So who was ACTUALLY in the wrong during the USA v Japan battles

More people would have died on both sides if the bombs weren't used and a land invasion happend.

The Japs raped their way across China and the Pacific. They just plain deserved to get nuked tBh

>>66918260
This. Also, it took 2 bombs to finally get them to surrender, so what makes people think a land invasion would have achieved the same result?

We didnt have to do it but looking at it in the coldest most rational way possible it WAS the way to end the war with the least lives lost.

>>66918260
>The Japs raped their way across China and the Pacific. They just plain deserved to get nuked tBh
yes, their war crimes were way worse than what the germans did

>>66918260
>>66918294
>More people would have died on both sides if the bombs weren't used and a land invasion happend.
It's always funny seeing anglos disregarding the idea that things could have been ended peacefully

Considered that anime was born from the nuclear fallout, I'd say that it was a good idea.

Most Americans agree that Hiroshima was justified, the main controversy lying in whether Nagasaki was excessive.

the fire bombings infamously killed more people

grave of the firefly features them

>>66918324
We are talking about Japan.

The fags who were training school girls to charge American troops with spears.

They wouldn't have surrendered without the total shock and awe factor the Nukes had

>>66918260

Isn't dropping a fucking atomic bomb over a city full of children because of a "What if" scenario a bit much, though?

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>>66918324
>Japs ending anything peacefully

>>66918172
it wasn't "necessary" but it did save lives, the pacific theater would have went on for a long time and a lot of people on both sides would have died. plus we REALLY wanted to test this thing on actual targets.

>>66918388
More children would have died if a land invasion ensued. You have to look at it from a bigger perspective.

It was better to nuke 2 cities than have half of Japan decimated by a long brutal land war

>>66918324
The Japs weren't going to surrender under normal circumstances. If the bombings hadn't happened, Japan as we know it may not even exist today. A land invasion would have only dragged the war on longer than necessary and could have very well meant the extermination of the Japanese people, since they were taught to fight to the very end. Not to mention, the bombs sent the message that you should never fuck with the USA.

>>66918368
they actually were in the process of surrendering because USSR declared war against them and invaded Manchukuo

the number one most important thing to them was that the emperor wouldn't lose his legal rights

americans didn't accept it but demanded a full surrender

after the bomb they gave up the emperor demand

>>66918324
>imperial japan agreeing to end the war peacefully
never would have happened, even if we left them alone china would have stepped in. so either we win, china wins, or japan turns into a little version of the middle east.

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>>66918324
>ended peacefully

You know nothing about WWII and the Pacific Theater.

It was total war

>>66918172
Just because gaijins are racist.

>>66918442
>after the bomb
bombS, plural. we fucking nuked them and they wouldn't give up. japan wanting to keep the emperor in power would be like germany giving up but only if hitler could still rule. its pointless

>>66918368
>>66918444
>>66918443
>>66918441
>They wouldn't have surrendered without the total shock and awe factor the Nukes had
Not really they were still ready to fight, it was when the news went to the emperor that he ordered surrender, to the point of the ministers rebelling against him, the fact is Japanese culture literally endorses suicide in case of failure, and his ministers probably always told the emperor that everything was fine even thought it was, if the Americans could send a diplomat or something to the emperor maybe it could have ended peacefully. But why that when you can show the Soviet Union your might and get all of Japan under your sphere of influence just like Western Europe

>>66918388
Continuing to firebomb Japanese cities and killing millions of people is not more humane than killing 125k-250k people with the two bombs.

>>66918442
>the number one most important thing to them was that the emperor wouldn't lose his legal rights

The number one thing was that they wanted to keep their military.

And considering what they did they were immediately told to go fuck themselves.

>>66918487
I wasn't clear enough that I was talking about Nagasaki

Hiroshima happened before

>>66918488
You really don't know anything about the Japs during WWII, do you?

>>66918488
>could have ended peacefully

NO. The fucking Japs were fanatics. This was the only way. Now stop trying to convince yourself the US is bad for doing this

Nukes were never supposed to play any role in actual warfare vs Japan. They were simply meant to scare off the Soviets who've been destroying the Kwantung army and would've surely done the same thing to Japan they did in Korea had US not shown off its weaponry

>>66918500
no, it actually was emperor's legal rights

remember that they truly did worship the emperor as god

even the most stern militaryheads had utmost worship-like respect for the emperor

>>66918488
>>66918442
>>66918324


Holy fuck, is this what Americans sound like when we talk about the eastern front or WWI?

>>66918388
those children would have been shot if we invaded because they were all taught to fight back if we invaded same with women and the elderly. the pacific war would have lasted years and a lot more people would have died.

>>66918528
>>66918531
yes, I know, especially their respect for the emperor above all, it's you guys that don't know shit about Japanese Culture, or any World Culture. To the point of doing shit all the time due to your arrogance

>>66918560
well no because you never ever talk about the eastern front where 80% of nazi germany's casualties took place

>>66918569
>hue education

>>66918569
Who gives a shit.

They had to be beat, and they were fucking beat.

Burgers wanted unconditional surrender, it wasn't a "Japs were bloodthirsty drones ready to be exterminated!!" issue.

>>66918548
the emperor was a figurehead, even if commoners thought he was god his own people likely didn't. we could have killed him and someone else would have taken over. they wanted to keep their military and we said no. they didn't surrender so we nuked them. they still didn't surrender so we did it again. we had a third waiting but they finally came to their sense.

>>66918596
>They had to be beat, and they were fucking beat.
Yes and the USA is forever stained due to that

>>66918569
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AuPYzWnT1aA

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>>66918612
>the emperor was a figurehead, even if commoners thought he was god his own people likely didn't.

>>66918569
t. high school senior

>>66918615
>implying burgers care what a favela monkey thinks of us
2 nukes weren't enough.

>>66918612
jesus christ you're talking out of your ass

literally all of that is untrue

Holy fuck are you retarded?

The Japs were fanatical and they wouldn't stop for nothing.

Fuck i hate my countrymen in this site.

>>66918654
>implying burgers care what a favela monkey thinks of us
yes keep on going with that foreign policy I am sure the world will simply surrender to you guys

>>66918684
>The Japs were fanatical and they wouldn't stop for nothing.
then why did they stop?

a guy tried a coup by just kidnapping the emperor
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ky%C5%ABj%C5%8D_incident
that's all he would have needed

>>66918710
2 nukes. you know this. you've been here the whole time. at some point the emperor(or someone near him) said thats enough we surrender because they realized we weren't bullshitting about nukes. to be fair i think i read somewhere that we didn't give them enough time between bombs to surrender but i dunno if thats true

>>66918770
>2 nukes. you know this. you've been here the whole time.
Yes, 2 nukes certainly stopped the guys that literally kill themselves in the name of the emperor. And not really because it was for the first time impossible to deny their failure. And for the first time the emperor became really aware of the whole situation and ordered them to stop in the name of the japanese people. And that's the whole point, if you guys knew how the japanese culture works you guys could have avoided bombing them, but for what?

>>66918667

Are you even aware that he was basically kidnapped by the military?

>>66918863
i don't understand what you think should have happened. we should have sent a bunch of troops in or just asked nicely that they stop? or just bomb the shit out of them for a few years?

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>>66918863
Holy shit, you really are retarded, aren't you?

>>66918894
there are other ways to end a war, by diplomacy especially, it's just that you guys thought they were too subhuman for that and your public opinion literally wanted blood

>>66918894
You could have accepted their surrender conditions but you didn't because the plan was to make Japan a vassal state.

>>66918172
>So who was ACTUALLY in the wrong during the USA v Japan battles

They were killing us, so we killed more of them.

>>66918928
diplomacy didn't work though. we tried. they didn't listen so we nuked them. they still didn't listen so we nuked them again. its not fucking civilization you cant just pull up the diplomacy menu and trade sugar for peace.

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>>66918928
It's not that we thought they were subhuman. It's just a fact that they already were.

>>66918880
he himself selected tojo

>The army and the navy recommended the candidacy of Prince Higashikuni, one of the Emperor's uncles. According to the Shōwa "Monologue", written after the war, the Emperor then said that if the war were to begin while a member of the imperial house was prime minister, the imperial house would have to carry the responsibility and he was opposed to this.

>Instead, the Emperor chose the hard-line General Hideki Tōjō

most stories about the emperor's pacifism are exaggerated, his actions counts the most

by the way I'm not against the bombing of hiroshima unlike the brazilian

>>66918863
>japanese culture works

Go ask the Chinese, Koreans and South East Asia about Japanese culture during WWII.

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>>66918770

No, we dropped millions of flyers over Nagasaki and Hiroshima, telling to GTFO or BTFO.

They didn't heed the first warning.

Pic Related: The fact that the US warned them via propaganda flyers is always swept under the rug.

>>66918946
those conditions included having a military and a god-king which wasn't going to happen after the shit they had just pulled.

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there wouldn't even have been a war between them if the US hadn't bullied the japs into attacking in the first place

>>66918977
>diplomacy didn't work though. we tried. they didn't listen so we nuked them.
you guys sent a letter that didn't even reached the emperor m8, and they literally didn't respond to you guys

With the bombings all we got was fucking anime and a dysfunctional society.

>>66919062
>didn't even reached the emperor
show me some proof for this.

>>66919017
>Nagasaki and Hiroshima
you guys didn't even know you were going to bomb those places lol

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If we never dropped the bombs, Belldandy would have never been created.

>>66918946
they had upper hand, why would they accept their conditions?

>>66919028

did we bully japan into invading manchuria or french indo china

>>66918988
>There has never been a cabinet in which the prime minister, and all the ministers, reported so often to the throne. In order to effect the essence of genuine direct imperial rule and to relieve the concerns of the Emperor, the ministers reported to the throne matters within the scope of their responsibilities as per the prime minister's directives ... In times of intense activities, typed drafts were presented to the Emperor with corrections in red. First draft, second draft, final draft and so forth, came as deliberations progressed one after the other and were sanctioned accordingly by the Emperor.

>>66919089
yes we did. we had multiple targets planned. where are you getting your info? weather impacted our choice but we knew more or less where they were going

>>66919104
Truman knew this would happen.

>>66919117
it was none of your business to try and stop them from doing that

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>>66918172
People like to forget that they were warned

>>66919130
exactly so you guys dropped those leaflets on all those cities you were planning? Also do you really think they would believe in an enemy over their leaders m8? especially japan?

>>66919178
it was the best we could do. their leaders lied to them about what was happening. if n.korea nukes someone are we supposed to not retaliate because none of their citizens will believe its true?

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>>66919154

>>66919253
>it was the best we could do. their leaders lied to them about what was happening.
kek also I just read they were dropped after Hiroshima Bomb

>>66918521
oh and the thing about hiroshima at the time is that interestingly the bomb was so efficient that full details about the bombing having taken place took some days to get to their HQ

they only got some shorter version at first which didn't tell much except that hiroshima was lost

>>66919297
where did you read that?

>>66919178
>enemy razing cities across your country warns you they're going to raze your city too
>believe them or your leaders who led them to that action
hmm

>>66919297
You probably read a bad source

>>66919118
>As the war turned against the Japanese, Hirohito personally found the threat of defection of Japanese civilians disturbing because there was a risk that civilians would be surprised by generous U.S. treatment. Native Japanese sympathizers would hand the Americans a powerful propaganda weapon to subvert the "fighting spirit" of Japan in radio broadcasts. At the end of June 1944 during the Battle of Saipan, Hirohito sent out the first imperial order encouraging all Japanese civilians to commit suicide rather than be taken prisoner.

>>66919414
>Poison gas weapons, such as phosgene, were produced by Unit 731 and authorized by specific orders given by Hirohito himself, transmitted by the chief of staff of the army. For example, Hirohito authorised the use of toxic gas 375 times during the battle of Wuhan from August to October 1938.

>>66919141
good foresight that man

>>66919272
why was it your business to prevent the japanese form getting their rightful clay?

>>66919579
>Article 4 prescribed that, "The Emperor is the head of the Empire, combining in Himself the rights of sovereignty, and exercises them, according to the provisions of the present Constitution," while, according to article 6, "The Emperor gives sanction to laws and orders them to be promulgated and executed," and article 11, "The Emperor has the supreme command of the Army and the Navy." The Emperor was thus the leader of the Imperial General Headquarters.

>In 1971, David Bergamini showed how primary sources, such as the "Sugiyama memo" and the diaries of Kido and Konoe, describe in detail the informal meetings Emperor Hirohito had with his chiefs of staff and ministers. Bergamini concluded that the Emperor was kept informed of all main military operations and that he frequently questioned his senior staff and asked for changes.

>We call upon the government of Japan to proclaim now the unconditional surrender of all Japanese armed forces, and to provide proper and adequate assurances of their good faith in such action. The alternative for Japan is prompt and utter destruction.

They chose prompt and utter destruction

>>66918172
Those dicks wouldn't stop Even after Germany an Italy surrendered. EVEN after we dropped the first nuke! The Japs were crazy, honor obbsesed, and deserved it. I'm still pissed that our president apoligized for it. desu 2 wasn't enough.

rape of nanking
they deserved even more nukes lol

Japan was on the wrong side of history in any meaning of the phrase, but the atomic bombings simply weren't necessary and anyone who argues otherwise has an incredibly loose relationship with the facts.

>>66918422

Many atrocities are done "for the Greater Good". There's no denying the fact that the USA government (not its people) acted inhumanly when they did it. They doomed innocent people, they 'pulled the trigger' on them. Dying by accidental fire during the war is completely different from actually intentionally killing innocent people. If the opposite happened (Japan made the bombs and nuked two US cities), the world would have decimated Japan.

>>66918172
Imagine if nyc and wasgington dc were nuked

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>>66920151
I would be so fucking happy

can we nuke LA in this fantasy as well?

>>66918442

Which is why what actually happened is that the US only nuked two japanese cities to scare the russians.

>>66918494

One bad thing doesn't excuse the other.

>>66920102
what was the alternative?
>>66920197
look out guys this guys a bit edgy

>>66920202

Don't even bother coming to this threads.

You honestly expects burgers to be truthful about Hiroshima and Nagasaki when they balantly lie about Vietnam and Iraq?

The nukes were dropped simply for the sole purpose of threatning Russia and to test them. Curtosy of Einstein and a few of his international friends who vouched for the testing of nuclear weapones.

>>66919962
おまえも犯してやろうか?

>>66919017

>"Leave everything you own, everything you earned with your hard work in the name of our countries, or face nuclear melting death and diseases for 50 years!"

Man, the USA were such good guys...

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>>66920315
in what world is it edgy to want to nuke la, washington and ny? half the world problems would be solved

>>66920402
yes, i know. the US is super evil and we're the reason your country is garbage. we do nothing for anyone and the world would all be living in total peace without us

>>66919157

Would you leave your home and your stuff if you opened your mailbox and found a letter saying a bomb would drop where you were? How the fuck would you feed yourself? Where would you go?

Do you really think it's reasonable to drop an atomic bomb on a city just because you told them beforehand you would do it if they didn't obey you?

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>>66920435
>we're the reason your country is garbage
but that's literally true you fucking idiot
>we do nothing for anyone
this is also true

>>66920489
Usa does government things but this has nothing to do with your people.

>>66920435
Is this supposed to be sarcastic?

>>66920559
well i guess if we weren't around you might have a capable military so maybe if we never existed you'd be better off.

>>66920551
>>66920435
>burger doesn't know about all the shit his government did in South America
kek typical

>>66920618
your governments keep letting it happen though, don't they?

>>66920435

Uh, you DO know your country is one of the main reasons why the political landscape is such a mess in most middle and south american countries, right?

>>66920615
We're talking about US interference in SA. What are you on about m8y?

>>66920660
we gotta get shit done, f am. once we legalize a few more drugs you can fix things but until then we got a nice thing goin here and you're not about to stop us.

>>66920677
i was speaking about the world in general.

Imagine a scenario where the atomic bombs were never dropped and the war continued until the last japanese soldier was alive (or allied troops completely surrounded Tokyo), the war was already lost for the japanese (even more after the fall of Germany) but the japanese officials were relentless in giving everything they've got.

If Hiroshima and Nagasaki never happened a likely scenario would be not only America, but China and the Soviet Union also invading Japan by the north (after all, after the fall of Berlin, Russia could focus entirely on it's eastern front) and if America didn't end everything abruptly with the bombs Japan would be occupied not only by the US, but also by the communists (both Chinese and Russians).

If that happened Japan would be like Korea today, divided in 2 countries, one communist and other capitalist.

Surely the attack of civilians was horrible, but if we actually take out the aftermath of America dropping those bombs and occupying Japan entirely, you can see that the bombs being dropped actually worked out better for Japan than if they were occupied by the communists.

>>66920484
>Would you leave your home and your stuff if you opened your mailbox and found a letter saying a bomb would drop where you were?
No, but I would if bombers that had annihilated other cities in my country dropped those letters warning my city was next.
>How the fuck would you feed yourself?
That's a secondary concern, just get the fuck out of there.
>Where would you go?
Anywhere away from there.

>>66920759
The people complaining about the bombings are likely communists themselves since they have no problem with that outcome.

>>66920759
Nope no excuses, masd murdering civilians is non excusable fight every soldier.

>>66920660
Tell me what USA is doing to your country now, did you not vote for your mayor hmmm?

You should blame your stupid turd world race of criminals that your province is a piece of shit not us foreign policy trying to do its thing.

>>66920865
you realize we'd have had to murder a bunch of civilians anyway, right?

>>66920924
Go ahead, but as vasuties not delibraye extermination.

>>66920660
your leaders seem to be fine with it. they might complain about us to the people but for the most part we're just a scapegoat to cover up the mass amounts of corruption

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>it's devolved into another let's blame everything wrong with my country on America thread

>>66920759

I only see conjectures in your post, familia. "If", "it could", it "would", "imagine"...

The facts we can work with are that the USA dropped insanely and unnecessarily powerful bombs on two cities full of civilian people - two cities that were untouched by war until that point - and that those bombs weren't properly tested before that, so the US didn't even know the full range of effects they would have on the territory and the people hit by the radioactive fallout.

>>66920950
why would we risk a bunch of our own men for that?

>>66920914
Right now: Spies on the president, fucks up our space program.
Then there was that whole coup thing decades ago.

>>66920986
>weren't properly tested
lol

>>66920914
I guess they don't teach in american schools that the CIA backed up most military dictatorships in South America during the 1960s and 1970s.

"Waaaaah my corrupt criminal race is corrupt like i am and my family!!!" and like the typical niggrr you blame usa which there are no us citizens in brazil.nor do we own brazilian corps.

Proof?
Fidel castro wasnt toppled by cia, get better security nigger.

>>66920998
how did we fuck up your space program? i know the us is fucking up south america, i'm not sure thats even debatable at this point. we definetely do some fuckery with south american politics. but leaders of south and central america also just like to blame us because your people buy it. waters undrinkable? blame america, child prostitutes? america. corrupt cops? america, corrupt politicians? america, no jobs? america

>>66920991

It's the choice a soldier makes when he enlists. Maybe you should ask your own government why they're sending you to war if you don't agree with it or if you think things could have worked out diplomatically.

The people who authorized the bomb drops are no better than the terrorists you fight today. Hell, some could even argue that they're worse than those, since the US was in a position of power and had powerful allies that were already starting the japanese invasion. Any civilians that started to fight in Japan could be treated as soldiers, but you can't preemptively kill innocent people because you think they could be enemies in the future.

>>66921028
And?
Were they Americans or Brazilians?
You know why we cant back warlords in Japan or China?
Because they arent fucking niggers.

>>66920998
I should expand on the spying thing:
It wasn't just the president, USA spied on CORPORATIONS like Petrobras for economic gain.

>>66921028
>>66921028
they do. but its not the 60's and 70's anymore

>>66920914
>Tell me what USA is doing to your country now

Are you one of those 13 year old autists who said stuff like "what are white people doing to black people now hmmm?" before all the arbitrary shootings started hitting the news?

>>66921122
ok. you win i don't want to argue about this anymore

>>66921145

But it has repercussions to this day, much like the US and Russia still have a weird relationship because of the Cold War.

>>66921121
You block any satellite with burger-made components from being launched by Brazil, you also forced Ukraine to not share space tech with us.
This is only known thanks to WikiLeaks btw, it's USA's "long-term policy" to stop Brazil from having a space program.

>>66921127
What do Japanese do?
Study, contribute to community, study, sacrifice for locality, work, contribute to society.

Tge nigger.
Drugs, crime, chaos, instability etc.

Blame your nigger slave blood for being so easily manipulayed kek.

>>66921122
most of the men fighting that war were drafted. we paint this picture of the honorable american man proudly fighting the japs but that wasn't really the case.

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>>66920998
>fucks up our space program
>BR space program

>>66921168
The nigger does crime of his own will, the nigger kills niggers and blames whitey.

How about niggers study get a job qnd stop killing each other?

>>66921217

That says more about the US government back then than about the war itself.

the nuke thing is debatable. but we really are fucking south america in the ass. we prop up cartels who funnel drugs into america, and then arrest and imprison people that get busted using them in the states. our prisons are allowed to turn profits and most of them are full of drug users/dealers who got there shit from south of the border. remember fast and the furious? did we ever get an answer about why that was going on? we do this all over the world. we keep standing on the throat of the little guys so they can never get up.

also why the fuck did no one in the election mention the ukraine conflict? i didn't hear it come up once in the debates. that shit could turn into wwiii and we're all talking about grabbing pussies and who has more seizures

Niggers are niggers for being niggers unpaid labor tenure of the ast or ethnic provincial system are of no effect to their ability.

>>66921293
most countries drafted. most countries still do. is norway evil? because i'm pretty sure they have compulsory service too.

>>66921326
USA did nothing wrong, spics are a criminal race.

Why cant we prop up rusdian drug lords?

>>66921267
>nigger goes to school
>cant fucking read
>its racism whitey keeping nigger down

Lawless corrupt criminal races ate eadily manipulated, we cant do any of this to civilized countried because their citizens dont partake in such activities.

>>66918928
>End WWII with diplomacy
t. Latuff

>>66921432
End war with soldiers not holocaust of 2 cities.

>>66921326

They did mention the Ukraine situation in the last or second to last debate, I think.

>>66921458
i'll have to relisten.

>>66918172
A large chunk of the American people wanted genocide.

>>66918172
Why was Japan attacking us anyway? We don't really cover that part of history here, it's usually just the old "they blew up pearl harbor and war were declared" explanation, with no background on motivations or existing political situation

>>66921849
Oil embargo.

>>66921849
I was taught oil embargo (and maybe iron/steel? It's been a while)

>>66920484
They tried to warn them in using the possible means available at that time.. there really wasn't much more they could do to warn them.

>>66921227
yes. they actually have a space agency.

>>66921849
Hull note

>>66920759
>Soviets invading the Japanese mainland?
>CHINA! WINNING AGAINST JAPAN?
You have no fucking idea what your talking about.
China was still losing battles mid 1945s.
The Chinese barely survived and got their country together thanks to the US defeating Japan and the Soviets liberating Manchuria.

Also, the soviets were a great land army.
They had very little naval sophistication. The IJN was extinct by 1945, but the soviets couldn't have put a big enough amphibious force to attack the mainland.

>>66918172
Japan drew first blood, anything that happens after is their fault.

On a serious note, we saved more Japanese lives by nuking them than if we had done a full scale land invasion and they fought to the last woman and child.

Plus are you gonna make a new toy and not play with it?

>>66920963
That's how they think. That is the reason their countries will never be nothing else than shit.

They think that a single dollar falling on the wrong hands is enough reason to blame the US for everything wrong with their country.

They make it look as if Chile was invaded and a dictator was set up by the US.

But they never mention that allende was threatening the Chilean constitution and the congress of Chile was adamantly opposed to him. They never mention that Pinochet was appointed general by allende himself, and they don't want to admit that anything to do with civil unrest and socialist regimes is anything but their fault.

The US might have supported one side over the other, but it didn't create the situation to begin with, only gave a little push to the side that it preferred.

>>66918172
Hey it's war not fight for justice

>>66919157
Those leaflets are same with those for ordinary air raids..

>>66921456
>Have a quarter million soldier dying and even more japanese dying at the hands of soldiers.
>warn the population of those cities that destruction is coming their way
>bomb one city and they still refuse to surrender
>Hiroshima contained 40K japanese soldiers and a huge army base making it a legitimate military target
>Nagasaki comes after and is also a major IJN port and a legitimate military target although it was unlucky as it was never meant to be bombed, at least not after other cities.
>get bombed twice
>Japs finally surrender
It's funny how japanese accept the necessity of the bombs, but other westerns and their modern ideas of nuclear bombs come to the rescue.

Ah come on
Everyone knows the US knew way ahead of time that Japan would surrender as long as they guaranteed the emperor's position
But James Byrnes, SoS at that time chose to test the atomic bombs for experiments and post-war pressure against the USSR
Political philosophers and theorists like John Rawls or Michael Walzer have clearly stated they were against the laws of war

>>66921849
The Japanese didn't attack us due to the Oil embargo.

The embargo pushed japan to seek oil somewhere else, like the dutch colonies and south east asia.

They wanted to conquer the entire region, but the Philippines, US navy, and Royal holding in the pacific threatened the Japanese domination of the area. So they decided to knock out the US and britain while they took south east asia without a worry in the world.

>>66924078

That's an autistic fantasy. I know you'll have a hard time accepting it since almost everything you could read on the subject would have been written by an American, but high ranking members of the Japanese government were so worried about a rebellion within Japan that surrender to the Allies seemed preferable. Women and children were not going to commit mass fucking suicide in the streets.

>>66924233

>what is cause and effect

>>66924221
The US could not accept conditions as the potsdam declaration took every change of a conditioned surrender away from japan.

>>66921849
Didn't the FBI recently declassified a few documents stating that a few officers warned the government that applying an embargo would push Japan to attack the US?
I think I saw a few people claim with some document numbers that the US outright baited Japan to attack while the bulk of the American fleet was off Hawai, but that's a little too /x/ for me

>>66924278
>We surrender on the condition that you don't kill us all
>HEY WE MAKE THE RULES HERE MONKEY

>>66924268
Some people make it look as if Japan attacked the US due to the embargo. As if they were bitter and saw it as an agression from the US. They hated the embargo, but knew that it wasn't an act of war, and could not do much about it.

Also, if you want to go by cause and effect, the cause of the embargo was japan taking the french colonies even after warning of an embargo. They knew they would get embargoed if they conquered more territory than China but their greedy little hands couldn't stop.

Nukes end the war? NO. Because of Soviet.

If a nuke ends the war. just nuke Syria

>>66924327
The soviet attack of Manchuria did have a part in the Japanese surrender.

The Japanese were so delusional that they still thought that the US was going to let them keep their colonies, Korea, after the war. After the Soviets took Manchuria and Korea, it left japan with nothing else but their mainland who was now getting nuked and was in danger of invasion by the US.

The Soviets didn't end the war. But they did made the Japanese make a check on reality which did help towards capitulation.

>>66919089
the fliers were dropped on all potential bombing spots, even though nagasaki and hiroshima weren't the first on the chopping block, their names were certainly on the list.

>>66918172
LIAR

I learned in school that the US did it just to show off (and that Japs were already clearly surrendering)

>>66918310
>Implying you don't want the world to have more cute japanese rape born girls.

>>66918172
Meh, who cares.

The true question is why didn't the allies do what the German scientists said they should do and nuke the shit out of the Soviet Union.

>>66918388
I don't think you understand the mentality of ww2 japan.

>>66918469
>gaijins
>racist
>japanese
>not racist

kek

>>66925355
It's funny that most of the German Scientists couldn't believe that America built a working bomb first.

>>66918569
That's the whole point dumb ass, they were fanatic to the emporer hence the bomb. But please enlighten us on your legenedary brazillian miltiary techniques

>>66918710
because of the nukes you literal faggot nigger. It's like your argueing agianst yourself all i have to do is point your points out to you to argue with you

>>66925355
We only had one left after Nagasaki

>>66920227
You sound like the kind of naive dumbass that thinks that a self-driving car should just ""avoid"" an unavoidable accident as opposed to killing the fewest number of people, or attempting to protect the owner.

>>66925580
>as opposed to killing the fewest number of people, or attempting to protect the owner.
Imagine the shitstorm when self driving cars start to kill their owners

>>66925552
But apparently between the Soviets testing their first nuke (1949) and the bombing of Nagasaki, the Fat Man Mk III went into production and had nearly 120 produced.

So you had anywhere around 100 nukes before the Soviets even tested one.

>>66925980
>But apparently between the Soviets testing their first nuke (1949) and the bombing of Nagasaki, the Fat Man Mk III went into production and had nearly 120 produced.
Didn't' know this tee bee t.bh

>>66918444
it's less brutal at least comparing to ivan's front, jon snow.

>>66918172
Kek so you wanna hear another "bias speaking" from japs?
There's no being """neutral""" in talking about history

>>66927182
i just notice that one that Calldodoody loading screen that says "history written by the winner, not ones who right or wrong"

>>66927113
The Americans had to do many amphibious landings and amphibious landings are much like the Russian front on a smaller scale.

>Having waves and waves of guys run through shitty conditions, only to get murdered trying to push up far enough to do any sort of retaliation

>>66925778
From my experience with working with defense contractors, the 'future' of flight is going to be semi-automated. Since literally everyone hates the idea of giving machines the "right" to kill things, that means the human has to give orders to kill.
So, the logical result when applied to self-driving cars is a copout. Google et al. will (and should) fallback to human judgement the moment the self-driving car detects an impossible to avoid collision with another person.
Of course, a human could never react faster than a machine, or even do a better job at killing the people that "need" to be killed. But this copout allows you to completely ignore the ethical concerns of writing a program that may inevitably have to decide who it needs to kill.

>>66927263
bro kangoroo.
do you even Barbarossa?

in amphibious landing you can choose where to land, choosing bad and got rekt.

you can't choose where the artillery shell or the drop bomb fall. but it's always in the city.

>>66918172
lol in the end, the only thing Japan needed was to guarantee Emperor's safety. the US back then was just asshole.

>>66918172
White people-sama just waned to test it in the zoo and punished the uncivilized yellow monkeys because they thought, and still think tho, the Japanese werent human beings. That was all about race and religion. People in that era were much more religiously racially biased, judgmental, and bigoted than you imagine.

>>66927470
>People in that era were much more religiously racially biased, judgmental, and bigoted than you imagine
People don't change.

>>66925507

>t-they were fanatic, I k-know because my government told me so! We totally didn't just do it to test bombs on a real scenario! But the same tactic cannot be used today against today's fanatics in Syria or Iraq or Afghanistan because reasons!!! They're not AS FANATIC as the japanese ones, you know? Plus, THINK OF THE CHILDREN!

That's what you sound like. Also, how much of a cuck can a country be? The US literally had a contingency plan to shoot atomic bombs over your country if they needed to use them, so that if other countries shot the missiles down the fallout would drop on Canada instead of US.

>>66925525

That's conjecture, son. Saying "they only stopped because of the nuke" is a fallacy, because things COULD have played out differently without the bombs and no one, including you, could prove it would or wouldn't.

>>66927777
Nice numerics friends

>>66918172
USA. For not dropping more bombs.

>>66927745
>hue doesn't understand MAD
opinion discarded

Shit, where's Russia when you need him?

>>66924364
what japan actually hoped to maintain was not these colonies, but kokutai, namely emperor monarchy.
they knew better than to take a hard line with remaining these areas regardless of actual military defeat.

>>66928004

Because all those countries mentioned are Russia's allies? Do you really think Russia would care if a bomb dropped in Iraq? Sure, they could get mad over Syria but they wouldn't do a THING.

>>66918339
Largest harbor in the region, Even after the second bomb military generals tried to start a fucking coup against the emperor to keep the war going.

>>66927359
>Muh eastern front! it was way worse
Yeah on a larger scale it was. But the russian and german will to fight doesn't even come close to what the japs had. starting in late 1943 the Allied forces in the pacific had to flush out those cocksuckers from every little nook and cranny from those islands. Fuckers still were emerging from the jungle in the 1960s thinking the war was still on.

>>66918324
>Peaceful
Lmao @ this monkey. Japs are killing south east asians with shovels and you think your weeboo opinion matters about WW2 war crimes?

>>66918172
Shit capitalist and bank

Why does Japan presents herself as a dindu nuffin victim of WWII?

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>>66919157
>American Diplimacy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ZSoJDUD_bU

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>>66930344
Because Japanese propaganda always said Japanese and other Asians were friends but white's colonists enslaved Asian.
Japanese government didn't force us to kill victims of capitalists.
Japanese government excuted shit Japanese who killed pubric or raped girls.

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They should have also nuked Tokio and Kyoto. Two were actually not enough

>USA
Only gives a shit about Hitler and not allowing slavs take over Asia with gommunism, Japan was nothing more than a footnote

>Japan
Bombs Pearl Harbor and kills 3000+ Americans for the most dubious of reasons (whether America allowed the attack to happen or was ill-prepared is another discussion)
Bombs all of American, British and Dutch bases all over Asia, even reaching India's (actually Bangladesh) borders and kills most of its defenders
When America finally doubles down on Germany takes Japan seriously and proceeds to steamroll them with massive casualties
They are somehow "evil" for nuking a fanatical enemy and not choose to save hundreds of thousands of lives and extending the war in the 50s

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>>66930824
Pet of Jiang Zemin was detected

>>66918172
Incendiary bombs instead of an atomic bomb were able to end the war .
Even incendiary bombs could kill tens of thousands of people in a night.

>>66930699

>the americans forced us to commit warcrimes like mass murder and rape

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

>>66932161
We now know Americans were not enemy.
Shit capitalists and banks were enemy.