So what does /k/ think about the Army's new sidearm? I would

>>32729284
thing about modular is it can fit with many different body/hand types. ambi controls, grip modules, safety(required in .mil) - Glock has 0.zero chance.

>>32729297
I doubt the Army will purchase compact frames, so not sure how modularity is important outside of easy parts replacement.

Is the P320 even available with a safety? I've never seen one.

Wonder how the ergonomics are compared to the M9

glock would never bother going through the hassle of overhauling the 17 to include a manual safety. theres nothing really to appeal. i bet any amount of money there was a pistol that performed better than the sig in the trials, but sig had the better deal.

plus, glock has more to worry about losing police contracts to smith & wesson and SIG than a military contract they never really had a chance with.

>>32729319
>I've shot both

Full-size Sig P320 is superior in every way

>>32729319
>>32729342
The 320 is a very comfy and easy gun to shoot.

>>32729319
>Wonder how the ergonomics are compared to the M9

The Sig P320 with its default medium size grip module is much more forgiving to people with smaller hands. One of the problems with the M9 for people with small hands is the size of the grip. Pair that up with not being able to get enough of your finger on the trigger with a DA/SA gun that isn't really taught how to be shot correctly and you have a lousy shooter.

I had a P320C for a very brief time and put 500 rounds through it before selling it but its ergos are on point.

>>32729284
>appealing the decision
Uh no. Glock doesn't get to cry and appeal shit unless they have evidence that the contract was somehow rigged in SIGs favor.

>>32729338
This meme needs to die. Glock is quite capable of adding a manual safety to their guns and it's likely that the MHS offer had one. We saw 21SF's with them for the JCP competition. If SIG beat them out, it was for other more concrete reasons. Not that Glock couldn't be bothered to add a manual safety for a 580M contract because they're lazy

The p250 in 45 is probably one of my favorite pistols, so I'm pretty happy about the military making the switch.

>>32729800
>concrete reasons
Occam's razor: the sig is cheaper

>>32729284
Owned one.
It was less comfy to carry than a Glock but slightly nicer shooting. For open carry, as long as it doesn't cost more than the Glock, it's a better choice.
That said, it's really sad the military went with them over the M&P imo.

>>32729284
Had a chance to fingerfuck it at LGS an hour ago. Feels nice, fire control group can be extracted by another move of a takedown lever as a part of a field strip - I guess it'll be really nice to clean. Same FCG goes into different frames. From what I saw, the slide is more complicated than usual (say, P226), with smaller parts - may be a problem in sandy environments, but wtf do I know. Mags have plastic floorplates, unless stock P226, won't pinch your palm if you make a slightest mistake while seating the mag. They had a full size (fits just like P226) and compact (the grip is a bit short for my hand), but not carry, it would be interesting to look at that, too. Mags are interchangeable like Glock - longer mags fit shorter grips just fine.


I'm really hoping that either SIG will make a Legion FCG for it, or someone else comes with an improved trigger - the stock trigger is, how do I put it, mil-grade, if you catch my drift.

Overall, very nice impression, despite my hate to plastic. Gotta admit, it doesn't look cool, but It Just Works. Especially now that you can replace plastic parts without a need to replace the FCG.

>>32729315
Of course they will purchase some compact frames. More importantly they will purchase different grip sizes.

Yes, the gun that won the competition had a 1911 style safety.

>>32730150

The X Five (formerly the Target, and before that the Competition) may actually come out this year with a flat trigger that's been worked over. I plan on getting one.

>>32730150
>'m really hoping that either SIG will make a Legion FCG for it, or someone else comes with an improved trigger - the stock trigger is, how do I put it, mil-grade, if you catch my drift.
The x320 series looks nice.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ID9k8U62a7s

If the P320 is anything like the P250 I hate it. Something about the grip shape made me hit the mag release with my long index finger when I was squeezing the trigger.

>>32730301
>use the wrong size grip for your hands
>blame the gun when you mess up

>>32730291
Going to get the carry version in a heartbeat it really is the same size as a Glock 19

>>32730351
Yeah, it looks sweet.

>>32730150
The trigger is fine. Slightly better than Glock. Slightly below the VP9 and PPQ. Miles above the M&P and about equal with the M&P with Apex or XD.

Definitely better than average for a striker

>>32730351
Compact is about the size of the G19 (little wider). Not the Carry. The Carry has the Compact size slide and barrel but the full-size grip.

>>32729315
yes, the Mass version has a safety

>>32730381
>VP9
VP9 trigger drives me nuts with its "trigger safety", and is quite, for a lack of better word, ratcheting, especially on reset. I haven't had a chance to shoot P320 yet, but I'd venture to guess that it feels better just because there are no extra moving parts - but that's just a guess at this point. In any case, dry firing it feels better than VP9 (also have it).

>>32729284
I like the P320. Have one in 357 Sig just for fucking around. I prefer it over Glock.

>>32729315
I had a stint where we had to cc in theater. Having a compact instead of shoving an m9 in my pants would have been a God send.

>>32732597
>>32724271

>>32729861
There was also talks and plans drawn about heavily reworking the chosen system. I imagine Sig might have also been chosen for the fact that they have the manufacturing capabilities to machine aluminum receivers as well, which the military is probably going to go with.

>>32729284
Modularity is absolutely retarded.

Pistols are completely fucking worthless.

They should have just grabbed an off the shelf contract for a medium frame pistol llike a Glock 19 and called it a day.

They will NEVER use the modularity features on these guns because they are useless in the first place.

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>>32734503
Sergeant Kasal might disagree. It's nice to have a backup -- especially indoors.

>>32729284
Fuck no the P320 is just better

>>32729960
Out of all the striker fired guns I've tried I've definitely liked the P320 and VP9 the best. The M&P doesn't impress me with its lame trigger, and meh sights.

>>32729284
So, is this a step up from my 226? I love the trigger and the ergo of the 226, do I need one of these now, too? Was going to go small and get a 938, but now I'm thinking I need one of these as well.

>combat proven platform
It's a fucking bog standard pistol you failed abortion

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>>32729284

>>32729284
Sure doesn't look good

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>>32729284
>So what does /k/ think about the Army's new sidearm?
They should have chosen one of the USP variants a loooong time ago.
9mm USP compact would have been more than enough for an ideal sidearm.
>lightweight
>ergonomic
>large simple controls
>decocker and manual safety
>slide finish that can withstand everything from gritty mud, humidity, to salt water
>80% ambidextrous
>extremely tough cannon grade barrel
>amazingly long barrel lifespan
>slides are machined from a solid piece of ordnance grade steel
>polymer frames are reinforced with steel
The US Army should rethink this...

Some generals are getting some cushy post-service jobs in Exeter.

The Beretta does not need replacement, especially for another 9mm. They should have just replaced the Sig M11 with the Gen3 G19, and kept the M9 for general issue..

I was hoping Glock wins so everybody saves money but SIG is fine too, I guess.

Just hope it becomes a wee bit cheaper.

>>32735559
It's already pretty fucking cheap. Don't be such a Jew.

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>>32735559
>Just hope it becomes a wee bit cheaper.
A FUCKING ANCHOR.

My point? They're probably going to charge more for it just because it's used & endorsed by the US Army.
They'll probably make models that are stamped with a star or the Army coat of arms and charge an obscene amount for it on the civilian market.

>>32735532
The Beretta is worn out. How does it not need a replacement? And why on earth would they choose a Glock? Some people have taste you know.

>>32735400
>13 round magazine
>weighs more than the m9
Lolno

What happened to them choosing glock?

>>32729284
With the G19 already having an NSN and already being in inventory for SOF use, I would've preferred them just going "yeah we're doing this" and skipping wasting hundreds of millions of taxpayer dollars, but yeah.

There really is no reason for the military to have a full size handgun, but opinions.

I dislike the trigger in the p320, it's outrageously long and heavy for a striker gun. The whole modularity thing will go largely if not completely unutilized because they do not trust soldiers to keep small, critical parts on hand, so the guns will forever sit in default full size configuration while armorers steal everything else to resell on ebay, and SOF will continue on with the G19s they've had for 5 years because fuck manual safeties.

>>32736999
>>There really is no reason for the military to have a full size handgun, but opinions.

Disagree. For guard duty, officers, MP's in green zones, a full size pistol is exactly what you want. No I don't want to be door kicking with a SIG 320 with an extended mag as my primary, but for any of the previously outlined roles a full size pistol is desirable.

>>32735400
>costs twice as much

>>32735400
USP is a shit
>low mag capacity
>rail system that was out of date 15 years ago
>big and heavy for what it does
>shitty plastic mags for 9mm and. 40
>not ergonomic- kek how can you even claim it is

>>32737359
>>shitty plastic mags for 9mm and. 40
Are you retarded?

>>32729284
I bought a compact model for myself for graduation right before Christmas. Haven't even shot it yet but I'm stoked on it.

>>32736999
There's actually a ton of reasons the military would want a compact or even subcompact handgun.

Modularity is a good thing.

There is no way around the previous statement.

They aren't wasting money by adopting this pistol, they'd have to spend a similar amount on a same sized Glock order

>>32737359
Seeing as they are modifying the Sig for the Army, it seems like they could easily modify the USP. They could easily use steel mags and change the rail to a picatinny. And unless you have soft baby hands there is nothing wrong with the USP.

>>32730150
Same here. Fingerfucked one at the LGS I went to on Saturday precisely because it won the contract.

Felt rather nice in the hand, and the trigger felt quite good. Definitely better than a Glock trigger.

The take up is short and smooth. The break is pretty crisp and clean, however rather heavy.

>>32734503
Even ignoring the modularity and the fact that now the military can replace worn "guns" without actually replacing the "gun", The P320 is better than a Glock. Feels better in the hand, looks better, better trigger, and comes with an external safety.

>>32736999
The P320 trigger is better than a Glock trigger.

>>32729284
i bought one last summer.
better trigger than glocks but not as good as walthers. shoots a lot like its patriarch 226. i prefer glocks with a lighter connector still tbqh

millions of dollars spent on something that barely gets used.

>>32729284
I like mine. Hopefully this means we'll get surplus mags for cheap.

>>32737387
are you? the mags are all plastic
people that try to use the extended hk45 series mag release end up ruining the 9mm and .40 mags

they aren't like glock mags that are metal lined unless we are talking about the newer 18 round 9mm mags which are retardedly expensive

>>32737505
>installs a mag release designed for metal mags
>damages plastic mags
I-i-its shit guiz, it totally wasn't my f-f-fault.

>>32729800
I 100% agree that Glock is just lazy. They don't want to change any part of their manufacturing process that would add a manual safety.

I think many first time buyers are moving to the M&P beacues they have the option. Glock just needs to make it an option and they would grow their market.

>>32737505
It's impossible to make metal mags since the stock mags are plastic.

>>32737403
I can see why they'd want a modular pistol.

99.9% of soldiers that get issued pistols will never see a single piece of the modular system though, relegating the modularity to cool-guy units (the ones that actually shoot people with pistols), who already have and use G19s.

I never said a Glock would be cheaper pistol for pistol, I bitched about the money spent to conduct the trials.

>>32737452
>the P320 trigger is better than a Glock trigger
No. And thats not endorsing the Glock trigger either, its still bad, the P320 is just worse.

>>32729284
I expected M&P to win, but what is the difference between polymer pistols with a flashlight rail anyways?

>>32735400
The USPs are not lightweight. They are very heavy for polymer guns. I say this as a lover of the gun. The P30 series is much lighter.

>>32729338
Companies bend over backwards to get these multimillion dollar contracts. I'm sure they would find it worth their time to include a safety.

>>32737626
>P320 is just worse
t.someone who's never shot the P320

>>32737505
Thats only for the fullsize USPs, and you don't need the extended mag release, its a luxury.

>>32737523
>>32738407
the stock mag release is small as shit
the usp compact uses metal mags but still has all the other problems of the usp

wanting the usp over any newer hk like the p30, hk45, vp9, or p2000 series makes no fucking sense, it is analogous to wanting to adopt a walther p38 over a beretta m9a3

>>32729284
I think it's a good design. Mine was a lemon. Traded it for an xd. Couldn't be happier. It's still a great idea though.

I won't be buying another one now that it's military and all the tacti-sexuals will want one cause it's military.

>>32729284
Glocks don't have a pic rail, or safety, the sights break off, the plastic mags don't feed into the magwell as easily when dirty, and on top of that they don't have this whole modular frame thing the sig has. If anything the FNS stood a chance because it's ambidextrous, the Glock literally has nothing going for it anymore. The sights breaking off issue alone is a big reason why the military should avoid it, it would cost them money replacing all those sights.

"Combat proven" my ass. Maybe they sold some batches to militaries that didn't want to spend a lot on their sidearms. I guarantee they had a host of problems when actually putting them to combat use.

>>32738539
>the stock mag release is small as shit

So? It still works fine. Stop judging guns by the 30 seconds you fingerprinted your friends gun in his grimy ass living room.

So, is the P320 a meme gun or is it actually good? Saw Dugan talk about it and it seemed really good.

>>32738539
I don't like guns with finger groves. The USP 45 with extended floorplate fits my hands perfectly. The HK45 grips are really weird. They make me feel uncomfortable, like I just shook someones hand and their hand was slimy. The VP9 is great but I prefer DA/SA triggers. No complaints about the VP9 though. I haven't shot the P30 or P2000 so I can't comment on those. You seem determined to hate the USP.


>all the other problems of the us
Can you elaborate on that?

>>32729338
>glock has more to worry about losing police contracts to smith & wesson and SIG

They're losing to FN and SIG. No agency is adopting m&pieces of garbage anymore. The only ones that have then still are the ones that got stuck with them.

So far at least in my locality the state troopers switched from SIG to FN and 2 city agencies switched from Glock to FN. But I think now that the p320 has some rep we'll see more agencies switching to SIG as they've done in the past. That modular design is very helpful considering officers/soldiers have different sized hands. FN was supposed to do that, supposedly that's why they were selling all their FNS40s off for like $300, because they were going to release a new modular frame/caliber conversion model. Not sure if that's still going to happen.

>>32738763
Yeah there is nothing wrong with the stock mag release. I put an extendo on mine and it's fucking great.

You can never have a pistol thread without some assholes jumping in with the whole MUH HK BEST bullshit.

>>32738856
You can never have a pistol thread without people bashing HK's and acting like they're garbage. It's okay to like other guns, I do. But don't act like they're bad guns just because new ones are expensive. If people didn't attack HK's you wouldn't hear people defending them.

I handled one briefly a few days ago. There's a tiny gap between the frame and slide, but it's big and loose enough you can pinch them together and the slide moves 1/16, possibly even 1/8 of an inch. The gave me serious doubt about its accuracy.

>>32738780
Seems decent desu. I can't get over that comical bore axis though, ON A FUCKING STRIKER GUN TOO LMAO.

It's still a sig and will likely have similar problems other sigs have had. Once other companies copy the modular design the fad should die out.

>glock
>combat proven
It's a cop pistol, nothing more. Fuck off Glockfags your pistol doesn't meed half the army requirements.

We gonna get cheap m9s soon?

>>32738912
All pistols have the same accuracy. The accuracy of the poor sap that put down his rifle when he shouldn't have.

>>32738667
>doesn't realize that Glocks can and do also ship with factory steel night sights
>doesn't know about the various mil groups using Glocks
pic rail doesnt matter when the rail takes normal accessories

>>32738763
you sound like a gun owner that doesn't actually use his shit

>>32738811
I don't even hate the USP in .45 but it is severely overpriced for how outdated it is. The USP fits my hands well enough but it is heavy for a polymer gun with a pretty low capacity for the size. When HK was doing the rebates with the release of the vp9 the USP was a good deal. At normal prices it isn't.

I listed the other reasons earlier in the quote thread

>>32738856
kek, this

>>32739018
They'll probably just chop them up and throw them away.

>>32729342
>I've shot both
>Full-size Sig P320 is superior in every way

smells better too

>>32739283
They should sell them dirt cheap to:
Albania
Latvia
Slovenia
Estonia
Lithuania
Bulgaria
Croatia
Slovakia
Romania

>>32739370
Or sell cheap as fuck $250 m9s in the US. I want my poorfag price m9s.

>>32739210
The Glock rail only takes Glock rail accessories. The gap is too wide or too loose (can't remember, but it doesn't fit) for the bar on a pic accessory.

>>32738816

What do the FN pistols offer over the Glocks? I never really warmed up to them but thought they were okay guns.

The P320 will definitely have more LEO adopters and then more civilian gun owners following. Few like the Oklahoma Highway Patrol and Hawaii DPS have chosen the platform a while ago. I'm a little surprised the P320 supposedly failed the FBI trials as the requirements seemed to have been written for the Sig P320 but I guess they got a few lemons into the trial which hurt them.

>>32730291

Say what you want about SIG, they are at least innovating.

>>32739588
>What do the FN pistols offer over the Glocks?

$100 cheaper, metal sights, metal mags, actual pic rail, full time ambidextrous (much easier one hand operation if your main hand is down), front slide serrations for press checks, magazine floorplate lip for one handed stripping (it's impossible to strip a Glock mag during a phase 2 malfunction one handed unless you use your teeth)

>>32734740
>step up from my 226?
I don't think it is, at least not yet. I'm tempted to get the Carry just for the hell of it.

>get a 938
Go for it, you won't regret it: >>32724271

P320 and P938 are two totally different guns, with different feel, and different purpose.

>>32737460
Just fingerfucked P320 again, next to P30SK. Got me thinking that P320 feels more like Glock - muted and dull, unlike HK which is totally crisp.

Still, modularity is a big deal, and I'm hoping that there will be improvements to all the things in P320. All in all, all it needs to do is punch holes when you need it to.

Quick question, is cleaning your gun everyday bad for it? I'm sort of new to firearms. Also didn't wanna make a thread

>>32738912
>slide moves
This is not the only gun where the slide moves. A lot (but not all) VP9s have the same trait, and it doesn't affect the accuracy a single bit. In fact, I'm shooting better fast groups and controlled pairs with VP9 than with my favorite 226 Legion, though I really hate the trigger on VP9 - it bites my trigger finger.

>>32740427
There's no need to clean it everyday. If it's a carry gun, especially a pocket carry, clean it every few weeks to remove lint. Typically a decent gun will function even with lint/dust in it.

If you're using something harsh like hoppes you could actually be stripping the finish by cleaning it excessively. Use something like a non-harsh dish soap, dry it all off, then apply grease and lube (not excessively, you only need a little bit on the high friction areas). Frog lube is good, but there are cheaper generics.

>>32740427
That's too much.

Every time you take it shooting is plenty and on modern center fire firearms not even necessary; or if it's been sitting around for months and months, or if you've been carrying it for a few weeks if lint and other general people gunk has built up but most people aren't particularly linty.

.22s, old surplus, and black powder guns require more care.

>>32740947
Also never use hoppes. That shit is Walmart tier. I don't get why it's so many people's go-to. That shit destroyed my museum grade Makarov. It now looks like it spent the last decade in a fat guys waistband in Florida.

>>32738912
Considering your sights and barrel are attached to the slide, it doesn't really matter if it has a lose fit on the frame.

Lmao I bought one a week ago and it's waiting at my LGS for pickup

MUAHAH I'm stoked

>>32735559
>a bit cheaper
It's already the same price as a Glock 19, and they won't have to replace a whole gun when it breaks, just the piece that broke. Money saving on point.

>>32734503
You're a total retard. Military use DESTROYS guns, and usually parts don't wear out at the same time. For instance, being able to swap out new grips for $40 instead of $400 is a godsend.

>>32730150

When the 92 became the sidearm of the military I'm sure that everyone touted about how ugly it was compared to a 1911, now everyone posts A E S T H E T I C at the Beretta and its looks.

The age of 80s and 90s action movies are over, and we are now in the age of "everything you like is bad" so the 320 won't get the same iconic movie treatment sadly. I would be interested to see how it would have weathered the days of Die Hard and Demolition Man like action.

I'm gonna call it right now though, after a couple years of showing up in movies and shows subtly, people are going to talk about how pretty it is. Based on the shape of the frame and slide down the length of the barrel, and the modularity, they're probably gonna talk about how it's "sexy, like a fine cut diamond that you can recut depending on how you feel that day". It's probably going to get the aesthetic title after a number of years like the Beretta did.

>>32740965
Tfw you recently used hoppes


Can you elaborate why it's shit-tier?

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>>32729284

>The only problem with the M9 is that ethnic manlets and women can't handle it.

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>>32740031
>>32739588

What he said plus better out of the box trigger more conventional grip angle and awesome control placement and general composition, seriously if you are a shooter's kind of shooter you will fall in love.

>>32738918

it's like 2mm higher than a Glock 17. i never noticed the difference in felt recoil between my G17 gen 3 and my P320.

the sig also has conversion kits

>>32740398
I have a hk p30sk and I will never go back to glock again although I do own a 19 and won't ditch it because it was my first gun.

>>32739540
They should just hand them out for for free. The taxpayers already paid for them once.

>>32729284
Literally everyone under JSOC is using the glock. Sig go home.

You know, the people that actually kill people.

Also a hilarious chunk of US police and the FBI. (also people that actually kill people)

>>32739540
They will sooner be destroyed than sold to the public

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>>32743631

>>32743268
Maybe because he used it on shit-tier guns.

I've used both bore cleaner and copper remover on my handguns, no ill effects to barrel finish (you shouldn't be using those anywhere else to begin with).

They do require special precautions, though - RTFM before using.

>>32729284
Glock will be fine.

>>32729800
With the scale they are producing and selling on, it might actually not be worth it even for the contract.

Will this affect the price of the P320? Will the price go up because the demand has increased or will the price be lowered because the supply has increased?

>>32729284
>since it's a combat-proven platform
Using this logic, literally nothing new would ever be adopted. Pretty retarded attitude, and one you see from Glock fans quite often.

>>32729284

how much different is this than a 2022 or p250? i've been looking at a few lower end siggies for my first handgun

>>32745982
>how much different is this than a 2022 or p250?
The 2022 is essentially a polymer-framed P229, so very different. The P320 is basically just a striker version of the P250, which is a DAO hammer-fired pistol - albeit with a trigger pull quite a bit lighter than most DA/SA or DAO pistols. There's even some parts compatibility I think. I was interested in one initially, but apparently they've been discontinued and now with our military adopting the P320...well the choice is obvious to me.

>>32729284
Will be good to see Glock dethroned. Eventually Glockfags will no longer to be able to use ubiquity and aftermarket support as excuses for their dogmatic fanboyism.

All P320 reserves have been snatched following the news. Fuck

>>32735400
Price is the deciding factor anon.

>>32732597
damn bro, I can Imagine.

>>32734473
>machine aluminum receivers
>aluminum framed P320
3 GUN CHAMPION COMING THROUGH.

>>32734473
>I imagine Sig might have also been chosen for the fact that they have the manufacturing capabilities to machine aluminum receivers as well, which the military is probably going to go with.
That'd be...awesome.

>>32743631
P320 has only been out for what, two years?

Give it a few purchasing cycles and you'll see a ton of agencies using them.

>>32729284
glockfags on suicide watch

even tho I don't like glawk, striker fired or tuppershit pistols in general they should have just bought a fucking glock 19. most of NATO military issues them standard and 'murica gives them to the special forces cool kids anyways so just standardize the fucking thing across the board

oh well some general got a hefty payout I'm sure

>>32729960

100% agree about M&P

It's a good firearm with the easiest grip change system. American owned and made.