Will we see the adoption of a 7mm intermediate cartridge

File: 7mm+Mauser+Rifle+Cartridge.png (58KB, 543x320px) Image search: [Google]

58KB, 543x320px

>>33948346
Probably, probably not.

I did create my own intermediate cartridge based on the 7mm Mauser. Ran it through ballistics charts and it almost has the same ballistics as .223

>>33948362
>7mm
>still same ballistics as .223
May as well swing your 2 inch dick at them

What's with the orange bullet case?

>>33948346
Hopefully not. Would be a step backwards.
But I wouldn't put anything past the stupid military bureaucracy making decisions detatched from reality.

>>33948373
>Photograph of various .280 Ball Cartridges. Orange cased cartridge is made out of aluminium.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.280_British

File: 7mm Kurzer Ballistics Trajectory.png (12KB, 750x400px) Image search: [Google]

12KB, 750x400px

>>33948367

It's pushing a 110-grain pill at those same ballistic trajectories. It's a pretty damn sure thing that it's terminal ballistics will put the 223 to shame at 600 yards.

>>33948346
6.5 Grendel maybe.

>>33948346
Sooner than you'd think.

https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2017/05/foghorn/us-army-considers-ditching-5-56-nato-round/

>>33948399
y tho

>>33950518
What do you guys think the new rifle will be chambered in?

>>33951090
My bet is 6.5 Grendel.
>7.62x39 mag capacity
>7.62x51 ballistics, although with a bit less power
>still fine for poking holes in dunecoons at 800-900 meters, and a significant improvement over 5.56 in that regard
>improved armor penetration compared to 5.56 and 7.62x39 at shorter ranges
>just requires a few parts swapped on an AR-15 platform so most of the logistics remain intact

>>33950523

Cause trying to LARP the 1950s when Britbongs, hon hon baguettes, and various other non-burger nations started experimenting with intermediate cartridges after witnessing the 7.92x33 Kurz.

Wanted to try and go my own way with that post-war thought process.

>>33948346

No need

5.56mm works well enough out to any range you can reasonably shoot someone with a carbine or infantry rifle.

Snipers and marksmen get full power.

>>33948346
Fuck no, but 6.8mm SPC seems good enough.

>>33951609

6.8 SPC is actually 7.0mm in terms of bullet diameter.

6.5 Grendel vs 6.8 SPC II

Which one is better for a combat rifle?

>>33952335
It's 6.5 Creedmoor short vs. .270 Win short-and-thin. My money's on 6.5 Grendel for better bullet selection.

>>33948399
How long was the cartridge? Same length as an 8mm Kurz? Also what type of propellant did you used for that data?

>>33948399
Why would you want that though, didn't you know that 5.56 was designed to wound?

>>33948399
And? So what?

>>33952335
I don't know why everyone's sucking the grendel cock. The US military fucking loves short ass barrels which the 6.5 really doesn't like

>>33952813
Which one would be best for a 16" barrel?

>>33952824
the m4 carbine has a 14" barrel, and shorter barrel lengths are taking off to "replace" sub guns so to speak

>>33948346
no but 6.5mm will replace 5.56 soon

>>33952890
Would 6.8SPC be the better option for a 14" barrel? I don't know much about these calibers, I'm only now starting to look into them.

>>33952706

Dude, scroll up. And I ain't saying anything on powders. I will say it's not your bullshit super-fast burning powders. It's one that's been around for a looooong time.

>>33952736

See >>33951509

>>33948362
This fag made an arfcom thread.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_16/713352_Help-with-Ballistics-Characteristics-for-Brand-New-Wildcat.html

>>33952813
>>33952914
the 6.5 has a better coefficient meaning that it's going to retain its energy over long distances better, so despite the fact that 6.5 loses a lot more velocity from short barrels than 6.8 does, it may or may not be equal or better at, say 300 yards

>>33952932
What about it?

>>33952915
Whoops, I meant to say case length, not overall length

>>33952981

2.28 in or 57.912mm, it's essentially a cut-down 7mm Mauser. Nothing much changed.

>>33952932
And? People want to do fun things.

>>33952955
>>33953005
just sharing

>>33948346
No, because 6.5mm is the master race

>>33948346
6mm seems to work better than 7 for intermediate cartridges.

>>33953495
Could go with what the Brits said was ideal and make it 6.25.
Heck, why not just revive the old 6mm SAW if you want.

>>33951151
>>33951090
.264 USA

>>33951090
.243 Winchester

>>33953624
fudd pls

>>33952943
All that is true, but it will not be Grendel if they make a change to a larger caliber. It's just too slow and not flat enough, especially out of shorter barrels.

>>33953515
>Could go with what the Brits said was ideal and make it 6.25.
6.25mm is awfully close to the existing .243 caliber.

>>33954060
Shhhh they don't have to know that

>>33948399
>pill
kys

What modern cartridge is closest to .280 British?

>>33954578
6.8 Remington SPC

One is 7.2mm, the other is 7.03

.280 british produces more energy at the muzzle though

>>33948399
>600 yards.
>7.62 RFN is better at 600.
>5.56 is lighter, better for auto.
A do-all round does nothing right.

>>33954714
6.8 Remington SPC is not much like .280 British at all.

File: 7x_46inmags-tfb.jpg (47KB, 540x366px) Image search: [Google]

47KB, 540x366px

>>33948346
No, never.
Militaries have been dancing around 7mm for practically a century now, why would they come to their senses any time in the forseeable future?

>>33951090
45-70

>>33951090
6.5mm CT.

7mm would have been retarded to adopt in the 60s when the design goals for the successor of 7.62x51 were to make a significantly lighter, smaller, lighter recoiling cartridge with similar ballistics. Of course 5.56 is kinda shitty past 300-500 yards *compared to full powered rifle rounds*, but at that distance the individual effectiveness of the average infantryman is not a concern for a modern military and the ability to carry a way larger amount of ammo is in my opinion more important than long range lethality. This has been a concept since literally the 1890s with 6.5mm, reduced power rounds with similar ballistics for more ammo you can carry.

>>33952813
>>33952890
>>33952914
>>33952824
what about countries that have bullpups and thus have like 20inch barrels? would they change to 6.5

>>33956521
>Austeyr F88 chambered in 6.5 Grendel
anon please, I can only get so hard

>>33954812
See >>33951509

>>33954812

Also samefag here, I'm not disagreeing that Real Fucking Nato would do better at 600. It's more or less LARPing the '50s like mentioned above. This would be a time before RFN came into prevalence.

It's also worth noting that this was a fork in the road moment in history. The US wanted a .30 cal because they wanted a smaller package that was still a full-powered cartridge.

The European nations were experimenting with and wanted an intermediate cartridge as to maximize the amount of lead going downstream without punishing the soldier in terms of accuracy.

Of the two paths, Russia was practically the only one who went down the intermediate path. They adopted the 7.62x39mm. It wasn't until the early '60s did the US realize that there were benefits towards intermediates. Thus spawned the 5.56x45mm cartridge.

I kinda have disagreements about the 5.56x45mm, but overall it's a good intermediate cartridge.

>>33952335
Totally different.

I'd guess 6.8 simply because of urban warfare, but they're strengths and weaknesses are polar opposites.

>>33957188
>Totally different.
>I'd guess 6.8 simply because of urban warfare, but they're strengths and weaknesses are polar opposites
Explain. Why is 6.8 better for a combat rifle?

>>33957198
not that anon but I think I get his reasoning, even though it's splitting hairs

According to this logic: >>33952943 6.8 would be better for CQC out of short barrels, but marginally so

>>33957211
So if a military were using mostly 14.5" and 10.5" barrels, do you think 6.8 would be the better choice?

>>33957253
14.5 inch barrel: considering most engagements are fought at ranges beyond 100 yards, I would say no.

No idea on the 10.5

>>33951090
6.8 SPC

>>33957621
explain

>>33957636
It's been on the Us military's "maybe" list for a while instead of 6.5 Grendel, just wouldn't be surprised if they did go with it is all.

I think the only reason they didn't switch over was because of what a flop the Magpul Masada and Remington Adaptive Combat Rifle were.

If 5.56 NATO is intermediate, what is an example of a full size 5mm cartridge?

>>33957694

.22 Eargesplitten Loudenboomer

>>33957694
.220 swift, .22-250

>>33956807
The 5.56 should have told you.
>5.45x39
>5.8x42
Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

>>33957253
6.8 doesn't really get anything more from using a barrel longer than 16"

6.5 gets a lot more from longer barrels

6.5 drifts less in the wind.
custom loading 6.8 with 140gr can get you the same drop rate as 6.5 (-5" at 1000yd.)

6.5 seems to be the longer range cartrage to me

File: DSC04234.jpg (31KB, 511x600px) Image search: [Google]

31KB, 511x600px

>>33956807
>I kinda have disagreements about the 5.56x45mm, but overall it's a good intermediate cartridge.
It certainly would benefit from longer bullets with better from factor.

>>33962431
fuuuuck my dick

why is 5.45 so much better? where did we go wrong

>>33955354
Is the government trustable enough?

>>33955349
Goddamnit Murray, post up more info on this cartridge and the rifle built to fire it.

>>33962441
>where did we go wrong
When we refused to adopt .280 British.

>>33948346
is .284 the new meme bore size?

>>33963529
>wanting rainbow ballistics

>>33963651
.264

>>33963660
broofs

>>33960825
Can't disagree with a fast, light cartridge. Again, trying to do the 7mm Kurzer from a 1950's design philosophy.

>>33962431

5.45x39mm is a very good cartridge. I kinda wish 5.45 is more prevalent in the US. Like, dirt fucking cheap. I remember being a kid and seeing those thousand rounds of 5.45 for a little over a hundred bucks.

>>33948346
>Will we see the adoption of a 7mm intermediate cartridge in our lifetime?
Most likely not.
We and the ruskies have no need to do so.
None of either of our protectorates have nationalism/pride anymore so no more czechnology.
Chinks are physically and mentally incapable of innovation, so they aren't going to do it.
South america is full of commie faggots, so they just need to be able to kill reason and peasants. Don't need anything fancy for that.
Aussies are cucks.
So that leaves africa. Egypt is retarded and south africa is too stable (enough). And everyone else is a nigger.

So basically, our only hope is for Rhodesia to rise like a phoenix.

>>33963745
What are you planning on putting that kurzer in?
Downsized T44 or T25 before stuffing it into a slightly smaller AR-10?