So I've been hearing that /ic/ knows jack shit about business

This is a place for beginners and intermediates, pros don't stick around.

>>3106938
What do you want to know about the business side of drawing and why don't you just ask your questions in a normal manner, instead of making a passive-aggressive shitpost thread?

>>3106938
Don't make ic yout go-to for everything art related, we're good at criticism and learning strategies, for business seek someone more in touch with business, Feng Zhu, Schoolism or specific artists on Artstation.

>>3106962
>we're good at criticism and learning strategies

ahaha
ahahahahahahahahaha

>>3106962
>we're good at criticism and learning strategies
kek

>>3106973
>>3106979
For beginners like you, /ic/ is definitely more than good enough to get the ball rolling into the right direction. Someone on here hurt you and told you that your art is shit, so now your go-to defense mechanism is to always shit-talk this board and pretend everyone is stoopid and totally beneath you. Grow up and man up or leave, but stop this pathetic, constant passive aggressive bitching.

>>3107007
you're right, I'm no expert but as the first poster said, there are no pros left here and it shows. Almost all the learning strategies and criticism is quite literally deferring to some higher up because it's clear whoever is giving the directions has no idea what they're doing either. It's amazing to see how many people here have biblical knowledge on someone like Loomis but, for reason's unknown, can hardly express the knowledge that they possess and give proper directions to beginners themselves.

Talking about the business of art (particularly illustration) is a complete waste of time here. I've tried to help others before, but people just don't care enough to talk about it. Generally I try give a basic blueprint on how to land freelance illustration jobs, and ask people to talk about their work and what type of jobs they would like to get. People don't bother responding, and then the thread dies pretty quickly. Folks here just don't want to take the effort to learn how to build a real freelance business for themselves.

Instead, most of /ic/ thinks the only way you can make a living is through porn Patreons, low paying personal commissions. The few focused on a real career have tunnel vision on fantasy/sci-fi/concept art, and cannot fathom a career in illustration outside of those fields. Shit is just delusional.

>>3107040
I am very interested in the business side of ilustration, it's just I am still a beginner and I am not sure what direction I am heading into. So assuming that I want to become a guy who makes fantasy illustrations for anything (meaning games and books), what should I do?

>>3107040
please share your blueprints

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>>3107043
>>3107050
Happy to do so, but take it with a grain of salt since I'm just a stranger on the internet and I don't know your situation. Attached is a recent sketch (~30 mins) if you wanted to gauge my skill (not much to go off of, but it's better than nothing). The most basic steps to getting work in every industry of freelance illustration is this:

1. Look at work being recently published in your desired field, and take note of what type of work is and isn't being used.

2. Create new work that is both unique and original, but would still fit into said field. It needs to be created with the intent of being useful to that industry. Compile the work into a unified, cohesive portfolio (like Squarespace, for example). Every piece of work should be geared at showing how you can fulfill the needs of potential clients. Ditch work that is not relevant to who you're pitching to. Your style is your brand - it's what sets you apart from everyone else.

3. Research companies that hire illustrators in your desired fields. Every time you see published work, make a mental note of the business that published it. Hunt down the names of art directors that work there, and gather their contact information. Art directors are usually who you're trying to sell your services to.

4. Organize your new contacts & their information into a list (I recommend a spread sheet). Keep it organized and easy to read.

5. Start a promotional campaign to each contact. Email them a briefly share a link to your work, what you can do for them, and why you're interested in working with them.

That's it. Rinse and repeat for forever. If you get a response, great. If not, do NOT give up after the first no-reply. Periodically check in every few months with a portfolio with newer, better work. Constantly be improving your portfolio with new, ambitious personal work if you're not getting commercial work.

The above steps are the framework for most freelance careers - not just illustration.

>>3107102
This is some really helpful stuff. thank you

>>3106938
>You realize that if you can't talk about real, important stuff, this place is no better than deviantart?
This isn't Artwork/Commercialism, it's Artwork/Critique. Please kill yourself, my dude.

>>3107007
Not really, the Rita here are dog shit. If you gathered every crit from over the past year and compared them you'd get like a 90% match because so much of what's said here is regurgitated nonsense. Also you can see how the quality of crits have gone down since there's so few red lines these days. Red lines require you to actually show your skill instead of spouting whatever advice you heard someone else say.

>>3107040
This. I've tried to give advice, but most of it's wasted here. 90% of the people are just basement dwellers who just want to "Draw boobies hurrr", and will never even rise to the level $10 furry porn. Too much emphasis is on "how can I be efamous on Tumblr and DA", not "How can I build a roster of clients I can survive off of", or "How can I get hired as a creative professional?" If it's not immature porn, the rest of the forum is weeabos who think they can strong arm their way into being Manga Stars by drawing the same heads from loomis for 10 hours a day, and shitpost about talent not being real.
I very rarely see someone approaching art with respect, as a life-long passion, as something to dedicate to - it's always a means to an end - free porn, or chumming for pennies in degenerate circles on social media. There are a few, but they're drowned out by the "Hurrr Loomis" crowd and the endless parade of anime tracers.

>>3107122
I don't redline for two reasons:

I'm not asked to, and drawing over someone else's work is rude.

Two, I'd rather see the person work out the correct line themselves, than be told what it is. The educational event will be stronger if they have to work it out themselves.

My teachers in school didn't draw over my drawings and paintings, to teach me - they told me where I was fucking up, and i went back and tried it again.

>>3107334
Even if you don't redline the crits here are, for the most part, garbage. Just take a look at the beginner thread and see I you can spot any quality advice.

>>3107334
>drawing over someone else's work is rude

wtf no it isn't. Especially not if they're asking for criticism.

>>3107102
>5. Start a promotional campaign to each contact. Email them a briefly share a link to your work, what you can do for them, and why you're interested in working with them.

This is important. When I started out, I'd ask any art director who picked up the phone for advice. The best I got was "Make sure I know you exist. I may not have work for you now, but down the road, I might. Make sure you get my attention, and I have current contact info for you. The people who I remember are the ones I hire", or along those lines, I don't remember the exact words.

If you're not in their database, they're not going to call you. It's a simple concept, but it's one that escapes many - you have prima donnas who think the art directors will chase them down (doesn't happen), and the shy ones who think contacting them is "bugging them". It's not. It's their job.

Blizzard isn't going to call you, by looking at Tumblr. You should have a clean, easy to use web portfolio, and a good, solid PDF portfolio to send art directors - call and ask what their submission policy is. (If it's a staff position, they don't want yours unless a position is open and they're taking resumes/portfolios). Have different versions - one for commercial art, one for fantasy art, etc. Be ready to make a custom one, for a specific company.
Be ready to follow through. If you land a nibble for a book cover, they don't care about vacation and family bullshit, they want to know when to expect the art, and if it fits their schedule.
Be easy to contact. They're not going to chase you down. Answer your phone. Call back ASAP if they leave a message. Have reliable email and texting.
Freelancing is all hustle. If you're good, you get an agent to hustle for you. But you gotta learn to hustle.

>>3107342
If they ask for it, fine.

If not, it's fucking rude. NEVER fuck with another artist's work, unasked.

>>3107340
I try to give crits occasionally, but I'm getting tired of being argued with, told I'm "mean", or being blown off. Some flops around with a pencil and fucks up basic anatomy, you tell them, and all you get is neckbeards mooing "show your work". It's pointless.

This forum is too toxic for any real education to happen.

>>3107347
I don't know what you're doing but when I give advice and directions on anatomy and posture I usually get thanked.

>>3107353
Same here. Either that anon has really REALLY bad luck or he's being a condescending asshole.

>>3106938
a true artist has no need for "industry".
a true artists only concern is skill & study.

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>>3107415

>>3107347
The only times that happens is when the critique is legitimately stupid or when someone is nitpicking a far superior artists and it's clear they have no clue what they are talking about.

>>3106973
>>3106979
What other communities have you guys tried, exactly? It's fucking hard to get an honest critique anywhere else, and /ic/ is undoubtedly the best place to find learning resources because of the sheer volume of books, websites and torrented video lectures these basement dwelling faggots go through.

>>3106938
Source on the artist? Google only leads to pinterest images with no source

>>3107467

This.


I always thanks when people take the time to critique my work, except when It's some clear shitpost..

(((exposure)))

>>3107415
You'll starve.

>>3107102
How can one define the field that they wanna work on

>>3107102
>>3107343

Listen to these guys. I also want to add that when you're freelancing, you're going to have good months and then bad months. If you live in the USA, make sure you have a job that gives you health benefits and then do your work on the side. I cannot stress that enough.

>>3108728
and your work is probs burgers shit. so eat and draw baby dicks you fat bitch.

>>3106946
I was intermediate and thanks to /ic/ I finally learned to hate drawing

goys

>>3107102
>>3107102
Captured this shit thank you.

>>3110296
Well post it so we can all share it anon

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>>3110300

>>3110305
Thanks im >>3110296
You did it faster dude

>>3110310
saved it earlier.

advice on making a living sure can be sparse on this board

>>3107102
>>3107343
These are both really helpful, thanks guys.
Would you recommend paying to go to art cons and similar stuff to network with local artists and scope out any attending companies? I've applied for a volunteer slot at CTNX this year but I have no ties to Burbank so it would be an expensive trip. Wondering if I get accepted, do I go or use the money to buy a cintiq and improve the speed at which I can work?

>>3107343
>>3107102
This sounds a lot like what my dad does. He's a painting subcontractor, and goes around stopping at any construction site to write down names and take business cards. He then forces me to write emails and such to introduce the self and send references. At first I was embarrassed doing this work because I thought I had to word it in a way that didn't bother the construction managers, but no, they all just said thanks, ill contact you when theres more work, and to my surprise, they often did.

I dont know. I just see some pottery in it. Doing art to escape working for my dad forever when I'm just going to essentially be doing the same work for myself anyhow. I guess I saw doing art for a living as a mystical thing (exactly how second anon described it, with blizzard hunting me down eventually) when it turns out I might already have experience in it.

>>3110362
Mind posting some of your work? Or detailing your experience?

Condescending cunt

>>3106938
>>3107657
Yeah, which chink drew dis? Shits tight yo.

There's a fucking business board faggot

>>3112137
No, there's a memecoin battle board mislabeled as a business board.

>>3107007
>Someone on here hurt you and told you that your art is shit

Not either of them, but actually I posted an actual professional artist's work and got Loomis'd to death just to prove that /ic/ is generally just a bucket of crabs.

I've never taken anything here seriously, I only come for the book thread. really.

>>3107344
sounds like some arbitrary bullshit rule to me
not anon who questioned, but what beginner has the ego to reject a paintover/redline?

>>3112225
>t. No coiner.

>>3112225

>>3113158
How's that ETH doing fuckhead?

>>3113158
Don't spread this garbage here.

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>>3116369
>374

Apologize.

>>3117562
See you on the lunar lambo club comrade.

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>>3118597
>383

Cosmonaut Yuri standing by, next stop: Alpha Centauri

>>3118624
up and up and up.

>>3106962
>we're good at criticism and learning strategies

HAHAHAAHAHA!!

jje

whats this bitcoin talk what the fuck.

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>>3122445
>tfw i had 3 btc, sold at 1k
> could have bought it back at 200 after china sell off
>.... didn't.

DUDE ETH LMAO

>>3124616
Buy the dip

>>3124619
>>3124616
>>3122457
>>3122445
>>3121824
>>3119978
>>3119958
>>3118624
>>3118597
>>3117562
>>3117526
>>3116369

Why do you guys keep bumping the thread with these inane, useless posts? Just let it die.

I quickly realized the majority of advice or critism given was anons trying to assert their own style. If you ever look at self promo threads here, you'll see who is posting and only one out of 20 anons here have talent.