Hello, negroids of /k/ so I've got some free money coming

>>34304978
If you want to shoot 7.62x39 get an AK
If you want to shoot 12 gauge out of a magazine semi auto rifle, get an saiga
What's wrong with an AR in good ol' 5.56?

>>34304997
Many people these days are hyping 300 blackout which is basically more expensive 7.62x39mm.

Alot of people don't believe anything less than 30 caliber has enough "stopping power"

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>>34304978
>or is it an abomination?
Generally yes.

SCAR 17
POF/LMT/LWRC/etc. AR-10
HK 91/ PTR 91
DSA FAL

Or pic related if you wanna be a real fuckin memester

>>34304978
If you want to shoot .300blk, buy an AR. 7.62x39, buy an AK. Neither of these are battle rifles.

No idea what to suggest for a magazine fed semiauto shotgun. A vepr-12 would probably be it, but with your budget I'd suggest dropping the magazine fed requirement and buying a benelli M4 and the OEM conversion parts to un-cuck it and go full m1014.

>>34304997
an AR that fires 7.62x39mm has all the benefits of an AR over an AK which you probably already know

>>34305049
I know it's not a battle rifle there are 2 separate topics in my post.

>>34304978
>narrowed my gun budget to 3k

SCAR 17s or LMT MWS.

>>34305044
>Bullpup

Fuck no.

Which one of those battle rifles would you suggest? Which one has best quality for a civilian? It doesn't need a 6lb trigger like military arms have.

>>34305090
>Which one has best quality for a civilian?
Those are all decent options, the more expensive the better but the returns per dollar are diminishing obviously.

Do you have a separate budget for optics or do you want that to fit into your 3K? How much do you want to spend on other accessories like magazines and such?

>>34305044
I was leaning towards the PTR GI R it has a picatinny rail on top for different optics and it looks cool. But roller delayed blowback < gas piston

>>34305103
3k is the budget for rifle alone

>>34305103
>>34305131
There's no limitations on optics or ammunition. It can really only cost an extra 1k or so anyway.

>>34305148
Then the SCAR or premium AR-10 would be your best bet, these will be optics ready, have a large aftermarket for parts and mags, and come stock with good triggers. A G3 of FAL would need work in that department.

>>34305090
>need
triggered

>>34305108
When you've got $3k to fuck with, a SCAR or top-tier .308 AR is really all you should be considering for a battle rifle.

>>34305040
>more expensive 7.62x39

Oh so you know nothing about ballistics, reloading, suppressors, ARs, or either of the two calibers.

>>34304997
>bears, moose
>"le what's wrong with 5.56"

>>34305044
>SCAR 17
>POF/LMT/LWRC/etc. AR-10
I kinda regret getting the REPR over the 17S.

>>34305341
Oh so you haven't compared the two at all. Look at the ballistics and measurements they're damn close.

>>34305206
The direct impingement gas system, with the 8 lug lockup, is ideal. The way the AR pattern rifles handle recoil in my mind does place it above most everything. But I still feel this weird pull towards the hk91 replicas. Mostly because I'm second generation German and I don't know how it compares to the AR pattern but I do know they both have similar MOA

>>34305341
300 blackout just weaker 7.62x39 with worse ballistics.
The inu advantages of 300 blackout is more ammo options, cheaper brass, 308 bullets vs 311 and non curved mags. Ballistically speaking x39 is better. And yes, you can have your subsonic quiet 240 grain bullets too.

>>34304997
Vesprs are better than saigas. Harder to get, but the quality control is better.

>>34306003
That 8 lug set up isn't exactly ideal for longevity, now is it?
If the ar had been designed with a larger bolt head in mind with thicker lugs this wouldn't be much of an issue. Another thing is the recoil spring is in the buffer tube. Should have made it above bcg and increased the heigh of the gun and with that added a folding or pdw stock. A quick change barrel system should also have been in place as well as a larger magwell for cartridges like 7.5 Swiss/308 With interchangeable magwells.

>>34306003
A 17S or high end AR-10 type rifle will be noticeably more accurate than a PTR91. It's one of the cold war era battle rifles, don't expect much more out of it than that.

I enjoy shooting my PTR, but I'm aware of the type's limitations. Could I shoot FGMM out of it for groups? Sure, but that would be a horrible waste of expensive factory ammo. Mine lives on a diet of cheap steel case and Hirtenberger because that's more in line with my realistic expectations for the rifle.

>>34306159
Right. But longevity is not really a concern for me. For a prepper who believes this rifle needs to last through the apocalypse then I'd look for something else. I already do and plan on carefully maintaining and cleaning my firearms, in a 1st world country, with the wealth to buy parts should they fail. The buffer tube problem is real. But I'm not making an SBR nor do I want a folding stock at all.

>>34306259
I was thinking from a prepper standpoint.
Also those pdw stocks just look very aesthetically pleasing.

The barrel system, I think, is a very legitimate criticism and applies to most people. I had to get help from another person to take the damn barrel nut off and I had to use a very large and heavy vice. A quick change barrel system would be very helpful. Same with the thread system for the muzzle devices. Aks have this spring loaded pin that basically sticks into the muzzle device. No need for extreme torque. To get my flash hider off I had to get another person to pull the barrel in the opposite direction as me when I was taking off the flash hider.
Also one last thing, the ar really should have been side charging. I see no reason why it wasn't originally made that way given today's side charging ars.

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>>34305390
>7.62x39
>bears, moose
step aside boy

>>34306326
Having a quick change would be nice. I thought some do have those. My armalite AR doesn't that's for sure.

>>34306382
Why would I choose 458? it'd be so damn expensive to git gud with that. Nah it's 308 or nuffin

>>34305058
Except for shit reliability

>>34306382
>>34307266
Also I used to use an AK as my bear defense gun in Alaska. A few 7.62x39mm could put down a grizzly easy and I could walk the rounds into it as it charges.

>>34307270
(citation needed)


Anecdotal but my dad has had both since I was a wee lad (he hid them during the AWB) and neither had problems and they're both old with thousands of rounds put through them.

>>34304978
a scar is exactly 3k just bought one myself.

>>34307333
What did it come with? Do you have any experience AR patterns? how does it compare?

Also was it 3k including FFL and shipping? or did you get it from a Lgs?

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>>34306143
I was thinking of the UTAS xtr-12. I love the AR pattern because it drives the recoil back into your shoulder so I am biased towards it like a motherfucker. Would vepr be better?

>>34306092
You are correct sir hahaha.

>>34307368
theres much less customization but it doesnt really need it. i paid 25 for the transfer not included in the total price though you might be able to find it for less in those auction sites. came only with 1 mag, the lock and the user manual. each mag is around 40 bucks, theres not many producers so theres like other 2 which were cheaper but out of stock, same thing with triggers theres only 2: geissele and timney. i am looking for a pistol grip right now as i hate the A2 with a passion. its a little more power but obviously i have the 308 other than that its honestly top of the line. impossible to go wrong with it. if youre asking about the 223 then dont. it would be like buying a 6v mustang, you dont do that. for 223 go with a mp15 and thatll run you 560 bucks so youll have plenty to buy anything else that you need. in summary the scar 308 is better out of the box than any ar you can buy unless its a custom made ar

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>>34307789
I should add I got the scar for bears too if you're op, I do have 12 more shots with a dd mag but this just feels better imo.

>>34307789
Youve made a strong case, I'm intrigued. I think you just supplanted the PTR GI R as my choice. The expensive mags suck but whatever I only ever buy as many as I can fit in my chest rig. So like 5 including one in the rifle.

>>34307929
i was looking at ptrs too as well since i wanted the 308 and ended up with the scar, its just better though obviously it comes with the price tag.

>>34307866
I am OP, brown bear and moose are big concerns where I live. I also wanted a battle rifle because I intend for it to have a variety of roles. Defending my multi acre property, range trips, and hunting bear or moose so it was always going to be a 308.

>>34307956
Thanks for the advice

>>34307270
nice meme

>>34305131
SCAR 17S or go home. That will kill anything that needs killin'.

>>34307968
I would probably go bigger than .308 for hunting moose and large bears.(if you have grizzlies)
http://onlylongrange.com/bn36-long-range-assassin-300-win-mag-7mm-rem-mag/

>>34308055
No. My grandfather was a Bush pilot in Alaska and they lived a subsistence lifestyle most of what they ate was moose and sometimes bear, and he hunted them all with a 1903 springfield firing 30-06. 308 is fine.

>>34308055
I would nickname that gun "the wallet eliminator" as doing magdumps at the range is a good way to go broke. 300 win mag is 2x as expensive as 308

>>34304978
PSA, has a cheaper version that's just as good. Save some cash and use the leftover to buy more funs

>>34305058
The problem is that majority of those 7.62x39 AR's have magazine/feeding problems. And to be honest I wouldn't buy them anyway unless I was dead set on AR ergonomics in 7.62x39 rifle. The advantage of AR15 over AK really boils down to the advantage of 5.56 over 7.62x39 which becomes especially obvious once you've shot AK-74. Of course the mechanical accuracy etc. will be better on AR but we're talking about paying 3 times of what you'd have to spend for decent AK and I don't think the differences really make that investment worthwhile.

>>34309193
That's great and all, but if the gun is also going to be used for defending yourself from a moose/bear, great shot placement isn't going to be a guarantee and using a round with more energy will only help.