Daily Japanese Thread DJT #1829

>>17393703
I'm the oldest, most senior DJT poster out there and I say this is the legitimate thread.

スレッドの消費サイクル早いな

>>17393890
夏のせいさ。

(南半球の人々を無視した意見)

Should I set new cards to 0 and raise new card limit manually when I need to study that certain deck? Or is there a way to lower/disable new cards just for one day?

私の近くは少しの日本人がいる。だから会話でどうしますか。難しいね。

>>17393993
会話で話し合えばいいと思いますけど、これは個人的な意見です

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>>17393691
You can't learn Japanese.

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>>17394232
We all can, if we stick together!

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>>17394232

>>17394390
>lingualift
>paying for a shittier anki
not gonna make it brah

How do I unlearn Japanese?

>>17394467
Watch a lot of manga.

海鼠子

Does とてもじゃないけど weaken or strengthen the negation?
The dictionary says it strengthens but I (trying to) analyze it logically can't see it that way

https://th.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E0%B8%A1%E0%B8%AD%E0%B8%A3%E0%B9%8C%E0%B8%99%E0%B8%B4%E0%B8%87%E0%B8%A1%E0%B8%B8%E0%B8%8B%E0%B8%B8%E0%B9%80%E0%B8%A1%E0%B8%B0

if you think that kanji is difficult...

Can も be used to increase the number of direct objects? For example in the first line of the code geass opening: 自分を世界さえも変えてしまえそうなit seems like this is what's happening, but songs don't exactly have to have correct grammar so I'm not sure. I mean if you can do that, what's the big deal about only having one を per clause anyway?

>>17394675
Aha. I guess you think じゃないけど negates とても. I've never thought in that way. It's more like "not 100% but mostly" and makes the negation more soft. I guess they say like that to avoid blatant expression.

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Would it not be better to learn sentences instead of words?
I mean, in real life when you use a language, you very much rely on patterns that are already in your head, swapping stuff around, changing modifiers and so on.
If you only know words, you'll have to reinvent the wheel every time. On top of that it's easier to memorise and recall stuff that way.

>>17394830
You learn sentence patterns through input. Memorizing them doesn't work.

>>17394744
Kind of, I don't know if it's technically correct grammar, but adding additional parts of sentences like that is not that uncommon. It's like if you have already started a sentence and used を, and then realize you have more to say before starting on the verb part of the sentence, you don't have much of a choice other than to just shove it in there and slap a も on it, lest you want to repeat the whole sentence.

>>17394822
There are tons of sources that say it strengthens とても rather than softens it, though even Japanese people seem to be confused why.

This page has a few theories.
https://web.archive.org/web/20120701165329/http://sohey.fc2web.com/mistake/mistake2.html

>>17394830
That's the method this guy used:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ejRkuX1RGf4

He has a huge blog about it here:
www.alljapaneseallthetime.com/blog/all-japanese-all-the-time-ajatt-how-to-learn-japanese-on-your-own-having-fun-and-to-fluency/

I'm spending the weekend playing games and not learning Japanese!

>>17394924
Why not play them in Japanese?

>>17394924
人生なんてそれぞれが好きなように楽しめばいいと思うんです：＾）

>>17394952
じんせいは しぬまでの ひまつぶし
by みうら じゅん

>>17394874
Another explanation similar to the first one there: https://detail.chiebukuro.yahoo.co.jp/qa/question_detail/q1164515556

Basically it says とても is used with the sense of "どうなっても" or "いずれにせよ", and が/けど are simply connective rather than contrastive.

There's also a poll here that shows 82% of respondents felt とてもじゃないが無理 was stronger than とても無理. http://matsuri.xii.jp/standard/std88.htm

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>>17395039
If not even Japanese people know Japanese, how can we hope to??

How do you pronounce 麻媽罵馬 ?

>>17395184
mamamama

i see your shit

In Anki, is there a way for me to extract the kanji from the vocabulary I'm currently working on and create a deck out of it? There's that Kanji Grid generator but I'm not sure how to turn that into a deck or a more complete reference guide.

>>17394833
I don't think anybody who uses sentences advocates actually memorizing the sentences

>>17395215
You think wrong then

すぐに冷たい雨が降ってきた

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Any tips on dealing with brain damage?

>>17395250
Read more.

>>17395250
Stop hitting "Easy".

>>17395250
Stop being a clueless ankidrone who thinks percentages matter

>>17395184
ma2ma1ma4ma3

>>17395184
麻(ま)媽(ま)罵(ま)馬(ま)

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Anyone please help me what the hell this is supposed to mean. There's no real context except them saying that they'll eat lunch soon.
I'd have guessed that he's saying he wants にぎおかし and that that's some kind of food, but google doesn't give any results for that so I'm probably wrong.

>>17395393
I (want to eat) nigiokashi.

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Your goals for learning Japanese are solid & firm, right?

>>17395400
That was also my guess, but what the hell are にぎおかし supposed to be? Google gives me no results.

>>17395409
My goals make me solid and firm.

>>17395393
俺はにぎやかしだぜー

>>17395393
yeah I have no idea where you got お from, you should've seen that as a か or at worst a み

>>17395409
naurto inspired me to become japan ninja

>>17395424
Fucking hell, thanks.
I hate handwriting.

>>17395428
Looks like either ka or o to me, and o made a little more sense.

Can anyone who played Dracu-Riot tell me what the symbols here are supposed to be?

>「頭の中、$f.word;でいっぱい……$f.word;のことしか考えられなくなっちゃう……あ、ア、あ、ンあッ、んッ、んンぁァああァァぁァーーッッ」

>>17395453
Stop reading off your hooker and look at the screen, idiot.

>>17395465
I'm not reading.

So i reached The Gauntlet in Sakubi, and i'm prepared to get this over with.
However, i have some confusion over some things, should i satisfy my doubts, or just get this over with so i can start reading with reference to the guide?

>>17395479
The gauntlet explains some of the confusing things but if you remain confused you should either slow down or check the other grammar resources at the bottom of the page.

>>17395479
Just read the whole thing. You won't memorize everything(/anything), but it won't take you long and it'll give you an idea of what to watch out for while reading. It doesn't matter how much you understand on your first read as long as you make an effort to understand the sentences you read "in the wild".

放任主義

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What the fuck is a "sortie"?

>>17395656
Fuck off cancer.

>>17395656
敵を攻撃するために自分の陣地を出ること。

>>17395661
Do you hate slighly old memes?

I have a hard time with から
for instance, two main characters in this VN go to visit another character
as they approach the house, the other character spots him and walks up to him and says
お前たちから出向いてくるとはなあ
does this mean "ah you were looking for me?"
or "I was about to look for you"
I also get confused with the とは phrase ending, I just don't get the nuance. another character uses it a lot

>>17395699
>does this mean "ah you were looking for me?"
>or "I was about to look for you"
Neither.
>to think you would be the ones to come (instead of me coming to you OR instead of someone else coming to him, the context is important)

>>17395725
that makes a lot more sense, thanks

>>17395699
The other guy already replied to you
But in my meager experiences I've seen they finish sentences with と/とは when 思わなかった is omitted

>>17395656
If you watch any mecha stuff you've probably seen that word at least 50 times

When I was reading my porn I came came upon the sentence
>妹思いのお兄ちゃん
I had a hunch what it meant and unexpectedly jisho had an entry for that
>4. love; affection​e.g. Ａ思いのＢ for 'B who loves A'
But I failed to find a guide talking about that, so the question is how do you go about studying those little things?

>>17396021
Open up a J-J dictionary.

>>17396027
Shit
What if I were to need a dictionary for understanding a j-j dictionary?
That'd be embarrassing

>no new news on NEWS WEB EASY
what's going on?

>>17396079
seems like they don't do news on the weekend. lame.

>>17396079
There was an unexpected weekend. They should be able to recover from that within 48 hours.

>>17393691
So for ru-verbs the passive and potential form seem to be the exact same.
Is there some kind of trick to telling which one is being used?
I've come this far without ever really thinking that I would mix things up but this just seems a little rough.

>>17396125
They are exactly the same. However when someone wants to avoid the ambiguity when they're using the potential they'll use れる without the ら.

>>17393993
リア充ばくはつしろ

I'm stuck watching Japanese from Zero guy's videos because his laugh is just contagious. Funny how he's actually stopping me from learning Japanese by making this stuff, since I'm watching his content instead of the reading I should be doing right now...

おはようおにいちゃん

らじおたいそうかえってきたー

>>17396200
Who's "Zero guy"?

Anyhow, assuming he's a native speaker, you're doing a good thing. If you do nothing but read, you won't develop listening comprehension skills. You should be watching/listening to stuff regularly, even if you hardly understand any of it.

>>17396287
"japanese from zero" guy and they're not only not native but they're bad at japanese

>>17396290
Oh. In that case, go find a Japanese guy with a contagious laugh to watch instead.

Where's a reliable place to find raw (or soft-subbed) episodes of Japanese TV shows?

Raws on Nyaa are often either poorly seeded or completely unseeded, and on top of that not packaged into batches so they're a real pain in the ass to download. A lot of the subbed stuff on Nyaa seems to be hard subbed so the only way to get rid of the subs is to hide part of the video itself.

>>17396328
avistaz

>>17396332
Seems like you have to register to use it. Does it require an invite to make an account?

>>17396328
Are you stupid? Soft-subbing is the norm nowadays. Just pick whatever batch and turn the subs off.

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>という

What does this accomplish that the nominalizer の doesn't already?

>主人公が犯人だったというのが一番面白かった。
>主人公が犯人だったのが一番面白かった。

What is this difference between these two sentences?

>>17396358
と constructs the embedded clause without nominalizing it or making it relative. This means you can do things like まいとする and というより. See the bajillion entries starting with という・と言う in https://core6000.neocities.org/hjgp/

Yo VN script bro, you might not have to download whole games to get script files. I got the Senmomo script arc file from the update file provided by August instead of the game itself so a 15 mb download instead of a 6gb one.

http://www.mediafire.com/file/08g2fy4eaf9ebmo/

>>17396406
This works for a lot of games. By default, though, I download the whole game just in case it has engine changes that I need to look at.

This happened with Shirokuma Bell Stars; it uses the same core engine as the company's earlier works, but it has a slightly different bytecode architecture, and I had to make changes to the binary scripts and see what the engine did in response to figure out where the differences were.

This was only a problem because the existing documentation on the web for this engine took the form of a partial reimplementation of the earlier version, and the bytecode format used by it doesn't keep track of how long each command is, so it desynced constantly until I sat down and mostly reverse engineered each different operation.

Ever since then I download full games by default since it happens not to slow me down and gives me a nice backlog anyway.

>>17396439
I uploaded the scripts for Shugaten a while back. Are they still in your backlog, or were they useless without the game?

>>17396494
I think I forgot to organize it, thanks for reminding me.

>>17396358
The most interesting thing was that the protagonist was the criminal.
The most interesting was the protagonist being the criminal.

So in the former, we have ([clause]という)のが... and in the latter, we have [nominalized phrase]が
Basically, what >>17396383 said

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what the hell is pic related trying to say? "My ability is so small so this foreign language is terrible!" ? That doesn't seem right, but I think shes saying something about how her lack of ability makes her terrible at the homework they're doing?

>>17396743
because you cant skate by on a superficial trick, foreign languages are terrifying right(roite??)
my n5 attempt, grain of salt etc

>>17396743
Because 小手先 don't work on them, foreign languages are 恐ろしい.

>>17396759
Reading J-J definitions makes me want to guess 小手先 here means something like "cleverness"

>>17396743
You can't wing your way through it so foreign languages are scary.

>>17396743
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22%E3%81%A7%E9%80%9A%E7%94%A8%E3%81%99%E3%82%8B%22&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8

>>17396759
that makes sense. The use 小手先の力 was confusing the hell out of me. but i think i get it now with your translation

I wonder if people who have been learning a foreign language for years using Anki to memorise the vocabulary have bigger vocabularies in their second language than they do in their native language.

Like, when I see a word I don't know in English, I:
Step 1 - Try to guess what it means based on the context because I can't be arsed to look it up
Step 2 (optional) - If I can't guess the meaning, I reluctantly look it up but make no effort to try to remember it because if I never encountered it before in 20-odd years of living then I figure it's not really something I need to know.

But when you're learning a foreign language, every word feels like it's important to learn (probably because of how painful it is in the beginning when you hardly know any), so if you use Anki you're liable to make cards for all sorts of uncommon and obscure words that you would likely just forget in your native language.

>>17396777
I almost never encounter a word I don't know in English. Even when I do, I can pretty much guess what it means through context and I don't even stop to think about it.

>>17396328
pick anything thats an MKV and turn the subs off

Is からかい上手の高木さん an easy read? I'm likely going to read it regardless if it is or isn't but any input would be appreciated.

>>17396328
I know it's

>Crunchyroll

but there's an option to turn subtitles off when you right-click the player.

>>17396855
Yes.

Are there any Japanese news outlets which provide an internet radio stream which doesn't require flash player to listen to? Every single fucking one I find needs flash player.

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>>17396905
but i love Macromedia flash player™

>>17396905
come back in 15 years that seems to be the gap for when japan catches up with the rest of the world

>>17396905
What do you have against flash player?

2017-07-29 Added Nanatsuiro Drops, Taretaba, Twinkle Crusaders, Clover Point, Fortune Arterial, and Dracu-Riot!.

https://vnscripts.neocities.org/

This is actually an important milestone for me, because it brings the stats page to a total of 24.7 million lexemes. This is basically 25% of the way to the 100 million words I want to eventually reach, where it'll be a "reasonable" corpus.

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>>17396960
it infringes my freedoms, and is notoriously insecure

also, adobe dropped support for it on anime/os

>>17396966
Tarareba*

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>>17396967
Just found this on the ground the other day. Is it yours?

>>17396966
>24.7 million lexemes

And how fucking long did that take?

>>17396978
No idea. I started May 20th though.

>>17396905
News is boring anyway, listen to something else.

>>17396979
Wow. I don't really understand any of what you're doing here, but keep up the good work.

>>17396977
You asked me that question just in the hopes that you could post that image, didn't you?

にほんはおきゅうりょうpayがすくない

それでもにほんにきて

かえらないあのんがおおいよ

なぜかって

きたらわかるよ

>>17394675
>>17394822
>>17394874
>>17395053
とてもじゃないけど=とてもでは＋ない＋けれど=迚も斯くても＋では＋ない＋けれど
→「迚も斯くても」＋ということは＋ない＋けれど
副詞「とても」は「迚も斯くても」もの略ですが、「とてもじゃない」の「とても」は「迚も斯くてもない=とてもない」という文の略です。
「とてもじゃないけれど」は、「とてもないと言うことはないけれど」と、つまり「どうにも無理(絶対無理)というほどではないけれど」言う意味でした。
　しかし、現代語では「到底無理」か「絶対無理」という意味で使われます。多分、関東方言の「じゃない」が確認の意味で使われるようになったことと関連しています。

>>17397019
ロリグッズを手に入れるためでしょ

How much Japanese can I learn by March if I already know the kana and a bunch of eroge words?

>>17397073
A lot.

>>17397075
Enough for conversation?
I kinda wanted to try going to Japan then. I have a friend at a university there now.

>>17397078
You can reach N1 in six months from where you are now if you do nothing but consume compelling comprehensible input (including verbal speech) every day.

question concerning names

suppose you are reading a credit list. how am i supposed to know how the names are read if at least one can be read differently?

which brings me to another question regarding name registration. Do you register a newborn with both kana and kanji to avoid confustion?

>>17397101
also, are they still borrowing kanji from china or did they opt to stick with kokuji?

>>17397084
Would verbal speech include anime or is it limited to face-to-face conversation with a real live human being?

>>17397150
Verbal speech includes anime but you have to be consuming it as learning input. In other words you can't be using English subs.

Also the "you can reach N1" in that post is only theoretical, it would probably take normal people 18 months to get there doing that, because normal people spend time doing things other than reading eroge.

>>17397019
さいはんは　JKの　すかーとが
ながくなったため
かえりたい　がいこくじんが　ふえた

>>17397169
いやずっと長かったけど
アニメにしかスカートを短くする女子はあまりいない

>>17397155
Oh good I've doing exactly that, along with regularly scheduled reading. I put more time into studying this language than I do my school subjects, which I probably shouldn't do.

If anyone wants any recommendations for easy comprehensible anime to watch, Shirokuma Cafe and Dragon Ball Super are good choices.

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Going to make a completely newfag question since I don't have any japanese knowledge and I'm weighting if I sould learn.
Why takes so long to translate from japanese?
For example people translating manga or novels takes several days to translate a chapter. Is it really THAT hard? After how much time (assuming serious learning effort) coud I read something directed at teenagers/young adults?

>>17397236
It takes really long because most translators don't give a single fuck about hungry EOPs and instead are only doing it for the money.

>>17397236
If by "translating" you mean "reading one word or phrase at a time", that's just because you're so new. After a week or two it should only take a couple minutes per page, assuming there's furigana and you understand the story.

If someone is actually translating manga and it takes them more than a day to translate a single chapter, just text, then they don't actually know Japanese. This is true of a majority of fan scanlators.

If you're including typesetting then it's because they hand the script off to someone that doesn't care about how long it takes.

>>17397247
This is true too.

>>17397254
Where would one go or who would one talk to if one wanted to help translate/typeset/whatever untranslated material?

>>17397259
Nowhere, they'd just do it.

>>17397264
Fair enough. I'm going to go brush up on my photoshop skills.

>>17397259
You apply at scanlation groups of a work that interest you, or you form a group yourself.
I was actually a redrawer/typesetter but it always intrigued me why translators took so much time.
Guess I'm going to learn, I mean, it can't be THAT hard right?

私は日本語話さない

>してきよる
Please explain what this is. Some fancy way of saying してくる?

>>17397236

Translating is harder than reading. The process of thinking about how to describe something in English, how to make it sound good, how to handle characterization etc. is itself time consuming. Sometimes a relatively simple line in Japanese can be hellish to make workable in English, which is part of why some lines end up with that distinctly Japanesey feeling. You can up spending a lot of time going over different phrasings or minor alterations to how the lines are structured, especially if you have an editor or are doing multiple drafts.

Motivation and time is another big factor. If you translated 12 hours a day for a week straight you could go through entire volumes of light novels, but most people don't have the free time or will to do that. This gets compounded if you're not working alone and have an editor, typesetter or anyone else you might have as part of a team. If you have a depressed translator and very busy editor the readers are pretty fucked.

>実にそつがない。現状のもう一方の戦力が今ひとつ、当てにならないことを考えると、非常に心強かったり。
>Completely flawless. It's really reassuring when I think of another existing unreliable war asset.
I don't feel I'm understanding this right. Is there anything wrong with my interpretation?

>>17396966
>https://pastebin.com/raw/TKnszHq9
Is this list sorted by which VN you'll be tackling next?

>>17397585
It's sorted very vaguely by how close it is to usable right now.

>>17397601
Ok. Also, did the Koichoco script end up being usable? I'm interested in its stats since I've already read it.

>>17397629
I misplaced it since I already had the game itself. Still have to check it.

>>17397236
probably depends on how hard you work and what you wanna read. I have been kinda slacking on learning my grammar and doing core, but its only been just over a month and I can read One piece. Slowly but im reading it. I'm sure if u start up and keep at it and do better pacing than I do you can struggle through some light novels by like 3-6months

>>17395479
Just power through it. Most of the confusing grammar that you'll run into in your readings is after the gauntlet anyway. Just be ready to always have it open in a tab

>>17397186
のぱんじよしこせはいないですか

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>>17397186
あたしのいなかは短いけど

中に短パンをはくのがきほん

>>17397905
いるわけないだろ

びょういんいけ

>>17397561
I think it's better to translate "〜ことを考えると" to "considering that another existing war asset is unreliable".

>>17397380
アニメや ドラマに でてくる じいさんが つかう ことばだよ

なんかおちついた

なんでだろ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NTwtOC7JMZ8

>>17396966
There are about 5 thousand lines of stuff like
手上げ・人間_笑い泣き（紅潮）_LOAD]
手上げ_微笑]
手上げ_微笑_ND]

at the end of Clover Point. It should be simple enough to just delete that manually though since they are all in a row.

>>17396905
http://www.nhk.or.jp/radionews/

and here's their rss feed with the mp3 files
http://www.nhk.or.jp/r-news/podcast/nhkradionews.xml

>>17396966
I've uploaded the script for Memory's Dogma CODE:01
https://a.pomf.cat/wbgaxx.zip

It's a plain text script format, encoded in Shift-JIS.
I've included the english script as well, because it has the japanese text as comments, so getting the raw text from there might actually be easier than stripping out the control stuff from the japanese script.

>>17396966
Does that mean you'll stop adding stuff at 100 million or is it just a personal achievement thing?

The first 3 volumes of the graded readers for KLC have been released, and the first volume is free for now:
https://keystojapanese.com/klc-reader/

No idea how good it actually is, because the introduction has this:
>Largely due to the absurdly long duration of copyrights, the material used for these reading sets relies heavily on texts written prior to 1923. While I have attempted to exclude any item containing offensive language, the remaining items still inevitably reflect the language and ideas of their respective eras.

おなかすいた

あんドーナツたべたい

たーべーたーいー

https://youtu.be/x_gj1c7AW88

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>中からヒアリが３０匹ぐらい見つかりましたが、福岡市は全部殺しました。
Does this mean that the city destroyed them all (meaning the city is a metonymy like in English)?

>>17398409
Yes, "city" is referring to the local government/agencies whatever, probably the 環境省

>>17397955
みさかみことたんぽんはくの

>>17398313
あなのなかにあんがあんの?

て-forms are killing me right now

>お寿司を食べて、出かけました。
>I ate sushi and then I went out.
How do I form the negative て form of 食べる here?
Is it 食べなくて or 食べないで? Because I think I've seen both somewhere, unless I'm confusing the adjective-て form here

>>17398511
ないで is for verbs only apparently
further reading
https://djtarchive.neocities.org/bunpou/full_day.html#なくて
https://djtarchive.neocities.org/bunpou/full_day.html#ないで

>>17398511
I believe you use 食べないで in this case. It's a grammar that means doing without doing something.
The なくて form is still used in other grammers, like 食べなくてもいい for instance.

>>17398522
I guess I'll have to one day just grind through that entire page and fix all the grammatical errors and misunderstandings I have

>>17398530
>The なくて form is still used in other grammers, like 食べなくてもいい for instance.
ooooh right, I knew I saw that somewhere before
thank you!

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>>17398537
>I guess I'll have to one day just grind through that entire page and fix all the grammatical errors and misunderstandings I have
there is simply no need

>>17398493
あんのなかにあながあんの

>>17398541
I don't think learning japanese is that hard actually, at least to me
I'm kind of gifted when it comes to languages

>>17398578
Agreed.
All I do is reading VNs while drinking some nice craft beers and occasionally furiously masturbating. If it were a job, I would say learning Japanese is the easiest job there is.

Im so happy. Just watched my first Hentai OVA without subtitles and understood everything. We're all going to make it.

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>>17393691
私ら　無星の
平民生徒に　とっちゃあー
３階級もうえのちょー偉いひとなの

>Compared to the Starless peasant students like us, he's a super elite who's three whole ranks above us!

>とっちゃあ
as far as my understanding goes this creates the "compared". from what is this derived? i know only 比べる　for comparsion.

>>17398753
にとっては

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>mining less and less as I read more
>feels like I'm not learning as much anymore

>>17398810
Up the level of your reading material.

>>17398810
So long as you're keeping up with your eroge you'll make it.

>>17398810
But that's a good thing?

ねこかいたい

ねこすき

でもおにいちゃんのほうがもっとすき

>>17398810
Ready something technical or something. Play Phoenix Wright in Japanese and learn basic legal vocab.

>>17398810
I can't wait for this to happen to me. I opened up the first Layton game thinking I could try playing it, but it had words like 遺言状 and 遺産 and I figured I'll just stick to simpler stuff for now.

>>17398511
>>17398522
>>17398530
>>17398537
お寿司を食べずに、出かけました=お寿司を食べないで、出かけました

この場合の「ない」は、助動詞です。
実は、否定の助動詞「ず」の連体形「ぬ」を形容詞「ない」で置き換える表現は、室町時代以降の関東の方言です。ですから、連体と終止の活用形が主でした。
この場合は、「食べる」と行為そのものが否定されています。従って形容詞「ない」の「なくて」は使えません。

次と比較してください
お寿司を食べないで、ラーメンを食べた=お寿司は食べなくて、ラーメンを食べた
この場合は、「お寿司を食べた」ことの否定で、「お寿司を食べること」を選択しないということなので、形容詞です。ですから、「なくて」が使えます。

直前の動詞の否定か節全体が否定的かで使い分けがあるということです。

「ない」の連用形である過去の否定「なかった」は江戸時代に、「なくて」は明治以降の表現です。
現在の関東以北の方言では、「ないで」を使うべき所も「なくて」を使うことが少なくない。
関西の方言では、助動詞「ぬ（ん）」の変形「へん」を使います。
で、本来、関西では過去の否定は「なんだ」ですが、「へんかった」も増えてきました。
こういうのは、「形容詞化」と言ってよいと思います。

>>17398901
Generally when you pick up something knew, that's when you encounter the most unfamiliar words due to subject material/writing style etc etc. It gets exponentially easier as you read onward.
So stick with it, anon

>>17398932
おすしたべたい

>>17398934
http://www.tofugu.com/japanese/language-first-page-syndrome/

>>17398962
「たい」も形容詞型ですね。
「お寿司を食べたくない」の「ない」は、「お寿司を食べたい」の全体の否定なので形容詞で、「お寿司を食べたくなくて」と言えます。

>>17398984
Can't read without a texthooker.

>>17399017
You're peak DJT.

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>retention rate has been slowly slipping
>hit 40%
>consider quitting
>decide I gave up last time, I won't do it this time
>turn off new cards
>go full review mode
>retention rate has been slowly going up
i'm glad I didn't give up, but doing this whole no-new-card thing won't end up biting me in the ass aside from being like a week behind where I was before, right?

>>17399044
Read more.

>>17398934
>>17398969
That's inspiring. Thanks.

>>17399017
It's from the Japanese version of HJGP.

>>17399107
Hungry Jacks General Protocol?

>>17399044
40% is very low. Are you sure you're not putting unreasonable requirements on your answers?

>>17399149
no i'm just an idiot who didn't really study for the last bit, and it fucked me over
now that im going through the words slowly and giving them each individual meaning instead of rushing through, its improving

>>17398149
>>17398235
Thanks.

>>17398242
I'm probably going to keep going for a while after 100 million but that's when it's okay for me to call it quits.

I didn't know where to look and I can't find on google, so I'll ask here
Does anyone know why the honorific suffix -bou is used for? Or at least can tell where to find the information.

>>17399278
Do you literally mean "why" or did you mean "what"?

>>17399288
Sorry to make it ambigous, i meant "what".

>>17399301
Just remember.

Why:
"Does anyone know why the honorific suffix -bou is used?"

What:
"Does anyone know what the honorific suffix -bou is used for?"

>>17399332
Thanks, but... do you know the answer to the question?

>>17399351
There's no single answer, it's not used every day in modern japanese so the nuance is determined by things more specific than just the japanese language.

>>17399351
https://dictionary.goo.ne.jp/jn/200980/meaning/m0u/%E5%9D%8A/

the ［接尾］ part

>>17399332
坊？
https://matome.naver.jp/odai/2146853182437929901?&page=1

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>Okay! Firstly, try (to) catch (them) freely!
The context is that Yotsuba, Ena and Jumbo are about to go catching cicadas. My translation doesn't make much sense in English though, specifically the word freely. I feel like mabye its some kind of catch and release type thing or Jumbo is saying something along the lines of "catch them however you wish"

>>17399421
Probably something along the lines of "however you want".

>>17399388
I'm not that guy, but thanks for that link
I always was to lazy to look up the difference between　陛下, 殿下 and 閣下

>>17399421
>Jumbo is saying something along the lines of "catch them however you wish"

this

>>17399432
>>17399445
Alright, Ill go with that then. Thank you.

>>17399421
This is like "read what they're saying, not the individual words" 101.

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>>17393691
今日はあなたのANKIがしましたか？

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頑張りたまえ

>>17399679
お前もしかして日本人

>>17399679
はい！
全部しましたよ！

>>17399679
ゆっくりしてる

>>17399723
頑張って、アノン。
簡単になる

ハイになる

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When are you supposed to read 今年 as 「ことし」 and when are you supposed to read it as 「こんねん」?

>>17399910
Oh, and the same question for 明日 with 「あした」 and 「あす」.

>>17399910
i've only ever seen ことし be used, but I could be wrong

>>17399910
both are a matter of formality

assume ことし almost always except in instances of extreme formality

あす you see primarily in writing or things that arent interpersonal conversations otherwise あした

>>17399910
Is there reading as こんねん? Do you mistake it for 本年(ほんねん)?

Please help me I'm retarded I can't find a torrent for flyable hearto

>>17400302
どっちでもよめるんじゃないかなあ

あたしのはつおんは「ほんねん」だよ

焼いたチーズたべたい

>>17399910
>>17399936
What >>17400003 said, and みょうにち is even more literary than あす.

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>78 lines of Hanahira
>45 words mined

i'm confused by something dio says in jojo, he says "ノロいノロい" according to a japanese site that had the script, but i can't figure out why it'd be in katakana or why the subs say it means 'too slow,' which would make sense, saying anything about curses wouldn't make any sense. i can't find any other meanings besides curse (呪い) or anything that'd imply slowness from のろい or ノロイ. is it an idiom i'm not aware of?

>>17400664
Install rikai.

>>17400664
http://thesaurus.weblio.jp/content/%E3%83%8E%E3%83%AD%E3%81%84

>>17400664
トロいもでてくるとおもうよ

トロいもノロいも「遅い」のいみだよ

あたしのちほーではノソいっていうのもつかうよ

>>17400676
>http://thesaurus.weblio.jp/content/%E3%83%8E%E3%83%AD%E3%81%84

not sure how this didn't come up earlier, thank you

How far if at all did you guys get into learning Kanji(readings and writing unrelated to just vocab). I got like 40 kanji in skipped and went to core + Milling, but i kinda want to revisit.

>>17400713
About 10

>>17400713
Never did it

>>17400664
install rikai pleblord 鈍い

>>17400713
I did all the jouyo then started reading. Works well for the honeymoon phase because its pure slog.

>>17400880
Then you have a retarded idea of a honeymoon

>>17400891
3D marriage is death m8

もし神様に会えたならどんなことを聞きたい？

>>17400947
「ふたなりの彼女を貰えませんか」多分

>>17400947
どの宗教が正解だったんですか？

so I know people bicker about all of the best ways to do this or that, but lets say you are looking towards knowing the language on a native level. Do Japanese people generally know all the different readings to the kanji they learn. I was wondering if maybe when a native speaker sees a word they dont know but they recognize the kanji if they maybe piece together what it is similar to how we would use context clues to guess what an unfamiliar word was in any other language.

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>>17395409
>いい理由の例え：
>忍びになりたい。

>>17401050
if you dont know the word most of the time you just dont know the word and have to look it up even if you know the kanji which is a thing

you probably know what the word means roughly but you still dont know how to read it until lookup

>>17400975
フライング・スパゲティ・モンスター教は唯一の正しい宗教だよ
それくらいは当たり前じゃん

>>17396759
I would rather translate it to "my 小手先 abilities (strength) is not sufficient, so foreign languages are 怖ろしい."

>>17401050
You'll automatically learn the readings of a kanji by learning whole words and reading a lot.

>>17401079
>>17401101
makes sense, and I guess that you can guess the words meaning but not reading by context all the same, but what about those made up and improvised words that I hear about in light novels. provided it doesn't have furigana how the hell do you know what they intended.

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What the hell is たてして supposed to mean?

>>17401138
呼び立てる

>>17401152
Ah, fuck. I should've gotten that.

Thanks.

Man, real nips talking and anime are two completely different worlds.

>>17401152
>>17401155
Actually, wait... what's the して for then? The て-form of 呼び立てる would be 呼び立てて, right? So what's 呼び立てして meant to be?

I would guess it's the ます-stem of 呼び立てる plus the て-form of する, but for what purpose?

When I'm reading something like はい , are the hiragana pronounced separately or together? Saying は and then い quickly sounds pretty close to how I would say はい together in english.

Similarly, I would say 元気 like "gehnki" but it sounds like Tae Kim is saying "genki".

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>>17401164
>Man, real nips talking and anime are two completely different worlds.

No shit dude.

Do you think americans talk like this in real life?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KffT5bPzsnk

in the end, you're watching cartoons made for children and comparing it to actual adult conversation

doesn't work

>>17401170
wouldn't listening to people saying the words do the trick here. those are fairly common words so it shouldn't be hard to find an example.

2017-07-30 Added Shugaten.
2017-07-30 Added Nanairo Reincarnation.
2017-07-30 Fixed stray formatting in Clover Point.

Removed the BCCWJ 1500 column from the stats because it was useless and added a VN 5k "sans 50" column, which ignores the contribution of uncovered words in that VN's particular top 50 most common words.

https://vnscripts.neocities.org/

>>17401184
Yeah, I'm going to try and say them how people pronounce them. It's just different from what I would expect so I was curious about it.

so I see rikaisama is still in the resource guide but I'm reading it's apparently broken as well now? Am I just missing the part that tells how to fix it or is it just fucked?

>>17401183
I guess that analogy makes sense if all you watch is Precure and Shinchan.

>>17401185
Why the fuck is Shirokuma Bell Stars in the middle of a bunch of chuunige when I sort by VN 5k?

>>17401200
I'm not really qualified to give advice at my experience, but just hearing people speak has already corrected me in a few places.

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>>17401211
shirokuma bell stars is the hardest japanese known to mankind

>>17401166
お呼び立て is a する verb. The て at the end isn't て form, it's the 連用形 (-masu stem) of 立てる, so this is no different from saying お願いする.

>>17401203
>I guess that analogy makes sense if all you watch is Precure and Shinchan.

THIS JUST IN
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZOQnGJDanE
AMERICANS TALK LIKE THIS

>>17401255
as an american I can confirm this.

>>17401255
Stop trying to compare Japanese shows to American shows, it doesn't work.

>>17397073
>>17397075
>>17397078
>>17397084
>>17397150
>>17397155
>>17397199
This conversation gives me hope. I'm feeling rather burned out lately, someone, give me some inspiration please.

>>17401226
Well, that's weird.

"お呼びたてる" - 22,700 results in google
"お呼びたてた" - 637,000 results in google
"お呼びたてて" - 3(!) results in google

"お呼びたてする" - 977 results in google
"お呼びたてした" - 499 results in google
"お呼びたてして" - 13,600 results in google

What the heck is up with that? お呼びたてる and お呼びたてた are massively preferred over お呼びたてする and お呼びたてした, it seems, yet when it comes to the て-form, practically nobody uses お呼びたてる's て-form and the て-form of お呼びたてする is more common than お呼びたてする itself.

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>>17401203
>tfw you watch a bunch of moe anime and then your Japanese teacher says you talk like a girl

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>>17401271
>tfw people say you talk like a girl

>>17401264
In japanese google, お呼び立てる has 365,000 results and お呼び立てする has 433,000

>>17401264
>expecting nips to know how their language works

>>17401258
explain how that's not a valid comparison?

what is so MAGICALLY different about japanese cartoons that has not been replicated in american ones?

>>17401264
Normally you would use it with します/しました, since (like the お) it's a politeness thing.

>>17401264
>"お呼びたてた" - 637,000 results in google
oh wait, actually, there are 0 results. The 637,000 results came from google instead searching for the word without the quotation marks.

Okay, so お呼びたてる is the most common form of the word, yet it is never conjugated for some weird reason and conjugations of お呼びたて+する are used instead. I don't get what's going on there.

>>17401280
I used Japanese google. You aren't using quotation marks so it isn't searching those exact forms of the word.

>>17401273
From here on out, I'll talk like a yakuza delinquent!

>>17401285
Japanese is a magical language

>>17401289
If I recall correctly, る (for ichidan verbs, I think) itself originated as a flexible "make this a verb" word just like する・す and ぬ.

>>17401286
"お呼びたてします" - 2 results compared to 977 when using する
"お呼びたてしました" - 700 results compared to 499 when using した

>>17401294
>Japanese is a magical language

oh, so you're still in the "alien language/culture" phase. that'll go away in a year.

in terms of dialect, it really doesn't matter what language you speak, the language/manners displayed on television are overly dramatic on purpose. you can't compare that to real conversation.

>>17401289
>Okay, so お呼びたてる is the most common form of the word

That only has 2 hits and isn't a real conjugation. Google is redirecting you to "お呼びたて". Similar for >>17401301

>>17401308
lol did they really not read the redirection text

I redact my response >>17401300

>>17401308
>Google is redirecting you to "お呼びたて"
A shit, so it was.

If you knock off the お prefix, you get 3130 results though, and "呼び立てる" appears in several dictionaries.

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>>17401333
On the other hand, I only found one entry for 呼び立て, which says in its definition "呼びたてること".

mad scramble for who can google their way to fluency the fastest

today we learned lil 立て is a special dude who is more flexible than he looks

or at least i hope we will have learned

Stop this google bullshit and watch some gaki instead for listening practice
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x5vcc03

>>17401271
>>17401273
If you don't deliberately use お嬢様言葉 you are a faggot.

>>17401365
no ur the faggot ですわ

>>17401185
>90%+ coverage for more than half of that VN list with just 5K words
Could you do a coverage comparison with Core2K+6K. We could have a more effective starter vocab deck on our hands for those that just want to consume otaku media.

>>17401415
There's no accurate way to compare the output of the analysis tools to Core 2k/6k. The reason it works for BCCWJ and the VN frequency list is because they themselves are generated from the exact same analysis dictionary.

Someone could, like, map every word in Core 2k/6k to this stuff, but it would be very time consuming. Harder than ripping several VNs' scripts.

>>17401427
Use the Japanese Text Analysis Tool, ignore the stats and get the word list it generates.

>>17401450
JTAT has exactly the problem and uses a worse dictionary.

>>17401502
so the nips have shitty wigger rap

>>17401518
nah homie its 超lit

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I'm at the first choice in Flyable Heart. Which route is the most fun (or otherwise least depressing/dramatic/whatever)?

Since I don't understand stuff very well yet, fun is my motivation to keep reading, so I don't want to go through a route filled with drama and depressing stuff first time around.

>>17401502
is this the new generation of nips? this looks like shibuya

fuck, these cunts will be in the government someday

>>17401524
超ホモ

>>17401526
isnt the entire point a visual game to weave your own adventure through life changing choices

>>17401531
i was hoping youd snap back instantly with 超shit

>>17401533
Nope it's to bang a 2D loli

>>17401533
>isnt the entire point a visual game to weave your own adventure through life changing choices
I tried that approach with the first VN I ever read (English translated) and ended up getting a bad end after hours upon hours of reading, so ever since I use walkthroughs to avoid repeating that misery.

>>17401530
B boys have always been there. They're just westaboos who have adopted the most cancerous form of American culture.

>>17401415
If anybody wants to make this possible, go through this and fix it up:

https://vnscripts.neocities.org/test.txt

The format should be fairly obvious. Words from core 2k/6k should point to exactly and only the entries in https://vnscripts.neocities.org/VNFreqList.tsv that they correspond to. When there is no correspondence, split the core 2k/6k word up into smaller parts if possible, and check those, otherwise delete it. There are 900 automatic mapping failures, so good luck.

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>>17401538
>B boys have always been there. They're just westaboos who have adopted the most cancerous form of American culture.

REMINDER - when i move to japan, move to RURAL japan. fuck tokyo and fuck osaka. stay away from all westaboo cancer

ninomiya here i come

>>17401543
This would probably have fewer failures if you used BCCWJ but I can tell why you didn't (the spelling stuff)

>漏る
The fuck is this in 2k/6k?

>>17401558
Actually yeah I should have mappings for that too. It doesn't give all spellings for each lemma like the VN frequency list does but whatever. Let me do that before anyone starts doing something with this.

>>17401536
this

>>17401550
youd actually be worse off and be more of an eyesore unless youre asian but if youre a nonjp asian then as soon as someone gets a good look at you すぐバレちゃう anyway

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>>17401564
How about Nishinomiya or anywhere in Kyushu?

>>17401560
>>17401543
Mappings to BCCWJ frequency list entries added, using > instead of :. This reduces the number of mapping failures to 661, which is still a lot, but less ridiculous.

>>17401537
There's a reason they give you 9 million save slots, you know.

>>17401537
>I tried that approach with the first VN I ever read (English translated)

Which was it? As >>17401590 said you should be obsessively saving at every choice.

>>17401602
Clannad.

I'm pretty sure it was one of those bad ends you get after making a bunch of wrong choices, so I would've had to go back hours to fix it.

>>17401090
"You can't use the power of 小手先 to communicate, so foreign languages are 恐ろしい。"

Ie. You can't fake it in a real conversation.

i mean do you really want the true end in clannad like truly

i think you should just make no saves and accept the life you lived when its over

>>17401605
You can skip through an entire branch's dialogue in about 5-10 minutes.

>>17398984
mind sharing?

>>17401804
See >>17399107. Also >>17399107 HJGP = 日本語文型辞典 (Handbook of Japanese Grammar Patterns)

(it's in the CoR)

>>17401813
>>17401816
CoR only has the PDF version (or scanned) though? I think the screenshot looks like it's coming from a word doc.

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After arduous work, I have finally read my first whole sentence.

>>17401955
And it's not even grammatically correct

>>17401955
I didn't know it was 2022 already.

>>17401992
Reminder that YYYY-MM-DD is the only valid date format.

>>17401996
The screenshot has only YY-MM-DD though.

>>17402001
Well suck my dick then

>>17402001
No, it clearly can't be from the past, that would be dishonest.

>>17402005
*sucks dick*

>>17398297
The past is so offensive, I hope history classes will soon show similar efforts to omit any problematic parts.

>>17402017
It's referring to things that are obviously archaic, not objectionable content.

>>17398297
>Largely due to the absurdly long duration of copyrights
tfw conning is a bro

>>17402026
>It's referring to things that are obviously archaic
No it isn't. Nobody would describe something as "offensive" just on the grounds that it's old. When was the last time you saw someone call the the language of Shakespeare offensive?

>>17402048
Linguists do in fact use the word "offensive" to describe bad/corrupt linguistic examples.

>>17402048
It's literally completely ordinary English to say things are "offensive" when they're situationally unwanted.

>>17402052
He's clearly not just talking about linguistics though since he brought up "ideas".

>the language and ideas of their respective eras.
>ideas

>>17402026
I don't get that from the statement, especially when it goes on to criticize "ideas" of that time.

>>17402056
Oh, and he also goes on to whine about how Japanese literature isn't "diverse" enough and how women are under-represented, so it's clear that he got triggered by something "problematic".


Lack of diversity among source authors
These reading sets draw most heavily on sources made available by Project Gutenberg and Aozora Bunko. Among the many dozens of bilingual texts available from these projects at the time of writing, not a single source was written by an author of African, Hispanic, or Native American descent, to name just a few excluded categories. Female authors were underrepresented.

As a symbolic gesture, I personally translated a smallquantity of public domain material written by Afro-American and Afro-European authors. But this material is far from adequate, and for future projects I seek suggestions from readers for sources of copyright-free bilingual material from a wider diversity of authors.

I was particularly disappointed not to be able to use Martin Luther King’s historic “I Have a Dream Speech” of 1963. In this case the barrier was not the lack of a translation, but the control Dr. King’s estate continues to exert over this copyrighted work. I invite readers to share their opinions on the issue of author diversity in public domain texts (particularly bilingual texts), both with copyright owners and with the translation community. For more information, please consult the following websites:
weneeddiversebooks.tumblr.com
projectgutenbergproject.blogspot.com/2014/05/wishlist-black-writers-in-public-domain.html

>>17402026

He openly refers to the "ideas" in reason to offensive language as well. It's pretty clear what he means.

>>17402056
>>17402059
It's not referring to offensive opinions, it's referring to things that are so different that they're "offensive" to someone trying to learn from them without being taken aback or failing to understand the content. Very few things are obscene, and those are the things that he would *not* have put into the reader, not the things he would have let in.

And this is a completely normal use of the word "offensive".

>中田さんが、自刃するため、刃をむき出した。
>Nakata-san unsheathed the blade in order to take it to himself.

>>17402080
I'm pretty sure that if he wanted to keep things that are offensive in that way out of the reader it would have been very easy. He specifically said that the material absolutely does contain such offensive ideas. This cannot possibly mean things that are morally or ethically looked down upon, it can only mean things that are unfitting for learning material.

>>17402082
Then all he would have to do is say "language". Why bring up ideas? And why does he go on to whine about how he couldn't find any black Japanese authors to include in the reader?

>>17402092
>Then all he would have to do is say "language". Why bring up ideas?
Because language and the ideas represented in language are very closely related. You would never talk about the usefulness of telephone operators in [current year AD]. Someone who doesn't care about history or phones wouldn't understand what such a sentence is talking about.

>And why does he go on to whine about how he couldn't find any black Japanese authors to include in the reader?
Things written by black people and translated into Japanese. And the only reason he couldn't find any is because anything written by black people worth translating into Japanese is under copyright or very technical.

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"Even though we are adult-like, cute things are good. Our infatuation probably got bigger" ? I don't really understand the second sentence in the picture at all.

>>17402102
Even though we look grown up, liking cute things is, like, good. So this is the power of gap moe (things being moe because of a disparity).

>>17402107
Alright so I more or less got the first sentence right. Just the second sentence is so damn anime, I couldn't think right. thanks.

>>17402113
My "translation" of the second sentence is extremely liberal, except for the gap moe part.

>>17401202
Use Yomichan instead

>>17402102
That sentence was only about マコちゃん iirc

Do you guys think it's important to memorize Japanese place names? Or at least the prefectures?

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>>17402786
whats the harm

>>17402786
>important
If you want to go there

Alright, finished up my grammar guide.
Time to read. Any tips?

>>17402873

Naruto is pretty easy and the first couple of volumes are good manga. Yotsubato has simpler vocabulary but the homoerotic slang makes it a little overwhelming for a beginner.

>>17402873
What kind of media do you want to read? Manga, visual novels, blogs, chats, news articles?

>>17402904
Manga, blogs & forums.

>>17402873
Post on HelloTalk!! All the girls want the 外人のおちんちん

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>>17402955
Man, i heard plenty of stories about HelloTalk.
There's the loner nihongoes neckbeards, the "N3" weebs, the girls who will treat you like a celebrity if you speak 2 phrases of Japanese..., the occasional Mexican grasshopper...quality...just...pure quality