What's /k/'s opinion on having the first 1 or 2 shells

>>31074176

Stupid as hell, friend. You're assuming you'll have more than one shot. If you have to shoot someone, go hard.

>Birdshot
>HD

Never ever.

you should only shoot someone you intend to kill, and if you attempt to kill someone, you absolutely need to succeed.

>>31074176
Nope. 3" magnum buck and slugs alternating is how I roll.
The way I see it, it's gonna be very hard for someone to keep trying to kill me if they take a shot of that center mass.

>>31074176
>birdshot
>ever
Uh no.

Fucking stupid, that's what. Birdshot is for (surprise!) BIRDS.

Buckshot is for medium game (Deer, B.B. Americanus).

Slugs for everything else.

Long distance waterfowl loads make good HD rounds in my opinion. I load #2 and #3 steel shot.

Birdshot and target loads are too situational

Its more projectiles to go through walls and kill/maim people if you miss
Bird shot at close range is similar to buckshot
I'd just go with a fancy self defense load of your choice, preferably one without birdshot

I also only have a crappy .410 derringer as my only shotgun and haven't shot it that much so take my advice with a grain of salt

>>31074197
>>31074206
>>31074216
b-but muh overpenetration

>>31074206
>>31074224
I use No. 2 birdshot for home defense, and BB shot is fucking deadly. A shotguns biggest benefit is its ability to spread shot, so invest in that.

No. 00 buckshot is a meme, No. 4 buckshot is better in every way
>inb4 muh stoppin powah

Never understood the overpenetration meme.

Are that many of you fags still living with your parents or something? Who are you worried about shooting? Lord knows you don't have kids.

Fucking move out to your own place and put some 00 in the tube.

File: copythat.png (51KB, 493x356px) Image search: [Google]

51KB, 493x356px

>>31074289
Some people live in apartments or tight suburbs
>tfw no 150 acres innamountains

>>31074289
Seriously? You think all of us live in a house by ourselves? I have a roommate and neighbors with attached walls, I need to worry about things like over penetration. Call me a poor fag all you want, the average house price around is currently just over $1M and even then your neighbors are going to be very close. Apartments aren't much more affordable, but it's what I can swing.

>>31074289
>He's not worried about blasting through niggers and hitting his Faberge eggs and Tiffany crystal

>>31074289
Spotted the fewguns.
If I shoot through the walls I might hit my other guns.

>>31074283
double ott. say it with me. double ott.

>>31074176
not a good idea. what if the first shots were the ones that were meant to count and all you do is end up getting fucked because you managed to just wound the perp?

>>31074383
It's spelled "ought" you retard, but no it's No. 00 Buckshot.

>not using dragons breath for HD

>>31074383
"double ott"

>>31074283
>A shotguns biggest benefit is its ability to spread shot, so invest in that
>A shotguns biggest benefit is its ability to spread shot
>spread shot
>across-the-livingroom distance

See, this is how we know you're fucking retarded, tripfag.

Let alone the fact of using #2 shot.

File: double otters.jpg (515KB, 1024x683px) Image search: [Google]

515KB, 1024x683px

>>31074449

>>31074453
If you want to use a shotgun don't use fucking slugs, use shot. The more shot that sufficiently penetrates the better.

So yeah, No. 2 Birdshot, No. BB Birdshot, and No. 4 Buckshot penetrate enough and give you a wider payload than bigger buckshots.

>>31074176
WHY.

>>31074449
>>31074419
>>31074383
funny how "00 buck" is one of those ubiquitous gun items that makes it into popular culture. anytime a noguns is talking about shotguns it's always "uhuh uhuh uhuh (seth rogen laugh) muh double aught buckshot, that'll do ya"

Use Dragons Breath.
You'll scare the fuck out of anyone.

>>31074421
>not using a Ks23 with Бappикaдa for HD

>>31074535
It's seriously a done up meme, fuddterm, whatever you wanna call it. It's mythical nowadays, like the fohty fives stoppin powah, knock a man off his ass! Load her up with dubble ott and you'll blow the whole wall down!!

The truth is its a good choice if your shotgun is your primary weapon and you only carry one ammunition. Muzzle to 50 yards it's fairly effective for a lot of things and for a tactical situation it makes most sense for as many applications as possible to be handled with as few different rounds as possible; hence why the military uses it.

But the right tool for the right job. No. 00 isn't what our use for deer hunting or bird hunting or snake hunting. People hunting included, and indoors in a defensive scenario heavy birdshot / light buckshot is the way to go.

>>31074533
'cause live in an apartment and afraid of overpenetration

>>31074565
>You'll scare the fuck out of anyone.
You'll burn your fucking house down is what you'll do

>>31074176
I think loading the tube so that your last shell or two is something much louder than the rest of what you shot is useful. Not like anyone is going to be counting how many shots they take.

>>31074255
>2012
>not living in an IFC house

File: image.jpg (3MB, 4096x3072px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 4096x3072px

At ten feet it makes no difference. Bird shot or buck will make the same hole in Jamal. Beyond that, no. 4 is like a dozen .32 rounds. Don't know why you would use anything else.

>>31074255
Use #1 then.

File: image.jpg (96KB, 640x480px) Image search: [Google]

96KB, 640x480px

>>31075081
ICF.

>>31074593
00 isn't even the best buckshot size for HD
Federal #1 buck with flight control wad or gtfo

>>31074176
fucking stupid, don't do it.

>>31074283

I've taken a shitty old denim jacket lined with this fake fur stuff I got at a yard sale for a buck out to the woods. Folded it over on itself so it was maybe four layers of the material. Stopped #4 Magnum shell cold. 00 2 3/4 cut through it like butter.

Anything but 00 is a terrible, dangerous MUH OVERPENETRATION based lie.

>>31074176
>What's /k/'s opinion on having the first 1 or 2 shells birdshot and the rest of them buckshot in a HD shotgun?
I get the thinking if you've got kids in the house but it's not for me. There's only me and the fiance in the house and we're fairly out of the way.
7 rounds of Winchester PDX1 with 3 slugs and 3 No.1 Buck in the side saddle is my setup.

Anybody experimented with the Centurion buck and ball shells? Thoughts?

>>31074283
>Not using duplex no 4 s in 3in with a turkey choke.
It's like you don't want a baseball sized pattern at 60 yards

>>31074176
>What's /k/'s opinion on having the first 1 or 2 shells birdshot and the rest of them buckshot in a HD shotgun?
I get the thinking if you've got kids in the house but it's not for me. There's only me and the fiance in the house and we're fairly out of the way. If I'm in a position where I have to shoot you I want you down and staying down.
7 rounds of Winchester PDX1 with 3 slugs and 3 No. 1 Buck in the side saddle is my setup.

Anybody experimented with the Centurion buck and ball shells?

>>31075288
>>31075415
Fuck knows how I managed to post that twice.

File: 1419861362354.jpg (1005KB, 4000x4000px) Image search: [Google]

1005KB, 4000x4000px

>>31074206
>>31074224
let me shoot you with 12ga bird shot @ 5 feet and lets see how youre doing ok

>>31076014
I've seen footage of a college girl shot with birdshot at close range and she just went into shock and walked back up the stairs.
You think I'm gonna let RayRay and Tyrone have the same chance when they're full of PCP and coming to do me damage?
Fuck that noise.

>>31076014
Only if you let my brother or cousin shoot yourself in the same distance and in the same place with buck

>>31074289
The wife in another room

>>31074419
Aught.
You ought to know that by now.

File: 1470364805949.gif (905KB, 374x211px) Image search: [Google]

905KB, 374x211px

>>31076041
Kek, this guy's a fucking amateur. He's off balance after 3 shots.

>>31076014
>being this stupid
you never let me down /k/

>>31074176
All #4 buck. Rainbow loads are dumb and possibly could get you in trouble.

File: weak should fear the strong.jpg (19KB, 392x395px) Image search: [Google]

19KB, 392x395px

>>31076345
I noticed that shit too. Makes me wonder why we aren't pushing their shit in.

>>31074176
>HD shotgun

Your first mistake.

Birdshot is for birds and vermin. My HD load goes 00-slug-00-00-slug.

File: buckshot_1_remington_a.jpg (34KB, 444x296px) Image search: [Google]

34KB, 444x296px

1# buckshot masterrace

>>31074176
Birdshot is for birds. Are you being burgled by pigeons?

>>31076041
I think the first one got him, bud.

File: 1459738952832.jpg (25KB, 480x433px) Image search: [Google]

25KB, 480x433px

Not exactly the point of the thread but didn't seem like it warranted it's own.

Just got home with a mossberg 500. First shotgun I've ever owned. I was able to fit 8 in the magazine and 1 in the pipe.

Did I get some kind of extended magazine barrel or is that last one not supposed to go in there?

It fit but juuuuuust barely.

File: 13083375_1068370336550723_3536464680395334153_n.jpg (12KB, 236x354px) Image search: [Google]

12KB, 236x354px

>>31076376
Amen.
> The current year of our Lord
> Defending the use of birdshot for defense

>>31075216
There's a big difference between #4 Birdshot (0.13"x170) & 4 Buckshot (0.24"x28). While velocities are pretty similar, the birdshot pellets weighs <1/6th as much and are sufficient for turkey necks and not much else.

>>31074176 (OP) #

Once had a dream that there was an alien invasion. Alien shock troopers were going door to door (what was happening to people was unknown, electricity was out). Could just see them outside going into houses.

I figured there was no point in small calibers, would have only one chance so might as well use the most powerful I had.

Shot the alien (wearing an advanced armor suit) in the face/head with a solid copper 3.5" 12 guage slug.
Literally had no effect. None.

Didn't even bother with a follow up shot and just put the gun down. I figured the best I could do was display no threat and hope I don't get blasted.

Ended up becoming a pet to the alien who took my followup lack of resistance as intelligence.

Truly the most powerless I have ever felt in a dream.

Imagine shooting something like that and having zero effect. The technology gap was like shooting a spitball at a tank.

>>31074176
What do you think of loading a blank, then a shotshell, then a wax bullet, then an fmj, then the rest jhp in an HD handgun?

>>31075216
this >>31077255

you absolute retard, if you're using birshot use BIG birdshot and high velocity, that's what I've been saying. No. 00 Buck limits your pellets way to much to warrant the penetration. Basically, smaller stuff is sufficient with more shot.

>>31075350
The thing is that No. 4 has pretty shallow penetration on denser targets. Don't get me wrong, that's fucking deadly up close I'm sure but the reason it works on turkeys at range is because their flesh is softer.

Turkey chokes will fuck people up though, its weird you don't usually hear about people using chokes on tactical shotguns.

>>31074176
Don't they make rounds specifically for home defense making this thread absolutely irrelevant?

>>31077367
i bet you're the type of person that sees motor oil with "#1 NASCAR approved" and buy it without any qustion

>>31077396
I mean, they wouldn't just put that on there without it being true...r...right...?

>>31074206
wax slug made out of birdshot will fuck someone up.

guys pls r8 my loadout ideas:

1) sand
like rocksalt loads, but instead medium-coarse sand. No worries about overpenetration, but possible worries about maiming instead of killing?

2) wooden flechetes
a bunch of tiny wooden darts (worried about overpenetration with metal ones). Hopefully these won't catch on fire? maybe ceramic ones instead (frangible) but IDK if they'd survive firing too well.

>>31077491
betterthanbirdshot/10

>>31077491
Pocket sand: Shotgun edition.
I like it.

File: 776722.jpg (41KB, 880x660px) Image search: [Google]

41KB, 880x660px

>>31074176

>>31077491
glass marbles are better than sand. sand is ground down already. it wont penetrate as well. the marbles will shatter and cut as they penetrate. those people will be fucked for life if you do that. sand is benign. tiny glass shards cutting through the body with every muscular contraction for years to come will kill a person.

>>31077843
thats some attrition warefare right there
>had a friend get in a car accident almost 6 years ago where the windshield shattered into his face and chest.
>still pulls occassional chunks out to this day.

>>31077843
>>31077870
That seems unusually cruel.

Shoot to kill or incapacitate. Not to cause prolonged suffering.

>>31074237
>Its more projectiles to go through walls and kill/maim people if you miss
unless you live in a home with a 30+ yard hallway or room AND using shitty ammo (whitebox winchester or green box remingshit comes to mind) the spread will hardly spread that much bigger than maybe an open palm or two.

Might as well just load blanks for all the good it'll do you.

There is no reason to have one round of birdshot in a shotgun loaded with buckshot, I can't imagine what the argument for it would be. You want to kill the first thing you shoot a tad less?

>>31077159
That's the extended magazine, holds 8. It's just tight. If a plug was installed you'd only get a few loaded. My advice is to keep the shotgun unchambered and unsafed with the hammer down. They aren't nearly as safe as pistols.

>>31077932
I have a makarov for my CCW and first fun. I strip and oil that thing twice a week. It is only 3 steps to completely dismantle it though. How often do I need to oil and strip a shotgun? Seem like a lot of moving parts.

File: buck1.jpg (862KB, 857x1142px) Image search: [Google]

862KB, 857x1142px

>>31077924

>>31077885
oh look it's this stale meme once again

I don't give a fuck if a home invader gets "prolonged suffering", as long as my shit is secure and my family and pets are safe. As soon as you invade a house and threaten the residents you lose all rights to mercy.

File: buck2.jpg (870KB, 857x1142px) Image search: [Google]

870KB, 857x1142px

>>31077957

>>31077885
>fucker stupid enough to break in
>pays for it by either going to jail and never getting a decent life after it
>or gets away, learns from the pain, becomes a better person for fear of that pain that is never enough to go to the doctor for, but always a reminder that he could have made a mistake that would have costed him his life.

>>31077885
either way, with a melee weapon i'd still break his knee or legs or limbs if i get the chance.

>>31077885
>>31077967
>>31077972
>>31077988
It isn't some damn meme or purposely starting an argument. You have a weapon to protect yourself, your family, your property. That is fair. If someone breaks into your castle and means to do you harm or rob you of your hard earned wealth by all means shoot them.

Shoot them to kill them. Or if the situation isn't life threatening, beanbag/rock salt their asses. Or blow off a kneecap. It is all gravy as long as it ends the threat with a proper level of response.

Using an ammunition which has only the purpose of inflict long term suffering is sadistic and reflects poorly on citizens who employ their 2nd Amendment rights. You have the right to protect yourself from a mugging, not to take the mugger into a basement and blowtorch his balls off and flay him alive for a month.

>>31078028
It's not for the sole purpose of causing suffering, it's for being sufficiently lethal/incapacitating without having to worry about overpenetrating and hitting your family / the neighbors / whatever.

>>31077954
Pumps are very simple to strip and maintain. It's actually what I learned before pistols. I clean mine after every use, which involves taking the barrel out. The normal procedure for a pump is to unscrew the end and slide the barrel out. Depending on the design you'll have to either partially pull the bolt out with the action bar and carrier or not. They barrel fouls quickly because the shot is generally all lead, etc. The rattle in the parts is to keep fouling from disabling any of the mechanisms. The Mossberg doesn't need much lubrication and you shouldn't need to pull the trigger assembly apart after the first time you clean it out and lube it.

>>31078028
>You have the right to protect yourself from a mugging, not to take the mugger into a basement and blowtorch his balls off and flay him alive for a month.
that sounds pretty neat, but what if you just bounded their hands and feet and threw them into a pit of ants?

>>31078200
how would you contain the ants? they'd just climb out of the pit?

File: that_wall_cant_save_you.jpg (997KB, 2272x1704px) Image search: [Google]

997KB, 2272x1704px

>>31074220
this

also,
putting DEFINITIVELY deadly projectiles through walls can be a valuable trait
for example,
shooting an intruder who is standing around a corner
pic related

>>31078256
you distract them by constantly throwing in sacrifices

Assuming you had an easy source of pure carbon and the machinery to compress it into diamond, would diamond loads be good in a shotgun?

If so, what shape diamond would be the best? needles? balls? traditional diamond-cut shapes?

>>31077275
what kind of anal probes did your new friend use?

>>31077076
QFT.
#1 buck has the penetration needed, plus more wound channels than 00 buck.

>>31079704
Why would you use diamonds? So your enemies can die shiny and chrome?

>>31078163
>They barrel fouls quickly because the shot is generally all lead, etc
What are wads?

File: 1454307247108.png (40KB, 467x400px) Image search: [Google]

40KB, 467x400px

>>31077957
>>31077969
>both hornady loads have tighter spreads as 20yds than 10yds

>>31079704
>diamond loads
>not dragonforce CD loads

>>31074176
> not always using birdshot for the highest resolution in your high definition shotgun
w-what?

>>31078028
Like shooting his knees off is a pain that will go away? Fuck that. Shoot him with whatever, however, just make sure it works alright?

>>31078342
LOL

get a fucking rifle if you want penetration goy, buckshot is weak ass bullshit

thin metal skin of a refrigerator door

buckshot is weak ass bullshit compared to a rifle

>>31074176
STUPID

Why I use buckshot.

A woman literally takes a shell of birdshot in the chest from point blank range and looks at the shooter.

>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_F_KuFzjOGA

>>31081634
Then stumbles away

If you have to shoot something further than 20 meters away you might as well throw a shotgun, what's the point.

>>31081634
Fucking THANKYOU!
This is the footage I was thinking of here >>31076101
#1 buck FTW

>>31081584
Actually Buckshot has a habit to clear a path for the trailing buckshot through obstacles better than a bullet alone

>>31081634
Kids got brass balls

>>31081634
jesus, i knew it wasnt suited for home defense but to think its THAT ineffective is surprising.

>>31077967
Using a round primarily designed to cause suffering instead of rapidly stopping the threat is great way to have your Self Defense Immunity claim defeated.

>>31081775
A leather jacket is surprising protection against bird shot. Highly recommend hitting a thrift store and seeing what heavy fabric does to light rounds.

Birdshot is a poor decision for self defense. You shoot to stop immediate threats. There is no shoot to wound, shoot to main, shoot to scare, shoot to kill etc. You pull the trigger because there's a threat to your life or someone else's and that the assailant may die as a result is a grave but necessary consequence. Any ammunition choice made that cannot reliably stop a threat is the wrong decision and should only be made out of necessity of its all you have or can use. Do you really want your shot to be ineffective because the attacker is wearing a heavy coat? Mitigate over penetration concerns after the primary goal of stopping someone is met.

>>31076014
And then let me shoot you with buckshot and see how much worse off you are.

File: 43DZZ_IMG_5410.jpg (82KB, 1000x666px) Image search: [Google]

82KB, 1000x666px

>>31074490
all ive got is 6mm steel ball bearings left, could i load those and make wax slugs?

File: wew.jpg (10KB, 223x200px) Image search: [Google]

10KB, 223x200px

>>31081584
>weak ass bullshit
dude i put 00 buck through 2x4s and 4x4s all the time
it will blast through studs in a wall
>hornady crit defense
>basically any 1500fps+ 00 buck load

>>31081584
cant tell if bait

>>31074668
>if I can't have it nobody can!

>>31074176
Stupid, and you're stupid for thinking about doing it.

You're also stupid for thinking dutch loading is appropriate in any scenario.

birdshot is useless for anything other than small animals.

File: bait.jpg (37KB, 600x401px) Image search: [Google]

37KB, 600x401px

>>31081596

>>31076947
We arent using ground troops at the moment. The people who are suck shit.

Slugs, all day, erry day

It's a great idea. Though personally I go a little further.

>Rock salt
>#10 Birdshot
>BB Shot
>F Buck
>00 Buck
>Brenneke slug

From first to last.

>>31086395
"You better watch out bucko. 4 more shots and you're fucking dead!"

>>31082213
this
buckshot or slugs only

>>31086423
Yup. I've shot hundreds of people and never once been sued because I demonstrated a clear and justified escalation of force.

File: confused.jpg (35KB, 500x350px) Image search: [Google]

35KB, 500x350px

>>31074593
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rhZf_x8Esms
temporary wound-cavity the size of a small dinner plate even with tame-fps loads
plus, can effectively penetrate studs in a wall
>fairly effective

>>31074216
At those ranges, even birdshot will be tightly confined around the diameter of the interior of the barrel- so if anything, your issue is the difference between low and high brass. At 2-3 yards its not gonna matter too much either way.

>>31081072
I figured since diamond is used for cutting tools and stuff it would go through people pretty easily, but thin slivers would probably not go through walls or would just get caught in the insulation

>>31081254
I know you were joking about this, but would polycarbonate plastic be a good shot or flechette material (for home defense)?