Why are the Ruskies always copying us? http://www.janes.com

>>31046746
Because the Russians are literally decades behind the United states in most areas.

>>31046746
Because they realized that even the goat fuckers they're fighting have nigger rigged their own slat armor for their DIY armored vehicles.

Because
A
> The Americans already put in the time and money to R&D this, let's just copy them.
B
> Hey, if we put some type of thing, like, a fence thing, between the projectile and the vehicle, shaped charges will be less effective.

The Russians are the most near-peer to us. Some things don't take hundreds of millions of dollars to develop and there's only one real practical solution. The Chinese on the other hand...If it wasn't for stealing from us and copying Russian exports, they'd be no where.

>>31046746
>>31046772
>>31046780
Because it's cheaper than ERA.

>>31046804
>The Russians are the most near-peer to us
Kind of, but no. They have been way ahead of us in some regards(mass issued weapon optics before it was cool, had their equivalent of .300 blk 30 years before the US, etc) but on the whole they are way behind.

>>31046746
Do you seriously think that recent use of slat armour on western vehicles is the first time in history it's been used?

>>31046830
Well true, but we need to remember that our way of doing things is not the absolute right one. The russkies have their own interests and doctrines and work towards them and dont try to mimick the U.S.

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>>31046833
Yes.

>>31046830
They were pretty much lock-step with us until the late 80s, early 90s. And it wasn't until the iron curtain fell we found out our tank guns were getting btfo against their ERA. They already countered our stealth with their SAMs. GLONASS is the only other fully global system. They've launched and fully supported a air war on foreign soil for the better part of a year. The fall of the Soviet Union set them back quite a bit, but they've been gaining pretty rapidly again.

>>31046772
this

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>>31046848
Whoa, wait wait waitwaitwait
Im by no meaans a scientist, but thats a nazi tank.
Are you implying that the nazis and their 1940s R&D were the largest initiator of what we consider modern technology? Are you implying that the nazis invented slat armor?

Sure, suuuuuuuuuure, next you are going to say they invented jet propulsion, or pioneered practical rocketry. I dont believe it.

This anon cant believe that you would believe, that a country that invested, developed, and tested almost pure military theory and sciences for the better part of 3 decades, would actually pioneer usefull warfighting equipment.

Get out, we dont like your kind here.

>>31047117
The thing about the Nazis is that they basically threw money and resources at absolutely everything. It resulted in a lot of neat things, but so many more failed projects completely forgotten. Turns out it's not a viable strategy for winning a war.

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>>31046746
cause we're the best aaarrooouuunnnddd

>>31047168
that had absolutely nothing to do with why they lost though. If it weren't for a few other stupidcrazy factors it literally wouldn't have mattered and probably would've been a net gain for nazi military development

>>31047192
They were sinking resources that they didn't have into projects that went nowhere even as the tide of the conflict was turning against them. I'm not saying it's why they lost but it sure as shit didn't help.

>>31046746
Russkies have used slat armour snice 1980 in Afghanistan
US of A copied that for their own

>>31047227
Do you have any pics or source? I've never seen any Soviet armour with slat armour.

>>31046746
>Why are the Ruskies always copying us?
Why are you such an ignoramus?

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>>31047239

>>31047199
It could have, though, and those resources going literally anywhere else would have done absolutely nothing.

What you aren't understanding here is that past a certain point, the Nazis had absolutely no chance at winning the war without a drastic technological improvement. If Hitler hadn't gone nearly crazy and actually listened to his generals' advice, if he had been able to get the war against Russia going maybe a year sooner, if they weren't forced to endure Russian winter, if any of those things weren't the case, Germany would have had solid chances. But the reality is is that the Nazis just could not have beaten Russia. None of those resources that went into crazy projects could have gone literally anywhere else and made a difference. If, however, the Germans had made significant advances in a few areas in time to actually field them in the war, they might have actually had a chance.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with how they chose to expend resources the way they did, because it literally doesn't matter when you're being outproduced and the enemy outnumbers you some 10-1. Hitler realized only too late that you can't beat Russia when it's churning out 30+ tanks a god damn day and has enough manpower to field millions more soldiers than you. You could probably find the youtube video where he talks about it, might've been in 1943, where he just realizes he's lost, and it's because Russia has so many more fucking tanks.

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>>31047271
I dont remember if the US used cage armor on their AFV in vietnam but they did employ a special net that they would plant in the ground a few meters away from for example a M113 and it had a 50/50 chance to competely damage a RPG so that it will fail to detonate, otherwise it would deform it enough that it would fail to form a perfect jet that would enable it to penetrate a m113.

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>>31047306

>>31047298
And even then released soviet documents show USSR was going to invade Europe anyway. No matter what Hitler or his generals did there was going to be over a million russians at their door.
Hitler didn't name it Operation Barabosa for nothing

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>>31047339
>barabosa
Hitler was a basketball fan.

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>>31046746
>>31046772
>>31046780
>>31046833
>>31046848

Here you go. T-34's during 1945 (especialy during Berlin) with "cage" armor in the attempt to defeat Panzerfausts.

copy what, slat armor? read a goddamn book my cotton harvesting friend

>>31047306
>>31047318
the Vietnamese called those B-40 net after the RPG-2( B-40 is vietnamese name for RPG-2, stand for 40mm anti tank gun)
Vietnamese source claimed that those netting fail to stop RPG-7 because they have a powerful booster,

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>>31047360
space armor =/= cage armor
space armor or box armor stop the round/denote the round
cage armor allow the round to pass though it, the cage bars then destroyed the round

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>>31047547

>>31046903
This level of delusion. Really?

Their jet engines have been shit since the 1970s with no real development.

Their avonics are such trash that they rely on commercial grade gps systems and old fashioned dumb bombs in syria.

>>31046830
>had their equivalent of .300 blk 30 years before the US
wut
the US army never adopted .300 blk
and 7.62x39 is a age old rounds

>>31047580
>Their avonics are such trash that they rely on commercial grade gps systems and old fashioned dumb bombs in syria.
the GPS pic is a old pic, and it is not Syria but some training center in Russia

and Russia use onboard ballistic com for bombing in syria, it is cheaper than GPS guided bomb

>>31046772
this tbqh

they're a cut rate regional power, no idea why you guys act like theyre a major threat

wait a sec, isnt it just a fucking metal cage, whats so hi-tech about it so russkies should "copy" that like they can't develop it?
t: aleksandr ivanovich

>>31046903
>They've launched and fully supported a air war on foreign soil for the better part of a year
I forgot they were supporting their effort with the rigorous test of lazily floating material through the mediteranian sea into a friendly port and then launching those hard to do air strikes from a ghastly few miles from their airbase. Truly a masterful display of skill and logistics that hasn't been seen since WWII d-day

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Ukraine Rebels

>>31047618
lol bro, how dumb are you. They are using straight up dumb bombs and a fucking gps. That is called being a dumb slav.

>>31047618
>and Russia use onboard ballistic com for bombing in syria, it is cheaper than GPS guided bomb

And the west had LABS and CCRP computers since the 50s

>>31047761
>meanwhile we use 1000000000000$ precision guided super duper solid gold MENSA member bombs to annihilate tents
Thats called good business practices.

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>>31046903
>us
>our

Sure thing, Ivan Bugerski

>>31046903
They haven't fully supported jack shit in Syria, they're doing the bare minimum they can

>>31047784
probably why Assad can't win while the kurds and iraqis are.

It's not good business practices. The simple fact remains, Russia fell behind tech wise in the 1970s. That's what I said earlier and that's where their tech level still is today.

>>31047822
The reason Assad isnt winning definitely isnt the quality of the munitions and the aircraft delivering them.

>>31047863
probably, all they do is carpet bomb civilians and can't figure out why the civilian population hates them.

>>31047618
I at first thought he mean 7.62x39 too but I think he was actually referring to 9x39

>>31046746
Google U-5TS "Molot" and after this, look in the M256A1 gun barrel

>>31047360

Nazi's made everything

>>31047580

>Their avonics are such trash

That's why the US couldn't into helmet qued missiles before the MIG-29, right?

>>31048589
lol, it was a good idea but it doesn't change how shitty their avionics still are to this day.

Even the guys that fly the mig-29 say they have no idea what's going on around them.

>>31048676

>Fulcrum pilots have enjoyed their most success with the HMS/Archer combination in one versus one training missions. In this sterile environment, where both aircraft start within visual range of each other, the MiG-29 has a great advantage. Not because it is more maneuverable than the F-16. That is most certainly not the case regardless of the claims of the Fulcrum’s manufacturer and numerous other misinformed propaganda sources. The weapon/sensor integration with the HMS and Archer makes close-in missile employment extremely easy for the Fulcrum’s pilot.

http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/429073-Pilot-evaluates-MiG-29A-vs-F-16C-Forums

And that's from an article biased toward the F-16.

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>>31048589
And their ergonomics are shit compared to F4s/15s/16s, what's your point? One innovation is something any nation can develop, it takes a diverse R&D base combined with a robust logistical complex to turn that into hundreds of stealth fighters.

Russia had the theoretical advantage, they're the ones whose scientist wrote the first stealth equations. Then they pissed it all away. The US didn't.

>>31048998

>And their ergonomics are shit compared to F4s/15s/16s, what's your point? One innovation is something any nation can develop, it takes a diverse R&D base combined with a robust logistical complex to turn that into hundreds of stealth fighters.
>
Russia had the theoretical advantage, they're the ones whose scientist wrote the first stealth equations. Then they pissed it all away. The US didn't.

Come back when the US is delivering to the ISS without depending on Russia and Space X.

>>31048951
Yeah, F-16 pilots admitted that HMS and Archer did give Mig-29s an edge, but they were very difficult/dangerous to fly compared to the F-16.

Plus, you know, F-16s tend to have fancy things called "radar' and "AIM-120".

>>31049037
Come back when Russia isn't buying all their thermal sights, NVGs, and other precision tech from the US and Europe.

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>>31048998
Oops, that's a landslav pic, not an airslav one.

>>31049080

>Yeah, F-16 pilots admitted that HMS and Archer did give Mig-29s an edge, but they were very difficult/dangerous to fly compared to the F-16.

We were talking about avionics. If you want to talk about flight performance, let's compare the PAK FA or later SU-27 variants to the F-22 and the F-15 respectively. Frame the argument. Russiaboos always get accused of stepping out of the argument, which is exactly what you are doing right now.

So is >>31048998

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>>31049098

>Come back when Russia isn't buying all their thermal sights, NVGs, and other precision tech from the US and Europe.

Heh. Unlike you, I am not a faggot and am not going to argue with facts.

>other precision tech

>rockets
>not precision tech

Also, Russia leads in non-GPS navigation suites. Obviously Russia is shit at thermals and NVGs, no one is going to deny that.

You will, to the end, deny that US is shit at space. it's funny.

>>31049080
Actually, for the majority of its part in the Cold War, the F-16 was not actually wired for radar guided munitions.

>>31049150
>Russia leads in non-GPS navigation suites

Yes, the whole world buys Slavic ring-laser gyros and on-chip INS...lol.

Incidentally, the US, being a superpower, can afford to conceal its secret weapons. Russia is in the unenviable position of having to trot out every last conceivable powerpoint for morale boosting.

>>31049150
>Also, Russia leads in non-GPS navigation suites.
The INS on American attack boats was supposedly extremely accurate. And highly classified.

>>31049178
The comparison was Mig-29A vs. F-16C.

>>31049186

>Incidentally, the US, being a superpower, can afford to conceal its secret weapons. Russia is in the unenviable position of having to trot out every last conceivable powerpoint for morale boosting.

The only argument here is "US has super secret tech." That's not an argument. It can easily be replied to with "Russia has super secret tech." I won't reply with that, because I am aware of the economic circumstances, but it IS a pointless statement in this context.

>Yes, the whole world buys Slavic ring-laser gyros and on-chip INS...lol.

You really think GPS won't be offline in any real war? Not that we are likely to have a real war, but come on.

>>31047117
>you are going to say they invented jet propulsion
I hope he doesn't, because they didn't.

>>31049202
>>31049198

Look guys, if we want to argue, let's frame the argument very clearly and go from there. Pick some pre-1991 weapon system or category, and let's stick to that. Need exact year and mission.

>>31047621
large nuclear arsenal

They might not be a superpower anymore, but they are still not to be fucked with too much