Whats is the best alternative for G19? FN509 or P320?

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PPQ 9mm M1

>>34126324
The FN 509 is unproven.
I'd take the FNS until it's been out for a while.

>>34126324
P320

>>34126324
Mauser C96

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Steyr M9, it's basically the same thing but with A S T H E T I C

>>34126392
hnnnng

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>>34126324
hickok45, the #1 glock fan
recently bought FN509
did he also buy P320?
i think so
pic related to glock manufacturing process

none
/thread

everything

Literally doesn't matter the differences between all wondernines are statistically insignificant.

>>34126354
Looks to me like that M2 on top (button instead of paddle, correct?) is getting a lot more use than the M1s.

>>34126633
>are statistically insignificant
What does that mean? Why would statistics be relevant?

>>34126640
Your public education is showing.

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>>34126638
The can yes, the 45 no. The 40 and 22 not so much either. The 9mm gets used frequently.

>>34126324
>>34126354
>>34126392
Any of these guns are great. The CZ P10C too.
All of them have great to decent triggers, ambi controls, good ergo.

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Why does everyone ask about the g19 when the g17 is a better choice?

>>34126324
There is something about the 509 that I really like.

>>34126324
>sig vs fn
FN every time

>>34126746
Every FN time?

>>34126760
Puns always leaves me in a saur mood.

>>34126765
And I fucking misspelled it, god damn it.

>>34126354
Where did you get threaded barrel for ppq45? are those being sold stock now?
>jumps onto Google machine

>>34126773
All of them are jarvis except the 22 which was factory.

>are those being sold stock now?
Not sure but I doubt it.

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FNS

>>34126791
Just looked it up. Lack of threaded barrel was the only thing holding me back from the ppq 45. How does it compare to the 9? That's the only one I've shot and loved it, but was hoping to add the 45 and suppress, otherwise I'm getting the fnx

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>>34126837
Ya they havent been out for THAT long but they are now. Grips are a little bigger and the button sucks compared to the paddle. If you're going to buy a ppq to shoot, get a 9mm. As much as I love walther, it wouldnt be my first choice for a 45. Never shot a fnx but sig also makes some great options.

>>34126765
You beretta be kidding, puns are garand!

>>34126392
>got into guns too late to ever find an M9 in the wild
>no one ever adopted them
Such a beautiful gun resigned to an ignoble death.

>>34126953
They're still in production. Steyr actually ran a mail-in-rebate over memorial day for them. It might still be available?

There's like nil for aftermarket though.

>>34126760
You clowns are a diamond dozen.

>>34126371
>>34126794
509 is just a highly refined FNS with 6 gorillian rounds of testing, a match crown and like stuff. It's good.

>>34126324
G23, G32
G38 if you live in a mag cap ban state
nobody makes a gun that competes directly with the G19

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>>34126324

>>34127325
>>34127341
except Steyr, apparently

>>34127050
Does it still have the retarded 2k round gunsmith check or no warranty clause in the user manual?

Cause if it is, I'm not gonna lie, that's a fucking deal breaker for me. Stand by your fucking gun or don't sell it. Hipoint and Glock warranties are the standard. Get with the program FN.

>>34128335
>2k round gunsmith check or no warranty clause in the user manual

Come on, seriously? How does that 2nd option even work?

>>34127341
> Defense factor
> Nearly off the scale
> Paint it red

Steyr confirmed for believing their gun should be the pay-to-win DLC.

>>34126324
why are you choosing pistols in a higher tier., better contest would be ppq, m&p etc

>>34128407
Maybe he has a different tier system.

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>>34126714
>it's a "I CC a full sized handgun" episode

>>34126324
FN509, VP9, PPQ
>>34128407
I'd put the PPQ in a higher tier than glock

>>34128449
>not shoving a Mark 23 with a suppressor down your pants

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>>34128470
>I'd put the PPQ in a higher tier than glock
I really wouldn't

>>34128335
lol are that guy that purposefully broke his fns9 and bitch that the warranty didn't cover it?

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>>34128449
> He doesn't wear button down plaid shirts, a different color for each day of the week, that come halfway down his thighs year round.

I bet you don't even tailor your entire wardrobe around muzzle velocity and capacity, you filthy casual.

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>>34128470
>I'd put the PPQ in a higher tier than glock


Would you call it a "sniper's pistol"?

>>34128393
That infograph isn't from Steyr. It's from a gun info website.

>>34126324
p320 compact or cz p10c

>>34128500
If you had to waive someone off of buying the Walther, what would you tell them specifically.

>>34126324
The 509 is just a glock wannabe that really does nothing special. Same with the P320. Ignore the fact that the P320 is modular and easy to swap calibers/configurations and a better trigger, or that the FN is ambidextrous with steel sights and a better grip than the glock. There is nothing different or special than those guns and their aftermarket sucks.

>>34128634
>Ignore the fact that the P320 is modular and easy to swap calibers/configurations and a better trigger, or that the FN is ambidextrous with steel sights and a better grip than the glock.
Damn dude, you just convinced me to get both the P320 and FN 509.
Thanks!

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>>34128576
Buy a P99. I wasn't a huge fan of the PPQ. I could not get the grip to fit right in my hands no matter which backstrap I put on it. The trigger pull actually left something to be desired, however the reset and the break were great.

So aside from me not caring for the grip and the trigger pull which I think is overrated, I had problems with F2F's. Pic related is an example. I was getting rounds feeding straight up every now and then and the slide would return home on them and would dent and sometimes puncture the cartridge.

That said, I'd buy a P99 instead if I was going to get a Walther again. My old roommate still has his PPQ M1 that has been flawless. I'm not holding it against the company just because mine had some issues. But even shooting mine and his, I was less than impressed after the initial excitement over the trigger passed and I realized it was a little overrated.

I think the VP9 is nicer, but it's a little larger if memory serves me correctly. The PPQ did carry nicely, but I still prefer the 19 in just about every way, but ymmv.

Also, I'd say skip the Walther and Go VP9, P2k or P30. Or get the FNS, it's pretty nice too. But I really like my Glock 19 as well, you may not though. That's okay.

>>34128655
>Buy a P99. I wasn't a huge fan of the PPQ. I could not get the grip to fit right in my hands no matter which backstrap I put on it.
Buy a gun
because of
somebody
else's hand
size
what the hell?

>>34128634
the glock is the same as those 2 guns except without the features u mentioned and with shit ergonomics so why buy it when you could get something thats equal or better in every way

>>34128683
>Didn't care for grip, trigger is overrated, gun had failure to feeds, gun was just less than impressive and overrated
>Suggests P99 as the nicer Walther
>Focus only on grip as argument to post

>>34128655
Thanks for the info. I'll look into some of the other options before I make my purchase. I did not like the weird groove thing beneath the trigger on the VP9 when I rented it though, so that one's out for me.

>>34128501
Nobody purposefully broke anything you mouth breather

FN has shit CS and built the entire FNS line to have a lifespan of 15k rounds, they are a joke

>>34128486
The suppressor has to come out of his unzipped fly

I've never been one to talk like this but is all the 509 love coming out of nowhere less than authentic? Just a bit ago people would respond "literally who" or dismiss it immediately because it's FN, now I see threads talking about how great it is when it looks like a Glock made even more generic.

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>>34129679
I think it's a great looking gun and the grip is perfect. The factory sights are good. Hickok45 said he really likes it, MAC really likes it, I really like it.
The factory sights are huuge, tall and have lots of air around the front, which I like. I like the that it has a match crown, flared machined barrel, good trigger and controls that actually work.
The trigger is good once broken in too.

>>34126324
Tp9

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>>34129808
And as much as I like the factory sights, it's got dovetails that will take the sig x-ray 3 sights, aka best sights ever.

>>34129814
Canik elite or sf may be good guns but it's like buying a Hyundai. Sure, it's a fine product but I don't really want one.

>>34129834
>FN pistol
>dovetail for Sig sights
why

Also,
>best sights ever
They're just Trijicon HDs but with rounded sides so they're harder to install.

100 buck rebate on ppq and pps

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7T2h5Nk6jQ

>>34129616
They literally fired over a million rounds in testing and had zero malfunctions you twat

>>34130750
Nice, just in time for a new pocket pistol.

>>34126324

CZ-75.

>>34130814
He said FNS, not 509.

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>>34130814

jesus christ, no they didn't, not at all.
they tested "the gun" - as in many pistols of that model, multiples, with what they are now claiming and is most likely over a million rounds fired, I guarantee that's not from one gun and certainly not no malfunctions kek.

Call FN yourself, press them about the slogan "500,000 rounds tested" (for the FNS) and now "1,00,000 rounds tested" (for the 509) - call the armorers at FN and ask them if that testing was in any way similar to the way you are describing it (as some kind of insane 1 gun gauntlet).

They are very well designed, great shooting guns, but lifespan leaves a lot to be desired and CS is a shit show. I talked to another FN employee about the 509 and he suggested it had a lot longer lifespan than the FNS, I hope he's on the level, maybe it's the same design with higher quality parts internally, looks to me like an FNS with a body kit.

While I haven't handled a 509 every birds eye shot of the slide or frame's internals looks extremely similar to the FNS if not exact, take that for what it;s worth.

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>>34131128
Seriously, a million rounds through one gun would be unprecedented by an order of magnitude.
When TLG ran 90,000 through a P30, HK flipped their shit and was super loud about the fact that it was all through one gun.
If FN doesn't explcitly claim that all million rounds were through one gun, then there's literally no possibility that's the case.

>>34126324
I'm surprised no one responded with just "Glock 19"

I would go for the SIG

>>34131190
N.b. >>34127325

>>34128393
genitron.com
Very nice site, but it lacks newer handguns.

>>34130599
Rounded sides makes them better, draws your eyes naturally to the front. They're better than the trijicons. Also they used an existing relatively common dovetail so there would already be an existing aftermarket on release day. Oh, and they fit in a lot of Glock holsters AND apex is already making triggers for them, not that you need one.

>>34131128
>>34131189
That's how I took it too, just a million rounds of testing and it shows. The gun feels refined and is a nice shooter. I've only got < 500 rounds through mine but I love it. I have no doubt that it's better than the fns which I never had any interest in for some reason.
I agree with you about the absolute shit customer service though. I've called twice during normal hours with a general technical question because I'm curious about a seemingly pointless notch in the barrel, still no answer or call back but I'm telling you as an owner, there's something right about this gun and I've owned a lot including the p30, p2000, several cz's and Glocks.
I hope you're wrong about life span and honestly don't think you really have anything to base an opinion on for this gun at the moment.

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>>34131674
The notch btw

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>>34131690

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>>34131189
Goddamn I really love the P30.

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>>34128634
You know what the P320 can do though? Win the largest small arms contract the DoD has put out in decades.

>>34126324
>>34126746
>FN
2 0 0 0
0 b
0 u
0 l
l
e
t
s

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>>34132037

I had to switch the left side slide stop lever out on my 2, now I'm all in.

>>34132205
What did you switch it with?

>>34132037
Side panels creek and are unnecessary.
PPQ doesn't have them; nobody complains

>>34132225
>Side panels creek
OK?
>and are unnecessary.
Sure, anything but a crude wooden grip is unnecessary, but I like the grip on my P30. I have a medium on the right and a small on the left, fills my hand like no other pistol I've handled.

>PPQ doesn't have them; nobody complains
Nobody owns the PPQ so how can they complain?

>>34132252
Are you implying they creak?

>>34126324
Glock 23

>>34132269
No they crikt

>>34132269
No they croak

>>34128507
This post made my rail gun tingle.

I like new things, I say the The CZ P10C.
I've always thought pistols were dumb unless you also have a carbine for timed competitive shooting with it. .380, ar15 and (maybe) shotgun is my 3 weapons of choice, but i live in commieville so maybe my inexperience is clouding my judgment.

>>34132220
The "S" slide lock/release.

https://www.hkparts.net/shop/pc/Slide-Release-Left-HK-P30-P30L-P30SK-Short-205p2486.htm

>>34132225
>side panels creak
Ask me how I know you don't own one. The PPQ isn't in the same league as the P30. Why would you want less user friendly features on a handgun?

>>34132350
>pistols were dumb unless you also have a carbine for timed competitive shooting with it
I have basically the opposite opinion: a pistol (with a light) is usable for home defense, but a rifle is more trouble to conceal than it's worth; pistols are practical in and of themselves, while shoulder guns are merely nice to have.

>>34126392

>just bought AUG
>sort of want to see if the atrax will be worth fucking with
>now I want a M9-A1

Fuck me I guess.

>>34132395
Nice. Do your thumbs ride too high and hit the standard slide release?

I love mine, only problem and I haven't determined if it's me or not, but as it heats up the shots starting wandering to the left. I thought I was getting too fast and slowed it down for a magazine but it kept doing it. I gotta do more shooting to figure it out.

>>34132225
>he doesn't know the creek point is basically an Illuminati tier award ceremony for training and shooting with your gun to a higher standard than the plebian masses

>>34132406
> Why would you want less user friendly features on a handgun.

Honest question since I own neither, aside from a short travel/ clean breaking trigger, comfortable grip, easy to grasp slide, and easy to see sights, what's really left for ergonomics on a pistol?

At what point are you just putting more shit on a power drill to outsell the next guy?

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>>34132442
>Nice. Do your thumbs ride too high and hit the standard slide release?

I have lanklet mits, needed the space to get my strong hand thumb out of the goddamn way,

>>34132406
WRONG
I know because I owned one.
Shoot it more.

>>34129616
all guns will malfunction without proper upkeep or maintenance

>>34132465
Hk snobs have to believe their "investment" is better than a gun costing half as much with a better trigger.
Ask them to explain why then laugh at them.
Hk does have nice barrels though.

>>34132491
lmao. You sound like your trying to justify getting rid of a good gun.

>>34132515
You never know. I remember when a cheap red laser guide on a drill press was the best time saver ever, so maybe there's something I'm missing.

>>34132515
Poorfags have to believe that they're somehow paying half as much and getting the same quality.

>>34132535
Look, I'll give Hk props for having a very strong polygonal barrel with tight tolerances. As pistols go, the have the best barrels but the other brands are close.
Their triggers, p30 specifically, aren't that good but it's partially because they use heavy springs which I guess is maybe extra reliable. The vp9 doesn't and it's their least reliable gun imo.

Meanwhile, ppq has similar ethos and aesthetic, is plenty reliable and has a better trigger for half the price. At some point you have to ask if Hk buyers are just brand whoring and in my opinion most are.

>>34132513
10-15k rounds is the mainspring change out point for (brands redacted) all the main competitors, stuff like S&W hits on the lower end of the spectrum but still insanely well beyond 15k as a gun life, 15k is a fucking mainspring life with serious competitor.

FN wanted me to buy a slide for $380 (dropped to $180 after I bitched) at that (15k) lifespan mark. Make of this info what you will. I'm out time for breadsticks.

>>34132608
Did you post the story about the $380 fee on another gun forum?

>>34132607
>Their triggers, p30 specifically, aren't that good but it's partially because they use heavy springs which I guess is maybe extra reliable.
Which trigger pack? My LEM V1 is 4.5lbs and breaks cleanly. Reset is a smidge long but that's because it's DA.

>>34132607
Also, name another model or brand that has shot 90k rounds through a single gun like the P30? That's a pretty big feather for HK to put in their hat.

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>>34126746
That's cute, how long ago did mommy teach you to turn the computer on?

>>34132607
Honestly a good trigger is the last thing on my mind when I buy a gun for defense. In my experience they're nothing but trouble as far as light primer strikes go. A P30 isn't twice the price of a PPQ either. Although it's not as aesthetic, the PPQ is a top notch gun and I went back and forth between buying a PPQ and the P30L I have now. Also the grips always put my hand and trigger finger in just the right spot with the right grip panels on.

On a side note the machining on the inside of an HK slide is just gorgeous to look at.

>>34129843
Nice

>>34132640
The second iteration of lem is a good trigger but it's just a SAO trigger with a lighter spring set is it not? It still has a long reset?
My p30 was da/sa but even in sa it had a ton of creep with a long reset. My p2000 was one of the first lem triggers, different from current, and it was a very hard wall at the end of a long pull.

>>34132665
A bunch of Glocks have I'm sure.

>>34132682
That's fair enough

>>34132682
>In my experience they're nothing but trouble as far as light primer strikes go

How many of those are you running into though? CCI primers are notorious for this, but in 2000 rounds of par-at-best Blazer training ammo, I haven't had one yet with a 6lbs trigger.

>>34132706
It's technically a DAO, but Glock is technically a DAO so it's not really a good descriptor.
>My p30 was da/sa but even in sa it had a ton of creep with a long reset
There's your problem. The gun was designed with the LEM, DA/SA was added as an afterthought. There's no defending the V3 trigger.
>>34132726
>A bunch of Glocks have I'm sure.
Probably, good thing my other gun is a Glock. Point is tho that most haven't and the PPQ certainly hasn't.

>>34132763
Honestly, it's mostly been a problem with sigs.

>>34132767
When LEM came out the hammer spring stayed compressed at all times and you pulled the trigger back without compressing the mainspring until it reached the point it engaged and broke. It was a very hard break with a long reset. I call that single action. However now that I recall it could be fired in true double action at like a 12 pound weight or something so I guess it was da/as.

>>34131189
this.

and if FN did perform the test magically with 1 pistol / barrel they would be the first people to be selling it based on that exact point, not "hurr arbitrary amount of testing with no context"

>>34132832
I remember trying my friend's Sig (don't ask me which one). All metal gun, with absolutely beautiful wood grips. I felt amazing in the hand, heavy in the same way that quality metal piping feels over PVC.

But 2nd magazine in and bullets start pulling up and to the right. I remember thinking nothing that felt that solid and steady should have that problem.

>>34132435
Fair warning, some earlier models had problems with the extractor. I'm told they've ironed that out in newer models though.

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>>34126354

Came here to post exactly this.

>MFW I will never have an PPQ M1 Navy

>>34132856
>the two-part hammer is pre-cocked every time the slide moves rearward. Or a smooth 4.5- 5.5 pounds if the operator opts for the lighter trigger pull configuration.

So one piece of the hammer is under tension all the time and you finish cocking it when you pull the trigger.

>>34131690
>>34131906
Barrel locking lug, like on a 1911.

Frankly them refusing to warranty their last line of striker fired guns that haven't been inspected at their factory every 2,000 rounds is enough for me to be highly suspicious of them in the near future. That doesn't sound much like standing behind your product to me. No reason for me to take a chance over that if i can find a gun that works as well for the same use.

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>>34126324
cz-p10c

>>34128646
>>34128690
>>34132155
You guys can't spot a ruse can you?

>>34133683
Yeah that's what I thought but the slide is smooth.

Glocks and P320 are going to fight for contracts and be the 2 duty striker fired pistols in the future I think. The aftermarket for the P320 is growing and will continue to grow for the pistol because the popularity is skyrocketing. There are already drop in triggers to reduce pull weight and such from grayguns and apex but the gun doesn't need it if you're looking for a duty or simple home defense/concealed carry option - all you really need are magazines and holsters.

The problem I have with FN pistols is that they seem to release new models to quickly where parts and magazines are not compatible. Maybe if FN is serious about their 509 and continues to support it by bringing additional models and if government contracts are awarded to them then it'll be worth it for me to pick one up. But this will be several years down the road where there are no signs of revisions or a new remake is in the works.

*Heavy sigh*
Are we gonna do this all summer?
Look, G19 is a good gun. If it doesn't tickle your fancy, go with a Beretta 92FS or a Springfield XD or literally almost any fucking 9mm pistol on the market. Hell, you can even go with a Hi-Point C9, just don't be proud of it or expect to CC easily . Or if you want to go Kardashian, get a Sig. Maybe get diamond encrusted sights and shoot 24k gold jacketed ammo. Nobody fucking cares. It's a wondernine. Like, do you want a woman with a landing strip, Brazilian, or full vee? B cup or double D? Interchangeable until you figure out your own neurotic "needs."
There is literally no significant difference outside your preferences for capacity, concealability, and feel. The terminal ballistics are identical and ammo choice means more by far. Even then, just fucking get 9mm ball, or be the kind of douche that installs a special air filter on his Mustang because "muh horsepower percentage."
There's something to be said for the idea that placing a deep hole, 4/10 of an inch wide, in or through an opponent, gains little additional benefit from microanalysis.

>>34133738
It was only a recommendation for the fns if you read the owners manual.

That language is not in the 509 owners manual.

I called FN and she more or less said they recommend it, that the consumer service the gun because they get a lot of heavily abused/neglected guns but they will service the firearms. She implied but politely stopped short of saying you're full of shit. At any rate they took that language out of the 509 owners manual.

>>34135154
>OP wants a plastic striker 9mm
>heres a metal frame hammer, a grip safety and a blow back, dont worry its all the same

>Or if you want to go Kardashian, get a Sig.
A 500 hundred gun is kardashian? Shit you must poor.

>>34127050
Huh, really makes me think.
You've convinced me anon, 509 is awesome or something.

>>34135352
Maybe he meant a Sig 1911? They still make those, correct?

>>34135402
Maybe, but 'just get a 1911' is even dumber than his other recommendations, so I hope not. He's thinking of the p226 (still a sub thousand dollar gun) but forgot the p320 is a thing even though its in the OP.

>>34126392
>Steyr M9,
Is it made by Stahl industries on Helghan?

How much will it set me back?

>>34126907
Stupid question.

When you use the de cocker to drop the hammer and it slips the whole distsance can it fire?

I ask because i lost my index and middle finger.

>>34135441
If the p320 is the next big thing, why is it's MSRP $400 less than the p226? Just the polymer grip?

>>34135458
No, it has a rebounding hammer so when you decock the hammer doesnt come in contact with the firing pin...plus the firing pin block. After you decock it's in double action.

>>34135502
I have no idea. M9's are 500 bucks...maybe its just the DOD contract thing.

>>34135441
I'm willing to call any pistol over $800 at the shop pretty damn Gucci when I consider lost opportunity cost for a nice rifle. Maybe not Weatherby and cognac gucci, but definately Browning BLR/X-bolt territory.

>>34126714
I like my 26 better than the 19. That shorter grip makes it dissapear.

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p80s if you can't get a real glock, anything else is just inferior/

>>34128527
WROLGTW Brah