Why are they so different to the western world especially the

>>67671076

I don't want to be western.

Also we're fucked just because western wannabes.

quality thread

>>67671076
I've always thought of my country as being a western country.
I think there should be a third perspective.
Perhaps African World?
Brazil is a lot like african countries.

>>67671232
fuck no, just call us latin or whatever

>>67671267
how about sudaca?

I have always thought that we are considered Western only for being Christian majority.

Anyways, we should unite but not including Brazil, the only thing we share is the continent.

Why wouldn't they be western?

>>67671076
>Why are they so different to the western world especially the other colonised countries?
Haiti isn't very different to Africa.

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>>67671232
Brazil is an African country.

>>67671382
They aren't western.

>>67671382
dictators, corruption, low quality of life, crime, not white etc
I see them (through american media) as more like subsaharan africa, they are christian nations but do not have the same ideals as us

>>67671391
Pretty different actually.

>>67671076
>christian
>believe in progress by reason and work
>scientific knowledge is the accepted official explanation in most(all) fields
>self hating af
>influenced mostly by european art
We are western, we're just shit at it.

>>67671076
Because Western is pretty much synonymous with white.

>>67671619
>Update
Not really.

>>67671658
Explain america then

>>67671662
Haiti is a derivative of French and African culture. Haitian creole is a French creole with mostly french words but a very different grammer.

im a weeb so im east asian

>>67671725
It's western for now.

>>67671728
Haiti shares everything more in common with a typical African country than with France, now BTFO!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ua-mqmUQBkY

What is western exactly?
nd who cares anyway?

They are western.. 90% of their culture is European including their languages.

In the future....south america will be paradise!

>>67672035
KEK, no.

>>67671076
>implying south america is western
FTFYFE

>>67671076
i think you're confusing 'western' with 'anglo'

>>67671596
everything except "not white" can be found in Europe too, and even that is beginning to change

>>67672148
>20
KEK no, indio negro culture isn't found in spain or any white country.

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>>67671076

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Daily reminder that this is a bait thread because people think we will get mad at other people not calling us western for some reason.

The truth is we aren't western by the popular idea of what "western" means, but a lot of the countries in the area are pretty much more European (not talking about race or economics here) than anything else.

But yeah, all things considered we aren't obviously western if we use the popular definition of it.

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>>67672172
>no negro country can be found in any """"""white"""""" country
explain pic then

>>67672225
You are Indio, not western.

>>67671658
Shut up Lee.

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>>67672289
Pic related is me. I'm a Nordic European you like it or no.

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I've always thought of Argentina as a latino country, and I've always thought of latino culture as a culture and society of its own separate from western and eastern and etc.

Maybe it's just Argentina but I'm happy that we are not western nor white nor like Europe or USA, and that we are juste simple and happy latinos.

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>>67672429
Why are Argentinians so racist??

>>67672124
>founded by europeans
>european religion
>european language
>european heritage
I don't see how this can be argued

Spain & Portugal are the lazy scum of Europe, this is hat happens when they procreate.

>>67671076
NO!

And fuck off! Go back to sniff petrol, Steve.

>>67672562
honorary white

>>67672732
putin said that not him lol

>>67672754
pootin admire messi and tries to act like him.

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>>67671076

Is South America even "Western Civilization"? I'd say its heavily influenced by the west, but I can't really see it being part of the west.

If you can consider places like Albania western, SA could be considered I guess. No one down here really gives a shit tbqh.

>>67672225
I don't care much for "popular" definitions tbqh

>>67671076
There's some differences which do come from us also being heirs to non Western civilizations, nevermind havinf developed our own societies in different circumstances for some centuries. We are Western peoples tho see >>67671634

>>67671658
Russia

>>67672912
>heavily influenced by the west
said no one ever
maybe in brazil you are influenced by the west and europe
but I was bred, born and raised in buenos aires argentina and believe me, european and general western culture is nothing like ours at all, they don't look like us, they don't speak like us and they don't even think the same way we do think and perceive life.
and don't use religion and language as an excuse because by those standards half of africa is western and that's clearly not it.

fuck westerns anyways.

South America is it's own thing, but I see them as fairly friendly towards to the West.

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>>67671596
>Dictators
Reminder that 3 Latin countries have better democracies than France.

>>67673146
>argentina
>not western
lol

>>67673174
Wow, it's really sinking in how much of a shithole France has become.

>>67673210
we are closer to african culture than to western culture, leaving memes aside and bad jokes,
so 2/10 your petty banter, at least you made me reply.

its probably as western as japan

inb4 muh religion, muh language, muh architecture

>>67673249
>leaving memes aside
>entire post is full of memes

>>67673262
違う

>>67673290
fuck off

>>67671076
we have personality

>>67673304
違う

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>>67673146
>said no one ever

Except that it is. I still don't consider it western. No need to tie your panties in a knot.

I enjoy comfy isolated South America, and if possible would like to remove as much as western, african, and indian influence as much as possible.

Brazil is Africa outside Africa

>>67673264
i haven't posted a single meme, just facts.

>>67671214
There's a lot of fucked places that aren't western wannabe and are culturally homogenous with nome of latin america's history. Just saying all of your problems are caused because you think there's a propensity towards wanting to be western is too simple.

>>67673262
You are right. Nothing of that (religion, language, architecture) really matters in classifying a culture as western.

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>>67671076
South America is distinct from the West.

>>67673331
good, it enrages me when someone toys around with the idea of Latin America being western, I mean, I don't even care about latin america but I don't like my argentina being included on the shit western list by extension.

we are latinos esse

>>67673338

enfermo mental no te cansas nunca de repetir las mismas pelotudeces todo el dia

>>67673462
cálmate

>>67673462
Sera Boliviano?

shitlekistan is not western

>>67671862
It has a lot of differences though if you bother to learn about cultures in Africa.

I don't want to be western

god knows nothing good ever comes of being allied with europe or the US

>>67673395
Many places can be considered western but it isn't because of some x people can't be western or "western can't be poor". What makes a culture to not western.

I'd say they're like SEA countries.

>colonialized by the west
>has unique culture
>has nice food
>mostly a corrupt and lawless shithole where human life is not valuable, comparatively at least
>cheap
>you don't give a fuck about anything if you're rich enough


The only major difference I'd say would be sudacas don't value whiteys as much as SEAmonkeys do, most likely due to having whiteys themselves here and there because of all the imperialist dicc they received.

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>>67673667
>turkey calling other countries corrupt, lawless shitholes where human life is not valuable

wew lad

>>67673734
Where I'm from doesn't change the accuracy of what I say, you monkey.

>>67673404
Huntington was a hack

"Latin American. Includes Central America, South America (excluding Guyana, Suriname and French Guiana), Cuba, the Dominican Republic, and Mexico. May be considered a part of Western civilization. Many people of the Southern Cone and Mexico regard themselves as full members of the Western civilization."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clash_of_Civilizations

Basically this is just a rationalization of exclusively American views on civilizational boundaries matching their prejudices and geopolitical aspirations.

Western means descended from Greco-Roman culture which LATIN America certainly is, this means Western philosophy, the fine arts, science and history.

>>67673667
same can be said about Roachland though

>>67673817
>Many people of the Southern Cone
we don't
we don't even considers ourselves western or any of that shit

speak for yourself mexicano sucio.

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>>67673817
>Western philosophy, the fine arts, science and history.

UHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEEHEUHEEUHEUHEUHEHEUHEEUUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEEHEUHEEUHEUHEUHEHEUHEEUUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEEHEUHEEUHEUHEUHEHEUHEEUUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEEHEUHEEUHEUHEUHEHEUHEEUUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEEHEUHEEUHEUHEUHEHEUHEEUUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEUHEEHEUHEEUHEUHEUHEHEUHEEUUHEUHEUHEUHE

>being a cuck
i aint none of that western shit im a nigga

>>67673774
It does though

you cannot have a proper idea of what human rights or government transparency is because your country must be one of the shittiest ones in the planet regarding these things

>>67673817
we do not

remember to hide bait threads
sage btw

>>67673667
You have got a point. SEA and LAT are very similar. SEA countries are way more diverse in the sence that some of their countries are first worlf tier (Singapur) and others (Myanmar) are wey worst than even the poorest countries in LAT.
LAT is also wey more Europe influenced, even tho it is also strongly influenced by african and amerindian culture.

>>67673887
Yes, and the flag above my post is me. I am, in fact, the entire country of Turkey. My opinions are therefore irrelevant because everyone knows entire countries always have a singular and impervious outlook on matters.

It's funny how this shithole of a board is so obsessed with roleplaying as their flags.

>>67673820
True, I couldn't contest that argument. However the sole reason I did not include Turkey, or Middle East in general is because of how SEA and SA are influenced much more by western colonialist values, rather than eastern and Islamic values.

>>67673977
Yes, that was my biggest point in that post, thank you. The income gap is extremely massive, which makes life not much different in those countries as opposed to western ones if you're rich, but you're shit out of luck if you're poor.

Why despise the idea of being in the western cultural sphere though? If you say it makes you a cuck then it's in the same way egyptians are cucks for being muslims and considering themselves arabs. Aka, they're not cucks except for a super meme sense.

I don't understand why it's so crazy to think that latin america is more western influenced than not.

>>67673555
chilestine

>>67673817
>this means Western philosophy, the fine arts, science and history.

Issue is when Western science isn't called western fine arts, science and history. It's just called science, history etc. Western is the default.

>>67674068
Because the image of the group clashes with the definition.

Also it's super inclusive. Everyone adheres to "western" science because it's just called science. Just like how traditional medicine that works is just call medicine.

>>67674302
Every country in the world went under a process of "westernization", yes. Japan and China are westernized governments, technology, and with westernized lifestyles, same with pretty much everywhere. However, that doesn't mean they're culturally western. Latin America has enough actual cultural overlap with the west that they can claim that.

>>67671076
Mestizo maligno is why

"Western" is a buzzword at this point. The Cold War and Anglo bullshit has made the concept useless.

In the historical cultural meaning Latin America would classify as western since its language, religion and instiutions are based on western european ones, not to mention that racially the continent has the highest %of yuro blood outside of Europe and the Anglo colonies. There are some countries with substantial indigenous influence like Bolivia or Guatemala though, and it's hard to see them as western.

Even then, it would probably be best to qualify the region as a sub group within the Western World because it does share some traits that differentiate it from the rest, while not having enough differences to warrant its own "group" or "culture".

However, the modern meaning of "western" means being rich and politically aligned to the US, that's why some people claim Japan or Korea are western when they are as eastern as it gets.

>>67673850
that was a quote from the book

>>67674578
exactly, I think there's some confusion as to what's actually meant by "western" itt

>>67674644
Going by the historical a lot of nations in Asia and Africa woudl fall under Western or "pretty much" western

>>67674699
Nothing wrong with that but there'd be a dissonance n some people.

>>67674699

Globalization has made things very confusing.

What would be your definition of western?

>>67674233
It's generally implied as the term fine arts is specific and there's no such thing as non-Western science. Arguably your point stands for philosophy although history, as in it's critical view rather than just record, could go either way.

Yes, everyone who has adopted these has become "Westernized" but there'a a difference in between these elements being a part of ancestral culture, as it is in Latin America where the overwhelming majority of the population does hold some degree of European ancestry, and these having become widely adopted as in the case of Japan.

>>67671076
they are different because of years of druglord dominance, internal conflict and international political/military interventions leading to an unstable and underdeveloped region

>>67674578
This is why some people don´t think that much of Russia as a western country, even though their culture is literally derived from european culture. Just because they are not aligned with the US at this point in time.

>>67674724
honestly I got nothing because whatever I came up with collapsed under any type of scrutiny or analyse.

>>67672429
wut? a soccer player could string so many fancy words together? or is it a meme?

>>67674699
Not at all. You've been complaining the definition of western is too inclusive but that's only your meme definition anyway

>>67674578
Nah, Guatemala is pretty much a Western nation, even indigenous culture today for non Spanish speakers is strongly influenced in not just religion but agricultural tecniques, animal husbandry, textiles, etc. The default mainstream culture of Guatemala isn't any more Amerindian than that of most South American nations. Bolivia and Peru could conceivably be different but I have so far not seen any evidence that would lead me to think so.

western civilization = western europe
spain and portugal aren't western europe
their colonies aren't western civilization
the end

We have western influence, just not go full western. But yes, in the strict way we are.

Amerindian culture is dying out in the region with the exception of some countries maybe. But, the reggaeton is to strong to die.

>>67674839

I agree, at this point it is very hard since European culture as become the standard worldwide.

What I would say to argue that Latin America is western while Africa and Asia aren't is that while Africa and Asia ADOPTED western ideas and customs, Latin America had them from the start. You could say something about the Aztecs and Incans but the Spanish brutally replaced their culture, and it was 500 years ago anyway, there is little of them at this point.

Not to mention that if you take race into account, Latin America is the only region in the world outside of Europe and the Anglo colonies where you will find substantial european population, pure and mixed.

>>67674885
>fu
Latin America is as western as Africa, you aren't Europeans thus not western.

>>67674699
No, Islam is traditionally the Eastern other, MENA was arguably once part of Westerndom (under the Roman empire) and arguably even Persia was a part of the same larger cultural complex as the Greeks but Muslim conquest changed things. Just look at Islamic attitudes today regarding philosophy, which while arguably influenced by the Greeks does not contemplate the advancements of the resnaissance, enlightenment and modernism, it does not share in the Western canon and has arguably contributed to it no more than the Far East.

As for Africa colonization was a rather different phenomenon there, leaving aside there was never such a widespread mixing of peoples Africans themselves do not view European culture as part of their own heritage eg despite the widespread use of Portuguese and French in the continent I've never heard of such a thing as a Latin Africa. There might be exceptions and some African peoples might substantially change their views on the issue but the point remains today Africans, even when they have adopted Christian religion and a European language, do not see Western culture as their own but as something foreign.

>>67675070
then you are not western by that statement, dumb unitedstatian

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>>67674885
Western civilization means the Roman empire you get, Spain and Portugal were a part of it unlike Scandinavian or Baltics.

>>67674876

Bolivia is making some amerindian revival shit. If there's a country in Latin America that isn't western it's Bolivia and even then they still speak spanish, are catholic and have an important white minority.

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>>67674885
>spain and portugal aren't western europe

>>67671728
But they're niggers

>>67675160
yeah this all pretty much sums up how I think about it.

western culture as we know of it only came into existence after islam. I'd almost call it two "halves" of roman civilization, the "old" and the "new", old being those traditionally civilized places like egypt, persia, mesopotamia, and new being europe. Europe became a thing of its own and became connected with christanity and developed into what we call "the west" now, and brought the americas under that cultural sphere through colonization.
Islamic civilization developed and became intertwined with non-europe rome (those "old" places) and I'd argue was rome's true spiritual successor up until the renaissance, when europe (the west) took that title and became culturally/scientifically the most relevant and dominant in the world. And thus we arrive to today. Who's gonna be the successor to the west? Fuck, perhaps latin america could take that title, who knows.

>>67671634
Over my dead rotting body!

We're not. Borrowing from the west doesn't make you western. Look at Asians, for example

>>67672680
N-NOT WHITE!!!

Here I go explaining the obvious: "West and East" is still about The Great Schism.

Western: Romance language, Catholic, former WRE.
Eastern: Greek or Slavic, Orthodox, former ERE.

By extension, you can claim former colonies of Western countries are Western too, and former colonies as Eastern countries (like Siberia) are Eastern too.

It has nothing to do with "life quality" or "economy". And specially not with race, since race doesn't always go alongside culture.

Countries like Brazil are definitely Western. Bolivia is not because its culture is predominately Indian.

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>>67675218
The carnivals are festivities that were originated in ancient Rome.

>>67675547
>trying to clear-cut
It doesn't work that way. Even on Bolivia, where 75% of the population speak Spanish and 40% speak native languages.

inb4 bilingualism.

>>67675218
>oh meus deus
*mi - vocative.

>>67675600
Wew. I did not know Bolivia was that far away from the 100% of spanish speakers.

>>67675659
Does deus have a vocative form?

>>67675687
"Dee" or "deus". I think the later is more correct for the timeframe.

>>67675423

The tricky circumstance here is that unlike Asia, South American countries were founded by Europeans.

>>67675665
I think the terrain bringing relative isolation helps keeping some small Amerindian villages alone, and they end not knowing Spanish.

>>67675412
I agree, although I wouldn't see the Islamic world as heir to Rome but rather hellenized Asia and even then not Byzantine Anatolia, Islam came long before the Turks took Constantinople and had already developed it's distinct non Western identity. Islam killed the Middle East in terms of culture, it's "golden age" was basically just an appropiation of the advancements of other peoples (Persians, Nestorian Christians, Hebrews, Hindus) and this only lasted while those peoples were not fully asimilated and had not had their creative impulses beaten out of them in the rote repetition of the Quran. The Arabs, and later the Turks, eventually lost their vitality to theocracy.

Personal views aside I think we both agree they're the Eastern "other" that defined the West.

>>67675224
I think we both agree revival hardly means a separate civilizational identity, Evo did embrace Venezuela's "bolivarian" world view, which is esentially Latin.

>>67675717
The African countries were founded by europeans too. The diference is that those failed. Say what you will about Latin America, but our countries are not failed states where human groups are divided by frontiers that where not stablished by themself but by european colonizers.

>>67675832
>Say what you will about Latin America, but our countries are not failed states
Actually... we are.

>where human groups are divided by frontiers that where not stablished by themself but by european colonizers.
Actually... check the Amerindian populations, none coincide with the country borders.

The _difference_ is that the European colonizers managed to impose their culture here as the primary cultures, unlike in Africa where most folks still follow their native cultures.

(One can argue Liberia is Western.)

>>67675896

Speak for yourself Joao.

>>67675832
I don't see how our nation states succeeding or not has anything to do with our civilizational identity, we are Latins because of our heritage not the uninformed opinions of Americans.

>>67675896
In all fairness we are very much what an heir to the Aztec empire should look like, our southernmost point, Soconusco, coincides with the southward limit of Aztec influence as roughly would be the case in the north east where the Huastecs did extend into modern day Tamaulipas. To the North East our country extends through the area of Uto Aztec peoples like the Yaqui and the Rarámuri, which being the dominant cultures in the sea of Cortés area makes our posession of the gulf of California a natural extension.

>>67673404
>japanese

>>67675896
Well I meant that in Africa most people are native of Africa, and belong to african groups. This means that the states in Africa are not build to acomodate this groups but served instead the porpouses of distribute the land between the european nations.

In the other hand natives groups in Latinamerica are a minority and are mainly encloused in their enterity withing the states.

As for if latin american states are failed states the same why as african's, I would say no. Latin american institutions might not be eficient or even adecuate, but at least they work. Institutions in african goverments, in general, do not fuction nor they fulfill their tasks.

>>67675934
I assume you're crying because of the first affirmation, right?

No Latin American government is able to provide the population under its control what it should provide regarding life quality, basic services, security and stuff like that. Our States are as failed as the Cold War states - in some aspects more, in some less.

Of course: if it helps you to sleep better at night, you can simply pretend the above is not true and repeat "muh cunt-tree is wunderfull" like a mantra.

>>67676172
But his country is doing pretty well friend, not everyone has it as bad as Brazil

>>67676152
>Latin american institutions might not be eficient or even adecuate, but at least they work

They are so corrupt and inefficient if they even work at all.

>>67676264
meh, it's enough to beat the Americans, haven't you heard Trump's speeches?

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>>67676147
No offence, but Mexico coincides more with the native populations of inca doves than the human ones.

Also, check this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Languages_of_Mexico#Language_Tables

The three main Amerindian languages aren't even closely related, they're from three completely different families (Aztecan, Maya and Manguean). I wouldn't be surprised if those peoples considered themselves as different as Spaniards and Russians do so.

>>67676307
Pretty much every latin sees Trump and thinks:
>Hey, that guy remembers me of my corrupt politicians.

>>67676240
I'd go as far and say the only country on the Americas going OK is Canada.

inb4 French Guiana is a shithole.

>>67676264
Ironically, this is a quite Roman legacy.

>>67675218
what's the orange ball flag in the last panel?

>>67676330
The Aztecs were an empire, it means hey ruled over different nationsand all three of those language groups were a part of larger Mesoamerican tradition, they all influenced each other and shared common traditions eg Mayan Kukulcan and Aztec Quetzalcoatl, as I mentioned modern Mexico coincides roughly with Aztec influence, where it didn't we lost the territory, this was the case in the South with the bulk of the Mayan heartland under the Capitania de Guatemala and in the north where the US did not take lands with what they considered too strong a Mexican pressence. Do keep in mind Nahuas did go along with the conquistadoires and expanded their own influence. Arguably the exception are the two peninsulas but since geographically they're natural extensions of the mainland they came under our posession.

>>67676457
I'll give you a hint: look at the bottom left panel.

>>67676457
Anglo Saxons, some of the evil Germanics

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>>67676172

You sound like a person that loves to hear himself speak. So whatever floats your boat Joao.

>>67676457
Probably some Ancient Saxon flag.

>>67676592
He's right though unfortunately

they're western culturally but politically they're their own thing, they aren't part of the anglo/western euro bloc

>>67676674
Pretty much this.

>>67676592
>saxon
I think it's the old Pagan England/Albion one.

>>67676674
Politics are ficle tho, for a time it seemed North America would exist as a politic/economic bloc. That's obviously not the case as of the last American election.

>>67676761
wew look at that number, so close.

>>67676820
who got it then >>67676767

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>>67676674
>politically they're their own thing

Well, I can speak for the rest of Latino America, but my country's corruption is Africa tier, not even kidding. Ironically that corruption is mostly done by europeans.

>>67676842
That post was way funnier than mine. Glad I did not get it. It would be a terrible failget anyway.

>>67676872
>my country's corruption is Africa tier,

That's a pretty disingenuous thing to say because corruption like culture highly varies all over the world as wel las the cause of said corruption.

>>67677173
Well, of course is not the exact same thing, I was just being very vague, I admit. But there is a lot of parallels, like politicians faking their deaths to avoid prison, starting their very important government jobs as a low middle class person and ending their term with a 8 million dollars house, politicians stealing million of dollars that were supposed to go to the victims of natural disasters (like earthquakes), selling weapons to the organized crime, and a lot of other fucked up shit.

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We have the same memes (in its original definition) as the developed contries of the western world. Just because it's disfunctional doesn't mean it's not part of it.

The fact that all of you are posting in this board, speaking in english and discussing the presidential elections of the USA means that we are all part of it. Don't try to be leftist hippies and deny it.

>>67677964
>memes (in the original definition)
I've often wanted to use meme in a non-meme way. It's a good concept that we have no proper word for except that word which we've turned into a meme.

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>>67671267
>>67673817

>brazil
>latino

>>67678077
Is Brasil not Latino?

Who honestly wants to be a cuck? Kek. i'd rather ally with Russia, China.

>>67678418
They're the South American equivalent to post national Canada, no core identity

>>67671076

>especially the other colonised countries

Because all the other colonised countries are anglo.