N.J. State Police sues gun maker for $2.5M over 'life threatening'

>>34002735
>new jersey

That's why.

>>34002735
they probably don't clean them

>>34002735
probably magazine issues.

Probably because NJ police are completely incompetent.

But seriously, most of the time I have feed issues it's the magazine.

>>34002735
do we know if they cheaped out and bought extra mags from a 3rd party or something.

>>34002735
>P229
>FTE
>New Jersey
Probably the toxic environment

Here's a better article

http://www.guns.com/2017/05/18/new-jersey-state-police-sue-sig-over-pistol-defect/

Looks like in the course of 16 months Sig first thought it was the extractor pin, then the barrel, then the extractor springs.

>>34002735
looks like extending the bottom of the slide under the bolt-face downward a little more would slap the top round in the mag and keep it down out of hte way so the one in the chamber doesn't FTE

alternatively modify magazine angle

if the extractor is slipping off the cartridge and not because of the empty case binding up then it will take more examination.

>>34002735
"In response, State Police officials and Sig reps tested 25 of the Legacy handguns selected at random from the department’s inventory. Sig gunsmiths immediately “red-lined” five of the guns “because they were so egregiously noncompliant with Sig Sauer’s specifications that they could no longer be used.”

Sig is fucked.

>>34002768
>>34002803
>>34002913
don't they have to use 10 round mags in nj?

I guess it's official.

SIG IS NOT DUTY APPROVED

just like XDs

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>>34002750
>>34002755
>>34002768
>>34002803
>>34002913
>>34002945
>All these Sig fanboys on damage control

haha fags cant admit the gun they spent $1200 on gets shit on by a $500 Glock lmfao. Sorry about that buyer's remorse.

Modern /k/ is probably going to blame solely on the police for bad maintenance or misuse, which is a position that doesn't hold up to even the most basic scrutiny.

Consider that the guns are basically new, having been received in 2014. Consider also that the only time the vast majority of police actually fire their weapons at all is at qualifications. Finally, consider that modern Sig has had well-documented QC problems, even with respect to major LE contracts (see: the P250 and the Netherlands).

I cannot imagine any possible scenario where an entire police department could have broken the majority of their guns despite the guns being new and barely fired at all.

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>>34002735
The Glock brand Glock 17 is the finest piece of personal defensive equipment ever made.

TAURUS MUST BE LIKE

"WELCOME TO THE TEAM!"

>not just getting the HK's to begin with and settling on Glock again

3rd time's the charm right?

>>34003098
they did not pay $500 a unit for the Glocks.

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>>34003098
I have a glock and a 226 so suck it.

>>34002735
huehuehuehuehuehue

This is pretty surprising. I thought the 229 was issued in a shit load of LE agencies.

*too lazy to look it up

>>34002735
1200 rounds so far. Not a single malfunction with my NH 229.

All of my keks if it turns out the cops were limp wristing

>>34002735
Is there anything different about the NJ p229s? I haven't seen people complaining about this on forums. I have a p226 and have never had a malfunction in the 2k rounds through it. I'm not a sig fanboy, but the 229 is just a shorter 226, right?

>>34003098
I'm a glock fanboy senpai. Dont forget that

>>34003262
Yeah 229 is half an inch shorter than the 226. Other than that I believe it's the same gun.

> the state bought 3,000 Sig Sauer P229s for more than $1.8 million

OK, pay retail prices for 3,000 guns, $600 each, and THEN figure out that the niggers, fags, and bitches on the Jersey po-po limp wrist all the guns and dicks they get their hands on?

Kek. Everyone from Jersey is a walking sack of fucking dumb.

>>34003336
In fucking deed.

I have not met anything from new jersey with more than one brain cell. Calling it now, crappiest state in the union.

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>>34003177
As much as I like HK guns they have a history of not being able to deliver parts in the necessary quantities to police departments, or at least, that's what a few LEOs have been saying on the internet so take it with a grain of salt.

Personally I think costs are a big factor for the hk's not being more common in departments, this is part of Sig Sauer's problem along with declining quality control.
I mean, why buy 900 dollar USPs for your officers (plus spare parts and mags $$$) when a 400-450 dollar Glock with LEO discount will work just fine? and most people will do better with it than with a da/sa transition.
>inb4 hk hating poorfag
I love my USP, thank you

>>34003177
Or Fn. Or cz.

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Seriously, wtf is wrong with this pistol? Besides manlets not being about to get there small, carny hands around the grip.

>>34002735
If they want guns that don't have difficult to fix jamming issues, why did they go with Glock?

>>34002735
Sig fags BTFO

>>34003456
On a standard issue level? the locking blocks. other than that they're fine.

>>34003361
...are your sights on backwards? The dots are facing forward.

>>34003669
NO COMPROMISE

>>34003120
it's possible the guns simply haven't been broken in yet. If they fired only a few rounds to dick around with at the range, its entirely possible these pistols haven't gone through the normal 200-round break in period.

On TOP of general lack of maintenance i've come to expect from LEOs in many places.

>>34003669
My USP is a first year 45 model, I don't know about later ones but the hole for the dot (it's a white plastic insert) goes all the way through.

>>34003456
if i had to guess, it's because Glock seriously did some "sign a deal with the devil"-tier advertising for their Glocks. Glock pushed INCREDIBLY hard for a lot of major police contracts back in the day, citing things like "see you don't even NEED a manual safety!" and "look how light it is" and "idiot proof" and "cheap as shit for the boys in blue". Essentially, they advertised really well.

Beretta 92s are perfectly fine. BUT they are admittedly xbox-huge and hard for small hands. They tend to be heavier than a lot of their other full-size competitors, and when you have officers who will almost NEVER have to use their guns but have to carry them, they will bitch about weight. They also carried fewer rounds (17 round flush-mags hadn't really caught on for a long time). Berettas tended to be more expensive too.

Further proof that $1,000 Sigs are no better than a $450 glock quality wise.

Sounds like what would happen if you shot .380 auto out of a 9mm

>>34003612
The locking block is a $20 drop-in part that's good for over 10,000 rounds with the current iteration.

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>>34003679
A true operator knows that you want dots on the front of your sights so the tango will be tricked into lining them up, thus giving you the easy headshot.

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>>34003732
>$1000 sigs
>$450 glocks

Now thats a bullshit comparison and you know it. Go sit in the corner and think about what you've done.

>>34003048
Only peasants.

>exetershit

I've heard nothing but bad shit about that factory and good luck to anyone who paid for one of their pistols.

>>34003681
If it was primarily a break-in period issue, do you really think that would not have been addressed during the multiple times they sent the guns back or during the handgun trials that were attended by factory armorers from Sig?

According to the articles linked in this thread, the problem is almost certainly caused by a QC issue. See:

>In response, State Police officials and Sig reps tested 25 of the Legacy handguns selected at random from the department’s inventory. Sig gunsmiths immediately “red-lined” five of the guns “because they were so egregiously noncompliant with Sig Sauer’s specifications that they could no longer be used.” Then, State Police officials selected five at random to test fire and three of them exhibited numerous FTE malfunctions, the lawsuit says. The remainder of the testing session was then canceled.

>>34003722

Their accuracy is incredible though. The only downside realistically is the double action trigger which is horrendous but can be worked around with just cocking the hammer or just firing the first shot as double action.

It's a solid gun that can be beaten up and can shoots tens of thousands of rounds and still be viable and accurate as ever.

>>34003456
dude, my hands are fucking huge, and I still can't quite get a good grip on a beretta. it's just too big.

>>34003814
Protip
Your hands aren't huge

>>34003814
i call bullshit.

>>34003098
I don't even own any semiautos.

>>34003814
>my hands are fucking huge

are your hands also fat?

>>34003746
Underrated

>>34003814
The C model is a lot friendlier in that regard desu, and the normal mags still work in them.

>>34003813
my M9 is a god damn tack driver, and i hate that phrase more than anything. It's stupid accurate and reliable, and if i had to pick a single pistol to go out long-term innawoods with or operate with, I'm taking the M9 over anything else i've ever fired.

>>34003681

There is no such thing as a "break-in period" for a modern service pistol.

It's just showing how much Cohen is fucking Sig QC up.

Classic Sig Sauers with carbon slides were never as strong as the modern stainless slides, but the autistic level of QC was why Sig Sauer justified the price.

Now, its just a coin flip if your $1500 P229EXTREME UFC EDITION WARRIOR COKE ZERO Edition is even going to function out of the box.

>>34003098
(You)

>>34003745

Yeah, but the M9 TDP was never updated for the new locking block. So literally OEM contractors make Gen1 M9 locking blocks instead of current Beretta Gen3 92 locking blocks.

It's why if the XM17 Program will fail since lol military proccurement.

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I'm glad my life's not endangered.

>>34002735
Obviously Sig doesn't like the NJ Police.

Probably working with BLM.

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>>34003814

I got small girl hands, and I can handle a 92FS grip just fine.

>>34003884
We get it. you live in alaska.

>>34003151

Is there another brand of g17

laugh it up, glockbois. this is a genuine screwup on Sigs part. and they'll pay for it. They should, in fact. Hopefully a 2.5M slap on the wrist will get the board to step on throats and get their QC pipeline sorted out. But every company stumbles. Glocks used to fucking explode on cops and other end users, remember? They sorted it out though, and good on them for it.
>But they still won the army contract.
>And the striker plastic gat market is growing more and more competitive.

>>34003906
yea, figglers.

>>34003929
No, they didnt. closest glock came to serious QC issues was the whole Gen 4 g19 kerfuffle

>>34003900
I'm not convinced you do, did you see his Kodiak Edition "I Live In Alaska" Alaska Badge™?

>>34003906
well there's sig brand glock, s&w brand glock, taurus brand glock, glock brand glock, and the best of all hipoint glock 40.

>>34003939
Nope, and I like Glocks.

*Gen1 Safety Update
*Gen2 G19 Phase III malfunctions
*Gen2/3 .40s in generally
*G21SF
*G36
*G3/G4 9mms FTE/BTF

Every manufacturer has issues.

>>34003881
>Yeah, but the M9 TDP was never updated for the new locking block. So literally OEM contractors make Gen1 M9 locking blocks instead of current Beretta Gen3 92 locking blocks.

Are you sure about this? I had heard that changing the locking blocks did not require submitting an engineering change proposal, which meant that they could and were adopted without any red tape. I know there are gen 1 locking blocks still in circulation, but that's just a function of some of the guns being 30 years old + the locking blocks being as terribly weak as some people seem to believe.

>>34003906
hi newfriend.

>>34003939
apparently our Austrian friend, Gaston, has never heard of the glocknade...

why didnt they have glocks to begin with? are they trying out a new gun to see if they can find problems?

>>34004260
They obviously did...

>>34002953
That is pretty damning.

Obviously the govs chances in the lawsuit depend on the wording of the contract but it does not look good for Sig.

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Rugers stock is up 25% in the last few months

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>>34003884
Shit nigga only time I put on a glove is when the beatch dont want no babys

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sabotage is still a thing.

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>>34004524
What about mittens god dammit!!!!

>>34004576
Why do you just post the same pics for years at a time? Even the trips in /arg/ post different pics of the same guns. Add some variety. Take more pics of Alaska

>>34004584
>Thu 16 Feb 2017 10:43:53 PM AKST
I just did the mitten one a couple of months ago and I don't trip so their may be many different people who own glocks

>>34003098
Which company just won the MHS contract?

Sam Gerard: [Referring to the Glock as he is changing magazines] These things are so cool.
John Royce: Yeah.
Sam Gerard: They shoot underwater! You can pour sand in them and they'll shoot. Shoot every time. It's a good choice.

Get yourself a Glock and lose that nickel-plated sissy pistol.

>>34003336
>>34003355

pls no bully :(

>>34003025
Or the guns have been mistreated by the PD

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>>34003906
>>34003968
FN brand glock

>>34004734
That's a blurry problem solver you got there.

>>34004742
it's solving my problems at too high a speed

>>34002735
Did anybody try filing down the magazine notch

>>34002735
NJ is just after that Army pistol money Sig is getting. Like when that nigga in the hood wins $50k on a scratch off and every hood rat is positive he their baby daddy.

>>34002735
There is a reason Why SEALs swapped their Sigs to Glocks.

>>34004584

that's because alaska anon doesn't live in alaska, he just visits. Otherwise he wouldn't make such a big deal of it, he couldn't deal living in the last frontier.

>>34004877
Nope.

>>34003231
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SIG_Sauer_P226#Users

It is. I don't really get it, these problems aren't found elsewhere. Either NJ got a special batch of shitty guns or they did something wrong.

>>34003329
I thought the 229 was beefier and made originally that way because it was made for .40, have I been wrong all along?

>>34003814
5'5" turbo manlet with girl hands and bitchwrists here. M9 is my favorite gun. Feels better in my hobbit hands than the glock 19 and 17. G19 my pinky floats in outer space, g17 meh, finger grooves fuck me up.
>>34003823
^this

>>34004886
Alas/k/a, the final frontier
These are voyages of the anonship neeterprise.
It's 5 year mission, to seek out new guns and fudd civilizations.
To boldly go where no NEET has gone before!

>>34003837
Heckin lmao

>>34003722
I thought the whole deal now was to get into striker-fired pistols because they're more reliable.

>>34003813
Shoot more, the trigger breaks in homeslice. Wear that fucker in.

Everybody wants to fuck over someone and feel good about getting the most while paying less and wants their shit to be smooth as fuck out of the box and not have to break anything in.

The da pull is not horrendous, it just needs to be broken in and you need to shoot enough to master it, it will make you a better shooter.

>>34004508
Nice wood. Looks like how a classy 80's movie about the future weapon would look.

Police just need to go back to revolvers.

>>34004535
Need info on that pic sir. Please and thank you.

>>34004668
Good movie

>>34004734
Jesus fuck, you could almost pull the trigger with your thumb

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>>34004726
>officers routinely taking to their duty guns with angle grinders and files for unknown reasons

Hmm, I wonder who recently spent thousands of dollars on trash tier US made sigs???

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>>34002735
> muh American engineering
> muh US made SIGs
> superior to German made
mfw American manufacturers though the mm tolerances where inches

>>34004891
U cryin'?

>>34002735
>>34002735
probably because they are using illegal hollow points and Sig gave them the NJ legal version that doesnt allow hollowpoints

>>34005397
Illegal for police? Doubtful.

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>>34005246

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>>34005443
Original image attached.

Found on this page about a 19 minute short film back in 2008:
https://web.archive.org/web/20080722014351/http://theorionconspiracy.com/index.php

>>34005343
I would honestly buy a Hi Point over an Exmemeter made SIG pistols.

Absolute fucking trash tier. It's odd because their MCX rifles are really good.

>>34002755
This shouldn't be an issue for any modern firearm.

>>34005397
>hollowpoints
>giving FTE
Im not an expert, on this sort of this, but this sounds impossible. The slug isn't even a part of the ejection process

>unless bants

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I wonder if those tool steel grayguns extractors could have been a possible fix for this problem.

Oh well, just Sig being Sig.

>>34003151
That holster. Geez.

>>34002735
EXETER
X
E
T
E
R

>>34006002
Also
P320
>tonight on 60 minutes, the fleecing of Murica

Sig America has always had horrible QC, especially with their newer line of pistols.

>>34003120
The shittiest thing in the end with the p250 was that sig fixed all the problems it had, but treated it like a bastard stepchild by not advertising the fixes. I've got the compact model made in April 2016, one of the last ones off the production line, and I think it's a great pistol, but sigs marketing and p.r. are shit

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>>34006047
They must only hire mexicans or niggers.

Swiss SIG must be crying everytime Exeter comes up.

>>34002768
FTE caused by a mag issue? FTF maybe.

Probably limp wristing bc NJ and everything.

>>34003939
What gen 4 g19 issue was there?

>>34006293
If they're limp-wristing it, the problem would be even worse with glocks. Lighter frame = less inertia in the gun = easier to limpwrist.

>>34005289
Is it so hard to imagine these American pencil pushers tried to "fix" their guns by beating on them with hammers?

>>34003151
Why did you stick a glock up that poor crocodiles ass?

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>>34002735
Why don't guns come with limited liability EULA like Windows or iphone?

>>34006468
kek'd

>>34004759
kek'd

>>34003248
This is actually my first guess.

I had a ppk that FTE constantly until I realized I was being a limp wristed faggot. Never had a problem after that

>>34003203

Hows that glock beaver tail adapter? I just saw those on Dawson Precision yesterday, and am curious.

>>34003329
>>34003262

226 was the original full size gun
228 was the 9mm compact version
229 was the 40 version of the 228
228 discontinued and 229 was made in both calibers.

The P229 is nearly identical to the P228, however its slide is made from milled stainless steel (versus the P228's forged carbon steel slide)

This all happened in the 90's

>>34003868

This.

The Sig pistols used to the best production guns in the world when it was just the
220
229
225
228
230

and you could have them in any color you like, as long as you like black nitron.

Now, Sig pushes nothing but chinese junk accessories, retarded limited editions, and a rainbow of colors.

Legion? Anyone who has ever looked down that travesty of a sight picture knows that legion are just a cash grab for people who think they can buy their way to competent shooting.

Breaks my heart, truly.

>>34003361
cut nail

>>34003098
a glock will fail if you don't clean it too

note "clean" means "remove carbon buildup"

keep your video of a muddy glock working after shaking the mud out to yourself

>>34006119
>Swiss SIG
Nothing about SIG Sauer or Sauer & Sohn or SigArms is Swiss.

>>34005569
A.you wouldn't

B.they're not.

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>>34007534
There was though.

>>34007914
they were owned by the same holding which is based in Switzerland, but never manufactured there. The company you guys know as SIG is the SIG Sauer GmbH in Eckernförde, Germany

BLM QC

>>34003120
>consider that modern Sig has had well-documented QC problems
No fuckign shit. Ask any gunstore counter guy and we've been sending shit back with the packing grease still on it for a decade. Account reps always use scripted bullshit about it being a fluke and "the engineers will inspect it" then we send it back and get the same p226 6 months later from a different distributor as CPO and it has the same fucking warped slide rail.

>>34005569
Own an MCX. It's been back to Sig twice in 2 years. Now it works but still isn't the most accurate rifle in the safe. After a year of back and forth with Sig I have a $1600 rifle that is 'fine'.

MCX, wouldn't do that again. Though the customer service has been acceptable (if slow, because they are backlogged)

I do love my p226 though.

>>34004508
Ruger has done terrific business the past 10+ years, with Bill six feet under the company is better than ever.

>>34002735
Sig is trash, I've said it all along and day by day I get proven right.

>>34008091
Well even a broken minaret is right twice a day.

>>34003361
Problem with Police departments is that they often tend to order parts on a case by case basis, whereas HK is used to recieving batch orders. IOW, stock your armory with parts BEFORE you need them.

>>34006059
Yeah, bullshit.
Sig had THREE tries to make things right on the Dutch police contract, and fucked it up every time.
Then the Dutch went with Walther, and lo and behold, Walther did not disappoint.

>>34008201
Probably because Walther still gives a fuck about what they're doing.

>>34008223
>UMAREX still gives a fuck about what they're doing.
ftfy

>>34003456

Nothing. It's a fine pistol.

It replaced the 1911. That's why it has a bad reputation. That's the entire reason. Back when the military wanted to replace Gods chosen handgun chambered in a "real man stopper" round they chose the Berretta. So fudds autistically screeched into the night about how Berretta was basically making the single worst firearm in the history of humanity and how the USA would surely lose any future conflict because the "lol 9mm" would take and entire magazine to slightly wound a man and how America has lost its way and surely Babel would fall and humanity was doomed.

When enough fudds screech the same shit for literally decades it just becomes accepted.

Literally the only problems with Berrettas are they are slightly bigger and heavier than some counterparts and military magazines only carry 15 rounds. I have tiny child hands and honestly the Berretta just sort of fits in them, I actually shoot the weapon very well. Go to a store and hold the gun you want to buy, don't let /k/ influence you.

my p320c has been amazing, are there issues with them?

>>34008295
45ACP was invented by America. 9mm was invented by Germany. When America decided to adopt the 9mm, they were basically saying that the Nazis were right.

>>34008295
>Nothing. It's a fine pistol.
>It replaced the 1911. That's why it has a bad reputation. That's the entire reason. Back when the military wanted to replace Gods chosen handgun chambered in a "real man stopper" round they chose the Berretta. So fudds autistically screeched into the night about how Berretta was basically making the single worst firearm in the history of humanity and how the USA would surely lose any future conflict because the "lol 9mm" would take and entire magazine to slightly wound a man and how America has lost its way and surely Babel would fall and humanity was doomed.
>When enough fudds screech the same shit for literally decades it just becomes accepted.
>Literally the only problems with Berrettas are they are slightly bigger and heavier than some counterparts and military magazines only carry 15 rounds. I have tiny child hands and honestly the Berretta just sort of fits in them, I actually shoot the weapon very well. Go to a store and hold the gun you want to buy, don't let /k/ influence you.

I'm seriously expecting that in 5-10 years the same thing will be going on with the military SIG, people shitting all over it because it's not the Beretta and back in their day when men were men the M9 was America's gun and it was perfect.

>>34008295
I'm not against 9mm, I'm just saying the berretta m9 is dumb.

I'll take a 9mm 1911 or a Hi power over it.

>>34008201
The fixes were made when they went with other contracts. Sig just didn't want to be reminded of their fuck up. I swear you glock niggers are worse than any fudd

This thread makes me ill. I love the sig P229/228/226. I've been issued an M9, carried in in combat, and owned one privately and regret selling it.

Why do people hate good guns

>>34009119
because they like US made ones so much

Sig sales when

>>34006870
I lik it. That grip become nice and meaty, and the ridges sit well in the hand.

>>34005216
>buying into the striker fired meme

the only thing that's really going to be much better than hammer fired is electro fired in the year 2048

>>34009045
There is nothing wrong with the Beretta 92

>>34008295
I wish Beretta made a modern M9 with a slide cut for a mini red ot.

>>34009019

There are already people doing that now, enjoying a gun is fine, but asininenly saying its' superior to a clearly more modern gun etc, is just....infuriating.

>>34004726
This. My department has an "armorer" who orders parts and replaces them. He likes to pretend he's a gunsmith, but it's basically 3 or 4 different types of duty weapons with the same 10 or so parts each that might fail, and he replaces parts, cleans, test fires, and returns them to inventory. He is a former firearms instructor (that used to mean something) and has "factory" training (went to a few weekend certification programs), and generally the repairs are fine because they're just parts replacements.

Problem is, replacing a worn part with a new part, when other nearby parts are still worn or out of alignment or scraped to hell, means they keep getting cycled back in for more repairs until the pins and screws and clearances are all wobbly too.

Point is, LE guns take a lot of abuse. Very little from qualifying at the range, but a shit ton from daily carry and getting thumped around and dirtied up. I've seen enough lint between a gun and holster to actually make it damn near impossible to disengage the retaining holster lock without a pocket knife.

>>34003745

That shit seems to fall out easily when cleaning but is difficult to get back in. I had to use a vice and punches last time to line it up after it somehow got stuck

>>34009375
Hah, that reminds me of a story i read from some armorer. apparently he had a gun come in once for a scheduled maintenance and the thing had so much lint in it it could barely be operated. He tries dropping the hammer and it only falls halfway. He looks closer at it to examine the issue while thumbing back the hammer and finds a single skittle, partially dissolved and stuck over the back of the firing pin...

>>34002735
So what changes did NJ mandate be made to the pistol that resulted in fucking shit up?

>>34005573
It'll be an issue for any firearm that gets carried openly in inclement weather. It's a machine, you need to provide proper upkeep.

>>34004508

What model is that? Any aftermarket other than the wood?

>>34003151
>that holster
Why

>>34009729
Pretty sure Fitzgerald even mentions stuff like that back when he wrote his book in the 30's.

I'm recalling a story about firing a shot and having lint fly everywhere like confetti.

>>34002735
Meanwhile they're still getting dicked by the dealership supplying their Tahoes by being overcharged for factory options and not receiving parts they ordered with them.
Maybe they should sue those cucks too.

>>34003697
>>34003746
That's pretty neat, TIL. With a "KF" date code, you're not kidding.

>>34003722
>comparing 15 vs 17 rounds like that's the least bit relevant

>>34003048
15, and that's only if your a prole. Big Brother Policeman gets to have whatever size mag he wants.

>>34003941
No, but I guess that's because I don't stalk people.

>>34003884
I've seen you post your stupid glock at least 10 times, get a life nerd

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>>34012206
>at least 10 times,
>newfag
It's probably been 1000's of times by now.

>>34002735
>millions of people have used 229s and other sigs with no problems ever
>nj police mystically has some weird problem that sig cannot identify

sig btfo!!!

>>34009019
I think we may see less of that due to the shorter life of the Beretta M9. M1911 had a LOT of action over the decades, Berettas served for a much shorter time.

People complain about safety controls on them, specifically the slide safety. It isn't my favorite placing, but the safety basically throws itself to "red is dead" by a light touch, so i give it a pass.

>>34003336
NJ fag here, can confirm

This communist shit hole of a state is anti gun, and nothing but a bunch of niggers and spics. Can't wait to hop over the river into based PA. Went to school in that state, I miss it ever since graduating

>>34003814
Get some G10 or aluminum grips and it's a night and day difference, dude

>>34009045
I love the 92 but the Hi-Power is all around a super fun gun, so

>>34003025
PD armorers are shit on the most part. Some old fat fuck on his last donut run working on guns. herr derr only cops work on our guns because we trust no one.

>>34012595
>swabs gun and finds jelly and powdered sugar residue in the action.

>>34003120
>remington
>sig
>smith and wesson
>all of them have developed QC problems
What the hell is happening? Which respectable gun manufacturer is next?

>>34008295

Tat and the M9 is the weapon the US military gives the least fucks about. No one cares about pistols that staff officers and tank crewmen take out once every 2 years to qualify on and are then thrown back to rot in an arms room.

They're all old as shit, beat up and the parts aren't replaced like they should. No shit, if you don't properly maintain your weapons and replace parts and the end of their service lives they're going to jam up on you.

>>34008073
>10/22 using cheaper trigger groups
>Mark IV shittier quality than Mark I, II, and III
sure bud.

>>34005979
I know, I should have gotten the belt loops.

Other than that it's a pretty fantastic holster.

>>34003746
Is that a Starrett box under it?

>>34002735
Meanwhile a Hi-point will work flawlessly without any care or maintenance.

sig fags BTFO!

>>34015171
S&W is nowhere near as bad as the other two. Their problems are mainly limited to the barrels on some of their guns coming overtorqued from the factory (this always occasionally happened) and their newer blued guns having a finish that gets damaged by solvents containing ammonia (this kind of sucks, but the instruction manual does warn you about it).

In terms of clearances, tolerances, muzzle velocity, and reliability--especially when comparing things like the 2nd generation and 3rd generation autos to newer stuff like the M&P 2.0--the new production guns are in many cases better than even the best vintage guns.

>>34003120
my cousin and all his asshole buddies are cops in NJ, none of them can draw, aim, or shoot worth a fuck.

they dont even know how to break down, or clean their own guns, and leave them with their shitty ass smith that knows less than /k/ at its newfaggest or even those fags on faggit.

they are the arch fudds of the highest most burled levels of STOPPAN POWAH!!! but they scream and drop guns if they shoot .45 because its too violent of a caliber for civilians.

>>34002735
>NJ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8sbhGggvCRI

>>34003048
it is 15 and laws don't apply to cops, politicians, or rich people in NJ

>>34008886
9mm was invented in 1902. Long before nazis


and yes i knew that this was bait, but i needed to say it

>>34002735
Maybe NJ should test their weapons before they equip their PDs with them

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>>34008886
You are wrong my dude

>>34005243
This.

>>34017581
>>34018104
The Nazis used 9mm. America admitted that 9mm was superior. Therefore America admitted that the Nazis were right.

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>>34002735
im a fudd so i dont have a dog in this hunt but

manufactures of firearms have already been repeatedly found not liable for the damage they cause in any respect on any level. they found even better lawyers than the tobacco companies.

i can file suit against you if i want. doesn't mean anything.

picture unrelated to post content

>>34002735
They went with the Glocks.

They saw the light. Good.

>>34018496
>manufactures of firearms have already been repeatedly found not liable for the damage they cause in any respect on any level.
Firearm manufacturers can be found liable for product defects, not for crimes committed by others using their products.

>>34002735
SIG BTFO


sigs are overpriced shit anyway. hahahaha

My departments duty gun was the P229 DAK in fowty. Trigger was awful, but they were reliable for the most part. After we swapped to the full size P320's, I bought a CPO P229 with the long extractor and new slide cuts. Frame rails were worn to bear aluminum, accuracy shit, cheap paint on the frame to cover the anodizing wear coming off by just looking at it. Call Sig and get an RMA. They say everything is fine and dandy with the gun. I pay another $350 for a brand new frame. They say they'll throw in night sights for my trouble. Get gun back in a few weeks and no night sights and mags are sticking in the brand new frame. Point of aim is also hitting a few inches low at 15 feet. Call Sig again and wear them out. Get another RMA and sent gun back. Now they say that everything is perfect on it and the night sights are zero'd. Still waiting on gun to show up.

TLDR Sig QC is trash on their CPO's. Don't bother. Buy a new one for better odds.

>exetershit

How long after the first delivery of P320s to the US military will they have issues and nullify the contract?

If (when) they do, what was the runner up? I've heard FN's entry was the closest competition.

>>34003939
>>34006355
Would like to know too, for a friend

Vaguely remember hearing about something maybe recoil spring related

So much Sig asshurt and damage control ITT
>hurr durr they're limp wristing
Then it should be an even bigger problem with their glocks, yet I doubt that will happen
>p-poor maintenance!
Cops don't shoot their guns that much, so what you're saying is that Sigs need to be kept minty clean in order to function reliably
>every manufacturer has bad apples!
Not at this quantity and frequency. You shouldn't buy such an expensive pistol and have to hope you get a good one. It's literally just careful machining combined with quality control. Sure there might be an occasion where the supplier of their steel or aluminum gives them a bad product, but that would probably result in a part breakage, not jams.

This happens time and time again, but people still chomp at the bit to defend whatever company they have an emotional investment in that has begun to fall from glory.

>>34019359
I'm sure FN or Glock would be happy to supply guns that work.

>>34015294
Just an outers cheap cleaning kit box, we've got some starretts collecting dust at work tho ;-)