I looked at a Rock Island Armory 1911 today, and it seemed pretty

>>34202626
Both, but I would say it's diminishing returns. Consider rock island to be the cheapest you should go as far as 1911

>>34202626
Auto Ordnance

>>34202626
from a functional practical standpoint ria is fine. as a base for upgrading its not that great and you do get what you pay for. ria makes a crude gun.

>>34202636
Is the Rock Island as reliable as, say, a Colt Series 70? If I fire 1000 rounds through it, is it going to jam?

>>34202665
This. Not much more (if at all) but it's US Made.

It's actually quite good for the price, but spending a little more will get you some extra refinement. Honestly when I play with a $2000 1911 it doesn't feel any different than an $800 one.

>>34202677
RIA is reliable. They're G2G.

>>34202665
>>34202678
I won't buy a series 80 1911.

on the topic of RIA/Armscor, anyone have experience/opinions on the VR60 plus? I like the way it looks and really like the idea of having a cheap semi 12 gauge.

http://armscor.com/firearms/shotgun-series/vr60-plus-1-brown/

>>34202732
Ah. So you're one of those that listens to regurgitated bullshit on the internet.

>>34202732
http://rangehot.com/series-70-vs-80-the-difference-is-more-than-you-think/

>>34202732
Ive never understood this. Yes a 70 series has less parts. Its like a ford vs chevy vs dodge. You just dont see one broken any more than the other. 80 series guns run great. People that say otherwise most likely have no experience with either.

>>34202898
The series 80 safety sucks though and makes the trigger worse

>>34202977
No. They don't

>>34202998
Yes they do.

>>34202977
Maybe in a bullseye gun. Not for anything else. Not enough to make a difference to any but the very top shooters. If you arent a top ranked shooter it will not effect your shooting. If it did no one would shoot striker guns or da guns.

>>34202749
After looking that up, I'd say save the extra money and go for the UTAS XTR-12. Looks like you get more options for a similar design without paying Saiga prices.

>>34203048
The series 80 firing pin block is inferior to the Swartz firing pin block

>>34203071
No, it's not

>>34203071
If the gun is clean and oiled you will never know the difference between them. Also 80s fire fine even when dirty. If you remember back a year or so i posted that i put 6000 rounds through my 80s gold cup without cleaning. Just a little oil on slide, disconnecter and hammer. All reloads. Run fine. Stainless frame and slide.

>>34203071
Also stop believing everthing you read. Go experience it for yourself and learn from doing not from hearing.

>>34202626

At a gun store once I handled a $400 RIA 1911 and a $900 Kimber 1911

Aside from the grip material I didn't notice a difference big enough to justify the difference in price, and that's without shooting. Everything I've read about RIA 1911s over the years says they function fine even if they're not the prettiest. Gotta change out the grips though, the smooth stock grips suck. Otherwise they're great

>>34203164
People want to over complacent 1911s. Theres a reason theyve been used for so many years. Really isn't much to a 1911. Ramp, mags, extractor and springs are really the only reason a 1911 wouldnt function. Any one item can cause problems but all are easy to adjust if you understand 1911s. Some guns need to be played with at first then will function really well.
Dont believe the tight slide to frame myth either. To tight is worse than loose. Barrel bushing to barrel is what matters.

>>34203319
Over complicate

>>34203142
A firing pin block that is disengaged via grip safety will have less of an impact on the trigger pull than a firing pin block that is disengaged via the trigger.

>>34202626
RIA 1911s are quite good value for the price.
There's nothing special about them, they're a largely A1 style pistol that works just fine.

Precision is about as good as you can expect from a GI pistol, that is; reliably hitting a mansized target at up to 25yds, what it's meant to do. It's strength is that, true to a GI style gun, it's a bit loose and rattly to handle dirt.

As for more expensive ones, yeah, spending more will get you a nicer gun, a Ruger will be nicer, a Dan Wesson or Smith & Wesson brand 1911 will legit be better, and a Wilson Combat or Ed Brown will feel fantastic, and shoot pretty tight.

Kimber is a meme, don't buy their guns, they are polished turds with a high premium.

>>34202665
Oh yeah, Auto Ordnance is good.
Also the goofy-ass "Desert Eagle 1911G" line, which are all just perfectly good AO pistols that say "Desert Eagle" on the slide for some reason (I'm guessing the moonies got a bit drunk one evening).

>>34202672
Oh yeah, this, don't really bother with upgrading an RIA much, except perhaps if you hate the grips or want nicer mags.

>>34202677
They should work just fine. Occasionally they might have some rough edge left from manufacturing, but it's a cheap beater gun and you'll polish that off yourself.

>>34202665
>Auto Ord
Owned by the Moonies - part of Kahr.

I guess it's a personal decision as to if you prefer Moonies over Flips. I'd go for either one long before I went for a Springfield or a Kimber though.

>>34202626
I'm canadian.

Remington R1 has been on my bucket list for a while. It's about 8-900 syrups and my buddies seems to work really well.

I can't justify a non US made 1911 or I'd get a Sam or even norinco or Canuck cos they seem fine.

>>34203589
Like i said.... on a bullseye gun. Maybe. You do understand that we are talking about a trigger that moves 1/8in. Right? All the talk of gritty, rough, i can feel the difference. Its all bullshit. This is why all triggers are compared to a 1911. If you want to argue over the feel of a hinged trigger that i can understand. Lcp vs glock vs whatever else. 1911s pull straight back .125 in. Get real.

>>34202626

Hey OP. I'm going to echo what some of the Anons here are saying and confirm from my own experience that you do get what you pay for, but there's also a plateau around $800-$900 or so with 1911s beyond which you see diminishing returns.
I've owned a Springfield Armory 1911, and a genuine Colt. The Colt cost $400 more, but had a nicer feeling trigger that broke cleaner, a smoother action, and it pointed better.
Both guns ran fine, and put round after round after round downrange - but the Colt was better.
You'll notice a difference between a $400 gun and an $800 gun.
You probably won't between an $800 gun and a $1200 gun.
This only applies to military style 1911s. Other gun types are different.

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So what were getting at is the 400 buck ria 1911 will still run just fine because its prefection as made by our lord and savior john moses Browning. Its just not as clean as a 800 1200 dollar gun

Pic related. My browning lawn mower

You can get. Remington T12 Enhanced for 500$ right now, definitely the better option at that price point

>>34202788
Do do realize that people have been (justifiably) complaining about the firing pin block since before the internet was invented, right?
>>34202898
>80 series guns run great
No, they don't. They are distinctly inferior. The firing pin block is a solution in search of a problem.
>>34202977
This.
>>34203048
>no one would shoot striker guns or da guns.
Nobody who cares about accuracy does.

It's a good gun, but it also depends on what price you're paying for one.

I paid $325 for my RIA GI, and it is a great gun for that price.

Now, the same gun is $425, and that is not such a great deal.

I REALLY want to get one of their M206 revolvers, though. A little .38 snubbie to leave in the car or to kill pop cans or tree rats with.

>>34205555
>Armscor M206

Its finishing is worse than a high school shop class project, and it isn't rated for .38 Special +P. Yeah, it's cheap, but it's not like a Smith and Wesson snubnose is expensive either. You can buy a basic J-frame that weighs 10 oz. less and is a better gun in every way for ~$320 right now.

>>34202626
Functional, but if you have the money go higher. Beyond 1000 dollars you're either hitting where preference matters more than company, or you're into the 2500+ semi-custom (Les Baer, etc) companies. In between is things like Dan Wesson and some STI models. Ultimately don't buy Kimber, they have problems and I personally won't buy Springfield anymore either.

>>34205492
>lawnmower
Something tells me that lawns arent what that thing mows.

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>>34205492
Im going to side with this. If you wan a 1911 a rock island is a 45 1911 that will run just like a $800 1911.

It may not be as crisp or clean as a more expensive one but unless your a snob it dosent really matter. And this whole 70 vs 80 bullshit. Its all in your head. Ypur not going to miss your target because of the way the trigger is diffrent

Rock Island Armory is a name and a pretty good one at that.

>>34205154
If your 1911 has an 1/8 inch of creep, you need to get a trigger job or throw it away. Creep should be imperceptible.

>>34205539
>Do do realize that people have been (justifiably) complaining about the firing pin block since before the internet was invented, right?

You do realize that people have been regurgitating bullshit they've heard since before the internet was invented, right?

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>>34207996
Ohhhhh snap. Get #rekt

>>34202749
Their shotguns are shit. If you want an ar style shotgun like that get the Tristar KRX.

>>34202626
the battlefield vegas guys said that the more expensive 1911s dont last any longer than the ria ones

>>34208588
Well yes, both a RIA and a Wilson Combat are short recoil automatics made out of steel, fundamentally, they probably would wear quite similarly.

>>34205587
I've seen them for $200 frequently, so I'm thinking that it's targeted at poorfags.

The things seem to run though, and the heavy weight must make a light .38 Special feel like a .22LR

>>34204863
I don't mind giving money to hard working Flips if their product is good.

Kimber was however horribly gutted in the 2000s and are nothing like their former glory (they were actually really good and fairly priced in the 90s), they are now nothing but shoddy MIM disguised by polish and a swanky feeling trigger.

And Springfield are just traitors, fuck them.

here's a tour of the RIA 1911 factory if anyone is interested

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pq1TXEE_QK4&t=300s

>>34202626
Get a TISAS. Much better quality and they are cheaper.

I fucking seen RIA's around 300. It's not a fucking mosin or some zatsava bullshit where they had some old supply rebels wouldn't buy. They're no where near what the turks have done I'd at least consider it.

>>34202626
I remember reading their slides and frames are only spot hardened - not fully heat treated. And I'm sure there's plenty of MIM in there of questionable quality. Something like a Ruger SR1911 would probably be a big step up in quality yet still affordable, but an RIA would probably still be fine for dicking around at the range with.

I checked out an RIA in Cabelas a couple weeks ago and was surprised at how tight the slide was. It wasn't sloppy at all, no rattle when I wiggled it.

>>34209907
Tight slide doesn't mean shit if the gun is made of soft shitty steel though

>>34202626
>I looked at a mitsubishi lancer base model today, is there really that much difference between this and an evo X?

>>34203164
>My century RAS47 is totally the same as your Arsenal AK bro.

>>34207879
>I don't know how to read: The Post

>>34209858
It is fucking easy to heat treat metal, i could explain if you guys wanna know how.

>>34209936
Hmm what do you mean by soft steel, 1040 mild steel?

>>34212070
Feel free...though I'm not sure I'd trust myself to not fuck up a gun, personally

>>34212082
It's probably 4140, which is basically the standard in the firearms world. I mean the entire frame/slide isn't heat treated - like other, more expensive brands. And then there's the MIM parts, which I sincerely doubt is HK or SIG quality. May not matter to the occasional plinker, but then what really does? There's definitely a point of diminishing returns when it comes to 1911s(and guns in general), but I'd say you've gotta spend more than $500 to get there...

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>>34212237
all you need to do is first:

Change the oil in your car, the older and blacker the oil the better. Save the old oil, put it in a metal container. The depth of the oil needs to be at least half an inch or more the the width of whatever you're going to heat treat.

You'll want the flame of the torch to look like pic related. Don't try to use a cutting torch.

Continued.

>>34212006
I know you are, but what am I?

>>34212307
sick brun bro

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>>34212302
Next, take the piece of steel you want heat treated and start running the torch back and forth. You want it to heat up as evenly as possible. Dont let the torch sit in one spot, and work it from all angles, be sure to flip your piece over every 30 seconds or so of heating. The picture from the post above shows the proper flame and distance to keep your torch from your part.

Keep doing this until your part glows a nice soft orange. Dont worry it will become a bright yellow before it actually becomes malleable to the point of it losing form. Pic related shows a very safe level of heat for treating. I would personally get it a bit hotter but thats me.

Once you get your part simply quench it in the blackest, most carbon filled motor oil you can get your hands on and you are done. The oil might catch fire so be sure to do this on concrete in a metal container. A fiberglass blanket is nice for smothering the flames, alternately you can just put a metal cap on your container. For the record i typically just use a metal folgers coffee can and a 10 lb weight from my bench press so long as my part can fit in it.

Anyhow, let it all cool and you're finished

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>>34212237
the battlefield vegas armorers said that the RIA 1911's were their toughest ones and the Sigs are the second toughest

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>>34212471
The barrels are thick as hell, im supremely pleased with mine.

>>34212471
So inferior production methods produce more durable guns? I find that very hard to believe,

>>34212237
The entire frame doesn't need to be heat treated though, only the portions that rub other parts when you rack/fire it.

>>34212570
that's what they said and they put hundreds of thousands of rounds through them each month

>>34212411
Thanks man. Gonna grab a bunch of shitty knives and see if a heat-treat will help anything with their ahite edge retention.

>>34212654
with knives the general rule i use is, if it wont rust, it wont hold an edge. Heat treating will help, but dont be surprized if it gets brittle.

Industrial files can be turned into very good knives. First you anneal them by getting them orange hot, then let them cool as slowly as possible. Repeat 3 or four times, grind out the shape of your knife, then heat treat the edge. You get a blade that will hold a very sharp edge and will bend before breaking.

>>34212471
Are you saying that video game makers are experts on firearm durability?

>>34213518
they run a high volume rental range in vegas and the owner makes threads on ar15.com to to tell how long various guns and parts last before they fail. he said they shoot around 500k-600k rounds per month. also the armorers that work there make youtube videos about the guns sometimes

vhttp://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2015/06/03/how-many-rounds-can-an-ak-fire-before-it-breaks-down/

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2015/09/08/ar-endurance-findings-at-a-rental-range/

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2016/01/12/battlefield-las-vegas-optics-report/

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2015/09/16/handgun-experiences-from-battlefield-las-vegas/

>>34204908
>Remington
Enjoy rust and half-assed MIM parts

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>>34205539
>Nobody who cares about accuracy does.

>>34209310
Yeah but Turks

>>34211905
>implying an RIA is RAS47 tier
>implying a Kimber is Arsenal tier
>implying Kimber isn't garbage tier