So i want to get a license soon and i want to buy a pistol and

What country are you in?

>>31016543
Luxembourg

>>31016552
Ah, gotcha. I was going to say, if you were in the US you were largely out of luck. What weapons are available there, and what is the process of acquiring them like?

>>31016574
>What weapons are available there
you mean legal? I think the ak47 is illegeal,cause its a typical terrorist weapon. Other than that no idea,my father owned a 9mm pistol but no idea which one.
>what is the process of acquiring them like
after you get your license you have to shoot one year with a pistol/revolver after that year you can buy what ever is legal here.

>>31016517

I believe this is a game thread but...

Assuming you're capable of such a feat as getting an SMG, and im not saying that you arent its just highly unlikely...

Top dog of SMGs these days is the...
B&T MP9
which is based on the Steyr TMP.

Other than that the russian Bizon because its got ammunition capacity like a calico, but the magazine and gun are reliable. They have it in 9mm and .380 and the latter has an even higher capacity.

>For the Pistol

Unless you want them to use the same caliber I suggest this handgun...

Glock adapted to .460 Rowland
(you can shoot .45acp with it)

> Legalities: realistically you wont get an SMG though because they are treated as Short Barreled Rifles and in the united states they are heavily regulated. And even then it wont be a fully automatic SMG but rather a semi-auto version of one. And I believe this goes Double for any other country out there who tend to be even more gun-grabby.

Realism:
For your first gun I suggest a Tokarev TT. Cheap, cheap ammo, thin profile, accurate as fuck.

File: Izhmash-catalog-saiga-9.jpg (91KB, 858x626px) Image search: [Google]

91KB, 858x626px

>>31016517
> i want to buy a pistol and a smg

9mm Luger is always a great choice

I would go with
> Glock 17M
> Saiga 9

pic and video related
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4eBiwJ5fXQ

>>31016618
>I believe this is a game thread but...
i have no idea what you mean
>B&T MP9
i will look into it
>Tokarev TT. Cheap, cheap ammo, thin profile, accurate as fuck.
reliable ?

>>31016687
> reliable ?
you can bet your firstborn son on it!

>>31016804
im sold.

>>31016687

Ive never heard of anybody saying the Tokarev TT-33 is unreliable. All guns are prone to unreliability under the right circumstances but nobody ive heard has said that it has problems.

Its got that nifty turn of the century feel like an M1911 does also.

>>31016631
so...

what are the real benefits of an SMG over an SBR again?

9mm weighs about as much as 5.56x45 bro

>>31016846
> lighter
> can be more compact
> less recoil
> cheaper gun & ammo

>>31017036
>lighter

not by a whole lot actually

File: Titty33.jpg (101KB, 476x408px) Image search: [Google]

101KB, 476x408px

>>31016838

pic related

>>31016846

9mm does more damage than 5.56 out of an SBR.

kinetic energy for 556 is lower than usual out of an SBR (might as well be 5.7x28), and the velocity of 9mm out of a longer barrel is higher than usual (might as well be .357mag)

but 9mm displaces more tissue, you've got to look at the physical results of this stuff before just considering equations.

also the mass of the projectiles is nearly meaningless since that only determines penetration.

Their respective effective ranges are also similar.

File: AR looking good.jpg (2MB, 3072x1728px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 3072x1728px

>>31017084
9mm has better ballistics than an SBR'd AR-15 ?

Well color me surprised, I'm off to youtube to look this up.

My AR pistol for comparison.

File: sm_Sa-vz.-58-Compact-cal_223.png (777KB, 1432x800px) Image search: [Google]

777KB, 1432x800px

>>31017111
trips confirm
.223 is shit out of a short barrel

7.62x39 is great for short barrels
pic VERY related

>>31017201
> pic very related
> posts a 223

>>31017201

Ill agree with that.

Consider compared to the Tokarev caliber, the 7.62x39 is the same size and going even faster.

Would cause somewhat more damage than a cooked 9 mil.

>>31017111
Whats more, the fragmenting characteristic of .223 is entirely lost with an SBR so its like being hit with an armor piercing round.

Only .223 ammunition which is effective from an SBR (neither of which you can get) is either THV or the new M855A1. And they dont make THV.

>>31017111
.223/5.56 relies on velocity. Out of an sbr it's effectively neutered.

>>31017402
You could always throw heavy bullets through it.

Hornady TAP is supposed to be good for short barrels.

>>31017412

Mass means little.

Despite the commonly accepted stopping power formulas... the kind of "damage" that a weapon causes to tissue is mostly a product of:

Diameter
Velocity

The problem with .223 is the fact its only 5.6 millimeters in diameter. Velocity helps it do damage but even then you've got to cook alot of velocity on it to make up for the small size.

Consider the difference between 5.56mm and .50 Bmg. Both are going about the same speed (5.56 out of an M4 carbine). But the .50 displaces over 4 times the amount of tissue or material.

The mass of the projectile just determines how long its going to be able to keep that up, and how deep into the target it can strike. Mass has a Direct and Proportional effect on penetration.

The longest 5.56mm projectiles ive seen are 100 grain, some kind of blue painted military target practice shit from the look of it.

Shoot somebody with that and its leaving a 5.6mm size hole in them, and its going to be travelling slower so the temporary cavity will be a little less pronounced than usual.

Out of an SBR its gonna be going even slower than a 20" M-16 barrel. Instead of 2500fps try 2 grand.

People need to understand that Kinetic Energy is only a guide, not the rule, for determining effectiveness. Just as Momentum is a guide for penetration not the rule.

.357 magnum does more "damage" than a 5.56 out of a SBR because it rips more tissue out of the way and its still causing a decent displacement wave (not as pronounced as a 556 but still).

.45acp displaces alot of tissue but its going slow enough that the displacement wave doesnt rip for shit. Just drills a 12mm size hole all the way through the target.

Tissue is elastic, even when BTFOd by a high velocity projectile it still comes back to where it was before. Combine ripping tissue and a vicious displacement wave and you cause alot of damage.

Thats why a .50 will blow somebody in half, its ripping a tunnel of 13mm worth of tissue and displacing at 2500fps

>>31017537
this sounds like bullshit

>>31017550

so says every last human being who has cognitive dissonance, as well as all shills

>>31017537
>commonly accepted stopping power formulas...

shape contributes immensely if you get reliable yawing, it can create an even larger wound cavity for which to bleed out of.

Saying Diameter is the end all be-all is fucking silly.

>>31017658

I would agree with that too actually.

Thats why 5.45mm 7N6 is your Friend.

>>31016804
minus the magazine dropping out randomly.

>>31017412
Yes, you COULD throw something heavy, but that would mean something other than .223/5.56