if you implanted a steel plate in your head, could you survive

Try it and find out

>>33672966
only if the bullet was made out of jet fuel

>>33672966
that would be 19mm steel

>>33672990
and how would i report the failure einstein?

>>33672966
Lets assume you have a strong enough/thick enough piece of steel that you are also capable of implanting in a head that is in fact capable of stopping 7.62 NATO

Goodbye brain functions

>>33672966
>short
No.
>long
You would have the same energy transferred to your head.

It would end with you dying from brain trauma (or being lobotomized, even worse) instead of dying from hydrostatic shock liquidating your brain.
So you get a slow painful death at best, or being both living and dead at worst.
This of course is assuming you're talking about things like 9mm and .45 ACP.
5.7x28 or other purpose built AP pistol rounds, any intermediate rifle cartridges or larger, and potentially some special made regular rounds will penetrate and liquids your brain either way, especially given a short enough distance.

>>33673071
Actually, let me just say this.

You would go from dying by being shot, to something akin to having someone wack you as hard as possible (frankly probably harder) with a baseball bat, or a car crash.

>>33673052
are you implying that the shock reverberation on the plate will cause lethal injuries? is there a way to make a bracket for it that has shock absorbers then?

>>33673071
ok what's used nowadays to stop armor piercing sabots? ceramic plates? plant that in.

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>>33672966
>Ghazkull is that you?

>>33673045
How would you support the success if you have brain damage?

>>33673114
by not getting brain damage.

>>33673118
Smart thinking, are you a marine?

>>33673083
No way to really do anything that would effectively absorb or dampen the rounds blow without fucking up your neck and face in the process.

You're better off just not getting shot in the first place.
And even if you are, people have survived headshots on numerous occasions with little to no permanent damage, which is much better than the possibility of the baseball bat like effect implanting this shit would have on your brain and skull and neck among a whole slew of other things.

>>33673118
That isn't happening if you are taking a round to the skull, bullet stopped or otherwise.

>>33673125
then why not just replace the whole skeleton with titanium? even add in claws. i dare you to make a counterargument for this.

>>33673133
>bullet stopped by plate
>plate transfers energy to shock absorbers
>no damage sustained

where is your dakka now?

>>33673138
Yes! Tek dis damned hummies! Da orks r gunna gif yo sum lessuns in hummie boddies

>>33673083

Nah, you would need head version of a trauma plate in your head with the plate. Or just get a helmet that's rated to deflect or absorb 7.62x51/54R.

>>33673138
Because even the shock absorbers imply translate energy into something.
If you put springs behind it, the springs will either
A: be so stiff they'll do almost fucking nothing
Or
B: bottom out and transfer almost 100% of the energy anyways.
This isn't even getting into fluid or hydraulic buffers, weight and pulley systems, or anything else.

You strap a play to your head, it doesn't do shit but make your death worse.

>inb4 "WHAT ABOUT HELMETS?!" Helmets are more of an "in case I bump my head" thing and not a "shit, I just stopped a bullet" thing. They've done it before but it's not normal, and the only one that actually has a good track record is the Altyn, which fuck people's necks up and causes problems.

>>33673158
>springs

just convert the mechanical energy into thermal energy. it doesn't need to be elastic energy.

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>>33673083
>are you implying that the shock reverberation on the plate will cause lethal injuries?

Rifle rounds hitting plate carriers can break ribs and cause internal bleeding, now apply that yo your noggin.


>is there a way to make a bracket for it that has shock absorbers then?

It's called a helmet.

>>33673138
Oh, also, titanium is fucking expensive as hell and you STILL have squishy bits that really can NOT be squashed without problems inside the titanium skull.

Unless you make work out how to make a brain completely problem free during the likes of, say, a car crash or a baseball bat hitting its case, you are achieving precisely nothing.

>>33673163
>convert it to thermal instead of elastic
But it just doesn't fucking work that way.
We're talking about shitloads of energy, so even with this magical system you have to make it into heat, you'll boil yourself alive.

And this is only IF you can find some magic "kinetic to heat 1/1 ratio" converter.

>>33673169
ok ok how about this. you know how the brain is in a fluid that buffers minimal shock? why not transfer that fluid with Electrorheological fluids?
>change the viscosity of a solution with the application of an electric field.
>application of a large electric field the viscosity of the suspension increases

bam you have a shock absorber and you haven't added anything physically to your noggin other than an electrical source. now it becomes a trivial issue of insulating the brain from the electrical field.
>>33673184
ok then go back to mechanical energy. but instead of springs you make it a fluid. that is, the fluid in your noggin. you make it eject and replenish using a feed. it ejects releasing all the kinetic energy from the plate. how about that?

>>33673184
>We're talking about shitloads of energy, so even with this magical system you have to make it into heat, you'll boil yourself alive.
>
>And this is only IF you can find some magic "kinetic to heat 1/1 ratio" converter.


>militaries around the world employ this magical boot melting armor
>other militaries respond by adopting larger rifle rounds
>soldiers around the world can finally realize their dreams of melting their enemies with conventional small arms

>>33672966
Which NATO round? How thick is the plate? What sort of steel? Isn't steel unsuitable for biomedical implants anyways? Do we care?

>>33673191
You already have brain case fluid for that (I forget the name)

And it's already as good as you're gonna get in terms of a fluid cushion.
No, you can NOT have your brain hit ANYTHING hard enough to take the necessary energy to stop a bullet of just about any kind except maybe .25 ACP or some shit.

>>33673203
says who? just make it that the displaced energy becomes thermal in the fluid and evacuate it, a combination of thermal and kinetic transfer should suffice.

>>33673203
Let me clarify.

ANYTHING THAT IS A THICK ENOUGH FLUID TO DO WHAT YOU WANT CAN AND WILL FUCK YOU UP ANYWAYS.

Helmets are as good as you're gonna get.
It's also part of the reason face masks are fucking stupid.

>>33673208
>turn your head into a teapot

This is getting silly

>>33673208
And again.

Any method of transferring the necessary amounts of kinetic energy into thermal energy will be bordering on magic, coupled with the fact that you'll have some serious problems with heat unless you add a fucking coolant system.

Pointless. Heavy. And based on magic no matter what way you spin it

>>33673224
I just want to take this moment to point some things out.

With bulletproof of the chest area (bulletproof vests) we already know that the body experiences shitloads of problems even when not punctured by the bullet due to the transfer of kinetic energy.

The kinetic energy transferred from something so tiny as this bullet to a comparatively massiv chest still causes things like internal bleeding and broken ribs among other things.

You intend to take something that has demonstrated that even when spread over a fairly large surface will still fracture bones and cause internal bleeding, and then transfer that concept to an even smaller area?
And on top of that try and make the transfer between the outside area that takes the impact and thus contains all the kinetic energy, and transfer it further still into the brain by thickening the fucking liquid?


There is literally no way in hell you'll accomplish this without a complete redesign of the human anatomy specifically to accept massiv punishment to the skull and neck area without flinching, and even more to the brain so as to be more impact resistant, perhaps even having to go to ghost in he shell levels of cyborg shit
(Hold on, this is getting a bit long)

>>33672966
That would rattle ye bones.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZ_qJ7esLZo

>>33673251
In the end you'll wind up with someone who has had modification to
Their skull
Their neck
Their internal fluids to compensate for kinetic energy absorbed from the skull and neck, to prevent internal damage to the brain
The brain itself to be just plain old more durable
The spinal column and legs and shoulders to support this new head and brain without causing severe pain
And billions and billions in research money.

All because you couldn't realize that if it's actually a part of the human body, a metal bullet proof plate causes more problems than it fixes.

>>33673251
what you fail to see is that the area is not the same. if the fluid is being changed out, then you can mimic an area that is many times larger than your torso. yes the head is smaller than the chest. yes the fluid is already optimal. but, with a change in viscosity and flow, it can take the kinetic energy and diffuse it out of the head to the air or whatever the hell you want.

to reiterate, you go from plate to fluid to external environment in the form of hot fluid. the brain is left unharmed and while exposed to hot fluids, its not as bad as being dead so i digress.

>>33673267
Being hotter than necessary is even worse for a brain than pure kinetic energy.

A fever of 104 can cause permanent brain damage if not kept in VERY close check, and ice that you're pretty much guaranteed death at best.

And venting it as a heated gas would mean the brain has nothing to be suspended in.

It still causes more problems than it solves. You seem to be ignoring the sides of the head, the eyes, the mouth, the neck that will support this.

There is no reason ever to mount a plate to the head permanently.
A helmet solves all this shit because a round can, if the helmet is designed right, simply transfer the energy to the helmet but the helmet simply flies off the head having done fuck all to it.

>>33673289
disregarding temperature, the point is that it's not a static fluid which means it can transfer more energy in that short distance. a helmet still transfers the shock to your head and can cause concussions. the fluid is ejected and can be replenished using an exchanger or a lumbar IV of some sort.the plates shock would be pushed out. the main edges of the skull can be padded with a support that doubles as your helmet anyway. hell, even your helmet will still transfer the shock to the head to an extent so the main system is still useful to implement.

>>33673311
And you are still running off of fucking magic.

Yes fluid will help.
But no. It will not help enough.
Nothing you can do will do anything but make you die by a slightly smaller margin.

And yeah, helmets still cause concussions. I'm not saying they don't. They're not designed to stop bullets though (most of them aren't at least)

So.
You're still assuming heat won't fry your brain, the fluid will Be both thick enough to keep your brain from banging against the walls whilst also not being hard enough to cause problems itself, that the heat conversion mechanism will even work to the extent you need, that the weight won't fuck the soldiers neck legs and shoulders, that the steel plate will be enough to even stop the round, that your people will even be willing to undergo this absurd and pointless modification, and finally, that you overall will even need this ever.

>>33672966
I could just hit you in the head with a sledgehammer and save the bullet.

>>33673158
So what im hearing is we just need to replace the material the brain is made out of because god gave us niggr tier durability. Silicon based neurons when?

>>33673184
There is not shitloads of energy in a speeding bullet.

The energy in a 7.62 NATO at muzzle won't even heat 1L of water a single degree Celsius.

>>33673261
I never asked for this.

>>33672966
Probably not. You'd need some kind of buffer layer to absorb the shock and something to prevent your neck from snapping. Kevlar bandanas only work in Cyberpunk 2020 and anime.

Good thread.

>if you implanted a steel plate in your head, could you survive a headshot from a nato round?
I'm no physician, but I do know that regardless of other trauma, rapid or unexpected acceleration, deceleration, and rotation of the brain is really really bad.

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Deep hole is .308
Glance and small hole is .303

Neither penned but they both rounds threw the plate 5m over the mound.

>>33673158
plus helmets have a suspension system, they don't sit flush against the skull

>>33673084
>having a g36
>putting a cheap as fuck reddot on it.

that had better be a 22 or airsoft

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>>33674193
Should clarify, .308 was 155gn FMJ at ~2850fps and .303 was 174gn FMJ at ~2300fps

All shots taken at 100m

>>33672966
>head now weighs an additional 12+ pounds
>head gains an inch of radius on all sides
>severe medical issues and heavy metal poisoning imminent

Think before you post.

>>33673138
Wolfie eventually dies because the metal skeleton is poisonous. He only lived so long because he has magic healing powers that kept the poison at bay for a while.

>>33672966
one thin enough not to be noticed or to replace the skull? It wouldn't do jack shit however if you got the thickness of 2/3 of a standard rifle plate it might stop small pistol rounds but because the plate is directly next to your skull cavity the shock will travel through the liquid suspension and straight into your brain. Either killing you or turning you into a vegetable

tl:dr buy a ballistic helmet

>>33673138
>titanium
raw titanium is actually quite soft, it's a common misconception that it is harder then steel. It has a higher HARDNESS TO WEIGHT ratio and is only used when strength and low weight is absolutely needed to justify the price increase (it is also used within surgery because it's highly corrosion resistant and won't rust inside you)

It would be an awful idea to replace the entire skeleton with titanium especially because YOU NEED IT TO MAKE BLOOD.

>>33674207
>frenchcuck speech
> "energy 2.0J"
gee I wonder. faggit.

>>33672966
Many peopke do survive head shots even at close range. Unless you hit the fatal T there is a good chance the bullet will reflect off your skull or simply knock you unconscious. Welk with a hand gun at least rifles are probably a diffrent story.

>>33672966
If it were thick enough, doesn't mean the transfer of energy from the round to the plate and then from the plate to your skull and from your skull to your brain wouldn't pulverize your brain and kill you anyways.

>>33673122
That would make sense. They don't need classes, after all.

>>33673079
Pff, implying you don't put it in front of your face with heavy springs attached instead of implanting it inside.

>>33678480
That's called a helmet.

>>33673045
Livestream it. Duh.

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>>33673071
>It would end with you dying from brain trauma (or being lobotomized, even worse) instead of dying from hydrostatic shock liquidating your brain.

Only one person so far has pointed out this bullshit, and only sort of.

Like the other guy said, the energy delivered to your head would be like being hit in the head with a baseball bat. Would it do damage? Yes. It would probably give you a concussion.

But fuck me, why does everyone think that being hit with a bullet cause this space-time rending cosmic blast in your body that causes all your tissue to explode? Fuck! The anatomy of a human head has mechanisms for surviving some degree of blunt trauma (which in this case, basically is). If you tripped, fell and smacked your head, you wouldn't be practically guaranteed to die, like you somehow think. Your brain isn't going to turn to a liquefied mass of protoplasm if you're hit in the head (on a steel plate no less - the energy would be largely distributed across the plate) with 3.5kJ of energy. 3.5kJ isn't all that much. If anything, the baseball bat example was being generous. Does it feel like you got hit in the arm with a baseball bat every time you fire a rifle chambered in 7.62 nato? No? Is your shoulder exploding into a bloody paste? No? Not much is going to change if the energy is distributed across a steel plate.

>b-but muh hydrostatic shock

That's not even what it's called, fucknuggets.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cavitation

And again, it wouldn't do nearly as much damage as you implied for the reasons I stated above.

Furthermore, if you believe that actual hydrostatic shock is a real thing (the idea that if you're hit in one part of your body it causes blood vessels to rupture in some other part of your body, killing you), then you have no business even discussing this topic.

>>33678646
>I got cavitation and hydrostatic shock mixed up.
It was 2 in the fucking morning.

And I am also the baseball bat comparison anon.

I was tired.

Anyways, 3.5 kj to the shoulder is one thing, not even accounting for the fact that a shoulder is a it more fleshy than a skull.
I still get nasty bruises from firing 7.62s.
You seem to forget about butt pads, and the fact that most rifles have the stock slightly offset for turning rearward energy into rotational energy.

All of this compared to a piece of metal hitting a steel plate.
Head on.
That also is connected to something that can be damaged quite badly just by someone tripping and falling, and all those things compounded together still leads me to believe that you can and will most likely die of traumatic brain injuries if shot in a steel plate riveted to your skull.
The dampening systems, kinetic to thermal energy conversion shit, the problems with the neck spine knees shoulders and heavy metal poisoning, all this means it's fucking pointless.

No. It doesn't vaporize your brain.
It smashes it like a 7oz lunch sirloin with fries instead of a baked potato so it's as tender and melt in your mouth as can be...fuck I'm hungry.
Still though.
It won't liquefy it. It'll still smash your brain enough to kill you.