Was Pershing right in telling other allied commanders to fuck

>>33618806
Never heard of him. So he was probably a bitch.

>>33618806
>gave the french all the blacks and said "I dont want them back"

seems like a fair trade

>>33618817
Did that happen? I thought US casualties were higher than most allied forces, partly due to leadership.

>>33618845
>I thought US casualties were higher than most allied forces, partly due to leadership.

Not even close, US casualties were very light in comparison to their time in the war.

>>33618806
Roughly 20% of US combat casualties came from two divisions that were put under French command during the Battle of Soissons. While at the same time they said that Pershing was mad because he did some frontal assaults that worked. So, yeah.

>>33618813
i can't tell the difference between ironic shitposting and newfaggery

>>33619921
Never heard of the bitch. No irony, but you might be a newfag.

>>33619935
Actually, newfags can't google. You just outed yourself. Queer.

>>33619950
No I don't care. There's the distinction.

"Newfag newfag newfag", yes you are.

>>33619974
>merely pretending

>>33618845
>I thought US casualties were higher than most allied forces
You can't be serious.

>>33619982
Pretending what? I told you I don't know who the fuck he is. Probably because nobody cares in America. Therefore unimportant.

>>33618806
Honestly he was wrong. The American tactics in 1918 were almost exactly the same as everyone else's from 1914, which was to close with the enemy and destroy, and what are these new fangled Maxim guns? The fresh soldiers tipped the balance because everyone else was fucking exhausted, but Pershing probably could have saved a lot of lives by listening to the French and British

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>>33619995
>>33619974
>>33619935
>>33618817

>>33620038
You say that. but it worked.

>>33620038
>thinking Pershing didn't know about machineguns
>When he used them against Villa, the Flips and got to see the Russians and Japs duke it out first hand as an official observer

Wat?

The reason Pershing didn't want to give up command of his forces was because the French and British were more interested in throwing more men into the meat grinder and using his men in the same way they had been using them the past two years, they were only interested in more cannon fodder so they could have a larger number to throw against the krauts. They saw the AEF more as gap filler than as a separate force that could be used to engage in operations and put pressure along the front. Even in 1918, Foch was still of the mindset of "Just one more big push!" and battles like Soissons show that.

>>33620038

> could have saved a lot of lives by listening to the French and British

the French are literally pants on head retarded. They wore bright red pantaloons to battle in the early stages of the war in fucking line formation toward machine guns.

>>33620144
>Everyone was using line formation in 1914

I hear this hot little meme in every WW1 thread but have yet to see a single source for it.

>>33620164

battle of the frontiers near Alsace Lorraine for the French. There was 1 battle involving Austrians using column advancing or line advancing getting mowed down as well.

>>33620238
There is no source I can find to back up that claim.

I tend to think it is either propaganda or historical revisionism that has passed into pseudofact territory.

Besides, I'm pretty sure the line formation was well gone by the turn of the century (2nd Boer War had no mention of it used) with the Zulu War being the last real war it was implemented in (Against an enemy that for the most part lacked firearms or bows)

>>33620341
>I tend to think it is either propaganda or historical revisionism that has passed into pseudofact territory.
alive and well in 2017

>>33620341
I think it has a lot to do with how it's hard for people to understand just how incompetent commanders of the time were and so just try to come up with excuses to explain it away.

>/k/ doesn't like the great war

sad

>>33621895
The great war was fought between empires, arguably the second one was more a fight between national ideology. Empires are dead, the fight over ideology continues to this day, so people are more drawn to it.

Or maybe I'm just full of shit.

>>33618813
>Never heard of him. So he was probably a bitch.

the first post on a thread about john pershing.
damn, this is truly a pitiful indictment of the state /k/ has fallen too.

the fact that "Pershing is the only American to be promoted in his own lifetime to General of the Armies, the highest possible rank in the United States Army" would be by itself a reason to know who he is.

>>33618806
>Was Pershing right in telling other allied commanders to fuck off when they wanted direct control of his forces?
yes both brits and French will slaughter other nationalities before their own

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>>33625513
>Pershing is the only American to be promoted in his own lifetime to General of the Armies, the highest possible rank in the United States Army

General Black Jack Pershing is literally "the Man". The only other person to be bestowed the rank of 5 star general is George Washington, and that was done in 1975 during the bicentennial celebrations of the founding of the US of A.

>>33620341
Even the Germans advanced in line against Brit regulars in the first large battle involving the BEF (The First Marne if I'm correct).

>>33619995
John J. "Black Jack" Pershing was the senior American officer in WWI and at present is the second highest ranked officer in the US military's history.

He served in the Indian Wars against the Sioux early in his career. He fought in the Spanish-American war and was cited for gallantry during the battles of Kettle and San Juan hills. During the Moro Rebellion he served with distinction and later commanded the Pancho Villa expedition into Mexico. In WWI he was in charge of the American Expeditionary Force and was promoted to General of Armies, the only person other than George Washington to hold this rank and the only person to hold it during their lifetime. It is the equivalent of a 6-star general.

Additionally he served as a mentor to such minor names as Marshall, Eisenhower, Bradley, Patton, and MacArthur. He was the namesake of the M26 Pershing tank, making him the only American to have a tank named after them while living. He created the originsl blueprint for the Interstate Highway system. Oh, and he fucked Patton's sister and had the balls to ask de Gaulle how Petain was doing, while Vichy France was still a thing.

>>33626936
>literally never happened

>>33626936
I'm pretty Supreme Allied Commander Eisnhower was also a 5 star general

>>33619083
>>33619993
I think what he means is the US took way more causalities than it should have in the short time due to poor leadership. We learned the lessons of 1914 against armies that have been doing this for more the 3 years.

>>33627978
>He was the namesake of the M26 Pershing tank
kinda shitty since he helped cause the 20-year stagnation of american armored forces by testifying to congress that the tank corps should be given to the infantry

>>33628162
Because the Cavalry did so much better during the interwar period.

>>33628670
we didn't have a tank named after johnny herr, now, did we?

>>33628682
>Naming a tank after Herr
He would fight you if you tried it.

He'd also declare victory because we used horse cavalry at least as recently as Dubya's term.

>>33628739
so like i was saying, naming tanks after officers who actively stunted their development was dumb

>>33628791
He wasn't wrong, in fact he was ahead of his time. He just used the wrong vehicle for his vision.

>>33628857
dunno if you're talking about herr or pershing at this point, but ok to either i guess

>>33628857
>>33628884
Your both retarded, can we return to the original subject of this thread?

>>33629210
>Your

>>33627978
>asked de Gaulle about Petain

Nice

>>33620341
I would absolutely be willing to believe that non colonial European officers did have their heads that far up their own asses. It was a generation sine the last war in Europe. Changes were made so rapidly to the point where I don't that there could be anybody that truly understood what the situation was going to be.

As for OPs question I personally wouldn't want to put my forces under foreign command because you just fucking know they're going to use them as expendable chaff to protect their own.

>>33627978
>ask de Gaulle how Petain was doing, while Vichy France was still a thing.

The absolute MADMAN!

>>33628059
He was.

Pershing was a General of the Armies though which is what I think they were referring to, which is equivalent of a six star general.

Five star: General of the Army/Air Force, etc
Six star: General of the Armies (as in everyone regardless of branch).