So outside of the USA, where does a sort of rich but not large

>>34469106
the vatniks or the slopes. is there some reason a country such as norway, with its thriving ship building industry couldn't build one though? or are you just masturbating to hypotheticals again?

>>34469106
Anywhere with a half-decent shipbuilding industry really.
It's actually quite a competitive and level market, so these kind of acquisitions somehow seem to avoid becoming massively expensive boondoggles.

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>>34469106

>Norway
>Can't make its own

...pic related

But if you're willing to expand that to "any given country that is rich but can't make its own," then I think the real answer is "such a country doesn't exist."

Yeah maybe Switzerland, but the reason they can't make their own is: They have no water, so they don't buy.

>>34469145

Turns out I'm an idiot. The answer is: Norway buy their frigates in Spain

>>34469106
South Korea builds a fuck ton of ships for navies around the world.

>>34469152
Australia got its carriers from spain. Even russia was gonna buy ships from spain

>>34469106
the UK, germany, spain, france

Problem is you can only get second hand in the UK for the next decade, their shipyards have a backlog of orders, but with the new frigates and OPV's you can place an order and get priority.

Germany are the go-to for frigates and diesel electric subs

Spain and france you can get some good deals for amphibious assault ships

>>34469196
Your thinking of france, the mistral class was pretty much built before they were seized after the crimean crisis and sold to egypt

Even small countries with a few million people can design and build their own ships.

>>34469152

Small rich countries in the north:
Netherlands: Build their own
Sweden: Build their own
Denmark: Build their own
Iceland: Not super rich, don't have a navy. Their cost-guard consists of foreign ships made in Denmark and Chile.


Small rich countries in the east:
Singapore: Formidable class (French), Victory class (German)
Republic of China: Kidd-Class (American!), Cheng Kung (Built their own)
New Zealand: Anzac Class (Australian),

Small rich countries in Africa:
These don't really exist? There are rich African countries, and there are small African countries, but I don't know any rich small Afrian country. South Africa buys their Valour class in Germany but I mean, South Africa is not small.

Middle East:
Qatar has british Vita-class FACs and French Combattante III FACs but no real ships.
Israel has lot of shit they built on their own, and also a joint israeli-(((American))) class called Sa'ar 5

South America
Again - are there Small Rich countries here? Not really?

>>34469246
>New Zealand: Anzac Class (Australian),
Built in Australia, but much of the design is German

>>34469246
Egypt and Morocco are not rellay small and they spend their money buying FREMM's.

Btw could somebody that knows his stuff explain why people are buying French FREMM's as exports (other than Egypt and Morocco having special deals with France for the procurement of stuff) and not the Italian Fremm's which seem like the superior ship?

The Netherlands sold ships to Greece, Indonesia and Peru

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>>34469106
Norway builds/designs many of their own, but due to differences in wages and competetiveness those mostly consist of specialized non-military and arctic vessels.

Pic related is apparently the fastest corvette ever built, and is domestically built.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skjold-class_corvette

When it comes to the coast guard we build our own ships, but they aren't really military in nature, but rather there to do rescue operations on sea. Even then some of our patrol vessels are built in Poland.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reine-class_patrol_vessel

>>34469145
The Nansen-class are designed, produced and put together in Spain, only some equipment is later fitted on after they arrive in Norway.
https://forsvaret.no/fakta/utstyr/Sjoe/Nansen-klasse-fregatt

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>>34469364
And if anyone cares about non-military equipment; we are now getting the italians to build our polar ships. It's funny since the train carriages we have are also from Italy, and every winter they break dow from the snow and cause mass delays.

>>34469106
Norway just ordered 4 improved U-212 class submarines from Germany.

>>34469364
>Nansen-class are designed, produced and put together in Spain

See:
>>34469152
>Turns out I'm an idiot. The answer is: Norway buy their frigates in Spain

>>34469377
>And if anyone cares about non-military equipment; we are now getting the italians to build our polar ships. It's funny since the train carriages we have are also from Italy, and every winter they break dow from the snow and cause mass delays.

Oh God we purchased trains in Italy too don't remind me ;_;

>>34469382
Singapore also increased their order to 4 submarines of the large sub-class based on the U-212 from Germany.

>>34469106
Russia, France, Italy, UK, Germany, Spain

>>34469246
>Qatar has british Vita-class FACs and French Combattante III FACs but no real ships.

Qatar is buying 4 corvettes (armed like small frigates), 2 patrol boats (armed like corvettes) and 1 LPD (+1 in option) from Italy, all scheduled to be delivered between 2020 and 2022

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>>34469437
Forgot pic

>>34469196

That's only because we don't have any shipyards capable of building them though.

>>34469308

France is the more aggressive of the two when it comes to exports. Additionally, I believe that France had to give one or two of their own ships to seal the deal since the shipyards are busy.

Not sure about Italy's own shipyards, but I know they are going under a pretty major shipbuilding program so likely there's no room in the yards / experienced builders available to help consult with the export nation to build.

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>>34469675
why post this?

>>34469890
Italy's shipyards are pretty busy. They have the last few FREMMs to build, they are almost done with the LSS, they have just started the LHD. Then there will be the PPAs, maybe one addition LSS and one addition LHD, or some LPDs. And probably a new class of destroyers and subs.

And they are going to build this stuff too >>34469437 >>34469443

>>34469934
Oh and I forgot, there's likely going to be a new minehunter class and a new small patrol class, both quite large (at least 5 boats/ships each)

>>34469934
>>34469940

Yeah, the future for the Italian navy looks brighter than the French one.

>>34469308
Well the french FREMM isn't "bad" either, in addition to that they're marketing both their new 4000 tons frig and jumboized FREMM with SF-500 radars, and in term of geostrategic partnership, you can expect more from working with the french navy and french governement than from the Italian who seem to be much less involved. If you need to train your navy in ASW, commanding task forces with international emphasis and the likes, i'm willing to bet the frogs have more recent experience than the italians, who, as some report i read not too long ago (maybe on Rand? can't exactly remember) that are not doing much besides glorified OPV work in close waters these days.

>>34469989
the italians have almost always at least one ship active in NATO counter-piracy operations

>>34470019
so glorified OPV work?

>>34470036
uhm, I guess, yeah

but I don't see where France got any real ASW experience lately

>>34470052
Long story short, the paper I read pointed that the necessity to sanitize areas when sortying their SSBN is a solid encouragement to maintain skills at peak level that the italians may not have. Also, when i was speaking of experience in commanding task forces, the frogs did took overall command of the combined naval forces supporting Irak/Syria operations on severall occasions, which did not seem to be exactly something the US navy trusts anyone with.

>>34470108
Makes sense.

>>34470108
Got a link to this paper? I wanna read it.

>>34470112
Not that I blame the Italians worrying about their close waters these days, btw. The situation is messy enough as it is.

>>34470121
Need to go get a blood sample, will try to find it back when I'm home.

>>34470131
Yeah, though I wouldn't understimate their ASW skills. The mediterranean is full of subs from a ton of nations, a lot of them not exactly friendly