How could one of the world's most popular anime/manga franchises

>>3008401
They are paid below minimum wage and probably don't want to put in the effort of this tired out franchise

Toei only cares about One Piece and Precure.

i looks like a cartoon, maybe its not the place to look for good art

File: tumblr_inline_o4ts2e1KWn1skta4k_400.png (107KB, 307x307px) Image search: [Google]

107KB, 307x307px

dragon ball has always been shit so who cares

>>3008417
Doesn't seem like they care too much about those either

>>3008401
Just look at the new Berserk anime, it's even worse. Far worse. I honestly don't get it why such iconic shows get so little effort and such a small budget to work with. Meanwhile every season there are tons of completely unknown light novel adaptions or sometimes even anime original shows with excellent art and animation.

>>3008401
Toei isn't particularly known for good animation.
Their long running shows generally have no off season. It goes on nonstop at the rate of one episode per week. As it shouldn't be hard to imagine they can't produce high quality animation on that schedule.

>>3008444
Try making your bait less obvious next time...

>>3008409
This. Animators are paid shit in Japan and they can barely survive off their salary. Really sucks despite working nonstop and being stretched thin.

File: YamamuroPoster2.png (2MB, 841x1139px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 841x1139px

It's actually kind of a sad story, and it has nothing to do with the reasons given in these posts: >>3008409 >>3008417 >>3008485 >>3008501

It comes down to Tadayoshi Yamamuro. Yamamuro was an animation supervisor and character designer for Dragon Ball Z starting with the Artificial Humans arc. His episodes are among the highest quality in terms of art and animation, and he set the tone for the latter half of the series by not only animating many important moments but also for drawing almost all of the promotional and licensed artwork for the series from 1993 onward. He's widely considered one of the best artists in the franchise's history, taking Toriyama's style and adding greater precision and depth.

Pic related is an example of his art. Odds are if you've seen a piece of DBZ art set from the Cell arc or later it's his drawing.

So what does this great draftsman have to do with how shitty Dragon Ball Super looks?

Simple: He got shitty. His art became sterile and overly simple. Lazy, in other words.

But in the industry seniority rules, and him being a living legend in the world of Dragon Ball meant he maintained his very high ranking position in the production of the movies and new TV show. But his art and style have gone downhill, and it's brewing controversy not just among fans but within the industry and on the staff. There are a lot of talented animators with great resumes working on Super and many of them are complaining of having their cuts excessively redrawn by Yamamuro to match his style, which just doesn't cut the mustard anymore. If his job was based on merit he would be given the can, but it's not so he's the captain and he's dragging the whole ship down with him.

So that's all there is to it. A really good artist who got high on his own farts, got shitty and still has the keys to the castle.

File: tumblr_niws8iTXkp1tjn5uuo1_500.jpg (254KB, 496x750px) Image search: [Google]

254KB, 496x750px

>>3008507

The Yamamuro of old's most legendary work: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6bz-vK4-fo

File: pepe1.png (165KB, 1500x1000px) Image search: [Google]

165KB, 1500x1000px

There's a reason why even Disney isn't making traditional animation anymore and only stick to 3D. It's the astronomical costs that come with making good animation. People just have no idea how long it takes to create a even a second of animation when it's not some shitty dialogue scene from a slice of life anime. Not only that, skilled animators are few and far between.
>but dragon ball used to have good animation
Yeah, it was alright, but you have to realize that MOST revenue from animation actually comes from toys and merchandise and considering that Dragon Ball isn't really big among the youngsters and the old audience isn't buying toys anymore, it's just not feasible to have a giant budget for animation.

>>3008507
Dragon Ball ranks in 10 ten in ratings every week in Japanese households, dumb frog poster.

>>3008523
meant for >>3008514

>>3008507
Animators really are payed below minimum wage in Japan.

>>3008507
One does not simply dismiss by saying it does not have something to do with it. Precure goods are everywhere and keeps Toei afloat; kind of what >>3008514 said except he is retarded, too. And OnePiece movies are far better animated than DBZs garbage.

File: 5468zc.jpg (210KB, 600x583px) Image search: [Google]

210KB, 600x583px

>>3008548
Fuck you tumblr brolly is not trans

>>3008514
>It's the astronomical costs that come with making good animation.

How come mostly every other anime manages these astronomical costs just fine then? Sure, tv anime always tries to cheat the budget, uses shortcuts, still frames etc, but for the most part, it's still doing just fine. DBS (and Berserk) go way beyond that in terms of lazyness to the point where they are just an embarassment to the whole industry.

>>3008507
>but it's not so he's the captain and he's dragging the whole ship down with him.

That basically sums up japan's work ethics in a nut shell. Most artists over there, what we consider good are simply titled "popular" simply because of the seniority benefits.

yoh yoshinari gets a lot of slack among the community simply because foreigners are all over his dick when there are better artists. But being the elder among the company, yoh is given power.

Japan is just shit.

>>3008514
Kind of reminds me of Don Bluth when it comes to making finances.
Even though Secret of nimh did extremely well in theaters and was a hot seller on VHS, Don explained how he didn't any money till a random game developer showed up to his studio and said "make me Dragon's Liar". Once that game hit arcades, Don was able to continue his work and make more movies. The huge success of Secret of nimh wasn't enough.

>>3008601
Yoh only has absolute power over his own shows though, as far as I'm mistaken. If he was in charge of everything that Trigger produced despite there being better options then I could understand the complaints, but as it is now what's the issue?

>>3008607
>as far as I'm mistaken
As far as I'm AWARE, I mean.

>>3008401
Kinda stupid really. I don't understand why they're throwing away potential $$ by shitting on a great franchise.

>>3008601
>better artists than Yoh Yoshinari
name them

>>3008601
What are you even talking about? The big guy at Trigger and Gainax has always been Hiroyuki Imaishi. Yoshinari got creative control over LWA and that's it. Imaishi was the director of KLK, Panty & Stocking and TTGL.

Also, please go ahead and name all the better artists at Trigger that could do a better job as designer and lead animator but are unjustly overlooked, I'm genuinely curious.

>>3008447
They treat OP like shit as well in terms of art/animation. But Precure gets a fairly good deal most of the time for some reason, the shows look good and have fluid animation.

File: checkd.jpg (12KB, 248x249px) Image search: [Google]

12KB, 248x249px

>>3008444
trips can confirm
check'd

>>3008401
It's actually because it's popular. Since it's so popular, they know people will watch it regardless.

>>3008444
>Tumblr
>idolshit

Look who's talking.

>>3008444

This tbqh famalam

>>3008601
Is Yoshinari the westaboo or is it all of Trigger?

File: 05c49aa1227798b368320248e8579b43.jpg (20KB, 480x328px) Image search: [Google]

20KB, 480x328px

>>3008401
>minimum wage

Good question. Dragonball Super is even worse.

File: maxresdefault.jpg (100KB, 1280x720px) Image search: [Google]

100KB, 1280x720px

>>3008507

File: images-1.jpg (10KB, 314x160px) Image search: [Google]

10KB, 314x160px

>>3008417
>Toei
>Caring about One Piece
Where were you since the last 7 years, anon?

>>3012600
WTF is this real? Ep. #?

>>3012600

Are you showing out of context inbetweens? I'm willing to excuse it if it's background animation, but not if it's a still image. It's the motion that matters, so post the webm.

File: r4nnNk.gif (748KB, 320x180px) Image search: [Google]

748KB, 320x180px

>>3012752
>>3012764
You ask, you get it.

File: aB5hkr7.gif (2MB, 376x214px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 376x214px

>>3012752
>>3012764

>>3008401
this was one of those cheap episodes, there'll probably be lots of action in the next few, this is a common practice in anime series

they fix that shit for the blurays. you know, the things that make them money, not the filthy web pirates.

>>3008507
How well was he in his prime as far as anime goes for all you artists?

File: 1476401337003.jpg (47KB, 500x563px) Image search: [Google]

47KB, 500x563px

>Just finishing up rewatching my favorite childhood saturday morning cartoon again in decades
>see this thread
>see this >>3008548

Why the fuck couldn't they just leave it alone.

>>3008548
Remember the days when Dragon Ball didn't have stupid transformations and auras and when the writers didn't have to come up with even more stupid shit to compete with the stupid shit they created? Good times.

File: tumblr_nv6bsvK7gS1uxy8t7o1_1280.jpg (1MB, 1280x1570px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 1280x1570px

>>3015253
As far as DBZ goes, he was the lead artist on everything post Frieza. His art style defined DBZ. All other animators based their style off of him, and that was their go-to reference.

pic related is some of his artwork.

Even DBGT, which is known as the most hated and shittiest thing of all DB is consistently better than DBS on account of animation and art quality. DBGT's style still had influence of Yamamuro before his new modern style.

File: 1497108448030.webm (1MB, 900x506px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 900x506px

>>3008401
If you think DBfags have it rough, look at what Bersekfags got.

File: 122122323.gif (3MB, 320x240px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 320x240px

>>3017846

What the fuck man? Beserk doesn't deserve this shit.

File: 1496125317628.gif (1MB, 467x490px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 467x490px

>>3017846
Is that CGI? Why do they do that in anime?

>>3017846
Isn't that a project from college students? Or did I just get memed? You got the one of the little guy rolling while Carsa runs behind him?

File: 1497119674035.webm (895KB, 1280x720px) Image search: [Google]

895KB, 1280x720px

>>3018283
This season has like 3 full-CGI anime, but Berserk somehow manages to be the worst out of them animation-wise.

File: 1497109956073.webm (2MB, 1280x720px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 1280x720px

>>3018284
It's all real.

>>3018299
Jesus fucking christ. I'm saving it this time, that is the single most fucked up thing I've ever seen. Why is he rolling at the same speed yet suddenly slows down? Wow, I've just realized if the background is done separately from the characters, he was supposed to be rolling far into some sort of horizon, but they forgot to make him smaller and they just chose a background with a completely different perspective. That's my guess anyway.

And I thought the first one was actually a project from some college students. It was a joke apparently. Poe's Law in effect indeed.

File: reeeee.jpg (65KB, 411x412px) Image search: [Google]

65KB, 411x412px

>>3018299
good god...

The rolling is fucking awful, we've already pointed that out but look at Casca's hair, its clipping to her fucking clothes. That urks me more than the rolling and I don't know why.

>>3012533
All of them.

the only studio that seems to care about animation anymore is Trigger