How do we help the Muslim/Arab world achieve secularism, democracy,

>Old sudan

update this shit ffs

>>67948803
For God's sake England stop trying to force our morals and values onto other nations. It has never worked before, what makes you think it would work now?

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>>67948835
Pic related then!
>>67948878
>force
Don't want to force anything. I want world peace and to help all people of the world without any violence.

>>67948803
Change can only come successfully if it's from the people themselves
Most Arabs/Muslims aren't interested in Western lifestyle

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>>67948803
Talk about how carthiginians lost against romans for Tunisia, Algeria, Lybia and Marocco.

When you think about it every good country of the world claims either a roman heritage (France, Spain, Italy and Russia nowadays) or a carthaginian heritage (US, UK) so it could also work with those. Though it should take some years.

Also replace islam by christianity. No idea how but it must be done.

>>67949014
This.

>>67948803
arabs shouldnt exist

>>67948803
You don't.
The West getting involved in shit with Muslims always comes back to bite us in the ass.
Just leave them alone 2bh.

>>67949014
>Most Arabs/Muslims aren't interested in Western lifestyle
dont lie
once you leave your shitholes you become degenerate subhumans

you either nuke that entire place or spread some rabies virus or whatever
OR
you force christianity onto those asses

>>67948803
Kill them all

>>67949083
t. urk

Go back in time and prevent the Eternal Anglo from creating Israel and Saudi Arabia

>>67949014
>Western lifestyle
I'm not talking about the "lifestyle" of liberal decadence (drugs, sexuality etc.). I just mean structural change to how the countries are governed.
>>67949119
Not a supporter of military interventionism. I mean peaceful cultural exchange to help these societies come up to date.

>>67949151
I am a Greek

>>67949185
>I mean peaceful cultural exchange
What if they don't want your '''culture'''?

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>>67948803
You can't, Islam is the basis of everything in their daily lives. Just leave them alone and keep them out of non muslim countries.

>>67948803
Invade each one of these countries on a bogus pretext and install a puppet "democracy". Meanwhile, play sectarian sensitivities against each other and get rich with arms sales to all involved parties. Always works

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>>67949125
No you don't understand, they don't "become" degenerate subhumans, they already were degenerate subhumans and specifically left their shitholes so they can practise Western heresy

>>67949222
>What if they don't want your '''culture'''?
I think they do though. What rational person could be against democracy and progress etc.?

>>67948803
You don't
Because everytime you do, you achieve the exact opposite so fuck off

>>67949397
>What rational person could be against democracy and progress etc
By looking at the hysteria behind Brexit and the US election so visable in modern """democracies""" and realizing that people are easily fooled into voting against their self interests

>>67949014
I agree, except you have to realize that your people do want the fruits of Western civilization such as medicine, technology or media. You can't have one without the other.

>>67948803
>not including Turkey

you do know they are at present returning to the middle ages, OP?

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>>67949211
Restore the Empire desu.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSaa2A7csxM

>>67949496
I know, I know. We're all too stupid to run our lives and only an elite group of Marxist lesbians can lead us to enlightenment.

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>>67949584
>Marxist lesbians
>In the Middle fucking East

wasnt the arab spring about the young generation wanting the stuff the op talks about?

>>67949486
That's a terrible attitude to have. I don't believe fatalism. Any society can improve its conditions, you just need to find a way how.
>>67949533
Yea I guess Turkey could be in that list but generally it's doing a whole lot better than most of MENA.

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>>67949667
>We want democracy!
>The majority votes in favor of a fundamentalist Muslim oppressive government
IT'S NOT POSSIBLE TO CREATE SUCH THINGS

>>67949667
>>67949758
Yea but the Arab Spring got overtaken by Salafist Islamist people. In the beginning it was about progress and democracy. Same was true with the Iranian revolution. These Islamists always end up manipulating the movements to suit their goals.

OP you need to understand every race develop a diferent culture, is genetical.

comunities will grativate towards their genetics.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0velAH-GnIg

look at this, is how blacks really are.
they don't want to be whites, this is the problem with white people, they think other races want to be like whites, and get surprised when it doesn't happen.

bunch of weak faggots.

>>67949817
>Yea but the Arab Spring got overtaken by Salafist Islamist people.
More like the people voted for them because Salafism is incredibly influential and popular in Muslim countries thanks to Saudi charities funding schools and hospitals.

>>67949817
Islamic guilt-tripping will always take precedence over any progressive movement, Egypt is a microcosm of the entire region

Every single time, salafist cocksucking shitheads will attempt to highjack the movement and incite anti-progressive hatred

The greatest folly is how Islam is fundamentally incompatible with secular advancement, arabs (or at least us) are far too stupid to realize this

>>67948803
well i was born into a rich family and living in a comfy small mountain village i pity all of you such a sad existence desu

>>67949683
>Yea I guess Turkey could be in that list but generally it's doing a whole lot better than most of MENA.
Turkey have a bigger terrorism problem, and increasing injustice in an authoratarian regime. It is ahead of some others thanks to legacy from past, nothing more than it.

>>67949870
>More like the people voted for them
When did these violent Salafists get voted in? I'm pretty sure they just take power through force like >>67949904 mentioned.

>>67949925
Isn't Tunisia like the only democracy in the region or something?

>>67950006
>When did these violent Salafists get voted in?
Look at how much support the Muslim brotherhood has.

>>67950006
democracy my ass we are ruled by mafia thus it doesn't affect my lifestyle so i don't care

>>67948803
They try to figger out right now.. But you idiot anglos always have to intervene. If you would just let them kill each other they could draw they boarders new and in 50-100 years there would maybe be some cool countrys

>>67950006
Salafi's are insidious, corrupt, power-ungry fuckers

They will commit adultery, take cocaine, embezzle half the national budget, but in the end of the day they exert their influence and constantly maintain a modicum of control by guilt-tripping Arabs/Africans

They always cuck the people with ridiculous statements like 'you want or humble benign Islamic state to have naked women running around, endless adultery and other forms of corruption?!"

>>67950133
Well what the hell do we do?

>>67950283
just leave them alone, dont bomb them faggot.

>>67950283
Stop listening to the Sudanese cuck looking for Yous

>>67950400
t. Muhammad ibn Ali Muhammad

>>67950396
I'm against all these wars/military interventions which are just done for big Western power interests anyway and leave these countries worse off.

I'm talking about getting these countries to improve their own situations from within and recognising the light of Enlightenment values.

>inb4 Reddit

>>67948803
Why do you want to help them?

>>67950283
Disembowel Islam's integrity, prove to them that its a neo-pagan-Arabian abomination that has no place in the 21st century

>>67949014
Is this a joke? All these regions were or were becoming secular in 60s and 70s before Cold War proxy fighting kicked in. Iran literally held one of the highest female university graduate numbers in the world back then when women in certain parts of Europe couldn't even vote.

>>67950524
Why be against making the world a better place?

>>67950485
why they should pick your values rather than their own?

have you read about sharia law?
It doesn't seem as awful as you may think and there's even pol threads asking why pol doesn't want sharia if is everything they want.

At least from my perspective Sharia Law is much better than the degeneracy of western shit, pushing for feminism, cuckholding, liberalism, trasgender and gay shit, also atheism.

You need to understand islam is having currently an identity crisis and muslims are starting to wonder about their culture, islam isn't even a monolith, and there's diferent school and sects.

Islamic terrorism isn't considered true islam by most muslims, nobody in their minds, even hardcore muslims want to engage in war and massacre people and kill childrens.

They're simply normal people with a diferent culture, most people are fine.

Islamic terrorism is a Saudi/Clinton sponsored terrorists to engage in proxy wars with Iran and to make terrors attacks in europe so their citizens give more power to the EU, why do you think they're passing all these anti liberty laws with the excuse of fighting terrorism?

In the end, is a brainwashing effort of the elites to scare people about islam.

OP asks how e can HELP them... but people get mad and tells us whiteboiis to gtfo and leave them alone.

Last I checked these people drown their kids trying to get where we live... and we send millions in foreign aid to those who stay behind.

So sure, yeah; fuck whiteboii.

>>67950831
Sharia Law is the definitive guide to making your country a shithole

It will never be consistently applied to the ruling class, they use it to subjugate everyone until the next popular uprising

>>67950681
Because everytime someone tries that they fuck it up

>>67950831
I can almost guarantee your some daddy's money mentally ill leb descendant. Literally the only soft apologists for shariah in Colombia.

>>67950976
it's a core cornerstone of muslim culture, you can't take it away.

you just have to deal with it.

>>67950831
I never mentioned anything about them giving up Islam. They should have freedom of religion and that means freedom for Muslims to follow Islam. I was talking about political stuff unrelated to Islam.
>>67951014
I don't think there's ever been a genuine attempt at improving the condition of these societies. Unless you think over throwing regimes and putting in puppet dictators for Western interests is "helping them".

>>67951063
>I don't think there's ever been a genuine attempt at improving the condition of these societies
That's the point. There never has been and there never will be. They'll just have to figure it out themselves.

>>67951063
Not going to lie the soviets worked more in their best interest than the west did.

>>67951063
because Islam is their identity.

Imagine asking a core religious christian if they support gay marriage and abortion.

it doesn't make sense.
stop thinking about how western values are superior.

just like gay shit, stop pushing that garbage in my nation.

>>67950831

lmao.

Inserting "cuckholding" there to make equal rights movement sound like some self-deprecation bullshit.

You live in a shithole Pablo, dont you have your own problems to fix?

>>67951250
those are the values the west is pushing on non westerners now, sorry Sven.

nobody wants to grant gay rights outside cuck europeans.

>>67951250
>pablo
He's probably some Leb oligarchs kid.

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>How do we help the Muslim/Arab world achieve secularism, democracy, human rights, the rule of law, science and respect for personal freedoms?

>>67948803
Just nuke the whole middle east and re-settle it with white people.

>>67951309

Its not spesificly about gay rights, its about equal rights for everyone... and everyone includes gays. What is the problem anyway? Give me a good reason why homosexuals shouldnt have the same basic rights as the rest of us.

>>67951218
>gay marriage and abortion.
>gay shit
I too am against these things to be honest.

>>67948803
Bomb the shit outta them.

>>67951426

Why?

>>67951404
>Give me a good reason why homosexuals shouldnt have the same basic rights as the rest of us.
Homosexuality is destructive to the nuclear family which is the foundation of society. Sexuality is only acceptable in heterosexual, monogamous marriage. Anything else will just lead to the nuclear family breaking down and society being corrupted.

>>67951485
See >>67951499 for Homosexuality.

Abortion is the murder of an innocent baby. Nothing is more immoral.

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>>67951382
>now you have millions of war refugees moving toward europe
wow, good plan retard.

>>67951404
because you're viewing that shit from your western core, retard.

come here and ask the common people if they support gay rights, the average person here will tell you is an abomination and will use the God made a woman and male as his eternal plan.

there was african polls in black nations and more than 95% of their population supported jail or even kill gays.

you're making a wrong asumption, because you were raised under a liberal feminist culture.
you can't simply ask to more conservative cultures to adopt values they consider degenerate.

pic related, countrywide manifestations because there was simply the suggestion that schools should teach something about tolerance to gay shit or trans shit here.

>>67951529
Abortion is necessary for keeping down the number of black people, and people who will undoubtedly be on welfare for their entire lives.

>>67951499
>Homosexuality is destructive to the nuclear family which is the foundation of society
How? The fags weren't going to be interested in women anyway, you'll just make them miserable pieces of shit that beat their kids to prove their 'manliness'

>>67951632
start promoting trade jobs and trade education on black comunities, stop promoting going to college to black people, retard.

>>67951499

How is it destructive to the nuclear family? They can adopt kids and raise a family.

And just because you outlaw homosexuality, doesnt mean people will stop being homosexuals.

The problem here seems to be that you guys think homosexuals are perverted sexual deviants.

Being ignorant bigots who publicly spew this bullshit out in the public is a bigger problem to society than homosexuality.

How come countries that score the highest in human development; are countries that have most equal rights? Guess where the countries that have outlawed homosexuality are.

>>67951771
>trade jobs and trade education on black communities
Implying they don't already do so and are likewise shit at said jobs.

>>67951751
gay population is less than 2% of the global population, is irrelevant of their feelings.

may as well legalize pedophilia at this point, or necrophilia.

gays are simply a too vocal minority.

>>67951776
let me ask this:
why is the white race the only race that will decrease it's population in the next decades?

>>67951804
>shit
they were pretty good at it during the great depression, but liberals and democrats had to destroy them to gain votes.

>>67951776
listen here you yo-ro-peean, I ain't letting them home of sexuals ruin my goddamn country like you commies, only lawful union is between a man and his sister

>>67951596

I dont give a shit what the public opinion is. Just because a bunch of idiots agree on something; doesnt make it right.

Real though, why cant you just give me a good reason to why homosexuals should have equal rights?

>>67951632
Instead of murdering black babies maybe you should try to integrate blacks and give them the chances that whites have.
>>67951751
>>67951776
>How
Because Gays/Lesbians don't settle down with wives/husbands and have children. Every person needs to do that for their own sake and for society. The liberlisation of sexuality from being something husband and wife did to being something you do for pleasure has led to enormous problems (single parenthood, sky high abortions, sky high divorces, teenage pregnancy, STDs etc.). Homosexuality is part of that.

>They can adopt kids and raise a family.
The thought of homosexuals raising kids actually makes me want to vomit. That is utterly depraved.

>>67951839
>may as well legalize pedophilia at this point, or necrophilia.
How is two men having consensual sex with one another as bad as one who exploits and defiles kids/corpses who have no say in the matter?

>>67951771
>start promoting trade jobs and trade education on black comunities
That shit's already done to everyone. People finally realized that white-collar jobs are now an over-saturated market, and employers are begging for skilled blue-collar jobs now.

>stop promoting going to college to black people
Why?

>>67951839
>why is the white race the only race that will decrease it's population in the next decades?
Asians are also going down.
Plus, dropping populations is what you get with modern societies.
There's not a high need to reproduce, since your children have a high likelihood of reaching adulthood, and parents don't need 25 kids to help run their farms or take care of them in their old age.

>>67951499
t. muhammad

>>67948803
Kiddnap their children and educate them without the quoran braiwash

>>67951975
>not giving the kids a quickie before sexy time

>>67951959
>>67951975
>le victimless crime
Except sexual liberation isn't victimless in the slightest. Homosexuality has numerous negative consequences for both the people involved and society as a whole.

>>67951891
How dare those blacks seek higher education. Also a fucking white supremacist living in Colombia doesn't strike you as odd.

>>67951959
I'm telling you fucking retard.
Stop pushing gay shit over non europeans because they DONT WANT IT.

Even N.Koreans don't even have a word for gay shit, they simply can't understand the concept.

>>67951975
it has always seen as degeneracy in all off history.

>>67951981
because trade jobs are perfect for the intelectual skills of black people.
most of them aren't suited to become engineers, may as well become electricians or plumbers or welders.

>asians are going down
asians will still be the majority in 2050.
whites will go from 25% in 1950 to less than 10% in 2050.
no other population will see this, and is because of liberal shit, feminism, women in the workforce, cuck and the city and abortion.
all degenerate garbage being promoted in non western nations.
fuck off white cucks.

>>67951839

Because the majority of the white race live in societies where they have high education and freedom of choice. They want to spend more time working and exploring.

And how is that a bad thing? Have you not seen how many people we are on this earth? How fast were growing. It needs to slow down.

>>67951967
>Because Gays/Lesbians don't settle down with wives/husbands and have children
Neither do many straight people. Nearly 50% will never have kids.
>The liberlisation of sexuality from being something husband and wife did to being something you do for pleasure has led to enormous problems (single parenthood, sky high abortions, sky high divorces, teenage pregnancy, STDs etc.).
First off, how the fuck does too men being able to buttfuck one another with no chance of having children influence straight people into doing degenerate shit? That makes no sense and implies lack of willpower on the behalf of heterosexuals.
Secondly, those were already massive problems when homosexuality was accepted and have gone down massively in recent decades due to education and alleviation of poverty.

>>67952115
>Homosexuality has numerous negative consequences for both the people involved and society as a whole.
Like? You're not being specific, you're dodging the question.
>>67952192
>it has always seen as degeneracy in all off history.
This is so untrue I don't know where to begin.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_LGBT_history

>>67952191
I'm brown as fuck.
I recognize there's racial diferences.

most black people don't have the enough IQ to suceed in engineering or philosophy.

>>67952197
except if you don't have kids, your population start to age, there will be less workers, less taxes and overall economic decline.

the solution?
massive inmigration.
what happens then?
your civilization collapses and is taken down by barbarians who are younger, more masculine and agressive.

wow, good job, feminism.

Read about how civilizations collapsed in history.

>>67952204
homosexuality and feminism is pushed in the last stages of a civilization, is nothing new, hedonism is the last stage of a civilization before it collapses.
also the welfare state.

nothing new in history.

>>67952253
LGBT shit is nothing new, it has existed in the roman empire and among greeks and chinese.
It's always pushed in the last stages of a civilization before it collapses.

>>67952192
>asians will still be the majority in 2050.
Yeah so? You argued that whites were the only ones; they aren't.

>no other population will see this, and is because of liberal shit, feminism, women in the workforce, cuck and the city and abortion.
>this is what /pol/acks actually believe
I just told you why they aren't reproducing.
Cuckoldry is a niche fetish.
In the US, whites are the least likely to marry someone outside of their race,
Abortions are a very rare thing outside of the black community.
Women in the workforce is arguable since women with full-time jobs don't have the time to have kids, but they're the not majority.

You really need to get out more, Pablo.

>>67952204
>Neither do many straight people. Nearly 50% will never have kids.
That proves how bad the sexual revolution has been. Procreation and regular family structures have fallen off a cliff.
>First off, how the fuck does too men being able to buttfuck one another with no chance of having children influence straight people into doing degenerate shit? That makes no sense and implies lack of willpower on the behalf of heterosexuals.
Changing attitudes in one area affect other areas. When sexuality was viewed as something you did when you were married between a man and a woman, families and communities as a result were far more stable.
>>67952253
>Like? You're not being specific, you're dodging the question.
Individuals need the stabilising factor or a wife/husband and children to raise. Stable communities need stable families. Children need the influence of a father and a mother to be well adjusted. Society needs healthy, responsible adults not sexually demented perverts.

Homosexuality denies all of that for short term pleasure of the individuals involved. It's so short sighted to say "hurr, no direct victim".

>>67952408
Stop making stuff about skin colour. Blacks are fully capable of being responsible, successful citizens if they're given the opportunity do so.

America is a highly racist society which destroys black communities. Our blacks do very well because we don't discriminate.

>>67952408
>It's always pushed in the last stages of a civilization before it collapses
Bullshit the first recorded same sex marriage in history occurred in 27 BC during the rise of the Roman empire and Augustus' reign.

>>67948803
>muh white man's burden

>>67952440
http://www.vdare.com/articles/whites-down-to-10-of-world-population-by-2060-does-it-matter

>>67952539
blacks were starting to do it fine until the 60's and 70's when drugs and ghetto culture was pushed by the merchants and democrats to destroy black comunities, kept them poor and make them vote for democrats.

>>67952583
you need to read the fate of empires.
here is it.
http://people.uncw.edu/kozloffm/glubb.pdf

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>>67948803
Nuclear weapons.

>>67952677
>blacks were starting to do fine until the civil rights movement
Also I find it hard to believe your brown if you're so obsessed with the breeding habits of white people. That or your levels of self loathing must be off the charts.

>>67952450
>That proves how bad the sexual revolution has been
That's a historical statistic. You'd be hard pressed to find a society where every single person was married with children.
>When sexuality was viewed as something you did when you were married between a man and a woman, families and communities as a result were far more stable.
How does semantics behind a word suddenly change how families are structured? That makes no sense and sounds like pseudo-scientific bullshit.
>Homosexuality denies all of that for short term pleasure of the individuals involved.
Homosexuals aren't attracted to women, plain and simple. How's that difficult to understand?
>Children need the influence of a father and a mother to be well adjusted.
Good thing gays can't biologically have kids than.
>Society needs healthy, responsible adults not sexually demented perverts.
Guess what? Most people aren't those things and never have been. Very few people go into marriage knowing how to raise a child from the get go.

This isn't a problem with homosexuality, rather that people are given little to no reason to put up with having a husband/wife who nags you 24/7.

>>67952835
>reading about diferent things is bad
lel the intelectually inferior.

>>67952677
>Sir John Glubb was brought up a devout member of the Anglican church
Yes, not biased at all.

>>67952925
You're placing individual decadence over the nuclear family (husband, wife and children). Once the nuclear family breaks down, so does everything else. If you don't construct policies with family in mind, you're in for a failing society.

>>67953042
>You're placing individual decadence over the nuclear family
Gays aren't going to have kids anyway. It's not choose one or the other.

>>67952935
>reading =/= being personally invested in who white people are fucking

>>67953095
Gays force society to accept their agenda which changes cultural attitudes towards sexuality, relationships and family. This has massively negative consequences.

Also, you're wrong about gays not raising children. They adopt/surrogate/inseminate etc. Children being raised without mothers or fathers is degenerate.

>>67953185
>Gays force society to accept their agenda
Lmao, no they don't.

>>67953042

What should homosexuals do then? Be forced to have sex with a woman? Could you be forced to have sex with a man?

Maybe we should stop invading them this time

>>67953095
gays means degeneracy, which destroy the family core.

>>67953175
I don't give a fuck about white.
Actually I hate white people.

About another 500 years of development.
They're going to be Liveleak-tier for the next half millennium.

>>67953304
most gays end up comitting suicide after all, just like trans people.
they're mentally ill.

>>67953185

So children that had their fathers/mothers die/leave at a young age will automaticly become a degenerate?

No one who was raised by a single parrent will become successful or happy?

If one mother/father can do it. Why cant two fathers or two mothers do it?

>>67953363

You mean thats the best solution? That they eventually end up dead?

>>67953277
>Lmao, no they don't.
They constantly demand greater and greater rights. That includes legal recognition, raising children, serving in the military etc.
>>67953304
>What should homosexuals do
What should drug abusers do? What should people who want to cheat on their wives/husbands do?

You don't have to act on your urges.

>>67953419
>single parenthood
This is a bad thing and I feel very sorry for kids being raised by single parents without a father/mother.

So there's absolutely no reason to compound the problem by introducing homosexual parenting. It makes no sense to tolerate further problems because others happen by accident.

>>67953525
>They constantly demand greater and greater rights.
What rights do homosexuals have that no one else in society does?

>>67953509
they're less than 1% of your population.

may as well call them mentally ill.

>>67953601
>What rights do homosexuals have that no one else in society does?
That wasn't your question. You said gays don't force society to accept their agenda. I gave your examples of them doing exactly that.

>>67953663
Demanding equal rights isn't an agenda. In that case there would also be a Black Agenda, Asian Agenda, Jewish Agenda etc.

We build a wall around all of it, Nuke the interior of the wall. Put drones inside. Broadcast the madmax helscape on TV.

>>67953798
>Black Agenda, Asian Agenda, Jewish Agenda
These groups don't corrupt nuclear families. Homosexuality does. It's a false analogy.

>>67948803
isolate them, never intervene, let them kill each other until they learn how to live together peacefully

>>67953525

>They constantly demand greater and greater rights.
Do you mean EQUAL rights? What the fuck about the world equal dont you get?

Comparing taking substances that harm your body, and dishonesty towards your lifepartner with a sexual act you do with another consenting adult. Do you seriously not hear how stupid that sounds?

>So there's absolutely no reason to compound the problem by introducing homosexual parenting.
Whatever you could learn from having a father/mother around you could learn from other family members, teachers and friends. What spesificly do you need one mother and one father for?

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>>67953798
That is an agenda by definition. Agenda's aren't inherently bad things. My agenda calls for shitposting and watching football.

>>67953602

>they're less than 1% of your population.
Then say that they're going to ruin society if they get equal rights... because then the remaining 99% cant control themselves.

>>67953963
Why should they have equal rights? Homosexual relationships are not equally beneficial to society.

>What spesificly do you need one mother and one father for?
Every child deserves to have a loving mother and father. It's incredible that you would place more value on the "rights" of homosexuals than children.

We're 600 years too late to do that.

>tfw no Iberian-Tlemcen union to push Moroccans back into the desert, form a strong alliance with north african sunni berbers and eventually spread western ideals to them

If only England and France hadn't dragged us into such a dumb war.

they need to figure it out themselves

>>67953963
>>67954061
gay shit equals degeneracy being pushed in your society.
degeneracy equals broken families.
broken families means the collapse of your civilization.

>>67954079

Well, they could have two loving fathers, or two loving mothers. Why would you spesificly need one of each for?

>>67948803
Unironically, we let Iran win.

>>67954210
The God of our ancestors said so.

>>67954210
Because fathers and mothers are different and have different qualities. Children need both. It's even how nature intended it.

Having two fathers or two mothers deprives the child the ability to have a parental relationship with both genders. So the child misses out on something that other children don't.

You can't the West will do everything within it's power to keep Arabs that's just how things work unless there's a major change in the world the West will just keep things the way they are for it's own benefit

>>67949938
The only reason we have a terrorism problem is "some" western countries see PKK as """"freedom fighters"""".Apart from that we are ok about terrorism.

>>67949667
the arab spring was a facade

>>67954330

Which qualities? And why cant they get this from other people than their parents? Why do children need both? They miss out on the experience of having two parents from different genders, but how is it a negative thing?

And this time can you please answer specifically isted of just repeating "oh its just bad"?

>>67954202

So 1% of the population have the power to corrupt 99% of it? The strong nuclear 99% that society so need cant handle it?

>>67954558
>being deliberately obtuse
The differences between men and women are innate. Missing out on a parental relationship with a member of one of the sexes deprives the child of developing these innate qualities. It's like saying you can survive eating only carbs, you don't need protein. Except the aim shouldn't be survival, it should be to give kids the best upbringing possible. That means the variety of a mother and a father.

>>67954711
shut up faggot lover, go choke on a fucking nigger dick if you love degeneracy so much.

look up how european is breaking apart and ask if non whites see the moral decay of eurocucks and think: wow, maybe we should become more like europeans, more gay shit, drugs, atheism, women being sluts before marriage, single mothers.

wow, maybe that's something we should emulate.

wow, being gay is amazing, I love sucking nigger dick, they're so big.

fucking faggot lover, kys like y'all other mentally ill faggots.

>>67954769
>Missing out on a parental relationship with a member of one of the sexes deprives the child of developing these innate qualities
Says who? You're making this up.

>It's like saying you can survive eating only carbs, you don't need protein
No, it's not like saying that, this analogy is erroneous because it does not equate the situation we're talking about.

>>67954769

That logic would make sense if only a father knew about carbs, and only a mother knew about proteins - but both these things can be learned from other people.

I was raised by a single mother. Do you think I will be a worse father to my children; than a person who were raised by both a farther and a mother?

>>67954919
Loving faggots or nigger dicks has nothing to do with it. Loving equality for all members of one's society is what this is about. It's what seperates us from muslims, hence our disliking them coming here. Your statement about gays ruining a society is in question here, and you can't come up with an answer on how exactly homosexuals will destroy a society.

>>67955180
yes, because you're a faggot lover.
you already failed.

>>67955259
is not about homosexuals, is about the current push for degeneracy, they're simply a part of it.

look, I'm a conservative and a traditionalist, take that as you want.

>>67948803
>i want new members in cuck club

>>67955013
>>67955180
>>67955259
Every explanation has been given already about how homosexuals corrupt nuclear families and how that destroys communities and societies. Children need both mothers and fathers. It's how nature intended it and every study shows that's the best environment for children to be raised it.

You keep ignoring everything being said.

>>67955349
I can agree that the west don't need to insist that other parts of the world share our values about equality. After all, this is the problem we're having here as well: muslims pushing their values onto our socitety.

>>67954919

Feels great man. Thanks for playing.

>>67952539
They're also polluting your gene pool because 50 % of caribbean black males in the UK have white partners
nothing like the good ol Ukuck

>>67955259
>>67955457
>doesn't like Muslims pushing their values on society but is ok with homosexuals doing it
wew

>>67955457
because your current values are fucking garbage sempai.

>>67955427
>Every explanation has been given already about how homosexuals corrupt nuclear families and how that destroys communities and societies.
No, I don't think it has. Where is the explaination?
>Children need both mothers and fathers.
Err, you have to back this claim up with something, lest I repeat what I said in the last message: says who?

>every study shows
No.

>>67955427

Are you more of a sexual deviant because homosexuals have equal rights? No? Then how is it true for everyone else? How does homosexuality affect you at all?

You can say: it corrupts society as much as you want. But you are a part of society; and I'll ask you again - have you become a pervert because of it? Are you not going to find a woman and raise kids with her?

>>67955552
Homosexuals, at least here in Norway, do not push their values on us. What would that look like anyway? Like, them pushing us to stop having sex with women, and instead embrace the love of other men?

They don't even push a right for equality anymore, because they already have it. They don't really have any big movements or anything, they live happy lives just as everyone else. They are not a problem to anyone here.

Muslims on the other hand....

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>>67955570

Yeah man, it really sucks to be us.

>>67955646
>Where is the explaination?
Sexual liberation:

STDs
Single Parenthood
Divorce
Teenage pregnancy
Abortion
Pornification of society

Which leads to breakdown of the nuclear family. Which leads to breakdown of communities.

>you have to back this claim up with something, lest I repeat what I said in the last message: says who?
Male and female nature is innate and child development requires interaction with both genders to access this male and female nature. Children deserve to have mothers and fathers more than homosexuals deserve to have children.

>>67955810
Cultural attitudes change as subcultures demand recognition. Homosexuality changes mainstream culture.


>inb4 you ignore everything I've said fr the 3rd time and ask me for explanations all over again.

>>67955552

Only self repressed faggots think this.

>>67955810
>>67955891
>>67955938
look faggot lover, if you love inmigration, that your women sleep with twenty niggers before you marriage her, if you want to raise tyrone and ahmed children, that's your problem.

stop pushing gay shit here.

>>67956038

>latino triggered by HDI posting

>>67955938
>Norway's oil money means their culture is good
Enjoy moral decay friend.

>>67948803
Leave us alone and let that culture grow organically over there? You can't just push another culture onto a group of people who haven't developed it themselves yet. In the meantime we need Islam in order to take over countries in the West. Just Britain and France desu since they are the biggest cucks to the jews. Everyone is alright. I feel bad for Sweden and Germany though since they did nothing wrong.

>>67955987
>STDs
Transmitted by sex, not by homosexuality
>Single Parenthood
How is this affecting the society in any bad way? I know people who grew up with single parents, and they are fine. Nothing bad happens around them that will ruin the society.
>Divorce
This is only a problem to someone who thinks morality is objective.
>Teenage pregnancy
A bigger problem is in fact that couples wait too long to have children
>Abortion
This is only a problem to someone who thinks morality is objective.
>Pornification of society
Porno is not here because of homosexuals.

>>67956109
my city has a HDI similar to hong kong, and medellin has a HDI similar to norway, fucking retard.

we have some nice areas, but most of the country is like africa.

>>67956280
>my society isn't morally breaking apart
>gays are not part of the moral decay of western nations

>>67955987
>and child development requires interaction with both genders to access this male and female nature.
Says who?

>>67948803
I've thought about this.

Nationalistic fascism and frequent death of religious leaders, the whole thing being controlled by some secret Illuminati-like organisation in order to steer it in the right path.

You do need people to be willing to vote for non-fundamentalist, decent governments before you push democracy on them.

>>67956525
God.

>inb4 I don't believe in Jesus

>>67956404
>>my society isn't morally breaking apart
Homosexuality may be immoral, but this belongs to an irrational morality lession which has no value. If homosexuality does not hurt the society, then it doesn't matter if it's deemed immoral. Morality is not objective, and if you discover that something which is deemed immoral is in fact harmless, then you should feel free to deviate from said morality lession.

>>67955987

All of this would have happened regardless of homosexuality. The only reason why you credit homosexuality with the sexual liberation is because you view it as something perverted and unnatural.

Also, all these things happened before the sexual liberation aswell. The nuclear family formula broke down because people were educated, and realized they could achieve their goals and ambitions. People just dont want to have 4 kids before they're 30 anymore.

I am not going to speak about the rest of mena, but in wb growing secularism is connected to a few factors 1) stable albeit shitty economy 2) growing educated youth 3) relatively peaceful times.

However, that secularism is going to be always limited and threatened by authority of old people, and regression resulting from conflict and poverty. The only possible way for us to become reasonably secular within a decade is if Israel announced tomorrow that it will annex WB. Why would that help? Easy, switching the political authority with a strong secular one that is able to force the rules is going to make more people feel more free to practice things that they wouldn't have done under the current regime. That being said, it also can backfires if Israel mishandle this transition by being aggressive towards the populatin

>>67956724
morality is objective, even animals have morality fucking dumbass.

read what is morality in reality.

kys faggot lover.

>>67956724
I'm telling you:
I have a good reason to hate gay shit.
look at history, everytime gays appear, a civilization has collapsed.

same with feminism.
learn history.

>>67956824
Would you even want Israel to annex Palestine?

It would be the end of Israel since you would outnumber them so it would never happen.

>this Norwegian flag who refuses to listen to a single argument presented to him and continues screaming egalitarian propaganda
terrible

>>67957053
he's a faggot.

>>67956685
>>67956899
Where did God get his morals from?

Have you heard of Plato's euthyphro dilemma? Is what is morally good commanded by god because it's morally good, or is it morally good because it's commanded by god? If it's the former, then morality has a different origin than god himself, and would exist even without a god. If it's the latter and it does directly depend on god, then it must mean that what is morally good is morally good only because god say so (this is known as the "divine command theory"). It necessarily means that god might as well be saying that rape and arbitrary infanticide is morally good, and then it would as such have to be so.

>>67957194
God is nature itself newfaggot.

being gay has no reproductive value, is like a mental illness.

>>67957017
>It would be the end of Israel since you would outnumber them so it would never happen.

I have no idea why people still buying this meme. Israel is going to annex the WB sometime in 2020s, settlers will be ~40% of the population then with their birth rates almost twice as WBers already, and with our negative net migration and their growing population and migrants, they will remain a large majority with ease, it's what's really going on right now.

>>67957053
Your argumens are lacking tho. I mean, your own argument was empty because you did not point to any real studies which are telling me that your claim is true. I already know that there are no scientific consensus which concludes the same as you did, but it would be fun to see what you managed to hurl up from google.

>>67957303
What about the right of return for all the Palestinians in Jordan/Lebanon? Also, you guys breed a lot too so I'm not so sure that Jews would outnumber.

Anyway, would you even like to live in Israel? Or would you prefer a Palestinian state made of West Bank and Gaza?

>>67957053

Be honest; it bothers you a little that this colombian guy agrees with everything you say.

>>67957541
Why would that bother me?

>>67957622

>newfaggot
>God
>kys faggot lover
>your women sleep with twenty niggers
>go choke on a fucking nigger dick

>>67957431
>What about the right of return for all the Palestinians in Jordan/Lebanon?
Most of our negotiation offers were about resettlement and reparations, and a small symbolic number of old people returning and that's the official policy of PA during the last deal that was about to happen under Olmert.

> Also, you guys breed a lot too so I'm not so sure that Jews would outnumber.
Are you sure about that? Our fertility rate in WB was 2.8 a few years ago and it is following a rapidly declining trend. Jewish fertility rate was +5 in the same year and following a growing trend.

>Anyway, would you even like to live in Israel?
>imblying we don't already

Traffic police outside of our cities are all Israeli, our groceries are done in Israeli shopping malls, and our youth work in Israel by tens of thousands, we have the same currency, same laws, same taxes and every single Palestinian town has a settlement next to it. It's only paper work matter now tbqh.

>Or would you prefer a Palestinian state made of West Bank and Gaza?
Naturally yes, but I am not optimistic about the nature of its culture whether it will be more secular than now or not, and I estimate it will be not.

>>67948803
Muslim here.

Get rid of Saudi Arabia, and Iraq.

Problem solved.

airdrop some manga

>>67958010
And Islam.

>>67958010
>Iraq
You mean Iran?

>>67958149
If it wasn't for the other ME countries, Iran would be doing just fine.

It's Islam's fault that Iran is the shit hole it is today.

I love how SJWs pretend gay is a race.

>>67957835
>he doesn't think God is a good argument

>>67958205
I never insulted Iran. I'm talking about whether you meant to say Iran rather than Iraq?

>>67958272
Oh.

Yeah, it's Iraq.

Fuck Iraq and everyone from there.

>>67958295
What? How is Iraq responsible for anything? The two biggest players in Islam are Sunni Saudia Arabia and Shia Iran.

Iraq is just an outpost of Iran.

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>>67948803
>bring back the Osman family members from Europe
>make the Turkish Grand National Assembly pass the Caliphate powers(which it technically is) unto a highly cultured Turkish scholar(like Ortaylı)
>turn Turkey into a constitutional monarchy with highly autonomous regions and a meclis to control the foreign policy with the Ottoman sultan khan overseeing
>restore the Devlet-i Aliyye-i Osmâniyye by conquest
>enforce secularism, democracy, human rights, the rule of law, science and respect for personal freedoms by soft and hard power on the whole region
>don't forget to execute the s*udi family members in Istanbul, again

>>67958513
>Want democracy and secularism

>Support a caliphate


hmmm. That's totally impossible, ottoman weren't a democracy or secular like any caliphate by definition.

>>67958612
democracy with autonomous republics, caliph to dictate(but not enforce) islamic way of life to individuals
ottoman empire after tanzimat reforms was pseudo-secular and operated somewhat similar to the way i described it, albeit more centralized

>>67958612
ottomans called wahabbism heresy.

>>67958714
Well ottoman failed modernization, failed science, industrialization etc. That's why they collapsed, you probably know that.

Why would they success today in what they failed in a century of attempt?

At least oil give gulf life condition far superior to Turkey, I don't see them accept an empire that lower their income.

>>67958513
>bring back the Osman family
>most cucked dynasty of the today
NO NO NO
>>67958612
t. never read about Ottoman history

>>67958850
>Well ottoman failed modernization, failed science, industrialization etc.

why were they a world power then?

ottomans did everything they could with their populace.

>>67954919
Kek you know extreme homophobia has shown to be more common with repressed homos right? Maybe you should just suck a dick Pablo, get it out of your system

>>67959083
they were a world power before the renaissance
failed everything after that, especially the industrial revolution
theres a reason they wuz called sick man of europe

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>>67958850
>Well ottoman failed modernization
i wouldn't say so, the republic of turkey was formed by the secular ottoman military class that was educated by the reformed ottoman systems. the ottoman meclis wasn't great but it contained a lot of different political ideologies as well, not to mention the industrialization efforts that had started to gain speed
late yes, but not a failure

if the empire could hold on for a few more decades there would have been major reforms, but the 1900-1925 period basically devastated the empires elite and systems with continuous warfare

>At least oil give gulf life condition far superior to Turkey
life conditions do not always mean everything, life in western turkey is very modernized already and some systems (like hospitals, schools, military education) are very sought after by many rich middle-eastern families. a lot of north-african/levantine rich families send their children to get education in turkey for example

we need to fix this shithole first before we try to fix the arabs though. turkish people have become weak and major change seems to be on way after the economic crisis hits

>>67956941
Romand were fucking men since before the empire kek. They used to call Caesar the queen of bithynia because of his affair with the king there. Same goes for the greeks. Face it man, western civilization was built by fags.

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>>67948803
You forgot to include Turkey, Afghanistan, and Pakistan

>>67948878
>it has never worked before
>australia, canada, new zealand and the us don't exist

>>67948803
What makes you think they want any of that?

It's the european mans burden all over again, the colonial powers built modern africa, and the (((resources))) that was extracted was minimal compared to the costs of maintaining and building entire countries with little to no production, the less we fiddle around in shitholes the better we will have it, fuck everything else.

build a wall around europe and USA and we'll leave this planet while the other plebians gets eaten by escalators and diseases, there's no reason to cooperate when your potential teammates are vegetables

>>67959729
states where the population was replaced

>>67948803
while in the 50-60-70s there was a genuine desire to become westernized among arabs, when they say what "modern society" (aka leftist liberalism) did on westerns: beta faggots, homosexuals, feminists, end of family, no culture, no spirituality, just materialis consumers; they prefer to turn back to islam

>>67958234

You dont govern people based on something you need faith to believe in; and metaphysics to explain.

>>67952450
Wtf m8 what is with your obsession with "family values"? Are you some grumpy old grandpa that's jelly of the kids having more fun than you when you were one?