if shotguns are so great how come no military uses them outside

They are great for house breaching?

>>34033927
Shotguns are great for non military reasons

>>34033927
Because the military expects to fight armoured targets

Because Shotguns don't have the same effective range that rifles are capable of

>>34033927
wait for trench warfare to come back

>>34033927
I love a good shotgun, but desu they are kinda restricted in how effective they are. Like submachine guns they just don't hold up to an AR

>>34033927
They are versatile for hunting. Only bubba think they are the ULTIMATE METAL GEAR WEAPON for warfare.

>>34033933
Load them with powdered steel slugs and they are wunderbar for getting through locks and hinges. When you don't want to carry around doorknocker charges.

>>34033941
/Thread

>>34033927
Try duck hunting with an ar-15

>>34034046
That only implies that you don't just shoot the ducks as they rest. A shotgun is fine for flying targets but last time I checked duck had to land sometime.

If theres a conflict were its strictly house to house urban warfare or maybe a thick jungle I bet they'd make a bit of a come back

>>34034061
Not going to land anywhere near the dude with the loud ass rifle.

(Yeah the AR is louder than my mossberg)

shotguns are perfect home defence weapons

>>34034087
It makes noise when you aren't shooting it?

>>34034092
This fag can only kill one.


Lolol lolol

>>34034087
.... You're just being unrealistic. If I had the option a net cast under a pond would be much more effective; but we're talking about one or two ducks for a meal to last a few days...
What does it matter if the rifle is loud if your intention is to just shoot two or three of them. They come back in about twenty minutes anyway. You're talking about sport hunting.

>>34033947
it wont

>>34033927
Because they discovered during WW2 that most modern conflicts take place between 200-300 meters, so they need a gun that can be useful up to at least 300 meters.

>>34034099
>Brings home one duck
>Spends hours calling it, setting decoys....

And of course waiting for it to land.

To hit it with a rifle....

>Ends up buying a .410 upper for his ar that ends up costing twice as much as a moss 500

>>34034115
Where the fuck do you live? Do you not have duck constantly annoying the fuck out of you with their calls and filling up your good fishing spots?
Where I live they're so common you can't go more than 10 minutes without a group passing over you or landing in the water near you.

I seriously doubt you've ever hunted. You don't need to 'set decoys' or call for them lmao

>>34034115
Also, if it's that hard to get duck in your area, maybe they're just not in your climate as readily as others like I said in >>34034128
If they're not super common you might be wasting your fucking time. Hunt something else. Deer?

We used them (Britfag army) in Afghan. We had them pretty much zeroed for centre mass at 100m with solid shot and used them for compound clearances with buck - worked great thanks to their narrow passageways.

We also uses them when fighting through fields and wadis as nothing stops a drugged up Pakistani insurgent better than a solid shot to the chest. 5.56m wasn't stopping them and it got to the stage where the point man was the GMPG gunner just to stop the fuckers in their tracks.

>>34034137
Southern California. We don't have ponds in the wild anymore. We have man made ponds with ducks, but I can't just walk into nobu or wherever off of rodeo and start picking off ducks

>>34034208
How about hunt something else then idiot.
Or better if you want to hunt and not be a tourist about it; move.

>its so hard to find duck
>because we have no ponds/lakes and I don't have my own land to even hunt on
Huh no shit.

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>>34033927
>how come no military uses them outside of house breaching.

My job as a maintainer in the USAF required posting sentry guards as a secondary duty. We used the M870 (870 MCS) exactly like pic related for close-in sentry duty. Primary security was run by the cops who had the M4 and M240B. The close-in sentry was just the last line of denial. We also kept shotguns inside the maintenance bays just in case.

I'm sure the reasoning behind using the shotguns is that they required very little training to operate and hit anything. Required training for us as only once a year and we only shot like 8 rounds before we were good for the year.

>>34033927
If pistols are so great, why do they only go to officers, SOF, and support? Different weapons are good at different things

>>34034310
Base LE carry pistols, too, dummy.

>>34034459
Too right, because they're better for that than rifles. Different jobs, different weapons.

Shotguns are not really going to shine if you expect to fight like the military (firepower, handling, armor, rate of fire, etc)

But its versatile in civilian capacity.
With correct shells, you are able to use it for general self defense and small to large game hunting. Does it outperform dedicated rifles for such applications? Not really, but you have a gun where you can go from birdshot to a magnum slug in seconds.

>>34034218
Do you know how much money it takes to have a goddamn property that you can hunt on in California?

My property is like 125feet by 125 feet and ran me over half a million....and it's not even in a super luxe area.

Like downtown San Diego a similar sized living space would be at least a million

>>34034076
I'd still go for an SBR

In Urban close quarters combat a shotgun with the shortest barrel possible is the most destructive weapon.
A double barrel shotgun with a short barrel could be a destructive weapons on the hands of a hit and run team.
Don't underestimate "fudd" guns, they have a place and a purpose.

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>>34034234
>that they required very little training to operate and hit anything
this is why no one takes the airforce seriously lol

>>34034536
Isn't the air Force fucking all the women while the army/marines sit in the dirt ?

>>34034102
I'll fight you

>>34034234
Security Forces are not cops, they are security. It's in the name. Please stop helping them spread their lies.

>>34034511
>get told the way theyre doing something is completely wrong
>get told to move away from shit state if they want to hunt duck a natural way
>'dood do u know how much property costs here?!?!'
Move. Just move that's all it takes.

>>34033927

Your use of redundant is suboptimal. I think you mean they are specialized.

They are specialized for close combat such as house breaching. There are such a thing as specialized weapons.

A sniper rifle is not "redundant" because it is mainly used for long shots.

A pistol is not "redundant" because it is mainly used as a weapon of last resort.

An auto-rifle is not "redundant" because it is mainly use to suppress.

Here are plenty of pics of shotguns being used in the specialized way that they excel at.

https://www.google.com/search?q=shotguns+in+iraq&rlz=1CATAAB_enUS685US685&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjrw4iR7YPUAhWB7oMKHd8wDWUQ_AUICygC&biw=1200&bih=585

>>34034554
Quit my job and turn my back on every relationship I have so I can go be unemployed in a shit hole state in the Midwest.

Nobody in Kansas gives a shit about my college education from California

>>34033927
They are great for shooting birds and shieet.

>>34034099
what if you use 5.56 to wound a duck and kill all the ducks trying to help the wounded duck

>>34033927

You can use them in riots and shit too, but thats mostly police.

They tried to make them work with Frag-12 ammo but i don't know if that is actually a thing.

>>34034115
>not just using a de lisle

>>34034536
Why would they spend the money and diverting the man-hours to train POGs that have no realistic probability of engaging in a fire fight?

>>34034589
Look there is an obvious divide here. Either you're looking for a job market in a place where you expect to not be able to hunt and game like normal; or you move somewhere where there is less of a job market but more of a hunting and gaming community.

Do not blame everyone else but yourself for your warped perspective. You've done this to yourself.
>spend hours calling ducks and setting up decoys
>doesn't understand how they're retarded because ducks are the easiest thing in the world to hunt besides firewood
Gee anon. You've totally lost yourself.
What do you even do that you cant just do from home? Probably some computer bullshit that makes you feel high and mighty while us in the sticks are providing your food at a 8x markup lmao.
Enjoy your espresso.

>>34034589
If you had any real meaningful relationships you wouldn't be namefagging on a Croatian history wiki.

>>34034550
Sure, but not from a trench

>>34033927

what the fuck is the faggot in this pic doing

>>34034589
>i can only do my job in california
.... are you a liberal barista or what? What fucking careers are limited to only california lmao what a waste of a degree.

Had you said 'this is my home' or anything that actually made sense and didn't make you a wage slave; that would have been different.

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>>34034841

>>34034046
Once shot a flying goose with a 10/22, what do I win?

>>34033927
Because using shotguns is a war crime.

>>34034864

Trying to convince the gullible that the most complex, uncomfortable, unnatural stance is the best stance.

He will teach you, but it will cost you.

If you disagree you obviously are a noguns, fudd, low speed high drag failure.

Why do 3-gun queers hold the handguard like that? Seems stupid.

>>34035012
How so? My brother served alongside some Poles in Afghanistan and one of them carried a polish 870 clone as his primary.

>>34034600
War...war never changes

>>34035107
Marginally faster to switch between targets. You do that a lot in 3gun and every fraction of a second counts.

>>34033927
Military has different needs from civilians, doofus.

>>34033927
Military doesn't need to hunt birds in flight and deer with the same gun.

>>34035107
Faster transitions and better recoil management. Easier to control a stick when you're holding it near the ends.

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>>34034061
>shooting ducks on the water
May as well go to the nearest farm and "hunt" cows

>>34034600
Underrated

>>34034511
Half a fucking million dollars for a fucking shoe box..... You are a fucking idiot.

>>34035012

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! The Germans tried that complaint in WWI because they were butthurt faggots.

What next? you gonna tell me landmines are against the law?

>>34034087

>Won't land anywhere near because the rifle is loud
>The rifle
>The thing that shoots other things that move faster than sound
>Hear
>Something faster than sound

Nigger what?

>>34034234
Great fucking shotgun. I missed an opportunity to get one just like except for it had traditional speedfeed stock.

>>34035107
SPEEEEEEED

>>34033951
>desu

STOP! FUCKING STOP!

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>>34034841
>will anon ever recover?
>will trenches regain their lost pride?
>have the keks ever been higher?
Find out next time on bant post z!

>>34033927
He's finna' rip them britches

>>34034589
That depends on what degree you have, if it's something useful like STEM, Kansas City is the fastest growing city in the US. But if it's a Liberal Arts degree you can get fucked.

>>34034600
Very underrated.

>>34037061
>being this new

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>>34034841
Oh snap.

>>34034511
depends where you live anon. buy property in bum fuck ass no where and its cheaper. Blythe < Temecula

>>34037061
Problem senpai?

>>34037281
I remember the days desu of spamming it on /b/, not just desu intersecting it into every sentence serving literally desu zero purpose desu

>>34033927
the marines use them fro breaching, checkpoints and city fighting. they also use them to shoot feral dogs.

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>>34034841
oh shit thats great

>>34034102
>t. someone who hasn't been paying attention to the Ukraine for the past three years

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>>34034536
>jet mechanics aren't soldiers hurr durr useless airforce.
shut the fuck up you filthy nonner

>>34037340
>Shitty rebels with Russian surplus gear
VS
>Soviet-tier army.

Truly the clash of these titans will shows us what the future hold-

The military doesn't shoot birds or sometimes durr.

>ywn see the military bring in shotguns and trained skeet shooters in order to protect against ever increasing numbers of suicide drones

>>34034167
What model shotgun did Britfags use?

>>34034552
OP wasn't a cop, he was a maintainer and they have far too much to do without becoming infantry.

>>34035012
>Because using shotguns is a war crime.

Prove it since you made the assertion. We'll wait.

t.actually read the Geneva and Hague Conventions.

>>34037766
The Air Force have BASH (Bird Air Strike Hazard) teams which do shoot birds overseas.

My bro spent most of a deployment killing birds in Iraq with a pellet rifle. His toll is somewhere in the thousands. Their trigger fingers got sore enough him and his team member switched back and forth.

>>34037280
Temecula is still pretty pricey. I was looking at a property in the wine country thing they have out there (it's like 20 wineries nothing special)

I was offered a job at Blythe....still like $250k trailers

>>34034511
>living in california.

>>34034046
Going to need your to look up the origin of the word "Sniper"

>>34033927

If ATGM's are so great, then why don't hunters use them to kill deer?

>>34034234
I know the Airforce also likes shotguns because they double as a tool to decrease the bird population - the Civil Engineers take em out from time to time to reduce the threat of birds hitting planes during landing/takeoff

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>>34034841
Heh

>>34033927
>if shotguns are so great how come no military uses them outside of house breaching.
Because there are not enough enemy drones in our close-in airspace yet?
Maybe...M203 + canister?

>>34034102

A man who was much more smarter than you said

"I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones."

So we got a chance for trench fighting.

>>34039222

Trips don't lie.

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>All these poor fag hill billy middle of nowhere midwestern trailer trash suicidal alcoholic idiots

I hate that California is liberal, I dislike the non-whites, Jews, etc

So its not perfect. And while I do occasionally entertain the idea of living in a nice town in the Midwest... it's not something most of us are dying to do.

But you all wonder everyday what it would be like to make more than 1,000,000 a year. You all wonder what it would be like to drive the latest European sports car. You all wonder what a limousine ride in Beverly Hills going to a 5 star restaurant with a model would be like. You imagine what a great tailored suit and a watch more expensive than your shitty mega mall watch feels and looks like.

My children will own the companies your children will work for.

I go hunting in Safaris with 20,000.00 dollar guns. I've hunted an Elephant and a Lion. But sure... I'll give all that up just so I can wake up in the morning and shoot some ducks in my backyard lol.

What a big disgusting circle jerk of poor peasant cretins. Enjoy your insignificant lives.

>>34039447

way to buy into kike degeneracy. Must be nice constantly telling yourself that the cool stuff you traded your soul for was worth it. Or nice role play. either way, go suck start a shotgun.

>>34034841
I will rape you

>>34034102
Thats what they said post ww1. Thats what they said when they tried to get rid of the bayonet pre ww1. thats what they said when cavalry were mowed down. yet here we are.

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>>34039447
>Lies.

>>34039720
that was a constructive conversation

>>34033927
>the military is the ultimate arbiter of all firearms use

child pls go

>>34034234
Former SAC troop?

>>34033927

The word "shotgun surgeon" exists for something, right?

>>34034102
Wait for space station breaching to become common place

>>34033927
Is a shotgun more concealable than a pistol? No.
Is a shotgun more accurate than a rifle? No.
Is a shotgun faster on follow-up than a carbine? No.

So why a shotgun? Versatility of loads means that it is the jack of all trades. Less lethal? Fuck yeah we have: bean-bags, rubber shot, CS gas, even taser rounds! Want to beach? Load some ceramic breaching slugs! Want to hit someone 100 yards away? Load a slug! Hungry? Adequate loads exist for every species on earth except maybe some dangerous African stuff.

>>34039447
>I go hunting in Safaris with 20,000.00 dollar guns

I actually know a guy that did this. Pulled overtime for like 4 months and bought some wildcat caliber bolt action that got his dick hard and went on a two week safari to Africa and murdered the shit out of their wildlife.

You, you're just a faggot opining on what you fantasize about while you sleep in your twin sized bed in your dingy apartment, beckoned to sleep by the gunshots and niggery of your ghetto lullaby.

>>34034046
>>34034061

Drone (duck) War-fare is getting more and more popular these days?

>inb4 new suicide drone from firearm blog post.

>>34034600
shiiieeeeetttttttt

Wounded duck programs exist.

Shotguns are for birds and doors the end forever.

>>34034899
there are more jobs in CA.

what is there in the midwest? part time jobs at the mall of america and ford in detroit?

that's it? going to make a career out of working at a mall in the midwest or assembling shitty cars

and what meet an overweight religious woman with a high school education?

no thanks

i've seen kids from the midwest make their way into california (through the military) and it's not a pretty sight

>>34034167
>general purpose machine gunner gunner

>>34037489
>jet mechanic
>not working on glorious turboprop aircraft
Straight jet fag.

Shooting drones out of the air.... Duh/

>>34033927
sometimes you want someone to survive, or you don't want that hostage having extra holes