cant be good at everything

File: 1497708505105.gif (67KB, 192x197px) Image search: [Google]

67KB, 192x197px

>>34634939
> %1.25 success rate
Got to try right? I had an uncle who was part of operation snowcap, and is the main reason I want to get 11b 18x
Of course the 80s entry to SF were WAY fucking different

Unlike what>>34633919 The fact that you don't have to untrain and retrain the 300 out of the 1,000 man troop for a higher level mission/combat set is a plus for pipeline from civilian.

Now like>>34634077 this question GB and SOCOM in General are mostly E&E at worst and Training sister forces at best

2003 or 4
>14 Green Berets enter Afghanistan
>raise and train local afghanis
>numbers up to 1,000
>tons of gear and guns flown in
>Defeat Muj, Taliban, Al Quada, or whatever the Saudis were paying for back then for a defunct state in a matter of weeks
>Karzai is now leader
>conveniently cooperates with UN and NATO to let ISAF into Afghanistan
Heres the kicker. All that was Accomplished to prevent Osama from escaping through the old Soviet gun running route that ran into Africa.

SEALs let Osama Bin Laden escape anyway

Still an entirely different mission set than that of front line infantry.

>>34633919
>this is what infatard cannon fodder actually belives

> Why do the SEALS seem to have the highest rate of fuck ups in their missions, among all of SOCOM?

Are you a seal or have security clearance to know that they do in fact have the "highest fuck up rate"? Cause im willing to bet the number of mission they actually go on is much higher than you expect and the ones the general public are allowed to know about it tiny.

Not that i give a shit but it kind of dumb to assume one branch has higher failure rate when you dont know the whole data set. Also yes there are much better SF unit in the us military/government.

>>34634701
Because you obviously know how many taliban were there.

Good bait bro!

>>34633784
They get hyped up by media/popular culture and are given missions better handled by other forces like green berets or raiders.

>>34634749
SEALS wouldn't be tasked for a job that can be done by DATs anyway. They would be tasked with taking out that CnC facility behind the lines or punching holes in a SCUD launcher with a 50 cal from a mile away. Anything else is just a waste of their skillset.

>>34635508

epic argument. even the pentagon admitted the range of taliban probably 8-10, scaling back from an initial intel estimate of 10-20.

i suppose the pentagon itself is just full of jealous haters

>>34634596
There is an over reliance on the use of special forces.
There are quite simply jobs suited to large infantry unit tactics

50+ replies and no one got it yet.

It's because you don't hear about most of the successes and you do hear about nearly all of the failures.

>>34636916
The idea that infantry is suited for anything is a flawed thought

They should be glider deploying armored vehicles directly on the target with no warning

>>34637175
>actually believing this

why would the pentagon hide successes when their conclusion coming out of vietnam was that PR is their #1 priority

File: 'MURICA.jpg (74KB, 900x900px) Image search: [Google]

74KB, 900x900px

>>34633784
SEAL's have a terrible track record because they have gone to great lengths to distance themselves from the Navy and piss off the people who are in the best position to help them. Richard Marcinko went out of his way and used Red Cell to fuck with a bunch of upper-echelon chiefs in different branches, just to prove how big and tough he was and to blackmail them with the threat that "we broke in your highly-secure base once before, and we can do it again to prove you are incompetent."

You see this reflected in the officer cadre within SEAL's. Most recently, Capt. Hooser and Capt. Howard have taken steps to re-integrate with the larger Navy structure, but pretty much all the leaders before them were followers of the Marcinko style of interaction with the higher chain of command (Gormly, Moser, Woolard, etc.).

The SEAL's have an excellent track-record as far as successful missions, but because they made themselves an object of public attention, their flaws are much more visible. Also, whenever the SEAL's do fuck up, ONI goes and tells the press exactly what the SEAL's goofed on.

The only reason the SEALS haven't been dissolved is because of the brand-name; they're too public and disbanding the organization now would probably cut into recruitment for high-school kids who enlist because they want to be on SEAL team six.

>>34637221
Hahahaha

>>34637654
?
There is no reason that they should be losing hardware worth 100 million dollars on these shitty raids they do

>>34637980
I was laughing at your dumbass idea to have gliders drop armored vehicles, as if that is somehow the "subtle" option.

my buddy tells me this story about the seals doing this mountain infil. but they are weak and didn't prepare so then the rangers had to come save them. he was in ranger bat.

>>34633784
>Iq of 104 needed to join
Kind of funny if you ask me.

>>34638113

What version of the IQ test are they using?

>>34638675
ASVAB, which roughly translates to IQ.

File: Bitch, I'm a pussy and even I know that's fucked up.png (119KB, 306x273px) Image search: [Google]

119KB, 306x273px

>>34638843

You fucking idiot

>>34638879
Not him, but I mean honestly it's not far off.

I'm not super intelligent; I'd estimate probably around average, maybe an IQ of 95.
Got a 96 on the ASVAB.

It only goes up to 99 but I don't imagine too many geniuses end up having to take the ASVAB.

>>34638907
They look at different subjects senpai. You wont find a mechanical and hand tool knowledge section on most IQ tests.

>>34637305
Because the kind of operations you send lone special forces teams on are generally politically sensitive enough that the diplomatic repercussions significantly outweigh any potential 'morale gain'. A good example might be neutralising an ISIS command element that just happens to be located in a city controlled by Assad.

>>34639018

politically sensitive tasks go to the CIA, not the SEAL primadonnas. your example would not even be attempted by the seal's because of the non insignificant chance of assad parading around US uniformed POW's on RT.

also the bullshit secrecy argument also applies to the CIA. using the false facade of secrecy to claim unknown success turned out to total horseshit, as the declassified cold war history of the CIA demonstrated. their record is one where success is the rare exception.

>>34638025
Not about being "subtle"
About being successful